Tax tips for republicans

Fuck you Jackie

Sounds good but challenge is the poor don't pay much in taxes now. Hard too give a tax break to someone that does not pay taxes. Democrats are Republicans now. Had full power under Obama and enacted a Republican HC plan. Makes no difference if their in power or not. All answer to corporate donors not the working class.

If you are going to collect more FICA, then you are going to have to eliminate the payment cap if you're going to be fair about it.

Many are calling for Citizenship Pay, and presumably tax free.

Now people with income get the fist money tax free, via std deduction and exemptions, and double that for a married couple, like $11k?

And then there is the Earned Income Tax Credit, and it can even be refundable, though it only helps people with children. Maybe though with Citizenship pay they would eliminate this.

But the basic idea, giving money to those at the bottom, is right. Like say Food Stamps. Poor people spend their money, and right away, and it recirculates. It is federal money, just like getting a contract to build a stealth bomber. But even it if was local taxation, it still helps the economy to siphon wealth downwards.

For the middle-class, the cost of living is always just the cost of keeping up with the Jones, that is relative.

SJG

Give a big tax break to upper 1/10th of 1% and cut benefits for the poor and elderly to pay for it. That's what Republicans are doing already.

You're basically telling republicans to be moderate democrats.

Yep, new healthcare law is nothing but class warfare.

The problem is that today's Democrats are basically the moderate Republicans of the ear before Reagan.

SJG

Before there is any talk about raising or lowering taxes, first thing is to get rid of all unnecessary spending, merge redundant agencies.

For example, why the hell do we need a BATF. While the gun lobby wants to get rid of it for different reasons, there still is a use for enforcement. The problem is the agency is relic of prohibition, whose operations can be shifted over to the commerce department, IRS and FBI. Getting rid of the agency would save 1 1/2 billion dollars plus the cost of congressional oversight.

Another area that can be significantly cut is our international assistance programs.

HUD is a complete fuck up that wastes money with no apparent improvement. The entire agency needs to be eliminated and it's funding sent to each state by a formula, based on the number of people below the poverty line in the state.

The department of labor is another agency which needs to be overhauled. The budget isn't as stupidly high as it was during the recession but is still way too large. It's only purpose should be to enforce labor laws, nothing else.

The department of education is another wasteful agency. It's only purpose should be to make sure that all states have the same quality of education. It doesn't need a seventy billion dollar budget to do that.

The office of personal management is also another waste. Most agencies have their own human resources anyway, so why the heck do we need another office with a budget of 84 billion to share responsibility with.

Why on earth should we be cutting our spending right now? Increase it!

The poor don't pay income taxes. They pay payroll taxes, and then they get rediculous credits, so that they usually get back more than they paid. The upper middle class and small business pay the most over blown taxes. Someone making ab 100k pays nearly 30 percent. can't cut that tho bc the upper middle class has to support corporate growth by paying for all of those "entitlements"/ "subsidies" whatever, that keep labor cheap and profit margins high as possible.

It costs the tax payer an average of $35k/annually to house a prisoner. That means I should be able to file for an extra dependent on my taxes each year!

Yeah, somebody needs to incentivize me to make more money, because right now I'm being incentivized to hide it, or move someplace where the tax burden is less.

The old adage "less is more" seems to fit. The less I do the more I keep.

BJ99: "The poor don't pay income taxes"

They aren't net contributors: i.e they receive more in benefits than they pay in taxes. I believe it's that way until you get to the top 20%. But if you listen to some of these lefties you would believe that the poor are the ones carrying the rich.

No, mostly the "upper middle class," carries the poor and the corporate growth though subsidies funneled through the poor.

No one on the top portion of authoritarian vs libertarian scale scale will cut subsidies. Left vs right isn't as important. Only a true libertarian, green peace, or maybe a progressive would actually reduce subsidies/ entitlements. The republicans always talk a big game, but those entitlements they bitch ab are actually helping to prop up their political supporters.

Dot forget small businesses cover both the employee match for FICA & SS as well as state taxes withheld and workers comp which is a tax like it or not which the workers mostly get back with their refunds and small businesses foot the bill the owners recieve nothing in return.

^^^^^^ The standard "my money" fallacy. Wages are negotiated in the free market. Employer matches for FICA and SS cost the employer nothing because it is all relative to other employers, and these others also have to pay. So it actually is coming from the potential wage money of the employee.

SJG

^^^^You are a fucking moron and don't have a clue as to what the fuck you are saying. That money doesn't materialize out of thin air it comes directly from the margins. You are a fucking leech and a real idiot. Payroll taxes are paid usually before payment is received and whether or not a bill is collected is due when the employees worked go duck your stupid self you have never made a payroll in your life just shut the fuck up you should stop being a fucking moron you blowhard jackass.

@SJG I am completely sick of all of you sanctimony and prevaricating bullshit I will never again respond to anything you have to say you lying sack of shit.

SJG: " Employer matches for FICA and SS cost the employer nothing"

Geee, if they cost the employer nothing they should quadruple them then. Nothing times 4 is still nothing. Great way to raise revenue, and apparently it doesn't cost anything.

@SJG: how about you spend 10 seconds trying to think of contradictions in your own arguments before you post, and save us from have to read your comically idiot non-sense?

It's definitely not "the upper middle class" who are paying for everyone both rich and poor either. They are net contributors, but most tax revenue is coming from the very top.

Kind of funny. I guess everybody thinks it's whatever socio-economic class they are in that's paying all the taxes mainly for the benefit of people in other classes.

About half of all tax revenue comes from the very top. Those making 100-200k pay ab 20 percent, which is fine, except they don't benefit from the subsidies that the poor or the big businesses receive, unless you count dollar chicken fries and whatever they manage to make in the stock market, but i doubt it comes anywhere close to evening out for most in the middle and upper middle class. I don't think the poor, or big businesses should receive unfair subsidies.

What "unfair subsidies" do big businesses receive?

Seems like the sort of thing you should have some idea of. I'm not the pissing match type. Do your own research, or don't.

^^^ Lol! Yeah, I didn't think you would be able to name any.

There's just no point in discussing something w someone how has to debate obvious little points. I'm not interested in proving rightness. I care ab gaining insight and learning something new, so that I can be better. I don't care ab you learning anything, and you aren't very enlightening for me to talk to.

^^^ got called bluffing, trying to talk her way out of it. Not working.

Right. Bc big business don't have access to subsidies that small business do not. when was the last time you saw a small restaurant accepting food stamps? You can't see anything past Immediate facts, which is why ppl like you blame everything on "the left," and if your are taking ab dem vs rep , they basically the same anyways. You don't even know what you are arguing against. Not fun, and not worth the effort to explain anything complicated to you.

Oh, I see so people are paying for their iPhone with food stamps, and that's unfair. Without the food stamps they would be going under. Okay, I think I'm following you now. Thanks for the clarifications!

If they are paying for their iPhone w food stamps it's bc they get so much that they have extras and sell them. There's a reason food stamps only goes up, no matter who is in office. It's the food producers and major grocers who benefit. Why would they care if someone sells them? Every dollar put out is one that someone spends on their product. I'm sure small grocers technically have access to accepting food stamps, but access and accessibility aren't the same thing. And it wasn't the lobbyists paid by the conglomerate of "food insecure" who pushed for fast food restaurants to accept them either; it was the big fast food companies. Both dems and republicans do nothing but increase subsidies. They just have different ways of marketing them to voters.

I'm playing "Switzerland" over here. Dougster has been as apolitical as possible when it comes to party lines, and that is intelligent in itself, but BJ99 also brings up valid points with a refreshing view. At least either of you aren't wacked out but jobs on the extreme like other posters.

The system will never be perfect or even close to it, due to our style of government and the pendulum swinging back and forth adapting to current needs while still holding on to our core constitutional values. I like sifting through the discord to find some validity in people's opinions, and the both of you have more solid ground to stand on compared to the supposedly high moral ground of the extremes.

You are so sweet, meat! You should be a politician. ;)

Ok, gotta admit that I haven't thought much about food stamps. I'll have to do my research on who is and is not to allowed to accept food stamps. Maybe it is a unfair subsidy!

Not sure about mandatory drug testing for welfare recipients.

On one hand it could incentivize them to be more productive citizens, yet many people on welfare tend to have mental issues and resort to self medicating a disease that modern health care hasn't caught up to.

It's possible a basic income could help this issue, or at least take some of the sting off the disparity of the poor/mentally challenged.

Our country's tax and loan laws encourage the most productive workers (the secondary earner in a tax paying hh is basically free taxes for the gov vs staying home w disabled/mentally ill/or children) to remain in the work force, while taxing them and using these taxes to help support the less productive members. Fine. If that's what ppl want.

I personally do not like this system bc the ppl who pay the majority of taxes in this country (middle class AND wealthy.. tho it won't make much difference for them) don't benefit equally, and wind up both working, and using their after taxes income, and savings, to care for their loved ones, or themselves if something happens to them, while the already poor get it for nothing.

@Bj99 I am well versed in all of this I have been running a small business most of my adult life my point was simple between the EITC, SS, & tax refunds, I pay, the employee collects. The money comes from me I could change models if it would be my goal like all of the new startups give them IC status like many of my competitors and no longer be responsible for their FICA, SS, stop providing workers comp and shift the burden on them. I would no longer need to carry three employees to administer these problems shift the cost of trade insurance just pay the and issue 1099s and I guarantee you I would see a 25-30% jump in my personal profit.

So why don't you do that?

Honestly, I got what sjg said ab it not being "your" money bc of competition in the labor market, which assumes that all employees know what their employers pay in for them, and consider this to be a part of their wages. That's theoretically how it should work. It's the economist thought that all information is known and all things are equal. If this was true, that money would be considered to be a part of the employees wages from the time they took the job and they would respect it as such. Unfortunately, most do not know what benefits they receive from their employers tax wise, so it doesn't give the employer any edge in gaining better employees, unless they are educated, and even then many of them are too shortsighted to figure it out or care.

The reason we don't do that is we started this business over 28 years ago we have squired the assets of several other companies and we have many long tile employees some whom have been here since the start. I feel the same sense of obligation to them as I do to my family and I appreciate the fact that I have had a good life with many blessings. Many of my people are like family and it goes both ways I would never tolerate a bigoted loser like SJG an none of my employees are uninformed, as to what my costs are, unless they want to be and those usually don't last Arron's here.

^^^Typo city,squired is squired, Arron's is around, tile is time. Sorry about the rant but that fucker needs to shut the fuck up if as he is so fond of saying he was standing in front of me I'd smack him in the head I'm not being ambiguous as he tries to be.

No, I get it. Personal values are as important as anything else, and can be expensive. If do cheap bastard things, then you are in fact a cheap bastard. It's your own small business and you have the privledge of choosing your personal values over potentially short term profit. It's my own personal feelings that this is a good thing. It also sounds like, in your case, you feel that your employees do recognize their benefits and hopefully do reward your company w their loyalty, and trust.

If you don't need all of your employees to remain employees for some group sized benefits, couldn't you let the ones who would rather be ICs choose that, and offer them slightly higher pay and performance based bonuses from the savings, instead? Any new employees could be ICs also. You'd still need hr ppl tho. My club lets dancers choose if we want to be employees, or ICs.

@Bj99 That is not available here we are in the construction industry work almost exclusively, on high and mid rise structures, the insurances that we carry do not allow for employees to work side by side with ICs as a matter of fact certain aspects of our projects, require subs skilled in other facets than our specialties, they must complete their portion of a project before we can begin. Additionally my subs are legit subs they work for many different contractors, my employees are not allowed by contract to work for other employers while in our employ. I am not complaining as I am satisfied with the way our business runs, I personally have gained much from my employees, I have been to hundreds of birthday celebrations, many baptisms, more than a few weddings, and there have been some sad occasions, a few funerals over the years, but I still feel blessed one of my favorite things is having two of my employees add their sons to our family and work directly supervised by their fathers. Also my office administrator is the sister in law of my original administrator started working in my office when she was still in high school part time and when her sister in laws husband received a promotion that required her to move out of state she seamlessly took over that full time position, she is now 28 with a baby and a husband and has worked here for 16 years, like i said there are so many blessings that go beyond money I wouldn't have it any other way.

25 and Dougster, no we don't want to arbitrarily increase the employer matching contributions because it is actually the employee who is paying for that.

And 25, you are the biggot.

SJG

And 25, you are a looser because you can't even see the nose on the front of your face.

SJG

Political thread on ignore.

Sharkhunter on ignore.

Talk about taxation is always political.

SJG

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