Radical right wing court

Progressives are dishonest, which is why we hear such phrases. Ever notice that 100% of the 'women" claiming these log ago attacks are feminists who contribute money to the democrats? Left wing women are today's nazis and left wing men their impotent cucks.

I think this country needs change. Whether Kavanaugh is the change needed on the court will be seen in the future.

When there is a perceived political change on the horizon - there’s usually significant political craziness on both sides of the issue.

The truth is generally less liberal than the left wants - and generally less right than the conservatives want.

I hope the democrats don’t pursue impeachment proceedings against Kavanaugh. I think that would be a wasted effort.

Based on the evidence - Kavanaugh is a reasoned and principled judge. There is no reason to expect him to be any less reasonable or principled as a Justice. I wish him the best.

As far as there not being a single supporter of any of the conservative issues mentioned in the initial post - I think that is a stretch.

You’re right skibum.

The 20 boys who accused Sandusky at Penn St after 20 years? Definitely lying progressives.

The 250 gymnasts who accused Nassar after 20 years? Definitely lying progressives.

The 250 boys who accused the Catholic Church in Philadelphia after 30 years? Definitely lying progressives.

Shut the fuck up.

Lmao lil Jimmy. You're one dumb fuck.

Titty the word is DELUSIONAL. You're inferior to an in-bred. Wtf were your parents? A pig and a dog?

The freedom of a woman to choose abortion without government interference is in jeopardy. Already many states make it very hard to obtain an abortion by creating regulations designed to limit access. The Supreme Court, without overturning Roe v Wade, can deny many women their right to choose by upholding these regulations.

Soon the only women who will be able to get abortions will be the mistresses of politicians and televangelists.

There is no such things as a "right to choose". Abortion existed at the time of the drafting of t he Constitution and it was left out. Further, Roe v. wade is an embarrassment as a case as it created a new Constitutional right, not in the Constitution, based on the "right to privacy", which is also not in the Constitution. Maybe the "right" wouldn't be in Jeopardy if it was passed as legislation instead of Judicial cheating.

JackSlash - the use of abortion in this country should come to an end.

The promotion of abortion (by democrats) as a woman’s right is horrific - and wrong. It is the killing of an unborn fetus. There is nothing reasonable about allowing it to continue.

I hope that this changes soon.

That "right to choose" bullshit is another progressive misnomer - what are about the rights of the baby - one has no more right to kill a baby you don't want that's outside your belly vs inside your belly, you're still killing it no matter what bullshit term you wanna use - it's not "your body" it's the baby's body that you are damaging - you're choosing to be judge, jury, and executioner - it's not about you, it's about that baby - you have a "right to choose" to cut off your arm if you want to, not have the right to end another life - and why the law states that if one kills a pregnant women that person is also charged with the murder of the fetus.

To clarify - the statements made by Papi aren’t radical. They are common sense, and it’s reasonable - and decent.

This issue should not be considered the right to choose vs the right to life - it’s simply the right to kill the unborn vs the right to life.

It befuddles me how liberals oppose executions (of convicted murderers) but yet how they want the right to kill (innocent) unborn fetuses?

Shit, I better buy a gun.

This could get bad. Like riots in the street bad.

Why if theres complications during labor and only 1 is going to make it out alive, child or mother? should the child be charged with murder if the child lives? Abortion should be legal, and if you decide to have kids it should be with someone that shares your views.

Just because the government legalizes crack, i am not going to start smoking crack. same with abortions

For me, the women who raised me asked for this right to chose and to have agency over their bodies. I owe them a great debt, which I consider now repaid, so I am done fighting this. I do not consider this being a “cuck” but rather honoring them and repayment of a debt and a gratitude of thanks. After 20 years I am done. It’s tail wagging the dog.

An embryo or fetus has no rights. It has no rights until it is born. This was the case when the founding fathers wrote out constitution. How does forcing a woman against her will to carry a non-viable fetus against her will, how does not violate libertarian Non-Aggression Principle (NAP)?? No one has the right to make her a slave against her will, for the State to co-op her body for 9 months. The Burger Court got it right when it said she loses her right to evict the fetus from her womb once the fetus is viable. This is consistent with the libertarian stances on trespass and murder.

Sometimes I think those older ultra-conservative customers who are high income and high net worth are divorced from some of the daily struggles and realities many of us face. A young 20 y/o woman who becomes pregnant may feel that her life is over. Young parents may feel priced out of the market, of raising a family. Unwanted pregnancies are one inevitable result of women’s sexual liberation. For now, for a small group, (young, scared group) abortion is the least terrible of 3 horrible choices. Though, I think history will paint us as being on the wrong side of abortion when it’s all done.

It depends how to see the issue: oppression or barbarism or coercion (three parties).

Radical right wing court

There's an oxymoron for ya.

First and foremost!: Judge Kavanaugh is a strict constructionist judge. For those of you that went to school later than 1975 that means that Judges do not set laws, write law nor set policy contrary to trends started by LBJ & Jimmy Carter judges. By the Constitution the Supreme Court is only allowed to rule whether a law meets the criteria laid out in the constitution for laws. Strict constructionists are also less likely to overturn decisions made by previous courts(precedent). Abortion will not change in the foreseeable future other than the possibility that tax payers may not be forced to subsidize it. The First Amendment will be more strictly interpreted, there will be no "fairness laws" for EITHER side. (there have been numerous attempts to shut down conservative talk radio and website under the guise of fairness because the left can't hold an audience(hence the low ratings of CNN etc.). If birthright citizenship changes it will have to come from Congress and will likely come before the court. Every other 1st world country has way more strict rules for citizenship than we do as well as the right to any government benefits. It is likely that we will see some laws to protect voters rights such as proof of citizenship and residency. Indiana has had that law in place for several years and it has gone before the previous supreme court several years ago and passed. Picture state issued ID's are available for free and the local BMV upon your moving into the state. Was put in place 2.5 years ahead of the first election enforcement to allow everyone enough time to get one. Unfortunately is was not in place before Obama fraudulently carried IN in 2008.
Everyone forgets (including some judges) the courts do not have the power to mandate laws. The job is the legislature's who (in recent years) have stopped doing their jobs and have let the courts and executive branches make the laws. The left has done this because if they actually had to run on their records they would be thrown out of office for destroy the schools, raising taxes, expansion of government, allowing welfare to get out of control, malfeasance (the list is endless). By allowing judges, governors and president to rule by fiat they wash their can say look I had nothing to do with your 60% tax burden it was tehm even though they arranged it all. I think Kavanaugh is more of a libertarian than anything else.

"Soon the only women who will be able to get abortions will be the mistresses of politicians and televangelists."

And the SCOTUS, as well as the senators who voted him through, will have blood on their hands for every woman who dies from a back alley abortion.

If a fetus had no rights Dominic than abortion at the time of the drafting of the Constitution would not have constituted the crime of infanticide. Let us murder those least able to defend themselves and call ourselves Progressive. Of course we could compromise and make 23 weeks, when fetus' become viable the cut off. Anything before then is abortion, anything after that is first degree murder. Simple solution? Protect yourself and don't get pregnant. That poor 20 year old girl who murders her child to spare her own life? Oh well, all acts have consequences, unless you're a progressive, then its the fault of another.

"That "right to choose" bullshit is another progressive misnomer - what are about the rights of the baby"

If an embryo or fetus cannot live outside of the woman's uterus, it has no human rights and is honestly just a parasite at that point. Women are not incubation machines. Although I personally would never have an abortion, I would NEVER agree with any law that takes away a woman's right to her own body. And quite honestly, it's both laughable and sad at the same time that so many men, whose bodies will never have to go through a pregnancy, have so much to say on why a woman shouldn't have a choice to her own body.

I'm sure all the guys here who fuck strippers bareback would be elated if they got one pregnant and she refused to have an abortion. /sarcasm. Hello child support and alimony for the wives who divorce them after that. Pff.

And before any regressive goes crazy about me calling embryos and fetuses parasites, I understand that they are not actual scientific parasites; however, the affect they have on a woman's body is completely parasitic.

And again, I'll reiterate: if it cannot live outside of the woman's uterus, it has no human rights. Its existence is entirely dependant upon the women's body.

Effect*

Sorry for any typos, I'm on lunch break from my real estate class and trying to study and tuscl at the same time. My point still stands.

The last time I considered myself "pro-life" was several years before I ever even started having sex, when I was a naive kid who didn't know anything about reproductive rights.

*affect

Whatever. You get my point.

Now I don't even know what side I'm putting my asterisks on. I should log off.

Effect.*

There, I'm done. I sound like Nicoke now. But my point still stands.

It’s said that a society should be judged by how it treats animals and children. Do its’ citizens show compassion to those that can’t look out for themselves ? Or, does everyone simply do what is their own selfish interest ?

Well, pro-life regressives are often the ones who want to cut welfare /government funding that will deny children in need access to food and healthcare, so right wing regressives are not even pro-life, they are just either (a) pro embryo and pro fetus, or (b) anti-women.

OMG, just read the recent entries, will get into it when i get a break.

Nothing speaks volumes more about the lefty than the word parasite. If they are fucking parasites why does my tax money go to pre-natal care? If a woman receives taxpayer paid pre-natal; care should she have to repay it after the murder of the unborn child/parasite? Of course if you're a guy there is nothing better than child birth classes, pre-natal care, painting the nursery, and thinking about baby names, only to find out that in week 26 your gf/spouse murdered your child because she got a job promotion at work. By the way Nina under your "logic" people who don't pay taxes have no say in how taxpayer money is spent; people who don't serve in the military cannot have a say in going to war and on and on. Spare the child killer - kill the child - Progressives lol.

Sadly, the truth is that we must understand the implications of our actions. We are responsible for the outcome of our actions. We can not simply kill an innocent fetus because we have acted irresponsibly. Does it make sense to penalize the innocent for our mistakes?

Unprotected sex can easily lead to pregnancy. The next choice should never be abortion. The sad truth is the abortion procedure is used as a method of contraception - and those folks (who use it as such) have blood on their hands.

The conception of a baby should be a joyous experience - that is enjoyed by both parents. In a society considered evolved and tolerant - we should not be penalizing the ones who have no defense (sadly considered parasites by Dominic77).

i also dont understand why CONs are prolife, but its nonwhites who have a higher disproportionate rate of abortions compared to whites. CONs should be cheering for pro-choice.

Mark 94 stirring the pot even better than flagooner.

Welfare, as it has been structured since 1965, is a trap for the poor, locking them into poverty.The war on poverty has been a complete failure. There are now multiple generations reliant on structural welfare.

Weve spent trillions of dollars and accomplished nothing. The welfare program needs to be restructured to encourage families to stay together while preparing recipients to be self sufficient.

Conservatives do not want children to die. They want them to thrive rather than to be victims of a failed government program.

@Nina

Nina, correct. The mothers say if you won't let me abort, then who will pay my prenatal care, who will pay for the delivery, etc. Who will pay to raise my baby. I get their plight. But asking for handouts or welfare is not going to fly anymore. The Johnson Great Society is over. In fact, Roosevelt's New Deal may also be over. Because to do that at the government level requires taxation theft, and wealth transfer.

We really should raise our daughters and sons to be adults who make responsible choices and so that there are less abortions.

@TiredTraveler

I actually think I agree with nearly all points. Including calling Justice Kavanaugh a libertarian. I see what you mean by strict Continutionalist not wanting to legislate from the bench. I think that is best. But I was willing to fight dirty to keep the Burger's Court decision because it is so important to many but not all women that I know. Even if some of those women have "rocks in their heads" from the feminist and Women's movement agendas (really both are special interest groups and not activist groups === we've been duped!) :)

Nina, a baby can't live on it's own outside of the uterus either.

"the protesters tell us we now have a radical, right wing court."

Just like they portray Trump as racist as Hitler. Sure he's a dick and at least a little racist but a Hitler or White Supremacist is not even close to the truth. People are always going over the top with their criticisms and portrayals of their political opponents. Just like you could hear conservatives calling Obama a communist.

Except in the three instances cited there was either witnesses or some evidence to back up the claims.

The 20 boys who accused Sandusky at Penn St after 20 years? Definitely lying progressives.

The 250 gymnasts who accused Nassar after 20 years? Definitely lying progressives.

The 250 boys who accused the Catholic Church in Philadelphia after 30 years? Definitely lying progressives.

What we don't have in this case is anything remotely equal to backup.

So comparing the two says more about your state of mind than anything factual.

One of the really odd items that I read ( with my own eyes) and then it seems to have been stricken from the statements was her cell phone call she made provided to her by one of her friends that had it in her purse.......ever see a cell phone in 1982? Ever think about the size the thing must have been if this friend had one?

Oddly enough those of us in the technology world ( if they saw the statement before it did a Keyzer Sozee and vanished) would tell you Uh Oh..... you just went down the road of BS.

And that is just one reason why you don't trash a guy and go liberal nutbag over any one person that can not produce evidence.

@skibum609 posted: “and call ourselves Progressive”

I’ve often found the Progressive Era, temperance movement, Prohibition Era and Amendment, women’s Suffrage, et al. an interesting thing. I used to wonder, “What started all of this?” But I can find it was men behaving badly. One was domestic violence. Another was is a man left a woman either because he walked out or because he died prematurely (e.g., Industrial accident at work) the woman (and child) were left destitute and she’s need to beg to survive.

We’ve corrected a lot of that. Women realized that suffrage was needed if they wanted to change anything. OK. We’ve tried some progressive things to fix it. Some worked, like women being able to work, support herself just as any man. Many jobs are open to women and barriers have been removed in most cases and lowered in others. We have welfare. We have access to healthcare. We understand domestic violence is a serious crime. In a lot of ways things are better for women today than in 1890 or 1919.

WOC still have some issues but that seems tied to generational or structural poverty that the progressive policies either helped create or made worse. But that’s not my fight.

@skibum609 said: “constituted the crime of infanticide.”

But it’s not infanticide because it’s not an infant. I would like to see less abortions, though. We also used to have laws against masturbation or “spilling the seed” because the church (before the U.S. was created) used to think semen contained the entire baby because they didn’t know then of the woman’s contribution of genetic material. They only know what they saw.

Things have changed in 240 years. Social mores are different today. We have sex and pregnancy out of wedlock as a norm. We have divorced fertility with pregnancy via birth control (the pill, the condom). Different things are acceptable today than there back then.

@skibum609 said: “Simple solution? Protect yourself and don't get pregnant. That poor 20 year old girl who murders her child to spare her own life? Oh well, all acts have consequences,”

I generally agree with that. I know from 15 to 25 I was deathly afraid of getting a woman pregnant. I had doubts I would be able to support a child or raise a family. I find the solution of “oh well” insufficient but that’s life. There are lots of men that are really pieces or shit (present company excluded) who will not support a child, ever. There are plenty of women how are pieces of shit, too. That’s not any of us. Oh well is right! It’s bone crushingly hard at times I have found.

Real question for all the "evangelical I hate abortion, unborn has rights folks." How can you in one sentence be caring humans full of empathy and love for that unborn child, then in the next sentence turn to a bigoted, unchristian/unloving, hate the poor and everyone who doesn't think like you for your fellow humans that are walking this planet?

daddyfatsack, you could say everything in reverse and have it apply to liberals. Today, too many people hate anyone who doesn't have the same opinion as they do - conservative or liberal.

You don't have to be religious to be against abortion.

Ok that is completely true and you are welcome to do that. IDGAF about liberals and conservatives. Two side of the same stupidity coin. Feel free to take religious belief out of it. I'll wait for an answer addressing inconsistent beliefs/applications.

I haven't kept up with the discussion but here is my take.

Women should have the right to choose. Rape is wrong. Women should gave the right to choose who they sleep with but then also be responsible for the results of it.

As for a fertilized egg being a parasite, it wouldn't have occurred if not for the woman to choose to take the risk of getting pregnant.

That being said...

I am for states deciding the issue themselves.

While I can't envision encouraging a lady to have an abortion, I would not vote against it because i believe there are situations that are justified (rape, incest, serious medical complications to the mother, to name some but not birth control), and only the life endangerment of the mother being a reason after a determined period. It would be too much for the legal system to determine on a case basis.

I do not, however, want any of my tax dollars being put towards it and I think we should be able to have a discount on health insurance if we opt to not have it covered on our plan.

@mark94 posted: “Or, does everyone simply do what is their own selfish interest ?

I thought one party constantly send the message that selfishness is good and a virtue. That a lot of economic good comes from selfishness. That social good (at the family level or at the church congregation level) is the result of selfishness. Hard work, sweat, toil, reap what you sow and all that.

I don’t know why women decide to abort. Or why politicians oppose abortions generally, but support abortions for rape and incest. Seems like if you’re pro-life, it would be all or nothing. Why should the baby of a rapist or the result of incest have any less rights to life than any other child. Hell, you might even be 50/50 in cases of the health of the mother. Why does the mother take precedence of the child in that case, unless both are at risk. Still some would say it’s in God’s hands, do nothing, let it unfold according to His plan.

Up until about 2 years ago, I didn’t understand why some politicians didn’t support abortion exceptions for rape and incest. Now I understand why. It makes sense if you’re really pro-life.

@cashman1234 posted: “In a society considered evolved and tolerant - we should not be penalizing the ones who have no defense (sadly considered parasites by Dominic77)”

I never called them parasites. Get your facts straight. I never said anything of the fetus or the birth of a baby. I will go on record that a fetus or the birth of a baby is a joyous thing. I’m quite envious of people who are able to do that. I realized early on (perhaps in error over estimating how much it takes to care and raise and educate a child) that I wouldn't make enough $$$ to provide. That will never be me.

All I ask for is some empathy because I might not be able to care and raise the child with advantages that are anywhere near close to your children enjoy. It’s really bone crushingly tough out there. I know I have been trying. I know the answer is “oh well” and “choices have consequences” because they do! I never once got a girl pregnant. I have had children I couldn’t afford. I acted responsibly and expect others to do the same.

I never called them parasites.

"Nina, a baby can't live on it's own outside of the uterus either."

A baby can live on its own outside of a uterus just the same as any other person can. Babies will not die just because they are outside of a uterus. Sure, they need nutrients, but so do all humans. Babies are not reliant on a uterus; fetus and embryos are. Find a woman who is three months pregnant, take the fetus out of her, and it will wither away and die. If you cannot understand the concept of embryos and fetuses being dependent on the woman's body to survive, you have no business arguing for or against a woman's right to choose.

In my view - this has little to do with religion - and has much more to do with caring about the most defenseless of all of us.

I believe we must be responsible for our actions. We choose to have sex - and we must step up an be responsible for the outcome of sex. Abortion is the ultimate shirking of responsibility. It’s ireeversible - and it’s a horrible practice.

^ I agree 100%, but I do believe there are justifiable reasons beyond a woman's choice. For that reason I am conflicted.

"I believe we must be responsible for our actions. We choose to have sex - and we must step up an be responsible for the outcome of sex. Abortion is the ultimate shirking of responsibility. It’s ireeversible - and it’s a horrible practice."

And if a woman decides to have an abortion, you can hold her responsible for it and let her feel like a shitty person for the rest of her life. That doesn't mean you should take away the right to choose. I know women who've had an abortion, and I do not judge most of them for it (except the ones who use it as birth control), because I've never been in that situation. I imagine if I ever had an abortion I probably wouldn't be able to live with myself and would be severely depressed, remorseful, and needs years of therapy to cope with it. But it should still be my choice. It is my body.

It seems that "caring for the most defenseless of all of us" is at best a subjective thought exercise as history has shown it to be a false statement. The most defenseless are always eradicated, enslaved or subjegated.

Responsibility for actions also seems to be applied to people very differently on this board which itself is a microcosm of society as a whole

I apologize to Dominic77 - as he didn’t refer to fetuses as parasites. My mistake.

The truth is - in deciding to abort - it removes all opportunity from the unborn. There is no good that comes from this act.

To choose a career in place of life - is a poor trade. It speaks of selfishness to a level that should not be condoned.

Sadly Nina, it’s an unborn life. You are acting as God and terminating a life.

You can claim that the life exists only due to your body’s support of it, and that would be true.

I don’t judge the people who abort, but I don’t support the act. This is viewed as an “out” for many folks who don’t understand there are options. Many folks are unable to conceive, and they would welcome a baby. Life is precious and it shouldn’t be discarded before it is given a chance.

@warrenboy

“What we don't have in this case is anything remotely equal to backup.

So comparing the two says more about your state of mind than anything factual”

My post was in response to skibum who did not limit his comments to the 3 kavanaugh accusers. He said all progressives were liars and 100% of the ‘women’ making long ago claims were democratic contributors. Then he threw in cucks just in case he hadn’t quite stoked the fire enough.

The point of my post is that just because there is no corroboration and the claim is about an assault long ago does not mean it’s not credible. We have 100’s of cases that show that victims of assault often don’t come forward. I agree it’s hard to prosecute a single claim of she said, he said but the fact that it happened long ago and they didn’t tell anyone, on its own, is not a reason to disbelieve someone.

Independent of that point, Kavanaugh seems like a dick.

"strict contstitutionalists" often forget they think they are such when the 2nd amendment comes up.

Read the damn thing. It's clear we are not taking an originalist read (which I'm fine with, originalism is stupid)

@daddyfatstack

daddyfatstack posted: “Real question for all the "evangelical I hate abortion, unborn has rights folks." How can you in one sentence be caring humans full of empathy and love for that unborn child, then in the next sentence turn to a bigoted, unchristian/unloving, hate the poor and everyone who doesn't think like you for your fellow humans that are walking this planet?

I’m not evangelical nor on that side of the argument. But I can answer that in eight parts. My wife is from this part of the country (small town, farmers, etc).

tl;dr Protestant Work Ethic.

1. They’re conserved that white women are murdering white babies and making us less-white.
2. They think the poor should pay for their consequences.
3. They think promiscuous women should pay for their consequences. Sexual liberation was a fucking social mistake. Despite what RickDugan does in SCs and OTC on Tuscl, I guarantee he’s raising his daughters to not sleep around, to get married to a great husband father and provider, and to probably be a virgin until marriage (I bet).
4. Poor and minorities should not have children they cannot support
5. Why? The Protestant Work Ethic (from Martin Luther) that’s why! This country the catholic and protestant denominations say was built on Protestant Work Ethic.
6. If you’re poor and can’t provide for your spouse and children then you are lazy. Because Protestant Work Ethic. No welfare for you!
7. They hate welfare, because for whites in protestant denominations, the Government gives money to people who “aren’t like them.” Like them, means white, protestant denomination, rural, works, adheres to traditional values.
8. Trust me. They love them some welfare, they love them some WIC, or medicaid. I’ve heard this more than once, “See, you’ve paid into it all your life! So it’s yours, you’ve earned it. It’s okay that it goes to you. See it should go people like us. It shouldn’t go to them.”

Real truth.

@flagooner

flagooner posted: “I do not, however, want any of my tax dollars being put towards it”

True. It’s really unnecessary. An abortion costs like $500. The man and the women or their families or a friend of the girl, etc should be able to come up with $500 and get in a car (or train or plane) to an abortion facility. I used to think gov’t should fund this because not all women have money. Then I realized we’re arguing over $500. At that point I lost sympathy for government sponsored abortions.

Real talk. If you’re a girl, you’re pregnant, and between you and those close to you you don’t have $500, you’re in serious trouble. I can even come up with that.

@daddyfatstacks

daddyfatstacks posted: “It seems that "caring for the most defenseless of all of us" is at best a subjective thought exercise as history has shown it to be a false statement. The most defenseless are always eradicated, enslaved or subjegated.”

True that! I’m reminded on Tuscl nearly monthly about: The Law Of the Jungle. The strong eat first. …. or eat at all. In fact caring for defenseless sounds like some libtard /progressive /leftwing /bleedingheart victimization ideology, am I right?

I though this group was the party of “oh well … tough”. no?

@cashman1234

cashman1234 posted: “I apologize to Dominic77”

^^^Apology accepted. (you didn’t have too. Thank you)

cashman1234 posted: “The truth is - in deciding to abort - it removes all opportunity from the unborn. There is no good that comes from this act. “

^^^It is a terrible choice. But the mother’s free will doing best. For some people it is the least terrible of 3 very horrible choices. The very pit of despair.

cashman1234 posted: “To choose a career in place of life - is a poor trade. It speaks of selfishness to a level that should not be condoned.”

^^^It is a poor trade. No one says otherwise.

cashman1234 posted: “You are acting as God and terminating a life.

^^^And criminals do it a 1000X times a day in other ways, too. A lot of that is uniquely urban problems. We also do it as nation with our constant wars and military interventions, too.

We're being surprisingly civil in this debate. I completely see the other side's argument. If you're stance is innocent unborn are being callously murdered -- how could you not be justifiably upset, demand immediate corrective action, or be morally outraged? That's 100% reasonable.

I love abortion. It allows me to screw as many women as I want without that stupid condom. If they get pregnant, let's go scrape that non life form out of there and continue screwing. I hate condoms.

Sarcasm off now

Dominic77 I appreciate the answer. You are officially off the list when I chime in on these topics and call everyone stupid! I have heard of the Protestant work ethic and whew...the cognitive dissonance involved in that is something to be amazed by.

You are 100% right about the libtard thinking that appears to have infested the pure conservative ways.

"Sadly Nina, it’s an unborn life. You are acting as God and terminating a life."

Separation of church and state.

Views of god should not be a part of law making or law amendments.

Why can't this be solved at the level of sex, before life is conceived. It would solve all problems of pro vs no abortion. Just tell your man to wear protection, take a pill or prevent the pregnancy. That's still allowing women the choice to have sex but it stops the scare of getting pregnant and the hassle and time going and getting the procedure done. It messes up a woman's body as well because an abortion is unnatural, yes unnatural. It also stops the potential for thaan to run off scared and leave you in the dust to deal with the pregnancy. That happens a lot because of crap asshole pansies. So many of these arguments wouldn't be there of protection was used.

The only method of birth control that is 100% effective is abstinence. Condoms, the pill, the patch, the ring, the shot, pulling out, (etc) all still carry a risk of pregnancy.

So I guess for anyone against a woman's choice, just don't have sex. Or just have sex with men and tell all women who don't want kids not to have sex.

Sorry Nina, your separation of church and state argument is completely off base there. I thought you were a law student?

@daddyfatstacks

daddyfaststacks posted: “real question for all the "evangelical I hate abortion, unborn has rights folks." How can you in one sentence be caring humans full of empathy and love for that unborn child, then in the next sentence turn to a bigoted, unchristian/unloving, hate the poor and everyone who doesn't think like you for your fellow humans that are walking this planet?”

^^^I should ADD something I forgot. It’s not just religion. But a lot of these people live in rural, farms, or very outer ring suburbs (exbubs?) or small towns. They see these problems are mainly urban problems. (Esp. gun violence). And they feel that urban areas are siphoning money away from rural areas. So there is sort of the resent for urban areas and people.

Also the liberals and progressives in the coastal cities seem to have a smug, elitist attitude about them. That isn’t helping bring people how might be liberal, into the fold.

Plus rural areas just have different problems than urban areas. So different they might as well be two different countries!

Ok Nina - I’ll change my statement to appease your argument.

Sadly Nina it’s an unborn life, and you are acting as an executioner, in your decision to kill an unborn life.

Fucking millennial libtards.

Okay, i feel better now.

Cashman1234: real talk. If you got one of your dancers (I mean whores) pregnant. Would you support the kid? Or are you snipped? I guess this is the hypocrisy we expect we're likely to find from the pro-life crowd. Just wondering if you can catch you in it? If you mind humoring us? ;)

In my life experience most men can’t be real men for longer than 10 minutes. :(.

The father kids, are absent, dodge child support payments, state efforts to collect do not work, are never in the kids lives. And that’s most fathers I’ve seen. Maybe I grew up around utter garbage and ditto my friends. But that’s what I know.

That’s why I was shocked to when I went to a better school and most kids had two parents, they all had the same last names (the dad’s) and the dad was something like Engineer and mom a substitute teacher. Their moms and dads were 10-15 years older, etc. Instead a single moms who are waitresses.

I forgot to add: and domestic violence. And cheating with other women and the pain that causes.

If I knocked up a whore - I’d strongly encourage the girl to see it through - and have the baby.

If it would make a difference (in the girl’s decision making), I’d pay for everything so that the pregnancy wouldn’t be a financial drain on her.

If the girl was unable to act as a mother, I’d find a means to do what was best. I’m getting close to retirement, so maybe I’d retire early, to be a full time dad.

If the mother didn’t want me in my child’s life, I’d respect her wishes. I’d make sure child support was paid regardless.

I’m not a deadbeat or sperm donor. I’ve been fortunate, and I made a good living, and it’s important to provide for one’s family.

Is adoption no longer an option?

This is about as personal as I’ll get here -

My father wasn’t around much for me. He thought I was (what they called slow - at the time), so he and my mother took me to my grandparents house and left me. I was lucky, as they were great folks and I wasn’t actually slow. They were the adoptive parents of my mother.

My mother is an orphan who grew up in an notorious orphanage in western Connecticut. She was adopted late - as a teen - by my grandparents.

So, I don’t find it appropriate to toss folks away, as I’ve seen it first hand. The life we create should never be viewed as a burden or something to be discarded.

There are specific cases people can point to to rebut just about any position. That is obviously a personal case.

Abandonment is horrible, but at the same time there are many heterosexual couples who are unable to have kids, want them, and would make great parents.

The heartbeat starts around day 18 to 22. Most women don't even know they are pregnant by then. If that heartbeat doesn't stop until the person dies of old age (leaving out unforseen events) then the baby is a life plain and simple. Rape accounts for less than 2% of abortions, and of those 2%, most are not an actual rape. I use to work with people in rape units. The women's body will a lot of the times go into an immediate period and Purge the body. I am not the stickler that doesn't allow for the morning after pill. Let the woman who just got raped clean herself out and take what's necessary to stop any potential pregnancy. The woman in that situation is of utmost importance. The woman who decides to be careless needs to live with the pregnancy, it was her choice to begin with. All choices have consequences. If I eat to many donuts I get fat. If I let a kid play with a gun and they get shot, my fault. If I drive drink and hurt someone, well maybe there is a way out. I have rights and choices. Leave me alone. No way! Same with abortion.

@gali Are you okay with the morning after pill?

I'm not religious, but for those of you who call them nut jobs they have just as much right to their beliefs as you do for yours.

I vote the OP, @Mark94, as Tuscl's number one ponderous bore. More cartoonish than Archie Bunker or any other character Norman Lear could possibly come up with.

When the dust settles on Dr Ford, the supreme court may take on Obamacare and the constitutionality of protecting preexisting conditions. Life and death for 10s of millions, and some of the TUSCL geezers who post here. There will be consequences to having a partisan hack on the SC.

But better to have a liberal partisan hack?

^^ just don't get sick, little guy, and maybe you can support your kid through college

Dominic - Hurried and used the wrong word: the crime was called feticide. I would also point out that unlike most people here I actually deal with poor people on a daily basis and I am Court appointed counsel for teens who need legal permission for an abortion, in opposition to their parent's wishes. Two things: Poverty remains a choice for most, like it or not; and people get abortions most of the time because they are careless and callous. There is no "right" to choose. If as many people supported this fake right then we'd have had a Constitutional amendment making it a right, but no one proposes one because it has zero chance of passing. Instead of even trying the left relied on Scotus cheating, and since Scotus created the right, they can take it away. Just like having your slave returned to you was a Constitutional right under Dred Scott, until the Constitution was amended. Sheer bigotry to pretend all those who oppose abortion are religious. I have spent zero days in my life believing Jesus was anything other than a jew. I think the idea of God makes people who believe in witches seem smart. Using a condom and birth control is %99.9999999 effective. Abortion has become birth control and is a disgrace. The only thing remotely funny in all of this is that with the influx of Hispanics, who are catholic and the huge influx of Muslims, which the left encourages, they are creating the possibility of a Constitutional amendment banning all abortion. That would be hysterically funny.

Using a condom and birth control is %99.9999999 effective

That's just patently untrue.

Instead of obsessing about poor people, why not focus on rich tax cheats like Trump and Trump's father who defrauded the government of several hundred million in inheritance taxes

Poverty is a choice guy. Someone save us

Always throw up a false flag and change the subject instead of accepting a simple fact. Condoms when used correctly are 98% effective and the pill when used correctly are 99.9% effective. Combined they are %99.9999 effective. End of story. As far as tax cheats? Shoot them all, starting with all the illegal aliens in this land and their refusal to pay taxes. Sel-employed people also cheat, whether they are rich or poor. Hey maybe you can go back in time and abort them.

@flagooner. I only support it in case of a rape. There might be conception but at that point only God will know. We would have to wait and that part is wrong in the case of rape. I believe in taking care of the woman in that case because that's the person in front of us now who we need to care for. Let her make the decision. Love and support her. All other thoughts I have posted is just my opinion that I wanted to add. When it comes down to it, this website is for one reason and we are all on level playing ground, here to learn, share experiences and have fun.

Also, a lot of people on this website have no clue about how a woman's body works. They just see holes and want to play with them. Women can only get pregnant when the egg is released from the ovary. That window is about 6 days, with 1 of those days being a "peak" day. Mucus is made to keep the sperm alive for the peak day. All other days of the month a woman can have sex with zero birth control, no mucus\a different kind. It's called natural family planning. Look it up. In Africa and many other countries they are teaching women this natural birth control and pregnancy rates are dropping in all of those areas but huge numbers. It's 99.8% affective and the .2% is due to not following the rules. All it takes is education. Most woman don't even know this about their own body. I am all for the government teaching this in school. Take my tax dollars and use it to educate young kids. If it saves a baby then I am all for it.

Sorry @SkiBirther, but 99.99% of your posts show your obsession with lazy brown and black people sapping our economy. Pay attention to rich white collar tax cheats. And the banking system that wiped trillions of dollars out the economy a decade ago.

Lmao @ racism. You friggen progressives are like silly robots with your name calling. Shout some more slogans, make up some more lies, call some more names, ignore the facts, be a progressive. If you want to know why Trump is President, look in the mirror. Its because of people like you, not me.

Is late term partial birth abortion okay ? Just wondering where everyone lines up on this.

Depending on your answer, the next question will either be whether it’s okay to “terminate” a one month old baby, or abort an 8 month old fetus in the womb. Or, 7 months.

If the line between acceptable and unacceptable behaviors is difficult to pinpoint, then the safe path is to avoid the behavior.

Nina, embryos can be kept alive outside of the woman by freezing them. They can also be transferred from woman to another for development and birth. So the embryo is not dependent on the woman who conceived it.

Abortion, a topic sure to cause conflict. Now what my thought is, in most cases, the "need" for an abortion is a choice. That said the woman already had her CHOICE when she fucked! End of story!!!

Club that like button

"Using a condom and birth control is %99.9999999"

That statement is not only untrue, but doesn't take into account that condoms ARE birth control.

And flagooner, my separation of church and state argumemt was absolutely relevant since I was responding to someone who said having abortions is "playing god," and god has no place in law making and law amendmemts because in the US we aren't legally bound by religion. Prove me wrong.

The easiest example... Murder is playing God but also illegal.

Separation of church and state isn't in the constitution but merely refers to passage in the first ammendment that prohibits the state from establishing a religion. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof".

Most of our laws come from Judeo Christian beliefs and traditions.

I'm no lawyer, but that's pretty basic knowledge.

But I will give you a pass because you are probably stoned.

Separation of church and state creates a distance between religion/religious obligations and laws of the state. Therefore, my saying "god has no place in law" and citing separation of church and state was correct and relevant, as I was responding to someone who was bringing god into a political argument.

Nice try trying to prove me wrong (not really though), but I stand uncorrected. "Prohibiting the state from establishing religion" (which in this case, the State is the US), goes hand in hand with what I was saying, anyway. You suck at trying to correct people because you are helping to prove my point.

LOL, delusional.

^Ooh, burn. You really put me in my place.

Birth control isn’t 99.99% effective because a lot of women are being irresponsible and do not do the “maintenance” on time. But that’s also many men’s fault because even if he knows that he will still try to have sexual with her raw.

I’m team pro choice. But I’m not interesting in debating something like that. Well maybe if I was in a troll mood right now but that’s it.

@Cashman

I find your point of view very interesting. I DO NOT want to invalidate the reason you have your opinion. I just want to give my personal backstory as well and explain how I came to an opposite conclusion.

I grew up under two parents with severe mental problems. They both flew throughout life without any medical attention for their conditions.They were (and still are) very loving and well-meaning as people.

But their problems sometimes caused them to behave in ways that objectively would be considered emotionally abusive. There would be wild swings in behavior towards me that would be out of proportion of my actual actions. (Both in my favor and not in my favor)

They are people who are very flawed, but do the best they can to be supportive. They have done good for me too. Such as get me a car and pay for my insurance and phone. I say this to emphasize they are good people.

Sure, I like to exist to read good books, travel, spend time in nature, have interesting comversations with others, and just live in general. I have every intention of designing the best life for myself that I see fit.

But just like I believe it’s good to be a bit selfish (as long as you don’t wrong others in the process), I wonder whether my parents (mother especially) could have better been able to heal themselves without hiding behind the excuse of having to focus on me.

They are each other’s own worst enemy and should have divorced each other. I wonder if they did that if it would have forced them to better self-actualize.

They could have gone their own way and dealt with the “emptiness” of life without a dysfunctional family to hide behind. And perhaps would have been more forced to seek the help they needed.

They were unable to take care of me. The extended family on my mother’s side of the family resentfully took me in and had me stay with my grandma my last year of high school.

By Christmas, I was forced to move out and find somewhere else to live. (I wasn’t even 18 yet or had any paperwork done on me to label me independent. But the burden was placed on me to do so.)

And so I did, somehow. I moved into a house owned by a 40something year old man and rented a bedroom (found off Craigslist). Nobody gave a shit that most of society would consider that sketch AF. But that was the option I had and I wanted to finish out my last semester of high school in one place.

By May however, I was lucky. I ended up moving in with my high school friend and her whole family. This was because I was complaining about my “landlord” and upset I had to be there.

Her mom and grandparents didn’t question my motives. They just instantly allowed me to move out and move in with them instead. And didn’t demand anything.

So when I read the statement “I don’t find it appropriate to toss folks away, as I’ve seen it first hand. The life we create should never be viewed as a burden or something to be discarded.”

...I considered that a moot point based on my own personal experience. And many others who comes from unstable backgrounds.

I view my presence as a child, based on others inability to care for me, very much a burden and something to be discarded.

Not my fault of course, but that doesn’t change the reality of it.

And I only stopped being a “burden” when I was almost a legal adult anyways. And my parents were very physically attractive and intelligent people. They could have made a better life for themselves.

If by magic, I knew for sure that my parents could have improved themselves had I never existed, I wouldn’t have take it personally if I had been aborted.

...On a side note, to continue my story, if anyone wondered why I am such a troll: just merely existing in childhood made me a troll. One day I was an amazing child even if I was objectively speaking being a shithead. Another day, it could be I said something careless, and then there would be two weeks straight of hearing how I was a horrible child and I made another individual lose the will to live.

I didn’t choose the troll life. The troll life chose me.

^holy shit with these fukken novels, you need a dick in your mouth

NiceSpice your insights are very thoughtful, and I appreciate your viewpoint. It isn’t easy to reach a realization that your parents may be been better off without you, but based on your life, your conclusion makes logical sense.

I thought about that as well, many times, when I was young. I knew my parents felt stress, and I know my father took it out on me, as I wasn’t the son he wanted. My sister was smarter and she brought them great joy - and she was able to stay with my parents.

I’ve got a good relationship with my sister now. It took a long time.

I’ve dealt with many mental health issues, and I’ve worked to keep myself together emotionally. However, I now see those issues were there when I was younger.

I think it’s important to be strong at all times, and to make every effort so that your children know they are loved. When bringing a child into the world, its nothing less than a wonderful blessing, and they should always be viewed as such.

Damn... I had a long post with multiple points written out and the site ate it when I clicked post.

Too lazy to type it all out again: Choice argument is utter bullshit. I personally find abortions distasteful and repugnant. That said I think it should be legal and available across the country.

@Cashman

Aye. That’s the problem with topics like abortion. There’s too many “good points” both sides make. Including yours.

That’s why, despite that I can be insolent when debating other topics, I determinedly stay cordial when it comes to an issue like abortion.

And from the sounds of it, despite your flawed past, you pushed through the difficulties pretty nicely.

Let me know when TUSCL becomes shallow again.

"Nina, embryos can be kept alive outside of the woman by freezing them. They can also be transferred from woman to another for development and birth. So the embryo is not dependent on the woman who conceived it."

A frozen embryo will remain an embryo until it finds a host (uterus). And yes, they can be "tranferred from woman to another" which is called IVF and still involves gasp a UTERUS. Embryos need a UTERUS to develop into a human. It is science, but it's not rocket science.

And what is your point of bringing up frozen embryos, anyway? Plenty of frozen embryos go unused. If you are saying that an embryo is a human (lmao), then by that logic, freezing embryos and not using them must be murder, right?

@Flag: "Let me know when TUSCL becomes shallow again."

That happens every time you make an appearance.

Thought you had forgotten about me, @Dougster. Good to see that you're okay

People, people! Can we just end this insanity and get back to discussing pussy and blow jobs!

Skibum,

25 years ago, we didn't have your information on the effective percentage of condom, pill, and combined. Or that information wasn't that readily available. So I know I didn't really know. We did know about the rhythm method or the family planning method and the window conception can happen. So we planned around that. As for condoms/pills and their effectiveness, we had to be sure. IF we'd had had those stats we might not have supported abortion as an option. But when dealing with an emotional female. She'll insist on 100%. No matter how many 9s you have there. Because sometimes she's irrational. Though you can work around that and charm her.

I'd probably agree with you that a lot of abortions are needed by callously reckless people and not responsible people on birth control.

I remember how much of a struggle both financially and mentally it was for my single mom to raise us. At 15 she said, she told me if I wanted adult things, I'd have to find a way to pay for them on my own (car, insurance, college). She should barely afford what she did to provide what she could. After living and struggling for so long (18 years) I wasn't ready to jump into that for another 18 years until I was set up, so I could at least provide for wife & kids. At 25 I did a reality check. Sober that with my income unlikely to grow beyond meager, I'd likely never afford to be a provider, and little options, I resigned that it wouldn't be in the cards for me.

I guess it is true as children you end up valuing as adults the same things that your parents valued. For me it was the constant struggle to provide.

Some of you guys dont even have kids; so guess what, when you die you shouldnt have a say in future of this country. and even if you do have a say, you wont for long because your values will be lost when you die. if you want laws to swing left or right start having kids so you can make changes to laws. There are more whites in this country but they are refusing to have kids and get married, and they have turned into anti-immgrants,because whites fear being a minority..lol, in reality yall should be getting married and having kids.

you can debate, prolife, prochoice, free healthcare, free education, right to bear arms till you turn blue. in the end, people having children are going to have the final say in those rights

LMAO at abortion. Any time any of my hoes get knocked up, they will think of killing that fucker unless it’s mine. Then they be HAPPY to have my babies.

IDGAF