Unintended consequences

I think it all depends on what you want the most. Do you want a long-term relationship with a normal woman or do you want the excitement of stripper.

As for me, women my age (60's) don't appeal to me at all. I could not make myself have sex with a woman over 60 (with the exception of Christie Brinkley).

Around 6 or 7 years ago I started an intense relationship with my ATF, spending a lot of time with her in bed and out. She was more fun than any woman I've known. I wished she wasn't a stripper. Then I realized if she wasn't a stripper she would not be spending any time with me.

Seems to me that you're creating a false dichotomy between strippers and "real" women. The issue with your ex-dreamgirl wasn't that she wasn't real, it's that the basis for your relationship was transactional instead of emotional.

You seem to have reached the level of self-awareness to recognize a woman's physical appearance is important to you, so what's wrong with making that one of your criteria in looking for a 'real' relationship? Depending on the other traits you're prioritizing - intelligence, compassion, sense of humor, mutual interests, etc. - you're probably not going to find the ideal mate in the ranks of "pay4play" women you've been marauding through, so the search won't be easy but you have to decide what you really want from this endeavor: another hot girl you can tolerate just long enough to bang, or someone you're genuinely attracted to in a way that can last long after her looks have faded.

IRL, i have almost (give myself that tiny bit) no chance with girls with elite stripper looks (face AND body). Or it will require the same dynamic, paying them for their affection some way, just less direct, and in real life i just don't have any whale qualities that i can kind of front at the club. I've yet to try online dating, but i hear the same games are played as IRL. But you can BS more and put your best "face" forward and share more about yourselves and get a few doors opened where they wouldn't have been before. Anyway, my ATF has practically ruined me from other strippers, let alone regular girls. I don't know how to go back (although i'm nowhere near 26 years out of the game), so i'm in a somewhat similar boat, but nowhere near the same degree.

@ will transactional vs emotional. Well said and appreciated. Thx Dirk and Jack I thought I was going crazy but I see I'm not the only one

My current SA girl is 25 years younger than I am, yet we are very compatible in ways other than sex. I like spending non-sexual time with her, and wouldn't mind spending more but I'm trying to curb any attachment issues (I've spent time with two other girls from SA that started making noise about the MRS upgrade). The sex is great, but by the standards used around here, she is a 6 at best because of her weight. I'm very overweight, so I tend to not be so judgemental in this area. At this point in my life, I'm convinced I have 0% chance at having sex with any young woman that doesn't at least begin as a p4p arrangement.

I'm sure if I was single and offered her a stable living arrangement (marriage, live in GF; decent car to drive; etc) she would take it. I imagine the sex would stay good, since we've both established we don't mind sharing. This aspect is what might help you.

If your civvie girl would be open to becoming a SC wingman (wing-girl?) and occasionally allowing another girl into your bed (like my SA girl does; she's already been in more actual strip clubs and had sex with more actual strippers than SJG has), then you could still get the occasional thrill of sex with an 8,9,10 hottie but the day-to-day emotional connection and regular sex from the other girl.

Your well developed confidence with women should make it easy for you to bring this up with the civvie girl. And, if she doesn't go for it, then it doesn't sound like your heart will be broken.

What do you have to lose if you give it a shot?

If you want some more adventure, my company is hiring! You can drive s shit truck!

@Sal69 I’m sure most of us here have allowed a transactional relationship to become emotional, that’s just being human, there is always going to be that one girl who just rocks your world, but the real problem is our desire to have that connection. Some strippers exploit that as their business model and that’s where we all need to be smarter.

Joc13 she actually brought up wanting to go to a strip club with me on our first date. That caught me off guard which is why I asked her out a second time. She seems very cool and like I said has a lot of other pluses. Last night she told me she grows weed (12 plants) in fact the strain I like gorilla glue. We smoked weed together last night before fucking. There's lots of other qualities too but I still can't get the one girl off my mind. It's seriously fucked me up. To top it off I got the end of shift 2:30 am text from my biggest weakness complete with more pictures. I just know I'm headed back over to her house this week now. I was halfway thinking about setting up a threesome with these two but now I'm convinced I'm just overthinking everything

@sal, I went through something very similar 6-7 years ago.

Being in strip clubs a lot changes the way you look at women if you let it. When I’d go out to eat, I’d talk to the waitress like I’d talk to a shot girl in the club. When I was clubbing hard, I’d go through 5-6 different strippers a week, in 3 or 4 week day visits after work.

After getting divorced, I started dating civie women (along with still going to the clubs), but I slowly transitioned to just dating civies.

In answer to your question, in as to how to best deal with it, I think the answer is to remove yourself from the Club lifestyle for awhile. Things will slowly start to return to normal, once you are out of the bizzaro world that is strip clubs.

^ But when you've been out of the game so long, the new normal seems so boring and often disappointing at times and yet requires more work compared to strip clubs. I've got more time, maybe considerably more time if i'm blessed, but i've already all but given up on the idea of having my cake and eating it too (finding the type of "love" that i really want) IRL.

Watching too much porn can have the same effect. Reality often doesn't live up to fantasy.

Tough situation. Unfortunately, many guys need to be with someone that they find both physically and emotionally/intellectually attractive if we're talking about a long-term committed relationship.

If you need to think about other women to have successful sex with your civilian date, then do not get into a relationship with that woman. Consider what it will be like 6 months or a year from now when that new relationship smell has gone away...

That said, if you're done with strippers, then you may need to accept that you're also done with fucking out of your league (at least to some degree).

I agree w Wilmunny. Also, keep in mind that a lot of “real” women are just in it for the long hustle. All women want compensation in the form of stability. Men want compensation in the form of sex, affection, and entertainment. It’s often the men, after years of marriage, who feel unwanted bc of lack of sex. Instead of taking away the money from the stripper, getting married is like giving the stripper your cc and telling her to use it whenever, and she doesn’t need to sleep w you to keep it.

Sal, this was your first “unpaid” encounter for a long long time. Test the waters with a few more civilians and you’ll find a better suitor.

You probably didn’t find your wife from the very first girl you went out with, so you’re probably not going to find a new girlfriend on the very first date you go out on.

I do agree banging away strippers is a soulless task, but sometimes we need that, and then sometimes we just need a change.

Why does it have to be one or the other, either a young stripper or a civilian pig?

I think you have impulse control issues, which is leading you to keep jumping head first into all of these things. Calm down and approach this with some patience. If you aren't remotely attracted to the woman that you slept with, then you'd be doing her and yourself a disservice by moving along something that will never ultimately work out.

Why don't you test the dating waters a bit and see if you can improve your civilian options? You might also want to find some hobbies and social groups to spend with. It sounds like you're lonely, which I'm sure is contributing to all of this impulsive behavior. Strip clubs are very dangerous places for guys who are struggling with loneliness, so you really could use some other things to do. Unless you are independently wealthy, you are going to go broke with all of that stripper binging.

Wow. Agree with what most have said, very good advice. Have had to remove myself from the SC world more than once also, like most things, moderation is the key. I think many people here have been thru this to some degree, I have, and have friends who have to an extreme.

I've personally dated seriously 2 dancers, only one I met in the club. Both were clean dancers not extras girls. Both were relatively sane for that environment. But still its a trial.

Take yourself out of it, allow time to recover in all ways, and try to build a Real Life. Only then, you can return to SCing for kicks and fun, and be stable enough to keep it in the proper category. Good Luck.

There’s lots of good advice in this discussion. You might be at a cross roads?

Also, you’ve found one girl online who shares your interests, but who doesn’t have a body type that you enjoy. I’d recommend you keep trying. Let the heavy civilian girl know that she’s not your type. She might think you are being harsh and superficial - but it’s better to not stick with her if she doesn’t arouse you.

Clubbing can spoil some guys. It can be a challenge to come back to reality. Everything you say won’t be witty to civilian girls. The conversations might not be as light either, and that’s ok too. Bodies of civilian girls might not be as hot as dancers - but there’s lots more to a civilian girl - than just a hot body (geared to separate you from your money).

As I’ve aged, I’ve found that strippers don’t intellectually hit the mark for me. The desire to chat isn’t there with a dancer I met the other night. The stripper bodies are hot - but there is stripper baggage that will follow them too - and it’s messy - very messy! Civilian women have baggage too, but it is usually more normal. There are fewer civilian women with psycho part time Pimp ex boyfriends!

I’m good at compartmentalizing my emotions - and that’s not good. It’s best to find someone who satisfies your emotional and sexual needs - if you desire a real civilian relationship. It will be much more fulfilling for you too.

Having a dozen, different, paid sex partners per month is compulsive behavior. First get tested. Then take a fraction of what you are paying and get some therapy.

My blood work came back 100% fine so all good there Random. Skipping the therapy thought though as this web site and the comments are much more helpful/entertaining. Thanks to everyone else. Decided I'm going to tell the date from last night I don't think we're a good fit for each other, and I'm taking the day off and head to the gym

Read The Kempton-Wace Letters by Jack London. You will see that the dilemma of finding a woman who you are both compatible with and find sexually desirable is an age old problem.

Yes, working on yourself, investing in yourself is always a good idea. I just hate the gym so much, even if working out has major health and psychological benefits.

I went through my unhealthy emotional connection phase years ago -- the few years after my separation. Even today, though, I'd say my various for-pay activities do have an impact on my real life lovelife, sometimes positive, sometimes negative.

Positive: Knowing I have a smoking hot 22-year-old to have sex with, has prevented me from having desperation sex with older women. Which means: 1. I didn't get buzzed and have sex with a woman I'm not really attracted to, and wake up hating myself for it, 2. I didn't possibly risk hurting the feelings of that woman when I never called her again. It's helped me consider only the emotional connection with the women I date, without being driven to do anything I'd regret due to runaway horniness.

Negative: The other side of the coin above: The fact that I'm having sex with hot 22 year olds does effect my judgement of older women, and there are definitely women who I didn't give a chance, even though we seemed to get along well, because I just didn't feel like accepting this much compromise in sexual attraction ... but meanwhile, if I wasn't comparing her to a 22-year-old, I might have become sexually attracted to her in time, as we connected emotionally.

In all, I think pursuing this probably on balance is making things a little harder for my civilian love life

If you aren't physically attracted to your civvy, move on. It's not fair to sting her along.

It just completely phucks with your mind when you can feel that you can have virtually any woman that you want sexually (for a price), and your ATF has you believing that it's realer than it is, and then you go to real life, where suddenly you have a hard time even getting close to you what you want. In many ways it makes you unrealistically pickier IRL and less willing to settle because the wife is for life and even more expensive. I am projecting a bit, but i believe it is that way for many PLs that get too deep into this, and i probably have gotten to deep into it.

This isn't just a problem for middle-aged divorcees. I'm 35 and I've always been single. Women gush over how handsome I am (because I pay them LOL). I went on a date recently with a woman my own age whom I met online. She turned out to be quite overweight. Her pictures were a bit deceiving. Now I happen to prefer thick women, but you know how it is, a thick stripper is the equivalent of only a medium-sized civilian with big tatas. Anyway, yes, we had sex, but now I hear from her almost every single day. I wish I hadn't met her because now I feel really badly about this. It feels wrong. The whole thing feels wrong.

I do this to myself about once a year: I put the clubs on hold and go on a few online dates, and I always regret it afterwards. Finding a super-attractive girl on a dating site is hard. Almost impossible. The best looking ones often get wifed up pretty early in life and we're left with the rest. The smoking hot ones who DO date online, well, they receive so many messages daily that it's almost impossible to get their attention. And then even if you do get their attention, what are the odds that they will have anything in common with you, as everyone here has already observed? And I wouldn't want to meet anyone through my friends or colleagues, that would be extremely uncomfortable if it doesn't work out. I think some guys are probably just better off paying for sex. It's a lonely life sometimes, but it is what it is.

^ And when friends (especially unmarried friends) try to set you up, they never set you up with someone they would be interested in (have to save those for themselves), but often just throw you a bone and expect you to accept it.

When friends try to set me up with someone - it always ends badly. My friends put on the hard sell - “he’s a nice guy” - “he’s a great dad” - safe lies. But then we go out a few times - and I try to fuck her very rough. I tie her down - snap her tits with a riding crop - or try to fist her (I use lots of lube - as I’m a gentleman!) - and then she never talks to me again! My friends really need to stop!

Interesting discussion. My history is similar to yours except that my time period with the “perfect paid woman,” and my time fucking nothing but strippers, was only about 2-3 years long. I now have a DC, and no longer rely upon strippers to meet my needs. Based upon my experience, I have three pieces of advice.

First, as I think most of us recognize, a paid sexual companion can never be perfect because they are paid. It’s an amazingly fun journey, but fucking young strippers only meets a PLs physical needs, not his emotional needs. At some point in his life, every man wants a woman who satisfies him sexually because she wants to, and not just because he is paying her to.

Second, for a man, a full time romantic companion must be physically attractive to him. She doesn’t have to look like a 20 yo red headed DS, but her naked body needs to get you hard. If it doesn’t, no matter how great the rest of the relationship is, the relationship will never be truly fulfilling for the guy.

It’s natural that guys who have spent years having sex with the most beautiful array of young women imaginable will have trouble getting the images of those young women out of their head. So I wouldn’t worry about that. But still your companion needs to turn you on sexually without you calling up Images in your mind of fucking attractive younger women. It’s ok to have those images, you will probably never get rid of them, but she needs to turn you on independently of those images. It is possible to find older women who turn you on sexually, but it does take work to find them.

Third, if you want a life with civilian women, you must break it off with your DS. This is what I did. I told my “perfect” sexual companion that I could not see her any more. It was a difficult thing to do. But it was definitely the right thing for me. I think its probably the right thing for you too.

Best of luck.

Interesting discussion, and as usual some thoughtful remarks from the mongers. Sal, if it helps the cause, while you are banging strippers, I can smoke weed and bang your civie girl. (Just kidding). Keep trying to find your soul mate in one way or the other.

TUSCL:free online group therapy fpr lomely divirced guys.

For

Divorced guys Lol

".... Read The Kempton-Wace Letters by Jack London. You will see that the dilemma of finding a woman who you are both compatible with and find sexually desirable is an age old problem ..."

LOL - yeah - seems hard to find a woman that you really like as a person but also really turns you on

If there was a method to finding the right chick (nice person that you really like to fuck) then most guys would already have a chick like that.

I don't have much to add except:

1. you may be overdoing-it w/ the strippers and kinda having a bad-reaction to over-whoreing - maybe if you focused in quality over quantity you may not feel the same way

2. strip-club bizarro-world is a turnkey operation - hot young strippers willing-and-able - just add water ($$$) and you get what you want - in the real-world it takes more effort and it's not prepacked like strip-clubs - i.e. if you keep at it better-chance of finding a suitable civvie

@JohnSmith69 - what is a DC?

^ DC = Dream Civvie

DS = Dream Stripper

Fuck yea I certainly feel ya dude. There are no absolute 'right' or 'wrongs' but you must know yourself and be brutally honesty with yourself. Sure everyone wants an incredible sexual experience. Which can be had from a 20 something hot stripper. But to me it's like a drug.... like crack or a line of coke.....incredible but short term high and there is a price to be paid. A civey will never give you the same rush, but some people find a psychological well being and feel hopeful in feeling loved, wanted and valued without a transactional relationship. I know that is an over-simplification and it's not that 'black and white', but only you know what you want and you seem to be smart enough on how to get it. Every gain you get comes at a price and ultimately you can't have it all and life makes you accept some compromises. Thanks for sharing.

@Sal - If the only thing you didn't like was her weight, why didn't you ask her to hit the gym with you? Lots of couples make workouts part of their daily lives.

@anon I did give that some thought. It would have taken her years to get of that much weight. She cried after I told her we weren't the right fit for each other. That was after just three dates. She really latched on to fast for me too. I don't know there were other things too. I'm going to start seeing another civie woman in the meantime based on the 4:30 am texting I'm doing with my biggest weakness DS looks like I'm taking her Christmas shopping next week and going to have crazy sex. John Smith is right I know, but just can't let go of the DS just yet.

I don't know about you, but did the world just get a little less interesting knowing that JS69 isn't chasing strippers any more?

NFL football did survive without Howard Cosell, Dennis Miller, and Chris Berman. I guess this too shall pass.

Lol joc13 yeah I noticed that too. I'm happy for him the dc must be pretty special. Ever happens to me prenup or forget about it this time.