Do you think the patron's looks can affect the mileage they'll receive by a danc

87 comments

• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  More than how he guy looks, its how he is dressed, which in my view effects how everything goes with the dancers. But buying services is not good, have to treat the girls like civilians. And the key to total paradise is that front room makeout session. SJG The Lifestyle, erotic rights of swingers [view link] [view link] [view link] [view link]
• Papi_Chulo

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  6 years ago

  Seems you're indirectly describing yourself
• shadowcat

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  6 years ago

  Dancers tell me that "You cannot judge a book by it's cover".
• ppwh

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  6 years ago

  Dancers tell me that they can tell that they can taste the Bookers on me, and I don't even drink Bookers. However, whenever it happens, it's definitely is a felicitous occasion.
• Lone_Wolf

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  6 years ago

  I'm fugly so would have nothing to compare it by but common sense would seem it has a huge impact.
• Papi_Chulo

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  6 years ago

  It can cut both ways. I *do* think a dancer may get into it more with a good looking guy (not that I can speak from personal experience although I'm sure many on here will say o/w about themselves :)). But I often see old fat dudes getting more love than young good looking guys - "in general" I think dancers are more motivated to give mileage to get more $$$ vs b/c the guy is good-looking - dancers are primarily if not exclusively at the club to get-paid vs hoping to dance for good looking guys - I even think they prefer an ugly-guy b/c he may be seen as more needy/desperate for a hot-chick and thus more willing to fork over the mula.
• JohnSmith69

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  6 years ago

  All other things being equal, most strippers would probably chose the most handsome PL to dance for. But all other things are never equal. Money is a hundred times more important than looks to most strippers.
• ppwh

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  6 years ago

  > Do these kind of patron's, from your observation, get similar or perhaps more mileage than the patron with the bigger wallet? Out of all the guys I snake, I think it's the ones who are nice to the stripper who get the best treatment unless she's completely ruthless. Then it's more like is it going to be your phone or your car keys.
• flagooner

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  6 years ago

  I think the only one's that can answer this with any degree of knowledge and accuracy are the dancers.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  Women like high social status. So it is clothes and demeanor. Looks is important, but not as important as the previous two. SJG
• AmeliaSmith

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  6 years ago

  I agree with ShadowCat. I've had some of the most money come from guys wearing sweat pants and athletic shorts. I do have to admit that I still am intimidated by the really good looking guys that I give dances to. They are usually the ones that ask for my number to take me on dates. That and I'm really thinking "Dayyuuummmm"
• Call.Me.Ishmael

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  6 years ago

  To a degree, yes. But to a far lesser degree than in a "civilian" setting. In a strip club, brushing your teeth, taking a shower, and wearing clean clothes puts you ahead of a lot of the other patrons.
• Uprightcitizen

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  6 years ago

  Yes SJG you should wear that old reliable Greg Brady wear to the club. Girls think its groovy. But dont get your pants caught in the bike chain again man.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  Upright, haven't you got anything better to do? SJG
• chessmaster

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  6 years ago

  I dont know. Logic says they are there to get paid and looks should be low on the list of priorities. If they wanted to dance/get picked up by a good looking guy a night club would be a better prospect. But who knows
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  I say that if you treat girls like civilians, while being generous with them, you are in large measure getting them off script. so clothes and demeanor are more important than facial looks. But they still like a guy who keeps in shape. So if you proceed this way, you have a good chance of being able to select a girl and be waking up with her the next morning. SJG
• GACA

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  6 years ago

  I can honestly say that the importance of appearance varies from dancer to dancer. Think of dancer with a significant other cares very little about how a customer looks and appearance. But dancers who are single or who are in an otherwise horrible relationship and are looking to upgrade then ya, looks play a bigger factor. To the point that they'll take less money to have a better time dancing.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  GACA, what effect would you say facial appearance has, versus how the guy is dressed? I have always found that the later makes a huge difference, as it gets into how women always judge men, and then women have for themselves high standards. SJG
• londonguy

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  6 years ago

  SJG, why do you always put SJG at the bottom of your posts when we can clearly see it is you? Just curious.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  politeness SJG
• Rickberge

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  6 years ago

  I think it's a combination of looks, politeness (respect) appearance, and money. Well at least this is what my CF told me. She stated that she was attracted to me based on my appearance and my vibe. Now I did spend $150 ($5 lap dance club day shift) on her the first time we met but the mileage was very high. She said it was easier to do VIP and high mileage because of my looks and persona.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  Rick, how do you think facial looks rates, versus just how a guy is dressed? As I have seen, how a guy dresses has a huge effect on how women respond. SJG
• Lone_Wolf

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  6 years ago

  This topic reminds me of the time I walked into a sc and saw my favorite talking to some young stud. She immediately rushed over to me leaving the stud in mid-sentence. The confused look on his face gave me chuckle.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  ^^^^ Were you dressed in a way which communicates "success" and high socio-economic status? SJG
• Papi_Chulo

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  6 years ago

  "... She said it was easier to do VIP and high mileage because of my looks and persona ..." Well - if she said it - I don't see how it cannot be true
• a21985

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  6 years ago

  I like to tell myself a story that I'm special whenever I go to the club. I always have plenty of money, I'm dressed in more business like attire, I'm articulate, I'm not bad looking at all, I'm well groomed, and I'm clearly in my mid 30s. The story I tell myself is that the dancers would prefer me any day over a kid in his 20s who may not have the money or manners, as well as over an older gentleman who may have the money and manners but not the look. There may be a smidge of truth in that, but the reality is the girls are out for money no matter who has it, and me thinking ridiculously thinking I'm any more worthy of purchasing a dancers affections is simply just a part of the whole overall strip club fantasy for me. Nothing more, nothing less.
• Uprightcitizen

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  6 years ago

  This is how you dress for a strip club [view link]
• twentyfive

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  6 years ago

  ^^^That man is suited perfectly.
• Lone_Wolf

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  6 years ago

  The question isn't about who the dancers want. It's about mileage. They may want to spend more time with me because I've got the cash but the young studs probably get more mileage then me in VIP.
• s275ironman

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  6 years ago

  I think a21985 sums it up very good. Not to sound narcissistic, but I truly do believe that I am a handsome man. However, I do realize that looks aren’t everything. If they were, I would be getting a ton of civilian pussy for free, and therefore I wouldn’t need to go to strip clubs. Based on my own experiences, often times a dancer I have my eye on chooses to approach me over all the other customers in the club who are several decades older and have a lot more disposable income than I have. Why do they choose me? It could possibly because they find me attractive, but I am not 100% sure because I never ask them. In the moment, I don’t really think about why they chose me. I just am appreciative of the fact they did. I then go have fun with the girl and leave the club with a smile on my face. Then again, maybe my strip club success stories may be as simple as the fact that I shower before going to a club and dress to impress. Lately I have been wearing khakis and a polo shirt when going to clubs.
• DeclineToState

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  6 years ago

  We dudes are mostly just guessing at the answer and the regular mongerer will have a better educated guess based on experience, but I think the better sources for accurate answer are our female comrades (Amelia, BG, poledancer, Nina, Eve, etc. - assuming none of them are aliases and really dudes - ha!). My educated guesses based on experience: --$$ is trump, especially if dude has reputation for spending / girls have seen you go upstairs with other girls. --Good looks and decent dress draw attention, especially if you're above college age with assumption of gainful employment - I dress decent, business casual so to speak, not suits, shower and try to smell good and that certainly doesn't hurt. Not knocking my shorts and sweats wearing brothers though because based on accounts read here the shorts and sweats guys do just fine. --Middle age and older men get an assist by being in halfway decent shape - I've dropped some pounds over past year and I've noticed that change draws increased initial attention, but it's initial attention in getting approached that's all, and ultimately being in better shape matters more to me than them because they're happy to take my money regardless of heavy or trimmer. -And: What a21985 said.
• DeclineToState

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  6 years ago

  ^^Sorry for not having responded to OP's actual question, as pointed out by Lone Wolf. New answer: Given that I'm average in the looks department I can't answer and for me mileage is thus girl dependent. I try em out and if I'm not satisfied with mileage I move on.
• Subraman

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  6 years ago

  For a couple of years there was a very handsome (no homo), younger guy (no homo) who SCed with us (fap fap fap), someone who worked with one of the other guys. The girls fell all over themselves for him. He was younger and spent a lot less than us, but at minimum he got as good, or better, treatment than those of us who were spending 2x-3x as much as him. He sometimes got far more than us (I hesitate to even tell stories, since they'll sound unbelievable). It was funny at first, and then started to annoy the rest of us. I do imagine that this might vary from dancer to dancer, at least in degree; there were definitely girls who immediately walked when they realized he didn't have much to spend, but for each one of those, there were several who'd give him the bonus treatment just for being handsome.
• larryfisherman

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  6 years ago

  I think generally not, but it can happen at times, especially with the less experienced strippers. They are women after all. Though I think spending money and being respectful will lead you to better mileage more than good looks will.
• FTS

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  6 years ago

  ^^ the ones making the offers to that young handsome guy were probably fat and ugly and couldn't get a good looking guy in their personal lives. IMO, this question is kinda like asking, "all other things being equal, would you work harder for a boss who was more appealing in this X way," (where X is a non-monetary characteristic). Would you work harder for a supervisor who was friendlier? Would you work harder for a female manager who was physically more attractive? Perhaps you might work just a tad bit harder... ... But now let's ask this question: All other things being equal, would you work harder for a (female) executive who had a 1 billion dollar budget, or an executive who had a one million dollar budget? If the capital cost of the project is the same in both scenarios, then it's reasonable to assume that your salary will be higher working for the billion dollar executive. So, which is a greater incentive for you to work harder at your own job? More money, or a nicer supervisor? Perhaps, if you already have tons of money of your own and you're getting bored with your current job, you might be tempted to take the job just to work for somebody with a better personality. But how many strippers already have tons of money and are no longer incentivized by huge sums of money?
• GACA

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  6 years ago

  So I just asked a dancer. She said it was all about the money. They are there to get all the money they can not have fun. So... Apparently appearance doesn't matter
• larryfisherman

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  6 years ago

  ^^^Because she said that I guess it means it’s universally true.
• chessmaster

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  6 years ago

  Strippers stereotype based on how you dress, age, race and at least some of them to a certain degree, gender. Why wouldnt they also stereotype handsome men? Unless im missing something and these good looking guys are spending significant money on strippers instead of laying civi chicks.
• PaulDrake

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  6 years ago

  Female perception of male attractiveness is really weird. Here is some public data from OK cupid: [view link] Basically women are super harsh in their rating of men's attractiveness. There was another more recent study that said that a median guy was only rated a 1.5 on a scale of 10. Quite surprising given the perception that women care less about a guys looks that vice versa. Given the data I tend to think that even those of us who have had attractive vanilla wives/gfs still probably aren't perceived as being attractive ourselves. Additionally I have seen other comments on the pink forum similar to Amelia's that say dancers are actually uncomfortable around guys they perceive as hot.
• goosman

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  6 years ago

  I think your cleanliness matters more, including not being sweaty & smelly. Also the softness of your hands. If you have rough hands that scratch their body, they're less likely to want to stick around.
• DeclineToState

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  6 years ago

  @Subra: "He sometimes got far more than us (I hesitate to even tell stories, since they'll sound unbelievable)." ^Lay a few of the unbelievable stories on us for entertainment plz. I don't have strip club stories like that to tell, but in college once we reached drinking age me and buddies would go out drinking on Thursday nites - one of em was very handsome guy and he'd always have the bar's 9-10 rated girl all over him and most times he'd take her home - lucky ass bastard, and he was a cool guy too
• lopaw

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  6 years ago

  I've been told by quite a few dancers that they tend to approach unattractive older guys first since they will tip generously out of sheer appreciation for any attention at all.
• orionsmith

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  6 years ago

  I think some dancers are much more attracted to me than other dancers and I'm not going to try to figure that one out. I believe if you dress well and appear to have money, dancers are going to be attracted to you. Every once in a while you get a crazy dancer or female customer that wants to get your attention or more and is extremely persistent. I haven't been to a strip club since last summer. If some of the same dancers still work at a local club if I decide to return soon, I bet some will be curious and I might get attention. However it could be none of the same dancers work there. Then I would get to find out if I was considered fresh meat. The feeling you get when you aren't a regular and everyone wants a piece of you.
• goldmongerATL

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  6 years ago

  I think it affects the negative more than the positive. If you are repulsive, overly rude or abusive/disrespectful in a big way it can cut or eliminate your mileage. If not, money causes more orgasms (real or fake) than any other factor.
• Longball300

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  6 years ago

  Yes
• jackslash

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  6 years ago

  Do a patron's looks affect the mileage he gets? I sure hope not!
• Huntsman

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  6 years ago

  It looks like Amelia is the only stripper who responded here and she is somewhat new. Therefore, I think the answer to the OP must be some super secret stripper m.o. shit, disclosure of which is subject to penalty. So, run Amelia, run. In fact, you can hide on my lap if you’d like.
• twentyfive

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  6 years ago

  ^^^If you can't dazzle her with your brilliance, baffle her with your bullshit !
• Rickberge

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  6 years ago

  @Papi... yea that's what she told me about 2 months later. By this time we've done countless OTCs without money exchanging. Well except for me buying dinner or a movie.. so I'm assuming she was telling the truth. Not in the sense that I'm the only guy she's every done high mileage with but her reasoning for doing high mileage dances with someone.
• Huntsman

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  6 years ago

  Good idea 25. Bullshit is my stronger trait, by far.
• NinaBambina

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  6 years ago

  I'd rather dance for an average-looking guy than an incredibly handsome one. I try not to vary my mileage based off looks. I can't say I never have, though. As long as hygiene and manners are fine, I will prefer a big wallet over a handsome face every time.
• yahtzee74

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  6 years ago

  @nina... all things being equal except attractiveness, why do you prefer an average guy over a handsome one?
• Subraman

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  6 years ago

  -->"^^ the ones making the offers to that young handsome guy were probably fat and ugly and couldn't get a good looking guy in their personal lives." Definitely not the case with my buddy, where there was no real correlation with looks -- ugly strippers threw themselves at him, but so did average and incredibly hot ones. Of course, as I said earlier, there *were* definitely plenty of strippers who bailed once they realized he had little money, but it was clear and obvious that there was a big subset of strippers who put aside their revenue goals to hang out with him. The guy regularly scored 9+s outside the strip club, too. I've also been in the club a zillion times, where there were good looking younger guys, and it was my table full of old guys who had all the girls clustered around us. I mean, this is the norm, not the exception. So I've always wondered if my buddy's experience is more for guys who are past whatever the female equivalent of the Dushku limit is -- regular-guy handsome is trumped by old guy with money, but Dushku handsome is not.
• NinaBambina

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  6 years ago

  @yahtzee74 idk. Less distraction, maybe.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  Subra, in a strip club all the girl knows is what she sees and hears. Don't you think the way the guy is dressed will outrank everything else. I have found that to be the case with women everywhere, strip clubs, amps, shopping malls, walking across the Stanford campus. I'm not saying this is fair or just, I'm just noting what seems to be happening. SJG King Crimson, Lark's Tongue in Aspic
• Dominic77

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  6 years ago

  Maybe, I guess. But you guys on Tuscl seem to swear up and down that it’s so easy to get more money — or at least it’s not super hard — so why would the original question even matter to you guys?
• chessmaster

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  6 years ago

  Man, life must be easy if you're good looking.
• flagooner

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  6 years ago

  It is.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  Yes indeed: [view link] Its not about what dancers want? Well, how women treat you depends upon how they perceive you. SJG
• twentyfive

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  6 years ago

  ^^^you beat me to that answer !
• Dominic77

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  6 years ago

  SJG+1. Succinctly what I have been trying to get these knuckleheads to understand about women. Thank you.
• Subraman

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  6 years ago

  -->"Man, life must be easy if you're good looking." Okay, I'll tell you one fun story about my buddy, to put things in perspective. I can tell you lots of stories about how women treat him (e.g., the girls at his local starbucks give him his drinks for free). But the really interesting thing I learned -- when you're that handsome, even men treat you differently. I am sure it's completely subconscious, because these aren't gay men ... but on some level, it's clicking. Case in point: one of the strip clubs we frequented always had the classic surly, opposite-of-customer-oriented type dive SC staff. One of the front desk guys was a mean old bastard, I'd guess in his 60s, the best you could hope for any interaction with him is that he didn't notice you at all and just gave you his obviously-forced-friendly speech about the club. So all the regulars just do our best grayman impression (look up grayman theory on google) as we entered. Well, my I don't know how it happened, but the guy just loved my buddy, right from the beginning... my buddy said something or other to him, and instead of being a dick back the old fuck joked back, and from then on, it was smiles and jokes, and anytime we went back to the lobby to look at our phones or whatever, if it wasn't too busy he'd come out from behind the desk and hang out with us. We have pictures with him :) lol ... Anyway, that's not a one-off story, not just young women but older men all reacted to the guy this way. I enjoyed it, I liked to pretend that the starbucks girls gave us our coffees for free because **we** are so hot and flirty, but oddly enough, when I go to that starbucks alone those bitches make me pay, as if I'm just some regular old guy.
• Mate27

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  6 years ago

  ^^^ That’s an interesting account and is reinforced by what you are saying that rapport is the one biggest variable. Some guys can start doing it way faster and better than others. It takes energy, but some enjoy the pure performance of it. It gets the intended reactions, at a better close ratio at best.
• twentyfive

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  6 years ago

  @Subraman I have a couple of buddies that go clubbing with me and although most of us are older guys, we are all in fairly good shape, none of us look like George Clooney, some of us might be fairly rugged in appearance, we are a pretty affluent bunch, I notice that when we are together, we tend to play off each other, and as a result we generally have a bunch of gals hanging around in the clubs that we go to, sometimes we go to a regular singles type joint, or a restaurant and we all sort of have a knack for getting women to hang out with us or waitresses to flirt with us. I believe it’s because we give off a certain vibe while we horse around, playing off each other’s and teasing and hitting the dozens in a way that draws them in.
• flagooner

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  6 years ago

  ^ @25. You lost me when you said you have a couple of buddies.
• twentyfive

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  6 years ago

  ^^^ Now you’re the one who’s being hurtful.
• Subraman

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  6 years ago

  lol
• rogertex

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  6 years ago

  "Do you think the patron's looks can affect the mileage they'll receive by a dancer?" To the same extent as you would in any other business or social setting. More or less. I'd rephrase above: "Do you think the patron's looks and attitude can affect the mileage they'll receive by a dancer?" If you say this with a smile, a dancer will feel like a asexual, homey, nerd walking away from you: "I come to a topless club featuring smart and beautiful divas - and I cannot touch and kiss their tits? WTF! I'd rather stay home and watch the scenery on internet!!!"
• Bj99

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  6 years ago

  Looks don’t hurt, but I think guys who I think will be appreciative, and not take a mile for every inch, get higher mileage w me. Some guys are so pushy and forceful from the start that’s I practically have to do their dance w my pages crossed, and lots of girls will air dance, if a guy is just too pushy. Money, and an appropriate ammt of patience helps too. I get irritated when a guy expects to suck my titties in the first song he’s ever gotten w me. Now, a regular who sometimes gets many songs, but only wants one or two, is different, and so is someone who lets me know he’s be getting several.
• Bj99

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  6 years ago

  A guy who says, “I understand if you don’t want to/can’t, but I’d love it if ____.” Is more likely to get higher mileage w me, than someone who just tries to force me and seems pushy, or irritable. I also hate when they won’t chill for a moment and let me get them into the dance, and just want to treat it like a groping session. I don’t care how hot the guy is. That’s just obnoxious.
• twentyfive

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  6 years ago

  ^^^ What you seem to be saying is you want a little romance. ;)
• Bj99

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  6 years ago

  No. Not at all. More like a little trust and understanding for my position.
• ppwh

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  6 years ago

  I have a little romance. It's in my pants. You have to know how to work a zipper, though.
• Dominic77

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  6 years ago

  I often read of dancers across the board complaining about Mr Octopus Hands. Not that he's going anything against the rules, but he's groping so hard and fast (ass to boobs to stomach to thighs to neck within 5 seconds) that it puts her on edge and causes her to dance defensively. It's like, dude! I know your excited and not breaking the rules but slow down. There are certain ways to touch a woman and that isn't it. Ease into, build gradually, and watch her for feedback and consent. And most importantly have fun with it. If you go too far pull back and start again. Above all, respect.
• Bj99

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  6 years ago

  You and 25 can have your romance. I want easy going and discreet.
• Bj99

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  6 years ago

  @Dominic, yes. Plus, that kind of frenzied groping makes us think if he can reach it, he will be grabbing it. It makes us worried he will do major no no’s if given the chance, since he’s obviously oblivious to our needs anyways.
• ppwh

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  6 years ago

  > You and 25 can have your romance. I want easy going and discreet. It's fagboner that I want and I don't care if the world knows it.
• ppwh

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  6 years ago

  > So I've always wondered if my buddy's experience is more for guys who are past whatever the female equivalent of the Dushku limit is -- regular-guy handsome is trumped by old guy with money, but Dushku handsome is not. This is a great theory, but they should have called it the NinaBambina limit. Dushku couldn't sell me a dance on most nights, but I would be in danger of being the guy who actually wrote a check at a strip club to Nina.
• twentyfive

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  6 years ago

  @Bj99 I never said I wanted romance, I was hoping for groping, but I take what I can get ;) @ppwh you seem to be so quick to dump Nina, disappointing that it's flag, but you just don't seem like my type anyway, you are more of Subra's type TBH, .) Btw if i can't have Bj I am feeling Amelia, she has a fascinating pair on display.
• ppwh

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  6 years ago

  > you seem to be so quick to dump Nina, disappointing that it's flag, but you just don't seem like my type anyway, you are more of Subra's type TBH, .) I'm not dumping Nina, I'm just acknowledging it is a crush and fagboner is my rebound dude. I like you, but fagboner was in the right place at the right time if you know what I am saying.
• Bj99

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  6 years ago

  ^ lol, poor lurkers on this site lately!
• flagooner

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  6 years ago

  Damn, I'm too fucking irresistible. It's a curse.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  My experience is that it is the clothes that determine how the women behave. I don't like it, not at all, except when I'm on the receiving end of it. And Dominic77, of TUSCLers always seeming to act like money grows on trees. Well, for a few I think that is true. It is circumstantial that they have lots of it. For most, I don't think this is true. Many are going for LDKing and some limited OTCing, keeping it in bounds. For yourself, you seem to want to save money. Saving money is fine. But the 'Invest and grow rich' idea is nonsense. For myself, I am not rich. But I believe that I will be. Its not that I strive for money, or that I have some special formula. Its simply because most people organize their lives around winning the approval of other people. Spouse, parents, and other people like that. I was that way too, far more than I'd ever realized. After all I have been through I am no longer like that. I do not play by the rules everyone else plays by. So I do not need to lift a finger, money will be raining down on me, as I build a huge power base. You get money by first getting power, so that you don't have to follow the rules. SJG Paris Hilton Says Leaked 2004 Sex Tape Was 'Like Being Raped' in New Documentary [view link] Rolling Stones - Under My Thumb LIVE Tempe, Arizona '81 [view link] ROLLING STONES - Sympathy For The Devil (Live 1969) HD [view link] Rock Me Baby [view link] [view link] [view link] [view link] [view link] [view link]
• Jascoi

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  6 years ago

  i dress clean and simple. i try to act respectful and not forceful. and i smile. i think i get pretty good response from the ladies. (i could use more money however.)
• Cashman1234

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  6 years ago

  I think a patron’s looks might make the dance more enjoyable for the dancer - but it’s one factor - and a much less important factor than money - grooming and cleanliness - and more money! I’m not a total mess - but I’m far from looking like Tom Cruise. I have no problems getting dancers to sit and chat with me. Maybe it’s the size - and girth - of my wallet?
• DeclineToState

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  6 years ago

  It's your Cash,man.
• san_jose_guy

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  6 years ago

  Women do respond to grooming and cleanliness, and also to money. But as I see it, they also just act on how they perceive you. They want to know what your station in life is. And this does not exclude older men, it can favor them. I find that women do respond to simple indicators of socio-economic status. And they make the fallacy of assuming that this corresponds to some sort of genetic status, rather than just to acculturation and inherited station. Also women's own standards for dress and grooming are very high, so they notice things which men tend not to. So for example, if a woman sees me riding a bicycle, looking like I am training for a race, then she will really take notice of me, no matter how young she is. She will admire my physique, she will admire the fact that I have money and time for such conspicuous leisure, riding in big circles. But do the same thing, looking like someone who uses a bicycle for transportation, and she will totally block me out. And I know not look at her or try to talk to her, or I might just end up in jail. Dr. Ruth talks about this, what are women's fears, their nightmares? Well they involve things with men where there are indicators of low socio-economic status. And so what are their dreams? They are pretty much the same as their fears. Some of them come very close to rape. But they involve men showing indicators of high socio-economic status. They do studies, they ask women what kinds of male behaviors they find offensive? They they ask them what kinds of male behaviors they like. The lists are pretty much the same, except that the first is loaded with indicators of low socio-economic status, and the second is loaded with indicators of high socio-economic status. I read this article once, a parody of The Cosmo Girl. They see men in very narrow stereotypes. I do not like to wear suits. They are and absurd monkey costume, and they are completely impractical. But when I have to do it, I am constantly having attractive young women coming on to me. Stores, restaurants, parking lots, shopping malls, and even on the Stanford campus. What they see is socio-economic status, so they think, and they treat this as evidence of genetic superiority. And yes, it applies in strip clubs as well. And if your socio-economic status is high enough, you don't really need to have much money, and often you can get things without paying for them. One of the motives behind the organization I am building is to neutralize all of this. SJG