discussion comment
6 years ago
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TonyT2what the worlds needs now is love, more love.
gmd: for quite a while, all the really good looking girls I met on SA turned out to be escorts, strippers, or ex-strippers. I've since met some really attractive non-pros as well, but that's the way it was for me.
What do you mean the pimp knocked on the door -- he knew your hotel and room? Not to take the thread off track, but it sounds like you let a massive breach of security slip through, maybe?
discussion comment
6 years ago
iced green tea, all day every day son!
I actually dislike Starbucks coffee, it is undrinkable in any form where you don't first turn it into a liquid coffee-flavored donut (i.e., add cream, sugar, whipped cream, caramel, sprinkles, etc)
discussion comment
6 years ago
JS, no argument that SF is not the zenith of strip club cities :) But, as I've said a few times, I think you got a quadruple dose of bad luck. One, I've never heard a price even a third as high as you were quoted -- at least on dayshift. Inside the local SC forum, we suspect those types of prices are reserved for customer who the girls think are from out of town. Two, MBOT lineup quality is nowhere near where it was 15 years ago, when it matched the high end Vegas clubs, but quality tended to run from meh to good with usually at least one or two bonafide hotties -- at least on dayshift.
SF clubs are better than Vegas, IMO, at least for a PL (versus a rookie); I'm not sure I'd SC much if I lived in Vegas. Although with the disastrous experience you had, I don't blame you for thinking otherwise
discussion comment
6 years ago
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TonyT2what the worlds needs now is love, more love.
au contraire, I'm all about the civet coffee :)
-->"@Subraman what's your reasoning for the coffee thing?"
Short answer: I don't like meeting people for the first time over coffee, nor do I think it's a good way to meet people... and so I'm not interested in driving up to an hour each way, arranging for my kids to be somewhere, forgoing doing something with my buddies, etc., all do engage in an activity I don't enjoy and don't think is a great way to get someone to open up, anyway.
Longer answer:
I actually love going to coffee with someone -- I just don't think it's a great first date. Among the reasons:
1. It's not great for getting someone who is a little shy to open up, nor is it a great way to see what they're like in the type of social settings I enjoy. Frankly, my requirements for a sugarbaby are: 1. she's hot, 2. she's crazy fun. I of course also enjoy it if she's smart, can hold a super intelligent conversation, etc., and she'll get lots of bonus points for that, *if* she makes the grade on number hotness and fun-ness. But for me personally, I have a civilian dating life that I'm prosecuting with sometimes good and sometimes bad results, but between my civilian dating life, work, etc., I'm not even close to lacking for intelligent conversation, any time of the day. I know what I need from an OTC/sugarbaby, and that's that she's fun... and meeting at a fun place and having some drinks is the best and most fun way for me to know what she's like in my native habitat.
2. If she's shy at all, then nothing helps someone stifle their personality even more than being in an environment like a coffee shop. Which might not be a problem if her "fun factor" wasn't a big deal for me, and I was just looking for dry casual conversation. But for me, I might rule out girls that I wouldn't, if we just fast-forwarded her comfort level with one drink.
3. As RM mentioned: "Also, if there's absolutely no chemistry, you can duck out early." This is not only true -- but the coffee shop meeting is basically optimized for ducking out early, over all else, at least to my thinking. There are other reasons women might prefer coffee shop meetings, so I realize not all women who insist on coffee shop meetings are unsure/unenthusiastic and would rather optimize to duck out early; but, it is definitely true that all women who are unsure/unenthusiastic insist on coffee dates. And again, I'm not interested in driving up to an hour each way, getting my kids looked after, etc., for a meeting with someone who can't even be bothered to socialize without a super-fast escape plan. I'll do that with the understanding that we'll order awesome drinks and appetizers, see how we like each other, and when the drinks and appetizers are done, we can part or order more, whatever.
discussion comment
6 years ago
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TonyT2what the worlds needs now is love, more love.
orion: I never do coffee first meetings -- it's a hard rule for me, that I only consider breaking for girls under 21, and even then, I usually propose a place that has drinks, coffee, and appetizers, so we can each get whatever we'd like. I have my reasons for this, and I actually have the same rule in my civilian dating life as well.
100% of my first meetings with girls who are 21+ are at bars that serve appetizers and food (even if it's just small plates). I pick a pretty cool, higher-end bar where we can get great drinks and food. I try to be the one who proposes the meeting place first , but if she asks first and suggests coffee, in my response I counter-propose drinks, and it's rarely an issue.
discussion comment
6 years ago
AA is the sound she makes when you "accidentally" put it in her butt instead
discussion comment
6 years ago
-->"Mamisan bring rhinoceros horn, tiger penis and yeti blood."
Fixed.
discussion comment
6 years ago
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TonyT2what the worlds needs now is love, more love.
Heh, I'd bet $1000 that was absolutely meant for you, she thought better of it, and sent the retraction.
discussion comment
6 years ago
Just to clarify: I major in Drinking Partners Then OTC, but have a strong minor in ITC Extras With Hot Chicks. The only reason I don't do ITC extras with hot chicks more often, is that in the extras club here, there's a choice of "hot chicks and hundreds of dollars per TEN minutes" or "horrible skanky ghetto chicks, for less". I'm exaggerating a little, and do indulge in ITC extras here and there, but I'd do it more if I could get ITC extras with 7+s for under $200 and for more than 10 minutes at that price. Just not really easy to find here anymore. But I am not doing ghetto girl 4s, or subjecting myself to New Century, under any circumstances
discussion comment
6 years ago
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san_jose_guymoney was invented for handing to women, but buying dances is a chump's game
Why in the world are comments closed on that article? It was posted April 9th, I thought they got 2 weeks before they got closed.
I have a question for you tijuana guys: Anything going on during the day. Asking for a friend (ha ha! fuck you assholes) who is planning to head over there during the daytime. Is it even worth going to the clubs then?
discussion comment
6 years ago
-->"But about what Subra says, I would not rule it out. If you learn the scene you can probably make things go your way"
Absolutely true -- a regular can learn to work the system here, and have a way better time than someone who isn't. That's true to some extent everywhere, of course
-->"Century, Darlings, 20's, and Eden... I do plan at a future time to be trying out these 4 clubs, and in the order listed"
Interested in your take, SJG. We're looking for completely different experiences, so in a way I won't be surprised if you like them! For me, the are my dead last (New Century, due to the ROB nature of strippers and staff, even though there's very attractive girls on weekends), and then the other three (usually, horrible looking ghetto girls). It's a good thing you're ok with ID scanning, they all scan :)
discussion comment
6 years ago
well shit, I didn't know about dayuse, thanks sinclair. Now I have 2 by-the-hour apps, hurray! dayuse is much more limited (at least in this area) than Recharge, with hotels that aren't as high end, but it's good to have options
discussion comment
6 years ago
New Century is a den of ROBs that has an atrocious reputation among PLs here (since management and the bouncers back the strippers as if it's all one big hustle); I can't warn you against going there enough.
There are no great SCs in SF, by tuscl standards. If you have lots of $, and I do mean a lot, and can find a girl at Mitchell Bros who you like, that will far and away be your best experience. The incredible cost of a very short amount in the VIP rooms makes it a non-starter for me, but if it's a one-time splurge, that's the place.
discussion comment
6 years ago
For those of you who live in New York City or SF, where only the most shitbox rooms cost under $150/night, then Recharge blows everything else away and there's no need to look at any other apps... Recharge lets you rent rooms by the half hour, in mid-range to high-end hotels. I can rent a room in a super upscale hotel for $50 for an hour -- that same room might cost me $350/night if I rented all night. It's a pretty great deal, and once you set the app up, it's super fast.
Of course, some of you are lucky enough to live in cities where you can get a decent room for $80/night, so you don't need Recharge anyway. But it's the right answer for NY and SF
discussion comment
6 years ago
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TonyT2what the worlds needs now is love, more love.
-->"They are out there and if they are not a stripper looking to find a side arrangement ( nothing wrong with that but it is a different vibe) "
Yeah, it's OTC by another name. I personally look at the huge population of strippers on SA as a feature, I love it, and think of this as a jackpot, just as much as I think of a more classic arrangement girl as a jackpot -- basically, anything that's not escort-ish "let's meet tonight for an hour", I'll consider. But yes, they can have a different vibe, just need to figure out which you like.
discussion comment
6 years ago
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TonyT2what the worlds needs now is love, more love.
-->"With this arrangement she’s probably gonna take half of my monthly fun budget, so I want to make sure it will be worth it."
You're talking like you two are in an arrangement already :) You realize there's an amazingly high chance she'll never show up at all, or if she does show up, she won't look that good, and/or her personality will be meh. Most of the guys on tuscl use SA as a simple replacement for bottom-trawling backpage -- that is, they just plan to fuck whatever shows up if she's above a 6 -- which is why they score on every date. If you're looking for an actual ongoing arrangement, IME you'll be the luckiest punter in the world if you don't have to go through at least a handful first. If you set your expectation there, then it'll be a fantastic score if your first SA date turns out to be your first arrangement
discussion comment
6 years ago
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TonyT2what the worlds needs now is love, more love.
GEneral expectations:
1. On Flaking: Expect her to flake, cancel, postpone -- SA girls have a higher rate than strippers of this. I realize she's already postponed on you, but I would have said this regardless. Wherever you're meeting for coffee, make sure you text her about an hour before you leave to see if she's still on -- if you don't hear back, don't go.
2. On Pictures: Just as with match.com, or escorts: 80% chance she doesn't look as good as her pics (anywhere from "just sliiiiightly worse" to "those pics must be 10 years old"), 15% chance she looks as good as her pics, 5% chance she looks better than her pics. If she looks as good as a hot stripper in a good club -- she'll almost always be in that first 80%.
3. On Payment and First Dates: I don't pay for dates in which there's no intimacy, period. For a simple first meeting (I don't do coffee, and have my own reasons for that), I don't pay, period. If she's coming from far away, and she's claiming super poor, I have on occasion volunteered to pay for her parking or uber or whatever. Beyond that, I press that I think it's fair that the benefits should be mutual, and most women back down -- the rest I jettison.
4. On Her Being Crazy: I think you need to strike a balance between irrational fear, and being smart about things. You're having a coffee date, so you get to start to see what she's like; just as with strippers and OTC, you'll need to stay aware as her real personality comes out more and more. And follow simple safety rules, same as with OTC: e.g., she doesn't come back to your house until you know her VERY well; she doesn't know which hotel you're meeting at until you've finished having drinks with her and you're walking there.
5. On where to do it: The general choices are hotel, hot tubs, your place. Your place is out for quite a while. Hotel or hot tubs. I always meet the girl for drinks before any "date", and if we're going to a hotel or hot tubs, I book the hotel on my phone while we're having drinks, never before (see On Flaking). I do always have the hotel picked out in advance (though I don't tell her where we're going, other than where we're meeting for dinner/drinks), so that we can just walk from the restaurant/bar to the hotel.
discussion comment
6 years ago
Ish, absolutely agree with those last two posts of yours. "Tragedy of the commons" is exactly what it is ... *if* I really believed a lot of guys were really pulling this off. On the other hand, from the very first time I read that salt daddy article a while back, it has that PUA vibe to me. And based on PUA articles on how to pick up strippers, I default to thinking these are guys constructing arguments that sound good, to guys who don't know any better. Not that I don't think there are guys doing this stuff, I've had a number of girls mention that a guy tried to salt-daddy her, just don't know how successful they are.
BTW, I also have no judgement for guys who are using SA like backpage, basically coming in, looking for a single hookup, and moving on, provided they are up front about it and not manipulating the girls like those salt daddies. It's not what SA is theoretically about, but there are sooooo many escorts, and women who behave exactly like escorts, that it doesn't make sense to get bent out of shape that there are people on SA who prefer this model.
discussion comment
6 years ago
Ha, yes, less-than. I use greater-than all the time when I'm quoting someone, but less-than fucks shit up
discussion comment
6 years ago
Are you typing a greater-than sign? That's a no-no. I'm guessing the software filters that out so it doesn't get interpreted as an html tag
discussion comment
6 years ago
I don't get the tongue thing either. I've mostly chalked it up to being the same sort of thing as the duck face -- women don't care that men find it almost always unattractive, or else they don't believe us; THEY think it's attractive, so by gum, it's going on their profile. Or, maybe, they're hoping to get across to us, "See I'm so young and crazy, I stick my tongue out! Also, if you want to take this as a subtle signal that I suck dick, that's okay!"
There's so many more disagreeable things on SA profiles -- in particular, the women who don't have the emotional IQ to keep their irritation and lecturing off their page, the many women who emphasize their political affiliations (almost always loony left around here) because evidently they can't hold a conversation with someone who has differing views without getting their feelings hurt -- that I tend to just ignore the stuck out tongue.
discussion comment
6 years ago
-->"Watching her was no longer pleasant. She was still bubbly and talked incessantly. But while I always enjoy talking to a hot woman, I don't enjoy talking to a fat one. I no longer wanted to date Bambi. Even though she's about 30 years younger than me, I had no desire to go out with her or have sex with her. ...
I was disappointed in Bambi. I was also disappointed in myself. I try not to be a shallow and self-centered person. My reaction to Bambi revealed how shallow I was. I did not even care to talk to her because she was not physically attractive enough. Maybe I am the one who needs to change."
I think this is crazy talk, man. It would be one thing if you hated talking to fat women at all -- even family members, even co-workers, even random people you run into. But entirely different standards when the relationship is 100% romantic and lust-based; a big part of underlying foundation of those types of relationships is the physical attraction, for everyone.
To take the opposite side of 623's coin: I wonder if you'd met her fat (so never had lustful intentions towards her), but she was interesting and funny and sharp, if you'd still dislike talking to her. An unattractive girl with the stereotypical stripper's personality can be ... trying for anyone.
discussion comment
6 years ago
623-->"My bet is that had you dated her 8 years ago she still would have been turned off by her drinking, incessant talking and whatever else."
I agree that's probably true if he had the excruciatingly poor judgement to, y'know, DATE date her. None of that is remotely a turn-off for me (and I'd bet a decent % of other guys here) for a more sane, OTC or arrangement-ish relationship. (and note that, from context, I'm not entirely sure jack intended "talked incessantly" to be a pure negative; it might only be a negative for fat chicks).
discussion comment
6 years ago
I understand why newbies might not have the sense to ask for a phone number, but you'd think anyone who not only knows about tuscl but who bothers to post a review here, would know to ask for her number right away. On the local board, there's a never ending stream of guys -- even experienced PLs -- asking if anyone knows what day Trixie works, or which club Ellie is working at now, or whatever.
discussion comment
6 years ago
https://www.tuscl.net/article.php?id=44731 I argue ad nauseam that OTC completely blows away escorts. The only way escorts beat OTC is in the reliability that she'll actually show up, and that cost for a single hour may be less expensive (although the good thing about OTC is that it never lasts just an hour)... everywhere else, OTC crushes escorts (for me, for the experience I'm going for).
ITC loses some of OTC's advantages... the cost optics are universally worse (sometimes much worse) than escorts or OTC, in most cases. For myself, I still choose ITC over escorts because: 1. I love being in strip clubs, 2. Because I love being in strip clubs, I count the entire 3 hours there as part of the benefit, not just the 15 minutes of sex, 3. as a group, strippers are far better looking than low-to-midrange escorts, 4. I don't like having to schedule for a particular hour, days in advance, 5. I don't mind -- and perhaps even enjoy -- the uncertainty of her showing up, 6. it's 10x more enjoyable for me to have sex with a stripper who I've spent tons of time with, than an escort who I haven't, 7. all of this adds up to a much much more enjoyable experience for me, and I don't mind spending more for it.
Obviously, escorts have their advantages: 1. reliability, 2. if (and only if) you count ONLY the time you're having sex as enjoyable, then cost per hour is cheaper.