Vaccine Question..

Fuck the vaxx. You are insane to take the jab. It is not even a vaccine, it is a gene therapy and it has not been approved by the FDA. I have been avoiding clubs cause I don't want to be around vaccinated dumb asses. Look up shedding. Vaxxed dumb asses can actually shed the vax onto non vaccinated smart people. I basically have not visited my current fave at Bare Elegance because her day job made her get the vax. I've just been bouncing around with a couple non vaxxed sugar babies OTC who are vaccine free.

Well, if you enjoy willful stupidity, definitely avoid being vaccinated. It might even improve the gene pool.

On the other hand, if you value your life, your future longevity and your future quality of life, then by all means, get the vaccine. Neither I nor my wife experienced anything more than minor tiredness after the second shot. The fact that they don't manufacture the vaccine with dead or weakened viruses means that you cannot catch COVID from the vaccination.

I got the Pfizer vaccine. I had some tiredness the day after both shots. In my case it was kinda weird because I was tired but couldn't sleep, which made me more tired. A little frustrating. I made up for it by buying a nice bottle of scotch and throwing down a few glasses. Slept like a baby after that. Other than that, no side effects whatsoever.

Its a bunch of paranoid boomer perverts on here from what I gather. That and a few conformist Millennial sheep. They believe they are all going to die from an illness with a 99.7 percent recovery rate.

Thousands have already died from this "vaccine." Who knows what will happen to people in a year, 2 years, 10 years. Do your research, don't believe the ad council or politicians or Google search.

Why is the establishment pushing this so hard? Is that not a red flag itself?

Why take medicine when you aren't sick?

Who profits from billions of people taking these vaccines?

Ask yourself that.

The most hilarious part is the people saying they were "only sick for a few days" after the vaccine. Seriously? Most people who get Covid gave less effects than that.

The media has literally brainwadged people with unwarranted fear for 15 months.

Yes you could get Covid and get really sick. You could also get hit by a falling tree branch walking down the street. Thats called "life."

Humanity has lost its collective marbles over the past 15 months.

Coming to TUSCL for medical advice is something that I'll never do.

It’s hilarious that anti-vax supporters will say “do your research “ then categorically advise “but don’t believe anyone who disagrees with my advice”. If you are not a research scientist you cannot even understand the research that’s been presented so you have to trust someone’s opinion. So whose opinion is more trustworthy? 99% of the scientific and medical community or the talking heads at Fox and Newsmax?

Wow, a lot of stupid coming out. Gene therapy? Are you aware of how hard the body fights foreign nucleic acids? We can't deliver gene therapy half the time when we want to, let alone with a molecule like mRNA with a super short half life.

Dave, show me some peer review that thousands have died from the vaccine. Infowars and its ilk don't count.

Don't have polio? Don't know anyone who had polio? Thank vaccines.

These vaccines have been extensively tested.

Get the fucking jab.

images.app.goo.gl

Besides, you could win a MILLION DOLLARS!

Taken lots of vaccines in my life including this one; no BFD.

BTW I have had family members die from COVID and young healthy friends get very sick with long lasting effects...... fucking Wuhan Lab.

@ Tet - That picture is funny.... and sadly true; idiot Anti-Vaxers.

@latinalover69, You are wise to avoid strip clubs. Since being fully vaccinated, I have been "shedding" on strippers every chance I get.

Considering the numbers of Americans who have gotten the vaccine already - it seems a bit excessive to think it’s super dangerous and something to avoid at all costs.

I think the politicians who decided to stir up constituencies over approaches to combating the virus have done a huge disservice to the country. This is one of those times when the country needs to unite - to stop this virus. Infighting benefits nobody - and it likely stalls efforts to return to normalcy.

The vaccines are safe and effective. I’ve gotten the Moderna vaccine and I’m glad I did.

I received pfizer. Arm hurt after the first one. Golfed after the second. I get a flu vaccine every year, I am almost 64, I smoke weed daily and drink too much. Seems kind of dumb to draw the line in the sand here.

"Coming to TUSCL for medical advice is something that I'll never do."

Well I suppose that is directed at me. I haven't asked for medical advice here I asked if people didn't get the shot, why not? That's all.

Any medical advice I've seeked has come from from doctors, nurses, and aides from the Cleveland Clinic, one of the country's best and most respected medical institutions which happens to be where I receive any medical treatment I need. I have questioned many of them to get their reasoning and opinions.

The main thing that has made me hesitate regarding the shot is this. The Cleveland Clinic mandates that all employees get the flu shot every year yet they leave the choice of the Covid shot up to the individual. None have been able to completely answer why the contrary policy exists. Most I have spoken with received the shot because of the nature of their work of being in close contact with people that are often there seeking treatment for an ailment. Some have said that they wouldn't have vaxxed if they weren't in the medical field.

I have been careful since this pandemic started last year but I have been out and about almost every day sometimes in crowded situations and I'm still in limbo trying to make the right choice for me. My problem seems to be that I see both sides of the coin. It's not as right or wrong as many are trying to portray it to be.

Once again I am not asking for advice, just asking reasons why the people that have held off vaxxing made that choice.

^ here in Florida the branches of the Cleveland Clinic required all eligible employees to get a vaccine

That hasn't happened here twentyfive. Another perplexing situation.

Don’t have an answer for you, I got vaccinated in early March got the Pfizer and other than some short term arm soreness and I was tired for a few hours after the second shot other than that nothing else.

Don't get the vaccine! When I got the Covid vaccine, Bill Gates put a microchip in me. Now a creepy billionaire is watching me 24/7.

Only about 37-38% of the country is fully vaccinated (completed both shots). No way will we get to 75%. Look at vaccinations by age and it highly skews towards older folks. I find it amusing that there are fast food chains coaxing people to get the vaccine with offers for free French fries (Shake Shack) and free donuts (Krispy Kreme). Obese people are more at risk for coronavirus, but they want to make them even fatter?

All of the strippers I've talked to over the last 15 months were not too worried about the virus. If they got it, they would recover seemed to be their attitude. I have seen almost none wear masks in clubs that were supposedly requiring masks. Young people don't want to waste an hour or two of their time to get vaccinated. I am dating a 22 year old, and she has absolutely no interest in getting vaccinated, even though I would prefer it for peace of mind.

The antigens produced by the vaccine do not last forever (some experts say six to eight months), so it is likely further vaccination/boosters will be needed.

Got my first shot of the Pfizer vaccine yesterday.

@jackslash, we carry devices so that creepy billionaires can track us already.

@sinclair, these are just the first generation of vaccines. I'm sure we are developing some that will cover new strains, generate longer lasting antibodies, etc. But I'll watch the data and be first in line for anything new that works.

@sinclair My suspicion is that it “highly skews towards older folks” mainly because they’ve had a longer time line to get the vaccine I’m sure as the benefits become obvious (the ability to attend events, travel etc. ) More likely we will get many more vaccinated and I believe we will reach 75% or more in due time.

Most healthcare clinics require employees to receive the annual flu vaccination. My friends in the military complained of side effects from other rare vaccinations against polio, malaria, and other diseases when deployed overseas. Seems kind of silly not to require those groups to receive the COVID vax as well.

My line is simple: you don't have to be vaccinated, but you do have to give up certain activities if you don't. We did not eradicate smallpox and polio without vaccines.

Foot note: some people do die of anaphylaxis following the smallpox vaccination. However, if either that or polio started making significant resurgence (and it will be because of idiot anti-vaxers if they do), I will risk that as well if offered vaccination.

Look at is this way. Ever watch the Walking Dead? I Am Legend with Will Smith? Do you really want to live through something like that? If we all turn into zombies I want to be one of the first to go. Had a good run, don’t want to eat cat food from a can and run for the rest of my life so I’ll take the vaccine thank you.

Are you obese? If youre fat and antivax do you really care about your health? same with fat people that are antimask...

It’s a very simple risk/reward calculation.

Are you old, fat, or have a chronic health condition ? Get the vaccine.

If not, don’t rush to get it.

In Arizona, it looks like about half the population will get vaccinated. Probably another 20% have already had CoVid and have natural immunity. That’s good enough to bring active cases to nearly zero.

@OSU-

There's still a stockpile of 63 million unused doses of hydroxychloroquine -- more than enough for both you and @Mark93. I say forgo the vaccine and we'll give a Darwin award posthumously.

^ That finalizes it, a former Calcutta alley whore who takes it up the ass and is in the country illegally has spoken. Cheers rummy! Lol

^^^ lol to that Calcutta alley whore!

I have not for the simple reason that I am currently living in Holland and my age group (49) has not been called up yet. Likely mid June, crossing my fingers!

I know that I shouldn’t but…

I’m going to strictly attempt to speak to and answer the OP’s question rather than argue with or try to convince anyone about what they should or should not do.

All medical decisions should always be driven by a risk/benefit analysis. Does the risk outweigh the benefit or not? To date, I have not been stuck. That is by choice.

I don’t deny that the virus exists. I would venture to say that I, probably more than most anyone here, have known more people (more than twelve, less than twenty, mostly physicians who were exposed early on without sufficient PPE) who have died FROM Covid-19. I don’t say that as a dick measuring exercise and for those that do have a higher tally than I then you have my sincere sympathy.

So why haven’t I chosen to get stuck? I did not vote for Trump nor am I an “anti-vaxxer” which is just a dismissive term used to silence people. I’ve had vaccinations for damn near everything including updating my TDap during this “crisis”. I take what I think is necessary and/or beneficial to my situation. I never get a Flu shot because I don’t consider it beneficial or necessary for me.

I’ve watched the development of this “crisis” very closely from the very beginning. The data is clear that this has been grossly overhyped and the vulnerable/at-risk are now well known. I don’t believe that I need a vaccine for Covid-19 anymore than I need an annual flu shot. That is my informed medical decision with regards to my health.

I am however of the belief that international travel will be largely impossible without a vaccination and that is extremely important to me. Every country has the right to control their national borders and I believe that most will make it a requirement for entry. For that reason and that reason alone I have been watching and will eventually get vaccinated. The first question has been when will the world open up because there is no reason for me to take the shot if it still won’t be possible to travel freely.

The second and more important question to this discussion is which vaccine to take. You see when people say “take the vaccine” they are showing their ignorance. There is not “the vaccine” but rather numerous vaccines. I’ve watched the developments and read what literature is available, talked with practicing physicians and paid attention to the roll outs. Choosing which vaccine is safest has been my focus. They are all experimental, none are approved and all are “authorized” for emergency use only. It’s still a question of risk/benefit but none of them are “proven” to be “safe” and any doctor who says they are should have his license taken away.

Normally anecdotal evidence has little value but in this case it has been a deciding factor in my decisions to date. Of the first eight people that I knew personally who got vaccinated four had the standard mild, nothing to worry about symptoms. The other four were a different story. The very first one was a 55 y/o female suffering from the effects of a previously contracted tropical disease (thus why she was at the front of the line). She immediately dropped to the floor in anaphylactic shock. Fortunately she was in a hospital and not a grocery store. The RN used her Epipen, she was sent straight to the ER, two days in ICU and three weeks bed ridden at home before she recovered. Next was a 65 y/o female (the wife of my now retired former physician) who had never had a nose bleed in her life until the day after her vaccination when she experienced seemingly uncontrollable bleeding (it has not recurred). Next was a 28 y/o very healthy female who experienced complete loss of vision in one eye for six hours immediately after her vaccination. The last of the eight was a 68 y/o male who happens to be my personal physician. He ended up in bed, unable to even get up for two days until he recovered.

After his experience I asked my doctor for his advice. At the time he told me that if I didn’t intend to travel that I should not get vaccinated. If I wanted to travel then I should wait for the J&J vaccine to be authorized and made available. I followed his advice with the addition of waiting for a couple of million other lab rats to take it first when it hit the streets. Clearly that was a wise decision based on the subsequent blood clot issues.

So I do not consider any of the current vaccines available in the States to be safe enough in relation to the (still) potential benefits. I have looked at other vaccines around the world and considered going to the UAE to get the Russian Sputnik V but dismissed that thought. Cuba has two of their own vaccines that they will give to anyone who comes but I don’t know anything about them and don’t know that any country would recognize them as legitimate vaccinations anyways. And then there is the ethical question of going offshore to get a vaccine knowing you are taking from a limited supply in a country that doesn’t have the money the US has to provide for their own population. And I do believe that there are many people who would benefit medically from being vaccinated so taking from them is a non-starter for me. I also know that I could obtain fake documentation saying I’ve been vaccinated but that just isn’t in my DNA.

As it stands now I am awaiting the release of Novavax and will again wait for a couple of million other lab rats to take it before I do and then only if international travel is returned to a somewhat normal state.

I’m not going to go into the nonsense of me being a danger to others or the thoroughly discredited “asymptomatic” Typhoid Mary or the fear mongering “variants” (there are already hundreds of variants, that’s what a virus does).

To the OP, you should know that you are not alone in being hesitant. During Senate testimony the heads of the NIH and CDC were just asked under oath how many of their employees were vaccinated and they both estimated that it was only about 60% (despite having head of the line priority for months). That is no doubt a high estimate but tracks with estimates for medical professionals nation-wide. Again I am not giving advice nor do I want to argue with some uneducated office boy parroting the propaganda of the day. I hope this answers the question posed and I would encourage you to do what’s right for you.

Great post BabyDoc! Well thought out and said my man, I'd give you a dozen likes if I could!

I should have said great post that addresses many of my concerns.

I've no regrets about receiving the Moderna vaccine as soon as it was made available to me. I had about 24-36 hours of flu-like side effects, and nothing more. As a matter of personal curiosity, I'm adding an antibody test to my next annual panel to see how effective it may have been.

I avoid taking meds I don’t need to as a “preventive measure” – back in the 90s I took the flu-shot for the one-and-only time – I was in my 20s and a new doctor I was seeing kinda recommended I’d take it and I thought “hey what can it hurt”; a little insurance seemed like a good idea – well I got sicker than I’d even been in my life – in retrospect it was a bad choice on my part b/c I was young and healthy and rarely got sick – after that I never took the flu-shot again and I rarely get sick from a cold and def not a severe cold/flu – over the years I’ve talked with people that have had a similar bad reaction to the fly-shot.

Thus I wasn’t gung-ho on taking the Covid-vax – I kinda went back-and-forth but finally decided to take it – most people that are not seniors seem to pass the virus just fine but you always hear cases of someone younger dying from it although I never really took a close look at the #s in terms of ages; I kinda didn’t wanna be one of the unlucky exceptions – another reason I opted for the vax are the reports of people having long term effects from the virus, and this was probably what tilted me into getting the vax although again I didn’t closely look at these #s.

I got both my Pfizer shots on Fridays – after the 1st one I slept all day Saturday and almost all day Sunday (Su I didn’t wake up till about 6pm) – I didn’t sleep all the way thru but felt tired and stayed in bed watching TV or listening to the radio and I would doze-off for a few hours at a time during the day. For my 2nd-shot I didn’t feel the same symptoms as my first shot and slept normally but I did feel sluggish for the next week.

There's very little info on Covid vaccine deaths - Tucker Carlson asks the question - take it FWIW:

foxnews.com

^ We'll have the usual twerps that will bad mouth that link because it's FOX and Tucker Carlson but I think that's an excellent opinion piece, thanks Papi!

"I'm adding an antibody test to my next annual panel to see how effective it may have been."

I'm planning on getting an antibody test as well in the future. I actually wanted to do it before my vaccine to see if I'd already gotten it at some point and been asymptomatic but I didn't know where to find one.

Just got my second shot last Thursday. Arm soreness and some fatigue. I took like 3 naps the day after that second dose. The first dose was pretty similar. Nothing serious.

I'll add that I never took a flu shot until the first time this past October. All of the previous years without a flu shot and I never caught the flu even after being jammed in rooms with others during various trade shows and public events every winter. Fact is I don't recall ever having the flu during my adult life, I was probably an early teen or younger the last time I caught the flu.

The reason I decided to get a flu shot this time was that if I did start showing symptoms of sickness that maybe I could eliminate the flu being among the possibilities of what I caught. Anyway right or wrong that was my reasoning.

I actually got an antibody test a week before my first shot just to make sure - no way I'd take the vaccine if I already had antibodies - I think I heard the antibodies from the virus are better than the ones from the vaccine (and some docs say it may not be a good idea to add a vaccine if one already has antibodies which makes sense to me) - I got my antibody test at Quest Diagnostics - it was easy to sign up online and I got my results in a day or two (came back negative) - I don't recall if it was free or if it was charged to my insurance.

I debated posting on this since TheeOSU has a bit of a “rivalry” with me but this seems like a sincere question so I’ll give a sincere answer.

It is certainly rational to have questions about a relatively new set of vaccines. That said, I urge you to just ask your doctor. I’m sure you can send an electronic message to you doctor through the electronic charts system. Frankly, I think you’re overthinking the question. It is impossible at the point to be 100% sure but you can certainly ask the your doctor’s gut feeling.

If you want an additional opinion a pharmacist may be a good source. At this point it isn’t horribly difficult to get in most places and pharmacists will have seen the reactions of many people.

It just seems to me that pondering questions like “why doesn’t Cleveland Clinic require COVID vax for workers?” is just muddying the water. Even if your understanding of the Cleveland Clinic’s policies are correct (and twentyfive says the contrary for the Florida hospital) there may be plenty of reasons. Ultimately, I would say that if you’re still unsure based the widely available the best place to go is a gut check from your doctor.

Finally, remember that your doctor’s gut check isn’t final - not like you can’t wait a little longer based on your own gut if he says “yeah, I’d get it.”

As far as anecdotes, I was fine with Pfizer. Slightly tired after first dose and totally fine after second. With only one exception, none of my family or friends reacted particularly negatively. Negative reaction was a fever and some aches. I know people who’ve had all three vaccines.

I debated adding this, but here goes - one thing that surprises me is that it isn’t that hard to find actual medical literature that is simple and well written. My problem with the Tucker Carlson link is not that it is Carlson or Fox but rather that it is not a medical professional, be it M.D., M.P.H., Pharm.D., etc

Letters after your name don’t mean you’re right, but when people write in the medical literature they give their true name, their professional affiliation, and disclose potential conflicts of interest. For example, the following:

jamanetwork.com

Was something I found after about 5 minutes of googling. It is short, easy to read, and asks a simple direct question (although it only focuses on the mRNA vaccines, not J&J). It was written by medical professionals who disclosed any potential COIs, not a TV personality. To be fair to Carlson, he does acknowledge that VAERS data he quotes has issues. However, it is also easy to find criticism of Carlson’s claims regarding VAERS - like here statesman.com

At the end of the day the quoted Journal of the American Medical Association data seems more consistent with my experience (i.e., the fact that out of about 15 people whose comments regarding the vaccine I remember there was one issue) than with BabyDoc who knew of four strong adverse reactions out of eight. Maybe BabyDoc is just an outlier - but 50% adverse seems really high to me.

Yes, a couple vaccines have been associated with blood clots. But guess what else is associated with blood clots, and at orders of magnitude a higher rate? That's right, COVID.

The plural of "anecdote" is not "data." All the vaccines in the US have tens of thousands of patients.

There is very little reason for most people not to get vaccinated. I chose Moderna because it was the first available appointment, but I view it and Pfizer as virtually identical. I'd take the extra protection over single-dose convenience.

Papers, Comrade !

Oregon has lifted its mask mandate for people who have been fully vaccinated against the coronavirus, but is requiring businesses, workplaces and houses of worship to verify the vaccination status of individuals before they enter buildings without a mask.

"All of the strippers I've talked to over the last 15 months were not too worried about the virus."

A lot of the strippers I know were terrified of the idea of getting the virus. Especially the ones with kids. Ages were 20's and 30's mostly.

I know that one manager of a well known Atlanta club is out with Covid. The dancers that I talked to didn't even know it.

I saw some fear mongering anti vaxxer claiming it would cause sterility.

And it hurt a helluva lot less than my vasectomy.

So, there's that.... Maybe... (maybe not...)

Got mine. Side effects very low.

Typical of TUSCL this thread has veered off from my original intent when I started it but I will respond to a couple statements.

I was going to discuss this with my doctor during my check up which was set for late April then moved back to late May. Then a couple weeks ago they called me to re-schedule again so now I won't see him till early September. All they'll tell me about the changed appointments is that he's taking a leave of absence and all of his patients have been pushed back. I told the scheduling girl that I felt like he was letting his patients down but since I like the guy and have been very comfortable discussing things with him I'd wait instead of seeing a couple other doctors offered up as earlier options but I did call back after starting this thread requesting to speak to a nurse from his office since I did not have the option of speaking with him.

While speaking with a nurse and explaining my thoughts she agreed with most of what I said but when I asked her what I already knew, yes Clinic employees are NOT mandated to take the shot and she did not know why the decision to not force them to was made. I then asked if she took the jab, her response was that she didn't share her health matters with anyone except close family so if she did or didn't is unknown but my gut tells me that she would have said if she did.

So that's my situation, I'm still in a holding pattern but collecting data and opinions from many people I know and even some that I casually met but ended up having conversations with. I'm still leaning towards getting jabbed but won't do it unless and until I feel more confident about it.

I have not been vaccinated and do not plan to unless it is required for international travel. I have been tested for antibodies and I have them due to having Covid in December. I honestly believe this virus has served its purpose and will die out soon anyway

Just to share, I had Covid in early January, not as bad as some, mostly respiratory in symptoms. Had Moderna 26 days after testing negative. Had the 2nd shot 6 weeks after that. First shot caused a slight fever half the next day but nothing else. 2nd shot caused fever half the next day and a feeling of being a little disoriented the 2nd day. I'm retirement age but still work.

I have not gotten the vaccine yet. The short development time is a huge concern for me. The long term effects are yet unknown. If I had weakened immune system, I may have made a different decision. Also, all I hear and see from the CDC seems like propaganda "the vaccine is safe", but never any explanation of how and why it's safe. Is it really "safe" for everybody? Maybe, maybe not. Under what conditions is it not safe? The CDC does not seem to know the answer, all they say about the severe reaction cases, (blood clots), is that they are investigating. They have been investigating for months. Does it really take that long to compile this data? For now, I'll trust my own immune system since I am low risk for covid.

Get the shot. It's no biggie. Covid vaccine good. Death or long haul Covid-19 bad. Variants arising from non-vaccinated people bad. People infecting those that can't get vaccinated bad. I got the Pfizer vaccine back in April. My arm was sore for about a day after the first shot, and sore for about 3 days after second shot. But no temp or tiredness. Everyone seems to have a different reaction. Looking forward to more mongering and travel without worry that I might win the Covid lottery and die. Too bad car rental prices are through the roof. It's gotten to the point where taking an Uber everywhere is less expensive than renting a car for a day or two.

Serious question Cowboy: why do you think you’d understand the safety data?

I’m not saying this to insult you, but really understanding the available data would require much greater background than the average person has. Intelligence alone isn’t enough. You might well be able to crank through the info if you spent a few years learning the background material, but even a very intelligent person simply doesn’t have to tools to really evaluate the data themselves.

Frankly, the average M.D. or D.O. probably doesn’t have the background to really evaluate safety of the vaccines in a rigorous framework, but I think they are likely to have a reasonable gut feeling.

TheeOSU’s way of going about this by asking a nurse an indirect question isn’t what I’d do, but I suspect the truth is that what he really wanted was a reason to feel good about not taking the vaccine. Which is fine, though it would have been more sensible to just go with his gut in the first place.

My first rule for taking a medication is that the medication must first be approved for general use by the FDA. So far, this is not the case. So, when the FDA does approve these gene therapies for use against the COVID-19 virus, I will consider getting the shot. Until these therapies received FDA APPROVAL on a non emergency basis, I am not partaking.

I’m getting my second Moderna vaccination shot in a few hours. I’ll let you know if I die from it.in a couple days.