My ATF will be turning 30 soon. She was 22 when we met. She was born on my 40th birthday and we've been using each other for 7 years now. I've used her for sex and she's used me for money. Other than on a few occasions, we've gotten together OTC at least weekly during that time. Most days we'd talk on the phone or text each other. She's been with the same BF for 11 years. She has had no qualms about cheating on him when he's been incarcerated or any other time. She's had many customers share her favors and many "hot" guys have gotten between her legs. She's been seriously drug addicted for 15 years and about 6 months ago she (at the court's behest) decided to get clean & sober. I've kept in touch through her process from detox to rehab, to sober house living. A few months ago she told me that she was sick & tired of using men and being used by men ( except me, that is). She's working at a car wash, going to meetings, etc. She says she can't go back to stripping because it'll be too close to the drug scene and other users. We were together in a hotel room a couple of weeks ago and she told me about a real cute 21 year old that she met in detox. She said that she was really attracted to her and this gal was a dyed in the wool lesbian. She said when she started stripping others said she'd learn to hate men and sure enough she's just totally fed up with men. So she's going to try women for awhile to see if she can have a better relationship. Today, I looked at her Facebook page and saw that she was "sending a little love" to a new friend who looked to me as if she might be a lesbian.
Do you think that spending lots of time with PL's may change her orientation? I've always viewed homosexuality as being 75% nature and 25% nurture. Now, after 15 years of rampant promiscuity, is it likely that she'll switch sides? I fully expect a phone call when the money runs out. Maybe a three-some might be in order.
she wouldn’t be the first stripper to decide to become a lesbian but scratch just below the surface and it has less to do with hating men and more to do with hating herself
No you don't switch sides suddenly and change your sexual orientation simply because you had a fight with your boyfriend (or girlfriend). Anyone that can easily & comfortably go back and forth "trying" the other gender is bisexual. With women it seems to be a very easy thing to do. Our sexuality is more fluid, and many women claim to be either bi-curious or bisexual, so it is pretty easy for them to proclaim themselves as lesbian to sample the other side's offerings.Think about it - have you ever heard of a man doing something like that? Nope. Most women who do this have a little fun, then go back to men. That's where I come in - "helping" these types of women explore their sapphic side before throwing them back over the fence to their BF's.
Yup....I'm a giver! ;)
I think Lopaw nailed it. I personally do know two women who identified as Lesbians at some point in their lives who now have children with men. Being California, I also know a few different women who dated another woman in college. I do think female bisexuality is more common than male bisexuality, but I also think the woman in this case is probably kidding herself to some degree. Obviously she has some deep problems with substance abuse. She's looking for a relationship that isn't based around sex, but that is likely to leave her new friend disappointed down the road.
I think these days most women get through college with a good idea of what their sexual orientation is. Young women can easily dabble with bisexuality with little social blowback. So if this girl never thought "hmmm, dating women might be fun" before now, the odds of it sticking are fairly low, especially if it's coming from a "I hate men" place rather than "Women seem neat" place.
I think sometimes strippers, like cops, see men at their worst. Although arguably some touching comes with the job, most dancers do get touched and violated in ways they don't consent to at points in their career. Some of the SW girls are amazingly delicate flowers, but it's also reasonable to not get a finger shoved in your ass while you're turned around. I can certainly see where stripping can harden dancers towards men over time. Rare is the dancer who can truly pick her clientele and make decent money. So they're going to have to deal with some assholes to extract dollars.
When you're constantly around people who are only using you to get something they want instead of true friends, I could understand not liking them. If it was one sex that always seemed like that, whomever is meeting the wrong people. A typical stripper meeting typical guys in a strip club, she might run into that a lot. I doubt the posters here are typical.
Lots of good points. Dr. Phil is spot on. Lopaw; your perspective makes things more clear. However in several three ways that we've done she has truly enjoyed sex with the other woman and I can picture her being submissive to a more dominating woman.
Bi-sexual is a much better descriptor.
There was one thread on here that said 3 drinks will turn many females into bisexual.
I did meet a couple of dancers one night who told me they were only interested in dick.
They were talking pretty openly with each other right in front of me while sitting at my table.
One of them must have noticed I stopped listening to them when I heard something about knocking on wood and then felt a oouple knocks in between my legs. Strippers know how to get your attention. Some may hate but not all do.
Lol no 3 drinks won't turn anyone bisexual if they aren't inclined in that direction when they are sober. What drinking does is release inhibitions so that you are more likely to try things that you already are feeling but too shy or inhibited to do while sober.
But it is a great joke:
"A straight girl is only 3 drinks away from some girl-on-girl action.
A homophobic girl is only 2 drinks away."
As is often the case, our cultural norms are so ingrained they seem biological. Homosexuality is taboo for us. But the deeper taboo is the old Roman one, against a "real man" accepting penetration. Which explains why it's winked at when straight women dabble in lesbian sex. And the behavior of men in prison. It's clear sexual orientation cannot be conditioned like tooth brushing. But the complex nature vs. nurture interaction is far from being understood.
Now lets watch the action as the bigot starter flag has been dropped.
Side note, I once saw a tv show indicating sexuality or desires originated in the brain and that brain development could be altered before birth if too much or too little of certain hormones were released during pregnancy. in other words a female brain could develop more like a male brain and a male could develop more of a female brain. People can go through life not realizing their brain doesn't match their body. I like females but if I meet a bisexual dancer, it doesn't bother me one bit. The way I see it, they were born that way.
Some of my favorites have been bi dancers. I've had conversations with dancers about what other dancers they thought were hot. I think a number of dancers are bi.
Just out of the generally decency of not wanting to make life hard for people for no reason, it's better to accept what queer people say about themselves, that the either gender identity can be combined with wanting to knock boots with either or both genders. There's behavior that makes it necessary to lock someone up, behavior that you personally would rather not be around, and behavior you're personally cool with. I don't see any use in classifying behavior as exclusively or biologically male or female.
There is no doubt that stripping makes some dancers dislike men. I see it all the time. But I'll defer to Lopaw on whether/how that might impact dancers decisions on sexuality.
I could see an argument for some guys disliking women in general if they always met strippers seeking money from them for very single little thing or if they often met rude strippers.
My ATF is more into women than men but she has had sex with men as well. She doesn't hate men at all despite many who have let her down. She just feels a closer bond with other women.
Late to this thread. It's interesting because despite a few sexual encounters with women in real life I have never wanted to have a true relationship with a woman. But When it comes to sex I am much pickier about men.
Hubby and I have discussed an mmf 3way, but I find women easier to be attracted to for casual sex and find most women who are not obese (or have bad teeth) to be more attractive and easier to be with than a man, unless I consider him a true 10.
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"Do strippers learn to hate men"?
Yes.
And then they all hang out on Stripper Web.
Yup....I'm a giver! ;)
Love it.
Anyway @Dr.Phil has a point. The more we love our choices in life the more we love the people in our lives and vice versa.
I think these days most women get through college with a good idea of what their sexual orientation is. Young women can easily dabble with bisexuality with little social blowback. So if this girl never thought "hmmm, dating women might be fun" before now, the odds of it sticking are fairly low, especially if it's coming from a "I hate men" place rather than "Women seem neat" place.
I think sometimes strippers, like cops, see men at their worst. Although arguably some touching comes with the job, most dancers do get touched and violated in ways they don't consent to at points in their career. Some of the SW girls are amazingly delicate flowers, but it's also reasonable to not get a finger shoved in your ass while you're turned around. I can certainly see where stripping can harden dancers towards men over time. Rare is the dancer who can truly pick her clientele and make decent money. So they're going to have to deal with some assholes to extract dollars.
Only if you're a squirter
Bi-sexual is a much better descriptor.
I did meet a couple of dancers one night who told me they were only interested in dick.
They were talking pretty openly with each other right in front of me while sitting at my table.
One of them must have noticed I stopped listening to them when I heard something about knocking on wood and then felt a oouple knocks in between my legs. Strippers know how to get your attention. Some may hate but not all do.
But it is a great joke:
"A straight girl is only 3 drinks away from some girl-on-girl action.
A homophobic girl is only 2 drinks away."
Now lets watch the action as the bigot starter flag has been dropped.
Some of my favorites have been bi dancers. I've had conversations with dancers about what other dancers they thought were hot. I think a number of dancers are bi.
Hubby and I have discussed an mmf 3way, but I find women easier to be attracted to for casual sex and find most women who are not obese (or have bad teeth) to be more attractive and easier to be with than a man, unless I consider him a true 10.