Comments by FONDL (page 21)

Guys, one of the things that I've frequently noticed about strip clubs is how little most of them ever change. I hadn't been in this particualr club in at least 3 years and there was almost no change. I don't think the place has changed in 20 years, maybe more. Which is something I've always enjoyed about strip clubs, while everything else around you is changing, they almost never do. Which means that if you've been to a lot of clubs it doesn't much matter how long since your last visit, you still understand what it's all about.

CasualGuy, I once did 16 straight lap dances with my ATF and by the end of it we were both laughing histerically. She has a really great laugh. David, a strip club full of college guys is my worst nightmare. I outgrew fraternity parties about 40 years ago.

I agree spitting is gross. I just wish someone would tell professional baseball players that, then maybe I'd watch a game once in awhile. I once saw a dancer jerk a guy off in a VIP room, then wipe her hand on the sofa. Think about that next time you're in VIP.

Bones, I hate to disappoint you but sometimes I'm not so sure about Book Guy, he often sounds like he hates women. Along with bible thumpers. And conservatives. And ... In fact I wonder if he likes anyone?

So I'm the only one here (and maybe Bones) who enjoys a really wacky girl clowning around on stage? Granted most girls couldn't pull it off. But a few are naturally like that (or maybe it's the drugs) and I love them.

Wondergirl, I guarantee that if you fall on your butt and burst out laughing, you'll be hired on the spot. Strip clubs need more humor, the girls who make customers laugh are often the most popular in any club. My ATF was the clown in her club, she was also the most popular girl there.

Tessie, I thought your first response to me was pretty argumentative and I was seriously trying to answer your questions, but maybe that was just my perception. If I inferred something that you didn't intend to imply, I'm sorry. I also thought that your second post, directed to Trogangreg, sounded like you were trying to lecture us all. It's isn't just women, anyone who comes here and tries to tell us what to think or do is asking for grief. But I guess women are more likely to be offended by some of the opinions presented here than are guys. Just like many of us are offended by some of the opinions posted by dancers on the Pink site. Anyway I hope you stick around. We actually have more women here now than we used to. Just ignore the few women haters that we unfortunately have with us. Believe it or not, most of us try to disagree when we do so in an agreeable manner, although it may not always come across that way.

Wondergirl, the thing about the schoolgirl look is if you act clumsy or nervous, it enhances the look. Everyone will think it's part of your act. So don't tell them otherwise. Break a leg (which is probably easy to do in those shoes.)

Tessie, one of the best ways to annoy guys here is for a dancer (or anyone else of that matter) to ask for our opinions on something, then argue with us when we give an honest answer. That's exactly why I stopped posting on the Pink site, too many of the people there don't want anyone else's opinion when they ask for it, they just want confirmation of their own. If you don't want to hear our opinions here, please don't ask. We love to have you or any other dancer participate here with us. Just don't try to tell us how we should think. This isn't a politically-correct site.

Tessie, one of the best ways to annoy guys here is for a dancer (or anyone else of that matter) to ask for our opinions on something, then argue with us when we give an honest answer. That's exactly why I stopped posting on the Pink site, too many of the people there don't want anyone else's opinion when they ask for it, they just want confirmation of their own. If you don't want to hear our opinions here, please don't ask. We love to have you or any other dancer participate here with us. Just don't try to tell us how we should think. This isn't a politically-correct site.

Thanks MisterGuy. Rescuing damsels in distress is FONDL's calling.

Jay, yes she is 4'11". But I wouldn't call her a spinner, she's much curvier than that. She definately has that little girl look. Dress her in a schoolgirl outfit and guys will be standing in line with $20s in hand. Now there are 3 people in the world who know the true identity of FONDL - Wondergirl, Funny Girl, and Snuggles. Rare company indeed. (I don't think I've ever mentioned Snuggles here before. Suffice it to say, she's the one for whom Friends Of Naked Dancing Ladies was formed and who won FONDL's first ever Dancer of the Year award back in 1997. Talk about your bittersweet memories. And in case you're wondering, Funny Girl won the award in 1998 and it was retired after that.) And not to worry Bones, I can't sneak out often enough.

I've been to Nepals too - very nice place. It's more like a cocktail lounge with dancers than a typical strip club. I always found it to be friendly - classy but not stuffy or overpriced. Medium contact dances in semi-private rooms. Nude on stage.

The thing that complicates a discussion like this is that we know what we like but we don't have a clue what works for the girl. Some of those super-aggressive girls that we all complain about probably make a lot of money. I once remember walking into a club and a girl grabbed me by the arm as soon as I walked through the door, saying something like "Quick, no one is watching the monitors yet (it was early and the place had just opened - they have TV monitors in the little private cubicles where the dances are done) and if we go in back right now we can do anything." Normally I would have brushed this girl off figuring it's a bunch of BS but for some reason the girl appealed to me so I went with her. I was back out on the street in about a half hour having spent all my money on her. But it was a very memorable half hour.

Priing of a service like this is like pricing most anything else - there's a negative correlation between price and volume, the most you charge the fewer customers you will have. The trick is to set the price at the level where you get as many customers as you want at the highest price. You can also do skimming cinse the customers presumably don't know each other - charge more for the people who are willing to pay top dollar, less for those who won't. There's also the question of where - if you have to rent a room somewhere who pays? That's also part of the price consideration.

I'm of the opinion that the way to have a successful long-term regular relationship is to never spend big. But don't be cheap either. Strive for that happy medium where the girl will eventually figure out that you are her best customer. Let her suck the big spenders dry for the short time that they're interested in her but she'll keep coming back to you because he'll realize that you're there for the long term.

The first time my ATF visited my apartment I was hoping that she would do some private dancing but she wan't interested, she just wanted to be friends. That was 10 years ago and we're still friends.

Sorry, Tessie. Club prices are a sore subject for me. I stopped going to the last 2 clubs in which I hung out regualrly because they raised prices to what I thought was an excessive level. It's my opinion that clubs are chasing away lots of good customers (including me) by raising prices. Maybe it's good for the clubs but it's making it a lot harder for many dancers to earn a living. Seems like every club wants to become a Gentlemen's Club so they can charge high prices for their VIP rooms, but there aren't enough high rollers to go around. In my opinion high prices are killing the business. And it's probably a major reason why your club isn't doing any business in the off season - the locals won't pay those kinds of prices. We've talked about that issue here a lot. Anyway I wasn't criticizing you, I was trying to answer your question about guys going to strip clubs looking for sex. IMO the higher pricing is a major part of the answer - when guys have to pay more they expect more in return. And the girls are often caught in the middle - they're being squeezed by increasing demand for extras and declining incomes.

Men do stuff like that either because (1) they get tired of overly-aggressive girls coming by, or (2) they have an expectation that girls are going to do so and want to head it off, or (3) they're just jerks. I really think some guys go to strip clubs because they hate women and enjoy degrading them. As I've said before, I prefer to approach the girl but I don't mind them approaching me as long as they're polite about it. But which is better for the girl is a different issue - I'm sure in some clubs the most aggressive girls make the most money. So which a dancer should do probably depends on the type of club she works in.

Tessie, I missed the couple of posts that were previous to my last one. So let me answer your question, "why do men pay dancers for sex." There are at laest 2 reasons: first, every guy here will tell you he enjoys the uncertainty and the thrill of the chase, which is missing with an escort encounter. And second, guys go to strip clubs looking for sex because it's there. I agree that not all strippers are prostitutes, in fact most probably aren't. But many strippers do provide sex in one form or another to some customers (and probably most of them don't consider themselves to be prostitutes either.) But now you've got me really confused - it sounds to me like you're already doing what you are asking about, so you probably know more about it than anyone here. I'm probably the only person here who would even be interested in what you describe, in fact some time ago I was looking for exactly that. And what I discovered was that every girl I found wanted just as much money as a full-service prostitute would charge. Which I thought was ridiculus. For $200 I can have a great time in a strip club for 2 hours or more, why would I pay a girl that for one hour? Maybe I'd do that for a girl who I knew well and really liked, but a total stranger - no way. Consider yourself fortunate if you have customers who will pay that. I doubt if you'll find anyone here who would. And Tessie, a 1/2 hour session in your club's VIP room wound never run me $300 or anywhere near that because I wouldn't pay that much for what you describe. Which is another part of the answer to your question - guys expect sex in strip clubs because prices have gotten so high.

Tessie, I'm not sure what you mean by it being more intimate but that no sex is involved. So many clubs provide such a high level of intimacy today that the only way it could possibly be more intimate is to include sexual activity. So unless you're in an area where clubs are all low-contact, your question doesn't make a whole lot of sense. A full-service escort charges $200-300 or so an hour depending on where you are and how young and attractive she is. An erotic massage is often a little less, $150-200, but some kind of sexual activity such as a hand job will often be included. There are services in some cities that will provide girls to dance (and nothing else) for private parties for around $200 an hour, but the girl is probably only getting half of that. So $200 an hour is probably the upper limit of what you could ask, again depending on where you are and how attractive and friendly. And also depending on what else is available in your area. Just be advised that if you're doing private one-on-one sessions many customers will expect some sexual activities to be included no matter how much you charge. And the more you charge the more they will expect. Can you be more specific about what you mean by "more intimate"? And how you expect to attract customers?

And just to clarify my earlier post, I usually discuss rules before committing to a dance, it helps me to decide whether to buy one or not. For example, when the girl and I are talking I'll ask questions like are there any private dances here, how does it work - who do I pay, how much, where do they take place and what are the rules. So it's all part of a general conversation about how the club works. And the way that the dancer answers these questions will give me some idea in advance what to expect. I've had many girls first tell me what the club rules are and then add that she usually ignores the rules when no one is watching, or she might tell me what her personal rules are. It's not always 100% accurate but it often does give a useful indication. How she says it is often as important as what she says.

I've seen similar signs in US clubs. And as Book Guy says, they often bear no relation to what actually happens, they're simply a CYA device for management.

MisterGuy, I spent 5 years in Happy Valley. JoePa was an assistant to Rip Engle when I was there and the current stadium hadn't been built yet. And students got free admission to all the games. And I still remember my fraternity brother dropping a pass in the end zone that would have beaten Syracuse the year they won the national championship. And I think the reason they win so many bowl games is that they take them much more seriously than do other teams - JoePa doesn't let them party the way most teams do.

Clubber, it is that simple. The secret of life is change - everything changes continuously. Change is life. To resist change is to resist life; to accept change is to accept life. Your choice.