founder take notice please

I think your point is that the hurdle to be in VIP is too low and hasn’t successfully barred all the trolls? If so, that is a fact. I’m ok with the current standard. Upping it will prevent a bit more, but the truly determined trolls will fond their way in. Honestly, I’m always surprised by how much time the trolls are willing to spend creating fake personas and posts.

While the new system isn’t perfect, it’s a decided improvement on troll limitation. I also take comfort in that the VIP status burns off every four weeks so they’ll have to keep posting reviews to maintain access. They can annoy in the VIP but make them work for it.

I don't care about the annoyance factor, it just seems that 7 out of every 9 threads are dominated by disruptors instead of the other way around. Let's look at it this way, last night at 9 PM pretty much primetime 9 of the first 11 threads were pure unadulterated garbage, let them keep that crap in the front room.

Is there some way to bounce the tedious trolls without making it more difficult for sincere people to post here? Maybe we could give a troll a downvote and after 5 downvotes he would not longer be able to post in VIP for a week. What I don't want is to keep anyone from posting just because I don't like what he says.

25: I agree with your point, but I think the way things are now is probably as good as it’s going to get. The spilt into Front/VIP rooms was beneficial, but the trolls and troll like accounts are infiltrating into the VIP room. A review requirement won’t stop them. Reviews aren’t that hard to get approved. And then how do you deal with someone like Rick Dugan, who is clearly not a troll; just someone who either likes being a fucking dickhead or is so self centered and arrogant he doesn’t realize what he is doing.

I learned yesterday that the trolls actually paid for VIP so that they could be here. Hard to fathom someone paying to troll a place, but there it is.

Hence what I said when these concepts were first floated, which is that there is no real way to maintain a discussion area that is conducive to mixed male and female interaction without some minimum level of moderation. As Jimmy rightly pointed out, trolls will always find a way around purely automated hurdles. At some point there needs to be human intervention.

Now obviously an account that has paid to be on this site cannot be banned outright, but I have to imagine that there's a way to code a suspend or access block to the VIP discussion board. That way the account can still have full VIP access to the reviews, but not to the VIP discussion area if he cannot use it responsibly. Just a thought.

Doctor, you deal with a rickdugan by developing a thicker skin and not taking this so seriously, much like we don't take your reviews too seriously. ;)

Jack I don't want to keep anyone from posting because I don't like what they say, but there is a limit, and if you can't contribute to a community, why should you get any of the benefits, that only come from contributions, in other words, take what you need but leave something beneficial to the rest of us.

Stop looking for programs to eliminate trolls. Any Google search will tell you the only way is to just ignore them. Either use the button or just pass over their posts. If you need something more why not punish the troll feeders.

Dr I follow what you're saying, and Rick Dugan can be insufferable, but he is a contributor, as you are, there will always be petty disputes, that isn't going to go away, but community is earned by community service, and both you and Rick Dugan are net contributors, buying your way into something, takes away from the privileges that we have earned, through our actual efforts.

@shadowcat I’m not looking for a silver bullet, I just feel that rank should have some privilege especially if it is earned

It would be an improvement if membership-via-payment only bought access to the ability to read club reviews in full (and possibly vote on unpublished reviews). I believe that the reviews are the premium content on this site and having a simple price barrier is appropriate.

But VIP discussion board access should have a higher participation requirement that cannot be bypassed simply by payment.

As always, not my sandbox.

Rick: You are obviously the one that needs to develop a thicker skin if seeing a review you don’t like sends you into such a hissy fit that you feel compelled to start hurling ad hominems and making threats of physical violence. But that’s ok. I’ve lived long enough to know that there are a lot of assholes in the world and that sometimes you just have to put up with them, so I guess we have to put up with you, at least until you go totally off the rails like Dougster and get banned (at least in that incarnation). In the meantime I’ll take pleasure in pointing out what a dipshit you are.

25: my apologies for going OT on your thread.

DoctorEvil said "A review requirement won’t stop them. Reviews aren’t that hard to get approved."

In another thread, founder stated that any published review that is bogus should be brought to his attention and he would delete both the review *and* the offending profile. He has done exactly that twice now (BigDickSammy and family_man). So, it's not a bluff. I also think it's the reason why more trolls have not tried to write fake reviews.

So, I do think that a review requirement has more teeth on it.

Aside... I think it's a smart policy. I suspect that discussions board regulars are a tiny percentage of daily TUSCL users who focus on the reviews. Those guys get bad data whenever someone tries to hack the system.

CMi: You may be correct. I wonder if Founder has stats on users who only visit the reviews versus discussion board users.

^Dr. No worries

I'd be surprised if he doesn't. When I occasionally poke around in the various clubs I see a lot of guys who have lots of reviews in a lot of places, but almost zero forum participation.

Having the Front Room be a troll convention is fine if moderation is out of the question. But it would be nice to attract those high-volume reviewers to the VIP discussion area. I don't think that will happen if certain profiles are hell bent on disrupting every thread.

My 2 cents.

-->"I learned yesterday that the trolls actually paid for VIP so that they could be here. Hard to fathom someone paying to troll a place, but there it is."

I came down on the other side -- I was surprised it took this long. Studies of internet trolls conclude they really are terrible miserable people, their behavior here isn't an act but a manifestation of their behavior in general, which prevents them from having any actual social life. And that's consistent with the most ubiquitous trolls here: this forum is their life. Almost delusional to think a troll who seemed to be on here 24/7 and whose main purpose was to disrupt the forum and engage in deeply personal insult-fests, would simply disappear; that kind of person would re-invent new fun trolls to come back with. But no such thing as someone whose entire social life and entire source of joy is based on turning tuscl into a shit show, simply going away.

^^^ This.

I like the idea of being able to downvote posts in VIP. The button for that would have to be labeled “Bounce”

If enough people vote to bounce someone it would hide all their posts and keep them from coming back for a day or two. They could still post in the front room.

Another idea is to give them a cooloff period after each post. Imagine what it would be like I f a troll had to wait 15 min between comments.

Kick em in the nuts 25

Doctor, anyone who writes reviews as crappy as yours shouldn't be calling anyone else a dipshit. Just sayin' tiger. ;)

Btw, are you going to keep trolling me with these whiny and petulant posts in every thread I participate in moving forward? Just curious as you're obviously having trouble letting go, which is kinda' funny really given how little trouble you have doing that to a club visit after a mere 10 minutes. ☺

Boring posted: "I like the idea of being able to downvote posts in VIP."

I don't, for too many reasons to state, including the LCD effect and turning this into a popularity contest with people trying too hard to post what others want to hear.

Mack Truck posted.

"Kick em in the nuts 25"

^this is correct

Rick: Time to change you tampon again.

^ I guess that answers my question. Troll away then I suppose. I'll view it as a public service as every minute you spend trolling me over here is one minute less that you're writing tortured reviews based upon walks from the club's front door to the bathroom. LOL. :)

As I said, I’ll take pleasure in pointing out what a dipshit you are. https://www.tuscl.net/app/discussion.php…

There is also the possibility of charging one price just to access reviews, and another higher price to access reviews as well as VIP forum (this would be in addition to being able to get VIP forum access just by reviewing clubs or writing articles).

I'm not 100% convinced that would be effective without a prohibitive review + VIP price, and that's probably not a great business model.

Now back to what we were talking about before another disruptive element came in here solely for the purpose of trolling me and I goofily responded to his whining (sorry 25)...

I still maintain that no system will be truly effective if moderation isn't part of the answer. I have both Trap Baby and Icey on ignore now, but they and others are still going to make new participants think twice about bothering, especially ladies who stick their toes in to check it out.

@Rick I agree that’s why I created this thread, what @CMI said is important too I know of several guys that have many reviews that I have read, and would certainly be of value to this forum, along with several dancers that do not post strictly because the creep factor is so high.

I’ve dealt with the two spammers by putting them on ignore. And it’s nice to know that they know their stuff truly isn’t being seen if it’s VIP. It’s weird using this feature, but I have seen the light.

As far as raising the barrier to entry for VIP...maybe. But on the other hand, TUSCLer user woodstock has access to VIP and hasn’t written a review before.

He is definitely legit though and has personally met me, April9424, and founder.

Not a big fan of changes right now. IMO let the dust settle, see what happens and then tweak as necessary. Until hen just ignore the asses and move on. I have two on ignore as of today, hadn't done it before but it is nice not to have to wade through their sewage to get to the discussions I like.

Yes, I can see why dancers would be hesitant. For example, Rick Dugan, for some inexplicable reason, brought into our dispute by name a dancer and threatened to “take her for a spin,” just because I happen to know her. What kind of creep does that?

@nicespice I get your point, but consider the part I wrote about community, you can’t just take out to belong, you also need to contribute, else it’s not a community.

Right. The point is to attract customers and dancers and not have them go through some sort of firewalking trial to figure out who is for real(ish) and who is garbage.

Though there is some fuzziness between legit users and trolls.

It's not easy, by any means.

^I don’t think writing a review constitutes fire walking or even a very high bar, but it does create wanted content, and shows good faith.

-->"Though there is some fuzziness between legit users and trolls."

And users who I think are legit, but who respond to, enable, and legitimize the trolls; still don't understand why, or if they realize what harm it's doing to the forum.

@Subraman I see your point but there is a legitimate difference between trolls and pranksters I may not be serious all of the time, neither are you and I don’t mind good natured kidding around, you do it as well

Agree... it's the guys engaging with the more malicious trolls as if they're legit, just going along and answering whatever ridiculous trolly topics and assertions they have, that I'm referencing

That’s why I put I see and Trap on ignore only sniping at them when they make particularly malicious statements, but I’ve decided not even bother doythat any more, I’ve in the last hour or so come to realize it’s best to not pay them no nevermind as there are people whom I respect are doyjust that.

“@nicespice I get your point, but consider the part I wrote about community, you can’t just take out to belong, you also need to contribute, else it’s not a community.”

Good point. Hmm, in that case, maybe make it so that people who purchased VIP but haven’t contributed yet can view VIP but can’t post anything?

--> "-->"Though there is some fuzziness between legit users and trolls."

And users who I think are legit, but who respond to, enable, and legitimize the trolls; still don't understand why, or if they realize what harm it's doing to the forum."


Not sure how to quote a quote, but there goes my attempt. Anyway, I see that as our biggest challenge. A number of posters I consider legitimate often feed the trolls, be it the prankster types or the more malicious ones or even the helpless sap types. I'll admit I frequently give the helpless seeming cliche types the benefit of the doubt. Honestly, I feel there's little harm in that type of trolling as those are the questions that probably bring a lot of new folks here. Having them & the subsequent answers on the board I think brings value, even if the poster was just some miserable troll trying to waste peoples time. I don't get why people feed in to the prankster/malicious shit though.

As I have said, until today I hadn't put anyone on ignore but I have two there now and the forum is much easier for me to read now.

As has been posted previously, aside from their being a constant moderator, not much can be done to eliminate trolls while still not making a PITA for non-trolls and/or new users to be able to easily participate.

As has been mentioned, use of the Ignore function or just simply ignoring those posts should work well enough.

I was never a fan of splitting up the board as if the VIP section would be some kinda "impenetrable barrier" - as more legit posters opted for the VIP section, there would not be enough for the trolls to feed on in the non-VIP section and they would need to migrate to the VIP section to survive.

I think we just need to accept trolling as part of the web and just learn how to deal w/ it w/o requiring Founder to devote large resources to it which he seems to be unable or unwilling to do (understandably).

I'm reading this thread.

"If you need something more why not punish the troll feeders."

+1 the troll feeders are to blame at this point. You're proposal will only encourage trolling the review section.

I wrote this on Dec 23rd, right after this board opened (and was ripped a bit by the founder for doing so):

In other words, twice as many forums to spam and troll now. As David Byrne would say, "Same as it ever was."

-----

Nailed it.

Founder: in your PM to me you asked for "constructive criticism." OK, here you go. Some I've written before, some are new.

#1: Stop actively encouraging trolls. You do this by including the #1 troll on this site (SJG, who admits to never going inside a strip club) and the #1 fake reviewer on this site (Juice, who has admitted that over 100 of his reviews are fake, but he's "sorry" now) in your TUSCL tag lines.

#2: Create an off topic section for everyone. Those who want to talk about sports, politics, jokes, or whatever, can post there and leave either forum more available for those actually come to talk about, you know, strip clubs.

#3: Make it impossible to post back-to-back in threads. No more "I blew up an airport shitter" 50 times in a row.

#4: Not even gonna realistically bring up moderating this site, because that, for whatever reason, is a non-starter for you.

Ultimately, you always get the message board you deserve. This message board has become the internet's version of the movie "Idiocracy" a movie in which stupidity and mediocrity are celebrated and become the dominant characteristics of the human species.

That's my take, and I am admittedly in the minority here, so please, all of you carry on while simultaneously complaining about the trolls but demanding this site needs no moderators.

CP

The OP here is the sort of user that we should want to participate in more discussions.

https://www.tuscl.net/app/discussion.php…

Over 70 reviews of 14 clubs, but only a total 10 discussion interactions. It's interesting that he surfaced in the VIP room and not the Front Room. It's also a blessing, because in the Front Room he would have likely had to get his head around SJG, txtittyfag, IceyLoco, TrapBaby, as well as all the inside-baseball spoof accounts.

A solid user who just wants to start a thread about how strip clubs have changed over the years shouldn't require a playbill listing all misfit toys that might blow up his discussion. Telling him to "just use the ignore tool" is *literally* useless.

Maybe requiring three reviews isn't the best answer. But I do think that there should be some barrier to entry that is more substantial than a fee and requires some level of interest / investment.

While I no longer contribute much I enjoy reading the "conversations" and discussions almost every night. As an older member I get a kick out of how offended some PL's get by trolls/disrupters. There's a technique to skimming printed material and just passing over the bullshit. I learn pretty quickly who usually has a valid point or observation and also know who has lots to say and little to contribute. My ignore list is short ( I'm not moving soon) and I find I can enjoy reading the discussions without breaking a sweat by just reading that which is worth reading. I've been telling stories about my ATF for years and as the number of comments decrease and people's interest is in other areas, I don't need to post anything about the lurid videos she sent me of her deepthroating her fiance's 9" dick. Who cares?

I do think that monitoring feeds the trolls. Place them on ignore and move on, I LOVE that and I can reinstate if I were to look at something they posted others referred to. Can't imagine that happening but it is a possibility. No more need be done imo.

Im posting this here because its relevant but founder didnt want comments in his thread.

Perfect example, at least 2 people have already voted for nicespice in a thread named "top 5 current contributors". She has 0 reviews and at least 10 troll accounts. What has she contributed besides being a female?

I stand corrected. 3 people

Nicespice contributes interesting comments. Sometimes they provide insights from the female side of this activity; sometimes they are just fun. I wouldn’t necessarily expect a dancer to review clubs, but some do.

Spice, I have written several reviews here, just not in a while. Several club visits are well overdue for a review, though, fer sher.

And shadowcat is correct; the only way for trolls to go away is to utterly ignore them. Sadly, it can take a while.

I do have to say, I was wondering how this thread lasted so long without Icey or Trapbaby coming in to derail the entire conversation. The fact that you have them on ignore and thus they can't post in your thread is brilliant!

Chessmaster is correct, those of you voting for her have either LDKed, want to LDK, want to bone her, etc. Her 20 troll accounts and instigating of others to troll are a source of all this drama.

“Spice, I have written several reviews here, just not in a while. Several club visits are well overdue for a review, though, fer sher.”

Oops. I was way off the mark there. Okay, 25’s argument is strengthened even more then.
——
@chessmaster Judge not (on trolling) lest ye be judged.
https://www.tuscl.net/app/discussion.php…
https://www.tuscl.net/app/discussion.php…
https://www.tuscl.net/app/discussion.php…
https://www.tuscl.net/app/discussion.php…
https://www.tuscl.net/app/discussion.php…
https://www.tuscl.net/app/discussion.php…

I have gotten numerous dances from Nicespice. No LDK or desire to LDK with her or any other dancer. As far as wanting to bone her . . . OK, so what’s you’re point?

Chilli Palmer said #3: Make it impossible to post back-to-back in threads. No more "I blew up an airport shitter" 50 times in a row.

^^ This would be a good idea, however if something like this was in affect it would be nice to have an edit feature or something like gmail has to stop something from being sent.


gawker said ...While I no longer contribute much I enjoy reading the "conversations" and discussions almost every night. As an older member I get a kick out of how offended some PL's get by trolls/disrupters.

^Brilliant!

@ chessmaster... you will not see this because you have me on ignore, Check your facts before you talk next time. Nicespice did do a review.

@ Dr, amazed I have to spell it out for you but I will - point is there are complaints about too many trolls, spice is responsible for tons of accounts as well as instigating others to troll aka cyberbully, and because y'all are thinking with your dicks you dont tell her to cut the shit. It's a double standard which makes a lot of you look hypocritical.
Instead you say 'we have a problem with trolls but she is a top contributor.' She really doesn't contribute much, unless you sum up her troll accounts and then yeah she's got more posts than anybody the past year. Anyway, I do hope you wind up fucking her. :)

Pistola: You’re probably right that she has some troll accounts but as far as I can tell she isn’t using them maliciously or to harrass. She’s not the only one with troll accounts for sure. I’ve never really complained much about trolling, maybe a little, but if it becomes a problem for me I just use ignore. I still say Nicespice provides some valuable insight into the female side of this activity, unlike Nichole1994 who is a waste of electrons. And thanks for the good wishes, but it’s not gong to happen. I already asked.

In case you missed it chessmaster...

https://www.tuscl.net/profile-reviews.ph…

Nicespice does have a recent review

@chessmaster: wrt nicespice’s contribution, being female on a male dominated discussion board, and frankly, holding her own, along with being a dancer at least once person has actually met, are their *own* contribution.