Some dancers and many civvie women say they dont do OTC.
People on another thread were saying some dancers charge 2k, 3k, 5k etc
So is that all it usually takes to get OTC from dancers who dont offer it? Offer more money? Is 2k, 3k enough to get OTC from dancers who normally refuse? Even dancers who have SO’s they want to stay loyal to?
Man im thinking if I should pay 2k or even 3k for a dancer i like. But its far above even the famous pornstar escort prices. I am so hooked on these dancers man. Im very picky when it comes to dancers, theres only 3, possibly 4 dancers out of 40 that i like here.
SJG how much free money should be handed as a show of respect and support?
Holy crap man. Do NOT pay any girl that much money. Yes, every girl has her price. But if she's quoting you something in the thousands, that means she is just not into you. Move on to another girl.
Warrior said "Holy crap man. Do NOT pay any girl that much money."
Don't worry. He won't. He's a troll. Check his posting history and judge for yourself.
$3.50.
Warrior she didnt quote me that I was thinking of offering it to a dancer Who says she doesnt do otc or only does private dances otc...
Ive already paid $600 for an hour VIP, several times with her $2000 doesnt seem that much, compared to $600 vip ITC...?
Btw Ishmael is lying and accuses like 50+ random people of trolling
Theres no way my OP can be used to troll, the content is non trolling
Ishmael ive spent over 3k in the last month on dancers. And no im not gonna post pics of it to prove it to you and idk how it would even be provable.
@BigThirdEye
I will play along and comment on your discussion.
Remember
“In this country, you gotta make the money first. Then when you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women.”
~ Cuban refugee Tony Montana (Al Pacino) in the movie Scarface.
There are men out there that become obsessed with dancers and stalk/harass them and the end result is not good.
Let me ask you a few questions, before I answer your questions:
How old are you? Where are you from originally? What is your line of work? How much disposable money you budget for the hobby?
Cj kent 28 The US, west coast and east coast No set amount, maybe 5k now, and maybe $500 - 1k a month going forward Cj kent, why is line of work relevant? Im in the finance consulting industry
Cj kenr, did you copy paste from your other thread? The stalking comment isn’t relevant here, i think you also posted that on the “dancer disappeared” thread
If you have to pay a girl thousands to grudgingly open her legs for you, then it's pretty much a guarantee that you're going to have an expensive & crappy experience.
It's one thing to nibble around the edges with a girl who's already tempted by a more reasonable offer but just isn't quite there yet. Then it is often just a matter of time, circumstances and maybe a little more money. She is generally more mentally prepared for the possibility that she may want to say yes.
It's quite another thing to call the bluff of a girl who is quoting a pie in the sky number because she doesn't really want to do it at all. Then you've put her on the spot by having to choose between turning away a boatload of cash or doing something that she is not comfortable with. Good luck with that.
Mr Dugan some women do charge thousands, often its the pornstar escorts... i guess with dancers this varies The thing is some dancers can make $1000 a night especially Friday or Saturday So if you’re asking them to do overnight with you on one of those nights, they may want $1000+
@BigThirdEye
“Quien no oye consejo, no llega a viejo”
This Spanish phrase is an Idiom used to describe the importance to listen to the advice of people with experience, in order to reach old age.
I asked you where’s are you originally from, because different countries have different believes/behavior/cultures, so my question is about your ancestry and if you are first generation or second generation in the USA, and that helps to understand your point of view.
However more important is for YOU to know and understand that:
"It's not up to you to decide if you're an asshole (stalker who thinks that women privacy doesn’t matter), it's up to everybody else (and the women being stalked)"
~ Louis Székely ~ White Privileged stand up comedian ~ Born Sep 12, 1967 Washington, D.C., U.S.
Self-awareness is very important. You need to once in a while recognize that YES, YOU ARE kind of an stalker, who thinks that women consent doesn’t matter.
You have dismissed most of the advice from experienced Tuscl members telling you that your behavior is clearly that of a stalker in the USA.
You seem to have had some initial experience with strippers similar to drug addicts that get really high the first time and get hooked and want to experience that again and higher/better and end up “chasing the dragon”, (You crave the drug more and more, wanting to feel the same way as you did on your first high.)
Maybe you are young enough and should accept aloneness now, and work on yourself to be able to attract better/more beautiful partners/lovers, something better later.
Work on getting the money and getting the power so you can get the women.
In any case, when visiting the strip clubs or any place in the real world or cyberspace keep in mind the Russian proverb:
“People greet you according to the way you dress and say goodbay according to the way you behave"
Sincerely caring about and respecting the places you visit in the real world and cyber world and the people who are there can make your experience better.
Just make sure you behave and can afford your visit to these places and don’t get buyer’s remorse, have fun and be careful out there.
And remember: Pics and Vids or it didn’t happen.
:D
“I asked you where’s are you originally from, because different countries have different believes/behavior/cultures, so my question is about your ancestry and if you are first generation or second generation in the USA, and that helps to understand your point of view.
However more important is for YOU to know and understand that:
"It's not up to you to decide if you're an asshole (stalker who thinks that women privacy doesn’t matter), it's up to everybody else (and the women being stalked)"”
Actually, people can feel stalked from anything, ive felt stalked just from someone walking behind me at a grocery store or sidewalk. It isn’t really relevant to what is stalking
Unfortunately for your case, im not like the creeps on here or the internet. Im morally superior, to the point its astronomically superior. I dont ask girls where they live, where they hang out
The only thing i do which could be considered stalking, is looking at social media pictures/profiles...
Asking dancers about OTC, asking for their number, asking when theyll be in the club, isn’t stalking.
Maybe there are creeps who ask for OTC because they want to abuse or beat or stalk women. Maybe there are creeps who ask for phone numbers for stalking purposes. Maybe there are creeps who ask when they’ll be in the club for stalking purposes. Maybe creeps ask what kind of food they like for stalking purposes.
However, these things in themselves aren’t indicative of stalking.
@BigThirdEye
I will play along and answer your questions:
Q: Do dancers and civvies who dont do OTC change their tune if offered enough
A: Some dancers would and some dancers never would do OTC.
Civilians are already outside the club, you are probably referring to sugar babies types or trophy girlfriends/gold diggers types.
In any case again some would and some never would, depends on the individual situation.
Some men are completely repulsive assholes and no woman will ever do OTC with them.
Q: People on another thread were saying some dancers charge 2k, 3k, 5k etc
So is that all it usually takes to get OTC from dancers who dont offer it? Offer more money? Is 2k, 3k enough to get OTC from dancers who normally refuse? Even dancers who have SO’s they want to stay loyal to?
A: NO, the dancer has to believe that OTC will be safe for her and that she won’t be harmed or cheated by the PL.
Some men are completely repulsive assholes and no woman will ever do OTC with them at any price under any circumstances.
@BigThirdEye
Google says; What is the act of stalking?
The act or crime of willfully and repeatedly following or harassing another person in circumstances that would cause a reasonable person to fear injury or death especially because of express or implied threats broadly : a crime of engaging in a course of conduct directed at a person that serves no legitimate purpose
Again:
A crime of engaging in a course of conduct directed at a person that serves no legitimate purpose.
@BigThirdEye
You wrote and I quote:
“Unfortunately for your case, im not like the creeps on here or the internet. Im morally superior, to the point its astronomically superior.”
You should know that your self-righteousness can be destructive because it reduces your willingness to compromise and creates distance between you and other people (women), and can lead to intolerance or even violence.
Feelings of moral superiority play a role in social conflict, political discord, and even terrorism…
So I asked the lady if she would have sex with me for 10 thousand dollars, she said of course I would. So I asked if she would have sex with me for 50 dollars.... She said 50 dollars???? what kind of woman do you think I am? I said we have already established what type of woman you are, now we are just haggling the price
CJ kent, i see your point but you may want to provide specific examples
Viewing social media profiles in itself isn’t stalking. Unless you’re viewing them, to try to find someones whereabouts or address to then stalk them further.
Asking about OTC, when theyll be at the club next, their phone number, isnt in itself stalking. It depends why the questions are being asked, and what the asker intends to do with the information
@BigThirdEye
Again stalking:
A crime of engaging in a course of conduct directed at a person that serves no legitimate purpose.
Denying a stalking problem exists allows you to continue engaging in stalking behavior without addressing the problem.
“Denial was first described by the famed psychoanalyst Sigmund Freud, who described it as refusing to acknowledge upsetting facts about external events and internal ones, including memories, thoughts, and feelings.”
If you are in denial, it often means that you are struggling to accept something that seems overwhelming or stressful.
You should know that your self-righteousness and denial of your stalking problem can be destructive because it reduces your willingness to compromise and creates distance between you and other people (women), and can lead to intolerance or even violence.
Feelings of moral superiority and denial play a role in social conflict, political discord, and even terrorism…
CJkent , instead of defining stalkerism, do you want to point out examples of something I specifically said or did, which is stalking? Surely you would habe examples of this?
No, Cjkent, you see , if I ask a dancer when she’ll be at club next , if she does OTC, her number, what foods she likes, then I know why im asking those things. There might be creeps on the internet who ask dancers for OTC or when theyll work in order to do creepy shit, but thankfully im morally superior.
If I do have a stalking problem, please advise what the stalking problem is and what can be done to correct it.
So you’re advising I should never ask dancers about otc, never ask wjen theyll work, never ask their phone number, ?
Funny thing is, i have had dancers offer on their own, their number and when theyll work , without me asking! Funny how that works doesnt it , kent
@BigThirdEye
Again stalking:
“Stalking is a course of conduct directed at a specific person that would cause a reasonable person to feel fear.
Unlike other crimes that involve a single incident, stalking is a pattern of behavior.
It is often made up of individual acts that could, by themselves, seem harmless or noncriminal, but when taken in the context of a stalking situation, could constitute criminal acts.”
You know what behavior you have done, asking around about a specific dancer, wanting to know about her personal behavior/life etc it is considered stalking in the USA, like many her have already told you.
But you are in denial of your problem.
You wrote and I quote:
“There might be creeps on the internet who ask dancers for OTC or when theyll work in order to do creepy shit, but thankfully im morally superior.”
You should know, but are in denial, that your self-righteousness and superiority complex regarding your stalking problem can be destructive because it reduces your willingness to compromise and creates distance between you and other people (women), and can lead to intolerance or even violence.
Feelings of moral superiority and denial play a role in social conflict, political discord, and even terrorism…
28 and in the finance industry... reminds me of when I was that young I'd invest the money. Make sure you're putting money into retirement, have a decent taxable account. Your 40s self will thank you!
I did when I was your age and now I usually have ~10k a year from investments i can just piss away on gambling and strip clubs without touching my actual income.
Cj kent,
You may have been a stalker or creeper in the past or present, but it doesnt mean every man thinks that way does it?
I didnt ask for her personal info now did I? I didnt ask where she works, i didnt ask for her address, nor where she hangs out. I didnt even ask for her number, I instead proposed me giving my name number to the manager who then contacts me or passes the info on to her, which purely puts power in her hands to decide. A creep on the other hand would desperately be trying to get her number, address, new workplace, hangout spots, etc
Cj kent, me speculating over why a dancer who made $1000 on a monday night suddenly disappeared, is not stalking. You would need to show the information being used for nefarious or stalking purposes.
@BigThirdEye
Google says: The Profile Of A Stalker
Relationship to victim: more often the stalker desires a relationship with an acquaintance. (Sounds like YOU)
Obsessed: They constantly think about or fantasize about the victim. The fantasies can be love oriented or angry and vengeful. (Sounds like YOU)
Rejected: Many stalkers have a history of failed relationships or have trouble communicating with others. (Sounds like YOU)
Most just lack social skills.(Sounds like YOU)
Motivated: Stalkers can be motivated by thinking that their victim is the only one they can ever love or they want revenge against someone who hurt them. (Sounds like YOU)
Common Stalker Characteristics
Since you are in denial, it may be time for you to get professional help, however it is up to you first realize YOU have a problem and then look to solve your problem.
Moving a stalker in denial through the stages of change is best accomplished with professional guidance.
I hope you do get help, for your own good and the benefit of your victims.
Cj Kent, yoire confused. This is a stripper, who i never wanted a relationship with.
Your 1. Doesnt make sense.
Lol, constantly thinks about, maybe. That’s subjective. There is no love oriented, vengefulness or anger that’s absolute nonsense. Show me where I was in love or anger.
CJ Kent, this has nothing to do with rejection, nor did I ever face rejection from this stripper. You seem confused, i got a dance from her, and would like more dances or otc, but thats it.
Subjective, i think my skills seem superior to yours.
Where do you get this nonsense from? Show me where i was in love with the brazilian or want any kind of revenge. Wtf?
Cj kent, i think those traits unfortunately apply to you much more than me.
CJ kent, you literally stalk and harass hundreds of random people on internet websites, your problems are much more serious and long ranging than mine. On the other hand, i dont have a single stalking victim, and the stalkiest thing ive done is looked at someone’s Facebook photos or looked at some hot chick on the street while driving.
Cj kent, where was I jealous? Was I jealous of her boyfriend? Comon now. You need to get serious help my friend. You’re actively stalking people on random internet websites, which is far beyond even the real life stalkers.
CJ kent ill make a deal with you, quote something specific I said, not your interpretation of it, or not your rehashing of it, quote me something specific I stated that you think is wrong or excessive, and ill go and get therapy.
@BigThirdEye
Like I told you, and other tuscl members have told you too:
"It's not up to you to decide if you're an asshole (stalker who thinks that women privacy doesn’t matter), it's up to everybody else (and the women being stalked)"
~ Louis Székely ~ White Privileged stand up comedian ~ Born Sep 12, 1967 Washington, D.C., U.S.
Self-awareness is very important in your case.
You need to once in a while recognize that YES, YOU ARE kind of an stalker, who thinks that women consent doesn’t matter.
It may be a cultural thing, because in the 🇺🇸 USA, we are aware that 1 in 3 women have experienced stalking victimization at some point in their lifetime.
Stalkers nowadays use technology to monitor, track, and/or spy on the victim.
Stalking is a crime under the laws of the 50 states, District of Columbia, U.S. Territories, and Federal government.
“Ignorantia Juris non-excusat or ignorantia legis neminem excusat (Latin for “ignorance of the law excuses not” and “ignorance of the law excuses no one”) is a legal principle holding that a person who is unaware of a law may not escape liability for violating that law simply because they were unaware of it…”
You want the girl to do your bidding, you don't ever treat her like a prostitute or like she sells sex or sexual services, or like she is motivated by money.
How much money? I suggest the per song dance rate. And as you are just feeding her money in the front room, there should be no house cut.
How much this is varies, like maybe $20 a song or a bit less per song, up to say $60 per song at DejaVu Centerfolds San Francisco, calculating from the $1,200 per hour VIP rate and figuring 20 3 min songs per hour. Walk to her money in hand and convey it to her as soon as you can get within arms reach of her. And be generous at stage side too. You have selected her and you intend to have her waking up with you in the mornings, so make her know this.
Strip Clubs are expensive. Only worth it to go there is you are prepared to and want to pass out money.
But if you do it right, you will have the girl of your choice on Mistress Maintenance, and maybe getting into other things with you.
SJG
X - Your Phone's Off The Hook - Live 1980 Rare Early Performance! youtube.com
CJ Kent
I think this is not good, I think you have some stalking tendencies or perhaps experiences or friends, and you are assuming things about people without evidence. Were this not an anonymous board you would be getting sued for defamation for all kinds of things
You stated “You need to once in a while recognize that YES, YOU ARE kind of an stalker, who thinks that women consent doesn’t matter.
It may be a cultural thing, because in the 🇺🇸 USA, we are aware that 1 in 3 women have experienced stalking victimization at some point in their lifetime.
Stalkers nowadays use technology to monitor, track, and/or spy on the victim.
Stalking is a crime under the laws of the 50 states, District of Columbia, U.S. Territories, and Federal government.”
Good thing i dont use technology to monitor, track or spy on people, instead i just use it to look at hot chicks. And i look at them in person too, and unfortunately its not illegal. Show me a single example where ive said a womans consent doesnt matter. I literally said I would be willing to have the manager hand my number to that brazilian, in which case I would be receiving none of her information whatsoever. Cj kent i think you may be a much bigger stalker than many on this board...
Cj kent, speculating what happened to a dancer who made $1000 her first night doesn’t fall under stalking.
We have to respect the privacy of strip club women. Respect it f2f and online.
CJ-Kent is not a stalker. He is a long term poster and he is perfectly reasonable.
SJG
SJG, good advice as always! You’re an expert at this stuff, and women. I do always make sure to respect privacy especially names and descriptions.
Yeah, need to respect privacy.
Most guys get into troubles with strip club women because they look at them as prostitutes.
SJG
SJG, good advice! I have made that mistake myself, greedily asking for OTC like a pig. She squirted on me crazily
The worse the economy gets the more common p4p will become. But just stay in your league. There's plenty of free pussy out there.
Stay in your league for free pussy?
I usually go to strip clubs so I could NOT pay that much to spend time with one person. Sure the day outfits some of these "escorts" wear and the work they do to look good on your arm in public is hot, but YOWZERS, if you have to convince a SINGLE DANCER/CIVVIE to spend "special time" with you for $2K for one visit, might as well get an escort. At least the escort would have experience I'd presume.
Estafador what are you spending per visit/per dancer on strip club?
What if the dancer or civvie super hot?
There are IG models and famous pornstars who charge 1-2k per hour. But they have millions of followers. Lots of fame and demand.
There are some civvie and IG models, maybe pornstars who seem worth the 1-2k. They’re crazy hot.
I think its worth setting aside 10k, to have available for scenarios where theres someone unbelievably hot!
Wouldn't it turn you off knowing she's with you only because you pay so much?
That's why I can't do p4p. I love and enjoy the seduction aspect of getting sex. It feeds my ego
Maybe, im not sure. Theres some excitement if she lets you do whateber you please.
On average I spent $250-300 per visit. But I spread it out between drinks and stage tips and different women. Most I spent on one woman was $400 and she was wanted to go all the way with me in the VIP. She was cute too with cute bubble butt. But I also don't visit strip clubs daily or even weekly.
WHEN I get rich I MIGHT consider paying 1-2K per hour on a IG model, but I don't know how approach that situation and I'm not all about the wham bam thank you ma'am. Besides I heard it's a real boxs of chocolates on experience with those types of women. I'd say more success comes from getting fit dressing stylish and that stretches the mileage a longer way than cash by itself. Though $10K for a scenario sounds crazy.
Estafador. With instathots. You have tonget in their dms. Some will ask you to cashapp them before meeting for their time. Some will straight out say they don't fuck for free. More often if you meet when you get them drunk they'll resist going all the way and will tell you that you can fuck for an x amount. Some will give an outrageous amount. Some may say a few hundred. They try to do it playfully to not look like hoes. Some will give up on asking and will just end up fuckijg if they're horny enough. They're kinda like the amateur hookers you get in regular clubs and bars. But some are pretty hardened. Just depends on your luck which one you get.
And I wouldn't put things on hold til you get rich lulz
If we all complain enough, maybe we can get his account shut down.
Man just let me ask the questions i want why is it sucj a big deal if you dont like it u dont have to post on it
BTE is being open and honest. He could well end up being our next Juice.
SJG
Sjg what was juice like?
Lots of fun all the time, and with a tremendous sense of humor, a kind of natural innocence.
With the strip club women, be generous with them, but don't try to mediate your relationship with them with money. Get them opened up and ready to engage with you, but don't try to use money to persuade them.
SJG
How am i like juice?
You seem to have a natural innocence and naiveite about you.
A lot of the other people on this board talk about "fun", but they are embittered angry creeps. They just want escape from their own pain.
You clearly are not like that.
SJG
Groove Blue Organ Trio (Steve Smith/Tony Monaco/Vinny Valentino) youtube.com
I would not try that, inducing them by more money into stuff they said they wouldn't do.
Rather, I would keep it strictly civilian and just wait until she says that she's ready to go.
Give her money as a show of respect and support, but not to bribe her or anything like that.
Most women that are not seriously attached can be gotten to.
SJG