discussion comment
5 years ago
25: I agree that you can't trust these mass print articles. I'm saying this particular article roughly matches what I've heard from both strippers and escorts for decades. And I think once you get past the whoreocracy arguments of who is better than whom (a laughable concept given that they're all sex workers), it's not hard to see that other than pimped streetwalkers/low-end escorts and trafficked amp providers, the SC environment can be more toxic compared to a mid-range escort's. It's not about who is above or below whom on the whoreocracy meter that some simple-minded people pretend exists; it's about a sex worker finding the environment that works for her. But agree, for every decent article, we've seen 1000 Cosmo articles on stripper etiquette that are all ridiculous, and 1000 articles "I'm a platonic sugar baby and I get $10,000/month";
discussion comment
5 years ago
Yep, and it's the club's job to get customers in the door, at least the first time, she merely has to turn them into HER customers. It's worth the toxic environment if she isn't capable of running her own business. But (almost) no one who succeeds at escorting ever goes back to the SC; the SC is the "sal si puede".
discussion comment
5 years ago
You don't have to buy it, for it to be true. You just have to have your eyes open, and know enough women in both, to see it's happening. We're all entitled to our opinion on whether this is moving up or down -- but it's the girls who make that decision for themselves, by moving to escorting/bodyrubs from stripping, but almost never the other way (because it's a step down, at least as far as toxic work conditions). And, like I said, even escorts who want to downshift on the extras move to bodyrubs, not stripping -- again, #1 reason, toxic environment, worst coworkers, worst management, worst customers.
Note, of course, for a stripper to move to bodyrubs or escorting, she has to be open to FS or HJs at least; she may well have gotten her start doing this ITC or OTC. A stripper who is uncomfortable with any extras at all, has few other options besides camgirl (which many do) or pro domme (which requires higher skills and has demanding clients, so not always an option). Or, as a huge % do, she can pick and choose who she has sex with by going to SA -- in my area at least, SA is full of strippers (along with escorts, college girls, regular girls down on their luck, etc). Nearly every stripper I've spoken with, in the strict no-extras SCs I go to, are either on SA, or have tried it.
discussion comment
5 years ago
-->"She's an attractive, educated white woman who can keep an appointment. For her hooking is better than stripping"
Not just for her -- as I said, if you've been around long enough, you know the flow of girls is from strip clubs to escorting/bodyrubs, and very rarely goes the other way (not counting strippers who tried to escort, failed at running their own business, and went back to stripping). It might not be the right move for everyone, especially if they can't or won't run their own business, or they won't do fs (escort) or hj (bodyrubs), but the flow in the industry is to move *up* to escorting/bodyrubs to escape the toxic environment of the SC. I might guess that the article wouldn't apply to street hookers or the low-end backpage girl (I wouldn't really know), but otherwise a good summary of why strippers become (at least midrange) escorts/bodyrub girls, but the opposite rarely happens.
discussion comment
5 years ago
The one-side zero-sum-game winner-and-loser view is pure stripperweb.
I do think that everyone would rather think of themselves as predator rather than prey. Customers would rather think of themselves as scoring pussy; strippers would rather think of themselves as hustlers than as sex objects performing for money. In the case of your average strip club customer, strippers may well be right that they are more predator than prey. How many times have your regular-guy friends said they'd gone to the strip club, stripper talked him into spending way more $ than he planned, he got way less action than he thought he would? Opposite with most PLs, I imagine, and even on StripperWeb they acknowledge this -- we are after what we're after, and dismiss her if there's any hint we won't get it. In the end, if I'm after a BJ for $xyz, and I get my BJ for $xyz, I'm happy. And honestly, if the stripper wants to convince herself that she "hustled" me for $xyz, that's fine with me -- I'm fine with both sides thinking they've won, in fact I prefer my stripper thinking she was treated fairly and got what she wanted out of the transaction. As a PL, don't let the SW-types and hustler-types get you into zero-sum thinking; the only thing you should be thinking about is "I want ABC for $xyz", and if you get it, you've won (and hopefully, she's won, too). One of things that makes SW so toxic is the relentless zero-sum-game thinking. I don't ever want my ATF to think she's "lost" or whatever. I just need to get what I want.
discussion comment
5 years ago
Anyway, I only skimmed the article, so it may have some howlers that I missed, but at least on a skim, I think it's totally reasonable. I've pointed out for years that the flow in the sex industry is 95+% from stripper to escort/bodyrub, and only rarely the other way around, for all the reasons cited in that article: toxic environment (management, co-workers, and customers all more toxic than with escorting & bodyrubs, for example), etc. If a stripper is willing to do full service with anyone (who has been reference cleared), is willing and capable of running her own business, and can provide excellent service including being on time every time -- and I realize these are three HUGE "ifs" that can be insurmountable, which is why not every stripper is doing it -- then she'll tend to move to escorting, etc. Even when an escort decides she's not willing to do full service anymore, maybe because she has a boyfriend who won't allow it or is just plain uncomfortable with it -- the migration is more often to bodyrubs than to strip clubs.
Another good reason to take care of your CF, perhaps :)
discussion comment
5 years ago
Depends on the area; in my high-priced area, $400-$500 is definitely mid-range, not high end
discussion comment
5 years ago
-->"I don’t hang around gossipy women"
You DO realize you're on tuscl?
discussion comment
5 years ago
Vegas can be super fun -- there's lots of good restaurants and fun bars, there's some fun speakeasys, some of the shows are good (though I'm often underwhelmed), there's gambling if you enjoy that. If it's your scene and you have $$$$ to spend and a bunch of buddies, getting a cabana at a pool party (pool season just started) or table at a good club will get a steady stream of hotties pointed in your direction.
What you should set expectations very low for, is the SC scene and sex scene overall. The strip clubs do not provide a PL-friendly experience; like SF, if you're not a local and haven't wired things up as an insider, it's going to be the opposite of what PLs like. Unspeakably high hustle and high prices, relatively low contact, everyone looking to fleece you at every turn (e.g., the ATM surcharge is 15%, using a credit card surcharge is 15%, etc). The reason normal guys (non-PLs) love Vegas strip clubs is because 1. the girls are smoking hot, 2. they don't have PL-type experience so don't realize they're spending $$$$ to get nothing, and 3. they have a "we're in Vegas!! Wooooooo!!!!" attitude, expect to spend $$$ and are just happy to be there.
Warrenboy's advice seems good. If escorts are your thing, I've heard many guys (including a buddy, recently) just sitting alone at a bar at any number of casinos (Warrnboy listed some, R** also is known for it (also why are we spelling it using asterisks?)) will get you approached by escorts, some very attractive, although prices are high. This isn't my scene so not interested in doing it.
For me, Vegas has become a good place to not go SCing and avoid the sex industry in general, and enjoy everything else.
discussion comment
5 years ago
-->"I like hearing gossip."
Team WinningTeam unified as always.
I love hearing club gossip. Fucking love it. No strategic reason, I guess I'm just nosey, fascinated with the angsty minutiae of strip club gossip, and can hear it all day. My CFs usually figure out I like hearing it, and then I get a steady stream. It's can also be a great source of g2, but really I like it just for itself.
discussion comment
5 years ago
Ya, the pimp persona, which was nearly gone, is coming back. That's ok, though, cuz we n-words
discussion comment
5 years ago
![]()
gammanu95My casual drinking is your alcohol poisoning.
If it's got a heartbeat, I'll lock it down. She goes to take some other PL's entrance fee while she's talking to me? Boom, I'm off to go lockdown the shot girl instead. You know how I do.
discussion comment
5 years ago
![]()
gammanu95My casual drinking is your alcohol poisoning.
Front door girl making gammanu feel some sort of way
discussion comment
5 years ago
![]()
gammanu95My casual drinking is your alcohol poisoning.
Heh, definitely no shame about the front desk girl. she's a club employee and I'm already in PL mode; if she triggers any feelings in me at all, it'll be desire to get a dance from her
By contrast, there's a club out here next to a small theater where many local bands come to play. When it's a popular band, there will be a line of college-aged and 20-somethings that can stretch easily 40 or 50 yards down the sidewalk, filled with young attractive girls. And you have to basically walk right next to this line the whole way to get to the strip club front door. You definitely imagine everyone knows where you're going lol
discussion comment
5 years ago
I had no idea the n-word was used so much on Team WinningTeam
discussion comment
5 years ago
Nidan: that's the kind of attitude that's going to fast-track you for an invitation to join Team WinningTeam
discussion comment
5 years ago
On StripperWeb, I've seen the girls advise: "customers *hate* being asked for tips, but you can guilt or bully them into tips most of the time. Don't do it with regulars, since they'll turn you down or even if they do tip you, they won't come back and now you've lost regular money. But with random guys, always ask for tips, they're not coming back anyway". One of the few pieces of StripperWeb advice that seems to play out in the club in the real world and not just in StripperWeb consensus fantasy world
discussion comment
5 years ago
I've used one! When I was married, and worried about disease but definitely wanted to eat my then-ATFs pussy. Shocking ending: it sucks all the fun out of it.
discussion comment
5 years ago
![]()
flagoonerEverything written by this member is a fact.
Very apropos, if Pulitzers were hos that you got addicted to meth
discussion comment
5 years ago
![]()
flagoonerEverything written by this member is a fact.
Flag: this is the kind of first-class troll thread that might just get you an invitation to join Team WinningTeam
discussion comment
5 years ago
1. If I just got one dance, I probably like it "meh, ok", so no tip, Otherwise, I'd "tip" her by getting more dances
2. Even if I did like it and for whatever reason stopped at one, I only tip for extraordinary service. "happy with the mileage and experience" sounds like par for the course good dance, exactly what I expect, but I don't tip for it.
discussion comment
5 years ago
-->"Democrats will vote Democrats while Republicans will vote Republicans. However captures the independent votes will emerge as the President of the United States come 2020..."
I'm not so sure; these are weird times. There certainly seem many moderate Republicans who would re-think voting for Trump, especially more center-leaning women. That's if the Democrats put up a moderate. I think all bets are off if the Democrats put up a progressive; that could not only drive moderate Republicans back to Trump, but I wonder if it might rally the loony left but also get some moderate Democrats re-thinking their vote.
discussion comment
5 years ago
-->"Strippers can do better than having a criminal loser boyfriend. Why don’t they go for one of their well to do RIL?"
I'd say that's not true, Bav, at least if it's a real boyfriend and not a RIL they're just playing. I don't think they have nearly as many options as you think they do
discussion comment
5 years ago
Uprightcitizen: please keep track of who gets the most votes for being craziest. I'd like to offer the top 5 finishers membership on Team Winning Team
discussion comment
5 years ago
![]()
CC99Say yes to the sex industry!
A always have a bunch of hobbies, but I can't be balls-out on more than a few at a time; the rest I just enjoy whenever. I don't consider SCing a "hobby", and kind of wince when people refer to mongering/SCing/etc as "the hobby". Just like, going out for beers with my buddies isn't a hobby, just a social activity I enjoy.