discussion comment
7 years ago
Local law enforcement's priorities & theories of crime reduction, local citizen outcry, plus potential cozy relationships between the club and law enforcement, dictate who gets busted. Here in SF, as a whole the citizens don't care, and law enforcement thinks some light prostitution in the clubs is better than street prostitution and potential slavery in AMPs. After many years of not busting strip clubs, some years back law enforcement made some arrests in a strip club, specifically to punish the embarrass the DA; the DA simply refused to file charges against any of the strippers or the club, absolutely NO FUCKS were given by the residents, and there has not been a bust since. Which, of course, leads to my usual rant of: this city had the potential to be the best SC city in the country (and arguably was, from mid-90s to mid-00s), given the progressive views on sexuality, but deja vu absolutely destroyed it, and the real estate prices have destroyed it further
discussion comment
7 years ago
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flagoonerEverything written by this member is a fact.
I, myself, am a "show me your ass" guy, but for the sake of brotherly unanimity, today I am a "show us your tits" guy.
discussion comment
7 years ago
Obviously enough, aside from strippers, there are zillions of women getting breast implants every year, and I'd bet a huge number of them are just your everyday average low-self-esteem partygirl chick with body image issues and a desperate need to feel hotter than other hot girls. In fact, most strippers, if they weren't stripping, would fit into that group as well. So, yes, I think that **if** they had the money, a decent percentage of strippers (25%? who knows -- but orders of magnitude more than the general population) of strippers who get boobjobs would get boobjobs anyway.
discussion comment
7 years ago
You have to tell by context. It's like how Mexicans say "orale". It means hello, goodbye, okay that sounds fine, what the fuck, fuck you, damn straight, etc. I don't have to stop and ask what they mean, I can tell a "what the fuck" from a "sounds fine, see you later"
ppwh's definitions are vaguely how it's used. I tend to use it to mean #1 -- a strip club aficionado, whose regular-in-love phase is years behind him, can see hustle for what it is at least half of the time, and who knows how to work the system. I almost never use it to mean "generic strip club customer" or "truly pathetic strip club customer", but it gets used that way, too.
discussion comment
7 years ago
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Doces300You can run but you will only die tired
-->"Or prop a bucket of cold water over the door so that it drenches them when they bust in"
That's what I'd do. I also often travel with a bottle of seltzer, and a pie, for these types of situations.
discussion comment
7 years ago
Nearly all of my OTCs begin with dinner, drinks, etc. Occasionally, events work their way into the OTC as well (I once took a stripper who was into art, to a great exhibit at the de Young, it was fun, then we had lunch, got drunk, and had sex. Perfect day).
Generally speaking, if I'm out with a stripper, it's for OTC. The main exception is that I'll sometimes take a stripper out for drinks immediately before her shift, just as some pre-shift-warmup, or immediately after her shift, for post-shift cooldown :)
Actually, now that I read Ishmael's response, there was a stripper who lived pretty close to me, and she would sometimes call me and ask if I wanted to go to lunch. I had lunch with her a bunch of times
discussion comment
7 years ago
My foot gon patronize your ass
discussion comment
7 years ago
Papi, was that in response to my post about the dead time between Thanksgiving and New Years? If so, I wasn't being hypothetical -- the time between Thanksgiving and New Years is significantly, unquestionably one of the slowest times of the year, and it's not even close. I am sure that like anything else, this could regional, and your city might be totally different, but in my city, it's a dead zone. I've doubled-down on this time period for many many years now!
I have my theories as to why -- if people are taking more time off they're spending it with family, people are feeling poor because they're spending $$$ on presents. I'm guessing that last reason (people are feeling poor) is why the 6 weeks leading up to tax day are slower, too.
discussion comment
7 years ago
Slightly off topic, I tend to double-down on my SC trips between Thanksgiving and New Years. This is the time when 1. the girls need money the most, and 2. the clubs tend to be relatively slower.
discussion comment
7 years ago
My CFs and many of the girls I just get dances with now and then, or even just buy drinks for, seem to know my stripper name. My ATFs often know my real name, which I'll tell them if they volunteer to tell me theirs (I don't ask). But I tend to spend most of my time at the same few clubs, and am decidedly not a variety guy, so easier for girls to get used to my face & name; I always have the phone # of CFs and ATFs so they have it right in their phone, hard to forget.
discussion comment
7 years ago
Hot civvies in the club is a mixed bag.
On the one hand, who doesn't love seeing another hot chick; and there's the undeniable extra appeal of unattainability. And, in clubs where it's allowed, often the girls get dragged and stage and stripped or flirted with, always incredibly fun when it happens.
On the downside, if the hot civvie is the hottest girl in the place, it's just fucking frustrating
discussion comment
7 years ago
I don't initiate discussion with other customers, I figure the vast majority of them want their privacy and anonymity. So for the most part, I keep to the PL Code, don't talk to other guys.
But when other customers initiate discussion with me, I'm happy to have a conversation, whether it's just pleasantries or more. My buddies and I have even once had the guys at the table next to us strike up a conversation, they were PLs like us and it was fun to swap info (and they had fantastic g2 on a club I hadn't been to yet), and we ended up pulling our tables together and hanging out and drinking and grabbing strippers together. Some of the customers are complete buttheads and I tend to just exchange a pleasantry and move on, but as with club staff, there's usually little downside to having someone to talk about sports with or whatever, especially if we're both between girls. I don't understand why spending 20 seconds just shooting the shit with staff or another customer is so stressful to some of you, or how it seems to completely distract you from being there for the girls.
discussion comment
7 years ago
I ONLY have strippers on my facebook, instagram, and snapchat; I'm not big on social media, otherwise. Among strippers:
Facebook: is usually for friends and family. As a result, there is often a carefully constructed facade of happy, clean living, good judgement, family orientation, taking steps to improve her life, and even Godliness (strippers love #blessed). Among the most interesting things about facebook is, intermingled with her family and civilian friends, will be her bff stripper friends... find one stripper's facebook, and generally you now know all of her in-club clique's facebooks; and if she has either the dj or the club manager on her facebook, now you have the entire club. For me, this is the main thing facebook is good for, doing research on your potential OTC, not for hot pics or the like.
Instagram: for friends only, heavy on the partying. The facade built around Instagram is different from Facebook -- it will be more constructed around what awesome food she eats, how she's always having an amazing time partying and going on vacations, and how fantastic things are going with her BF. None of these things are true, but that's the impression you'll get. You'll also see pics of her and her friends in bikinis and hot party dresses. Somewhat interesting for hot pics.
Snapchat: by far the best social media to have your stripper on. The mistaken impression that the videos posted there are temporary, means snapchat will have the raciest content. The ease of use of snapchat means that, in her more impulsive moments, and poor judgement moments, it's where the raciest spur-of-the-moment content ends up, especially when she's drunk. The mistaken impression of the transitive nature of pics and vids on snapchat, also means that if your relationship with her involves pic and vid exchange, you'll get by far the raciest private pics and vids through this medium. #1 social media to share with strippers.
The other advantage of social media is, most strippers lose their phone, break their phone, and/or change their number often, but they seem to always find a way to keep up with their social media. You can direct message her there, those times when she's incommunicado.
discussion comment
7 years ago
Papi-->"seems the hardcore escort guys are not into the hit or miss sex-aspect w.r.t. dancers/strip-clubs"
Yes, for sure. Aside from the certainty, I think other ways there are big differences:
- Escort guys tend to love the private, completely-solo aspect of the entire encounter. Strip club guys I think are more likely to enjoy the social part of the encounter. * *love* sitting in a room full of hot half-naked chicks for an hour or two before pulling the trigger.
- Escort guys often only value "dick in hole time", which is why 100% of the time they phrase their question, "why pay $300 for 15 minutes when you can pay $300 for an hour?". Strip club guys value the whole time they're at the strip club, and I doubt many of us go to the strip club for just 15 minutes. Watching dancers on stage and flirting at the table "count" as enjoyment time for us. The guys who don't value this, or find it a nuisance, always end up transitioning to escort guys, IME on my local forums.
- Escort guys are highly tolerant of the hit-or-miss aspect of escort sex, which is, in the end he's not sure what's on the other side of that door, but no matter what, he's going to fuck it (and despite claims above, in general doing your research only increases your odds, perhaps it avoids the "her pics are a 9 but she's a 5", but not the "her pics are a 9 but she's a 7"). Strip club guys highly value the fact that they know exactly how hot the stripper sitting next to them is, and if she has a good flirty hustle, she can rev his motor as if she were hotter anyway. For myself, I fucking HATE that door-opening moment. Meanwhile, it's VERY common on escort forums, "She opened the door and those pics of hers are at least 20 years old, she's older, gained 20 pounds, doesn't look so good. I was horny so I fucked her anyway." ***I was horny so I fucked her anyway***
discussion comment
7 years ago
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Doces300You can run but you will only die tired
When I was married I did layer upon layer of security :)
Base principles:
- Always have a change of clothes.
- At minimum, wash arms, face, and neck with soap and water before you get home. Preferably, take a shower.
- Have a 2nd line -- there's tradeoffs of hobby phone vs 2nd line app on your main phone. For me, best answer is solidly 2nd line app, but for others, hobby phone
- Always have a reason for being in the general area of the strip club. If you get into an accident, or a red light camera snaps your picture, or whatever, there should be no surprise that you were where you were. Reasons could include: I go to the city for work, once a month my buddy who lives in the city and I go to happy hour together, etc.
Layer examples:
- She looks in your car and sees the change of clothes. WTF do you have a change of clothes in your car? Answer: it's in my gym bag, and she knows I go to the gym, and my gym bag is always in my trunk. I have gym clothes in my gym bag, in case I go to the gym from work and need to change. And I have regular clothes in my gym bag, in case I go to the gym straight from home, and then need to shower and change into work clothes after my workout.
Overall, I'd have an explanation for things like: why were you in the city on Thursday? Why do you have a change of clothes in your car? Why do you have a 2nd phone?
discussion comment
7 years ago
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Doces300You can run but you will only die tired
Okay, as much as I love JS, and I do think he's a fantastic contributor, I find the entire concept of "Dream Stripper" to be douche-chill-causing juvenile nonsense. I can't help it, if someone asks me "how much do you pay for DS OTC", my first reaction is to ask them what the hell they're thinking. Hell, if you've internalized the concept of "dream stripper", you're already at a disadvantage in that you can talk yourself into anything.
So, pretending you were asking about OTC with my ATF, who I'm in total lust over and whose company I really enjoy, I might be aligned with shadow, I could probably talk myself into an extra hunnit. That's it.
While there's no right or wrong on this particular topic, I personally am NOT interested in paying an exhorbitant amount to bang some hot chick just once, especially since I think the sex gets better the next handful of times. So there's no amount of hotness that's going to get me paying $1000 a pop, because that's just not a sustainable number for me. Sure, I can afford spending $1000 once, but it's a non-starter to pay that amount 10 times, so not interested in bothering, and not interested in paying a whole lot more than I usually do. Totally understand some of you guys are fine with one-and-done, and if that was my philosophy, I might be talked into a far higher fee, once
discussion comment
7 years ago
FT: I don't think there's any downside to asking explicitly no matter what the context, although even if there was, I think it's best to optimize for the 99.999% case where she isn't really into you, vs the .001% case where she might be (I may be drastically over-estimating the % where she might be into you :)
In any case, when it comes to domination in the strip club, I am even MORE demanding that explicit consent be obtained, as long as constant monitoring that the intensity level is appropriate and welcome, at least until you get to know her well enough that you understand her limits. In short, I'm doubling down on asking explicitly, especially for your incredibly unlikely scenario: she will not be turned off by the fact that you're seeking to understand her limits.
discussion comment
7 years ago
-->"OTOH, I have had instances where the girl was willing but a bouncer spied the action and put a threatening stop to it and later pulled the dancer aside. "
An interesting aside here, I am quite certain that what you described happens often. But it's also pretty often the case that the bouncer's timing isn't as impeccable as you think, the girls all have ways to signal the bouncer. Some of the girls like leaving the impression, "I'm willing... if not for that dastardly bouncer". I remember an old ATF of mine telling me all the ways she got the bouncer's attention that she wanted him to come in and reduce the contact without getting the good-paying customer irritated with her. She'd distract the customer in some way -- usually putting her breasts, ass, or pussy in his face, but basically anything that would block his view of her face -- and then she'd making quick eye contact with the bouncer and a short nod, or if he was not in the room, look straight at the camera and do the same thing. Lo and behold, bouncer appearance and warning. Then she could tell the customer how she loved it and how she wished that bouncer would mind his own business, etc. I imagine that they could always stage the "bouncer pulls her aside" as the final bit of theater.
Anyway, like I said, very often I think it's just the bouncer catching things on his own, but the girls do have ways to surreptitiously signal them
discussion comment
7 years ago
While I still do the "slowly move your fingers towards ground zero and see if she intercepts" method, these days I almost always stop my fingers just outside the demilitarized zone (that is, just outside her g-string) and ask, "May I touch?".
In the old days, I had this notion in my head that if you ask, that just gives the girl opportunity to think about it and say no, whereas if you just went for it, she might let you slide. These days, I think it's the opposite: a girl who doesn't want you to touch her pussy is going to stop you regardless of whether you ask or not, a girl who will let you touch her pussy will let you do it regardless, but a girl who is on the fence or decides on a case-by-case basis is more likely to allow a guy she can trust to respect her limits (that is, the guy who asks). As anyone who SCs with a group of guys knows, strippers sometimes let one guy do something that she won't let another guy do, and I suspect her trust level ("if I let him touch my pussy, will he just shove his finger in without asking?") is part of what determines this.
In short: particularly for CFers who will be seeing the same girl over and over, I see all-upside no-downside in asking explicitly. Things may be different for variety guys for whom every girl is new to them.
discussion comment
7 years ago
My long answer is here: https://www.tuscl.net/?page=post&id=44731 That article focuses on OTC with strippers -- which is 1000x better than any escort experience, and since OTC is something that's done with strippers, that is an answer by itself. But, I think you're asking about ITC, and while I think the answer isn't quite as compelling, there is an answer.
BEAUTY: We start with the fact that when that escort opens the door for the first time, she won't be as hot as her pics, and the excitement is in how MUCH less hot she'll be ... which is a type of excitement I don't exactly love. More generally, hot strippers are far hotter than hot mid-priced escorts; I'd claim you could go to a decent strip club on a Saturday night, and probably see 15 strippers who are as hot as the hottest escort you've been with.
LUST and the HOTNESS of the overall experience: With an escort, you have an hour to get in, get to know each other a few minutes, shower, 50 minutes of sex, shower, go home. With a stripper, with many of us PLs, we're getting horny looking at the stage shower, getting even hornier doing a lap dance or two with her, flirting out on the floor ... suffice it to say, it's not uncommon that by the time I'm walking into the booth with that stripper, I'm a dysfunctional mess of lust, and THAT leads to far more amazing sex, even for 15 minutes, even in a little booth. As opposed to how I feel with an escort -- still a little stressed from trying to find a decent parking spot in the fucking city that's near her place, still a little disappointed that her pic is a 9 but she's a 7 (but meanwhile, I get to fuck legit 9s at the strip club), trying to decide how much I like her based on our 2 minutes of inorganic smalltalk before I went to shower. That's not even taking into account the fact that strippers often do things like send naked pics and snaps to get me revved up beforehand.
TIME is TIME is TIME: This statement of yours might be the ultimate difference between our outlooks: "why go into a tiny closet for 15 minutes when you can dial up a escort for the same money or less and spend 60 minutes". Many of us here love going to strip clubs. I personally love being out and about among people, in a strip club, watching girls gyrate on poles, watching gorgeous girls wander around in g-strings, getting dances, flirting and drinking. I'm often in the club of 3 hours -- and every second is a second I enjoy. I get it that for you, the only time you value is the time your dick is in a hole. Nothing wrong with that! And of course, with that type of value, you won't value the rest of the time at a strip club. For me, I value all my time at the strip club, and I "count" all that time as our time together; and even if my dick is only in a hole for 15 minutes, I want it to be 15 mind-blowing minutes with a chick who has driven me crazy.
THE BOTTOM LINE: Even if the two of us spend the same amount, here's the tally based on my personal values: 1. You were with a 7, I was with a 9, 2. We spent the same amount but you had fun for 50 minutes (minus shower time), I had fun for 3 hours, 3. You walked in in whatever frame of mind you were in, I got a lot of time of flirting and lust, 4. You got 50 minutes of ok sex, I got 15 minutes of fantastic if not mind-blowing sex.
Anyway, I realize nearly everything I said above is subjective and you could argue with all of it, and you might be right for you, and I'm right for me. Just giving you the view of someone who loves strip clubs. For myself, the bottom line is this: I am not a "I just want my dick in a hole for as long as possible, nothing else matters" guy, and I personally do not enjoy or value the escort experiences I"ve had, and don't bother partaking. For me, it's strippers, seeking arrangements, or sensual massage.
discussion comment
7 years ago
TL;DR on my previous post: my guess is that the variety guys will say they are looking for quality, too -- their notion of quality is just different than an ATFers notion. "quality vs quantity" is a bit unfair way to put it, perhaps; "familiarity vs quantity" is probably more fair. The variety guys are not looking for a low-quality experience.
discussion comment
7 years ago
I think the thing to keep in mind is that for some people, these are the same things. It's been over a decade since I switched from a primarily-variety guy to a primarily-ATF guy, but I remember that back in my variety days, the variety WAS the quality -- that is, the heart-pounding excitement of a new girl's hand going down my pants was more exciting than anything that was happening with some girl I already knew, even if that girl was technically better.
These days, my perception of quality is "high mileage and kinky, WITH a girl I know well enough that she turns me on to the point that I"m a horny dysfunctional mess even before we step into the booth or hotel room". So total pursuit of quality, which for me means my goal is always to have at least a CF if not ATF
discussion comment
7 years ago
I like talking to strippers in general, and enjoy talking to them in dances, provided the context is right. E.g.,
- Any and all sex talk is good :)
- Any non-sex talk, as long as it is interesting and fun, is fine, as long as I get extra latitude to let my hands roam while this is going on. I sometimes verbally make it clear to the stripper that that's the quid-pro-quo. I'll say it in the form of a compliment, "I love when you look in my eyes and we talk about fun things, and you ignore my hands roaming while it's going on; such a turn on to have a regular conversation while we're doing something perverted". Okay, I don't think I phrase it quite so dorkily, but you get the idea: I thank her for something, sometimes mid-dance, that she might not have realized is going on. Often, from then on it's "our thing", and I'm happy.
discussion comment
7 years ago
I don't kiss girls in extras clubs.
Do kiss girls in non-extras clubs, LK is fine
discussion comment
7 years ago
1. When I read the headline, my immediate thought was that you'd gotten ass-to-mouth in a car. I'm not sure if I'm disappointed or relieved you meant automatic teller machine.
2. Tough crowd, man! $40 is chump change for most of us, so if it works out for you, great. Like many of the guys above, I might have handled it differently -- even though $40 isn't a ton of money, I'm still not particularly inclined to give away money for free to strippers, "her driver" = "her boyfriend" and I'm not at all interested in any interaction there, and damn, at 5am I'm not about to do anything other than concentrate on softening my morning wood so I can go pee, much less check up on my stripper to see what she's spending her money on :) But again, if this was a mistake, it's a relatively cheap one on your part.