Another OTC Question

I wouldn't bring up the money. If she's going to see you OTC, there's a slight chance that she digs you. Try to fuck her for free. If she wants to be paid, avoid her. Sex for money = gross.

I wouldn't want to go anywhere near a dancer who wanted money outside the club. Guess I'm not much help. Going out with some dancers is enough of an ordeal all by itself.

Speaking of OTC, I was just offered OTC from a dancer at Diva's in Kokomo just yesterday! No price was quoted, but she couldn't get me off with a BBBJ and CF in her club and wanted to find out what makes me tick. She was excellent at BOTH, but I just can't seem time find time to go out of my way for her experiment with me. BTW, just finished a 6 club tour (Ohio/Indiana). Read the reviews.

There are so many variables here that none of us can possibly give you sound advice, we simply don't know enough about your situation and they're all different. But with that caveat in mind, here's my advice: do whatever feels right to you, considering where you want this to go. For example, if you want it to be a one time thing, that's a very different situation than if you want it to continue. And keep in mind that whatever you do you're setting a precedent with her that will be difficult to change in the future. So make sure you're comfortable with whatever you do.

Remember this is your buddy talking. Email me her name and I will tell you what I honestly think.

That's interesting. I be looking for a discount from what she would make at work: No fees for her to pay and guaranteed return and less abuse (if it is an upscale club I guess that's not an issue) and less work. But, if paying a premium is no problem, then nothing at all wrong with that--usually.

In my opinion, you want to make it clear that your date is "doing business outside the club". You can use this phrase exactly. This way your relationship remains professional and it takes the pressure off of any uncomfortable expectations at the end. Also, offering the money will give you a much better chance of the event happening and re-happening if you enjoyed it. At a minimum, she should be paid a slight premium to what she would make for a good day at work, about $400. You can ask her the charges at the end and she will either give you a low number or leave it up to you. If she gets greedy and asks for too much, offer her a day of pay if she was at the club and you will probably be back to the $400. If she is looking for escort money she will ask for $1000-$2000. It's up to you if you think you would enjoy it that much. I think a good OTC would be better than any escort experience.

There's a rule, that I'm not sure is true, that the person to mention price loses. One assumption here, I believe, is that it is an adversial situation. Often that isn't the case at all. Some dancers have wanted to charge in line with they believed my budget to be. Others seemed to be thinking more in terms of repeat business. Still others wanted a lot mainly because they viewed the money as representing their actual worth, which is fallacious in my opinion--IOWs, just a customer can't afford a brand new caddy don't mean the caddy isn't the bomb.

Surprisingly, it seemed like 90% wanted to under charge. But, if I was driving a new car and seemed successful then perhaps 90% would be seeking full value or more since they figure spending some money on me won't hurt him and it sure as hell will help me.

Magicrat, why are you so sure she expects to get paid, and if so, why would she be offended if you brought it up?

So, you're a dancer, huh? It's ok for a guy to give you money to spread your legs and for you to hump all over him but if he gives you money for two way interplay it= gross???

Is "CLIFY" back posing as a dancer??? Just a thought...

Thanks for the comments guys. If this does happen, I think I will just say something like "we never did discuss the details of our evening" and just play it by ear depending on how the conversation goes. I still think it's a longshot that anything will ever happen, but stranger things have.

Chandler, I assumed she would require compensation..it was never mentioned so I could be wrong. Would a hot sexy stripper want to spend her day off with on old fart like me, just for dinner, drinks, orgasms and whatever else came up just cause she likes me and wants to have a good time? One reason we keep going to the clubs I guess...the old holy grail.

FONDL..I like your comments. I suppose I figure she's on the same page as me as far as one time thing or repeat engagements. A difference there could be anything from interesting to disastrous. I think I also read here that sometimes an OTC can ruin the good vibe you get from the girl in the club to begin with. I really enjoy hanging with her in the club and conversing with her..we have a lot of the same interests...so I don't really want to screw that up either, even though it's not a once a month thing that I see her.

Situations with hot naked women can become complicated can't they? I'm betting nothing is going to happen, but I will report back. We're supposed to get together this week.

Just one other thought - unless she has made it clear otherwise, I'd assume that she just wants to hang out with nothing sexual involved. If that's not the case she'll let you know, there's no need for you to ask.

As for the money thing, I personally have no problem giving a girl money OTC, but I'm in the minority on that here. As I said before, do whatever feels right to you.

MagicRat: I'd be inclined not to bring up the money. I'd let HER bring it up. If she expects to be compensated, you can be SURE she that she will mention it before anything happens. If you are compelled to bring it up, your "we never did discuss the details" line sounds like a winner.

I have no problem giving a girl money for OTCing. If it's a business transation, she will be earning the money. If it's more of a "friendly relationship", then I feel like I should be giving her money that she'd other wise be making in the club. If it's a girl that I have "feelings for", then I'd probably be giving her money to "help her out".

DougS, you and I are on the same page re money and OTC.

There are 4 possibilities here: (1) sex for money, (2) free sex, (3) no sex just companionship for money, (4) no sex no money. If she's looking for (1) she will bring it up, no need for you to do so. If it's (2) or (4) there's nothing to discuss in advance, and (3) is strictly at your option, although she may ask for help.

I think age has a lot to do with this too. If there's a large age difference between the two of you, the most likely options available are (1) or (3). If you're nearly the same age, then (2) or (4) are probably the most likely.

When I started seeing my ATF regularly OTC, she visited me, which was a long drive for her. I showed my appreciation my helping her out a little, and I think it helped us become friends. And I made it very clear from the beginning that I wasn't expecting anything in return for the money other than her time and companionship. I think it's essential that you're up front and honest with her (and yourself) about what you want out of this, especially if there's money involved.

In reading these posts it is clear to me why OTC's are too few and far between. To assume she isn't working hard or risking anything is a very bad assumption. First, she risks her job if caught. Next, she risks her business with you if there is a dissapointment. Next, what if you turn out to be a stalker or a violent person, she risks the protection of the club and bouncers. She will typically take a year to get to know you before considering an OTC to make sure that all of the above concerns are low risk. Thus, she deserves a premium to her job to take on these risks. If you are expecing a freebe chances are it will never happen. But in my opinion the excitement of the OTC is the oppertuniy to break the rules of the house and find out how much she really enjoys your company.

Chipitin: Very good points and observations! There are HUGE risks involved in meeting up OTC - for BOTH parties, but the majority of the potential downside resides with the girl.

There is always the chance that one of the parties involved could be a cop, though not very likely.

To me, my biggest fear is a setup. It would be VERY possible that when you meet up with a girl outside the club, she could have her boyfriend waiting somewhere, with plans to rob you, and/or do you great bodily harm. She could always have a weapon in her purse and rob you herself, or could take our her hostilities on you. You just never know.

For the girl, the chances of getting robbed, raped, abducted, beatup, etc. are far greater. Personally, I am surprised that any girl would take such a risk.

In my experiences, Chipitin's observation about most girls taking a year to get to know the guy before meeting up OTC is far from reality, though. She obviously has to trust the guy before doing so, but usually, I can prove to the girls that I can be trusted in a short period of time.

Two of my OTC "partners" agreed to leave the club with me the same night I met them. Admittedly, it took me longer to convice my other three OTC partners that I was trustworthy. I visited my first OTC girl about three times in the club, before she agreed to dinner (we never did more than going out to eat a few times).

My second OTC girl and I spent about six marathon nights together in the club (and hours on the phone). I'd brought the topic up several times, but she didn't go for it, until I was on my way to visit her for the 7th-ish time and she called and told me that she'd meet me OTC instead (dinner, hotel, etc)

My ATF and I spent five marathon nights in the club (and countless hours on the phone), before she also agreed to meet OTC and called me while on my way to see her at the club.

So, the five girls that I have OTCed with spent an average of about four visits in the club before they gave me their stamp of approval and trusted me with them outside of the club.

Before you get too carried away, most clubs I know of don't care whether strippers see customers OTC, as long as you aren't seen leaving together, and some don't even mind that.

DougS- good points, if your a charmer and can offer them something they want besides money, you can cut the delay time down significantly. But for reasons you began to express, I always use the 1 year rule for my own protection, especially if you are married. As you mention, you don't know if you are being set up by their boyfriend or possibly even a black-mail situation. Recently in Chicago an escort was arrested for doing $40,000 of business with a client, and after the business she got greedy and decided to try a black-mail tactic threatening to expose the customer if he did not pay an additional $40,000. The customer turned her in, she was arrested, and he now risks public exposure by cooperating with the police. Hence, just another reason why I would never consider an escort service for my entertainment. But I disagree with Chandler about the clubs caring about OTC, at least where I come from. Taking your business OTC will cost the club major $'s, most clubs benifit by 25% on every dance sold, plus drinks, cover charges, etc. If 50% of customers go OTC, half the clubs in the country would close due to lost business. In addition, if you have an OTC never tell one of her co-workers in the club. From her perspective she is jealous because your $'s and business that she could have had is leaving the club and likely she will spread the word to get the co-worker fired.

Chipitin: I wasn't talking about clubs where you come from, just saying that the policy isn't as universal as you seem to assume. And I don't dispute that it may be in a club's interest to prohibit OTC hookups. Perhaps the reason many don't is that they know they can't control what happens outside their doors. I do agree that it's not usually a bright idea to blab to other strippers in the club about your OTC partner, tempting though it may be.

Well guys, it was all stripper bs as I figured. No answer, no return phone calls. I guess I will just let it pass because (1) I have no choice and (2) I do really enjoy her company and dances ITC...that's good enough for me actually.

Magicrat: In retrospect, the most useful advice probably would have been that whatever you do, try not to let her stripper shit turn the good thing you have going ITC sour. Make the call, but don't make too big a deal out of such a longshot. Mention it next time you see her, but don't dwell on it or lead her to come up with more SS. I used to get so weary of that kind of thing I stopped even bothering to make the calls and resolved to never take the bait unless it was for that same night after she got off work.

If she wants money, she'll definetly let you know before you get to your intended destinastion.

Having said that, if during the "significant" time you have spent with her( I assume you are talking about time in the club) you are paying for services other than the standard lapdance fare then it's a pretty safe bet that she is expecting no less for OTC activity. Nothing written in stone on all this but given the situation as you describe it, I think that's a reasonable assumption.

Chandler, that's good advice. My last good ITC relationship went bad when the girl started suggesting that we get together OTC and I pursued it. I should have just ignored her and held on to what we had. But at least she saved me a lot of money.

I agree with Chandler: don't take the bait unless it's for the same night. In fact, I might go so far as to require it to be for the same HOUR ...

How often if ever do any of you guys actually have sex during a lap dance. I have been lucky at several different clubs. Both with first time visits and also ATF. Is this normal or not?

JumboBert: Depends on your definition... Are you using Bill Clinton's interpretation? If so, for me, it's never happened ITC.