discussion comment
10 years ago
Honestly, I think this whole thing makes the NFL look really bad.
There are ways in which the NFL should try to be "old school," namely promoting the old-school style toughness that guys like Nitschke and Butkus had. But there are ways in which you just have to get out of the 50's & 60's.
Distilling this down, here's how this looks:
OWNERS: "Oooh, idea! We can have sexy women that we have do our bidding and can treat however we want. OK, let's have them, and make them sell calendars, and force them to buy those calendars in bulk so we make sure we make money off them, and make them do fundraisers where we and our friends can grope them, and pay them as little as possible because we're giving them a 'privilege' and 'honor' because we say so and because they like attention, especially the harassing kind. They know they want it, even if they say they don't."
SOME CHEERLEADERS: "Oooh, yes, daddy, we'll do whatever you want. And we don't need any compensation, and we'll let you tell us when we should remove our tampons, and we'll let guys harass us at fundraisers we don't see a dime from because we're doing it for you, daddy."
MOST WOMEN: "Um ... doesn't look all that appealing to me for any amount of money, much less that little. No thanks."
OTHER CHEERLEADERS: "OK, tried to do this and, not only is it crazy, it's demeaning and, oh yeah, ILLEGAL. Lawsuit!"
OWNERS: "Oh, try to question our authority, eh? Fine. Be gone, women. You are inferior to us men and didn't deserve what little you got."
SOME CHEERLEADERS (notably the Buffalo Jills Alumni): "No, daddy, don't do that! Those OTHER cheerleaders are just bad eggs. We'll be good, promise! We'll do it for nothing! And we'll add 20 pages to our requirements book and make dinner for you every night! Now, let us crawl over to you and make you forget about the whole thing, hunny-wunny ... "
How is this not stuck in an era that isn't today?
I know this comes out odd as a strip-club goer, which many see as demeaning to women as well, but I treat girls well when I go, tip well and am generally polite and respectful. I'm helping them have a better life if I feel like they're helping me feel good, which usually means I try to avoid the drugged-up, tatted-up ones that aren't good with money and try to find the ones who actually kind of enjoy it, or at least fake it really well, and seem to be somewhat put together.
I have relatively little tolerance for guys who don't treat women well. Or just other people, in general, well. They kind of ruin it for the rest of us. And these owners ... yeah. Many got to where they are by being stingy and mean, taking money for themselves rather than giving it to employees, such that they could amass a fortune worthy of buying a football team. Not sure they're folks we really want to look up to.
Honestly, it's starting to get to the point where the only reason I follow the NFL is because I'm a fan of my team, the Packers, of whom my fellow fans are the owners and who are probably the smallest contributor to the nonsense that goes on at the highest levels of the league. Otherwise, the NFL ... looking pretty bad right now.
discussion comment
10 years ago
Overrated: Jessica Biel. Face isn't that pretty. Not much up top. Don't get it.
Underrated: Anna Kendrick. Reminds me a little of Joan Severance. Has potential.
discussion comment
10 years ago
Copy-pasting from a comment I made a while ago. Almost feel like I should put this in my bio page:
---
I feel like the strip club is one of the few places where we can feed or only real, hard-wired desires in life. I think we're all hard-wired for just a few things: A want for food, clothing and comfortable shelter (to survive), a want to have sex/be sexual (theoretically for reproduction, but we've been able to limit that part) and a want to sleep (so we're at our strongest when needed to fight off others for the necessities and the chance to have sex). That's all we really want.
The club gets rid of the pretenses. Here's something I really want for something you really want. Perhaps the only thing I really want since I can get all the necessities myself, but I myself don't have awesome boobs, ergo, I need someone else to provide them for me. So, I'll give you cash so you can provide yourself and yours with the necessities in exchange for you giving me the one thing I can't give myself. Seems so simple and sensible that I almost don't get why folks who think it out would have any problem with it whatsoever. (Darn moralists, monogamists, etc., not getting it.)
For those who get it, and are OK with that, I feel like they've reached another, higher plane of existence. A better oneness with themselves and their distilled-down needs such that they see how, on the whole, all this is about is making people, yourself included, happy.
---
Meanwhile, Dan Savage outlines my views on monogamy quite well in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8SOQEitsJI
However, he hints at but doesn't fully acknowledge is that, for most people, culture looks down on non-monogamy, including your wife, your kids, the folks you do business with, etc. So, for those of us with a stronger-than-average non-monogamy bent, for whatever reason good or bad, we have to hide it.
Could I go to a bar, try and pick up a random chick that might be better looking than anyone I can get at a club and probably spend a lot less than I do at the club? Sure. But I'm more likely to get caught, shamed by everyone I know, have to deal with all the other trappings of a random chick other than the physical gratification I wanted, etc. And, honestly, I love my girlfriend, as you love your wife and kids. I want her to feel good about herself and not like she has a substandard man, even if I feel like the reasoning I would be seen as substandard by society is ultimately dumb, given what Savage says in the video. It's not like I'm not taking care of my girlfriend. She's happy with me. It's just that, as I like to put it, you wouldn't expect me to eat the same food for every meal or wear the same style of clothing or have one and only one friend I hang out with, every day, for the rest of my life ... why I should I expect the same kind of sexual satisfaction from the same person all the time?
Part of the reason you pay what you do at the club is the same reason you pay what you do for an escort: Your natural needs get met, and none of what happens leaves the walls of the building. Do it right, and you can do it the rest of your life with no one knowing and no ill effects. It's a service, and it's a damn good one, given how messed up everyone else is.
So yeah, that's how I look at it: As long as it doesn't get to the point where it impedes you from taking care of yourself or your family, where you spend your rent or your kid's braces money on the club, or you're missing family events to go out ... I wouldn't feel bad about it.
discussion comment
10 years ago
Interesting.
Never been to Club O. Have not heard good things about Harvey -- I believe that's where "The Blues Brothers" shot the mall scene, then the mall sat abandoned for 30 years -- but hey, maybe it's turned around some since they tore that place down.
I've also never clubbed south of Indianapolis, and have heard good things about South Florida mileage. I think all of us in Wisconsin and all parts of Illinois not near St. Louis agree we could use some places with mileage that aren't backwoods townie bars.
However, the reviews of Tootsies Miami don't paint a rosy picture in that regard. Afraid this might just be another overpriced Chicago club in a sketchy area.
Oh well.
discussion comment
10 years ago
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Papi_ChuloMiami, FL (or the nearest big-booty club)
This is common at Wisconsin's Silk chain of clubs. Dances are generally $20 per, but every 90 minutes they run a "special" where they're two for $40 but you also get a shirt.
I never liked it because, really, what do you do with the shirt? The dancers didn't like it because they had to sell one a night, otherwise yes, they had to "buy" the shirt. In the end, the girl lost out on the promo, and the songs were usually shorter, too, so the guy lost out as well.
After it was explained to me how the promo worked, I just started asking a girl I was kinda digging if a promo came up, "Do you need to do yours? OK, I'll handle it, but you dispose of the shirt somehow. If not, then let's wait and I'll hit you up after it's done." I think everyone was happier in the end.
They did, on occasion, substitute in free entry passes or, once, even a cheap porn DVD. These were better options, IMHO.
discussion comment
10 years ago
Go to one of the nicer places that has an online way (text, coupon, whatever) to get free cover.
Find the hottest woman in the building.
Tell her to give me all she's got for one glorious song.
discussion comment
10 years ago
New outfit is the first thing that pops into my head. All her if she can save the surprise for your next visit.
discussion comment
10 years ago
Anything related to computers. If you don't have tech smarts nowadays, you're way behind the curve.
discussion comment
10 years ago
My first instinct in any bad situation is to run. Maybe not literally run, but move quickly and get out of the situation. Escalate and there's a good chance there's a bouncer punching you 10 times harder than she could. You can heal, puke, come up with a story as to why you're bruised, etc., all much better on your own than I'd you get sent to the hospital.
Of course, I have a pretty good sense for both avoiding people who are angry types and for sensing when people are getting pissed, so I'm thinking this will not be something I'll be encountering.
discussion comment
10 years ago
With apologies to SlickSpic, I liked a headline I saw elsewhere better:
Wu-Tang man GOT nothing to fuck with
discussion comment
10 years ago
Got about $500 back from both, but I'm recovering from a surgery, so it will languish for a while before it ends up in a dancer's hands because my body's not ready to handle full grindage yet and won't for another few weeks. Or it will go towards my health care deductible. One or the other.
I don't mind a refund. Everyone seems to believe that investing more in a workforce generally leads to better results ... except with government, when everyone thinks the share they give is too high and everyone tries to finagle their way out of paying theirs. I believe in helping the common good, so I figure my $500 loan makes up for at least a few people who don't want to help others. You can thank me later.
discussion comment
10 years ago
It says 37 companies paid in. It could be possible that many clubs are owned by the same parent company.
The last couple times I went to Scores (which will probably be the last couple times I go to Scores), they made you pay the flat $3. At Polekatz, though, it was never brought up.
discussion comment
10 years ago
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shailynnThey never tell you what you need to know.
Based simply on my limited experience:
1. Detroit (one SC visit)
2. Indianapolis (three visits)
3. Chicago
T4. Milwaukee/Madison, Wis.
5. Rockford, Ill. (two visits)
6. Stevens Point, Wis. (two visits)
discussion comment
10 years ago
My batting average with OTC isn't even at mendoza, probably closer to .050, so I think it's fair to say that if I sense it might be a possibility, I'm taking a swing, even if it's a night when I theoretically shouldn't. To me, it's just living life and trying to take advantage of every single opportunity that comes our way. We can sleep when we're dead.
So, to me — nothing wrong with what you did. Next time around, go for it.
discussion comment
10 years ago
I could try and debate you, George, but I know far better than to try and go toe-to-toe with a Marine.
All I'll do is respectfully tip my cap and say, "Semper Fi," thanks for all you did and if anyone's earned the right to wear ink, it's you and your fellow servicemen.
discussion comment
10 years ago
No thanks.
Sports teams change logos. No relationship is ever necessarily forever. It's perfectly plausible anything that seems aesthetically gorgeous now could seem cliche, passe and dated in 10 years.
Long story short: Decisions that have largely permanent results with no recourse to change them are rarely great decisions, IMHO.
discussion comment
10 years ago
Yeah, it's going to be different in different places. Travel around the country and you'll see quite the range in prices.
In Milwaukee, $20/dance is the lowest anyone goes. Even the "special" is two for $40, with the "special" featuring a T-shirt, a hat, a free admission pass, a cheap porn DVD, whatever. The high end is $35/dance with three for $90. Keep in mind, there's only a few clubs around here with a halfway decent selection, otherwise you're driving 45-120 minutes out of your way.
In Chicago, cheapest I've seen is $25/dance. $35 is common. Go to Indianapolis, however, and Brad's used to be $10/dance (think it's gone up since the last time I went). It's hard to gauge the pricing scheme in Detroit because so many other services can be negotiated.
There's only so much control we have over the market.
discussion comment
10 years ago
If a girl were to check her phone in a non-discreet way during a dance with me, it'd be her last dance with me. And the tip would reflect my displeasure.
That said, I once had a dancer in a couch room start and hold a conversation with another dancer giving dances in the couch room during a dance with me. It was a little funny but also a little not. Smallish tip.
discussion comment
10 years ago
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motorheadFat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life
I've done some work with women's sports, so I'll be the one to actually -answer- the question.
Generally speaking, women will wear something lycra-esque (akin to sportsbra kind of material) or just regular cotton underpants along the lines of "granny panties" (maybe not THAT bad, but in line with it). Nothing remarkably sexy or notable. I suppose some wear compression shorts, but no more or fewer than guys.
Take my word for it: Maybe it's because it's a job for me, but there's not a lot hot about women's sports. Maybe tennis or swimming, but I've never really been involved with either. Even the ones that clean up nice look a wreck when they've got tangled hair and no makeup. Some of the season-end banquets I've attended have featured some nice eye candy, however, but no more or less than you'd see at any other dress-up event.
Funny related story: I'm working a soccer match where I'm on the sidelines with another woman. One team is in an all-white kit. Girl comes to sub in. She bends over to stretch. The woman sitting next to me, under her breath, says, "Ooh, stripes." I'm not sure what she's talking about at first until I look forward and see that you can see pink and gray-striped underpants through the white shorts on the inbound sub. Couldn't believe it wasn't my perverted mind that saw that first.
discussion comment
10 years ago
Predrag: I'm with you. She was smoking hot the first season of "Big Bang," but now, she's kind of a difficult sell as a "hot chick" altogether. She's alright, but she's put on weight and wears her hair up a lot. Her arms are thick and she does have a wide frame.
Melissa Rauch (Bernadette) has a better figure and a prettier face, which the producers try (and largely fail) to hide behind a plain haircut and glasses. Howard is proof that life ends up being way better in the end when you don't mince words and are just the dog all men are inside, anyway.
Would still hit either Haley or Melissa, or Mayim Bialik, just to say I hit Blossom. But yeah. Not a show you watch for the eye candy. Writing is hilarious, though.
discussion comment
10 years ago
Rick ... spot on.
There are very, very few women I've run across who are OK with "just sex." In fact, I've had a few times where I felt like OTC was on the table with a girl at the club, but I began to sense the OTC was going to be tied to some sort of eventual assurance of "other" OTC activities -- dinner, phone calls, social media, whatever. That's usually the point where I try to clairify: I have a SO and you have to be OK with the idea that this is about one thing and one thing only. I like you, but I don't need another girlfriend, just some company tonight. Usually that's meant the end of it, including any P4P OTC possibility.
I think this is also why a lot of escort service is less than stellar. I think a lot of women feel like they're resigning themselves to something anathema to their being by letting guys that don't want them "forever and ever!" get a piece.
The good ITC/OTC/escorts are able to take to it like us men do: The sex, itself, is the good part, while anything else that comes of it is bonus. And I really don't understand why more women don't/can't think that way. Hoping it's not something hard-wired but rather cultural such that, in time, we can change it.
discussion comment
10 years ago
If I have to point to any particular moment, it was the second or third time I saw "The Bikini Carwash Company" on Skinemax at the age of nine, which became the first time something happened that has probably happened thousands of times since then.
All I knew was that it felt really good and Mom would kill me if she knew what I was watching, or what happened. From that point forward, pleasure, kept secret from most but enjoyed with a scantily clad, well-built woman, would be something I'd want to get for years to come.
discussion comment
10 years ago
There are levels of involvement with "porn stars" at the club.
I've known two girls who have done some video work to have been regular dancers at clubs I've frequented -- one in Milwaukee, the other in Chicago. The Milwaukee one was impressive looking, but once got upset because she thought I motorboated her while her boobs were in my face and complained to a bouncer. Really? The bouncer was sympathetic and apologetic. The other is impressive on stage, friendly and good conversation, but wasn't great for dances.
I've seen a few features on stage. Best was Lisa Ann. Really wanted to see Gianna Michaels when she came through town, too, but it didn't time out well and that club has fallen out of my favor now. Once saw Tera Patrick in Chicago. Kind of a waste of my time.
Never actually connected with one for a dance (or more). Seems like more trouble & cost than it's worth. A lot of hype, not a lot of return.
discussion comment
11 years ago
Yeah, generally speaking, I try to avoid naming names. If you say a club is great, it can generally be assumed there's great talent there. On rare occasion, I've brought up a dancer in particular in the hope she'd get more business, but only if she was ridiculously good and also clear about rules.
discussion comment
11 years ago
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rickduganVerified and Certifiable Super-Reviewer
liveescortreviews.com basically takes BP ads in whatever city your in and does a lot of the TinEye work and/or trying to match up a girl with a review for you. What you'll find is that maybe 10 percent of the girls have reviews and, at least in my neck of the woods, there's maybe 0-5 percent of that 10 percent you'd actually be willing to touch with a 10-foot pole.
Might also be good to look and see if there's a local escort/hobbyist review/message board in your area. We have one in mine.