Maybe I'm off the mark here, but I can't help but suspect that guys who call themselves and others PLs really do harbor some self-disgust. I know that they argue that it is just tongue-in-cheek humor, but the longer it goes on the less I believe this explanation. I am rather starting to believe that they either truly dislike themselves and/or others for hanging out in strip clubs.
Idk, but if I ever actually felt this way about myself, I would be highly motivated to do something about it. Just a thought. ;)
Or maybe they dislike themselves for whatever reason they blame for why they seek out paid companionship. Again, idk, but it is starting to get a little weird now.
If you are asking me, I would say yes, it is self disgust. But it is also just correct perception.
Anyone who depends upon strip clubs or P4P for their sexual gratification has got something seriously wrong in their life.
If your life is not somehow screwed up ( including dysfunctional marriage in this ), then most sex workers can be gotten into ongoing relationships and even off the clock. In most countries other than the US, smart guys keep mistresses. They get money, but they are still not really P4P.
I don't really go along with the idea of Winners and Losers. I don't view the world that way.
But I do know that many end up cast into roles which look that way.
When I first joined this forum I wrote on my profile that I may look like a PL, and I may even really be one. But my objective is to like like King Herod The Great.
Papi, I hear you, but I'm just not sure that I buy it. Most self deprecating humor is often a bbackhanded form of humble bragging, but this feels nothing like that. It really does feel like some guys here, on some level, feel a kernel or more of truth in it. Kinda' sad tbh.
I don't use the term myself, but the opposite extreme is 10x more clownish and neurotic. In other words guys who don't seem to understand that they are nothing more than johns paying prostitutes for sex. As if there's some kind of "thrill of the chase."
A big part of the discussion board is being a bit goofy - it's TUSCL not The Academy Of Science - no need for a big-dive into most of what's posted here.
The reality, @Dugan, is that you're a middle aged guy squandering his kids inheritance on prostitutes. We'll give you a gold metal instead of calling you a PL.
It's also a unifying term for all strip clubbers. As long as one pays a stripper for anything sexual, one is a "pathetic loser". We are all the same in this regard whether it is a single $1 stage tip or $500 to take her OTC for an hour.
If you go to a strip club it is irony to judge others that do it too.
It wouldn't surprise me if someone who isn't really a frequent club patron coined this term on here. But the self hate is so strong in some that they readily adopted it like some badge of pride. If I was that person, I'd be getting a never-ending kick out of it. Nobody who has any real sense of pride would willingly label himself that way, regardless of the context.
To be clear, I couldn't care less about what anyone on this board thinks of me, which I'm sure has been pretty clear for some time now with my posting style. This is just an extension of my clubbing entertainment when I cannot be at the club. But all this constant "PL" self-hate is becoming a real buzz kill, LOL.
I'd call most custies either pathetic or losers. Pathetic in having to pay women for attention, and losers for having no friends IRL... But it takes a special breed to be a Pathetic Loser. ;)
But srsly, guys here call themselves PLs as a way to show they're not ashamed of going to the SCs and own why they're here. Like any social group there's those who truly belong and those who pretend to be. It's part of the vernacular to form an in-group vs out-group. It's a badge of honor, but only within the SC community and more likely just here. Guys aren't running around referring to themselves as PLs outside in the real world.
It wouldn't surprise me if someone who isn't really a frequent club patron coined this term on here. But the self hate is so strong in some that they readily adopted it like some badge of pride. If I was that person, I'd be getting a never-ending kick out of it. Nobody who has any real sense of pride would willingly label himself that way, regardless of the context.
To be clear, I couldn't care less about what anyone on this board thinks of me, which I'm sure has been pretty clear for some time now with my posting style. This is just an extension of my clubbing entertainment when I cannot be at the club. But all this constant "PL" self-hate is becoming a real buzz kill, LOL
Rofl... I wonder who coined the terms "stroke a manager" and "greasing the bouncer"
Also nothing is more pathetic than paying a dancer thousands of dollars just to talk.
Oh wait I figured it out... someone wearing a white polyester suit and bragging about a 35% success rate at paying strippers for sex
I guess it's something like a strip club n-word. For instance, blacks that use the word for themselves aren't self-hating but a non-black wouldn't be allowed to use it because the usage/meaning outside of that group is offensive. Likewise, among mongers, there's a general acceptance (or a lack of judgement) of what it means to be a PL, but if someone outside of that circle were to call a PL pathetic, they'd be told to fuck off and that they didn't know shit. Anyway, PL for me will always be pussy lover and it suits me well...
-->"I guess it's something like a strip club n-word."
YOu're on the right track. Maybe a little more like the word "queer", which was "taken back" by the gay community. Although in this case, not so much taken back but adopted the moment we heard it. I've related the etymology of PL on this forum several times -- I was there when it was created, on usenet as gmd correctly remembers.
Who's to say some of those guys aren't aware and are actively making changes? It's there's any self hate (or self deprecating humor), it's usually to fish for advice. Tuscl is about 50/50 weirdness and real talk. Plus this is about the only real place our social circles intersect.
I don’t care what term is used to describe my clubbing.
If I feel self- loathing or other issues, those issues are more related to my decision to club. What folks refer to me as, because I club, is secondary.
That's true! Any self-loathing never related to the actual club or dancers and more with what's happening in my real life. If anything the pick-me-up I get from clubbing helps to alleviate that and motivate me to correct the real underlying problem. I always look forward to each visit once I decide and plan in advance to go, I enjoy the visit 110% while I'm there, and the after-club lift and happiness and glow is good for at least 3 days is not 2 full weeks!
Those guys who are sad while in the club or sad when they leave the club. That's never me! Maybe I'll start a new trend and call myself regular guy who sometimes goes to strip clubs.
It doesn’t matter much to me what terms people use. Some folks seem to be serious in there postings on here, others are almost always just fucking around and, I think, most of us post as a mixture of the two. But even saying that, I don’t actually know people here and whether they are projecting a persona for their posts, deliberately or not. So I have no idea whether people on Tuscl dislike themselves and i don’t think anyone is going to figure out the inner thoughts or feelings of anyone else here.
I have women half my age sitting around naked and flirting with me. Why on earth would that be pathetic? They ignore the cheap bastards and pay attention to me. I view it as a sign of success.
I do agree with what rickdugan is saying. If you know what you want out of this and have the means to get it, go ahead and get it.
I consider strip club customers pathetic if they fall into one of these categories:
1) They've been trying for years and have never gotten OTC
2) They overpay constantly and/or they feel obligated to buy a dance from anyone who asks politely
3) They think the girl really has feelings for them
4) When they get a girls number they're blocked almost immediately because they text her constantly
The list, of course, is not all inclusive. But I would never refer to myself as a PL. I don't see the humor and I don't think it applies to me.
"It wouldn't surprise me if someone who isn't really a frequent club patron coined this term on here."
We cover this every few months. It was first used by a stripper in a usenet forum over twenry years ago. Perhaps founder can create a sticky from one of the previous discussions.
I find it a humorous term - I think I first heard it from one of Papi's posts. After that I got used to it. I think if you have the full meaning of it - it is hilarious. Of course for humor to be good there has to be a little truth in it....He He
"Dugan has a wife and kids, but yet fucks strippers and takes advantage of strippers when they’re in tough situations."
I could easily make the argument that everyone's employer takes advantage of their need for money. Otherwise we wouldn't work. But I did choose my occupation. Sometimes I stay later than I want to and sometimes I take on assignments that I'd rather not have. Should strippers be spared from making similar exceptions in their line of work?
In the pool halls, the hustlers and the losers
I used to watch 'em through the glass
Well I'd stand outside at closing time
Just to watch her walk on past
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Anyone who depends upon strip clubs or P4P for their sexual gratification has got something seriously wrong in their life.
If your life is not somehow screwed up ( including dysfunctional marriage in this ), then most sex workers can be gotten into ongoing relationships and even off the clock. In most countries other than the US, smart guys keep mistresses. They get money, but they are still not really P4P.
I don't really go along with the idea of Winners and Losers. I don't view the world that way.
But I do know that many end up cast into roles which look that way.
When I first joined this forum I wrote on my profile that I may look like a PL, and I may even really be one. But my objective is to like like King Herod The Great.
SJG
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As I said, 10x more clownish.
Personally if a guy is sensitive to it enough for it to be an issue, I think he's the one with the issues.
SJG
I know for me, I just use “PL” because
1. It doesn’t offend anyone here (as opposed to other words, like “trick”)
2. It’s more convenient
https://www.tuscl.net/discussion.php5?id…
https://www.tuscl.net/discussion.php5?id…
SJG
SJG
If you go to a strip club it is irony to judge others that do it too.
So what are they good for?
Imbibing a sexual aesthetic.
For those who want outside relationships, not strict P4P, with dancers.
SJG
RD=rickdugan, or also Real Donkeys
To be clear, I couldn't care less about what anyone on this board thinks of me, which I'm sure has been pretty clear for some time now with my posting style. This is just an extension of my clubbing entertainment when I cannot be at the club. But all this constant "PL" self-hate is becoming a real buzz kill, LOL.
But srsly, guys here call themselves PLs as a way to show they're not ashamed of going to the SCs and own why they're here. Like any social group there's those who truly belong and those who pretend to be. It's part of the vernacular to form an in-group vs out-group. It's a badge of honor, but only within the SC community and more likely just here. Guys aren't running around referring to themselves as PLs outside in the real world.
going by this reasoning, being a PL is a form of humble bragging. Pretending to be a PL, but having(bragging) about the means/money to do so.
To be clear, I couldn't care less about what anyone on this board thinks of me, which I'm sure has been pretty clear for some time now with my posting style. This is just an extension of my clubbing entertainment when I cannot be at the club. But all this constant "PL" self-hate is becoming a real buzz kill, LOL
Rofl... I wonder who coined the terms "stroke a manager" and "greasing the bouncer"
Also nothing is more pathetic than paying a dancer thousands of dollars just to talk.
Oh wait I figured it out... someone wearing a white polyester suit and bragging about a 35% success rate at paying strippers for sex
I’m pretty sure I don’t abhor myself enough to actually think of myself as pathetic in anything other than an ironic way, but what do I know?
YOu're on the right track. Maybe a little more like the word "queer", which was "taken back" by the gay community. Although in this case, not so much taken back but adopted the moment we heard it. I've related the etymology of PL on this forum several times -- I was there when it was created, on usenet as gmd correctly remembers.
Honestly, this is one of the most narcissistic forums I've ever participated in, and that remains true if you exclude the dancers who post here.
If I feel self- loathing or other issues, those issues are more related to my decision to club. What folks refer to me as, because I club, is secondary.
Those guys who are sad while in the club or sad when they leave the club. That's never me! Maybe I'll start a new trend and call myself regular guy who sometimes goes to strip clubs.
I do agree with what rickdugan is saying. If you know what you want out of this and have the means to get it, go ahead and get it.
I consider strip club customers pathetic if they fall into one of these categories:
1) They've been trying for years and have never gotten OTC
2) They overpay constantly and/or they feel obligated to buy a dance from anyone who asks politely
3) They think the girl really has feelings for them
4) When they get a girls number they're blocked almost immediately because they text her constantly
The list, of course, is not all inclusive. But I would never refer to myself as a PL. I don't see the humor and I don't think it applies to me.
We cover this every few months. It was first used by a stripper in a usenet forum over twenry years ago. Perhaps founder can create a sticky from one of the previous discussions.
SJG
What would be a better word Dugan? Prophet? :)
I could easily make the argument that everyone's employer takes advantage of their need for money. Otherwise we wouldn't work. But I did choose my occupation. Sometimes I stay later than I want to and sometimes I take on assignments that I'd rather not have. Should strippers be spared from making similar exceptions in their line of work?
I used to watch 'em through the glass
Well I'd stand outside at closing time
Just to watch her walk on past
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH29n-MV…
SJG