Dancers and the Economy

POP has come down.

I have x stripper tomorrow for $100, a married 31 yo gal off SA on thur for $100, a separated 35 yo gal off SA on Sat for $140. On the recruiting board is a 21 yo married college off SA student at $140. I will fuck her next week.

Quality has stayed the same. I'm not old enough for nostalgia to have set in yet.

Mileage started to sky rocket around 2006, IMO. The economy was only one factor.

quality is worse now. this is for all of the clubs i go to in new york and new jersey. it gradually gets worse year by year. i even heard that at some states in the south it's also the same down there. and if you do find that girl that's an 8 or 9 she won't stay at that club for long. it's just the way it is.

What is SA? I agree with rattdog. Anyone have any theories as to why? I dont get it.. Whats going on??!!

I'd rather have average looking dancers who provide plenty of Xtras, instead of 10 rated dancers who you may barely get to touch or have touch you.

I think that dancer attitude has gone downhill more than anything else. Mileage is still at Prius Plus while looks have gone slightly down. I find that they're too many so-so, extra-average looking dancers out there. It seems like nowadays, any ratchet can work at a club. Not too many years ago, dimes were plentiful but now more and more pennies and nickels abound. Tis a shame, I say.

And BP is even worse.

Easy, all of the really hot girls (10s) aren't willing to do extras or even strip at all for less >$1000/night, it's more lucrative and worthwhile for them to do something else/just marry rich. All of the 8s and 9s that think they're 10s feel the same way OR they're pulling pretty good money with low mileage/no extras because their only competition is a bunch of ratchet 6s and 7s. All of the 6s and 7s are the girls that can't find normal jobs, rich boyfriends, whathaveyou and have turned to stripping for whatever reason and are hired by the clubs due to the shortage of actual hot girls to flesh out the roster.

I concur with most of the above, except Dougster. He and I are both in Seattle, but we seem to see the area differently. I can definitely point to fewer dancers working at the Puget Sound Region Deja Vu clubs. They have a list of their dancers in their website, and it has decreased in number, significantly, in just the past two years.

Whenever this topic comes up, I always point to increased competition from on line sources: Free porn, web cam actresses, and escorts as reasons for lower quality and/or quantity of dancers.

@Club_Goer: Huh? I spoke about quality of dancers. Didn't say anything about number working.

IMHO:

Quality has stayed about the same or decreased slightly.
Value has increased.
Supply and variety has decreased.

The reason is that a slow economy means fewer customers with less money to spend. That smaller customer base can support fewer performers.

It seems more of a reason for patrons (gender nuetral baby) to stkp beating around the bush get cynical and straight up tell a girl no and why. Kindness keeps the worse of them in the club it seems. Either way, I'm not sure how it was back in the heyday, but now I find just a few out of plenty that really hit the bar of attractiveness.

Unscientific analysis: As the recession hit, customers cut back on the number of dances they were willing to buy. Whales became minnows and the rest were just watching the stage shows. To make money, club managers allowed almost anyone who wanted to dance come on board, hoping to at least make some money on the tip outs, the meals and the drinks they could hustle. Fuglies were hired in droves. High mileage became one way some dancers could keep regulars and regular income. Detroit dancers routinely ask for customers to buy drinks, meals or pay tips for five second conversations. (This is how "no extras" dancers try to make money.)

Dancer insecurity has increased SS. Dancers will tell any lie necessary to get you away from your ATF and in her stable of regulars. I have seen dancers try to nudge each other out of the way to sit my booth just because I was wearing a suit and, as I was told, looked like money. The turf war is on.

" I have seen dancers try to nudge each other out of the way to sit my booth just because I was wearing a suit and, as I was told, looked like money"

The question is, DID you have $$$$? Wearing a suit is no guarantee of having money to spend. When I wore suits to clubs years ago, I had little money to spend. NOW I wear my clubbing outfit [NOT a suit - LMAO] and have a lot to spend. The hard up dancers will miss out on a BIG payday if they walk on by me.

I must tell you that this economic downturn just does not exist in my part of the world. It is very rare to find an Alberta dancer in an Alberta SC. The overwhelming majority of dancers in Alberta clubs are touring dancers from out of province.

I am seeing so many more young women doing traditional male jobs in the oil patch now. I have yet to see a female rig pig but female diesel mechanics and welders show up from time to time and female truckers are a dime a dozen. There are now more women than men doing the work of a landsman. It is odd to hear a woman refer to herself as a 'landsman'. Women are preferred drivers for the monster trucks involved in the tar sands operations; they have proved to be gentler on the machines than male drivers, lowering maintenance costs.

All of these oil patch jobs will pay a woman much more than she could make as a stripper in an Alberta club.

I've noticed in my neck of the woods much more quantity and an extremely lower quality. There is one club in Superior Wi that routinely has 12-15 dancers midweek that I never saw a situation like that before the economic shit hit the fan. That happens to also be a very economically depressed area with few quality jobs. I've also noticed in that area, or southern MN, Iowa, Western Wi if a black dancer is a traveler from Milwaukee, she will do extras/OTC, without exception. Many travelers do, but for some reason Milwaukee is 100% sure thing. I did not notice that pre 2007. It seems like every club I go to has travel dancers, which I also never noticed in the past. Even the ones in the middle of nowhere boonies.

Alucard--
The suit was used to disguise my poverty--LOL.

In my area-Baltimore-, both the quantity and quality went down during the 2009 to 2010 time frame. Lately though both appear to be picking up. This area never has nor will have the nines and tens that NV or FL or CA has, but value has always been high.

For me, I know the quality of girls that I find super attractive, has gone over the years.

Too many piercings. Too many hideous tattoos. Fewer ideal bodies - either too heavy or way too skinny. If I do find a model quality babe, she typically ruins herself with fake tits.

Yeah, I'm extremely picky. But I used to be able to walk into a club and always find 2 or 3 girls that did it for me. Rarely anymore.

It seems to me that the overall quality of dancers has gone down in the Detroit area. I used to fall in love with 7 or 8 hot girls on every strip club visit. Now I'm lucky to find 2 or 3. At the same time extras have become routine. It's rare to find a dancer who won't provide them.

The economy has to be a big factor. Older dancers tell me how they used to be able to earn $1000 to $2000 a night without extras. Now some of this is SS, but there are definitely fewer customers in the clubs spending money. I'm no whale, but I spend about $500 a visit and this gets me plenty of attention.

Besides the economy, social change has also driven the increase in extras. High school girls provide BJs to their boyfriends, and so they don't see any big deal about providing BJs when they graduate to strip clubs.

I wonder if the dancers feel that the quality of the customers had gone down over the years?

It's my personal belief that, at least at the clubs I visit regularly, the quality has unquestionably gone down, but quantity is stable. One of my regular clubs has a cap on the number of dancers they can have, and it seems they always get there, at least on weekends, but the girls they hire leave something to be desired, for the most part. They don't ever seem to have as many 8's or 9's as they used to. As for my favorite club, as much as I like their dancers in general, I have a hard time visualizing most of them stripping elsewhere, because they're either 35+ or overweight (or in a few cases, overly skinny), or else have a personality disorder that prevents them from working at a better run club. But they never seem to have a shortage of dancers, except for possibly some midweek days (which I never get to go to).

In the few clubs I frequent the change I've seen could be considered "quality", but I prefer to consider it societal. They are becoming more and more what I would call "gangster". More crap "music", more tats, more piercings, and just plain not for me BS!

10's still exist, but they are less in number. 10's can still make money without the significant wear and tear of heavy extra's. It is rare that a 10 has such exquisite entertainment skills to overcome the wants of an extra's savvy customer. Short version to the original OP - Overall beauty has declined and extra's have increased. Duo: Some 10's do what your suggesting only 6's do!

Gotta agree with Rockie-In the COI, 10's do the do.

Around me the quality of dancer has gone up, while the quantity has gone down. With less money for clubbing, only the girls with looks, talent and energy survive. There are fewer girls who can make a living dancing, but the ones that can are successful for a reason.

What is SA?

If I knew what effect the economy was having on strip clubs, I would be a lot wealthier. What I do know is that in Atlanta quality is down but quantity and mileage are unchanged.

Victor - I believe Player11 is referring to the web site "Seeking Arrangements".

It definitely ain't Cypress Hill's label, Soul Assassins.

@rockie - Yeah, but I assume they mostly do it OTC or charge more than the 6s. I've known a lot of escorts and the truly beautiful ones are loaded and do a lot of scoffing at the cheap extras girls.

I agree with Motor, quantity the same, mileage up but quality WAY down! TOO many tatted up girls!

"I wonder if the dancers feel that the quality of the customers had gone down over the years"

How do you define "Quality"?

If the dancer gets her $$$$ from an average person, does it really matter the the paying customer MIGHT not be a very well off high powered Business person?

@victor2 - I think they're talking about Seeking Arrangement

^^^^ I agree with Duo totally. Lots of average priced escorts in San Diego, but the hotties would laugh at the offers guys on this site consider "generous". Makes me wonder what are they paying for. And blondes command the most money, generally.

I'm originally from OK but now live in central NJ. Both places, quality is down but quantity is up. There used to be, in both areas, 4 types of clubs - stallions (9-10s), quarterhorses (8-6s, newbies) fillies (5-4s, newbies) and the glue factory - everything else. Most clubs were for the fillies and quarter-horses. Now its 1:5:2:2 ratio. The stallions go where the big spenders are; the quarters & fillies are transitional as the less talented/attractive girls make up for it in mileage or extras or they're new to the industry and think that they just show up and guys throw money in the air, find out you actually have to put work in and club hop or drop out altogether which deepens the pool but regresses the quality.

Hmm. I must live in a different universe. I've not noticed a significant downturn in either quality or quantity. Other than the normal seasonal ebb and flow.

I think its a societal/generational thing. Some of the younger dancers may not see it as a big deal to give extra services, but in my experiences the young 'uns do a lot of things on a lark and aren't really serious about following through. I think that explains the tattoos and piercings as well. I have dabbled in the sugarbaby world and that attitude is very prevalent there so I've pretty much quit going for anyone under 25. They seem to thing that thang is made of gold. I guess I can't blame them if enough guys are willing to pay the young, pretty ones for doing nothing, why shouldn't they?

I also think more girls are trying the stripping life and don't really have what it takes to be successful so they don't last very long. The good news for us is that there is another batch coming on board next week.

Duo: I know a "10" or three that meet your standards. I know many other dancer "10's" and below - who feign disdain for such behavior, but their actions contradict their stated contempt. In my backyard it's 50/50, but the breakdown doesn't totally follow the theory that those with less provide more. Some dancers seem to believe that it's easier to give extra's than the effort that is required to entertain by the dancing act itself.

"so I've pretty much quit going for anyone under 25"

I have a definite preference for dancers in their 30's. They are just more mature physically, mentally, emotionally & just KNOW what they are doing.

Alucard - Are you saying that physically women do not reach full maturity until they are in their 30's?

Hard to say – it may be a chicken/egg thing.

A bad economy often means less $$$ in the club thus driving away the dancers since pickings are small – or a bad economy brings in dancers b/c there aren’t too many other good options to make $$$?

Most of what Duo says makes sense to me.

I think I saw many more very good looking dancers when there was much less mileage and dances consisted mostly of table-side air dances. That was probably a palatable way (i.e. air dances) for many dancers to make $$$.

With all the groping going on with today’s LDs; the very good looking dancers are not going to put up with that for $20 or $25 a pop – if they are going to be groped or give up the cuchie; it will probably be at $500 or $1k a pop (if not more for the very beautiful).

In the days where air dances where the norm in many if not most areas; dancers could get away w/ not providing any 2-way contact since it was the norm and not allowed – but now that high-mileage dances are the norm; they really cannot get away with it (no-contact dances) nearly as much as in the past.

Not too mention the impact technology (i.e. internet) has had – cam modeling; free porn; and easy accessibility to sex/escorts via the web means providers have many more options to make $$$ off their looks/cuchie thus depleting the dancer roster.

Also the proliferation of SCs may water down the roster. It was often in the past where there may have been just one game in town or just a couple of players (i.e. SCs) – but now they seem to be all over the place.

SC proliferation is pretty evident down here in South Florida. I’ve actually noticed dancer quality (and #s) go up when a nearby SC closes – and have seen new SCs that have opened struggle to get enough dancers and enough good looking ones.

Argh, lost what I wrote. @#$%!

Duo and SuperDude have very similar thoughts as me.

In the PA clubs I got to, both quality of talent and dancer attitudes are way down and continue to decline. I haven't notice a change in quantity, but agree with the feelings that clubs are 'hiring' whoever to fill the ranks. It wouldn't surprise me if clubs were also raising house fees.

I've said this before... it's a vicious negative feedback cycle right now. Guys are spending less, which drives away top talent that thinks they are worth more, clubs bring in lower quality, guys less motivated to spend, and so on.

The impact technology has yet to REPLACE the joys/fun of skin-to-skin contact & interaction.

Give that t me EVERY TIME over the technology of the Internet.

[I DON'T do Escorts, so I'll leave them out of my equation]

I'd guesstimate the typical guy/lesbians finds (at most) 20% of women to be hot. At most 20% (probably much less) of women are willing to be sex workers of any kind. So at most 20% x 20% = 4% of women that you would want to pay for some naughtiness and are also up for it. Way less than half of the 4% will be up for mileage/P4P/escorting.

Player11 casts a much wider net than most as far as women he finds hot (look at his pictures), thus his path to happiness is an easier one.

A bad economy means fewer and stingier custies as well as un and underemployed women. Strippers (even very hot ones) who earn have some hustle, and people with hustle are the least likely to be totally desperate for money. Passive hot girls end up as trophy wives or kept women under some other arrangement. Desperate women are more likely to come from booze and drugs (which are always there), not a slow economy.

There's no club I go to where strippers weren't more attractive before the bust. I think you have to be careful, it's easy to romanticize the old days, but the best looking girls were during the height of the internet boom, when even hot girls with decent regular-job prospects were coming in to cash in on the $$$ that was flowing. The more money that's flowing, the more it's worth it for an attractive woman to consider strippng; more beautiful girls in the talent pool, more beautiful girls in the clubs.