Seems to me that they are making good money. I hear about $500/night on average. What the heck do they spend it all on that they constantly need more? Deadbeat "boyfriends" or something?
Makayla It is nice that you pay your taxes, but you have to know you are in the extrememe minority in doing that.
It is nice that you have expenses that you can offsett some of your income with but at the end of the dayyou will still have some income left, a general rule the IRS uses is if your expenses equal or exceed your income 3 out of 5 years then you "job" becomes a "hobby". There are deductions given for "hobbies"
It is not rare for people that are in business that deal with a lot of cash to at under report the amount that they get.
Your "average" housedancer gets nothing but cash, and does not get any income that is reportred on a W-2 or 1099, it is quite tempting to just not report any of it. This can lead to a problem for girls that do save there money. Interest income gets reported VIA 1099, then you have to file. a high percentage of interest/unearned income to earned income raises red flags, when the bank acct. in question has regular deposits in cash it triggers the "where did you get the money" question. The picture only gets worse from there. Some try to avoid this by the "I put the acct. in my boyfriends name" thing but this can cause it's owm set of problems. the least being that he will no have to pay additional taxes and can fall into the same unearned/earned income problem.
I believe the majority of dancers that as a rule file there taxes are the house girls that have or had some other type of "W-2" wage paying job, so they have to file.
The rest are mostly features, they get paid a lot of non-cash apearance fees at clubs (if they can't get paid in cash) Modeling fees, Hustler and Score ETC. is going to pay with check. "acting fees" if they are into videos. They also have the most to write off in the way of expenses, travel, costumes,ETC. these girls do also make some cash along the way, but they do report most or least some of it.
There are not that many girls in the business, once they become known I guarantee thet there returns are looked at every year.
Phonehome, I also agree with your categories although I've always called them (1) party girls, (2) college girls, and (3) seasoned pros. I also usually add a fourth category: single mothers. These categories are of course not mutually exclusive, some girls fit several categories at once or move from one to another. I presonally prefer the college girls but have had some really good times with party girls and single mothers. I'm not usually attracted to the pros. I especially like girls who are new to dancing because they are more open and honest, they haven't learned the tricks yet. My ATF was a party girl who I met the first week she started dancing. My current fav and #2 ATF is a college girl new to dancing who started out as a party girl. My #3 ATF didn't really fit any of these categories - she was a short-timer dancing in a resort area to pay for an extended vacation. You'd usually expect someone like that to be a party girl but she wasn't. I think she was trying to get over a romance gone bad.
Phonehome: You are correct, others have made the pedestal comment in the past, usually as they where bashing dancers and calling me a suck-up. Thats fine, I stand by my opinions and my life experiences. The truth as I see it is no better or worse than the truth as you see it. There are no published statistics regarding the topics we have been tossing around here. Ultimately all that matters is that we enjoy our SC experiences and walk through the door with our eyes wide openned.
Well you have your experience and I and others have ours. I also do prefer the older goup three girls and OF THAT GROUP it may be true that the majority, but maybe not by much, 60-40 or so are the smart money savers, but you can't look at the small sub-category you or I prefer and and draw conclusions for the whole group based on that. When you include all three groups I think you would have to agree that the smart money savers are in the minority, 10% maybe. As far as the pedestal thing,that may have been a little harsh, but I have seen others comment to that effect and you do seem to always paint strippers in a very positive light and there is nothing wrong with that, for the smaller slice of the population you prefer it may be more true, but noticing in the population in total a negative and acknowledging it as being there is not bashing them it is just stateing the truth as you see it.
ShotDisc: No I don't care what they spend there money on either, but as far as the "well at least they are not living of the government" thing, trouble is some are. How many I don't know, I won't go as far as to say a lot, but I believe it is a significant %, not just a few. They get paid in cash and as such can qualify for all kinds of goverment benefits, AFDC, WIC, other income based benefits, because they "don't have an income" Why? For the same reason most don't pay income taxes, because they know they do not have to. These girls are all to some degree hustlers, some more than others some a lot more than other, Uncle Sam is just another "regular" An Example, I like examples BTW is that Big Blonde that was at Jerry's Cabaret in Mobile a few years back we talked about a while ago. I talked to her a few times and she was a talker, she was on SSI disability, she said because she was BI-Polar. She said if she worked a "real" job she would loose her benefits.
...and BTW, I still happen to believe that the majority of dancers are level headed and smart with their money. Since we all can only comment based on our experiences, my belief may have a lot to do with my preferences in women and my ability to avoid dancers who don't fall into my preffered demographic.
Phonehome: I agree with your three basic categories. My preference is for older dancers and your third category sums them up rather well. As for the "pedestal" thing thats basically a load of crap. What I do is treat everyone I meet-dancers included- with basic human decency and respect until they give me a reason not to. People who bug me-again, dancers included, I avoid as I have no use for the aggravation. Putting someone on a pedestal is stupid and will cause you no end of heartache as few idols ever live up to their billing or our espectations. At the same time, no one deserves to be looked down upon based solely on their choice of employement-a problem I see way too often in the world. The best relationship-any kind of relationship-between two people is that of two equals.
who cares what they spend their money on. all i care about is the fact they they are working and earning a living, rather than sitting on their asses and collecting government aid. if a dancer wants to spend her money on drugs, or an abusive boyfriend, or school, or houses, or her parents, or her kids. who cares. as long as they earned it, they have a right to spend it wherever they want. just like us customers have a right to spend our money wherever we want. no different
I think you have the majority/minority thing backwards.
Maybe you just have some highly abnormal strippers in your area. I have seen a few other people make comments to the effect that they beleive you seem to put these girls on some kind of pedestal and I would tend to agree. That said, no I don't think they are dumb lazy sluts either, they are just not all the smart savy business women you seem to want us to believe they are.
My experience is that strippers fall into three basic groups
Group one are the girls that have never done anything else, they got lead into it by some older female friend or relative as soon as they had a fake ID and what would pass for a "womans body" In no time these girls are making 100's and sometime better than a 1000 of dollars a week. these girls have never had money beyond some small amount they got for their parents or whoever, which they always spent pretty much as soon they got. The fact that they now make more has not changed that habit, they just find more to spend it on. Clothes, shoes, cars, vacations, sometimes boyfriends and sometimes yes drugs. Very quickly being at the club is there life, the other strippers are her friends. It's a big party that they get to go to every night and get paid to attend. Because they are 18 (or less) and they have plenty of older (mid to late 30's)stripper friends, they tend to believe that they can do this for what at the time seems like forever. They maybe tell themselves that they are going to start saving their money, they just never do. Next thing you now a lot of them are 40 years old, probably divorced a few times, several kids and can't find a club where they can make any money dancing anymore and they have nothing.
Group two are the true college girls, some actually get do get there degrees, but most do not, some get caught up in the never ending party and never actually start, a lot more just quit, it just gets to hard to keep getting up in the mornig for class, at first they miss a class or two but before long thye just quit altogether. then there are some that look ahead and see that an entry level job in whatever they are going to school for is only going to pay a fraction to what they are making now, so they quit, so they can make all they can from stripping while they still can. They tell themselves that someday they will go back, but most never do. One way or another they basically end up the same as group one girls.
Group three is the smallest they are they are typically older (late 20's to early 30's) they have had other jobs and normally have a good idea about the value of money. For whatever reason they end up stripping, these girls are mostly likeley to be the home buyers but it takes disipline to not blow all that newly found money and even some of these girls can't resist the temptation.
I can site two examples, favs of mine from a way back, both single moms, one 37-38 the other 33-34 the older one her son was out of the house the younger her daughter was something like 14-15. Both had stripped for around 15 years the older had had a few other jobs over the years but always ended up coming back to it. The younger one never did anything else as far as I could tell. They were pretty good looking, the younger one had the big fake boobs and with the right makeup and hair could look a lot like Pam Anderson. Her "dream" was to be in Playboy, IMO she had the looks for it and she alway talked about how she was going to send in pics, just somehow never did. Both made good money, 200 dollars was a "bad night" they were not the "I just work on weekends" type either It is a conservative estimate to say that over 15 years each of these girls made well over a million dollars, but neither one of them really had anything to show for it, cars that were nothing to write home about, the older one rented, the younger one had a double wide that probably cost 50-60 grand tops, I don't know that she actually owned that free and clear.
The last time I saw the older one she was starting to work as a waitress at her club because she wasn't making it as a stripper any more. Physically or money wise.
I have no idea what they spent all there money on.
I think there has been a significant increase in college girls at strip clubs in the last few years. I used to have trouble finding them (they're usually my preferred type of dancer) but they seem to be everywhere now. And yes I realize that some of them are being dishonest but an awful lot of them can talk intelligently about what curriculum they are pursuing, what courses they are taking, and can discuss the content of those courses. If they're lying they've done enough research that they might as well be students.
Well when I first started dancing, I am not going to say how long.. I will be aging myself then, I mostly spent my money on shoes and out fits for work. I was horrible with money lol. I haven't bought a new costume in so long, Oh it has to be at least 3 years ago. Now a days ALL my money goes to my SO and son.
I seriously am not trying to sound mean in any way to makayla, but more than half do, do drugs, way more than half are greedy gold diggers, and half of them are sluts, and more than half are single mothers. I have worked in over 15 clubs across the US, from the dingiest to the most upscale and I know what I am talking about. I am not on here trying to be some stripper crusader by any means, but I want people to know how it really is. Working at one or 2 clubs in the same geographical area is not going to make a case. in some areas I have worked in had NO drug users, and most were just paying thier way through college. But trust me those clubs are further and farther away than you may think.
Some of them actually do go to school and spend large amounts trying to better themselve. My ATF put her husband through a BS degree and he ended up with an excellent job at a DOW 30 company. Lots of the girls do it to save money as the comment above mine mentioned. In addition $500 a night is on the high side. I expect an better average is about $300 a nite. I know girls that work at small quiet neighborhood clubs for $100 a day shift and others that work 12 hour nite shifts for $1000 a night. I doubt that many average $100 per hour for their time. Compare that to a whore government consultant taking down $350 and hour from you and me and you would admire dancers a lot more and not begrudge them their $50 or $75 an hour for great entertainment.
The answer is as diverse as it would be for us customers. Beyond what Yoda has already said, you can't generalize about stuff like this. Plus not all these gals make all that much, many of them only work a few days a week, which for them is the whole point of stripping.
Stupid ones-the minority spend it on boyfriends, vacations and drugs. The smart ones-the majority use it to buy houses ( I know at least one dancer who owns 3), school, supporting their families(including their own parents in some cases), cars, food, rent, starting a business etc. Most dancers are smart enough to know that stripping is not something they wil be able to do indefinitely. The key is to establish your goals, work toward them and get out of dancing ahead of where you where when you got in.
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My mistake
It is nice that you have expenses that you can offsett some of your income with but at the end of the dayyou will still have some income left, a general rule the IRS uses is if your expenses equal or exceed your income 3 out of 5 years then you "job" becomes a "hobby". There are deductions given for "hobbies"
It is not rare for people that are in business that deal with a lot of cash to at under report the amount that they get.
Your "average" housedancer gets nothing but cash, and does not get any income that is reportred on a W-2 or 1099, it is quite tempting to just not report any of it. This can lead to a problem for girls that do save there money. Interest income gets reported VIA 1099, then you have to file. a high percentage of interest/unearned income to earned income raises red flags, when the bank acct. in question has regular deposits in cash it triggers the "where did you get the money" question. The picture only gets worse from there. Some try to avoid this by the "I put the acct. in my boyfriends name" thing but this can cause it's owm set of problems. the least being that he will no have to pay additional taxes and can fall into the same unearned/earned income problem.
I believe the majority of dancers that as a rule file there taxes are the house girls that have or had some other type of "W-2" wage paying job, so they have to file.
The rest are mostly features, they get paid a lot of non-cash apearance fees at clubs (if they can't get paid in cash) Modeling fees, Hustler and Score ETC. is going to pay with check. "acting fees" if they are into videos. They also have the most to write off in the way of expenses, travel, costumes,ETC. these girls do also make some cash along the way, but they do report most or least some of it.
There are not that many girls in the business, once they become known I guarantee thet there returns are looked at every year.
Well you have your experience and I and others have ours. I also do prefer the older goup three girls and OF THAT GROUP it may be true that the majority, but maybe not by much, 60-40 or so are the smart money savers, but you can't look at the small sub-category you or I prefer and and draw conclusions for the whole group based on that. When you include all three groups I think you would have to agree that the smart money savers are in the minority, 10% maybe. As far as the pedestal thing,that may have been a little harsh, but I have seen others comment to that effect and you do seem to always paint strippers in a very positive light and there is nothing wrong with that, for the smaller slice of the population you prefer it may be more true, but noticing in the population in total a negative and acknowledging it as being there is not bashing them it is just stateing the truth as you see it.
ShotDisc: No I don't care what they spend there money on either, but as far as the "well at least they are not living of the government" thing, trouble is some are. How many I don't know, I won't go as far as to say a lot, but I believe it is a significant %, not just a few. They get paid in cash and as such can qualify for all kinds of goverment benefits, AFDC, WIC, other income based benefits, because they "don't have an income" Why? For the same reason most don't pay income taxes, because they know they do not have to. These girls are all to some degree hustlers, some more than others some a lot more than other, Uncle Sam is just another "regular" An Example, I like examples BTW is that Big Blonde that was at Jerry's Cabaret in Mobile a few years back we talked about a while ago. I talked to her a few times and she was a talker, she was on SSI disability, she said because she was BI-Polar. She said if she worked a "real" job she would loose her benefits.
I think you have the majority/minority thing backwards.
Maybe you just have some highly abnormal strippers in your area. I have seen a few other people make comments to the effect that they beleive you seem to put these girls on some kind of pedestal and I would tend to agree. That said, no I don't think they are dumb lazy sluts either, they are just not all the smart savy business women you seem to want us to believe they are.
My experience is that strippers fall into three basic groups
Group one are the girls that have never done anything else, they got lead into it by some older female friend or relative as soon as they had a fake ID and what would pass for a "womans body" In no time these girls are making 100's and sometime better than a 1000 of dollars a week. these girls have never had money beyond some small amount they got for their parents or whoever, which they always spent pretty much as soon they got. The fact that they now make more has not changed that habit, they just find more to spend it on. Clothes, shoes, cars, vacations, sometimes boyfriends and sometimes yes drugs. Very quickly being at the club is there life, the other strippers are her friends. It's a big party that they get to go to every night and get paid to attend. Because they are 18 (or less) and they have plenty of older (mid to late 30's)stripper friends, they tend to believe that they can do this for what at the time seems like forever. They maybe tell themselves that they are going to start saving their money, they just never do. Next thing you now a lot of them are 40 years old, probably divorced a few times, several kids and can't find a club where they can make any money dancing anymore and they have nothing.
Group two are the true college girls, some actually get do get there degrees, but most do not, some get caught up in the never ending party and never actually start, a lot more just quit, it just gets to hard to keep getting up in the mornig for class, at first they miss a class or two but before long thye just quit altogether. then there are some that look ahead and see that an entry level job in whatever they are going to school for is only going to pay a fraction to what they are making now, so they quit, so they can make all they can from stripping while they still can. They tell themselves that someday they will go back, but most never do. One way or another they basically end up the same as group one girls.
Group three is the smallest they are they are typically older (late 20's to early 30's) they have had other jobs and normally have a good idea about the value of money. For whatever reason they end up stripping, these girls are mostly likeley to be the home buyers but it takes disipline to not blow all that newly found money and even some of these girls can't resist the temptation.
I can site two examples, favs of mine from a way back, both single moms, one 37-38 the other 33-34 the older one her son was out of the house the younger her daughter was something like 14-15. Both had stripped for around 15 years the older had had a few other jobs over the years but always ended up coming back to it. The younger one never did anything else as far as I could tell. They were pretty good looking, the younger one had the big fake boobs and with the right makeup and hair could look a lot like Pam Anderson. Her "dream" was to be in Playboy, IMO she had the looks for it and she alway talked about how she was going to send in pics, just somehow never did. Both made good money, 200 dollars was a "bad night" they were not the "I just work on weekends" type either It is a conservative estimate to say that over 15 years each of these girls made well over a million dollars, but neither one of them really had anything to show for it, cars that were nothing to write home about, the older one rented, the younger one had a double wide that probably cost 50-60 grand tops, I don't know that she actually owned that free and clear.
The last time I saw the older one she was starting to work as a waitress at her club because she wasn't making it as a stripper any more. Physically or money wise.
I have no idea what they spent all there money on.
I seriously am not trying to sound mean in any way to makayla, but more than half do, do drugs, way more than half are greedy gold diggers, and half of them are sluts, and more than half are single mothers. I have worked in over 15 clubs across the US, from the dingiest to the most upscale and I know what I am talking about. I am not on here trying to be some stripper crusader by any means, but I want people to know how it really is. Working at one or 2 clubs in the same geographical area is not going to make a case. in some areas I have worked in had NO drug users, and most were just paying thier way through college. But trust me those clubs are further and farther away than you may think.
Love sara
No hard feelings what so ever please.