tuscl

OTC dancer- but not for extras

travelingthrough
Here is a topic that the more seasoned members of the group have probably encountered, but is new to me. I'm looking to get some advice/guidance on how to handle a new situation. (davids is going to love this!)
I have a new favorite that I have started hanging out with after the club she works at closes. We'll go get food and talk until she has to get home. (a shared car, long story, typical stripper shit.) No extras occurring or even mentioned by either of us. I know she has a boyfriend, and I'm not trying to date her. (I live in a different city, so I only see her a couple of times a month.) I'm not giving her any money outside the club, so it seems to be just a cool friendship.
My problem stems from the fact I have a dancer/friend and I can't separate the two while she can. She'll take off her clothing and rub me for money, and then go out and sit next to me for hours just joking around. I know it's her job and she has learned to be detached. I just haven't figured out how to partition my brain to handle both realities. I like her more as a friend than a dancer, and I sometimes feel that I should stop getting dances from her and just concentrate on the friendship. I know that would only hurt her financially though, and she wouldn't understand my reasoning, since the situation doesn't seem to bother her. Since the club she is at takes a portion of the money she makes on dances, I've also considered seeing if she will do the dances outside the club so that she doesn't lose the cut. (Treading dangerously close to private party territory. I'm afraid of insulting her or giving her the idea that I'm just trying to f*ck her. I'm not, but I'm not opposed to the idea either...) She's pretty level headed and mature (as far a strippers go), and we're almost the same ago, so I'm not a father figure for her. Has anyone got suggestions on how to handle this? Let the comments and rips begin. :)

26 comments

  • travelingthrough
    •
    19 years ago
    SC: It used to be anyone with a little cash could find a willing pair of spread legs at Southside Johnny's. Things have changed in the last couple of years. Still my favorite dive though. (Definitely in the "local bar/dive" category. No comparision to any of the Platinum Plus clubs.)
  • travelingthrough
    •
    19 years ago
    Well, I hope to avoid the dreaded dive into being an RIL. I'm not spending any more money in the club than I ever did, so I hope to avoid the broke part. Hurt, that will come eventually. I have no illusions that this will end up happily ever after. I'm just trying to enjoy the ride while it lasts... Since this isn't an extras situation or a sugar daddy, I'm hoping when the end comes it will be a parting of friends, not a major scene. (Unless SC is right about honesty building trust, and trust spreading legs... Then it will be a whole different ballgame!) LOL!!!
  • chandler
    •
    19 years ago
    SuperDude, I think you're getting melodramatic. Sure, it's bound to end in tears eventually, but predicting that is like coming on here and telling us we're all gonna die someday. TT, if it's as much fun as you say, you're a lucky guy. For now. All I can say is enjoy it while it lasts.
  • SuperDude
    •
    19 years ago
    You are, or soon will be, a RIL. If you don't break this off, right now, you will wind up hurt and broke. She has no use for you beyond transportation and money.
  • AbbieNormal
    •
    19 years ago
    Traveling, One other possibility if you don't want to miss the stage show is to move up to PR when she dances. You can give her one big tip and enjoy, or see how a few tips works with you at the rail instead of a tippers area.
  • travelingthrough
    •
    19 years ago
    Hmm... I enjoy watching her on stage (it is an all nude club), and I don't have any interest in giving that up. She was encouraging me to come up to tip, so we'll have to see how that goes next time. The lap dances aren't awkward, but we usually talk right through them. The enjoyment comment was strictly because we talked less this time, which left me able to concentrate on the naked body rubbing mine, instead of what to say next... I think she understands that now, so it shouldn't be a problem in the future.
  • chandler
    •
    19 years ago
    TT, I'm glad you're feeling better about things, but it sure sounds to me like you're sacrificing fun in the club in order to sustain your afterhours chat affair. You say you "managed to enjoy" her lap dances? It shouldn't be an effort. If you're not driven by an urge, what's the point? Likewise, if you're uncomfortable tipping her at the stage and checking out her goods with a long, lusty stare, I'd say skip that altogether. My advice is to do whatever feels good in the club without making concessions, and if your friendship is genuine, it will continue regardless. If it doesn't, then at least you'll get your kicks, which is what you're there for, I hope. Otherwise, you're left with compromised fun and a compromised friendship, and your situation will keep nagging at you.
  • AbbieNormal
    •
    19 years ago
    One other thing you could do if the stage dances make you or her uncomfortable, aside from FONDL's suggestion, is to watch the dances without approaching the stage and tip her when she gets down. For one thing, that'll probably encourage her to come by promptly after her stage set (if that is something you want). You could also maybe let her know you enjoy watching but didn't want to make her uncomfortable when she's working. The "goodwill" since she stated she felt a little awkward may translate into the LD. Just some thoughts.
  • FONDL
    •
    19 years ago
    This sounds almost exactly like how my ATF and I started out. I used to go see her at the club, get lots of LD's (we once did 16 non-stop and were both laughing our asses off by the end), then went out to dinner when her shift was over. She was like two different people, inside and outside the club or maybe more accurately sitting and talking vs. dancing, and I found that to be really enjoyable. One change I did make though after we became buddies - when she was dancing nude onstage I sat as far from the stage as possible, and when I went up to tip her I maintained eye contact the entire time and never stared at the goodies. I think she appreciated that.
  • travelingthrough
    •
    19 years ago
    OK, one more to bump back up ahead of RL. I hung out with her again this week. A couple of hours in the club, including tipping on stage, and several lap dances. Then we went for a meal and chatted for hours again. I managed to enjoy her dances more this time. (We talked less during them, which helped.) The funny part is that she actually said was a bit self-conscious during her stage dance when I was tipping. Almost like she was closer to me, and we shouldn't be doing things out in public. (Laps in the back room don't bother her at all.) Then she called me last night to tell me she finally got her own cell phone and we can talk more often now. (She had been using other dancers phones to call before, which meant if I wasn't around when she called, I couldn't call back.) I think I am finally starting to get comfortable with the situation. Thanks for the previous advice!
  • travelingthrough
    •
    19 years ago
    Well, she called me just to "say hi" (Do club buddies do that? It wasn't a "come in and spend money on me" kind of call...) I'll see her Tuesday, and let you all know if I manage to keep the customer/friend roles separate.
  • FONDL
    •
    19 years ago
    Shadowcat, that's exactly where I was. And loved every minute of it.
  • FONDL
    •
    19 years ago
    I think that what Traveling is experienceing is pretty common - it's much easier for dancers to separate their two lives than it is for us guys because they do it all the time. My advice - if you enjoy both the friendship and the LDs, and there's no reason why you shouldn't, just relax and go with the flow. I think that where we tend to get into trouble in situations like this is when we try to manage it by setting goals and trying to manipulate the girl into moving in that direction. In my experience that almost never works. Just relax and enjoy, and let whatever is going to happen just happen all by itself. That's most likely what she is doing.
  • Yoda
    •
    19 years ago
    Davids has a point. My advice definitely has a shelf-life and also requires that the feelings be mutual. I have converted a couple of Dancer/Customer relationships to Friendships but it's 2 or 3 cases out of dozens of ladies. It's better to get friendship from friends, Sex from girlfriends and grinding LDs from strippers.
  • chandler
    •
    19 years ago
    JC: You're right. I should have emphasized that he should evaluate her DANCES independently, and let the friendship take care of itself. If they're both genuine, the friendship will last regardless.
  • JC2003
    •
    19 years ago
    I agree with chandler though I believe that's travelingthrough's dilemma: he's having a hard time separating the two.
  • chandler
    •
    19 years ago
    I wouldn't stop buying dances with her because of the OTC thing. Nor would I continue with the dances because of it. I would evaluate the two aspects - dances in the club and friendship OTC - independently, as much as that is possible.
  • travelingthrough
    •
    19 years ago
    Thanks guys. The comments have helped me sort out my thoughts a bit. Seems like it comes down to 1 of 2 things. I either have to suck it up and deal with the customer/friend dicotomy that she seems comfortable with, or I have to find a way to spend time with her without money being involved. I have no intention of paying for her time OTC, as that would completely defeat the point of her being a "friend."
    I think AN is right about asking to meet her OTC as being awkward if the club wasn't the focus or starting point. (Although I visit her city on a regular basis for work, so I'm not making special trips to see her at least.)
    At this point I think I'll just try to accept her terms and see if I can wrap both my big brain and little brain around the situation and see how that goes. I can't see a way to approach her about spending time together without spending money that won't cause a problem.
  • travelingthrough
    •
    19 years ago
    Interesting comments, thanks. Let me try and answer a couple of things that came up. I'm not a "big spender" with her, I just know she isn't making tons of money on the nights I tend to go in. (Slow weekdays only. If I'm a sugar daddy, she is in serious trouble!!) No offense taken JC. I tend to be cynical too. I do feel guilty if I don't get dances from her, since I like her, and I know her $ situation. But the dances feel more like helping a friend out, which is not why I go to a strip club. That is why I was wondering about lap dances outside the club, so that she'd get to keep more of the cash. I'd feel really foolish giving her money for her time inside the club without getting the dances. (That would reaaaaally piss her off, since she is a bit insecure to start with.) SC, you are right about not knowing her long. We've only started hanging out after the club closes the last 2 times I was there. I'd like to transition to 100% friend, no money involved, but I haven't figured out how. Any more ideas?
  • AbbieNormal
    •
    19 years ago
    I really don't think the friend transition is in the cards, sorry. Exactly how would you bring up an OTC meeting without the club as the focus? Offer to meet her after her shift is the only one I can think of, even that seems a bit uncomfortable. Asking for the OTC dances sure isn't going to put her in the friend catagory. Sorry, but I think she'd interpret any move away from the club as looking for extras. Also ask yourself if you'd come from another city a few times a month to see her as a friend if there were absolutely no chance of sex or dances.
  • davids
    •
    19 years ago
    I am tempted to agree with Yoda here, but I think he has already gonna too far down the road of mixing friendship and business with her. Thus I agree with him that she l may not understand the change, or at least woner why it was not a problem sooner. But if he really wants her as a friend than that is an acceptable risk.

    Get a girlfriend. That's the cleanest way to transition her to friend.
  • Yoda
    •
    19 years ago
    Why would you ask her to do dances OTC if you are more interested in her friendship than in her ass? Be honest with yourself here. If it's really about friendship then you need to eliminate money from the equation. That's the only way to find out if she is sincere. Another option is to payher for her time when in the club while you are sitting with her without asking her to dance for you. Again, you need to be honest with yourself about what you want and what she is wiling to offer.
  • davids
    •
    19 years ago
    This one's easy: Get a girlfriend to take of your sexual needs and keep this one as a friend (if you can!)
  • davids
    •
    19 years ago
    I think SC is way off base here: It seems to me pretty clear that this one would be willing to do (paid, of course) LDs for him OTC. She will also continue pretending to be his friend too. (Or maybe she really is a friend. (5% chance.))

    In any case the chance of him offending her by asking is far less than 1%.
  • JC2003
    •
    19 years ago
    If the dancer/friend is too much of a dichotomy for you, stop getting dances from her and just see her as a friend outside the club. If she asks why, tell her.

    You could stop seeing her outside the club if you're more interested in the dancer side of her. Like you said, she already has a boyfriend. She hasn't expressed an interest in having sex with you so you can rule that out.

    It sounds to me like she may be using your feelings for her to guilt you into continuing to buy dances from her. You say that stopping that would "hurt her financially" so I assume you're spending lots of money on her. Then again, I'm a cynical bastard. My apologies -- I don't mean to offend you.
  • travelingthrough
    •
    19 years ago
    Damn RL. Dumping all those posts again.... OK, back up to the top-
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