discussion comment
7 years ago
As best I can tell, this discussion of "at risk" seems to be implying some diseases floating around? Spill, don't want to shout you down if you have something important to say, but the style of your post is coming off a bit melodramatic and not completely coherent. You bothered to create an account and post twice, which means you must have a cogent point to make, that you think is important that we hear; your instincts may be right, but we need that point to be made more clearly. Not meant as a criticism but don't know how else to say it.
discussion comment
7 years ago
I have to say that, contrary to every forum I've ever been on, tuscl as a group has the most realistic, un-inflated standards for the 1-10 rating ... in fact, if anything, as a group we're tough graders (except when it comes to whomever we OTCed with last night; those women are all 9s, shockingly LOL). I've moved away from 1-10 grading to crowdsourcing my grading, which takes the personal subjectiveness out of the rating, but nevertheless...
In this area, for DAYshift, on a typical day you'll find probably no 10s. At the hottest club in the city, there will be numerous 9+s, but everywhere else expect 0-3 in the 9+ range.
discussion comment
7 years ago
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Papi_ChuloMiami, FL (or the nearest big-booty club)
I'm with you. I've spent a shit-ton but did not spend beyond my means, and because of that, I'll take the memories and experiences over the $$$ and it's not even close.
discussion comment
7 years ago
One or two test-drive lapdances, just as teasers to see who goes on my List to see next time, or possibly be promoted to the B team. Everything else gets spent on 1 girl
discussion comment
7 years ago
No exit plan.
I'm a bit opposite of most of you... I've always SCed as much or more when I was dating or had a girlfriend (or was married), than when I was single with no propects. When I'm not even dating, it feels like that's what I should spend a bit more time on, having the SC be my entire interaction with women socially isn't the healthiest place for me (just a personal thing). Whereas if I'm dating, I love the SC as some nice spice (and much younger flesh).
The older I get, the harder it gets to keep to this general pattern (since dating gets harder), but that's where I am currently... I'm still definitely the opposite of many of you in a "get girlfriend, no SC" "break up w/ GF, go SCing" etc. type pattern
discussion comment
7 years ago
Like chess, I don't "get" camming -- I just plain don't understand why guys pay for this, and never will. And that probably colors my view of camming in general.
I think calling the death of strip clubs is a bit premature, but I don't see why we wouldn't see the same trends as now:
- Some girls will go into typical "legit" stripper professions: cosmetologist, hostess, etc.
- Some girls will move elsewhere into the sex industry. The best opportunities for low- and no-extras girls will be in camming (which I hope dies), professional domination (which is far more work than most strippers will want to do, plus can't support a much bigger population), sensual massage (for those willing to give HJ), and arrangements/sugaring. You'd think arrangements would not be a good choice for a no-extras stripper, but IMO many of those strippers who could not cross the line in a strip club for random customers, can find a way to convince themselves "it's just one guy, he gives me a lot of benefits and I really like him anyway so I might as well get paid for it!"
discussion comment
7 years ago
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Doces300You can run but you will only die tired
... I will repeat, from an earlier thread, that I've gotten more requests for money for nothing from SA girls/scammers, than from strippers. "Can you help me out a little before we meet on Thursday?" kind of thing -- I immediately drop those girls the moment such a request comes in, no matter how hot their pics
discussion comment
7 years ago
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Doces300You can run but you will only die tired
I have never been scammed on SA, but that's because I"m not stupid enough to send any girl money, nor am I willing to pay for the no-sex meet-and-greet, I always make it clear that allowance begins when intimacy begins. That's all it takes. You'll still be assaulted by scammers, but if you don't send anyone money, technically you weren't scammed (right?).
discussion comment
7 years ago
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Doces300You can run but you will only die tired
So I think it's awesome you're getting the experience you want. I do note that you're using SA much differently than I was: I was looking for something like a more traditional SD/SB relationship, *or* at least something vaguely like OTC-with-a-CF. Along the lines of RM's feedback, you're using it as a simple alternative for BP escorts, which is fine if that's your bag, baby. I'm mostly not interested in an escort-like experience, so that's an important difference in what we're looking for.
Literally 100% of the guys in this area who I've commiserated with, have seen the same thing as me: incredibly high flake rate, and as a rule, women who aren't as attractive as their pics (sometimes a little, sometimes a lot). Almost a little unbelievable how you're not seeing that AT ALL, not even a little, especially considering that arguably you're doing a little SA bottom trawling and that is the group that tends to be the most flakey and do the most lying with their pics IME.
I do disagree a bit with RM that all the "sex on the first meeting" girls are basically BP refugees. Again, speaking of my particular area, there are definitely a lot of pros on SA, but my perception is that there's a lot of lower volume girls who would not be in the sex industry if not for SA, but just want to start making money right away. In fact, once we decide to meet, I always ask "do you prefer a meet-and-greet where we just go home afterwards and think about whether we want to start the arrangement up, or do you want or require the option of having our first date with allowance+intimacy right then", and it's always interesting to see the results. It's 75%+ who are in the latter camp; I assume those in the former camp are either cautious newbies or actual high quality SB candidates.
discussion comment
7 years ago
-->"
That said, I (thankfully) don't have the time to be such a frequent customer that I could have any dancer as a regular. If the clubs here were to my liking I still see myself only being able to go at maximum two times per month. Not enough to be a known customer or be steady income for any dancer. Therefore I doubt I'd get the special treatment that you probably do."
TFP, especially given how sloooow things have been here, twice a month is **easily** enough to get established as a valued regular, even if you spend rather modestly. At least for dayshift or early nightshift. When in the day do you SC?
-->"Still, I wish our clubs were like other clubs I've been to out of state in terms of mileage for any old guy that walks in"
Were you around in the mid-90s to mid-00s? If not, I can tell you stories of the golden age of SF SCing that will make you cry! Ya, wish it was still like that here
discussion comment
7 years ago
^^ I"ve been agreeing with Ish shockingly often lately. I'm not sure I would NEVER try to talk to her about it, but as a general rule, I would not. 100% guarantee she knows she's gained weight, she's anguished over it, she realizes she's losing customers (and/or attracting different types of customers, who like bigger girls), and she knows why you've lost interest. At best, this type of conversation only hurts her feelings, at worst, it can go sideways, and neither is anything I'm interested in being part of. I brush her off the same way I brush off any other stripper when I'm moving on: big smile and hug, "hey I'm here to see Mocha today, stop by if you want to do a shot with us!" and then disengage and move on. No hard feelings, no reason to pretend to ignore her, etc.
discussion comment
7 years ago
Most (all? can't remember) of the deja vu clubs scan IDs at night (that's every club except for 2), and the smaller deja vu clubs also scan IDs during the day. I'm not a big night SCer so doesn't bother me as much, and when I do SC at night, I'm more likely to go to one of the clubs that doesn't scan IDs. If *all* SCs scanned IDs, I would probably just deal with it, but as long as I have a choice, I'll always choose a no-scan club.
Among the concerns here: A driver's license has information on it -- e.g., your picture, birthday, and DL # -- that a credit card does not. A stolen credit card can be used to make fraudulent purchases, which you are not even responsible for. The info on a DL can be used for more invasive things. And, remember, 1. SC employees have not exactly shown to be recruited among the most honest in the world, now they can get access to your DL, 2. ignoring that, even companies with top-notch IT departments are vulnerable to hackers, imagine what a soft target a strip club is (or whatever service they're using).
I understand the safety concerns of the club -- can be used to ban rowdy customers, can be used to identify customers who assault someone, can be used to track down someone who skips out on his bill -- and while those are reasonable enough, I don't care, it's not worth the risk to me... unless and until ALL strip clubs use this system and I don't have a choice. As it is, I get to choose
discussion comment
7 years ago
I like slim girls. IF she gains some weight soon after I met her, I'm probably moving on . If she's my ATF or even a really valued CF, I'm sometimes surprised how tolerant our sexual history together makes me ... Obviously, all this does is move the bar, there's a point where she gets too big and I'm gone. But that point is further down the line for a valued CF, than a random stripper
discussion comment
7 years ago
But seriously, don't get sick
discussion comment
7 years ago
BJ99: damn straight. Bitch, get yourself a flu shot.
Ha ha! Just teasing! :) :)
discussion comment
7 years ago
^^^ I don't understand why you guys think this works. Are you speaking from experience, or just guessing this might work? Guys throw money like that at my ATFs all the time, she thanks them profusely and comes right back to sit with me. Once I watched a guy tip her a hundred, she came right back to sit with me, and even as much of a selfish prick as I am, in good conscience I had to tell her it was fine if she wanted to go get a couple of lap dances with him.
I can definitely see that approach working if she is just sitting with a guy who is furniture (fun customer who just buys drinks) rather than a good-spending regular, but in that case, you don't need to blow $50 to pull her away.
discussion comment
7 years ago
-->"^^^^^just try another girl. If most of them deny nipple sucking, then fuck that club. That's how I feel about my area clubs. Fuck em. I'll wait till I travel to better areas to go clubbing. "
Discussion of this almost deserves its own thread ... I am a strong proponent of figuring out which experiences you value, and finding them at a price you can afford. That said, I think it's important to learn how to work the system -- I might not be SCing at all anymore if I hadn't done that. In the late 2000s, when the extras clubs around here went to shit, it took me some time to figure out how to have fun in the tightly-patrolled no-extras clubs.
Working the system is key. It MAY be the case that girls in Darkblue999's clubs don't allow nipple sucking in the VIPs no matter what. But it may not be. The girls in the club I go to absolutely DO NOT take out their breasts, or allow FIV, or do stick shifting ... except that they do. For me, getting this has been about 1. Cultivating good CFs (and "failing fast", quickly identifying and firing those who won't work out) who will do more for me than a rando dancer who has no idea how much I'll spend on her, 2. cultivating friendly relationships with manager and bouncers. I'll give you an idea of what that's meant: the bouncer normally walks through the VIP 2-4 times per 3-song VIP; I have not had a bouncer walk through my VIP in several YEARS (except for the occasional new bouncer who doesn't know me). I'm pretty sure the manager does not bother watching the monitors when I'm alone in the VIP, and I time my visits so that I'm often alone in the VIP. My CFs know all this.
Anyway, I strongly agree that: don't pay for an experience you don't enjoy. But I'm also saying: those who work the system are having a different experience than you are, and it may be worth it to give that a try, rather than just abandoning ship.
discussion comment
7 years ago
BJ99-->"@ Subraman, I have a the hardest time getting guys to make that first appointment."
Well, I'm not complaining -- that's good for me, I'm glad most guys aren't making appointments, since appointments work out awesome for both the stripper and the guy making the appointment, but not for any other hapless customers at the club at the same time who want to see her... and of course, whenever I'm on the hunt for a new CF, I'm in that latter category.
I wonder if guys just don't think of it, or think it's out of bounds to even ask. IMO, a lot of the things discussed on tuscl, like OTC, and indulged in by a surprisingly few number of PLs, partially because they don't think it really happens, partially because they've read too many of the Cosmopolitan-type by-rote banal "here's what not to do in a strip club" articles that say sex never happens and you should never ever ask her to meet you outside. Maybe appointments are the same way.
discussion comment
7 years ago
I mostly SC at low-mileage clubs that are tightly monitored. Also, I don't do 30 minute champagne rooms, only 3-song VIPs; no particularly strategy here, other than I enjoy my private time 10 minutes at a time, rather than 30 minutes all at once, at these types of clubs. She'll be spending at LEAST an hour with me between each VIP.
Expectations:
- Each club is different, so you can't have expectations going in
- Each shift at each club is different
- If you are on good terms with the manager and bouncer, you will get more leeway
- If the stripper is on good terms with the manager and bouncer, you will get more leeway
- Even in a tightly monitored club, *if* the girl wants to get away with it, things like FIV and FIA are easily hidden from staff and the eyes in the sky. In your particular club, as in mine, they may be rare unless you develop a good CF/FC relationship first
discussion comment
7 years ago
sf: don't knock it until you try it. I'm the opposite of a rainmaker ... hell, I don't even like sitting at the stage because I don't like all eyes turned in my direction, even if I'm not the one they're looking at. But whenever I can pull it off, I make SCing with my stripper a part of any OTC. Strippers are fucking fun in strip clubs. Aside from just being a blast to hang out with her at the strip club, she can often finesse some rule-breaking on the part of the other strippers (to my benefit)... and the OTC pattern of "get crazy horny at the strip club, then go back to the room and fuck it off" is spectacular
discussion comment
7 years ago
I'm with anonlvone "I can't believe there are guys who actually put up with this shit", which leads me also agreeing with Ishmael, this all screams of troll. Even at my worst I can't imagine myself following this path.
If, for a moment, I pretend this isn't a troll and it's all true, I don't blame the stripper at all, she found a live one. A complete and total behavior modification is in order...
discussion comment
7 years ago
lol ... I replied to this thread before I read the earlier replies, and I see I replied already, months ago!
discussion comment
7 years ago
I'm not a fan of Starbucks for any number of reasons (mostly, the taste of their coffee), and I am also not a fan of coffee that is really basically a liquid coffee-flavored donut, so full of fats and sweeteners and flavorings that you can barely taste the coffee or espresso.
That said, I definitely appreciate an amazing espresso or pourover, especially made by well-trained baristas and with beans freshly roasted within the past week. This is a great time for coffee aficionados.
discussion comment
7 years ago
No idea what BS or HL are like, but years back there was a very similar effect that PLs around here talk about all the time. Basically, MBOT had by far the hottest girls in the city up until the mid-2000s. Girls from other clubs that were attractive would get hired by MBOT, and all of a sudden, instead of 7.5s or 8s, they were 9s. I attributed this to:
1. MBOT had a critical mass of gorgeous strippers, enough to kick off the "kid in a candy store" reaction. I think we PLs just walked into that place, with gorgeous girls everywhere we looked, and got our brains flooded with dopamine and seratonin and boner, and every girl just looked hotter being surrounded by a zillion other hot girls.
2. I think there was a lot of competition and the girls just plain raised their game. An attractive-with-potential girl from another club would come into MBOT, see what girls who make $1000-$2000 per shift (on dayshift) look and act like, and followed suit.
discussion comment
7 years ago
One man's butthurt is another man's refusal to compromise on the experience he's paying for. I agree, butthurtness can happen to anyone, but there's a world of difference between getting personally hurt and insulted, versus "this isn't the experience I want, or feel like paying for; best to move on."