tuscl

Why are strippers so dumb?

Sunday, January 13, 2008 8:21 PM
Not all strippers of course, but the average stripper I find has a brightness level roughly equal to a 20 watt bulb, except of course for bright lights like Melonie (on pink site) and certain others including posters in here. I believe it's probably a combination of just having innately lower IQs and sometimes lower educational achievement. While I am this week focusing on researching and finally resolving the massive sex industry slave issue in the United States, I began to wonder how we can help increase the brain capacity of strippers. This problem has now reached a crisis and must soon be resolved and I am thinking a government program of some type could work, and cash payments to strippers to go to school and maybe have tutors at the clubs, who in turn would receive lap dances as payment, or some other creative idea to help these stripper victims.

78 comments

  • driver01
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    16 years ago
    Let's see-- she smiles, makes small talk, drinks till her hearts content, takes off varying amounts of clothing(depends on the particular locale) and men give her money to the tune of $20-25 per three minute song just for the privilege of her company and perhaps her touch for those precious few moments... Hmmm, are you sure strippers are the dumb ones?
  • BobbyI
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    16 years ago
    Cute. But it is, of course, a logical disaster to equate money making ability with intelligence. Drug dealers make alot. Does this make them smart?
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    Well the average PL may be somewhat dumb also, maybe a govt program to help them too?
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    Maybe it is from the economic evnironment where they were raised. Thats as far as Im gonna try to explain it. Your on your own man!
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    To be fair in some cases, particularly true of strippers at the 8 to 10 level in beauty, some probably realized at a relatively young age that their high end physical attributes were in effect a type of currency which they came to realize could be exchanged for money, gifts, or attention from males - so moving ahead in their education became of secondary importance, therefore their apparent lack of intelligence possibly being more an issue of lack of education vs lack of intellectual potential.
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    The PL crisis is another serious issue too, and selective mandated reading on the pink site could help, for example like the thread started the other day on "Hustle hut" entitled "This RIL needs a proper milking..." where the original poster seeks urgent advice in regards to her "absolutely infactuated" RIL so she can "start working him better" in effect how best to trick, scam, and fool this customer. Her ultimate stated goal being to: "finally land myself a walking pot of gold I can count on for a few shifts a week" and to "literally, curl up with my wads of money at night"
  • driver01
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    16 years ago
    Bobbyl-- 1)Maybe, if they are smart enough not to get caught. Good money, low to no taxes. You could make an argument that if they are really good at drug dealing they'd have to have a modicum of business acumen and more than a subpar IQ to keep ahead of the man...just a thought. 2) Some "dumb" strippers are simply sly like a fox...and while foxes may not be the smartest animal on the food chain at least they don't shell out $25 to have a woman dance on their lap for three minutes. 3) There's book smarts and then there's street smarts. Lot's of dancers with none of the former take lot's of guys with none of the latter to the cleaners on a far too frequent basis. In the strip club world, street smarts trumps book smarts pretty much every time...
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    extracting money from PLs and then spending it all (as most do) either supporting abusive boyfriends and sometimes drug habits or very often nicotine habits and many times for fancy clothes, cars and jewelry w/o saving, I am not sure how "smart" that really is. The ones that really plan ahead I believe tend to correlate with strippers on the higher end of the intelligence scale.
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    ok thats messed up. Im sorry revoke my damn feminist card if you must but that pink post is c*ap. So we get mad at men for sterotyping and objectifing us but its fine for us to do it to them? A walking pot of gold? Come on thats a freaking HUMAN BEING were talking about!
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    You know what NO Im sorry for thread jacking David9999 but DAMN. I cant get this damn double standard today. Sice when was having male genetalia a reason for treating them like inferiors. Im sick of hearing women bashing men all the time. I told FONDOL the same thing we lost our femininity for the promise of liberation. I DONT Feel Liberated.! But supressed for feeling a fondness to the opposite sex. Yes I want to be treated respectfully but not soley based on my gender but because my character deserves respect. Sorry that pink post ticked me off. :)
  • DandyDan
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    16 years ago
    I can't say they are all stupid. But it's clear most of them were never fully engaged in the learning process while in school. But I think a lot of education has to do either with useless trivia or pointless social programming and not a lot to do with actual practical knowledge. Who knows, maybe by not being engaged, they were the smart ones.
  • BobbyI
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    16 years ago
    I don't know. I would define intelligence as how well one can solve problems in totally new domains, or in situations they have never encountered before. Otherwise you start to confuse intelligence with knowledge. Strippers have some super specialized skills and they are also part of a community which has collectively gained a pretty good amount of knowledge in how to scam PL/RILs over the years. They are pretty good at winning unfair fights. Give the PL/RILs the same amount of collective knowledge (e.g. sign them up to read this board/the blue site for a few years) and then field tips decidedly toward the customer. To elaborate on the example, consider a blackjack who has been dealing for 20 years. Almost never makes a mistake, can deal an ungodly number of hands per hour, could probably rip off unwitting customers if so inclined. Does this make them smart? I would say no. Does it preclude them from being smart? Again no. So put a stripper and customer face to face with problems in areas both are unfamiliar with to see who is the better problem solver. I think you'll find, as David has, that once you take them out of the very narrow areas they are familiar with they do not fair very well, and can say some incredibly stupid/illogical things.
  • BobbyI
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    16 years ago
    P.S. My guess is that the average stripper IQ is well below 100. What thinks the rest of you?
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    Bobbyl- IQ wouldnt have anything to do with it. The concept of IQ was developed by Lewis Terman (circa 1916?) which revised the intelligence scale created by Alfred Binet and Theodore Simon. Hence the new name ,the Stanford-Binet Intelligence Scale. In this Terman used the ratio of mental age to chronological age. It is this ratio—or quotient—concept led to us conning term IQ (Intelligence Quotient). This mental age-chronological age concept works well for children, but has proven difficult in determing an adults "IQ". The problems here are so complicated ( what environmental, socialogical, and economical factors should be included in the measurement of someones "IQ") that today psychologists speak simply about intelligence and have generally given up the idea of IQ. Today, intelligence is measured according to individual deviation from standardized norms, with 100 being the average. So you may meet a stripper with an "IQ" thats off the charts but she socially may be underdeveloped. I think that its basically a crap shoot on the level of intelligence of anyone providing a service. OK 2 cents deposited LOL
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    hee hee I knew my old college papers were useful for something.
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    "This mental age-chronological age concept works well for children, but has proven difficult in determing an adults "IQ"." Large variations in IQ between X subject and Y subject or X group or Y group are not difficult to determine. Imperfect measurements do not make them irrelevant despite that being a popular position to take on college campuses today. When the issue of general intelligence is discussed today, particularly in the world of academia, an ultra high level of political correctness is required, and we have to now pretend that IQ is irrelevant or too "complicated" to accurately use, when in fact such pretense is a convenient fiction to avoid unpleasant debates. I will tell you that there is little debate that surgeons for example typically have higher IQs than dancers, and we can pretend its all irrelevant anyways, unless its YOU on the table in the operating theater.
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    Televised congressional hearings on these "Regular in Love" VICTIMS with followup legislation would be nice, maybe at the start of President Obama or President Hillary's term, in-between their efforts to turn america into socialist euro-trash west. Testimony from witnesses about exactly how a dancer carries out a "proper milking" of an RIL customer -would be absolutely critical
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    So would you say that IQ's are lower in diffrent races as well?
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    Because you seem to be quoting the theories of Psychologist Arthur Jensen and Physicist William Shockley. If thats the case then any debate will just go on forever. I have known surgeons that stripped to get tuition money does the "dumb stripper" anomoly apply to them as well according to your theories? Im not asking out of any disrespect I just want to understand your basic hypothesis for that theory.
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    oops I forgot but University of Pennsylvania Anthropologist Peggy Sanday, insists that the differences are environmental. Maybe that theory could be tossed around too.
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    I will simply restate what I've already said in BookGuy's "poverty" thread, as both questions are really the same. Also note that EAST Asians, most specifically Chinese, Korean, and Japanese have on average the highest IQs of any racial group - (these 3 groups physically removed from equatorial regions). So if some groups do better, some groups will do less well, its a simple matter of logic, and ironically (though never conceded by its proponents) the only valid and honest argument in favor of affirmative action. (quote) Over 1000's of years and sometimes less, geographic variable weather seasonality (e.g a distinct 4 season climate) enhances creativity and intelligence, and its precisely why the great advances in civilizations have nearly all occured in temperate climates (e.g the pilgrims in america) vs equatorial based cultures who often are dis-incentivized to create and produce when food can derive from hunting or to some degree can grow naturally on trees, and shelter requirements (in such a warm climate) are minimal Nearly every major country in the world has increased poverty rates as it concerns cultures that derive from equatorial regions. In simple terms, "necessity is the mother of invention, and when you don't heve much necessity, you don't get much inventing, nor do you get a particularly high amount of brainpower" (end quote)
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    Ok A Sanaday - Shockler-Jenson Hybrid
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    Wondergrl Before you get too upset the entire thread was actually posted as a joke following the (absurd for a strip forum) prior question entitled "Why do we have poverty in America"?
  • wondergrl5
    •
    16 years ago
    Never was upset LOL never read that thread either to "heavy" Just wanted to get where you were cumming from
  • wondergrl5
    •
    16 years ago
    Oh crap I mispelled Coming Hee hee
  • jester214
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    16 years ago
    You average person is an idiot, so why should strippers be any different? lol For every moron stripper you meet theres an average one and probably a smart one too. Its relative just like everywhere else, why are fast food workers so dumb? It they could be doing brain surgery they probably would be...
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    Jester - read the original post, its a joke.
  • casualguy
    •
    16 years ago
    I heard that guys react irrationally after they see anything that really visually stimulates them. So if I suddenly see a really nice looking dancer with a hot body and very nice legs and ass (such as in the one youtube video, another thread) and she asked if she could dance for me at 10 or 15 dollars a dance, I'd probably just say "ok". Regardless of the fact that it's costing me 10 or 15 dollars for 3 or 4 minutes when I could just watch her on stage for only a dollar. So if she was dumb, I wouldn't even know it. Maybe she succeeded in making me dumber. Now where some dancers get upset is when you aren't visually stimulated by them and they try their best and you just say "maybe later". If some dancers knew after I drink a certain number of beers, I sometimes lose interest in them, they would probably stop me from drinking anything past 4 beers. Maybe I have something weird going on in my head after so many beers. I remembering playing an arcade game after drinking a few in one strip club and everything seemed to be moving in slow motion but I could still move and think fast. I went past 1 million points on one arcade game and started back over, all on one quarter. That was several years ago though, I think the game was Galaga. Why are strippers so dumb? Doesn't matter if they just made you dumber. Besides, if I was interested in their intelluctual abilities, I would be less interested in their body and probably want to know them better. That leads more to a relationship instead of just getting dances in a club. I guess another way to answer that question would be to say, guys don't care if the strippers are dumb. They just want to see their tits and ass. However who is dumber is another question because the guys are paying big bucks to watch those tits and ass on occasion.
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    David9999- You started a trouble hun hee hee
  • David9999
    •
    16 years ago
    I like them a little dumb actually
  • wondergrl5
    •
    16 years ago
    And trashy?
  • wondergrl5
    •
    16 years ago
    LOL
  • David9999
    •
    16 years ago
    sorry, actually I am hooked a bit on non-trashy ultra feminine girly-girl types who are a bit on the shy side, and that just fell into the dancing profession by accident by selecting the wrong men - to marry and have kids with - except for one (never-married no-kids) very young wild ATF who is basically whoring on the side, and predictably (and not surprisingly) I never really had a "thing" per se for, except in a purely hedonistic way - as she gives these incredibly wet and intense kisses and per chance just happens to have a beautiful face, amazing natural breasts, long legs and very nice (latin) ass
  • FONDL
    •
    16 years ago
    I don't think that strippers on average are any dumber than the customers. Sure there are dumb strippers but there are also plenty of smart ones. I prefer above-average intelligence in a dancer and I've never had any trouble finding it. Many of them are students - I've run into several graduate students dancing. And many others aren't particularly well educated but are intelligent - I usually enjoy girls like that, I think it's a fascinating combination. My ATF was like that when I first met her.
  • MisterGuy
    •
    16 years ago
    Yea, right...the Pilgrims were *much* more advanced than the Mayans or the Incas or the Egyptians or the civilization in India...right.
  • David9999
    •
    16 years ago
    "Yea, right...the Pilgrims were *much* more advanced than the Mayans or the Incas or the Egyptians or the civilization in India...right." Although an average 6th grader reading my remarks in context would clearly understand what I was referring to, I will spell it out anyways: the "pilgrims in america" formed THE critical underpinning to the THE AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION allowing America itself to achieve the greatest economic prosperity in the world. Last I've heard Mexico and India were still 3rd world countries, and not surprisingly located approximately within a zone extending out 20 to 30 degrees latitude relative to the equator.
  • parodyman-->
    •
    16 years ago
    David9999 Seems to me like a SLIGHTLY more articulate version of Romantic Lover. (not good)
  • harrydave
    •
    16 years ago
    I'm with FONDL on this one. The club population is probably no different from the general population. Looks can be deceiving. I remember a tall, thin German girl that danced at my favorite club in Phoenix. When I first met her, she seemed excessively giggly and ditzy. Because she was very tall, I asked her how tall she was, and she said "Five foot, twelve!" Ok, that was clever. Two dances and many fun comments later I learned she was a PhD candidate in biochemistry. Brains and beauty!
  • casualguy
    •
    16 years ago
    I was thinking it doesn't help when a dancer asks the question? So what is your job, or what kind of work do you do? I give my answer, then sometimes I hear, "you must be smart". I understand she is trying to compliment me but is she also saying I'm smart compared to her? That's just the general impression that statement gives me every time I hear a dancer say that to me. I think I usually try to change the subject at that point. Every once in a while a dancer will tell me she has another job other than dancing. One dancer was working in real estate and moonlighting. Another was a bit of an artist and had some pretty good paintings. I wouldn't be surprised if she continues dancing for awhile though. Another had a job as a dental hygynist if I spelled that correctly. It's nice to think a dancer may think of you as icing on the cake rather than merely another income source in the club or part of her bread and butter.
  • David9999
    •
    16 years ago
    Parodyman - I see you have an ongoing need to engage in personal attacks, preferring to hide behind your clown facade as (w/o any doubt) you clearly lack the intellectual firepower to respond to an issue or question in a substantive manner. Can you even read basic english? Have you actually compared my posts to "Romantic Lovers" posts? Any rational person comparing my typical posts on various topics vs the (apparent) infantile posts of "Romantic Lover" and arriving at your conclusion - is either a fucking moron or a fucking idiot, probably both. (not good) I just reviewed a dozen or so posts of "Romantic Lover" from earlier in the year and the pattern I've found (if consistent with his other posts) is child-like or perhaps suggestive of someone with limited mental capacity, this one from Feb 17, 2007, actually one of the less infantile posts. THREAD STARTED BY "ROMANTIC LOVER" "What kind of FRIENDSHIP have you had with strippers? Do you consider strippers to be your FRIENDS? What if they REFUSE to tell you their REAL NAMES and PHONE NUMBERS and REFUSE to spend time with you OUTSIDE THE CLUB for FREE?
  • AbbieNormal
    •
    16 years ago
    "Yea, right...the Pilgrims were *much* more advanced than the Mayans or the Incas or the Egyptians or the civilization in India...right." Uhm, yeah, they were, and it's pretty obvious. Aside from the whole technological part (you know, iron working, firearms, etc) they sprung from a society that taught the value of the individual, and a tradition that the individual was free to live as they desired and to worship as they desired, free from the dictates of anyone other than their god or conscience. These were utterly alien concepts to Mayans, Incas, Egyptians, or Indians. If they weren't what the hell are all these white people named Smith and Jones doing over here and where are all the Incas and Mayans?
  • Book Guy
    •
    16 years ago
    I don't buy the street-smarts theory about strippers. Not only are the dim ones lacking in book-smarts, in my experience; they're also lacking in practical smarts. I think it isn't because they're "dumb" or "smart" by specific biological standards. Nor is it because "smarter" people go into other jobs. I think it's because those who have the stomach and skills and assets necessary to be vaguely successful at stripping have, by definition, a trait that causes them to believe that others ought to do their thinking for them. They USE MEN to do thinking. Among other things. Therefore, they don't learn to do thinking themselves. Simple really. Kind of like why Hollywood actors are bad at dressing themselves when they're not on set. Unless they've HIRED someone to read fashion magazines for them, their look is not "natural." Brad Pitt looks like an idiot when he appears in New Orleans at his charity building site; he can't dress himself up, and Angelina can't do it either, not to the degree necessary to accomplish the "polished" movie star look we've learned to expect. Same with strippers. They use other specialists for mental endeavors.
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    This question is sort of like saying "Why are full-time Walmart cashier clerks so dumb"? Less intelligent people tend to work jobs requiring less intelligence, and that's about the sum total of it, and that's why the question itself (particularly given the other comments made in the opening post) - was clearly written as a joke, made to follow the (insanely off topic)and arguably absurd "poverty" post that preceded it. Now for CYA purposes, I have no doubt that some current brain surgeon somewhere and maybe an astronaut here or there once worked as a Walmart cashier, probably part-time etc, however, ok fine, they are not all dumb, some in fact can be very smart.
  • Book Guy
    •
    16 years ago
    PS -- to David9999, I did notice that this thread and mine about poverty are actually quite similar. Both ask an "unanswerable" question that tries to get at the heart of a "system in place" but allows for complaint about individuals whose actions manage somehow to perpetuate that system. So, there's the "cultural" aspects, which dovetail into the "individual" aspects. As far as your explanation about continental resources ... I do agree, to a limited extent. I do believe that there is something to the fact that Northern Europeans were spurred by geological climatic factors into innovation for the sake of self-preservation, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that it's therefore genetic. I don't think there's been sufficient time for the phenotype / genotype link to be so markedly differentiated. Instead, I'll say it IS perhaps location-specific, but not necessarily race-specific. (I know plenty of Thais who are quite innovative and business-oriented, for example.) On a related note, if you like that kind of analysis, then you would very much enjoy Jared Diamond's books "Guns, Germs, and Steel" and others. His overall thesis comes down to something quite similar, but he packs it with examples from history. Comparing why the Europeans has all three of those items in their favor when they met the native North Americans, etc. Domesticable animals, proximity to agriculturally viable plants, east-west rather than north-south continental axes, etc. etc.. He has the science background to list the specifics, including archaeological, genetic, linguistic, and other biological evidence. Very compelling. He writes it dumbed down a little bit too much for me -- eighth grade level, roughly -- but at least it's palatable.
  • wondergrl5
    •
    16 years ago
    Just a note Ironworking and firearms(i.e gun powder- JAPAN) was prevalent WAY before the Pilgrims. And by Indians do you mean the indeginous people of this Land? And as for "free" from the dictates of anyone other than their god or conscience you mean from england or the church because when they came to the U.S the forced their beliefs and religion onto the Native Americans. BTW Im not being controversal but being from a Native American background I have a slightly diffrent opinion
  • David9999
    •
    16 years ago
    "I wouldn't go so far as to say that it's therefore genetic." This unreasonable and seemingly mindless obsession (God forbid) that someone might actually use the G word and present a logical analysis w/o being shouted down as a racist - THAT is precisely the problem, because its distorts all subsquent analysis. We know eye color is genetic, same with hair color, intelligence within races no doubt, often music ability, height, all sorts of things - yet we deny the obvious to such a degree we desperately look for other explanation, turning for example to the so-politically correct explanations of authors like Jared Diamond, who now has become among other things the poster child of Public Broadcasting System in america and for much of the left - providing THE all-purpose explanation of all such matters. Yes, I've been familiar with his writings for several years, however this focus on trade routes and so forth its only part of the explanation. Compare this to author (Harvard Ph D) Professor Gregory Clark's "A Farewell to Alms: A Brief Economic History of the World" which presents equal plausble explanations to why some societies developed and some did not. However Mr Clark dares to bring in the subject of genetics as a critical component, and his work (as expected) ended up receiving the expected trashing from much of academia. SO WHAT if it turns the aggregate group differences in "intelligence" in regards to different races - are tied into genetics? These are GROUP differences, not true of the individual. The evidence that East Asians as measured by standardized methods of intelligence come out ahead of any other racial group - means that I being a non "East Asian" am therefore a member of an inferior group, and it doesn't bother me one bit Personally I believe one could conceivably argue physicality itself could be deemed a type of intelligence, (as some have already done) therefore some groups that do less well on a GROUP BASIS in the more traditional measures of intelligence - arguably would have a different type of intelligence. Obviously blacks in sports have some kind of genetic based ability that is clearly tied into their many 1000's of years existence on the plains and in the jungles of africa, even though we all have to play this silly game, that "oh we didn't notice the connection" Your comments in reference "I don't think there's been sufficient time for the phenotype / genotype link" That's no doubt is true, because genes (unlike environment) are very slow to change, however note we are also looking at 1000's of years before in the same or similar climates with many of these same groups in some cases. However in any case, its the inverse case that seems to be most dramatic: that being the cultures living for 1000s or 10's of 1000's of years within 25 to 30 degrees latitude of the equator, nearly all those societies have been lagging in their development as it concerns typical modern advancements today.
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    "Just a note Ironworking and firearms(i.e gun powder- JAPAN) was prevalent WAY before the Pilgrims." The pilgrims were simply one example, and the most obvious, because they provided the underpinnings to the greatest societal advancements in the history of the world, related to the american industrial revolution, eventually leading up to 20th century conquest of the atom and conquest of space. That's not surprising at all as Japanese along with Koreans and Chinese, all in locales far removed from the equator, but not hindered by extreme artic level cold to any large degree - now have the highest IQ's of any racial groups in the world at about 105 vs european descendents at 100. Compare this to southeast asians with avg IQs of 87 with south asians at 84 - both from equatorial regions.
  • MisterGuy
    •
    16 years ago
    The Pilgrims had nothing to do with the Industrial Revolution in this country. The Industrial Revolution in this country was basically started by Samuel Slater, when he came over from Europe with plans for a textile mill that he had memorized. The British had restricted the import of technical plans for such things because they didn't want their colonies refining anything in the New World...they just wanted raw materials shipped back to them. Slater's Mill was built in my hometown of Pawtucket, RI. You can still visit it today...it's downtown along the Blackstone River. The Mayan and Indian (in India) cultures were indeed subjucated...by the white man from Europe. This "equatorial" region stuff that you keep spewing Dave is nothing but blatant, racist nonesense. Oh yea, and blacks are better at sports cuz of all that runnin' they did in Africa (sound like Jimmy the Greek & Rush Limbaugh anyone?). Be a man and own up to it at least... BTW...the Incas were *flying* in balloons looong before we were in this country. The Egyptians learned about the stars before just about anyone, and the Indians did a hell of a lot of math before much of anything like that was going across the rest of the world. The Pilgrims were repressed pinheads...they were thrown out of Europe! The Spanish slaughtered most of the Mayans and Incas unfortunately. I'm beginning to agree with whomever described some strip clubs patrons as dumber than some strippers. :)
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    "The Pilgrims had nothing to do with the Industrial Revolution in this country." Pawtucket, well that explains alot. Since you obviously are of limited intelligence unable to comprehend even the most elmentary of facts I will once again spell it out: the term "pilgrims in america" as I used it clearly refers to the entire culture and belief system related to the religious, social, and business institutions developed in america in the 17th and 18 century - all which were critical to what followed. However, I realize this is beyond your limited mental capacities, so lets just drop the argument.
  • wondergrl5
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    16 years ago
    This thread is getting dumb. Bring back the SC talk!!!!!!
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    "This "equatorial" region stuff that you keep spewing Dave is nothing but blatant, racist nonesense." Ignorance is bliss baby and your world is serene.
  • MisterGuy
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    16 years ago
    Hey Dave, in the immortal words of probably one of your biggest heros, Sen. Phil Gramm from TX, why don't you get out of the cart and start pushing/pulling like the rest of us, we've all been pulling you along for far too long...post a fucking strip club review!! Have you even *been* to a strip club?! Yea, I'm originally from "the Bucket"...you can hold it against me if you'd like to. :)
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    "post a fucking strip club review!!" An ignorant puke like you is telling me what to do. NO one tells me what to do buddy. How about I tell YOU what to do? "MISTER GUY, GO FUCK YOURSELF"
  • MisterGuy
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    16 years ago
    So sue me counselor...you're contributing very little to this site from what I can tell IMO. You love to stir the pot and try and show everyone what a know-it-all you are. Put your money where your mouth is...put up or shut up...
  • driver01
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    16 years ago
    LMAO-- So much for book smarts. 55 posts on an admittedly bullshit thread starter--LOL.
  • Book Guy
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    16 years ago
    Dave: dude, you're the one not using logic. You have a conclusion (certain groups had technological advantages), you have your own reason (those groups are genetically superior), and you have no necessary or sufficient connection between the two. Correlation is not causation. I can agree that the groups are represented the way you describe, but I can name a bunch of smart folks who are industrially inventive or financially quite competent who nevertheless are genetically strictly non-European. Genetic theory kaboom, gone. Read Jared Diamond. He'll give you more science to go on. You are right, in your conclusion -- Atahualpa lacked germs, steel, guns, when he met Pizarro. Diamond tells you why.
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    "but I can name a bunch of smart folks who are industrially inventive or financially quite competent who nevertheless are genetically strictly non-European" Group aggregate averages is what is relevant to the macro discussion as it concerns alleged variances in group abilities. One could say "I know a 4 ft man and a 6 ft woman, therefore most women are taller than most men" Its irrelevant. Citing books to substitute for argument is fine, but I already know what various authors have said, because in fact I was aware of these things way way before most of these books were ever written. My education goes well beyond that of a typical lawyer, so I'm not giving ground to any of these authors with their fancy credentials and major media parrot-like supporters, the ones you've cited clearly being determined from Day One to arrive at a politically correct conclusion. The evidence - of group differences as it concerns raw intelligence - is overwhelming. Causation is another matter. I had no reason to conclude either for or against that its related to genetics, but we do know this:((caps for emphasis) THE POLITICAL CORRECT CROWD COULD NOT CONCLUDE IT WAS GENETICS) Geographical based connections are a viable line of argument, though ultra non-politically correct. Political correctness tends to shut down debates, not add to them, because it takes off the table the most logical of all explanations. As expected, myself brought up as a liberal, in a liberal community, educated at 4 major eastern liberally slanted universities, with friends and all colleagues of all races, never a single racial issue with them, yet I am now being labeled a "racist" by another poster in here. Its not a suprise to me at all.
  • Book Guy
    •
    16 years ago
    Didn't say "most." Said I knew one. But if you're arguing "group aggregate" I guess your evidence could be a fair proof of your conclusion. I'm still not buying it (maybe I'm hoodwinked by the PC crowd, brainwashed). I'll accept the idea as far as to agree with you, that in given locations, because of certain geological and climatic factors, the cultures which developed there ended up needing less innovation, less pursuit of excellence, less competition, and generally less "success" oriented behaviors, and so over the long haul, the people who lived there didn't need to learn success-orientation as much as the people in less viable climates / etc.. I still don't think it's necessarily genetic ... otherwise Eskimos would be the world's greatest entrepreneurs.
  • David9999
    •
    16 years ago
    I've already specified temperate latitudes as being the primary high development zone, so that rules out Eskimos, or other ultra-cold areas not conducive to even developing large populations of humans, let alone advancing. Much of this is simply a matter of common sense, as one can arrive at these conclusions independently of commentators like Shockley or Jensen etc - I'd in fact never read any of their works. I heard later they were in effect run out of town - so to speak I tend to adopt the most logical explanations, not the most politically correct ones, and its obvious to me (as has been for many years) that there is some connection between development over many centuries and temperatures. climates, and geography, and over 100's of thousands of years, these factors can enter into the gene pool. Trade routes and other factors enter into the equation, however the evidence that I see is quite substantial with for example one knockout case being the substantial IQ variations between Eastern Asians vs the (equatorial centered) Southeast and Southern Asians. Note in regards to the ones in the USA they cannot claim to have been brought to america in chains, and if anything they benefit from a type of reverse (favorable) prejudice, very different than that experienced by african-americans, yet we see reduced IQ's attached to 1000's of year of development in equatorial based areas. Many noted the very high welfare rates of Cambodian refugees who arrived from their equatorial based locales, and believed it to be anomaly as this is unusual for asian groups in general in the USA. That's just one of many examples.
  • David9999
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    16 years ago
    "maybe I'm hoodwinked by the PC crowd" No doubt, but there are very few in america that are not. Add to this a very swift enforcement mechanism for those not toeing the line - such as what happened very recently to Nobel prize winner James Watson (co-modelor of DNA) - who made some non PC comments on these precise matters, and he was effectively banished, - and its no wonder an honest debate can and probably never will occur
  • David9999
    •
    16 years ago
    "Genetic theory kaboom, gone." I assume you must be kidding of course Your example you alluded to in conjunction to this doesn't even put a dent in the basic facts involved here, as the IQs are group averages, and there are large ranges within each demographic group making all sort of possiblities for variation in skills and so forth.
  • MisterGuy
    •
    16 years ago
    "I still don't think it's necessarily genetic...otherwise Eskimos would be the world's greatest entrepreneurs." LOL... What exactly were the "temperatures, climates, and geography, over 100's of thousands of years"? Careful here...you might step on a landmine... Oh, and you're right...Asians have it easy here in the USA...when we're not locking them up in concentration camps and calling them "Gooks, Chinks, Slant-eyes", etc., etc.. Is there *anything* that you don't know everything about Dave-o? Oh, and here's a link for you: [view link] They even have a catchy song there that you can probably sing along to... :)
  • Book Guy
    •
    16 years ago
    Well, I CAN agree with Dave's contentions to a degree. I don't really mind disagreeing with him on the genetics subject -- in my opinion he's pretty bright, we can continue to discuss other issues in a friendly manner. I forgot where this thread was going when we got side-tracked ... 8^o
  • ShotDisc
    •
    16 years ago
    OMG, you guys sound like kids arguing on the playground. Take it somewhere else!!!!
  • Book Guy
    •
    16 years ago
    Wait, agreeing to disagree, and admitting I got side-tracked, are things that kids do on a playground?
  • David9999
    •
    16 years ago
    Book Guy - your comments are well thought out and most importantly directly responsive to the substance of the issues presented vs an attack on the parties, however as this thread demonstrates, its very hard to say anything controversial about these matters w/o being called a racist - and that's when it ends up a playground situation. Point is nothing you've said contributed to it becoming a playground fight.
  • Book Guy
    •
    16 years ago
    Yeah, David, I do respect the fact that although (a) you're saying things that might be mistakenly considered inflammatory by some people (and you know that fact) nevertheless (b) you're doing your best to present the ideas in a well supported manner, a manner that indicates you've thought about the matters and come to conclusions on the basis of what you perceive to be evidence (you consider it science) rather than just group-think from some peer pressure in your past (which is the root of most bigotry). In other words, you're not saying, "We all know X. X is obvious." Instead you're saying, "I see evidence which points to X. This is the evidence." When "X" is, itself, something quite different from the accepted notion of things -- a part of a PC agenda or not -- it's hard to get your point across. I 'feel your pain' in the sense that I understand that you're saying thing which aren't common, or which are commonly misconstrued. Here's a similar situation which happens in my life. I can't keep down a job, and often am very very sleepy first thing in the morning. Nearly all my employers, and all my old school chums, no doubt would assume -- were I to tell them these facts -- that I'm just a dead-beat who doesn't "try hard enough." Fact is, however (and these are facts they probably won't ever hear, even if I say them clearly to those people, because they've already come to their conclusions), fact is, I'm EXTREMELY productive at my workplace, and also a rapid riser. Just not an EARLY one. Whenever I've gotten fired, it has STUNNED and SURPRISED my colleagues, although it was a _fait_accomplis_ on the part of my superiors, because I'm always perceived as one of the people who "really carries his weight, and a little extra" by the people who know who is doing the work. So, although my initial statements make me sound like a dead-beat -- sleepy; dislikes getting up on time; loses his job often -- nevertheless the very same pieces of evidence might point to the fact that *I'm* not the problem, but rather the problem resides with the idiot superiors (with whom I have yet to learn to interact effectively, obviously). Sometimes I get started on a board and just mention, "Goddarnit the boss was an idiot again." And I'll get 75% sympathy, but 25% misguided advice or invective -- "You obviously didn't try hard enough, if he did fire you." In syllogistic terms, this 25% has confused sufficient and necessary conditions -- the syllogism is, if you don't do your work then you do get fired. That much I agree with them on. But then, their mistake is, to understand the reverse: that if I did get fired, I must not have done my work. In fact, I DID do my work, but got fired for another reason (in my opinion, bad moron boss number 11). If A implies B, B does not necessarily imply A. Right? So, you can see that I've experienced, in a very real manner, exactly what you're going through on this thread. My advice to you is, to stick to your guns (even though I disagree with some of the things they're firing) but don't just fire away at a blast-all rat-a-tat-tat service. There's no problem with agreeing to disagree. Meanwhile, the bystanders misunderstand. That's because they're slow. Poor dears. :)
  • pushin50
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    16 years ago
    Maybe they are just bringing their intelligence level down to the level of the people they are dealing with?!
  • MisterGuy
    •
    16 years ago
    If you're not a morning person (neither am I BTW), try working second shift Book Guy. Sorry to hear that you've had so much trouble in the past.
  • hornytoad085
    •
    16 years ago
    I think the crude nature of many of the interactions in SCs has a cognitively disabling effect on many of the dancers, causing them to drink a lot on the job, act bitchy, disappear into the "locker room" [my term, apparently that's offensive and it's actually a "dressing room"] for extended periods of time, or just burn out and quit the biz altogether. Of course many (most?) of them aren't starting with highly-developed intellects to begin with.
  • Book Guy
    •
    16 years ago
    Kind of like doing mindless construction-lot unskilled jobs ... kills your brain cells, makes you dull and angry.
  • 2for20DollarsLapDancesForever
    •
    16 years ago
    wondergrl5, you said "And by Indians do you mean the indeginous people of this Land?" For the record, the available evidence suggests that caucasians were the natives of this land. The oldest human skull ever found in America was caucasian. The politically correct crowd tried to cover up the discovery(with some success). To their credit, '60 Minutes' did a story on it about 10 years ago.
  • MisterGuy
    •
    16 years ago
    "the available evidence suggests that caucasians were the natives of this land." You'd have to post some kind of link to back that claim up before I believed it my friend. Where was this skull found?
  • 2for20DollarsLapDancesForever
    •
    16 years ago
    I'm not your friend. If any open minded people are interested: [view link]
  • MisterGuy
    •
    16 years ago
    Thanx for the link...does that mean we're enemies BTW? :) Sounds to me like it might have been someone from the East coast or ancient Asian peoples of the time that somehow ended up on the West coast. It also sounds like the Native Americans want their remains back. Sounds like there needs to be more comprehensive study to me, but the remains seem to be Native American for sure. I don't think there's any way that a white "explorer" would be in that neck of the woods ~6000-8000 years ago. Where would these white males have gone between then and when the Vikings and other Eurpoeans showed up? Try this link for the real story instead BTW: [view link] I used to like 60 Minutes too, until they did a story on the crook politican that used to run Providence, RI (Vincent "Buddy" Cianci). They made him look like a good guy when, in fact, he was a crook of the first order. You can't believe everything that you see on TV or read on the Internet.
  • Book Guy
    •
    16 years ago
    But you CAN believe everything you read in books, of course. :)
  • shadowcat
    •
    16 years ago
    One day my ATF and I were discussing her best friend. She kept beating around the bush. She did not want to use the word "DUMB". I said "In other words, it's a good thing that she has nice tits". Her reply "YES".
  • MisterGuy
    •
    16 years ago
    Another phrase that I've heard girls use to describe someone that's said something dumb or a "blonde moment" is, "She's/you're so pretty..."
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