discussion comment
12 years ago
"...maybe we'll have to turn it into an epic guys' road trip instead."
I strongly recommend you make it into a big road trip instead. I think you might get real bored and disappointed when you wake up at 10am and it's cold and snowy outside and there's nothing to do for the next 8 hours until you feel like going back to a strip club. It's a lot more fun to walk down to the beach, check out the hot ladies, go for a swim, have a nice breakfast, etc.
discussion comment
12 years ago
I dunno, I'm not a big fan of Vegas, and I've been there many times. During the day there's really not much to do, depending on what you like to do. Yeah, you can go golfing if you like that and it's not freakin' freezing outside like it gets in the winter. Or you can drive out to the lake and go boating and stuff. Otherwise you're gonna go gambling, and that's about it. And as far as strip clubs, personally I think they generally suck. Overpriced, low mileage, and you just get the feeling that they're out to suck every penny out of your wallet. But it's Vegas, and if you love it, now's probably a good time since prices are way down.
As far as other places, it's starting to get cold out, and unless you don't mind the cold and the snow, given the choice I'd tend to head to places like Florida, Texas, and the Southwest. Detroit? Maybe the clubs are fun, but the last place I want to be, especially in the winter is freakin' Detroit. But to each his own.
Personally, I'd probably head to Miami. Good weather, beaches, insanely hot chicks, night clubs, lots of stuff to do.
Phoenix clubs are great, but in the "other stuff to do" category it doesn't come close. But if I was going just for the clubs (as I've done before), it's a good place to go. High mileage, hot girls, nice weather.
I would also consider LA even though the OP dismissed it. Though I'm not certain if you can find clubs with exactly all the requirements the OP listed. But in terms of "other stuff to do", there's an insane amount of things to do (beaches, mountains, sports, etc.), great weather (it's in the high 90's and not a cloud in the sky today), and some of the clubs are excellent. But again it depends on what you want to do.
And someone mentioned Providence? As in, Rhode Island? You gotta be kidding.
discussion comment
12 years ago
The OP needs to clarify what he wants if he's gonna get any useful info. Are you looking for a place for a bunch of guys to go where clubs are just part of the entertainment, and you also want nice weather and stuff to do during the day? Or is it just you, and you want to spend 24/7 get VHM lap dances with hot ladies and don't care if it's snowing outside?
discussion comment
12 years ago
"I would put her in the same category as CoCo Austin"
Yeah, exactly. Coco Austin is up on the top of my list of hottest bimbos around. Damn, if I got a dance from her in a strip club I wouldn't last 30 seconds.
discussion comment
12 years ago
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motorheadFat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life
Clearly there are a bunch of older guys here with ATF's who dislike anyone who isn't an older guy with an ATF. And they look for any reason they can to justify themselves. And calling younger guys rude is just one more.
Not being a dancer I can't know how younger guys act in comparison to older guys in general, or whether there even is a difference. But asking a couple of dancers for their input doesn't answer the question either.
Personally, I'm jealous of good looking young guys. I'll be honest. A lot of times I'll see dancers run over to the good looking young guy and wish it was me. But that doesn't cause me to get pissed at young guys in general and look for more reasons to dislike them.
I don't see guys, young or old, acting like dicks in a club. Of course I don't hang out at many clubs with liquor, so I imagine that is a factor. I've never seen a fight, don't recall ever seeing really obnoxious customers giving a dancer a hard time, never heard a dancer complaining about any of the customers.
Really, the only disrespectful behavior I see from customers is, as I've posted before, the disrespectful regulars who lock down the best looking dancers for hours at a time so nobody else can get a dance from them. But that's gonna just piss everyone off, so I won't mention it.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"But your showing yourself to be uncompromising. If your trying to win this argument that's dandy but your just calling everyone who doesn't agree with you stupid. and don't take anyone else's word into consideration"
So tell me, does that same logic not apply to txtittyfan and to rickdugan?
I post pages and pages of rationale and examples, and they both refuse to accept a single word of it, or post a single bit of rational support for their position. Instead, all they provide is "trust me, because I'm a seasoned veteran".
And it's worth noting, BTW, that just about everyone here apparently disagrees with their position, including rogertex's quote from an actual strip club owner.
But you call me out for being uncompromising and showing bad form? Hmm....
discussion comment
12 years ago
Okay, call me dumb, but I don't see why it's a good thing for a dance to use your lap dance time to get off on a dildo. Yeah, I get that it's hot to watch, but hell, I can watch a porn video and see the same thing.
Kind of like dancers who spend the lap dance time using your hardon to get themselves off, instead of pleasing you. Sometimes you get a dancer that maneuvers her clit to ride on top of your bone as she's facing you cowgirl, and spends the whole dance trying to get herself off.
Bad form, IMO...
discussion comment
12 years ago
"It is pretty much a truism anywhere that 10% of the people take up 90% of your time and some SCs may happily choose to forego the income."
Absolutely. There's a story about Herb Kelleher, CEO of Southwest Airlines, who was presented with a problem customer who was always complaining and treating his employees like crap and writing nasty letters and just being a bitch. She kept warning Southwest that if they didn't do what she wanted she'd stop flying with them.
Exasperated, his underlings sent the problem to Kelleher. His response to her? "Sorry to see you go". Some customers just ain't worth the hassle.
No question.
But as you said, that's the small exception. A good manager recognizes that all customers should be, to some extent, "coddled". Of course, you can't please everyone. But a good manager tries to strike a balance. But, for example, saying "fuck you" when a bunch of your dayshift guys ask you to play some different music is moronic. It takes zero effort, and could be beneficial.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Oh, and this is obvious, but I'll say it anyway...
The other option if you're losing money between 11am and noon is to treat those customers really well, and maybe they'll keep coming back, and maybe even tell their friends, and maybe if you manage it right, you'll stop LOSING money from 11am to noon and actually start MAKING money. Maybe you work a little harder to make the dayshift a great place to be, and guys will start streaming in during lunchtime.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Oh, and I thought of one other thing that they might be using to justify their position. If the club loses money during, say, the 11am to noon hour, then of course the manager isn't happy. Let's say the expenses (staff, utilities, etc.) associated with keeping the doors open during that hour are more than the revenues from the 3 customers that come in and pay $10 each during that hour.
So what does the management/owner do? He's regularly losing money from 11am to noon. Well, you can either treat the customers who come in during that time like shit, which means they won't come back, in which case you lose even more money between 11am and noon.
Or, you CLOSE THE FUCKING DOORS between 11am and noon. There's a club I like to go to that doesn't open until 3pm on weekdays. It's in a low rent area, they probably lose money during dayshift, so they don't even open.
There is never a good reason to treat customers like shit. They give you money.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"You can't really make a good hypothesis on one item can you"
You CAN make a good hypothesis when you base it on a fact. The fact is that every business on the planet relies on customers. And it makes more money when it has more customers. And it makes more money when it can keep those customers coming back. That is a fact. That is how businesses operate.
Are strip clubs different? No.
Might a particular club manager be clueless about that simple and basic fact, and in fact treat his customers like shit because he's an idiot and a poor manager? Of course. But that doesn't make it right. Nor does it make it generally true.
The only thing that comes even close to what these guys are proposing is the case where a particular customer is bad for business, and causes damage to the employees or club reputation or whatever. But that is rare in any business, and is certainly not the case in general.
The only other thing that might apply to a few clubs is the desire to change public perception of a particular club, and, for example, give the perception that your club is for high rollers and big spenders. It's called marketing. You market your club as "The Gold Club" or the "Rolex" club, hoping to draw big spenders. You make the interior classy, etc. But is that the average club in the US? Of course not.
And does that mean you treat dayshift customers like crap? Not at all. Unless you're an idiot. They bring free money into the club, and, especially with an expensive "Rolex" club you need that money to pay the lease, to pay for staff, to pay for air conditioning, to pay for lights, etc.
discussion comment
12 years ago
So, Rick, your response is that you have no response, and I just need to trust you and the other senior, experienced guys, and maybe, when I get more experienced, suddenly the light will come on and I'll understand.
Okay. That's pretty clear.
I asked you a simple question. I asked you to explain why you're convinced that it is "reasonable for a strip club manager to treat ANY customer who brings free money in the door like shit". But you can't. You and others believe it's reasonable, but you can't explain why you believe that.
You're right, there's not much more to be said.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"...you are so emotionally invested in your beliefs"
And Rick, I know you desperately want to characterize me as being "emotionally invested" in my beliefs, but it's not emotion, it's being RATIONAL. When someone says something stupid, it's rational to counter that with logic. Which is all I'm doing.
I would be more than happy to admit I'm wrong if you could give me some reason to do so. In fact, I just admitted I was wrong in another thread about the bogus-ness of many of the reviews here. I was convinced that many were bogus, but a lot of experienced guys said I was wrong. Which I was. That's fine, I appreciate the info, and gladly admit I was wrong.
Not a problem for me to admit I'm wrong when I'm given a good reason that shows I'm full of crap. Just give me a good reason...
discussion comment
12 years ago
Rick, look, I know you don't like me because I argued with you. I get it. And I know that, because of that, from now on you'll be taking pot shots at me, no matter what I say. I get it.
But just try to make a rational point instead of just attacking, okay? Just try.
And you can start with explaining why you guys are so convinced that it's reasonable for a strip club manager to treat ANY customer who brings free money in the door like shit.
But you can't. Nobody can. Because it IS stupid. No matter how you slice the lemon, it's stupid. No matter how "seasoned" you are, no matter how many years you've been visiting clubs, it doesn't make sense. Because every business on the planet has a goal to attract customers, and keep them coming back. That's how businesses survive.
discussion comment
12 years ago
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Papi_ChuloMiami, FL (or the nearest big-booty club)
"what are you? crazy jerikson? Apparently you haven't hanged out with many black people have you?"
Steffy, sorry but I can't decode what the fuck you're talking about. My second favorite club in SoCal, and one I frequent, is an all black club in South Central LA. If you're going to start throwing that ridiculous BS about racial bias around, don't even fucking start. I prefer black girls, I love black clubs, I've dated black girls.
Yes, you're right about the black (and Mexican) community being VERY negative about people who snitch. It's insane, but you see it all the time. So yeah, he might get jumped by supa-thick's boyfriend next time he leaves the club. But that anti-snitch attitude is what keeps South Central LA gang crime and freeway shootings going strong. People don't have the balls to snitch. It's freakin' disgusting. I have a lot of respect for people who do the right thing, even if it might be dangerous.
Try it sometime. Grow some balls.
discussion comment
12 years ago
You have to be fucking insane to even consider going to a club like this. There are other clubs down the street, there is no club on the planet that is so good you need to do stupid shit like this to go there.
I agree we should make a list or something to let everyone know that you shouldn't even consider those clubs.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"Txtittyfan still didn't admit he was wrong on point 1? No surprise..."
Dude, there are people in this world, many, many people, who are physically incapable of admitting they are wrong. Absolutely, positively, physically incapable. They will say stuff that a normal person would be embarrassed to say because it's insane (y'know, stuff like 'slicing lemons'), but will never admit they're wrong. But when you try to challenge them they'll just say stuff that's even more insane in an attempt to deflect your challenge. And they'll never, ever, ever admit they're wrong. Because, to them, admitting they are wrong is a fate worse than death.
It's an ego thing. They actually think that admitting they're wrong means they're a bad person, and their egos are far too fragile to allow them to admit they're a bad person.
And in fact, all they really want is for you to act like you agree with them. Even if you clearly don't, and give them a totally sarcastic and meaningless apology, it's enough to make them happy.
The other day the Dustin Hoffmann movie "Rain Man" was on the tube. And the whole sense of the movie was this: we tend to assume that everyone we meet is capable of having a rational interaction, but in fact there are some people who just aren't. And it's incredibly frustrating, but it is what it is.
You ask them "how much does a car cost?" and they reply "$100". Then you ask "how much does a pencil cost?" and they reply "$100. Yeah, $100. And I'm an excellent driver".
You'll never get anywhere with them. They're incapable. Kinda sad, but people are what they are.
discussion comment
12 years ago
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Papi_ChuloMiami, FL (or the nearest big-booty club)
Excellent. And it highlights how stupid she was. She SAW the other dancer do a good job, treat you right, and you rewarded her. As a result, you'll probably be asking the spinner for dances next time.
OTOH, if supa-thick had just done the same as the spinner, and treated you right, she'd probably have made the $40 she wanted, plus made a happy customer who'd be back to see her. Instead she lost her job.
And if it was me, based on the manager's response, I'd not only make that my regular club, but I'd let everyone know what a great place it is. BTW, what club was it? Next time I'm in Miami I'm gonna give it my business.
discussion comment
12 years ago
Okay, txtittyfan, I give up. You're right, I'm wrong, and I'm sorry I challenged you, because you're far more knowledgeable than I ever will be.
Feel better now?
discussion comment
12 years ago
"daytime customers pay the bills, nightime pays their bonuses"
By the way, I think Rogertex probably nailed it with his statement from a club owner.
For his business, apparently daytime customers pay the bills. And those bills are the monthly bills (lease on the building, insurance, etc.) plus the hourly costs for whenever they open the doors (staff, airconditioning, lights, water, drinks, etc.).
To say that daytime customers aren't important to a business is insane. ALL customers are important to a business. The more customers a club has, the more money they make. The more often those customers return, the more money they make. That's why businesses try to not only attract customers, but also make them happy so that they return over and over and over and over.
No owner/manager in their right mind would disregard a paying customer. Because the owner has bills to pay, and has to make a profit.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"Bars/clubs are open during the day because they they have daytime needs to do paperwork, receive inventory and prepare for the night(where they generate the bulk of their income). Daytime revenue primarily goes to offset the expense of these staffing needs."
Dude, with all due respect, you're a moron. You can't be serious.
Let me give you real life example. Club I go to opens at 11am. They have, on staff, a waitress, a manager, a DJ, a bouncer/door guy, and bartender. That's five people.
Now, according to you, they need five people, a waitress, a manager, a DJ, a bouncer/door guy, and a bartender to "do paperwork, receive inventory, and prepare for the night".
Am I hearing you correctly? Receive inventory? Do paperwork?
INVENTORY? What type of inventory? What type of paperwork? And why would they bring on five people, at $8-10 per hour each, for a total RISK of something like $40-50 per hour they have to make up EACH HOUR just to break even?
But more importantly, are you actually serious that it's okay if they don't care about attracting and keeping customers? Are you serious? Basically they're telling dayshift customers "fuck off, we're busy doing inventory and paperwork. Come back in the evening when we give a shit about you".
And what about the clubs who don't open during dayshift? There's a bunch in my area. How do they get that all important inventory and paperwork done?
Dude, seriously, I can't have a rational discussion with someone who's totally irrational.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"You on the other appear to just not get the point"
No, it's that your point is ridiculous. They make money during dayshift. Anyone who enters the door pays a cover. Free money. And maybe a drink. Free money. And maybe a lap. Again, free money.
To argue that it's reasonable for management to not care about, or cater to, guys who bring in free money when they walk in the door, and who could just as easily go down the street to another club and never return, is just stupid.
It takes ZERO effort to change daytime music. ZERO. It also takes little effort to cater to a daytime crowd. How you can justify them treating "non-target", paying customers as not worth their time is just beyond belief. And then to equate that with "maximizing their revenue" is beyond stupid.
Many, many times I've walked out of clubs with at least $100 in my pocket, unspent, because the club sucked. If it hadn't sucked I would have given them my money. Very simple. Happens all the time. But you aren't going to admit anything outside of what you want to believe.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"About 90-95% real, 5-10% fake to get a month's VIP membership."
Really? Well, that's good to hear.
BTW, if you want a laugh, you should check out the review I'm talking about. It's pretty funny. The guy even changed the part that originally read "I had one dancer tell me she was nearly finished with Vet School" to "I had one dancer tell me she was nearly finished with Law School". At least he didn't just copy and paste, he tried to cover his tracks. He was a moron in how he did it, but at least he tried.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"It's not exactly Stockholm syndrome but along the same lines. An attempt to reduce dreaded cognitive dissonance..."
Dude, I have no clue WTF you're talking about.
But I think the answer is more along the lines of this:
It's been said that for most people, decision making is 80% emotional, and only %20 logical. Few people really think, or use logic, to form their beliefs. They believe what their emotions lead them to believe. Facts and rational thinking usually don't factor into it.
So when you get into online discussions, for most people it's all about emotion. Facts and rational thinking just get in the way, and piss people off. And when you confront them with all that rational stuff, it upsets them because that's not how they operate.
They also vote based on emotions, not based on really understanding and evaluating issues. They place their support behind that which agrees with them, or which they decide they "like". Most people, IMO, are really nothing more than very emotional 6-year-olds who never grow up.
Guys here like strippers, therefore they place their support behind them. And the more they like strippers, the more they feel that strippers can do no wrong. She makes me feel awesome, therefore she's totally awesome. Not a lot of thought behind it.
discussion comment
12 years ago
"Oh for fucks sake, the energy it takes to get through to someone like you is exhausting. You want to argue about everything with everyone. Where do you find the energy?"
Wow. Sorry Stiletto. I thought this was a discussion forum. Where you, like, discuss stuff. Which is what I was doing. Am I not allowed to do that? Cuz a bunch of other people were spending just as much time posting their views. But you don't get pissed at them. Maybe it's because you just don't like me because I don't agree with you, so whatever I do is automatically wrong. Yeah, that's probably it.
I'll stop now, because I don't want you to blow a freakin' gasket.