DEBATE TOPIC: *ANY* Use of Dancer Names in a Review
Call.Me.Ishmael
Rhode Island
DEBATE QUESTION: Assuming that you are NOT connecting the dancer to extras, is it good or bad to include dancer names in a review in any context?
==== BACKGROUND ====
In this generally civil thread posted by 623...
https://tuscl.net/discussion.php?id=8147…
... the strong consensus is that dancer names should not be connected to extras provided or the pricing. I'm on board with that, which surprises no one.
That said, there have also been opinions expressed by BubbleYum, BHarlem, Warrior, and Cashman [1] putting forth the opinion that dancer names shouldn't be in any review at all under any context. The position being "You're reviewing the club, not the dancers." So, let's have that debate and see where it goes. I think that it's a more worthwhile topic that slippery pants.
Full disclosure ... I do not connect dancers by name to extras, but I do use names (often many of them) to describe the dancer and whether or not I've enjoyed spending time with them. That said, I've now seen enough points being made where I'm willing to change tracks on this. I'm half convinced already; take me the rest of the way if you can.
A REQUEST ... This might be fruitless, but I suspect that some here will actively seek to trigger others into a name-calling battle. Resist the urge, please.
=====
[1] If I misinterpreted your stance on this, call me out on it. I have no problem with being corrected.
==== BACKGROUND ====
In this generally civil thread posted by 623...
https://tuscl.net/discussion.php?id=8147…
... the strong consensus is that dancer names should not be connected to extras provided or the pricing. I'm on board with that, which surprises no one.
That said, there have also been opinions expressed by BubbleYum, BHarlem, Warrior, and Cashman [1] putting forth the opinion that dancer names shouldn't be in any review at all under any context. The position being "You're reviewing the club, not the dancers." So, let's have that debate and see where it goes. I think that it's a more worthwhile topic that slippery pants.
Full disclosure ... I do not connect dancers by name to extras, but I do use names (often many of them) to describe the dancer and whether or not I've enjoyed spending time with them. That said, I've now seen enough points being made where I'm willing to change tracks on this. I'm half convinced already; take me the rest of the way if you can.
A REQUEST ... This might be fruitless, but I suspect that some here will actively seek to trigger others into a name-calling battle. Resist the urge, please.
=====
[1] If I misinterpreted your stance on this, call me out on it. I have no problem with being corrected.
80 comments
I think the OP makes a good point about reviewing the club, and not reviewing the actions of a single dancer. This makes for a more useful review. I think it’s impossible to review a club without including the dancers in the review - so it’s important to not just describe the furniture and drink prices.
I stop reading reviews when the headline is “Bubbles is back and better than ever!” Sorry, I’m not part of the Bubbles fan club, and I don’t bark off to a poster of her in my bedroom. That type of review is likely better posted elsewhere, as it’s not a review of the club.
I don’t want to be a rude customer, but I don’t care what the dancers names are. My phone has a description of the dancer and her number - as that’s all I need to know. It might sound impersonal, but I know that Bubbles at Club A - becomes Juicy at Club B - and then she’s Minx at Club C - so it’s not worth the effort to play the name game.
Leave names out of reviews and things should be safer for the dancers. The only folks who will get annoyed are the guys who want the TUSCL Price Match Guarantee! As far as I know - that doesn’t exist. If guys want that crap - they should go to Best Buy!
Dancers are named on here when guys get bitter that they wouldn't fuck them. Or when they try to brag that they did. In both cases tge intentions seem nefarious.
Yeah the reviews are of clubs and not dancers. But many treat them as reviews of illicit brothels. Hence why they want details on hookers.
If there was a stripper review section, that would be different. I don’t recommend that, as it would expose dancers to additional danger.
There are guys who want to know all the details, and they are usually lurkers with no reviews or comments. My guess is they just message others asking for details, and they don’t contribute to the site. I don’t know what they will do with names, but I don’t care to share information that could endanger a dancer (and possibly myself).
With that said, I am also careful about trashing a dancer. I won't do it if she just had a bad attitude or if there is a commercial dispute. These girls have enough problems with dudes twice and 3 times their age without piling on to their challenges.
The only time I name a specific girl for something bad is if she outright steals from me, which has only happened twice in all the years in all the gin joints I've been to. When that happens, she deserves whatever negative attention she gets.
I don't like naming dancers in clubs, it's really not necessary, it just makes it easier for stalkers and other weirdos to victimize them.
It seems to me that many of these types of review discussions are already addressed in Founder’s review guidelines. In particular:
“ Be honest. You can go into explicit detail of the private dances. Just be careful with names if you think it may get someone in trouble.”
So, again, we assume that you're not directly linking the dancer's name to extras of any sort. Also, I'm also going to acknowledge that the definition of "ROB" is a moving target, but let's set that debate aside for the moment.
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As a personal opinion, I'm also going to part company with Gamma a bit. In terms of "GPS snobs", I'm not going to name dancers who are charging more than I want to pay. Dancers get to pick their customers and set their prices. If I don't like those choices, then I go find another dancer.
Also, if a dancer is successfully negotiating $1,500 for a hand job, then the only reason why I want her name is to hire her onto my sales team.
You can find reviews of mine from years ago where I mentioned dancers by name, but more recently I have been careful to avoid this.
Nowadays I might mention a bartender, hostess or staff for exceptionally good service, or I might mention a dancer if she made my night enjoyable by hanging out with me and providing good company, but there is no reason to call anyone out by name with respect to extras.
I suppose calling out a ROB might be appropriate as a PSA, but this should really only be in a case of outright theft - something I have never experienced. Calling a dancer a ROB because she didn’t perform an illegal sex act, or didn’t perform to one’s expectations really isn’t appropriate.
There are guys who define ROB behavior vastly differently - and that will be another challenge to find agreement on.
Many will say naming so-called robs is okay.
However every thread where they've done this has pretty much just been a butt hurt customer with buyers remorse because she wasn't a hooker.its always with a malicious intent. And since her side isn't heard...
Extras are a buyer beware game. Though I've never been ripped off in a "you only gave me an HJ when we agreed on BBBJCIM for price X," sense, I would have no reservations in saying I was lied to, though without detail on what.
If a girl overcounts dances or tries to say you agreed to a higher rate than she did for dances, it absolutely deserves a mention. No idea why Icee says ROB only comes up in the context of extras; I have to correct him every time the topic comes up.
Being an ROB is about lying, not sex. I will absolutely call out liars in detail, sorry not sorry. Dishonest people deserve to lose business.
Some dancers or dancer fans say this doesnt exist and refer to it as a hustle or finesse to make it sound better.
A rob isnt someone who refuses to be a hooker or refuses otc
Icee i havent seen any threads where someone was said to be a rob because she refused otc. The worst ive seen is someone calling someone a rob because she charged double the regular rate for otc
That’s mostly you
I'd add the caveat that a physical description should be provided with names. Bad buxom blonde Lexi may move on in a few months only to be replaced by a good petite dark hair spinner Lexi. In some clubs, there may be 3 different Lexi's. In a recent case, there are 2 dancers with different spelling for same sounding name. (eg, Sofia, and Sophia. Different hair colors, builds, levels of ink.)
A glance at my Mar 2, 2022 review (2001 Tampa, "Gasparilla Thursday") illustrates that you can't please everyone. Some thread posters would think that I gave TMI. For a couple of review commenters, my description of 2 way mileage or better was not good enough for them.
How do you know they _are_ lying? Or that the dancer wouldn't lie when asked about it?
I find that few ROBs are only ROBs to one person.
First, thanks to you and others for staying on topic!
I don't know of any club that allows multiple dancers to have the same stage name. Though I do know of clubs that allow dancers to have annoyingly similar stage names.
I'm wondering about the possibility of stating something like: "I eventually caught the attention of a hot buxom blonde who gave me a great VIP." and not name names at all. I could go into greater detail (possibly) per the guidelines as I'm not naming anyone. This allows me to talk more about the experience rather than the dancer. If someone wants a name, then they have to message me *and* be someone that I know well enough to share. Rather than broadcasting that information out to the planet.
In most clubs, it's 10 - 20 % (at most) of the dancers who are available to give me a dance, and I'm attracted to. So a "general description" of the dancers is of little use to me.
To minnow's point about name reuse, associate a polite physical description with the name.
Girls liked to be named when you talk about how hot and awesome they are, let’s not get it twisted. Just not crazy acts, let’s just leave to tip/great time, hot experience whatever and we’ll use our imagination to take us to rest of the way. Eh it’s irrelevant to me anyway I can’t even remember these fucking names.
Otherwise, my feelings regarding this are already well known. A broad description is helpful, but other than ROBs, I see no reason to name anyone. And as Icee said (I think? I'm too lazy to go find the quote above) a ROB may only have exhibited ROB behavior to that one person the one time. We only get one side of the story in these reviews, so if a customer is doing something shady or making a dancer uncomfortable, I can see why she may pull some EOB behavior. It's not okay, but I can understand it from an angle of discomfort or the customer being a creep or disrespectful.
I'm dealing with a bad migraine right now and my vision is blurry as a result, so apologies if there are any typos above.
I think that's a bad idea, but obviously not my call.
"A broad description is helpful, but other than ROBs, I see no reason to name anyone."
So, would it be fair to say that, in limited instances, it's okay to name a ROB? I'll be perfectly honest and say that it would have to be absolute blatant robbery for me to report a ROB. Fun fact ... I've never reported a ROB. There's been only one time where I was tempted, but I took the issue to club management and they sorted it out. But that was one time in many years of clubbing.
"...a ROB may only have exhibited ROB behavior to that one person the one time."
My sympathies are limited here. If a customer tried for surprise FIV "to one dancer the one time", I would fully expect that she'd go to the dressing room and warn the other dancers. He did a stupid thing, and consequences aren't limited to repeat offenders only. The same applies to dancers.
"We only get one side of the story in these reviews, so if a customer is doing something shady or making a dancer uncomfortable, I can see why she may pull some EOB behavior. It's not okay, but I can understand it from an angle of discomfort or the customer being a creep or disrespectful."
My opinion... what the dancer should do in that situation is go find another customer. We've said on here a bunch of times that if a customer doesn't like a dancer's behavior, limits, or prices, then he should just go find another dancer. One set of bad behavior does not justify another set of bad behavior.
Also, there's really nothing to be done about the one-sided nature of reviews here. It's not like movie reviewers have to corroborate their reviews with the movie director. I think that the only way to deal with that is have dancers here to provide other points of view.
But again, my personal belief is that if a dancer blatantly tries to scam a customer, and consequences happen, then she opted into that.
"I'm dealing with a bad migraine right now and my vision is blurry as a result, so apologies if there are any typos above."
I hope you feel better.
This is diving a bit further down into the ROB debate, which I guess was unavoidable. I'm still hoping to hear more from other users about non-ROB use of a dancer's name in a review.
Agreed. If a dancer offers a $1,500 hand job and a PL agrees, that's not a ROB. Likewise, if a dancer refuses to fuck or objects to intrusive fingers or other body parts, that's not a ROB either.
As for what defines "ROB behaviour", I totally get the differing definitions of such that different people have. For instance, if a dancer is overly ambiguous about what she delivers, and then doesn't deliver on what I expect, I personally don't consider that a ROB thing. I'd suggest being specific about that in a review, whether it be miscounting dances, up-charging after price has been negotiated, or whatever. Likewise club strong-arm or deceptive practices.
In terms of considering the question, Rick said “ These girls have enough problems with dudes twice and 3 times their age without piling on to their challenges. ”. I think that’s a reasonable measuring stick for whether to name or omit. Aside from the ROB question, if naming a dancer might lead to a problem for her, that’s not something I want to contribute to. Im curious what dancers think of something like “Cricket is a real smoke show on stage”. I’ve always thought that sort of naming is fine. Maybe I’m missing something.
https://tuscl.net/discussion.php?id=5383…
Here is an example of a review, that managed to describe dancers in detail, but wasn’t as bad with giving out info. (Though about the dancer who was giving tips of where to go for illegal activities, I’d probably have left that detail out if I was a male customer)
https://tuscl.net/review.php?id=391056
I am not a perfect sleuth by any means, but I do have to say there is enough posts on this site that keeps me from, for example, wanting to ever link my profile to any particular club that I’m working at.
Odds are when someone posts an anonymous review on a site like this where most people won't have access to said review. Is most likely lying.
I do enjoy reading reviews with specific details about each dancer though the names are meaningful to me in such reviews. A good description is better for me than a specific name. When someone give dancer-specific details regarding looks, personality and mileage for a number of dancers in the club, this goes a long way to seeing what hiring practices and extracurricular activities are common in a given club. The names aren't important because I won't remember them when I get to the club anyway.
I think it would be okay so long as the whole review doesn't sound like it's deliberately targeted at her. I'll use an example that I've seen happen at my club in Detroit. Our club dances are a minimum of $25 per song. However the club allows us to charge our own prices if we desire. If a customer asks what dances are, most girls will tell the customer they are $40 a song or three for $100. So let's say the customer new club prices are actually $25 a song And after informing the dancer that he knew that, she agreed she would do dances for $25 per song, yet she had originally tried to charge $40 per song. After the dances she asked for $40 per song and insisted that that's what they had agreed to while either forgetting or deliberately ignoring that they had agreed to a different price.
In this situation, I think it would be okay for the reviewer to explain what happened and that she tried to overcharge him after despite agreeing to $25 per song. I can see that sliding for review as long as it seems to be factually written. I have seen some reviewers mention girls (ROBS and not) where it's a targeted attack against that individual And sometimes it seems really personal, too. I hope that makes sense.
And Huntsman, I think that would be okay so long as it was limited. Like, "I watched crickets stage performance and was absolutely blown away. If you happen to visit and she's working I suggest not missing her stage show." That's genuinely harmless and gives no extra details that could hurt the dancer's job or privacy.
"I'd suggest being specific about that in a review, whether it be miscounting dances, up-charging after price has been negotiated, or whatever. Likewise club strong-arm or deceptive practices."
It's different from a yelp or Google review where they'll say skittles made my night. Make sure to get a dance from her.
I can think of at least one thing dumber I've seen in TUSCL reviews than not putting in dancer names.
Following from this, I originally thought that this site would provide more information on the dancers themselves. Indeed, if law enforcement/safety of the girls wasn’t an issue, I would want that information. But the wise men of this site have correctly pointed out to me (as they have in this thread) that law enforcement and safety are legitimate issues. Thus, as much as it pains me, I understand the rationale behind “no dancer names” for most purposes. But I agree with Muddy and others above that there are times when the above concerns are not implicated, so I wouldn’t say that names should “never” be used.
So, anyone thinking that "no names at all" is going to become the standard operating procedure here has a long, uphill battle. I mean, when I go eat at a steak place and I get asked about it, I'm going to talk about the steak, and not the plates and cutlery. Because I went to that place for steak. I know that there's a bit of an apples-and-oranges thing, because that steak isn't worried about the next shift. But the natural instinct when reviewing a strip club is to talk about the dancers, and recommend the ones that are fun.
Now this discussion seems to be advocating for elimination of some dancer details.
The problem is that eventually every review will read “went in, saw a brunette, had a good/great/ok time; left happy” whatever that means.
Without details every review is neutered and eventually this site is just a list of clubs that may or may not have bare chested entertainers.
In this thread, there are users who have advocated for removing all names. There are other users in this thread that agree with you. That's the nature of debate.
As I pointed out to someone yesterday via PM, we can experiment with our reviews to see how people react to a new format. If it doesn't work, then we do something else.
Regardless of how either of these threads wind down, it remains ultimately true that we police ourselves. Founder has made it clear (at least from my perspective) that he's not going to actively moderate how we write and adjudicate reviews, with the exception of plagiarism.
I think that my complimentary reviews provide positive advertising for dancers whose company I have enjoyed. This, in turn, increases their business, the club's business and makes it possible for them to keep working profitably. If a dancer just doesn't turn me on, I do not name names. That is just a chemistry problem.
If I ever have the misfortune to run into an absolute ROB, I would definitely out her by name, but that would have to be systemic and not just having a bad night. That, imo, is just a public service.
I think we're a long way from that, 623. For one thing we've got longtime members like yourself to throw the bs flag on that. And we've got guys who'll describe the inside of a dancer's vagina (cuz you know he put his whole head in there and she liked it for no extra charge) in a review who don't read the boards and don't care about the comments so long as their stuff gets posted.
My solution is to write reviews warning dancers about certain regulars at clubs. Naming them and exposing their weird hangup and fetishes. Like fingerings Phil at.... or Tom Lane who gets off on biting nipples then leaving ..... when the girls scream. Might go through some reviews here and give dancers the tuscl handles of guys naming hoes and accusing girls of being robs. To watch out for them.
That's fair right
But thanks to everyone else. It has been a productive discussion.
Isn't that what the pink site is for?
And I'll make sure they know who does that shit on here
So glad I wear a placard with my TUSCL handle in the club, now. Or anywhere else.
You just said dancers do that already. They have their channel, we have ours.
A client who stiffs a dancer after agreed upon services deserves it too.
But the pimping, pandering, woman beating, woman manipulating, lying, thieving white knight act is hilarious.
They’re free to post online.
Who would care if a dancer posts online saying Johnny was creepy and cheap and wanted to finger or whatever? Nobody
Yet you persist.