Comments by WillMunny (page 6)

I agree that it will always be case-by-case, hut there is also less of a clear distinction between info useful to dancers and info useful to customers than you might think at first. Example: if I know the dancer's house fees, tip-out, etc, that can be useful if trying to negotiate a VIP fee (or at least give you a better perspective on what ballpark dollar range you need to be in). I've also found that having some knowledge of the "behind the scenes" situation at a club can help build rapport with a dancer even if it doesn't have a direct economic impact ("Yeah, I heard the new day shift manager is a jerk"; "I can't believe they make you carry a prop around even when not on stage" etc.)

@Shadow - apparently Target is in trouble for using your discussion title: http://m.wistv.com/story/38422012/baby-daddy-cards-to-be-removed-from-target-stores-amid-accusations-of-racism (Putting a photo of a black couple on the card was clearly a poor decision)

Should be an interesting comparison/contrast with Mother's Day. https://www.tuscl.net/discussion.php?id=56807 I would expect Father's Day is a lot more likely to bring out the dancers and custies. And yes, I'll be one of the latter.

By any chance is this gal's stage name a 1930s screen siren? It's been a while since my last visit but I recall being pretty disappointed when she told me she didn't do VIPs.

"Close-up vaginal yoga"? If that occurs during a table dance, wouldn't that make all us PLs the Upward-facing dogs?

Nihilists! Fuck me. I mean, say what you want about the tenets of National Socialism, at least it's an ethos.

I've done a VIP with a confirmed welder before. She volunteered that as her other job (IIRC she was in the process of certification when we first met). I also ran into a tile flooring contractor that I'd be willing to bet was a former or current dancer. I was tempted to ask if her kneepads were dual-purpose. If the subject of her work or school comes up (and I'm interested), I'll usually add "if you don't mind me asking" to a question about job or major that could give away info she might prefer not to share.

Miami/South Florida and LA/COI are the only two that probably fit all of your criteria. I wouldn't describe the non-Follies Atlanta market as a desert, but there is a substantial drop in availability of extracurriculars (or increase in price) elsewhere in that market. You also failed to mention cost/value, which is part of the equation for most PLs. Detroit and Atlanta would rank higher if that's taken into account. The subject of a mongering junket seems to come up periodically and the point is usually made that for a genuine vacation you're better off finding cities/regions with more to offer than clubs alone.

I've never been an eyewitness to this happening, but I've heard about it from dancers frequently enough to believe it's more than just a PL urban legend. In a perverse way it makes sense that a guy looking to get his jollies for free would attempt such a move - the likely worst case would be getting tossed and banned from the club, *maybe* being roughed up in the process. But most clubs wouldn't sweat a dancer being stiffed enough to call in police for theft of services. There does seem to be a pattern that new dancers are the ones I've heard about getting cheated, which is probably a combination of two factors: the more experienced dancers are more likely to ask for (or to see) the cash up front if dealing with an unknown customer; and the newbies are less likely to shy away from any warning signs, or simple intuition, that a custy might be a runner.

Agree that it isn't rude, but this is why most experienced PLs choose not to sit stageside to begin with.

In an "extras" market (COI, Detroit, etc) a "meh" club can still provide a high level of service, and has the potential up-sides of being less expensive and offering variety (with the rare occasion of finding a "diamond in the rough" - i.e. dancer of the premium club caliber working in an otherwise "meh" place). In a lot of places "meh" is the best thing available (Tennessee from circa the last five years comes to mind). Personally I tend to skip clubbing entirely in those markets, but locals don't have the option or know any better (witness positive reviews on this site for what experienced PLs recognize as a mediocre experience).

Athena seems fine. Cleopatra's a bit cumbersome - maybe shorten to "Cleo"? Frankly your stage name isn't going to make much difference either way to 98% of the customers.

@ Shadowcat "Yesterday a new dancer told me that she saw a Latina dancer fucking a customer bare back at the bar and she wanted to know if it was OK to do that." I hope you explained to her that it's customary to leave at least a 15% tip for the bartender.

I don't buy the cow even though I have to pay for the milk. Assuming cows were suddenly free and easily available, I still doubt I would change the way I get my dairy products.

#PippasBum #CheekyMonkey

Speaking of new features on the site, check out Founder dropping a zinger into the discussions! @Gawker, I believe your followers are past due for a more comprehensive update. Last we heard you were going to take the car back, but now she's using it to stay out all night with "B"? I realize the horse already left the barn and the barn has gone up in flames, but dude: BOUNDARIES. ...

@AJ - Flight Club is still Flight Club, but it remains to be seen what effect Penthouse reopening sans private VIP will have on dancer quality @ FC. Most of the PH diaspora had settled @ FC while the club was closed, which had effectively concentrated the hottest dancers at FC. Now the Penthouse refugees are free to return, but the extas-friendly environment is gone so the logical inference is that FC will keep the extras-friendly hotties they added.

@Bubba, it's not clear if you actually tried the number already, or if you're treating the background hit on an apparently different name as certain proof of a wrong number. I've done the "background check" thing before on numbers I knew were valid and gotten what I knew were invalid hits (especially with pay-as-you-go mobile numbers, ownership can transfer pretty frequently). I'd suggest texting (strong preference of most dancers) or calling the number before you pitch it, on two grounds: one, it's possible the number is 100% legit and just doesn't show up as hers in any public records. Two, she may use a friend or "administrative assistant" to track potential clients, ITC and/or OTC. I can see why case two might present its own set of issues, but I'm sure you can see how it might also lead things where you'd like them to go anyway.

I've always thought the dancer rating (whatever label Founder chooses to put on it) had mostly to do with physical appearance. "Friendliness" - in the sense of mileage - is a factor in the Value score.

@JS69 - Just be sure to remember her name. I seem to recall it rhymes with a female body part. And by the way: they're real, and they're spectacular.

Let us all remember the wisdom of Lopaw: "I'll pay for pussy, and I'll beg for pussy, but I won't beg to pay for pussy." Show some self-respect and act like you been there before....

*Damn post button... But it's still ROB behavior. Especially in a club where you've been a regular, my reaction would be to end the dance immediately, pay whatever the standard rate was for only the dance(s) completed, and look for a better dancer.

I think when a club has standard dance pricing (as is the case in all the Atlanta clubs I'm aware of), it's perfectly reasonable for a customer to assume the standard rate applies until told otherwise. To be fair, at least the dancer did try to upsell *during* the dance, not after.

Interesting survey. Maybe the most significant factor this doesn't take into account is how widely available such an experience might be in a given area - e.g. Detroit metro you've already got folks parsing the price point by quality of the clubs, vs. a city like Atlanta may have a decent number of clubs but only a few where ITC is consistently available. Anyway, here are my impressions of a few markets I've experienced (numbers are for VIP experience only, and do not factor in cover, drinks, parking etc): Geographic area: Detroit Metro What is your OPINION of: A Good Deal: Below 100 dollars An Acceptable Deal: Up to 250 dollars A No Deal (no one should pay above this amount): Above 300 dollars Comments: Notes by others above are accurate with respect to tradeoffs in pricing/quality for metro Detroit clubs. ITC is available in virtually all area clubs. Geographic area: City of Industry (LA metro) What is your OPINION of: A Good Deal: Below 200 dollars An Acceptable Deal: Up to 300 dollars A No Deal (no one should pay above this amount): Above 400 dollars Comments: CoI is similar to the Detroit market in the sense that ITC is the norm, however (a) ROBs are much more common, (b) general pricing is higher, but still affordable - top quality dancers may not fall into that category, though. Geographic area: Atlanta What is your OPINION of: A Good Deal: Below 200 dollars An Acceptable Deal: Up to 300 dollars A No Deal (no one should pay above this amount): Above 300 dollars Comments: Follies is the outlier in Atlanta, arguably the only club where ITC is standard practice. There are of course other clubs where it's available, but prices are usually double the going rate at Follies. Once that $ threshold is crossed, it's hard to justify ITC over OTC.

COI/Upland is the obvious choice, but if you were willing to burn the extra time & gas to do a day trip to TJ you might consider another alternative: wait out the morning in the airport area, and hit up Bare Elegance in the afternoon. *Disclaimer: never done a Tuesday day shift at BELAX, but I'm willing to bet the quality would be equal or better than COI at the same timeframe.