What the hell to make of tonight? [long-ish]

Strip clubs are bizarro world – up is down and down is up.

Most of us grow up believing we should give people the benefit of the doubt and to trust them unless they give us a reason not to. Well in stripper bizarro world; it is safer to do the opposite – don’t trust them or expect anything from them unless they prove o/w.

With most strippers; if you meet them OTC; you can usually expect 2 things:

1. she is an unreliable whack job
2. she is a ROB that only wants you as an ATM

Many strippers are as adept to the 2 items above as a professional jewel thieve is at stealing – and you may not even see it coming.

Seeing a stripper OTC should only be about business – you give her X amount for her do Y for Z time – and believe me – when it comes to dealing with strippers; for 99% of them it’s all business no matter what they say or how they act.

I would say proceed w/ caution if you really want to “see her” OTC and not want to just b/c she gave you her # (there is a difference w/ the latter not being worth it).

My opinions are not facts; but they seem to correlate to the experiences of many when dealing with strippers OTC.

BTW – if you are unfamiliar with the acronyms used on the board; refer to the Glossary link at the bottom of the TUSCL page.

That's the thing that gets me. She didn't really seem to want money and (seemed) surprised as hell when I just handed her the $20 near the end of the night.

And, really, we haven't even mentioned meeting outside. The only thing we talked about was me getting back to the club to see her again. (And since she usually works at the same time I'm at my job, that'd be difficult.) I wouldn't exactly be opposed to meeting her somewhere else, but I'm not going to be the one suggesting it.

Take her to dinner, just like a real date. You can discover a lot about her.

Particularly if you don't go to strip clubs a lot, the thing you should always assume is: no matter how much smarter you think you are than her, she's better at seducing men and making it seem genuine, than you are at detecting any game she's playing. If you don't assume that, you're only asking for trouble. Rather than try to explain why she behaved the way she did in the club (though I"ll add I've gotten similar treatment a number of times), look at the outcome: you probably are very excited, thinking about her a lot, and plotting out when you'll return -- and when you do return, there will be only one girl on your mind.

For myself, I consider it all stripper-client games (it might be favorite client, but still client) unless she meets me outside the club, without charging me.

"She's just trying to get money out of me, right?"

YES Sir!!! Don't fool yourself. Be careful & try to think with the upper brain.

Dan! She is a lioness. What she did is charge the herd to separate the old,infirm and weak.She toyed with you to show the rest of the pride her power.It's just a matter of time before she thrusts her fangs into your neck. Sleep on it.

This is not unusual. The dancer has your phone number and got you to text her. She's establishing a relationship, which is what good sales people do. She will now text you to ask you to come see her ITC or OTC. You have to decide if she has what you want and if you are willing to pay the price for it. Of course, she wants your money. You have to decide if you want to part with that money.

It's not impossible that she likes you for yourself, not your money. You can test this by texting her that you would like to see her but you're out of cash until the end of the month. She will probably tell you to come see her November 1.

Not much difference in your story and how I met my ATF. It happens, but RARELY!

Jack and Dain have given pretty good advice already. All I can add is to be up for adventure. Are you a man or a mouse? I know that lots of dudes wouldn't let a dancer doing OTC sleep overnight but I've woke up without my throat slit and all my personal information intact. You must ask yourself this, Captain Dan-Are you a Captain in name only and a swabbie at heart or are you the Captain of your vessel? Are you ready to sail the seven seas or are you happy sailing around Newport Harbor where it's safe? I am by nature a risk taker so I'd see what old girl is all about.

We like to try to figure out whether dancers like us for who we are or for our money, and tend to think of these as two mutually exclusive categories. I believe that for the girls it's more of a spectrum.

Step back a minute and try to take the emotion out of it. Here's an example. I have a mechanic who works on my car. He's also an old friend. We drink together and go to each other's parties. But he also works on my car, and I wouldn't dream of asking him to fix my brakes for free. Dancers are kind of like this. They may genuinely like you and enjoy your company, they might even give you the occasional freebie, but you shouldn't assume they're going to give you any service for free.

Keep that in mind, and also take Slick's advice to heart. She's human too, treat her like a person, but be the captain of your ship, take control of the situation and chart the course.

Ermita, you really brought some insight. Great comment about the mechanic.

There's a good chance she's just setting you up.

"Can't make it to see me because you have work at the same time? Why don't we get together at my place, your place, hotel, etc?" Perhaps that will be fun and worthwhile if you're interested, time will tell.

I had a similar experience when I first started the hobby. Young and beautiful but her life was a complete train wreck. I immediately slipped into white knight mode and spent a lot of cash trying to help her.

She was sweet and I had a good times her but the friendship vs p4p vagueness muddied things.

No thanks. I'll keep my leverage and stick to the provider/client p4p relationship.

You all give very good advice. Obviously, since she wants me to go see her back in the club, she wants more money out of me. In terms of OTC, that hasn't even been brought up. But everyone here seems to assume it's heading that way, so we'll see what happens, I guess.

How sweet...she is in LOVE with you. Now you have a story to tell your kids about how you met their mother.

"Now you have a story to tell your kids about how you met their mother."

Not unless I have a friend named Barney. lol

I have several dancer friends that do similar things to me. I am not even getting dances from them every time I go. We just sit and talk random topics between her stages. we are cool if I get dances from others and she works with customers. That being said, I've also met many dancers that quickly become greedy after a few visits. And I never met dancers that are genuinely "in love" with me.

Bottom line is that it's quite possible that dancers may like us as a friend -- everyone likes friendship after all. But very rarely will they have affectionate feelings to us. Any experienced dancers would avoid that from happening. And even if they do, I don't think it could even end well.

Just to counterbalance a touch, it happens that dancers and customers sometimes date, or become friends with benefits rather than stripper-customer. Not very often, but it happens. Most strippers have stories about dating a customer at least once (though many finish that story by rolling their eyes and saying "never again"). That said, to reemphasize everything said above, there's nothing in your story that indicates any of that. Your girl is just running a game that some girls do, and again, the result is exactly what she wants -- you're excited, you're thinking about her, you'll be back, and you're probably spending more money next time. Again, for me, unless we're seeing each other outside the club for free, the relationship is stripper-customer, period.

BTW, in the game she's running, some other common patterns: she asks you to meet OTC, which gets you even more excited about her, but when that day arrives, she texts you to tell you she got scheduled at the club and can't get out of it, so meet her there instead.

IMO, she's playing the long con, and she thinks you are an easy mark.

Mjx said the exact words I was thinking of. This is the long con. Now she may really be setting you up for future rip off or her intentions may be milder. But very good chance she's cultivating.

I would expect some friendly banter and then if A. "Hey it's slow tonight, want to come by the club?" B. A sob story and request for cash.

"How sweet...she is in LOVE with you. Now you have a story to tell your kids about how you met their mother."

Couldn't keep it "real" heh? Too bad.

What is really you're question here Cappy? Yes strippers often pretend to like custies more than they really do to get more money out of them. But yes strippers occasionally date and even marry custies. You probably won't become her boyfriend, but only a small percentage of flirting and coming on leads to a steady relationship. Yes, the odds are less of having a good, steady relationship with a stripper. But it's not impossible.

@Papi +1 "My opinions are not facts; but they seem to correlate to the experiences of many."

Something for all of us to remember - our opinions are not facts even when based on our [or others] experiences.

CaptDan - lots of good advice above.

Also ask YOURSELF: [1] How lonely/needy am I for an emotionally/sexually intimate relationship right now?,

AND [2] Ideally, what do I want from this relationship?,

AND [3] Remember Ronald Reagan's dictum "Trust but verify"

Good luck

Joker, I think Reagan actually got that from the Russians.

Per what others dancers have stated here on TUSCL and on SW:

“strippers don’t do anything for free”

Joker and Papi like Stockton to Malone. Y'all sunk the rock.

If a woman is genuinely interested in a guy; she will not take a guy’s ph and dial her # w/ it so she and the PL can both have each other’s #s.

This just sounds like a dancer trying to cultivate a regular.

I’ve heard more than one dancer say that they would not date (in the genuine sense) a guy that goes to SCs. I don’t think dancers view men that go to SCs very highly – I think many of them view the PLs as losers or pervs and very very rarely as genuine dating material.

As others have said – it comes down to $$$ - if she will want to hook up w/ you w/o $$$ being involved; if she doesn’t tell you academy award winning stories of woe to hit you up for $$$/”loans”; and if she doesn’t call/text you out of the blue in a sexy voice telling you she wants to see you and to swing by the club; if she doesn’t do any of this – then she “may” genuinely like you – but IMO I doubt it.

If you are really interested in her – then just roll with it and either spend $$$ for services you want or test her intentions by not giving her any $$$.

I've recently had my preconceptions turned upside down, so don't take anything I say to heart.

She might like you. She might have just seen someone different enough that you interest her outside of the customer zone. Don't count on it.

This happens more frequently than you think. Id bet that every member here has had it happen at least twice. The easiest way to find out and text her. Ask her to go out, shell agree and then come up with an excuse the day of why she cant. Play it off and dont do anything. Shell probably text you the following week or when its slow. Offer to take her out again, shell get the hint she shouldnt bother you . At least thats my experience. Its like 1 out of 20 that is legit and hang on for the craziest drama roller coaster ever. Shell tell you what an asshole her boyfriend is while youre fucking...i need a new life lol

next time put teh TL;DR at the beginning!

It is certainly more likely that she is playing you but not necessarily. I had a stripper that I had a bit of a relationship with but it ended because I always thought she was trying to play me. Fast forward a few years and I am talking to a stripper that worked with her and she said that the girl I saw for a while really did have feelings for me and would talk about me all the time. She thought she could never get me to see her as anything other than a stripper and that was true. Sad thing, is I really liked her and miss her. You never know.

I don't know if anyone cares, but just as an update:

I went back to see the girl yesterday. She was talking about how she had hardly any money and went auditioning at a club in Philly, but got there too late and missed the auditions. I was half expecting her to hit me up for some cash then, but she didn't.

Today, however, I'm texting with her. I mention I'm going back to the club tonight around 7pm to see this other girl I like. She texts back that she got an "emergency" shift tonight (yesterday she told me she wasn't working today) because she's moving soon and has to make a down payment tomorrow on her new place.

Then she tells me she lives in Trenton. For those who don't know New Jersey, Trenton is a hell hole. It's always been bad, but it's gotten a lot worse in the past 5-6 years. It's not too much better than Detroit at this point. Does she really live in Trenton? I don't know. Her cell phone is the right area code for Trenton, so maybe.

So yeah, I'm thinking a hit up for money is coming tonight. I usually give her $20 for spending time with me (as she normally spends about two hours with me), so we'll see if she asks for something beyond that.

But yes, considering I got nothing but sob stories out of her yesterday, I feel like you're all correct and she's setting me up for a "loan."

Dan, I don't see anything in your account to suggest she wants to be an IRL GF, so keep in mind this is a business relationship. She'll probably run to your side next time you walk into the club. You may get improved mileage as time goes by. Just keep one word in mind: BUSINESS. That's what she's there for. Unless you start getting lots of unpaid benefits, don't even think GF.

You have to trust your own instincts. Would it be age appropriate for you two to date? If so, maybe there is something there. Many on here dated a stripper, and it can be fun, but there are many more warning stories than happy endings. Be careful, and always keep the fact hat you may be being played in the background.

Dating a stripper leads to shrapnel wounds....explosions abound. But its a hell of a ride till the timer hits zero.

“… You have to trust your own instincts …”

In a perfect world yes – but I’ve come to find out my dick has very poor instincts and reasoning capabilities.

I've only ever dated one guy I met in the club. But, I've seen strippers start legit relationships with customers. It's pretty easy to tell if a stripper is actually into you. This is how:

She doesn't take your money. Yes, she will allow you to buy her dinner, pay for drinks, etc. But, she will not hustle you. When strippers find a customer they are genuinely interested in, we get stressed out about making sure the guy knows we are for real. This can be tough because they've already met us as our fake, money grubbing, evil selves. So, we generally make a BIG effort to show that we are normal girls that can be trusted, when we like someone for real.

When I met the guy from the club that I dated, he came in a few times b4 we actually went out. When he came in, he did ask for dances. I was happy to do them, but refused to let him pay. And I sat with him for most of those nights, just chatting and refusing to be tipped. He'd always offer and I'd take his money and stick it right back in his pocket. Sounds crazy, I know. I made no money on those nights, at all. But I was able to send him the message that I was honest about wanting to get to know him.

Yes, there are crazy girls who don't know if they are coming or going that will give mixed signals. And there are girls who may hold some level of respect/attraction for you in the context of a business relationship (like the mechanic example above). But, if a girl really likes you, she will do whatever she can to prove to that she is interested in you as a human, not an ATM. She will not ask you for money. After you've started hooking up, she will continue to never ask you for $. The last thing she wants is for the guy she adores to think she's a whore.

Also, as states by everyone else, this almost never happens. 99.9999% of the time girls are just trying to catch a new customer with whatever silly tactics we can imagine.

This is true. Interestingly enough, she just recently (as in yesterday) said she thinks I'm spending too much in the club and should stop. I say to her, "You realize you just cost yourself about $80 from me every time I go in, right?" (I usually tip her anywhere between $20 and $50 when she sits with me, plus tips after she's on stage, money from lap dances, etc.) Her response was, "You can't afford it." Then 5 minutes later she asked me to visit her apartment next time I have a day off.

I am so goddamn confused.

(Interestingly enough, I tried to tip a totally different girl $20 that same night for spending about 15 minutes with me, and she refused to accept it saying she hadn't done enough to earn it. That girl gave me her phone number right after she turned the tip down. What the fuck kind of alternate dimension bizarro strip club have I found?)