Trans insanity: Doctors claim children know they're trans practically from womb

If you always knew you were straight why do you think gay or trans people haven't always known?

^ how long before you figured out you were a douche?

Progressive = child abuser. Progressive = ignoramus. Progressive = vermin.

2 and 3 year olds barely know anything.

Gay people aren't getting treated with irreversible surgeries and drugs with lifelong consequences. boy We're back to the days of troglodyte gender roles. The only difference is rather than ridiculing the girl who plays with trucks, they're taking out her uterus.

And the boy who plays with dolls, rather than calling him a nancy boy or a sissy, the solution is to lop off his dick and balls.

I didn't know homosexuals existed until I got picked up by one while hitch-hiking when I was 14. Sure, we'd insulinës each other by saying "eat shit" and "suck my dick", but I didn't know people actually did it. An old, disgusting geezer picked me up and said "how'd you like to have your cock sucked"? I was shocked and just said "no thank you".

we'd insult each other...

“A good portion of children do know as early as from the womb”

Yeah right, right now there are boys waiting to be born thinking to themselves 'I'm a girl, why do I have a dick?

Who the fuck thinks this shit up and how can any sane person think it's acceptable and true?

This is going too far. Sorry. Folks need time to discover themselves. This is a dangerous thing to promote, as very young children might be labeled as trans (or another type of identifier) - and then it can be difficult to remove that label.

As a father to 3 children, I can say with certainly that they don't even really think much about sexuality until they start getting close to puberty. To believe that that an elementary school aged child is equipped to make life altering decisions of that type is ludicrous.

Any parent who makes that decision for a young child should have his/her head caved in with a baseball bat. I wouldn't dream of doing anything to my children that would alter their natural courses through puberty. If one of them makes it to adulthood and decides that she wants to be something else, at least she can process the enormity of that decision. To make this forever decision for a young child just because little Jimmy prefers dolls to trucks, or just because little Sarah is a tomboy who prefers to play with the boys, should be criminal.

Again. If you know you're straight then why do you assume gay and trans people don't know they're gay or trans? How old were you before you knew you were straight? Were you confused about it?

iceydougee, did you know you were going to be a troll on tuscl when you were in that possum womb?

Shouldn’t this be in the medical forum👨‍⚕️

Treating 2 and 3 year olds for gender dysphoria? Here's a novel idea: How bout we don't allow anyone that eats their boogers to make permanent life altering decisions.

If you think one sexuality is unnatural then they all have to be since they're all sexualitues.

Are you sure you're not just gay and confused about being straight? When did you choose to be straight?

I agree with Rick Dugan. He speaks from experience, as he has children, and he knows it’s dangerous to make irreversible decisions at a young age. In all honesty, it should be a criminal offense.

I’m not admitting to anything - but I don’t agree with datinman. Lol!

Some idiot running for the local school board actually had the grammar school students take a gender identity survey - without getting the parent’s approval. That idiot is no longer part of the board, and a few other board members are now out as well.

Datinman nails it.

It's funny how progressives say 18 year olds aren't mature enough to decide to take on student loan debt think 5 year olds have the mental capacity to decide to irreversibly sterilize themselves.

Again when did you choose to be heterosexual? At what age did you make that decision? Should your parents have intervened?

You won't answer coz this thread is just a homophobic cookie toss

^ I realized as a little kid that titties were awesome and only grown in that belief.

Icee, do you support sterilization of 5 year olds who think they might be the opposite gender?

===> "Again when did you choose to be heterosexual? At what age did you make that decision? Should your parents have intervened?"

For me girls started getting less "icky" when I was around 10, but that was an evolving process over a few years.

But what does that have to do with whether it's ok to sterilize a prepubescent child? You're conflating sexual orientation with sexual identity and even the orientation question is one that some kids grapple with well into their 20s. How could any parent possibly believe that the best course of action is to sterilize a child long before that child can mature and make his/her own decisions?

Once again....

iceydougee, did you know you were going to be a troll on tuscl when you were in that possum womb?

You won't answer coz this thread is just a possumphobic cookie toss Lulz

I knew I was straight as early as I was able to understand the concept. But no, not as early as 2 or in the womb.

I question though these news sources, I find them to be disreputable.

And Skibum wrote, "Progressive = child abuser. Progressive = ignoramus. Progressive = vermin."

He is still mad because even though he wrote the words for Leni Riefenstahl's "Infernal Jew", just because he is Jewish she refused to list him in the credits.

SJG

In My Dreams youtube.com

^ "I question though these news sources, I find them to be disreputable"

They cite the actual center's video. Saying "I find that site disreputable" says you were too fucking lazy to click the link and see that it actually linked to primary source material.

Anyone else noticed Icee runs away when faced with a tough question?

Icee, do you support the castration of a five year old boy who thinks he's a girl?

Tetra, that is my post above you.

The only video I can see is this one with Diane Ehrensaft

thepostmillennial.com

They talk about their clinic and about meeting with people, but they don't actually say what they do, or what they have done.

I find this: diversitybch.ucsf.edu

I listen to it. Yes I am always opposed to psychiatric medications.

About gender discussions, I think that could be okay, so long as you are letting Child Protective Services check out the home situations.

Gender change hormones, I have questions about that and minors.

And about surgery, I cannot go along with that an minors.

But then again, I have never knowingly met anyone who might want that, and all the more so a minor.

So I would like to see and hear more about it so that I might better understand.

I still do find a lot of these kinds of news sources to be less than credible.

SJG

@SJG, you don't have to find that news source credible. I don't dismiss shit as "hey, it's CNN or Salon, I can dismiss without reading in." They cite what comes from the horse's mouth. Boston Children's Hospital talks about performing "gender affirming" hysterectomies.

To you, does this count as "psychiatric medication"? Even if it isn't an SSRI or atypical antipsychotic?

Whether or not you know someone who wants it or not is irrelevant. Nor do I, but personal experience isn't an argument. As far as I'm concerned, adults can do whatever they want. But encouraging a child to question their gender, at a time when their hormones are going wild and uncomfortable bodily transitions are happening, is abuse.

Icee seems to think people are trans from birth, and can't address whether a hysterectomy on a 5-year-old is appropriate. I want him to say "yes" or "no."

I still find the info incomplete, but it is enough to make me concerned and seeking more so that I will understand.

Even if people are trans from birth, I still would not trust their ability to koow that or to have the necessary agency. I need to see much more.

SJG

In My Dreams youtube.com

Aww dad just be gay!: youtube.com

It's definitely not OK to make a decision like that for a child before they're fully capable of understanding the ramifications.

It's definitely not OK to pressure a child into making a choice like that before they're fully capable of understanding the ramifications.

It's definitely not OK to prevent a child from learning about the fact that transsexualism is an actual, real thing (despite what some Bronze Age snowflakes might think) and to let them know about the possibilities open to them if they feel different than society tells them they should.

^ AGREED!

And this is why I want to see more information before I form an opinion about what is happening now.

SJG

UCSF universityofcalifornia.edu

Q: How is the process of seeking gender-affirming care different for minors?

A: If a child is prepubertal, there's no medical treatment that's given. The only decision-making is, do they use their chosen name and pronoun? Do they present themselves with clothing and hairstyle in a different way?

There are specific medical criteria to diagnose different stages of puberty. When a child gets to a stage of early puberty called Tanner stage 2, if the child is still expressing what is called gender dysphoria, or gender incongruence, then, depending on the age of the child and a bunch of other factors, such as family, environment, and so on, and after an assessment that includes an evaluation by a qualified mental health clinician, puberty delaying becomes an option.

I call them puberty blockers, but really they just kind of put the brakes on puberty. It's fully reversible.

At UCSF, the Child and Adolescent Gender Center assists patients with this care. My work focuses on adults.

Q: When is gender-affirming surgery considered?

A: Like any surgery, there are different criteria depending upon the procedure.

Historically these assessments were very like, ‘Are you really trans enough to have this surgery? Prove to me you're really trans,’ and we don't want to do that, although a mental health assessment can be useful, and is sometimes required to align expectations and goals.

What we want to do is make sure the patient is really prepared for the potential for unsatisfactory outcomes or complications. That they have adequate support in place to deal with potential complications and the rigors and demands of self-recovery, which can be months depending on the procedure performed. These kinds of things happen for most surgeries. You go in for weight loss surgery, you’re meeting with a social worker and mental health clinicians to talk about recovery, for example.

We focus on what assessments should look like so that we’re not creating a gatekeeping or stigmatizing environment, but still providing important assessment and preparation so that it centers truly informed consent.

Q: Gender-affirming health care has been politicized a great deal recently, especially with kids. Do you think this kind of care is at risk?

A: That’s a difficult question to answer. In the early 2000’s in Los Angeles, when I was in the midst of my own transition, I got thrown out of a bathroom in a restaurant in downtown L.A. That seems like a lifetime ago for people who are in their twenties, but it was not that long ago at all.

What we have is still fragile and is not baked in. I think that as generational turnover continues in this country, the size of that majority who are supportive of these issues will continue to grow. At the same time, there are some very real, politicized threats in states such as Florida and Texas, which are aiming to restrict or even outlaw these treatments altogether on political rather than scientific grounds.

I think that there’s a great deal of structural risk at the federal level that makes it entirely possible that there will be legal difficulty coming for a lot of different groups in this country, including sexual and gender minorities. In 2021, the Supreme Court ruled in Bostock that Title IX includes protection around gender identity. But they also recently overturned the Roe V. Wade decision, and as part of the decision, Justice Thomas made comments that suggest this court will consider overturning other precedents as well, should they come before them. Would they turn around and say, ‘No, we don’t think that anymore?’ It is a concerning time indeed.

New York Times Magazine nytimes.com

audio available.

SJG

^

Did they botch your gender affirming surgery? Is that why you're a sexless eunuch with a sewn shut asshole? Is that the reason you despise Cesar Chavez? Were you force fed wine made from grapes smashed by Cesar's feet? Was Cesar fucking your wife because you're a sexless eunuch? Did Cesar's dog shit in your box and you came home from the burger king dumpster only to find your sleeping quarters filled with dog shit? Is that why you eat dog shit with your burger king morsels now?

Here’s a hypothetical situation - that could easily cause an issue here.

Let’s say a kid wants to be a pirate - and he dresses up like Jack Sparrow. His parents see him looking more flamboyant than an actual pirate. They decide that Johnny wants to be Jill - because he’s wearing scarves and necklaces and earrings - and eye makeup.

But, Johnny is just living in a 7 year old’s dream world of pirates living on the high seas. He’s not interested in transitioning. His parents see this and draw immediate conclusions and begin to get him ready for surgery..

These "gender clinics" make it out like "puberty blockers" are safe as mother's milk. Read the side effects of Lupron, which was developed for prostate cancer. Sterility, bone and tooth loss, other cancers. Read the product label.

Yet they gloss it over because trans stuff is sacred these days, right? Joe Biden called it the civil rights issue of the day (lulz).

Same reason monkeypox, largely a disease of promiscuous gay men, is a public health emergency but 100,000 dying of fentanyl overdoses isn't. Because gay sex is sacred and needs to be protected. After all, we can't go around saying unprotected promiscuous anal sex is risky and should be discouraged, right?

It's good to be the alphabet mafia under a Democrat administration.

"the fucking trannies are playing into the childs idea of fun, fiction and imagination... "

This is exactly what they're doing and then the schools influence the kids with parades for gay and trans kids.

SJG "I question though these news sources, I find them to be disreputable."

Those videos were straight from Boston Children's youtube account but they have now hidden all their trans-child videos and now Twitter may have also blocked them. Transgender Reproductive Health Care Service | Boston Children's Hospital youtube.com

This is one of the videos that Boston Children's has hidden: youtu.be

Here's another video from Yale that hasn't yet been hidden by the perpetrators:

Yale Medicine: Meet Psychologist Christy Olezeski, PhD youtu.be "working with gender expansive individuals, 3 to 25"

===> "It's definitely not OK to prevent a child from learning about the fact that transsexualism is an actual, real thing (despite what some Bronze Age snowflakes might think) and to let them know about the possibilities open to them if they feel different than society tells them they should."

That's great in theory, but the questions are when this should be introduced and by whom.

I am in FL and I very much agree with what Gov. DeSantis has done on this. Putting aside the drama queen hyperbole being splashed around by too many media outlets, the reality is that it simply prohibits discussions of sexual topics, including alternative lifestyles, with children too young to properly process them. These young minds have enough to deal with. Suddenly putting their previously unquestioned genders into question shouldn't be one of them.

As far as who should be doing this, it is the job of teachers of instruct young children on the ABCs and 123s, not the Birds and the Bees. That last piece is my job. Some claimed that what DeSantis did was unnecessary overkill, but during the pandemic, when we suddenly got granular insights into what was being covered in classes, many FL parents were shocked to find children's books being used in these classrooms which contained alternative lifestyle and/or gender dysmorphia themes.

Our children do not exist to serve as validation tools for the lifestyle choices and/or social beliefs of others. The pattern is becoming increasingly clear - first supposedly responsible adults fuck their heads up with concepts that they cannot truly process, then similarly oriented psychiatrists convince gullible parents, using what is increasingly being understood to be quack science, to sterilize and then radically alter their kids forever.

Other industrialized nations, realizing that this has gone too far, have actually started pulling back from this stuff. The U.S. is way behind its European counterparts in understanding the fallacy of allowing young children and their parents to make these choices. But it starts with not fucking up the heads of these kids in the first place with concepts that they should not be exposed to at such a young age.

When I was raising my children, this type of subject never came up, so I have no idea if this stuff is really as common as y'all are making it out to be. I think it's moronic, to even consider this type of treatment, or any other irreversible types of elective therapies, for minor age children, or even immature young adolescents, or even young adults, my best guess is this is just a trigger topic to irritate people, and used mostly by people with a political axe to grind. Topics of this type, really don't apply to most of your lives, I personally have never been affected by anything like this, so why get so worked up over this.

^ Sadly 25 times have changed. Mission creep has been a real problem in schools for some time now. Increasingly teachers and administrators have come to believe that social values and beliefs are part of their mandates, which then allows them to justify things that historically never would have been acceptable. But knowing that parents might object, they were cagey about limiting what parents saw.

It wasn't too bad here, which doesn't surprise me as this is a rather conservative part of FL. But in some of the Tampa and Miami area schools some of the materials that parents found out about when kids switched to remote learning were more problematic. Same held true in a number of schools around the country.

So now parents around the country are becoming much more active with their local school boards and are demanding much more transparency. Overall this is a good thing, though every so often it gets a little out of hand.

Listening to this audio: nytimes.com

I am concerned about this, and I know that I don't know enough about it yet to take a position.

There hormone treatments and puberty blockers are serious things. Now they have said that before puberty there is zero medical treatment, they only talk about names and pronouns.

But it must be at the very start of puberty that they would give out these puberty blockers.

And they talk about breast enlargement or removal at age 15.

Now I am not usually going to side with the Right on culture war issues. And I do stand up for LGBTQ rights.

But this is something else. Minors cannot consent to sex. Having sex with them is always are serious felony. I know a guy who served 10 years for that.

So why can they consent to this physical gender therapy?

When it comes to the doctors that parents take their kids to to have them put on psychiatric drugs, I want them prosecuted in the International Court for Crimes Against Humanity, and I want them to receive the death penalty.

So how is this juvenile gender therapy different?

I still do not know anywhere near enough about this.

SJG

^

Did they botch your gender affirming surgery? Is that why you're a sexless eunuch with a sewn shut asshole? Is that the reason you despise Cesar Chavez? Were you force fed wine made from grapes smashed by Cesar's feet? Was Cesar fucking your wife because you're a sexless eunuch? Did Cesar's dog shit in your box and you came home from the burger king dumpster only to find your sleeping quarters filled with dog shit? Is that why you eat dog shit with your burger king morsels now? Is the reason you spew so much shit online because someone sewed your asshole shut? Was it your EX wife that did the sewing to get revenge for you being an impotent psychotic creep?

^ Your asshole closure surgery was a complete success. Now all you can do is regurgitate.

SJG

Above audio explains about how state by state opposition started to develop to this Gender Therapy.

Explains that usually conservatives will defend parental authority. But in this arena they were opposed to parental authority.

Interesting. When it comes to Mental Health and Autism Spectrum I see parental authority as the start of the problem. I see that this could likely be true with this gender therapy too. The child's feeling that they should have a different gender has developed out of structural conflict with the parents.

SJG

@SJG: Not all parental authority is created equal. I am also against parents beating their kids with baseball bats as a form of discipline, or starving their kids for days to teach them a lesson, etc. That doesn't mean I am against the presumption of parental authority in general, such as in matter of child discipline, just against the use of that authority to perpetrate blatant abuse.

If you knew you were straight from early childhood. Tgwy know they're gay.

Rick, usually problems develop because the parent is using the child, to get back at someone for what was done to them, and they rationalize this with the idea that children need to be broken.

About this Trans and Gender Therapy, I am having a hard time relating to it. For one thing I have never knowingly met a teenager who felt that they were of the wrong gender. Maybe they dress in somewhat of a trans way, but that is as far as it goes. And I certainly have never felt any desire to be the other gender.

I have never felt same sex attraction and I am not open to that. But I can see how someone could feel that. And maybe for young people today this is not such a big deal.

There is a citation in the above article to someone who says that these surgeries should not be allowed until age 25, as that is about the minimum for someone to really be able to know such a thing.

Minors cannot consent to sex. Maybe this is overlooked with people their own age. But it stops them from having sex with experience people.

And when living with their parents and being financially supported by them, there are still all kinds of life experience they lack.

If a juvenile wants to experiment with names, pronouns, clothes and same sex attraction, I see no problem with this. And I say this even though I have never done this and never would.

But I cannot see how the quality of life and their development for a juvenile would ever be enhanced by these things or be something they would need to depend on. I see their feelings that they have to change genders as just some kind of a structural conflict they are having with their parents. And it is the parents who are culpable.

SJG

"If you knew you were straight from early childhood. Tgwy know they're gay."

@Icee, stop dodging. You don't need irreversible surgery to live a gay lifestyle.

At which age should a child be able to undergo an irreversible sex change surgery?

Your answer should be a number.

I am still trying to understand this, but maybe I would say min age 21years. And these hormones and puberty blockers still pack an effect which maybe irreversible. So I would say also 21 years.

And really I think this is quite far "out there", so maybe there should be other legal requirements which have to be satisfied.

Certainly a juvenile or someone being supported by their parents should be ineligible.

SJG

In My Dreams youtube.com

Newshour youtube.com

^ Your asshole closure surgery was a complete success. Now all you can do is regurgitate.

But... Did they botch your gender affirming surgery? Is that why you're a sexless eunuch with a sewn shut asshole? Is that the reason you despise Cesar Chavez? Were you force fed wine made from grapes smashed by Cesar's feet? Was Cesar fucking your wife because you're a sexless eunuch? Did Cesar's dog shit in your box and you came home from the burger king dumpster only to find your sleeping quarters filled with dog shit? Is that why you eat dog shit with your burger king morsels now? Is the reason you spew so much shit online because someone sewed your asshole shut? Was it your EX wife that did the sewing to get revenge for you being an impotent psychotic creep?

TheeOSU had a bad night under his lamp post. Asshole sewn shut has cost him half of his service menu.

SJG

In My Dreams youtube.com

Newshour youtube.com

^

^ Your asshole closure surgery was a complete success. Now all you can do is regurgitate shit.

^ AM for ingesting, PM for regurgitating.

SJG

^

^ Your asshole closure surgery was a complete success. Now all you can do is regurgitate shit. Takes it down his throat 24/7

@SJG, you know I generally think you're nuttier than squirrel shit, but you're a voice of sanity on this.

@Icee, on the other hand, has a question to answer. At what age should a child be allowed to choose, independently, to have their born sex organs removed?

I still want to read more about his before I commit to a position. This is complex and very alien territory for me.

SJG

In My Dreams youtube.com

zzounds.com

^ And that's fair.

Icee, on the other hand, says some people know they're trans from birth, and said so in the context of gender reassignment surgeries.

These clinics are saying they treat children as young as 2-3, and talk about hysterectomies on teenagers.

So I'm asking him again, at what age should people be able to consent--with or without their parents wishes--to have their sex organs at birth removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

Tetra, I also have doubts about these clinic doctors really believing that they are serving the needs of their clients when they do this stuff on juveniles.

So then either it is for money, or it is for the ego gratification of the doctor.

And this last way is the central component of the allegation against Josef Mengele. And it is on account of him more than anyone else, that the Statute of Limitations on War Crimes and Crimes Against Humanity was lifted.

The hunt for Mengele did not end until there was positive genetic identification of his remains.

en.wikipedia.org

SJG

In My Dreams youtube.com

zzounds.com

25 "so I have no idea if this stuff is really as common as y'all are making it out to be."

This paper from Boston Childrens says that in the last 3 years this one hospital has done 65 surgeries on minors. 15 min age for mastectomies, 17 min age for genital surgery. ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

In the UK, lawyers claim 1,000 families will be part of a lawsuit against the Tavistock gender clinic.

My tranny 8n da shit truck is named Allison bitches

SJG and TheOSU, that’s a hilarious discussion you had going on there!

They know they're gay just like you know you're straight

Icee, stop ignoring.

At what age should people be able to consent--with or without their parents wishes--to have their sex organs at birth removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

Sex reassignment surgeries have been done without a child's consent for decades.

And saying kids are choosing these surgeries is ridiculous. A few sensationalist stories aren't the norm.

The reality is about not forcing gender roles onto kids and letting them develop naturally. Just like you are allowed to naturally develop your sexuality

Icee, the answer to my question is a number.

At what age should people be able to consent--with or without their parents wishes--to have their sex organs at birth removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

I don't think there have been any gender reassignment surgeries on minors until very recent times. The only exceptions would have been those with hermaphrodite genitalia. And even this remains controversial.

And Icey, what you are saying, done without a child's consent? And so what then is it based on, and how is that different from Josef Mengele?

SJG

Jane - School of Rock youtube.com

@SJG, surgeries on hermaphrodite or intersex genitalia (which are a legit medical condition) are a completely different issue, and do not speak to trans gender reassignment surgery.

Icee, at what age should people be able to consent to have their healthy, birth sex organs removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

And Icee, you say "without a child's consent", what then is that based on?

SJG

At what age did you know your sexuality? Why do you assume others are different? This is just another transphobic thread

@Icee, my sexuality didn't involve having any organs chopped off or my body shot up with side-effect-heavy drugs.

Stop deflecting and answer my question.

At what age should people be able to consent to have their healthy, birth sex organs removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

And icee do you some how think ok to do such surgery without a minor's consent. and if they have to consent, under what conditions can they, and should they also be deemed able to consent to sex.

SJG

^ Your asshole closure surgery was a complete success. Now all you can do is regurgitate shit. Now you can take it down your throat 24/7

You're citing extreme examples.

You're transphobic and refuse to acknowledge even the simple fact that they know what sexuality they are just like you know what you are.

Your rants here are in line with your transphobic rants elsewhere on here

More from Boston, here the doctor seems to be implying that the child can keep their doctor's consultation secret from their parents. twitter.com

Democrat controlled states are passing laws that allow minors to get medical treatment without the consent of their parents:

The Left's alarming push to sever the parent-child relationship has hit the medical industry libsoftiktok.com

A safe place for trans kids is bad? When did you earn you were straight??

Icee's hiding behind insults again.

At what age should people be able to consent to have their healthy, birth sex organs removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

If "they know", that would imply this can be done at an early age. Icee, do you believe a 6 year old girl should be able to undergo a hysterectomy so she can live as a boy?

I learned what "gay" meant when I was 8 or 9 and that I wasn't it.

Icee, is that an appropriate age, if someone knows they're trans, to consent to have their healthy, birth sex organs removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

The point if this thread is to make a.transphobic stance. Just like the other transphobic threads here.

These centers offer medical psychological and legal help to the transgendered. They're not chopping off sex organs as a communist conspiracy against hetero white men as many on here assume

In this a clip a doctor admits “there is not a full range of evidence to support the treatments that we’re using but there is a lot of anecdotal evidence”

twitter.com

Anecdotal, not science.

Again Icee goes for the pHoBiC!!!111 rather than address the question.

At what age should people be able to consent to have their healthy, birth sex organs removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

Answer must be a number.

Tetradon you latch on to any thread about trans people and spout transphobic hysteria. You have a history of that and this thread is no different.

You almost go full sjg on this topic.

And yahtzee has an unhealthy obsession with posting about kids and sexuality on what's basically a prostitution forum

Transphobic rants about whether or not the existence of trans people is natural deserve zero consideration. Just call them out

Again, you attack something that was never said (no one said trans people don't exist) rather than address the plainly worded question.

At what age should people be able to consent to have their healthy, birth sex organs removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

Again he can't answer. The woman beating, manipulating, lying, addicting, thieving pimp thinks a few progressive positions make his depraved ass holler than the rest of us.

At what age should people be able to consent to have their healthy, birth sex organs removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

Tetradon, in cse you missed it, Icee just continues to regurgitate the same comments over and over. He will keep doing it while others keep responding as if he just posted a novel fresh point. It's just what trolls do.

^ He said trans people knew from birth. I knew I was straight very early, I knew what gay people were and that I wasn't that.

I'm giving him a chance to clarify that he isn't in favor of mutilating children with a clear answer to this question.

At what age should people be able to consent to have their healthy, birth sex organs removed so they can live as their preferred gender?

^ Why do you care, he won't give you a straight answer, and what ever position he takes will just be self contradicted in a future post

I get all that Tetradon, but scroll back up and look at how many times he has said the same stuff over and over. He's just fishing for reactions now.

Because I love watching him sweat.

^

No offense bud but I think he enjoys the back and forth banter with you. You really want to see him sweat, ride him to the point that he puts you on ignore. It worked for me although I know he still reads my posts because we b homiez lulz

Gender reassignment surgery isn't genital mutilation like circumcision.

Funny how I'm called a troll for pointing out the obvious that this is just a transphobic homophobic thread.

Some of the bigots here go full sjg on these kinds of threads.

@TheeOSU, I'm having more fun with this than he is. He calls me "transphobic" like the insult should make me recoil in fear.

It means nothing from anyone, let alone from the barely-literate woman beating, manipulating, lying, addicting, thieving Vegas pimp who is justifying sex changes for children. I'll add this to his litany of moral deviancy.

You have fun talking about kids sexuality on a whore monger forum? That's all you

You want to tear out the sex organs of mentally ill children; I want them to be left alone.

No, we can't allow anyone to do sexual alteration surgery on minors, and if this has been going on, we cannot allow it to go unpunished.

If this is going on I would like to read more about it. Or I should say, I would like to see more articles. It is not the kind of thing I really look foward to reading about, but it is incumbent on all of use to put a stop to it and to make sure the perpetrators are made into public examples.

SJG

^ Icee thinks you're a bigot, now.

I don't have lot of patience for people who use the medial system to fuck with juveniles. You can call it mental health, or you can call it autism, or you can just let it be anyone of a number of other things regularly used for medical abuse, or now it can be gender reassignment. No matter, my patience with the people who do this is zero.

SJG

Omg the world is just too crazy. I think I might need a lobotomy just reading this nonesense.

I'm not against trans, this is a free(ish) country, but I think kids should be adults first before they switch sides.

In most cities on earth the doctors at Children's hospital would be in jail for violence towards children, but when you're a progressive being a sick, vile, child abuser earns you a medal.

Looking up this thread I find:

twitter.com

I guess this is about puberty blockers.

No I don't like the idea of that being done. I don't think that is a minor thing. I don't think a juvenile is able to consent to that. But I still need to see more credible source discussion on this issue.

SJG

stupid said "Funny how I'm called a troll for pointing out the obvious that this is just a transphobic homophobic thread."

It's actually trans ideology that is homophobic because many gay men like feminine things and many gay women like masculine things and according to trans ideology that make them trans. Many adult homosexuals are realizing this and don't want to be associated with the trans-movement and feel that trans people have hijacked the homosexual communities fight for civil rights and are endangering it.

So I look further up this thread and I find:

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

" Over the 3-year study period, a total of 204 gender affirmation surgical cases were identified: 177 chest/top and 27 genital/bottom surgeries (Table 1). Most cases were masculinizing chest reconstructions 177/204 (86.8%) with 65/177 (36.7%) of those patients being less than 18 years of age. Patient characteristics included a median age of 18 years old, with the overwhelming majority of the patients (90.7%) identifying as transmen. Ninety-five percent of patients presenting for gender reassignment surgeries were healthy American Society of Anesthesiologists physical status (ASA-PS) I and II. "

Yes, 204 surgeries and 36.7% being minors is of great concern. I have never talked to someone who has done this, but it concerns me greatly.

SJG

What is the min age for a woman getting breast enlargement surgery? I would have assumed it was 18 years.

Though I know this usually appeals to women getting older. But I have heard of exceptions.

Ever on women less than 18yo? And is that a clear legal restriction?

SJG

Being debated on the floor of the CA Senate NOW!

S.B.No. 107 —Wiener et al. An act relating to health care. Legislative Counsel’s Digest of Assembly Amendments SB 107, as it passed the Senate, required the State Department of Social Services to participate in the federal Elderly Simplified Application Project and develop a user-centered application to enroll eligible individuals in the project, among other things.

The Assembly amendments delete those provisions and instead prohibit the release of medical information or issuance of a subpoena related to a person or entity allowing a child to receive gender-affirming health care or gender-affirming mental health care in response to a criminal or civil action based on another state’s law that authorizing a person to bring a civil or criminal action against a person or entity that allows a child to receive that care. The Assembly amendments also prohibit law enforcement agencies from knowingly making or participating in the arrest or extradition of an individual pursuant to an out-of-state arrest warrant based on another state’s law against providing, receiving, or allowing a child to receive gender-affirming health care or gender-affirming mental health care that is lawful in this state. The Assembly amendments also make nonsubstantive double jointing amendments to the bill.

senate.ca.gov

SJG

This subject are is still quite new for me and I want to read more about it.

This is another Scott Wiener bill and he wants to give total legal immunity to the parents if their minor child gets "gender affirming care", and this could mean people coming from out of state, and even when there is parental disagreement. The parents are to be immune from legal challenge and from Child Protective Services.

Arguing the other side is Senator talking about genitalia removal, and a girl who maybe was awkward and had a hard time making friends and found a supportive place in an Internet Trans community. She ended up having her breasts removed.

I don't see how a minor can make an informed choice about this sort of thing because they own sexual identity is not well defined at all. For one thing, the law does not allow them to consent to sex, and CA law and enforcement are very strict about this.

Senator Pan (D Sacramento) talks in support of the Wiener bill and says that there is no recommendation of surgery on minors.

He says talk of surgery is an exaggeration.

About puberty blockers he is saying that most who did this as youth do not regret their decisions. And he is acting like it is reversible. He dismisses the opposition as exaggerated and false information.

Senator Dave Min (R - Irvine) speaks in support of the Wiener bill, and says he has a 12yo trans nephew.

Senator Brian Dahle ( R - Candidate for Governor ) is asking what the min age for "gender affirming care" can be. He finds nothing in this legislation about this. Wiener says that these are medical decisions and medical professionals make these decisions. But Dahle says that he can't find any age limit in the bill, and that with minors gender identity can change many times.

The main voice against this Scott Wiener bill has been Senator Melissa Melendez (R- Lake Elsinor) melendez.cssrc.us

Scott Wiener says that the other side of the aisle is making this about culture wars. He says that that is the problem and this bill prevents this.

Calling the role now. So it passed 30 to 9. Really it has passed before, this was just concurring with the Assembly Amendments.

Wiener says that the problem is that Red States are branding the parents criminals over this, so CA is to be a refuge.

To me it seems that if something medical is being done which is wrong and the parents are complicit, then they are criminals. We see this all the time with MSBP, and I say that Autism and Mental Illness are little more than examples of MSBP.

But if something wrong is being done medically, and the doctors are not being duped, then they should also be held medically responsible, and likely more so.

This is interesting because usually conservative do not want the law getting between parents and their children. But in this case it is reversed, they want the government to protect children from their parents. But to me it still seems like what drives this are doctors which have gone way way too far.

I want to read more about this subject, as it is new and challenging to me.

SJG

All Right Now - Free youtube.com

Not taking sides here, just posting what the news says. I posted above about the CA Senate discussion. If the Right is trafficking in exaggerated accounts, that is very serious. All the more so if they are just doing this for the Nov election.

Children’s hospitals become targets of anti-transgender attacks and harassment (PBS) youtube.com

SJG

There are life stressors that can come into play in the life of an adolescent.

One of them is that they could come to feel that they are transgender.

I am not taking a position on this because I do not know enough about it.

But here I post a video of the CA State Senate 8/31/2022, the last day of the legislative session.

They are discussing Senator Scott Wiener's (D) SB-107. It is about protecting parents and doctors from prosecution under out of state laws for allowing their child to receive "gender affirming care".

Now I know this is just a small facet of a much larger subject, and I am not clear that anyone could be prosecuted under out of state laws anyway.

My real question is, what can a minor consent to? And consider that minors are not allowed to consent to sex.

I have heard from gay activists that one cannot develop a gay identity until they are of legal age, because developing that identity would mean they have to have sex, and with adults.

So should we lift the age of consent laws?

I also find this interesting because usually it is the left that wants to protect children from their parents. But here it seems to be the right that wants this protection.

And then, what about protection from excessive doctors?

Now, the Left does accuse the Right of using rare, unusual, and false stories in their opposition to this. And that would be very serious. The same day on the PBS Newshour they said that the Right was using false data. They didn't get specific about what the stories were though.

Speaking in opposition is Senator Melisa Melendez (R)

Senator Pan (D) a pediatrician, speaks in favor of the bill. He says that there is no recommendation for surgery on minors. But then what is the legal standard? If it is just left to the medical profession, then you have the same sort of situation you have with the Mental Health Industry.

Senator Min (D) speaks in support of the bill, and he says he has a trans nephew age 12.

Senator and Candidate for Governor Brian Dahle (R) asks a question of the author, at what age can a minor consent to these things?

Wiener does really answer this, saying that it is a medical decision. He says that there are standards and ages of consent, but that parents can also consent.

Well doing it that way, with no external legal boundaries, sets up something like the Mental Health and Autism Industries, a complete abomination.

And I don't think these puberty blocking drugs are some minor thing either.

I post this though because I want to learn more about it, not because I am trying to advance a position.

senate.ca.gov

SJG