Bringing your ATF home ( part 2)
gawker
Older than dirt
A week ago I solicited advice on this site regarding my plan to house my ATF for a few days following extensive dental surgery. Most thought I was nuts and you were right.
Day 1: picked her up from a sober house where she'd spent a couple of nights with a "friend" after flying in from Floriduh. Two dirtbag guys drove her to a coffee shop to meet me. She gave me a big hug while they failed to acknowledge my existence & drove away. I told her I assumed she was staying with a girl friend and she said no, her plans got screwed up and she thought this kid was okay but he was goofy. Glad to get away. Nervous about the surgery. Got to the dentist, 2 1/2 hours; 15 stitches, scrip for Vicodin for a recently sober addict raised my eyebrows, but...
Got to my house, good greeting by my disabled wife. ATF went to bed and awoke when I went to bed. A kiss good night for me.
Day 2: In the morning she had blood from her mouth and her period started so lots of laundry . I waited on her - soup, yogurt, iced coffee, etc. A quiet day.
Day 3: No noise from her room. At 11:30 am I knocked. No answer. Door locked. I unlocked the door and opened it to her squatting on the floor, asleep, with a syringe on the floor. I got her up and got her coffee and a shower ( God, what a body). When revived she said she got high at the sober house and was just using a maintenance dose. All afternoon and evening grousing with my wife. Arguing about everything.
Day 4: I drove her 100 miles to visit her mother & her son. Back to school shopping with her taking frequent bathroom stops and nodding off after obviously using. Then to an appointment with her psychiatrist for med refills. In the waiting room, she fell asleep and was drooling when the shrink got her. Drop the son off and then to dentist for a quick visit. I give her shit about using and she tells me that she overdosed on her first night home and the jerk she stayed with kept fucking her. She told him to use a condom and he didn't. She told him to pull out he didn't. Over & over. Then he wouldn't pay for a plan B pill.
That night my wife was sound asleep and I just wanted a Bbbjcim, but she started crying that she was just a sex object and she knows when guys are visually undressing her. She is so stoned she burnt a hole in my porch rug with a cigarette, got water all over the bathroom floor, and made a huge mess.
Day 5 I drove her to the cheapest hotel, paid for one night, and wished her luck. I then blocked her number on my phone. What's Massachusett's gain will be Florida's loss.
Day 1: picked her up from a sober house where she'd spent a couple of nights with a "friend" after flying in from Floriduh. Two dirtbag guys drove her to a coffee shop to meet me. She gave me a big hug while they failed to acknowledge my existence & drove away. I told her I assumed she was staying with a girl friend and she said no, her plans got screwed up and she thought this kid was okay but he was goofy. Glad to get away. Nervous about the surgery. Got to the dentist, 2 1/2 hours; 15 stitches, scrip for Vicodin for a recently sober addict raised my eyebrows, but...
Got to my house, good greeting by my disabled wife. ATF went to bed and awoke when I went to bed. A kiss good night for me.
Day 2: In the morning she had blood from her mouth and her period started so lots of laundry . I waited on her - soup, yogurt, iced coffee, etc. A quiet day.
Day 3: No noise from her room. At 11:30 am I knocked. No answer. Door locked. I unlocked the door and opened it to her squatting on the floor, asleep, with a syringe on the floor. I got her up and got her coffee and a shower ( God, what a body). When revived she said she got high at the sober house and was just using a maintenance dose. All afternoon and evening grousing with my wife. Arguing about everything.
Day 4: I drove her 100 miles to visit her mother & her son. Back to school shopping with her taking frequent bathroom stops and nodding off after obviously using. Then to an appointment with her psychiatrist for med refills. In the waiting room, she fell asleep and was drooling when the shrink got her. Drop the son off and then to dentist for a quick visit. I give her shit about using and she tells me that she overdosed on her first night home and the jerk she stayed with kept fucking her. She told him to use a condom and he didn't. She told him to pull out he didn't. Over & over. Then he wouldn't pay for a plan B pill.
That night my wife was sound asleep and I just wanted a Bbbjcim, but she started crying that she was just a sex object and she knows when guys are visually undressing her. She is so stoned she burnt a hole in my porch rug with a cigarette, got water all over the bathroom floor, and made a huge mess.
Day 5 I drove her to the cheapest hotel, paid for one night, and wished her luck. I then blocked her number on my phone. What's Massachusett's gain will be Florida's loss.
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41 comments
I will. And all of this is surprising how? It finally took this for it all to sink in, including what you are to her? 5 days and not even a BjJ for your troubles. Once the cash dried up, so did she. Go fucking figure.
I actually feel bad for your ATF. Addictions are terrible. Who knows if she got into stripping to support a drug habit or if she turned to drugs to cope with being a stripper.
I can't figure out why she did not take care of you (bj) if you have taken care of her in so many ways. Maybe if she was not on drugs, she would have.
Well. You tried to help her but it's obvious that there is no hope for her. Sad.
I also called her father and he said he guessed that she came back just to get high. He said she couldn't return to his house till she'd been through detox again. I told him that I wasn't proud of the circumstances which brought his daughter to meet me, but that I've truly just been trying to help her. As a "recovering addict" himself, he pointed out that my "help" was really forestalling the inevitable and that's enabling just as much as giving her money or drugs. Bringing her to court, paying her rent, buying her a car - all allow her to support a $200 a day habit. C'est la vie.
As long as the ATF is alive, she will find a way to come back into Gawker's life because he takes care of her.
Just like she is addicted to drugs, so is Gawker addicted to her. It's not easy giving up something that has become a habit. He has been seeing her for at least 7 years, I think.
I can't judge. We are fallible.
Gawker and John Smith have the best stories.
Looking forward to theirs books about their lives with strippers. It can be something published as an e-book on Amazon.
I don't gamble either. I am not addicted to the strip club but I am "addicted" to a stripper. That's just the risk one takes when going to a strip club. Sooner or later, you will meet a stripper who will make you lose all common sense. That's why I can't judge any of the PLs that post here.
:)
I don't know how you had the patience and tolerance to put up with her addiction and all the problems it caused for so many years. She must have been a seriously hot piece of ass, you were addicted to her and/or you loved her.
I had a really pretty SB that I had to cut loose after a week because she got too high on drugs and made a mess of our hotel room. One bad night was enough for me. Can't imagine going through that for years.
Anyway, hope you find someone you really like, who is much less of a headache.
Hopefully this will send her on the right path.
I hope you recover quickly as well gawker. I'm sure this is not easy on you either.
Having dealt with drug abusers and alcoholics on this level, I feel your pain Gawker. Sadly, your ATF will not remember any of the trouble she caused you.
In your case, you might benefit from the Sugar Daddy/Sugar Baby or Seeking Arrangement websites to find someone rather than 'put up' with all the SS you encounter at the SC.
So you were trying to "help" her when you asked her for that bbbjcim the other night? ;)
I've said it before and I'll say it again, there is no such thing as the noble pervert. You can either be the guy who truly tries to help or the one who sticks his dick in her mouth for sexual gratification; you cannot be both. You lose all moral authority with a girl the second that you pay her for sex.
Now maybe the altruistic spin you are trying to put on all of this would seem more genuine if you had a true epiphany and really converted from the guy seeking gratification to one who truly wanted to help some young girl who lost her way, but you were just trying to stick your dick in her mouth even just one day after you found her doped up in her room. Did you believe that your dick was some magical detox tool? Or perhaps you thought that sucking the your dick would somehow make her feel better about herself and where her life has gone?
Seriously dude, enough with this noble pervert nonsense already. You didn't finally get fed up with her until it became crystal clear that she wouldn't service you anymore. If she was throwing you the occasional BJ or piece of ass, she'd probably still be doping it up in your house in between trips to fuck younger dudes for free (and maybe to score more drugs). The father was 100% right about you. You enabled his daughter. Moreover, you did so not out of some misguided altruism, but because you wanted to keep fucking this young girl and (I suspect) because you enjoyed the drama/attention that your dealings with her brought to your life.
I want to be clear gawker, I respect the hell out of what you are doing for your wife and I certainly don't think you are a bad guy. But let's be honest about what all of this was and what your motives were in doing everything that you did.
The tragedy in this whole situation is that she has a son. If you really want to be a noble helper, then cut off all financial support to her. Then, take 1/2 of what you'd normally give her each month and set up a little bank account to help out that poor little boy. You'll come out ahead financially, and you'd actually be doing some real good.
Don't judge someones path unless you've walked in their shoes.
Is it because she gets into troubles with her drugs?
She is going to end up being run by a pimp, just waiting in a bed somewhere for her next client and her next fix.
But I don't know what is going to happen to her Sugar Daddy, or what he is trying to do.
And don't think for a minute that any of this is caused merely by the addictive power of drugs. This girl has got serious stuff going on with her.
SJG
Timbuck: I don't think the kid, being raised by his grandmother, needs my money. The grandmother owns her own business and is well off. The kid gets all A's in a gifted & talented program. He told me that he'll be studying pre-calculus in the 7th grade. His father , another "recovering addict" has a restraining order against him to stay away from the grandmother's house due to having stolen $4000 in cash from the grandmother. The kid needs a parent's love not money.
I like the term, "noble pervert". Admittedly, most, if not all, contributors here have our idiosyncrasies and peculiarities. If I'm a noble pervert, when I fart is that a noble gas?
My conversation with her Dad was awkward, but I'm glad I made the call, in that he helped me see how much of my "help" has just been disguised enabling. I stupidly thought if I paid her rent, drove her to court, etc. it was helping but not if she kept using.
I haven't given her money (cash) for sex in almost a year, but I've bought her food, paid for housing, brought her to detox (7 or 8 times) and had convinced myself that this was not enabling.
I'm not going to say that I'm done with her, because I've said that too many times and then eaten my words, but I think she'll get her ass to detox within a week or so and then move to Fort Pierce. Either that or she'll overdose and die.
Don't ever deal with anyone who is "in Recovery", or who even believes in the concept of "Recovery". It is nothing more than just a door being kept open for more drinking and using. It is rooted in the religious concept of Original Sin, the belief that you have an innate moral defect. So long as someone believes in Recovery, or Rehabilitation, or anything else like that, don't expect anything good to happen.
Usually all each clean and sober interval does is get them primed up with more fatalism for even deeper relapses. And the problem is that their thinking has not changed. They may be Clean and Sober, but they are not Sane.
I explained this at great length to our DA's Office as it pertained to the Pentecostal Daughter Molester and his church. A very high number of them have serious histories with alcohol, drugs, and spousal abuse. Now this was before they got Saved, of course.
So say they have a new job which they don't want to lose. Or say the SO is threatening to leave. Or say CPS has taken their kids. Or sometimes its just that their kids are reaching adolescence, and the parent wants to be able to claim moral superiority. All really stupid, but usually they will stand up and make the professions to the idol, and Get Saved.
Its not just trading one addiction for another, its actually a major progression of addictions.
But they don't feel different. And they are told that the way they make themselves "Really Saved" is by proselytizing. And they hear about the scapegoat siblings and scapegoat children who died while living on the street, and hear, "So now I have to wonder if he was Really Saved or not."
And so they learn that what they are to do is to dance around and keep calling out the name of idol, because he is hard of hearing, and because he gets so constipated and spends so much time on the toilet that he's got hemorrhoids. But just have faith, eventually he'll hear your prayers and make it rain on you.
And so what happens if they still lose their new job, or if the SO leaves anyway, or if the kids are not to be returned, or if the children becoming adolescents still see the parent as full of it? Well with all the fatalism, they are now primed for chemical binges beyond anything ever seen.
SJG
"
I think the image of he voluptuous woman is firmly planted in the darkest, least evolved parts of our brains. If you look at the stone-age fetish figurines -- like the famous Venus of Willendorf -- they were basically little statues of fat chicks that cavemen jerked off to.
"
Coop
He was a much featured artist for Anton LaVey's Church of Satan.
http://www.dking-gallery.com/pix/Coop/CO…
http://thumbs3.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/m…
I think it goes back to what I've always said about this situation, that I see tremendous desperation on the part of all the associated parties.
I think of the movie Klute. She is feeling attracted to the guy, so to protect her own feelings, she gives her standard working girl come on. He just refuses to respond.
So later on she tries again, 1/2 price. Same response.
And then again, for free. Same response.
Finally, at the film's end, she has been tamed and he has got her in tow by the hand.
But Gawker, you know how this looks, like you are going to end up married to her. You've known her for a long time and spent a huge amount of money on her and have been very involved in her life.
Until she rejects all chemical mood alterants, and Recovery and Rehabilitation, and Getting Saved, then nothing will change.
Once a person can see how they have been used and abused, that is what can free them and give them a chance to build a different life. But Recover, Rehabilitation, and Getting Saved are exactly the opposite of this.
In the organization I am building we don't deal with people until they have clearly already accepted the above.
SJG
SJG
I'd would never put up with this from any woman let alone a stripper. Way too many other women out there like larryfisherman alluded to.
But given that gawker is quite invested in her, what is the realistic scenario? I agree with Rick Dugan that you cannot be engaging in sex acts with her, otherwise you are condoning her "bad choices".
I do not however agree with "tough love". I say that is bullshit.
The reason she and I would not have gotten along in the strip club is simply that we do not think the same way, and this would come right out. Usually drug people do not like me. I am after all what Shailynn said, a buzzkill.
If it were me, no sex, but I'd always hold out the olive branch of harmless fraternizing. But she must convince me that she has moved on from drugs, alcohol, and tobacco, and she must show substantial capacity for self awareness.
SJG