Comments by FONDL (page 50)

BG, I think the rationale is that the free speech provision has been interpreted to include any form of artistic performance, which of course is what a lap dance is. At least a good one is. Maybe we should call these ladies nude performance artists instead of strippers. Except then they'd probably raise prices.

DougS, if any young woman had a free romantic interest in me, I'd be too scared of her sanity (or lack thereof) to take her up on it.

Fxxy, the answer to these kinds of questions will almost always vary termendously with both the club and the girl. In some clubs it would be frowned on while in others it's clearly the whole point of the exercise. And in the case of the latter type club, whether or not he says anything, the girls will know when the guy is "finished" because he'll stop getting lap dances at that point and probably leave.

Show-n-Tell Showbar in south Philly has nude bed dances in private cubicles.

McDoogals in suburban Baltimore has nude laps, but they're done in an open area with supervision.

But is it really stripper shit or is it pretty young girl shit? Seems to me I've seen lots of stripper shit by girls who were never anywhere near a strip club.

AN, I would never do that. But if I were going to I'd start by commenting on Casualguy's remarks about speed limits. As he should know, speed limits are safety laws put in place to protect others from self-centered idiots who value their own pleasure more highly than the safety of othersand drive at unsafe speeds. If police really wanted to use them as revenue sources they'd give out 10 tiems as many tickets as they do now. And frankly I wish they would. Most of our 40,000 annual highway deaths result from driving too fast. IMO that number could easily be halved by observing speed limits. And I might also point out to Bones that you don't have to be "rightous" to be concerned about the negative impacts that individuals pursuing their own happiness (micro effect) is having on society as a whole (macro effect.) But I'd never do any of that.

Bones, I have learned to prefer massages too and as a reault I haven't been to a strip club in a long time. But the problem is the same as it is for LDs, they aren't all that much fun unless you really like the girl, and finding a girl you like can be difficult. It's not like in a club where you have a room full of girls to choose from, you generally have to take pot luck. Any suggestions on how to improve the odds? My ATF is a massage therapist, but she lives 1200 miles away so I don't have the opportunity to get massages from her very often. And I used to have a therapist nearby who I really liked who worked out of her home, but she moved away. Since then I haven't found anyone I like nearby. There's a massage school not too far from me that I've thought about trying, but my ATF says I wouldn't like it because at her school there is no privacy (you have to keep your undershorts on), the massages are given in front of the class and you have no control over who gives it. Sounds like that's not the case at your school. Incidently, if you're hoping for a happy ending someday you're likely to be disappointed. These schools really emphasize not doing anything sexual and most of the girls strongly agree. My ATF would get very angry if I ever suggested it. It's a huge no-no for most massage therapists, at least those with licenses. States vary in that regard.

How you approach the girl depends in part on what you're looking for. Your first step is to define your objective. Believe it or not, there are many different possibilities. And age is only an issue if you're looking for a free romantic encounter.

Thanks, AN, for an excellent quote. I think many of our problems today stem from ignoring our Constitution.

Casualguy, this is an example of the conflict between micro-effects and macro-effects. Individuals often want to do things that they perceive to be of benefit or to bring pleasure to themselves (micro-effect.) One of the main roles of governments, on the other hand, is to outlaw things that they perceive to be bad for society as a whole if large numbers of people do it. That's the justification for speed limits and drug laws for example.

Expat, what do you recommend in Fayetteville? And I don't consider complaining about $30 dances to be a rant, I totally agree with you.

I think there are a lot of reasons why some guys don't partake of the fun. They don't think it's worth the money or can't afford it. They're intimidated. They're afraid they might have an accident. They don't want to get that intimate with a total stranger. They have an SO and would consider it being unfaithful. They think it's silly. I'm sure there are others. Take your pick.

Never been patted down. I only know of one club with a metal detector. But then I've only ever been to a few inner city clubs - most of my clubbing has been in the 'burbs and rural areas, where metal detectors and pat downs are rare.

I think some dancers like to pretend that they're someone else in the club, just like a lot of customers do. That makes it OK for Fantasy to do things that Sandy would never do.

I always thought that the term "Eurasian" meant people from countries like India and Pakistan where Europe and Asia meet, rather than people of mixed races, because that part of the world used to be called Eurasia (and maybe still is.) Is that incorrect?

I once had a dancer who I had never seen before do much the same thing - before my eyes adjusted to the dark she came up behind me and asked if I wanted company. Since I had no idea what she looked like I said no. Then later I saw her on stage and asked her to join me. And I was her regular customer for nearly a year, in fact she's the first regular I ever had. Turns out that when we met she had just moved into the area and just started working there; a couple months later she was the most popular girl in the place. It eventually ended badly as these things often do. But I'm thankful to her because she's the reason I met my ATF. If I hadn't met her that day I probably wouldn't have become a regular at that club, and I wouldn't have been there several months later when my ATF started working there. Everything happens for a reason.

Chandler, that's good advice. My last good ITC relationship went bad when the girl started suggesting that we get together OTC and I pursued it. I should have just ignored her and held on to what we had. But at least she saved me a lot of money.

I used to know an Angel dancing in a club and that was her real nickname, people actually called her that outside the club - she even had a tatoo of an angel. I also once knew a dancing Tasha, turned out it was her real name too. You never know. I should be more explicit about what I mean by a girl using her real name. I'm talking first name only. I don't recommend giving out last names but I don't see the point of having a fake first name, that's silly. As Chandler says, it's all silly, but there is silliness that has a purpose and that which has no purpose. Fake first names fall into the latter category IMO, they contribute nothing to the SC experience, at least not for me.

DougS, you and I are on the same page re money and OTC. There are 4 possibilities here: (1) sex for money, (2) free sex, (3) no sex just companionship for money, (4) no sex no money. If she's looking for (1) she will bring it up, no need for you to do so. If it's (2) or (4) there's nothing to discuss in advance, and (3) is strictly at your option, although she may ask for help. I think age has a lot to do with this too. If there's a large age difference between the two of you, the most likely options available are (1) or (3). If you're nearly the same age, then (2) or (4) are probably the most likely. When I started seeing my ATF regularly OTC, she visited me, which was a long drive for her. I showed my appreciation my helping her out a little, and I think it helped us become friends. And I made it very clear from the beginning that I wasn't expecting anything in return for the money other than her time and companionship. I think it's essential that you're up front and honest with her (and yourself) about what you want out of this, especially if there's money involved.

I don't recall ever seeing an Asian dancer, at least not in a club that had LDs.

Once I became a regular with my ATF and visited her fairly often, I got to know her friends, who sometimes stopped by our table to talk to her while she was sitting with me. They often called each other by their real names and when they talked about some of the other girls they used real names too. As a result I knew the real names of many of the dancers there. I think that's pretty common, for dancers to call other dancers by their real names in front of regular customers, almost like they don't really think of regulars as customers anymore. So what's the point of the fake names when many of the regulars know their real names? It's always struck me as somewhat silly. I've always used my real name in clubs. But never on the internet. I'm thinking of registering on another site on a totally different subject but they ask for your real name and that makes me a little uncomfortable - I don't really care to do that but I hate to lie too. Any advice there? How do others handle that? This board is different because they don't ask for a real name.

I should add that I don't much care whether a girl uses a fake name or not if I'm just spending one evening with her. But if I start to become her regular, at some point I'll expect to be treated a little better than a one-time customer. It's that trust thingy - giving me a real name is an indication of increased trust. It's also a good marketing gimmick.

I've found it to be pretty common for a dancer to be pissed at her SO. Which is why I never care if she has one, cause sooner or later she'll be pissed at him.

Some over-the-hill dancers obviously migrate to a seedier club. I've been in some joints where you could have sold AARP memberships to some of the dancers. And some of those old gals are surprisingly popular. Gee I wonder why.