OTC Apprehension - Smart or Overly Anxious

If you don't feel comfortable don't do it. It won't be enjoyable if you're worried.

It would be kind of difficult for a girl to work as a regular in a club, and be able to pull off the kind of robberies you seem to be worried about. That doesn’t mean she doesn’t maybe sneak a few extra bucks or possibly pinch a CC, but an overt bold faced act committed by a person whom is a regular at a club, seems hardly likely.

Fair point, 25. I have heard of instances where club girls set up guys for hotel robberies, but I suppose odds are in the favor of the PL, as word would get out about her shenanigans.

If I am in town, I'm too cheap to pay for a hotel room. I bring em home but only if I know that very well.

It happens a lot and they get away with it. The club has zero liability. It has nothing to do with it. And most men won't file a police report for being robbed by a prostitute. But being set up and assaulted is an extreme example. The most common thing is her getting paid or stealing money and leaving

It's really no different from having your pockets picked in the club

Grow a pair dude. Seriously. If this girl has been dancing in the same club for a while, she doesn't want drama any more than you do.

But if you need added comfort, just do it in a hotel with indoor hallway room entrances. Nobody is going to plan a serious crime in a place full of witnesses and cameras.

Mr Persianility, the good news is just like most men wont call the cops for being robbed by a hoe, most hoes wont involve the cops either. So, if a hoe tries robbing you, you can give her a good ol fashioned KO and get away with that too.
And their pimps are pretty scared too, given that pimping is a felony and, i think if they cross different states to do it, it can be trafficking as well? This is all in addition to the fact hoes with pimps provide scammer esque service to begin with. They’re completely worthless

25 is right. Low probability that the girl who's been dancing at the same club for 5 years and has been boning your ITC for 6 months is also going to arrange a strong arm robbery. If you rent a room at a decent hotel with security, your risks are low. Not zero, but low. Of course, ITC is even more secure, this is one of the benefits of our hobby!

@funontheside the best option IMO are escort agencies. The bigger ones operate like a small company, and if a girl causes any issues you have recourse and can go directly to the agency. Its still safer to use their own location rather than having someone come to your house. Some girls wont even come to a house, only a hotel location.

Half or more of those girls posting as independent on eros/tryst etc are actually pimped out

How many dancers are pimped out in a ghetto city like baltimore? Probably half. it sometimes even seems their pimp sits in the club watching them

One thing to keep in mind is that in most OTC adventures the dancer is taking more risks than the PL. This is especially true if the meet-up happens the first time you meet her.

This isn't dismissive of your nervousness, but simply points out that the risks are far from one-sided.

So, I usually don't try for OTC immediately. I try to see a dancer ITC a few times before asking about OTC. I'm also a PL who likes to chat with the dancers. Even though dancers adopt a persona in the club, that doesn't necessarily stop them from throwing warning signals. Ultimately, I don't ask about OTC until my gut tells me that the dancer is after money sans drama.

In terms of location, I use mediocre, mid-grade hotels. Nothing fancy but also not a rat's nest. There are apps that will be useful for finding discounts.

Ultimately, the reality is that the vast majority of dancers who might do OTC don't want the risks attached to trying knock you out and leave with a kidney on ice. If they're going to do OTC, then they mostly want to do their job, get paid, and go home (like most of us).

If a dancer is going to misbehave, it's more likely to be in the form of dipping into your wallet for an extra "tip". So, don't bring your briefcase full of cash and cocaine to your OTC date.

Rickmacrodong... Yeah many prostitutes are assaulted by clients and not much happens. When the law gets involved its ironically tougher on the prostitute. A prostitute who assaults a customer can get anywhere between 6 months house arrest to 4 years for a first offense. A pimp who has repeated offenses of beating or pulling a weapon on a customer can be out in 4 months. A lot of legal factors come into play. But its pretty much a revolving door the thing in practice. Id argue that most prostitutes have a handler. It doesn't affect the services she gives. The biggest factor with that is the customer and the vibes they give off.

If you live in a city with a lot of customer turnover like a tourist or convention hot spot . Then you can expect to get robbed more than actually getting what you want

The details matter. If you hardly know one another, and she's offering, and she's deciding all the particulars ... then maybe you should think twice. If you've become more comfortable with each other in the club over time, and she's not so particular about the particulars, then maybe that's an easier choice.

Something else to remember is this gets easier with repetition. That's not always a good thing, however. Our guard should always be up. Just like our dicks!

With regards to dancer OTC, IMO you have to get at least one dance from her, maybe a couple 1 song dances before discussing OTC. In the dance show that you are willing to break some rules or okay with her breaking rules. To show youre not a cop.

For hotels you can use priceline… thats the best ive found…

@MrP, how do pimps have an easier time and get out in 4 months? Pimping is a felony in itself, plus trafficking if theyre moving around their hoes across different states. If theyre out in 4 months, they must be hiding the fact they were a pimp?

dayuse.com is a good site for finding cheap, short term lodging at decent hotels.

Rickmacrodong.... They lie. For example. There was a case where a customer refused to pay. So she called her pimp. He threatened the man and shot him. When the police came she said her boyfriend saved her from a rapist. Pimps are arrested a lot but let go because the girls won't corroborate the police's version of events. You can arrest someone for anything. Making charges stick is another thing

He didn't kill him. But the guy wouldn't testify and the girl wouldn't press rape charges. Plus the police in tend to not care about these types of crimes. Inbaome cities they get freebies from providers

The guy didnt testify for being shot , just because he didnt want to admit he saw a prostitute or escort?

That story just further proves how subhuman pimps and their hoes are.

Yeah most men won't testify. They don't want any record of what they did. They don't want anyone finding out. Today prostitution is an act of desperation.

Everything has changed the past few years. End stage capitalism fucked everything over

Why do you have disdain for prostitutes when you hire them? Or talk about pimps so much?

"The game" is a complex subculture

Prostitution is not desperation.. for the girl its a method to make far, far more money than working a typical retail job, without needing to run a business or have a degree. For a lot of these chicks its because of materialism. How else could they possibly afford multi thousand dollar pieces of clothing, shoes, handbags etc unless they either went to school, had rich parents… a rich boyfriend/husband

If you mean desperation on the part of the consumer, thats not true either. For most if not all guys, if you arent a famous celebrity, youll have to pay in some form, directly or indirectly.

I dont hire or deal with pimped out hoes. Theres ways you can find out if a hoe is pimped. For starters theyre more likely to scam, more likely to clock watch. Pimped hoes dont provide “gfe” or “pse” services. Thats one easy way to weed them out.

Most prostitutes have pimps. Agencies are basically trafficking organizations that skirt the law. But honestly most customers don't care. It doesn't affect them.

Prostitution is an act of desperation. Some hooker with a designer bag fake or real doesn't change that. The things you see on social media aren't reality.

Prostitutes provide what you pay for and what they feel comfortable doing with a customer. If she won't do it with you. It's you.

You can't tell who is or isn't trafficked or has a pimp when you're just paying to fuck. They won't tell you anything.

They won't tell you the truth

So whats stopping the prostitute from working at mcdonalds, or an office job or many other jobs?

If a girl can make $300 an hour as a hoe, meanwhile standard jobs pay $15 an hour, nobody can genuinely say that prostitution is desperation. If its a street ho willing to be a prostitute for $20 an hour, that is desperation.

Regarding your last paragraph, no lol. Thats not how it works. Theres prostitutes who wont do certain things with 100 customers. It isnt because those 100 guys had issues. Its because the prostitute is following her pimps rules.

You dont need to be told anything. As i said, if they dont tongue kiss, that factor alone means they are likely pimped. If they dont let you eat their pussy, that’s an obvious sign of being pimped. At minimum a boyfriend pimp. Obviously they wont answer honestly just from you verbally asking. You can use several other cues to figure out if shes pimped.

And if you do want to get a pimped hoe to bend her rules and cheat on her pimp, itll take repeat visits and tons of money spent for the possibility of that happening. A lot of time and investment for little benefit.

You're either trolling, delusional or on the spectrum.

A girl will do what she's comfortable doing with you. Her life is her business. Making up what it scenarios about it is pointless.

Stripper I know somewhat yeah that’s a slam dunk. It’s the seeking stuff where you haven’t met yet where you gotta do FaceTime, meet and greet get that feel. I would stay away from any hood rat shit. Just pay the extra to not deal with that.

Also where do they live where you picking them up at? I used to do that going the south Bronx, Brownsville Brooklyn, Irvington NJ, west Philly. While it went over alright I ain’t doing that shit no more.

Lol Mr P, so to clarify, youre saying girls who are pimped out, behave exactly the same, and provide the exact same quality of service as girls who dont have pimps? IMO youre trying to normalize pimped out hoes and hoping you can convince guys on here to accept scummy pimped hoes when they could see someone far far better in every way possible. Pimped hoes are subhuman scum, regular hoes are regular girls, its just that simple.

No, the service level of an escort or hoe is not based on how attracted she is to the guy or what she’s comfortable doing with each client. You clearly haven’t read reviews of escorts who provide GFE or PSE services where they provide repeatedly good service to 20, 30, even 50 guys. It doesnt mean they’re attracted to every one of those guys. GFE providers usually charge more so its an experience the guys are paying for.

A pimped hoe, even a pimped stripper, will have all kinds of rule’s making it a mechanical experience.

Its not a good look for you to be defending pimped hoes considering several people think youre Icee, and that guy was known to be a guy who was pro pimped hoes and basically thought its fine for hoes to scam and rob clients.

I’m probably dumb and underlying anxious, because I’ve done OTC meetups with dancers, sometimes on their turf, the night of or day after first meeting. Seems relatively risk-free compared to online escorts. The dancer doesn’t know that you won’t contact LE if things go seriously sideways and she’ll be a lot easier to track down than some rando with a fake profile and burner phone working out of a hotel room

“Underly anxious”

I bring up OTC only after I've seen a girl at work a number of times and we've developed a rapport with each other. We'll meet, chat a bit, do some dances and maybe but not always more. If I like her, I'll usually say I'd like to see her again and ask if she has a schedule. I don't usually go back specifically to see her on a day she said she'd be working, but it lets her know I'm a regular customer and looking for a regular stripper. When I see her again, if things go well again, we'll exchange numbers. Then I might make a plan to see her ITC at a specific day/time. If that goes well, that's when I might ask about OTC. Another path to OTC is often the ride home. If I'm at the club when she's leaving, I'll offer a ride home. Then after that goes off without drama, meeting up OTC is less of a leap.

I don't do background checks or a lot of research to try to find out about the girl, although I almost always pop a girls number into google and if I get back online escort ads I delete it. I don't stress about a hotel, or being vague about where we'll meet or shit like that. I invite her to my house. Often, they need a ride, so I'll offer to pick them up and they tell me where they live. We're both taking risks, and we both know it.

I've never had any serious issues bringing strippers to my place. I've had more problems with civi girls I either picked up in bars or had relationships with. The kind of issues I typically have with strippers are from things like spilling drinks on the couch or carpet. Occasionally they'll overstay and it's a little awkward telling her to hit the road. But, no stripper has ever stolen a thing or attempted any sort of violence. That's despite at least one of them having an attempted murder charge and freely admitting that she stabbed the dude in the chest with scissors. That girl was actually a favorite I saw for years.

Am I taking some significant risks? Yup. Do I think I'm more likely to be assaulted in the parking lot of a strip club or some other random place I go than by the stripper I bring home? Yup. Am I even more likely to be injured in a car accident on my way to work? Probably. When I'm out 4-wheeling, boating/fishing/diving, skydiving/bungie-jumping, etc? For sure.

But I don't live my life holed up in my basement in fear. I assess the risk and what reasonable precautions there are to mitigate it and then decide if its worth it to me. All the things I listed I've decided are worth the risk to me.

I do Google phone numbers because that's easy, low-hanging fruit. Also, one time it led me to information that caused me to veer away from OTC.

Rick - Pimps have ONE rule for their stable girls....bring home maximum amount of money in the shortest time possible. Well, that, and don't steal from me or defect.

If a girl need to kiss, be DATYd, etc, she will...pimped or not.

I've had spur of the moment offers in Vegas, Tampa and NJ clubs. Want me to come to your room after work. One time in Vegas it was a duo. No thanks. Too much risk of getting ripped off or rolled.

I've had successful, long term OTC setups. Some for 5 and even 15+ years. In all cases they are with girls I've had many ITC experiences. Sometimes for years. And in almost all cases I've brought the OTC subject up first. Cut out the middleman, less time pressure, no house fee, more comfortable etc. I've never felt unsafe. All sessions were a hotel room of my choosing.

Interactions with women and with p4p in particular will be different for everyone. With urban culture blurring the lines between dating and prostitution and the economy, its a whole different game than just a few years ago. But you have to evolve with the game. The thing is don't overthink it. Go by what feels good to you and learn to distinguish between your intuition and your fears. You'll be treated by how you come across.

Dolfan do you not have expensive stuff lying around the house that they could be tempted to take?

Also you mentioned these girls usually need a ride, are they always getting rides to and from work- they dont have their own car?

As far as offering a girl a ride home or so on, if its the first time youve met them they may not trust a client enough to tell them where they live.

Funontheside thats not how pimps nowadays work especially boyfriend pimps. A boyfriend pimp isnt just a pimp hes also her boyfriend. Also pimps are worried about their girls falling in love with clients. Thats why they will try putting rules in place so the girl doesnt get too intimate or attached to a client. No kissing, no daty, no getting turned on so no nipple stimulation,

Whats wrong with a stripper also posting online escort ads on the side? This is one of the modern day problems… guys want an OTC girl yet also want an OTC girl who doesnt bang any other guys OTC.

The smarter girls charge a huge, huge fee for that sort of exclusive arrangement. If you give the dancer any sort of indication that you dont want her seeing other guys OTC, she’ll probably lie to you about it anyway. I have no idea where people are finding these dancers willing to be exclusive with 50, 60, even 70 year old men.

Rick - especially in cities, people don't always own cars. Also, Ubering is safer after drinking. Giving rides home is not all that uncommon. I've done it mutiple times...and each time I did it, it paid off....both immediately and longer term. They also don't always have you take them "home"...it's to another club, flophouse, or "near" their home.

Many here are right....despite some fears of robberies/theft, girls actually often do understand the risk of alienating repeat business. So, often, they won't steal. And, it's probably not all that much more risky than pissing of an ex-girlfriend, and having her return for revenge.

Okay i see. Whats the issue with escort ads? Also where are people finding these dancers willing to be exclusive with 50 year old and even 70+ year old men. It seems to be a criteria for many on here that in order for a dancer to qualify as their CF or ATF, they have to have some sort of loyalty and exclusivity with them

Yes, I have stuff laying around the house they could take. No, they never touch it. I'm not totally reckless about things. I don't leave Cartier watches on tables near the door, but I might leave a Samsung smart watch sitting on a charger or even a couple hundred bucks sitting around in the open. Sure, I'd be annoyed if that shit walked off, but its not like it would kill me.

Many girls don't have cars or at least don't drive to work. The most common scenario for needing a ride is because they car pooled with a friend who made other plans and left them to fend for themselves. But there's plenty of other reasons why they might not drive, having or not wanting to get a DUI, recent accidents or repossessions, no insurance, etc.

I'm sure some girls are reluctant to tell me where they live, and those girls probably simply say no thanks to the offer. Usually though, they're fishing for the offer when they mention needing to find a ride. I don't press the issue, if the topic comes up I'll usually offer but that's it. Like funontheside said, giving a girl a ride home is quite often a good investment. It's right up there with buying her a meal. The two aren't mutually exclusive either, it's not unheard of for the ride home to add a stop for a bite and or a stop at my place. Even when it doesn't it certainly helps ease into it.

The reason I avoid girls with online ads isn't because I'm seeking exclusivity. I suppose I do prefer a girl with some sort of standards. But moreso I simply don't like girls who operate like escorts. Girls who place ads online act like escorts and I don't enjoy that. If that's what I wanted, I'd just find an escort online.

And who said I was 50 or 70 years old? Or that they're exclusive? I'm not, and they're not.

I don't like online ads either. They'll post ads on any site they can and it's usually never the girl herself that you interact with. Its usually her pimp or folk.

Not necessarily you Dolfan, but other users. Theres a guy over 70 years old who has an ATF who’s exclusive, and he also only pays her like $200 or $150 per meet! Guy claimed to also be fat, bald, with a small dick

Icee they were discussing dancers in the club, who provide their phone number which then potentially pulls up online escort ads. Not online escort ads in general…

"Theres a guy over 70 years old who has an ATF who’s exclusive, and he also only pays her like $200 or $150 per meet! Guy claimed to also be fat, bald, with a small dick"

Cacaplop. He sounds as believable as your troll ass

"the south Bronx, Brownsville Brooklyn, Irvington NJ, west Philly"

damn muddy!!! you went to all those areas and you're still in one piece?

He's still in one piece because he spent so much time in those places and knows how to deal with things as a result of his time spent there.