tuscl

OT : Standing for the Star Spangled Banner?

londonguy
Breathe, breathe in the air
Sunday, August 28, 2016 4:10 AM
What do you think of this? Within his rights or the ultimate show of disrespect? [view link]

136 comments

  • Tiburon
    •
    8 years ago
    Lack of understanding creates contempt and ire. Is ignorance truly bliss?
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    Fuck the flag. Fuck america. Kapernick gets my respect but he is still a scrub on the field.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    I get why veterans would be salty and feel disrespected but that doesn't the fact of the matter. Blacks aren't afforded those same liberties and feedoms that whites are. So Fuck this country.
  • Dominic77
    •
    8 years ago
    "People mad Kaepernick sat during (The Star-Spangled Banner) in protest but they aren't mad about the injustice he's protesting. That's the point" . -Sam White (via Twitter) I agree it's not very classy or respectful of him not to stand at attention. However this is American and Kaepernick has his Constitutional rights to protest. It sounds to me the problem was he made others feel uncomfortable. Hopefully this gets people to think and talk about these things.
  • Beaver_Hunter
    •
    8 years ago
    United we stand...
  • sharkhunter
    •
    8 years ago
    Thousands of people fought and died for our freedoms in this country and he is disrespecting everyone who did so. In my opinion, he is also disrespecting Martin Luther King and others who fought for rights. Just because he thinks he and others aren't getting fair treatment isn't a good reason to disrespect everyone else. There's a lot of unfair treatment going on right now but I think his protest is not respectful and the wrong way to protest. The dead who fought for our rights in the past don't have a voice to say there is a much better way. If you feel that strongly about it, don't protest in a way that disrespects everyone who fought and died to defend our freedoms in the past, do marches and rallies to protest what you think are injustices. If people ignore you, help do bigger and bigger protests and marches in city capitals until enough people take notice. The guy makes millions of dollars a year and he is disrespecting everyone who fought and died defending our rights, even if those rights are being slowly taken away by those in power.
  • sharkhunter
    •
    8 years ago
    What's next? Women not standing up for the pledge of allegiance because they don't have the right to go topless? That's not fair either. However I do not see any million March of topless women protesting in DC.
  • sharkhunter
    •
    8 years ago
    I would like to see that.:). ^
  • vincemichaels
    •
    8 years ago
    I'll support their breasts if they can go topless. :)
  • Daddillac
    •
    8 years ago
    I believe he has the right to not stand or protest for his beliefs..... I also believe he is an asshole.... I also believe his sponsors have a right to drop him if his image does not support their brand
  • sharkhunter
    •
    8 years ago
    I forgot, for athletes, it can cost them millions for doing things sponsors might drop them over. He's very brave risking millions of dollars doing his protest. Of course I would not call the college swimmer that caused a disruption in Brazil brave. Just stupid or drunk.
  • sharkhunter
    •
    8 years ago
    He does have a right. People died defending those rights.
  • motorhead
    •
    8 years ago
    He has the right to sit, that is what makes America great. But it's disrespectful and he's an asshole. He says America "oppresses" blacks. But he's going to make $12 million this year while probably sitting on the bench. Yeah, he's an oppressed field slave.
  • shadowcat
    •
    8 years ago
    I'm not impressed by celebrities opinions.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    "He has the right to sit, that is what makes America great. But it's disrespectful and he's an asshole. He says America "oppresses" blacks. But he's going to make $12 million this year while probably sitting on the bench. Yeah, he's an oppressed field slave." And how much do those white owners make? For doing even less?
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    ^^^That isn't even the point, he has the right to protest, and explain to us why we have to agree with him. Those owners have made it possible for a jerk to make millions of dollars playing a game that many would do for free.
  • 4got2wipe
    •
    8 years ago
    "Those owners have made it possible for a jerk to make millions of dollars playing a game that many would do for free." I disagree that many would play for free. Maybe for a game or two, but not long term. I actually knew a former NFL player who blew his knee out. Never really talked much about playing, but his comment at one point was "it was a job, nothing more." Kaepernick is luck to be in a position to use his job to make a statement. Whether you agree with that statement or not it's still brilliant that he can make it.
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    You can make a statement, without offending the people who fought and died to give you your rights, you can work within the system to make it better, or you can resort to anarchy and blow it up, when you do that you loose the support of people like me that are moderate and fair minded.
  • Dominic77
    •
    8 years ago
    The problem with these protests is they offend people like veterans, active duty service men and women, their families, and supporters (among others). That is understandable and sympathize with the soldiers. Hopefully the message can reach an audience where it can do some good. (Rather than just piss off veterans). I don't feel Kaepernick compares favorably with Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. King was a great man. I don't follow American pro football that closely but I trust the others here. Not only is Kaepernick not a great man in the spirit of King, Jr. but it doesn't sound like he's that great of a pro athlete right now! So perhaps his protest is due to his frustrations in his career moreso than he's standing up for social injustice. I believe that might be Kaepernick's motivations, if I had to guess. My hope is that we concentrate the dialogue and our thinking on the issues that matter to us. I'm worried we are more focused on shooting the messager in an attempt to avoid dialog on this issue. But Kaepernick might be setting himself up for some character assassination right now. It's not like pro athletes have the best tact and the best social grooming, for the most part. But with the alleged $12MM compensation, you think he could find some!
  • Dominic77
    •
    8 years ago
    Twenty-five, I agree and sympathize. Unfortunately some people in society lack the tact and grooming necessary to think before acting. I don't know if Kaepernick's upbringing was privileged or not or if he had decent parent(s), extended family, peers, or mentors to instill values like this in him while he was growing up so assume he didn't -- like many black athletes -- but I might be proven wrong. If so, I'll acknowledge that. Regardless I think his lack of fact here I his choice of protest gives some strength to the argument of he social problems affecting some class(es) of people. Some change is needed. Or he's an ignorant thug. I dont know all the facts.
  • mjx01
    •
    8 years ago
    The 1st Amendment give him the right to do that. Extrapolating an attention cry for him BLM position to somehow also being aimed at members of our armed services is pretty unfair IMO. He'll learn his lesson just like Lochte when sponsors realize he's too much of a liability.
  • shailynn
    •
    8 years ago
    Yes he has the right to do that. BUT, to the common person watching football, who likely has a relative that is in law enforcement or in the military, it is seen at utterly disrespectful. Also, since he's getting paid millions and millions of dollars to play a sport, and he does that mediocre at best right now, he's just drawing more displeasure from a lot of people who are NFL fans and who spend a lot of money towards the NFL. I read an article comparing him to other professional athletes who have protested against police brutality but I disagree, what Kaepernick did is borderline stupid, and I think it's more of an attention grab from himself than a protest for something he believes in. After all, since when has he been concerned with someone else? In the past all he has shown is arrogance and selfishness. If you disagree with my assessment of Kaepernick, just look at this article and it will show really what a douche he is, when compared to someone like Russell Wilson who is using his celebrity to do something good, while Kaepernick is using his celebrity to benefit himself. [view link]
  • JimGassagain
    •
    8 years ago
    Kapernick's parents are white. This is a prime example of the hypocritical stances made by the race bating movement over the past few years. Smh as the true civil rights activist are rolling over in their graves watching what the so called "neo-activists" are fighting for; self-promotion.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    Maybe this is an attention grab but at least he's also drawing attetion to race issues which a lot of white people dismiss or don't want to talk about.
  • clubdude
    •
    8 years ago
    The hell with anyone who never served and disrespects the flag.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    ^lol
  • larryfisherman
    •
    8 years ago
    He's just bringing attention to himself. If he hates America so much, he should go live in Iraq and see how he likes it. Racial tensions in this country are not great right now, but there are better ways to stand up for it. Kaepernick needs to worry about if he's going to be the starter for the 49ers. If he get cuts by the 49ers it might be a wrap for him in the NFL.
  • minnow
    •
    8 years ago
    As Daddillac, Sharkhunter, and 25 say. To him and others who think USA suppresses "POC": You are also well within your rights to migrate your sorry ass to places like Nigeria or Uganda (plenty of blacks there), and see how suppression really works.
  • shailynn
    •
    8 years ago
    "Maybe this is an attention grab but at least he's also drawing attetion to race issues which a lot of white people dismiss or don't want to talk about." Chessmaster, I have to disagree with your statement. I feel the only thing people are talking about it his disrespect for America, and the real issue is being tossed aside. I think several NBA and WNBA players made much stronger statements when they wore certain t-shirts during their warm ups. Doing so, they didn't disrespect America which is the message that most people seem to be talking about regarding Kaepernick. I really don't think that was his original intention, but it looks like that's what it has morphed into. America and the flag mean big things to older generations because many of them had to fight for it, losing loved ones which younger people today simply cannot relate to.
  • JamesSD
    •
    8 years ago
    I dont think it's an effective tactic to fix real issues
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    Perfect example of dismissing it. Just take my sorry ass to Nigeria or Uganda or Iraq... Ok.
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    My personal take on this is he is just a jerk, nothing he is doing is going to give me a reason to give a damn about his position on anything. I am not advocating that he leave the country I just ignore him and its as if he never existed. If he really wanted to express an idea, it wouldn't be too hard for a rich professional (any professional, athlete, actor, etc.) to get my attention long enough to be heard and considered, but when you act like a spoiled child I have no desire to listen to what you have to say.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    "feel the only thing people are talking about it his disrespect for America, and the real issue is being tossed aside." Exactly the point I'm making. Its much easier to ignore the actual issue and just villanize Kapernick for daring to disrespect america. Btw, my father served 4 years in the air force. But go ahead and dismiss that because it doesn't mean anything.
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    ^^^^But why should I give a damn about a spoiled brat having a temper tantrum, and what does that have to do with your father's service or mine or my father's or any one else' for that matter?
  • Mate27
    •
    8 years ago
    Jeez Cheesemaster, way to stay on point. Maybe we should start talking about 2 AM lists, too. That would be the equivalency of your twisting tangents spun. I'm sure many people, including me, would thank your father for his service. I digress because I'm on ignore. Lol!
  • jester214
    •
    8 years ago
    Absolutely his right but still classless and really doesn't bring any attention to the issue.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    ^^^"But why should I give a damn about a spoiled brat having a temper tantrum, and what does that have to do with your father's service or mine or my father's or any one else' for that matter?" ^well shit. Everyone is so concerned about the veterans. My family is full of them . I doubt this is the version of America they want to see. My father served to protect the freedoms and liberties that so many take for granted. And to think, this country really doesn't give a damn about that or his life or any other blacks. This has little to do with kapenicks tantrum. The bigger issue is people still ignoring the (alleged) reason behind his tantrum.
  • jester214
    •
    8 years ago
    "The bigger issue is people still ignoring the (alleged) reason behind his tantrum." Which is why it was a bad protest, if you'd like to call it that.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    The truth is, this country does oppress black people(and more than just blacks). I don't stand for the national anthem anymore either.(i haven't for a long time.) why should I?
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    And why isn't there an uproar when the Donald says half the disresptful shit he says about everybody?
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    Sorry chessmaster I don't agree with your premise, many people in this country give a damn about the lives of black folks, you just want them to give you a blank check to say whatever shit you feel at the moment. Myself and many others both White, Black, Hispanic and Asian are dismayed at the number of young ethnic men getting killed during encounters with the police I agree that it is more lopsided towards young black men than others yet how would you fix it, you seem to have a lot to comment on negatively, yet lets see some offer a constructive suggestion, like the Dallas police chief who loudly proclaimed that Dallas was, hiring yet you and many others dismissed that out of hand by calling him a house slave which is totally unfair. Just because his view is not the same as yours ,doesn't make him a house slave or Uncle Tom which is the way that conversation degenerated. I sort of understand your frustration with what is going, on but I don't really know how to fix it other than living my life in a way that I treat every one the same regardless of who they are. I am not one of those that shouts people down because they disagree with me but if you are desiring of my support, don't step all over what I believe to be important. if you or Kaepernick wish to bring attention to an issue there are ways to go about it that don't include just smacking me or others that feel the same way in the face, all that will accomplish is a slap in the face in return and the reality is, I would prefer to see these kinds of events (police killings of minorities or anyone for that matter)disappear from the life of our country.
  • georgmicrodong
    •
    8 years ago
    "Thousands of people fought and died for our freedoms in this country and he is disrespecting everyone who did so." Frankly, unless you're one of those who actually "fought and died", then you have no business speaking for them. Speak for yourself all you want, but you don't get to co-opt the offense of those who can't speak for themselves. As one who *did* serve, albeit not lethally, I am in no way, shape or form disrespected by his stance. I might disagree with it (which I don't, entirely), but his ability to do what he did is one of the very things I served in order to defend.
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    ^^^^Responding to your Donald comment which was posted while I was replying there is an uproar and it ain't just black folks, its decent folks all races, but you wont acknowledge that because it doesn't fit your narrative.
  • flagooner
    •
    8 years ago
    I fully support his right to protest, in fact I served to protect that right. I also have the right to thing he is an ungrateful, attention-seeking little prick.
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    George, I'm only speaking for myself and a few others that I personally know, like I said, he has every right, I have the right to not pay attention.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    "Like the Dallas police chief who loudly proclaimed that Dallas was, hiring yet you and many others dismissed that out of hand by calling him a house slave which is totally unfair. Just because his view is not the same as yours ,doesn't make him a house slave or Uncle Tom which is the way that conversation degenerated." I never commented on that discussion. So I don't know where you got me from saying that. But I'll say it now. He is a house slave or uncle Tom at worst. Terribly confused and misguided at best.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    "Responding to your Donald comment which was posted while I was replying there is an uproar and it ain't just black folks, its decent folks all races, but you wont acknowledge that because it doesn't fit your narrative" Lol what narrative? Tell me, as a veteran, how did you feel about him attacking the parents of that Muslim veteran?
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    Sorry, I thought remembered rightly or wrongly but if you didn't say it then why now ? whatever I'm done with this subject.
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    America has progressed folks. 50 years ago Kapernick would have got his ass kicked
  • shailynn
    •
    8 years ago
    Chessmaster you make some great arguments but let me put it this way. 1. Since you have several members of your family that have served in the military I would think you more than most people on here should be more offended. 2. Kaepernick is a douche, plain and simple, who has two white parents. While he has a right (thanks to people like your family members fighting for that right) to express himself. The problem is most people think he is just grabbing some media attention so they will not take him seriously. Last week he was bragging about how many shoes he owns in Instagram so when someone like that takes a stance on a serious issue, most people will not be able to take him seriously regardless of he is really is concerned with the issue. 3. Personally if he's truly concerned with BLM, maybe he should show a different way to show his protest rather than disrespecting America and the NFL which has made him a multi-millionaire. A lot of things are biased in this country, look how Gabby Douglas was criticized for not putting her hand over her heart at the Olympics in Rio, but some white boys that swim cause trouble and everyone says "oh boys will be boys."
  • san_jose_guy
    •
    8 years ago
    The man is protesting over extremely legitimate issues. I'm glad he's doing it. I'd posted articles about him yesterday, but here are two new ones, connecting him to 1968. I don't care about football and had never even heard this guy's name before. But his protesting really impresses me. Taking great risks with his future career and income. Glad we have people willing to do that. Now lets see how other players and owners line up. [view link] [view link] SJG Alban Berg: Three Pieces for Orchestra [view link]
  • whodey
    •
    8 years ago
    One of the greatest things about this country is that everyone has the right to express themselves. Kinda reminds me of an old Johnny Cash qoute: "I love the freedoms we got in this country, I appreciate your freedom to burn your flag if you want to, but I really appreciate my right to bear arms so I can shoot you if you try to burn mine." - Johnny Cash
  • motorhead
    •
    8 years ago
    He better keep protesting while he has the forum. If you can believe Jay Glazer on Fox, Kaepernick is struggling to make the team. He might not be on the team when the season starts and it has nothing to do with his political statements he has regressed as a QB. To paraphrase - he sucks
  • motorhead
    •
    8 years ago
    SJG; "I don't care about football and had never even heard this guy's name before." I'm a bit surprised. I thought you had a broad knowledge base. You do realize he plays in San Francisco? Do you really live in San Jose? He played in a Super Bowl a few years ago. How did you miss that? You really do live in your mom's basement.
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    ^ ^ Of course he knows. Somehow he thinks he;s impressing us
  • ndnman
    •
    8 years ago
    Most people are simply reacting to the only thing they know about the situation...that he didn't stand for the anthem. His reason for not standing has a lot of merit and most people don't even know about that part. As one of the persons of color he's referring to I have to tip my hat to his actions. On the other hand as a native American that descends from the people who actually won world war 2, the Navajo code talkers, you're welcome....I think he could have chosen a different manner of protest. But that would surely not have garnered such media coverage. Not to worry, this will blow over once there's another story to be told by the media.
  • mjx01
    •
    8 years ago
    what's really going to bake your noodle later is when he's cut from the team, and then he cries and sues for being discriminated against for his political position.
  • DandyDan
    •
    8 years ago
    The real problem is there is absolutely no reason except tradition as to why they play the national anthem at sporting events in the first place. Kaepernick is well within his rights to sit out the national anthem, but sports organizations need to question why they even bother with it in the first place. Just curious at English soccer matches if they begin the whole spectacle with God Save the Queen
  • flagooner
    •
    8 years ago
    It is simply a tradition to some, but an act of respect to others. It is not for me, or anyone else, to assume what significance others attribute to the rite. That is probably why it evokes such emotion on both sides of the issue. In any event, it's a tradition worth preserving in my opinion.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Forget his constitutionally protected rights, this is America. He should obviously be lynched for this. He is just another "thug" who wants handouts, is on welfare, and never worked a day in his life. He has no right to complain, there is absolutely no racism in America anymore. (And of course the most brilliant response I can think of is that he should take his sorry ass back to Africa, because it was colonized centuries ago and stripped of its resources and is now impoverished, so yeah, it makes total sense to send those thugs back to where they were stolen from now that there's nothing left for them there...) That lazy jobless thug. That welfare queen.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    "America has progressed folks. 50 years ago Kapernick would have got his ass kicked" And who would have kicked his ass, mikeya02? Would it have been you?
  • dallas702
    •
    8 years ago
    Kaper kid will get, "his ass kicked" Not for being black (he barely has any connection to blacks in the US since he is over half white, was raised by white parents, attended college on a full scholarship, and now earns millions of dollars a year). Not for exercising his First Amendment rights. (Nobody cares what he has to say.) Not for "exposing" racism in America. He didn't. Not for having an unpopular opinion. (many people have a similar opinion of the degraded status of race relations in this country since Obama began his race "war." Kapernick in going to get his ass kicked because he is a self centered, egotistical jerk, who is more talented at worshiping himself than throwing the football. I won't be doing the ass kicking. I am willing to bet that hundreds of NFL defensive players will be happy to "knock" him down a peg or two. I also expect that a team owner will "reconsider" Kapernick's value to the team in the near future.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    All this talk about Kaepernick getting his ass kicked, there sure are a lot of violent, primitive people on tuscl.
  • dallas702
    •
    8 years ago
    Nina - - YOU are the one I read repeating the "ass kicking line> Are you violent and primitive?
  • ime
    •
    8 years ago
    Free speech doesn't mean free from consequences. Nothing will happen to Kapernick other than washing out of the league.
  • ime
    •
    8 years ago
    To be specific i am not condoning violence against him, but criticism and potentially losing endorsements is fair. Hard to feel bad for a guy who signed a $116M contract who prior to this was known as a bad self centered teammate who acts like a petupant child. Also he made his "statement" during preseason which is not nearly as watched, seems like it would be more powerful to make this kind of protest during an important game or at least during a regular season nationally televised game.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    'Nina - - YOU are the one I read repeating the "ass kicking line> Are you violent and primitive?' I did not repeat anything, I inquired about mikeya02's statement about Kapernick getting his ass kicked. That isn't repitition, it's a reactionary question you mindless idiot.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Furthermore... all you whiny little hypocritical bitches saying he's offending "people who served and died," (so I guess the dead have risen from their graves to tell us this), why the FUCK did people die to protect these rights if no one is allowed to use them? He has no obligation, explicit or otherwise, to stand during the national anthem. None whatsoever.
  • dallas702
    •
    8 years ago
    I guess Nina, that you have just answered my question with an indirect affirmative. Please, chill. I am not attacking. I have no desire to "kick ass," yours, Kapernick's or anyone else. I simply responded to your post where you repeated a "kick ass" comment and asked a question. By the way, I doubt any rational person could possibly ignore the fact that American football IS primitive and violent. Kapernick will get his because he participates in a primitive and violent sport, with other primitive and violent young men who will also choose to express their opinion. Some of Kapernick's opponents will choose to express their First Amendment rights with legal hits on the football field that will leave a certain quarterback on the turf to reconsider his original opinion. Should you choose to apologize for your ill considered works, please consider your apology "pre-accepted.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    "Like the Dallas police chief who loudly proclaimed that Dallas was, hiring yet you and many others dismissed that out of hand by calling him a house slave which is totally unfair." Twentyfive - wrong black guy. It was sheriff clarke of Milwaukee who we called a house slave, not Dallas police chief Brown. Same color skin, yes, but they ARE two totally different people.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Dallas702 you cannot accept my apology because I did not give you one, because I am not sorry, and will never be.
  • jester214
    •
    8 years ago
    You're so classy nina.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Thank you :)
  • jester214
    •
    8 years ago
    "because it was colonized centuries ago and stripped of its resources" Exactly! Except... for ya know... Diamonds, Gold, other precious metals, Iron Ore, Oil, Timber.... Aside from that though!
  • rockstar666
    •
    8 years ago
    I don't think using his employer's forum as a platform for protest is appropriate. He's paid a lot to play football, not to symbolically air his grievances on their dime.
  • Dominic77
    •
    8 years ago
    ^and Uranium (yellowcake).
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    but sports organizations need to question why they even bother with it in the first place. This.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    "All this talk about Kaepernick getting his ass kicked, there sure are a lot of violent, primitive people on tuscl" Its probably one of those alt right things.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Thanks jester for that good point; Africa is rich in resources. If it weren't for colonization, leading to the destablization of Africa's nation's politics, the continent would be thriving right now. Instead, it is filled with corruption and exploited by colonialism and large corporations. Colonization destroyed Africa.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    "He's paid a lot to play football, not to symbolically air his grievances on their dime." Is there anything in his contract that obligates him to stand during the national anthem? Just curious.
  • rockstar666
    •
    8 years ago
    He has every right to sit (unless it falls under his conduct clause, which is a stretch IMO)...but if I were the team owner, I'd be pissed one of my employees is using the platform I gave him to make my company look bad.
  • jester214
    •
    8 years ago
    Actually it was decolonization that fucked up Africa.
  • minnow
    •
    8 years ago
    YO, LONDONGUY!!! Did I get your attention through all this chaff ? Or through the fine tea, or stout ale that your nostrils sprayed on the computer screen reading all this ? My question for you: How kindly would British public take to someone dissing the royal family at a public event ? I'm guessing that you're regarding an American sitting during the national anthem as an act akin to a Brit dissing the royal family.
  • larryfisherman
    •
    8 years ago
    DandyDan makes a great point. Just to clarify, my problem with Kap is that instead of bringing awareness to the issue, in reality it's just bringing attention to himself. He made it about him instead of the real issues. There are better more efficient ways to protest.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    The guy who wrote the damn star spangled banner owned slaves, there was a verse that talked about killing slaves. God forbid an American, with rights that soldiers FOUGHT TO GUARANTEE TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, exercise those rights and not fucking stand up. The backlash he's getting from these racist little bitches is proving he had a valid reason to do it in the first place.
  • rockstar666
    •
    8 years ago
    My opinion wasn't racist at all. It more stemmed from good manners in a business relationship.
  • san_jose_guy
    •
    8 years ago
    "The backlash he's getting from these racist little bitches is proving he had a valid reason to do it in the first place." I agree with this. Thank you White Male Tuscl members for letting people see how serious the problem is. And motorhead: I really don't care about football and would very rarely know the names of any players. Lots of things more interesting than pro sports. First heard of this guy in connection with this national anthem issue. So are you the one who sits in your mom's basement, where you can watch sports? I have things to do which involve ordinary people being within normal speaking distance. SJG
  • larryfisherman
    •
    8 years ago
    ^^^Lol
  • san_jose_guy
    •
    8 years ago
    I actually posted about this guy refusing to stand before anyone else did, because I was looking at local news. But that was definitely the first time I heard his name. I am impressed with this man too. First time I can remember that an NFL player has impressed me. But I still wish they would run football out of that stadium. We don't need more drunks on the roads and we don't need more head and neck injuries either. Just let it be reserved for my Christian eating lions. They do a tremendous societal good. SJG
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    But Nina baby. America has progressed. Japs and blacks used to get beat up. Gays got beat up .Flag burners got beat up. Mouthy wives got slapped all the time. Things aren;t perfect, but much better now. I was just a little kid, btw
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Mikeya02, 49 gays were just mass murdered at a night club last June. You're stupid as shit, dude.
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    ^^^^zero comprehension
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Bitch.
  • flagooner
    •
    8 years ago
    He should stand for the FLAGooner.
  • Mate27
    •
    8 years ago
    Holy shit you can tell who has been indoctrinated on their way to try and become the "Al Sharpton" of TUSCL! Misplaced anger is no substitution for political correctness. What's wrong is rong. Angry much? Oh, and I love the SJG pile on to this topic, because it shows what company you're with when he agrees with you.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Meat72 please enlighten me on what is wrong, with ya old ass. Is sitting down during the star spangled banner "wrong"? If so, explain. Unless you are talking about the backlash he got from all the racists. Racism is wrong, so if that's what you're getting at, you're right!
  • motorhead
    •
    8 years ago
    SJG you don't have to be a sports fan to know who he is if you're from San Jose. How far is San Francisco from San Jose? 30 miles? When he played quarterback in the Super Bowl a few years, I would bet if you never heard his name in the Bay Area, one must be living under a rock.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    ^and since then nobody heard his name until now!!
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    Meanwhile 10 killed, 57 wounded in Chicago this past weekend. Not by cops, not by racists
  • motorhead
    •
    8 years ago
    Is the Chicago Police Superintendent Eddie Johnson another house slave? Afterall, he did say "enough is enough"
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    "Meanwhile 10 killed, 57 wounded in Chicago this past weekend. Not by cops, not by racists" You and motorhead(and more, I'm not going to mention all of them. You know who you are.) are fucking idiots. Do you not think given the opportunity, that these criminals would kill a cop or a racist or anybody else? That's a rhetorical question. Furthermore, just because another black man would kill me, why is it ok for the police to kill me??? The criminals committing black on black crime are criminals. What is so hard to understand about that? THE POLICE HAVE A JOB TO PROTECT AND SERVE ME FROM THESE CRIMINALS THE SAME AS THEY DO FOR YOU AND MOTORHEAD AND EVERYONE ELSE. THEIR JOB IS NOT TO KILL ME AT THEIR DISCRETION!
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Chessmaster, most of the racists here are miserable old geezers. Throughout their very long lifespans they have seen racism and either turned their heads or added more fuel to the fire by being blatantly racist themselves. And it doesn't matter what evidentiary support you show them, doesn't matter what scholastic studies you cite; they simply cannot and will not understand. There is something possibly chemically wrong with their brains that prohibits them from seeing things any other way. It's a sickness. For example, they won't care that the star spangled banner was written by Francis Scott Key who was an aristocrat, pro-slavery, anti-abolitionist prosecution attorney and that blacks (and anyone else for that matter) shouldn't be condemned for not standing during the song he wrote; these same racists will not care that there is another verse to the song that talks about slaves dying. The normal person, regardless of race, would understand. These racists are just dumb bags of bones with neurological systems that do not work correctly.
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
    ^thanks for that history lesson. :) I never knew that(in part because I don't care about the star spangled banner or national anthem or anything else "patriotic"). Of course they never mentioned that in history class.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    At one of the predominantly white schools I attended when I was a kid, we learned all about the Native Americans, who were portrayed as having blonde hair and blue eyes and living harmoniously with the Europeans. Lol, "history."
  • chessmaster
    •
    8 years ago
  • rockstar666
    •
    8 years ago
    Meat: I know we butt heads a lot but you are a bit disappointing in this thread. While I agree the overall tenner of race relations has improved in the long run, the advent of everyone having a movie camera in their pocket has shown all to graphically how far we still have to go, specially in law enforcement who seems to be rife with Donald Trump supporters. Nina: The fact FSK wasn't god's gift to political enlightenment, neither was Ted Nugent who is almost as stupid as Trump ('almost' because he neglected to run for President). But I still like his tunes. The Star Spangled Banner's 1st verse is wonderful poetry, that plays on the emotional range from despair to an emotional catharses. The fact it's a British drinking song and written by someone with questionable 21st century morals doesn't bother me.
  • seaboardrr
    •
    8 years ago
    He has every right and FREEDOM to be as big a douche bag as he wants. I don't believe in organized religion and don't go to church but if I'm at a public or private event or in a church for some reason and there's a moment for any sort of prayer i stand at ease and bow my head. Not because I'm praying but because I'm respecting the right of others to do so without disrespecting their beliefs. There are many other ways he could help bring attention to certain issues without making a spectacle of himself on national television which is really all he did.
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    Rockstar666 - I'm not arguing that. I'm simply pointing out that since the song has an ugly racist history attached, why should it be so frowned upon for somone to choose not to honor it? I can completely understand why someone would not want to stand - and they don't have to. On the other hand, I understand why many people DO want to stand, and that's fine too. I'm not gonna be bitchy-barbie to someone who doesn't want to stand, because I completely get the reasoning behind it.
  • rockstar666
    •
    8 years ago
    Nina: I'm not willing to sacrifice true art for political correctness...there would be nothing left. What if Shakespeare were a child molester or Jesus were gay? No 32 year old Jewish man would be unmarried at that time unless he were gay. If I were a Christian, should I then disregard his place in the Bible?
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    But Nina sweetie, you're complaining about words that aren't in our national anthem. America has progressed and you complain like it hasn't
  • NinaBambina
    •
    8 years ago
    "Nina: I'm not willing to sacrifice true art for political correctness..." No one is asking you to. In fact, the hypocrisy in what you're saying (and I doubt it is purposeful because you do not strike me as a small minded individual), is that standing up for the anthem IS what is "politically correct," while refusing to stand for it is the opposite. I'm not saying the anthem should be abolished altogether, I am asking you why, given its history as well as current race relations, don't you understand why some people wouldn't want to stand? I would say critisizing someone for not standing is just as un-American as the act of not standing. "What if Shakespeare were a child molester or Jesus were gay? No 32 year old Jewish man would be unmarried at that time unless he were gay. If I were a Christian, should I then disregard his place in the Bible?" If Jesus were gay, the platform Christianity would be completely different. But Jesus, as far as we know, was not gay. If he were gay, bible-thumpers would hate him and would worship someone else as the "son of god," so that's a weak argument. If Shakespeare were a child molester? Again, everyone should have the right to choose whether or not the read his works, not be bashed for choosing not to do so. Alfred Hitchcock ruined Tippi Hedren's career for not sleeping with him. I still own about 5 of his films and love him as a director. Roman Polansky actually DID commit statutory rape, I love Rosemary's Baby and also own Chinatown. I loved "And then there were None" by Agatha Christie, although the original title was "Ten Little Niggers." I am wondering if you see my point yet? Not everyone should have to face shame just because they don't stand up for a song they don't believe in.
  • larryfisherman
    •
    8 years ago
    Chess- stop going back and forth with them bro. They have their views and their views will stay the same. They can't look at it objectively. My thing with Kapernick is he has the right not to stand up, but I personally don't think his stance has any impact in trying to make change. We'll see though, it looks some NFL players are gonna start doing that too.
  • rockstar666
    •
    8 years ago
    Nina, going back to the original subject which is not standing for the national anthem: I only had a problem with him doing it on the job. We show respect for our country by honoring our national anthem and if I'm paying a guy millions of dollars I want him to stand. If he wants to sit at a Cubs game I'm fine; in fact if lots of people sit and start a movement I might applaud it. In fact, it could become the PC thing to do if Trump is elected. But for now, I take issue with him sitting when he's on the payroll.
  • larryfisherman
    •
    8 years ago
    Black on black violence is the number one issue in the black communities today. Sometimes we forgot about that issue when we talk about police brutality. We need to stop killing ourselves. But Chess is right, that has nothing to do with the police brutality. Just because we're killing ourselves, that doesn't give the police a pass to kill us. The police's job is to PROTECT AND SERVE.
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    But they do Larry, it's not in the news. The rogue cop assholes are. Where does it end? An innocent black gets killed in one spot so five innocent cops get killed in another? Innocents lose their property in riots? We can weed out the bad cops, I'm sure.
  • rockstar666
    •
    8 years ago
    Mikey: In Chicago, it's not just a few "rogue cops". It's the entire department, which is why Rahm fired the superintendent and a few others. The power of the press reporting the pervasive racism finally made the corrupt government accountable. Yes, lots of cops do good things, but let's not pretend there's not a problem in Chicago, Baltimore, DC....many other cities.
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    Sure Rockstar, but's who's doing the shootings? In Chicago
  • larryfisherman
    •
    8 years ago
    mikeya I agree in general that the cops do their job. It's just a few idiot cops that ruin in for everybody. The problem is that these idiots cops are getting off with paid leave and MAYBE getting fired. Those crook cops need to be in prison for murder.
  • mikeya02
    •
    8 years ago
    Yeah, some obviously do. And others aren;t crooked but they freak out. Gotta get them out. I still don't see that BLM has helped one bit Hands up don't shoot was bullshit
  • motorhead
    •
    8 years ago
    Nina, it's ironic you like to accuse otherrs of racism when one looks at your past posts. Your comments a few weeks ago about Milwaukee County Sheriff David Clarke was blatant racism. It is clear that you feel that a black person does not have the right to think for himself and express his ideas. No matter how you parse it, that's racism.
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    The idea of what this country is supposed to represent is what you respect and stand for. The folks that just want to tear shit down they are doing that anyway so why should I pay any attention to them ? In my copy of the constitution the preamble states in order to form a more perfect union, implies that our founders knew that it wasn't perfect and intended to keep at it. That is an idea worthy of respect.
  • Mate27
    •
    8 years ago
    The Al Sharpton's of TUSCL won't be happy unless the British proletariat from the 1600's and 1700's, along with their descendants, are brought to trial and convicted for any civil rights crimes they committed under current law. Oh, and then totally dismiss the fact that times were different, and current citizens have reaped all of the conveniences brought on from their progressive education and technology. You, and the Kaepernick followers are simply ungrateful for the true historical activists, which many are white. You just choose to not see it that way. Rather play the victim card, because it's easier to complain about what you don't have instead of realizing the great things you do have, which is equal opportunity.
  • dallas702
    •
    8 years ago
    Nina has gone ballistic in this string of comments and, along with a few others, made some pretty outrageous claims. Among those assertions, she said that the author of the poem that became the lyrics of our National Anthem, Francis Scott Key, was, "an aristocrat, pro-slavery, anti-abolitionist prosecution attorney." She also asserts that, " there is another verse to the song that talks about slaves dying" and claims that, "the song has an ugly racist history attached." I am one of those people that Nina has lumps into her category, "miserable old geezers" since I am Anglo, over 60 and disagree with some of her rants. She labels all "miserable old geezers" as racist. Nina doesn't know that I was sitting at a Walgreens soda counter just over 45 years ago with friends when we were dragged out and beaten (my friends because they were black - me because I kept getting in the way.). In my life I have served this nation in uniform, and in civilian clothes, I have stood in the line against racism, I have seen real racism and I know how much it hurts PHYSICALLY to be beaten by racists.. Nina apparently doesn't care what my views are, or what I have done in my life She chooses to call me racist because I hold different opinions from her and I am an Anglo male over a certain age. (Can she spell, "prejudiced"?) Like her opinion of me, her assertions about the author and content of the National Anthem are also skewed and fail to meet factual reality. from Wickapedia (edited for brevity) (I know "W" is a poor resource but this is accurate): "Francis Scott Key purchased his first slave in 1800 or 1801. Mostly in the 1830s, Key manumitted (set free) seven slaves, one of whom (Clem Johnson) continued to work for him for wages as his farm's foreman. Key throughout his career also represented several slaves seeking their freedom in court (for free). Key, Judge William Leigh of Halifax and bishop William Meade were administrators of the will of their friend John Randolph of Roanoke, who died without children and left a will directing his executors to free his more than four hundred slaves. Over the next decade, beginning in 1833, the administrators fought to enforce the will and provide the freed slaves land to support themselves. Key was considered a decent master, and publicly criticized slavery's cruelties, so much that after his death a newspaper editorial stated "So actively hostile was he to the peculiar institution that he was called 'The Nigger Lawyer' .... because he often volunteered to defend the downtrodden sons and daughters of Africa. Mr. Key convinced me that slavery was wrong--radically wrong." " The complete lyrics of Key's poem are: "O say can you see, by the dawn’s early light, What so proudly we hail’d at the twilight’s last gleaming, Whose broad stripes and bright stars through the perilous fight O’er the ramparts we watch’d were so gallantly streaming? And the rocket’s red glare, the bombs bursting in air, Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there, O say does that star-spangled banner yet wave O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave? On the shore dimly seen through the mists of the deep Where the foe’s haughty host in dread silence reposes, What is that which the breeze, o’er the towering steep, As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses? Now it catches the gleam of the morning’s first beam, In full glory reflected now shines in the stream, ’Tis the star-spangled banner - O long may it wave O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave! And where is that band who so vauntingly swore, That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion A home and a Country should leave us no more? Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution. No refuge could save the hireling and slave From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave, And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave. O thus be it ever when freemen shall stand Between their lov’d home and the war’s desolation! Blest with vict’ry and peace may the heav’n rescued land Praise the power that hath made and preserv’d us a nation! Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just, And this be our motto - “In God is our trust,” And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave." Just as other of Nina's arguments depend upon half truth's (i.e. - I really am Anglo and over 60) to made multiple incorrect assertions (I am not "miserable" nor "racist" and there is nothing "chemically wrong" with my brain. In his times, Francis Scott Key was actually one of the most successful opponents of the institution of slavery and his life's work clearly showed both empathy for the condition of slavery and zeal in attempts to correct it's wrongness. No informed American of Black African heritage could possibly object to the man, Francis Scott Key, based on his efforts, actions or accomplishments. Nor , could any reasonable person find fault in his poem. In the poem, Key describes the horror of war as, "No refuge could save the hireling and slave From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave." These two lines do NOT describe, "slaves dying" and no reasonable reader could miss the contextual connection that Key makes between the "foul footstep's pollution" (British troops) and the "hireling and slave." (Nina - he is writing about the invading British troops!) I am not bothered that a poster on this site should call me names. I am not even particularly irate that a poster chooses to interpret "free speech" as speech approved by the poster, "politically correct," and without consequences for the speaker. It does bother me to read ugly distortions of our national history used to justify idiotic self centered misbehavior. Kaepernick is a self centered child of privilege who has no concept of racism, and is a total fool. He has a God given right (protected - not granted - by the first Amendment) to freely express his opinion, no matter how wrong headed. And the rest of us (including the SF 49er's owner) have the right to express our opinion. My opinion is that the little shit should be played in a few games, to let other team's defensive line show how they feel, then fired (cut) for being an idiot.
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    I agree with you Dallas the problem we have here is that some of the posters here not even out of their twenties and thirties, think that history wasn't written before they read some of the revisions. Its popular to jump all over us old racist geezers, they have no idea what we lived through, they don't have enough experience to judge us, yet they insist that they know everything. Colin Kaepernick definitely fits into that category spoiled entitled brat and know-it-all.
  • Mate27
    •
    8 years ago
    Dallas for the score! And 25 with the assist! Surely you can tell which people are simply pushing an agenda and spinning a narrative of "progressive" fallacies. If you want progress, stand up for yourself and improve you're lot instead of dwelling on others with your hate filled gossip. And be a little grateful for once, especially for those fore fathers who paved the way to freedom and excellence that we all share together.
  • jester214
    •
    8 years ago
    I strongly suspect Francis Scott Key was neither a saint nor a devil. He was a byproduct of his times
  • twentyfive
    •
    8 years ago
    Jester my very point.
  • Dominic77
    •
    8 years ago
    ^that fits with some of what I've been reading in books on success is that selfishness is a virtue whereas average people think selfishness is a vice. Thanks. Also overt selfishness is better than covert selfishness. Tusclers are cool. Lots of successful dudes here.
  • TheeOSU
    •
    8 years ago
    "Dallas for the score! And 25 with the assist! Surely you can tell which people are simply pushing an agenda and spinning a narrative of "progressive" fallacies. If you want progress, stand up for yourself and improve you're lot instead of dwelling on others with your hate filled gossip. And be a little grateful for once, especially for those fore fathers who paved the way to freedom and excellence that we all share together." And Meat with another assist! There's so much written here it would take forever to address every comment and I don't have the time or desire to do so. I'll just ad that I'll bet none of the old white guys here never owned any slaves and you whiners were never enslaved, lived in chains, or were forced to pick cotton all day in the hot sun so quit whining about being held down! The only thing holding you down is your attitude and expectations that because of what happened in past history you should be revered, put on a pedestal, and given a free pass on everything! If you put as much effort in improving your lives as you do complaining the fact is you would have much less to complain about, but then again complaining is much easier than actual effort.
  • san_jose_guy
    •
    8 years ago
    motorhead wrote, "you don't have to be a sports fan to know who he is ..." San Jose is 50 miles from San Francisco, and now it is right next to the Santa Clara Stadium, where my Christian Eating Lions made their debut. Many of us wish that stadium had never been built. Online is an unusual thing, it brings people together and gets them talking, when face to face they would probably not talk. Face to face there are clues about people, so one can see that it would not be constructive to talk with them. I talk to people all day long, countless numbers of people. But almost none of those conversations deal with professional sports. It really is not something I care about. The only exception is when there is some connection to politics. And that is why I posted about this national anthem issue, before Londonguy did, and before it was being raised to a level of controversy, because it has political meaning, it is a continuation of the 1968 Mexico City Olympics. We have a statue of that at San Jose State. [view link] Otherwise, I have very very few conversations about sports, or about any other kind of consumer recreations. The people I talk with are not concerned about such things, nor am I. SJG
  • 4got2wipe
    •
    8 years ago
    I probably shouldn't wade into yet another political thread but I will throw caution to the wind and do so. Another thread (and I can't remember who started it) asked "what's wrong with America?" I'd say the inability of people to see that those with whom they disagree might have a point and be at least partially correct. I don't want to belabor that point, but many political threads suffer from the inability to admit that some things are complicated.
  • gammanu95
    •
    8 years ago
    How incredibly ironic that he hates the national anthem of the nation which is one of the few to rant him the right to disrespect said national anthem. A nation in which he, an ignorant biracial orphan, was adopted by white parents and raised as their own. A nation where people are so prosperous they can focus on trivial sports entertainment careers, instead of worrying about secret police, party komissars, kidnappings, beheadings, etc. Where he gets $19M per year for playing a GAME. Yeah, and he says fuck that country. However, we should acknowledge that he is adding more fuel to the BLM fire. His actions have been noticed. But, he also supports Castro, so he should take his ignorant fucking ass to Cuba. See what happens when he sits through their national anthem.
  • sharkhunter
    •
    8 years ago
    So I guess the nfl player is black and was protesting something affecting him. I really didn't know for sure. I just picture disrespecting the pledge of allegiance right up there with past Iranian hostage taking of Americans and foreigners disrespecting our country by carrying trash using the American flag, I didn't care if the guy was white, black, Muslim or Christian or whatever he was protesting. He could have been protesting not getting a salary increase and it wouldn't change my opinion of the way I heard about his protest. Disrespect for our country in my opinion. I assume the guy is black even though I read he has white parents or I doubt I would have heard all the comments about racism. Should have waited until a white or Asian nfl player protested I guess to avoid that accusation and then I would have to check to see what he was protesting as well. I can't even remember the guys name even though I read it on here. That's what happens when everyone starts assuming. They make an ass out of you and me. Famous Benny Hill quote.
  • sharkhunter
    •
    8 years ago
    To avoid possible racism charges, I guess I need to stop posting opinions about people without checking to see what race they are first and checking to see what they are protesting. If there was a delete feature here, I would just delete my previous posts because it offended people posting comments when I knew hardly anything about the guy and was just upset about disrespecting our country. It does get me upset when I saw pictures of foreigners carrying garbage with US flags in an obvious attempt to disrespect every American. That's the way I view this type of protest. Disrespect for every American. More so if you served this country in any service or work. No disrespect intended for any American.
  • sharkhunter
    •
    8 years ago
    In my personal opinion, he also disrespected some of my relatives who died fighting for this country, not just me, but I did feel like he was dissing or disrespecting every American. I guess the younger generation and possibly others feel different. I know we have rights to disrespect people but there are consequences for doing so. Oh well, I said enough of my opinions.
  • san_jose_guy
    •
    8 years ago
    "My country wrong or right" Is this what you are saying. That is never good. SJG
You must be a member to leave a comment.Join Now
Got something to say?
Start your own discussion