discussion comment
11 years ago
Let's do a Tosh.O-style breakdown, item-by-item:
1. Clubs are as creepy as you make them. If you're gentlemanly, they're not creepy. You can be polite, well-mannered, thoughtful and intelligent -- as long as you're open-minded about sexuality and pleasure, and your dancer is as well, it's not creepy. If anything, it's more real about what our instincts are than everyday life! Now granted, if you're there in a group and you know not everyone is comfortable, then it's creepy. But this is why the only time I was ever at a club in a group (with a bachelor party of friends) I felt awkward, whereas by myself, no problem.
If you're looking to the other guys in the club to see how to act, you'll feel like the place is creepy. If you feel like a creep, you'll be creepy. If you know what you want to do isn't what the dancer wants to do, or try to push her to do things she doesn't want to do, it's creepy. If not ... then it's not creepy.
Item 1 -- wrong.
2. Again, it's as degrading as you allow it to be. No one forces girls to strip. Do some do it because they feel they have to and don't want to? Sure. Those are generally the ones I try and avoid. There are ones that actually enjoy it, work at it and are good at it.
I have money earned elsewhere from my talents and skills, you have talent and skill I would like to purchase. I make you happy by giving you what you want. You make me happy by giving me what I want. How is this degrading to anyone?
Item 2 -- wrong again.
3. OK, this is true. But if you toss #1 and #2 and you consider what you're getting: A beautiful woman, doing exactly what you want her to do, in private, with basically no concern of it ruining your marriage, relationship, job status, whatever, which it might if you did it in public? I'd say that's worth a lot of money. The market plays itself out perfectly, if you ask me.
Item 3 -- right, but those who are cheap will end up getting the $13.50-worth of enjoyment 'Frozen' gives you, versus the $600 worth of enjoyment a CR with a 9/10 and maybe something extra will give you. You get what you pay for, and my friend, I will have walked away from life a lot happier for spending money on what I spent it on than you did for watching animated movies.
4. ... seriously? Do you consider sex to be uncomfortably intimate? Guess what? If you want someone to do things to you in places on you they might think are a little disgusting, then you might have to deal with things that are a little disgusting. Grow some you-know-whats and deal with it.
Item 4 -- I don't even think "uncomfortably intimate" is possible with an attractive woman. Dana Carvey as John McLaughlin: Wrong!
5. Take a shower and wash your clothes afterwards and it'll be fine. This kind of goes back to #4. Ever been with a woman, author? It's wet and sometimes kind of sticky down there if you're doing it right, plus, while it shouldn't smell like a sewer or bread, it also won't smell like a flower, either. But that's not disgusting. You realize the enjoyment she's getting and say, "That's glorious." What you get in return far outweighs what you deal with.
Item 5 -- true, but again, missing the point.
6. ... huh? There are some dancers that are really, really good on the pole, and they tend to be really, really good with LDs and CRs, too. This just in: If you feel like they're being ignored, it's because YOU'RE IGNORING THEM! If that's what you're into, tip her on-stage then take her back for ... oh yeah, #3, you're too cheap to actually reward the girls who are worth rewarding, which is your own damn fault.
Item 6 -- no they don't. Wrong.
7. Not every guy in the club is desperate. If there's nothing that appeals to me on a given night, I will leave and save my confederate dollars for another day. If you know what you're doing, you will commit to only spending on what or whom you feel is worth spending on and pass on what or whom you feel you can pass on. Clubs only represent "dudes at their worst" if the dudes themselves decide to be at their worst. If anything, I feel like I'm at my best in a club because I'm dressing nicely, being respectful and honest and giving my money to some hard-working folks who deserve it.
Item 7 -- wrong.
8. ... [headshake]. Why are you thinking about whether or not you should have a boner? What kind of a self-conscious PL are you? Are you looking to see if other guys have boners? If you are, then maybe you should be at the club downstairs with the beefcake guys stripping. Do you think anyone else cares if you have a boner? No. Do the dancers care if you have a boner? NO! Their job is to give you a boner! The thought being that if you have a boner, you are feeling good and should feel appreciative to the dancer for making you feel that way and tip accordingly.
Item 8 -- if your dick wants to get hard, and your brain is telling you it shouldn't, it's not your penis that's confused, it's you. So. F'ing. Wrong.
Net sum from what I get in this article: If this is truly a representative view of the supposed "majority" of American men who "hate" strip clubs (I hope not), it begins to make sense to me why most people are so messed up and, frankly, dumb. We are human beings -- smart, but still animals, and animals have an instinct to look for attractive traits in the opposite sex and want to mate. Sure, sometimes there are slight mutations in that instinct -- take the 10 percent of the population who is not heterosexual. Fine. Follow that instinct then. And there's probably a percent of the population who's asexual. Fine. I'm OK with letting those folks be who they are. But I'll be damned if there isn't a large section of the population who would love clubs if their heads weren't screwed on so damn incorrectly, be it by religion, spouses, overbearing parents or what. And they're the ones that make it so difficult and expensive for the rest of us who are more in touch with what really makes us happy.
Screw this guy and his F'd-up thinking. If it were up to him, the most fun thing we'd get to do would be to take our buddies and kids to go see 'Frozen'. What an asshat.
discussion comment
11 years ago
It's going to be different woman to woman and situation to situation. It's generally understood, if we go out or get a meal together, I'm paying and it doesn't get listed. But with day-to-day, she pays some of the bills, I pay some and we balance it out.
There isn't a huge disparity in our income -- the monthly ratio is usually about 60/40 in my favor. But I also incur more costs to get to and from work and pay in more, too. If the disparity was wider, a different model where some of mine ends up being hers might be in order.
We've both agreed it really works well and we have no plans on changing it if we step things up a notch or two.
discussion comment
11 years ago
@Clubber: Correct. We live together, but aren't married yet.
FWIW, she's been divorced once already and her ex royally F'd her credit, so she's all about being in complete control of her own finances. I'm OK with that, as I have great credit (got a mortgage on my own) and she's done a great job of doing everything she can to repair hers.
discussion comment
11 years ago
Wish I lived in an area where you knew you could drop your pants. Where I live, out-and-out drop your pants and the bouncer will have you out before you get them back on.
Nice, thin slacks, no belt, loose cotton boxers, dress shirt. Look sharp, get the most worthwhile talent.
discussion comment
11 years ago
Since my habit predated my meeting my SO, it factored into my thinking when I set up our financial plan:
No shared account at all. We keep a monthly spreadsheet where we input our "shared" expenses (rent, groceries, etc.) and also all our monthly income.
At the end of the month, we take our income ratio, apply it to our net expenses to see what we would have contributed if we did have a shared account and figure out who owes who what to balance it out. Because I pay the rent, usually she owes me. Sure, the more we earn in a given month, the larger fraction we pay, but we never earn less than our expenses, so it still pays to make more.
She loves it because she knows she can use her own cash to shop for whatever she wants. I love it because, yeah, the club.
Finding the time to get to the club is more of a concern than where the money comes from.
discussion comment
11 years ago
West side. Brad's is on the east side. All is well.
Far as I'm concerned, only reasons to be on the west side are to be at the racetrack or the airport.
discussion comment
11 years ago
I wonder how many of those 75 percent have been to a strip club. And what percent are religious or not, our what percent had to take the survey with their SO listening/watching.
Also, I hate shopping. Get me in and get me out.
The rest doesn't surprise me, notably the manicure part. I once read that the late Bernie Mac thought getting his nails taken care of was the most important part of his grooming routine and he knew he wasn't the only one in his crew who felt that way.
Honestly, you should take care of those nails, guys. Let's just say that your hands can give a lady a lot of pleasure if you use them right, but in the most sensitive of sensitive lady parts, pointy corners or rough edges down there don't feel real good. Raise your game, gents.
discussion comment
11 years ago
I've been approached a few times about two-girl dances. If I like both girls, I usually say I'll get one from each and more from the girl I like better. Make 'em work.
One time, though, I bit. I had gotten dances from both girls before and both were great. One was your prototypical fantasy big-boobed blonde. The other, also blonde and also big-boobed, but we had gotten dances the last time I was there, in which we found out we were from the same hometown (100 miles away where the club was). That first time, we really hit it off with our conversation and she gave a stellar dance. I had to tell her to take it easy on me at one point, lest I LDK, which I didn't think she'd want.
So I go again and the one blonde tells me it's the other's (the one from my hometown's) birthday. They say we should get dances as a group of three. The hometown blonde is drunk, but remembers me. Must have liked me, too, because she had the other blonde entertain me with her rack while she put little Jimmy between her own breasts and said, "This time, I -want- you to finish."
Let's just say they we all walked away happy and two ladies got good tips.
discussion comment
11 years ago
Also a cat guy. Have one now. Had one as a kid.
In between cats, had a goldfish for a while named Tiger. Named for what appeared to be tiger-like stripes on the fish, but also dropped a Nike golf ball in there in honor of my secret hero. Face it: We all wish we could be the best golfer in the world and bang every piece of tail that comes along and catches your attention, right?
discussion comment
11 years ago
I dunno. There's one club I've only been to three times in the last nine months or so. The second time I went, like two or so months after the first time, two of the dancers I got dances from the previous trip not only sought me out on stage and remembered me, but remembered specific details of our first conversation.
Can you be a regular after two visits?
discussion comment
11 years ago
Yeah, never ever had a girl tell me it was her last night or even if her last night was coming up soon. Closest I think I've come is a woman say she was flying to Sweden for a month the next day. She still came back and I did see her again.
If I was in that spot, I would definitely shoot for a phone number. Public retirement doesn't prohibit private shows. But if she didn't give one, would probably just treat it like any other night. I've never been so hung up on any one that I can't look at others.
discussion comment
11 years ago
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Papi_ChuloMiami, FL (or the nearest big-booty club)
HDTV probably hurt porn more than it helped it. The ability to hide flaws, wrinkles, cellulite, etc., goes away when soft-lighting and analog have to give way to 1080p and extreme, detail-revealing definition. Porn and local news, LOL. Not sure that cranking up the level of detail will help.
Also not sure that charging for it will help, either. One of the things that makes Internet porn so nice for guys is that if you're the least bit smart about your browsing history and/or using Incognito mode on your browser, there's basically no trail someone who's not real tech savvy (i.e. most spouses) can trace. No tapes to hide, no charges to explain, nothin' except maybe some Kleenex. That 99 cents shows up on a credit card bill somehow and, hard as you try go be discrete, someone figures it out eventually.
They caught music downloading while it was in its relative infancy and also made iTunes play so nice with the first uber-easy digital music player, the iPod. There's no special viewing device that a porn company to use to revolutionize it.
I'm not really sure you can adequately monetize that market right now. The house has left the barn.
discussion comment
11 years ago
Hopefully the club is smart enough to know when to cut someone off.
While the club may not necessarily be financially liable, I will say this: It's my hope the club does what's best for ALL it's customers. Goes back to something said in another thread: The last thing you want to have happen at a club is getting robbed, shot, arrested, whatever. Not only would that suck, there's the added stigma of it happening at a club and your wife, family, parents, employer, etc., passing judgement on your use of free time in addition to the hardship. Clubs know this, and (you hope) clubs budget for adequate security to avoid that happening -- bouncers, parking lot cameras/security, etc. Heck, I once misplaced a newish phone in a club, and I give the club credit -- the last girl I was with and a number of available bouncers helped with search and we did find it between the cushions of a bar chair. That's good club customer service and a way to ensure someone comes back.
I, personally, would also be OK with a club budgeting for the occasional cab ride home for the drunk dude that would otherwise hop in his car and hit eight other cars in the parking lot on his way out were he to try and drive home. If that makes my cover go up a buck or two, it's worth it to not have to explain that an accident happened in strip club parking lot.
Does that mean that a guy who blows a .09 after he hits three pedestrians six miles from the club should be able to join the victim's families in a lawsuit against the club for its serving him? No. But the club should step up a little in the foresight to make sure the really obvious potential problem children don't create larger issues.
discussion comment
11 years ago
The site Danni's Hard Drive used to have a weekly POV lapdance video. Had some good talent, too: Shauna O'Brien, Veronika Zemanova, Akira Lane, etc. A lot of those videos are now in the public domain, ahem. If you search Kowalsky Page or whatever your favorite adult video site is for "lapdance," you'll find something.
Just remember, when you actually get one in person, follow the rules of the club you're in, at least the first few times. Nothing ruins a visit like not knowing the limits and being "escorted out" by one of the bouncers (and by "escorted out," I mean a 350-pound former D3 defensive tackle will try to see how hard he has to throw you to make you skip across the pavement like a rock across a pond).
After a few trips, you'll become more Neo-like and understand how some rules can be bent and others broken.
discussion comment
11 years ago
There are four possible combinations of ugly/hot and good dance/bad dance.
Fair to say I've had all four.
Protip: The better the club, generally speaking, the more likely the hot girls will be good dancers.
discussion comment
11 years ago
First job out of school: Went for four months part-time, then 10 months full-time. New boss for the last two months was a jerk. Quit.
Second job: Promoted after one year, laid off after two and a half more.
Current job: Getting on towards three and a half years. Starting to get antsy. Realizing it was kind of dead-end.
Do a lot of side jobs to supplement the income. Longest stretch in one of those is seven years and counting. Wish I could do my side jobs for a living, but I would make about 1/5 of what I make at the day job. Oh well.
discussion comment
11 years ago
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Papi_ChuloMiami, FL (or the nearest big-booty club)
Funny you should say that, Papi.
Real-world chicks at a bar aren't fun. They're typically out in a group where at least one of them is a major cockblocker. They trump up their standards so flippin' high and the most you can maybe hope for is conversation, a phone number and a drawn-out dating process if you're out alone. And I wasn't the type to gather three or four other douchebags I don't really want to hang out with up to be "wingmen."
In the age of safe sex, I really don't understand why women are so uptight about it. I'm not here to hurt you or get you pregnant. I have fun, you have fun, if we like it, we do it again sometime. Seems simple enough.
But instead, silly games. I decided early on it was easier to pay a little extra and just get to the point at a SC. I enjoy myself a lot more in the end. Heck, even if it's fake attention just to get money ... who cares. But I even feel like girls who find me in the club end up actually kind of liking to talk to me, whereas I probably wouldn't get the time of day from that same girl in a bar because she or her friends would be thinking they could get someone taller, richer (looking), more athletic or whatever.
discussion comment
11 years ago
First off, it's rare for me to get dances from a girl without talking to her for a good amount of time first, like at least 15 minutes or so. To me, that's the first thing you have to do: Prove you're not a psycho killer and actually try and build a little rapport with the dancer. If she's willing to talk that long without getting pushy for dances, and hasn't turned me off, onto Stage Two.
From there, it's about dance quality. If there's sufficient two-way contact, onto Stage Three.
I will politely ask if I can ask a question, then ask if she's "available independently." To me, that's pretty straightforward without actually saying it. It shows you have a level of discretion and aren't looking to "date," but are interested and able to do more, elsewhere, if she's interested.
I, too, believe it's a matter of finances. We can do a room, have to adhere to all kinds of rules and the club keeps half, or we can GET a room, have twice the fun and she keeps it all. We both get greater value. Again, given I can prove I can be trusted not to abuse her, get her arrested, get her fired or get her pregnant, which I won't, won't, won't and won't, I don't see how it's not advantageous. Heck, maybe she'll even enjoy it a little. :)
Granted, the type of girl that gets past Stage One for me usually doesn't like Stage Three because she's usually that girl the article talked about who became a dancer BECAUSE she didn't want to "work independently." But since I'm polite, she's usually polite about turning it down, too. Have had some interesting results on very rare occasions, though.
I even kind of use this methodology when turning down rooms. "Sorry, I like to save my money for things that are more fun," I'll say. If she asks what, I'll say, "Things you can't do here." Usually makes it clear.
discussion comment
11 years ago
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Papi_ChuloMiami, FL (or the nearest big-booty club)
RL's right that there are a lot of plausible reasons.
I do think some girls are only there for the drugs, sadly.
Others, on the much better end, are actually there because they enjoy it, as long as they can stick to somewhat classy guys. These will probably not hustle as much but simply be on the lookout for the "good ones."
Still others are just lazy, which is how they ended up being a stripper to begin with. And some do lack confidence. You would hope a good club manager would help coach girls how to have that so the could be a better earner, but most managers probably aren't that smart or just figure the drugs will do the trick.
discussion comment
11 years ago
Dougster's got it right.
I feel bad for Marilyn. No one ever really looked out for her, including her. Marry and keep her from spiraling.
Bardot didn't stay pretty for too long. Hit it and quit it.
Fawcett had one good moment -- the poster. Other than that, I'd take the other two over her.
discussion comment
11 years ago
A few more questions would have to be asked to make sure this wasn't the female version of Patrick Bateman. Also, some other variables would have to be considered -- "average looks" means this person may or may not even be worth considering for this proposition. What flips my lid might not flip yours. Also, the area around the club and/or if I even know the area matters, too.
This is kind of the adult version of a kid having a stranger asking them to get in the van for candy. Caveat emptor.
I will say this: Went to a club one night when there was a feature. It was some dancer with inhumanly sized fake boobs. Group of nice, 20-something girls came out just to see that spectacle. Got to talking with one. Ended up tagging along with them to another, non-dance bar. Didn't get anywhere with any of them, but, was with the effort.
discussion comment
11 years ago
If it's a club with a cam, they better darn well make sure only the girls are on it. Last thing I want is to no longer be Anonymous.
discussion comment
11 years ago
Correction to the second word of the second paragraph: I'm TRYING, not GOING.
discussion comment
11 years ago
As I've aged, I've tended to prefer slightly older dancers. I feel creepy now getting dances from girls who look fresh out of high school.
I'm going not to be the guy at the club when I'm so old that actually dating girls the age of those who work at clubs wouldn't be seen as normal in real life. I wouldn't be able to buy into the fantasy at that point. We'll see, though.
discussion comment
11 years ago
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Papi_ChuloMiami, FL (or the nearest big-booty club)
Didn't ever sound like my cup of tea, but I wonder about repercussions, namely if that means dancers/customers will move onto other places.
Also, when I saw that review pop up, I Googled to see if I could find a news story on it and I couldn't. In all seriousness, if this happened, hope everyone not only got out OK but got to someplace safe from fire but still sufficiently warm, too. Much as we all love the clubs, I don't think a one of us would want to go that way in one. Heart attack during an epic dance, maybe. Fire, no thanks.