discussion comment
12 years ago
One thing that has struck me as interesting about this unique social environment is that both the customers and dancers think that they are far more in control of the situation than they think they are.
What should be obvious is that unless you are using a degree of coercion to keep her there that would border on criminal then if she is sitting there it is because she has calculated that it is to her advantage to stay there.
So while you may think that she is there it somehow represents that she is yours what is really going on is that she is staying there to demonstrate that YOU are HERS. She has made a calculated decision that it is better for her to hang there and get the one or two extra private dances that she figures are still in your wallet than to go work the room and maybe or maybe not get a private dance out of it while at the same time make you available for someone else to grab.
So it isn't that she is going to make 'enough' by staying with you. There is no such thing as 'enough' there is only 'as much as possible' and she thinks that getting what is left in your wallet is the best chance at 'as much as possible'.
What enters into that decision for the dancer? How many available fish are in the pond, whether they look like minnows, big fish, or whales, and whether any of them have already shown that they aren't taking the bait she has on her hook.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Ummm, from all the reviews here it is a bit like asking which dancers at Adelitas in Tijuana will have sex with you. They all will.
discussion comment
12 years ago
The lawyer tries to make the point that who is responsible if you throw your McDonald's wrapper on the ground. What he doesn't realize is that most fast food franchises are expected to agree, as part of their conditional use permit, to clean up discarded trash within a certain distance of their location.
Frankly although persons do have a first ammendment right to hand out flyers I think that a requirement that they clean up discards a reasonable distance from themselves might pass judicial review as not being an infringement on that right.
discussion comment
12 years ago
this is not a subject where it is useful to sound like too much of an expert to coworkers and outside friends. Play it a little dumb. Well, I heard of this site where they do reviews... and it would seem to me that....
discussion comment
12 years ago
If the club that you are going to does extras it is likely that virtually all of the girls do extras. If it is a club that doesn't allow that sort of thing then pretty much none of them do extras except possibly OTC.
discussion comment
12 years ago
1. With the exception of licensed bordellos in Nevada, Yes.
2. No club is going to hire undercover security just to draw attention on the problems under their own roof. When police try to bust strip clubs they will have officers pose as customers.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Trust me, don't pay for extras and you won't get any. They are called extras for a reason.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Another really affordable choice for SoCal is to take the trip down to TJ. You get to see them beforehand AND get a good price on the full service for less than half of what an OTC costs you north of the border.
discussion comment
12 years ago
To be clear I am not saying that they all have bad technique, but more than I would expect.
It can't be 'just wanting to get it over with' since the better technique would certainly have it over with sooner! Maybe it is just not caring, but I would have thought that the economics would work against it. Unhappy customers do not repeat. Maybe they are thinking that if you don't finish in the allotted VIP time you will have to pay for more time, but again that is not going to make for a customer that wants to repeat.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Wooddr2 I think has it about right, which makes me wonder why anybody is so interested in OTC. You can get a darn nice incall or outcall escort for that price with less complexity.
discussion comment
12 years ago
1. Set a spending limit and do not carry more into the club than that in cash.
2. It may be just a business, but treat everybody in the club with respect
3. When in Rome....whatever the club or dancer's rule are do not get pushy or whiny about them.
discussion comment
12 years ago
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Book GuyI write it like I mean it, but mostly they just want my money.
My theory: It has been a long time since a local club, massage parlor, or whatever has been busted. Most likely it is because the local law enforcement is underfunded and as a result are focusing on violent felonies and property crimes and not paying much attention to well behaved vice.
The club gets one new dancer who is used to working extras clubs. Not really knowing (or believing) the rules she offers extras. The management looks the other way because they are not afraid of being busted and the new girl is bringing in money. The remaining girls respond in order to stay competitive.
As to the impression they are enjoying it, well honestly is is more work to have to hump and grind a guy through his clothes to completion or to reach down and give him a hand job? We are programmed, men and women both, to regard sex as enjoyable.
discussion comment
12 years ago
I was talking with a paid ballot measure circulator and after signing several of the petitions he came to this one. I said it was dumb and he kind of sheepishly said 'yeah, but it pays the most per signature'.
Honestly I don't think it will pass at all. The actual STD occurence among professional porn actors is low because they get tested frequently and, away from the cameras are very carefull because their jobs are on the line.
The real problem, if there is one, isn't with the actors, it is with the audience getting the impression that really great sex must be uncovered.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Omega22 I appreciate your honesty. First of all you deserve to have a private life, but part of having a private life is taking steps to keep it private.
So now that you have gotten away from the college crowd it is best to make a policy of keeping you private and public life separate.
And honestly you sound too young to be so jaded. Real relationships are still out there. Saying things like "...have never experienced love and don't think I ever will...no desire to seek love seeing how I don't even know what it is like nor care to find out." just screams of issues that need and deserve help with resolution.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Unfortunately the general society is not only prudish but something of a busybody. In particular that goes for 'bible belt places'. I do not know what field you are trying to make it in, but sometimes the best judgement lies in being able to keep your private life private.
Another thing to think of is...are they saying these things because you are clubbing or because of other reasons? If they say that you are never going to have a regular relationship is it because you go clubbing or because you have an awful way around women. If they say that you are ignorant financially is it because you are going to clubs or because you seem to be broke all the time?
The best revenge against the zealots is to prove them wrong.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Oh, and in the general nomenclature of zoning the letter is they type of use and the number is the DENSITY of use. So for example R-1 is the lease dense housing, single family. While R-2 often is duplexes and condos, R3 is apartments, and so forth.
So C-1 might be corner mini-malls and C-5 might be heavy factories. It is a measure of density, not desirability. So a C-1 zoning for a particular jurisdiction might be fine for a tavern or private club. It is those conditional rules that get tacked on for adult businesses that are usually the killer, not the base zoning.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Planning and zoning is a city or county, not state, function. So there is no answer 'in Colorado'
The rules themselves will vary greatly between cities and between land that is inside the city boundaries and unincorporated spaces. In general the looser the country requirements are the more likely the city council will pass a much more restrictive law for themselves.
Very important to know the jurisdictions and their boundaries. Often you will find clubs in little patches of unincorporated land in and around a city with strict laws.
Speaking of planning codes in general for each zoning designation there are permitted uses and then there are uses that are permitted but require a Conditional Use Permit from the planning authority. And then there are uses for which a conditional use permit is requires and a custom set if rules have been created. Very typically for adult businesses these requirements specify X distance from any residential, X distance from any elementary or high school, X distance from any church, and X distance from any other similar adult business. Not too surprising that for many cities being able to meet all of these requirements means that there is no place inside the city that qualifies.
So broadly speaking you are looking for county land used for commercial or industrial purposes not close to residential uses
discussion comment
12 years ago
In places where independent outcall is legal, like Canada, the backpage content, like other free newsstand papers, is reliable. In places where it is not legal it can be chancy.
Some rules.
Real pictures are mandatory.
If the pictures avoid a certain part of her anatomy don't expect much of the rest. If the pictures are always from behind the breasts are likely unimpressive. If they never show below the waist expect a bubble butt.
If the ad intimates that the girl might be underage it is a law enforcement scam. I am not saying that there are no underage ones, but any one that is real and says so would be immediately removed.
Going with a girl that has a history of ads with the same or similar pictures is likely to be legit. Reviews are also a good sign.
If you don't like what you see at the door, don't enter.
discussion comment
12 years ago
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motorheadFat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life
The most likely back-story is that the club is being pressured by the local authorities to prove that they aren't allowing any underage patrons and prove that they aren't accepting any phony ID's.
Of course you have the right to simply not enter the club. But you also have a right to ask the club management about their privacy policy regarding the information about you that they are collecting. If they are collecting personal information about you then they should have a privacy policy, just like you would expect an online site. If they don't have a privacy policy or you think that they are BS-ing you then there are other clubs out there.
But bear in mind that a valid legal demand from law enforcement (warrant, subpoena, etc.) trumps even the strongest privacy policy.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Not sure about prices there but in most clubs a half hour VIP is about $150 so even including a fairly generous tip she needs to be darn lucky to be consistently clearing $400 an hour.
Still you do need to realize that when you are asking here to spend time with you you are asking her to give up something that has value. There really is something called opportunity cost, which is the value of doing something else (hustling other customers for dances). So she is exaggerating the value of her time, but it is not worthless.
discussion comment
12 years ago
So here is an interesting question. The tax apparently applies only to clubs that serve alcohol.
Would you be more inclined to visit a juice and soda place if the cover charge was ten dollars less?
discussion comment
12 years ago
So the girl might get insulted? Do you actually care? I might approach it this way "Does the club provide shower facilities for the dancers?"
discussion comment
12 years ago
If you must choose, choose her. But there may be other solutions.
Now, it looks like she is willing to try some things to accommodate you since she did go to the club. You also seem to say that part of the allure for you is the seediness of the clubs.
So get thinking. Is there some way you can engage in the seedy side of life without having a secret life from her?
Thinking about here in LA I might think about one of the topless places like Sam's Hofbrau or even more so the Neo-Bullesque places like Jumbo's Clown Room or possibly even fetish shows.
Another possibility would be to consider going to a swinger's club but only having sex with each other. I know that sounds contradictory but swinger's clubs have a definite no-means-no policy and more than a few couples go there just for the exhibitionism/voyeurism.