What is the best way to....

In most strip clubs that I'm familiar with, LE hangs out in them regularly, both on duty and off. I think they're much more concerned about drugs than they are about lap dances. Or like everyone else, they're there mainly to watch. And maybe one of the reasons girls like us old geezers so much is that they know we aren't undercover cops. But I am wondering where that undercover stripper would hide her gun?

Well, someone did raise the question of how do we know we won't get busted by a stripper. This is always the delicate part of arranging OTC or extras. She has to be sure you aren't LE. If you make the first move or ask, that is usually enough to let her know. A cop is not going to jepordize a possible bust, let alone his career by groping a stripper then busting her. If she's a stripper, she isn't LE. Since a few leading questions on your part would be entrapment from a cop that usually is sufficient to let her know. I used to get the cop thing all the time. I found after I let her know I wasn't the lapdances improved.

How did we get to undercover strippers from asking for extras? LE doesn't plant strippers.

A few weeks ago I was getting LDs from a very hot dancer at a club in San Diego. After about 4 dances she told me she was convinced I wasn't a cop and started getting a lot more up close and personal. The club had recently been the focus of a trial and conviction of it's owner for bribing city officials and the girls where all a bit nervous about getting in trouble for too much contact. As I was getting up after getting about 45minutes worth of dances the lady slipped her business card in my shirt pocket and told me to feel free to take advantage of the information contained on it. Unfortunately I was leaving town a day later and we didn't have a chance to get together. Hopefully I'll be back in the area soon.

I think the possibility of an undercover stripper is almost nil. For her to be undercover she'd have to either do it with the cooperation of the club (unlikely!), or without the knowledge of the club. If it is without the knowledge of the club I can't see her lasting more than a day or so without arrousing suspicions since she'd not be able to stage dance and lapdances would have to be limited and clothed too. Think of the politics of any city and what would likely happen to the police chief who put a female officer undercover as a stripper. True they do prostitution stings, but those are on public streets and the officers don't get naked and give lapdances.

But even if she doesn't get naked onstage, don't all clubs require at least a topless audition before any girl is hired? Still, if it makes you feel better, SC, you could ask her to show you her tits before heading to the lap room. Not an unreasonable request, I would think.

You will not get an undercover cop as a stripper. If you see them naked on stage, they aren't cops. There is no way in hell any police force could give out that assignment.

One of the alltime myths debunked. I had a brother in law in LE who worked extensively undercover (divorce, not death is the reason for the past tense). He said the great myth that LE has to answer truthfully if you ask them if they're LE was one of LE's favorite urban legends. The prisons are full of stupid people

No, the fact the copper lied is not a defense. After all, when you think about it, all undercover work is a "lie," albeit not one that is verbalized. Unless the cop comes into the club wearing his uniform, he is encouraging people to think that he is simply another customer of the club, an impression he furthers by ordering a beverage, sitting among the customers, and watching the dancers. No one has a legal interest in undercover LE telling the truth, unless a false statement is being used for entrapment.

I had a dnacer ask me point blank if I was LE. I told her "no", because I'm not.
Question: If an undercover cop is asked if he's LE, does he have to say yes? If he lies and later busts the dancer, does she have a defense because he lied. ChiTown, let's hear it.

two issues: 1) in my town a few years back, a business exec. arranged for a stripper to visit him at home when his wife was away. She brought her boyfriend, who killed the customer and looted the house.

2) more minor concern: strippers worry about LE. Even if you're not looking for full-blown (so to speak) acts of prostitution, strippers are sometimes scared, depending on local mood of LE. I've had air dances because I looked like LE. So, my first step with any stripper I don't know is to let her know that I'm not LE. Reaching for a breast or a kitty will send that message; just do it softly and be willing to take no for an answer. I've had dancers be a bit standoffish until I made the right move, then they settled down for some serious lapping.

I see the big concerns, in no particular order, as AIDS, law enforcement, and being set up for robbery with attendant physical assault. All of these can be controlled to some extent, but none can be completely eliminated. After the possible controls are put into place, to-wit:

AIDs-> condoms
Law enforcement--> A dancer who is well-known to you.
Robbery/assault--> Meeting in a fairly public place where you have at least as much control over the environment as the other person;

It comes down to each man's personal risk tolerance.

At least this is what I hear from the older boys.

My biggest concerns are probably LE and VD. Either one of those would really mess up my life. Even if the risk is small it's still too big for me because the potential adverse consequences are much much larger than the opportunity for pleasure.

FONDL is right, we are all over the place on this one. I will take slightly more chances that he will, but I recognize that as certain benefits go up, so do the chances of an adverse result including, but not limited to, disaster.

There is no concensus, some of us are just more cautious than others. Some of us will willingly take risks that others won't take. No problem there, as long as you are willing to accept the consequences if you take a risk and lose.

So what is the consensus? If a stripper mentions OTC, don't go unless you know here or does one let the lower head do the thinking for you? Protection - protection - protection - in more ways than one!!!!!!

To clarify my prior post, although offers of OTC have always been veiled in such a way that they could be construed as non-commercial propositions, I have always interpreted them as being commercial propositions. This is especially true when I have known a dancer for all of five minutes, and she grabs me at fifteen minutes to closing time with the offer of some after-hours fun that morning at her home or my hotel--which is not a frequently received proposition, but one I have gotten maybe four or five times.

Good advice. I have never met a stripper I didn't know well anywhere other than a restaurant. I would never tell a stripper my hotel room number, that's just asking for trouble. Nor would I meet her at her place unless I knew her really well.

I join in the consensus on this topic. It is risky to initiate the discussion about extras, and at best probably counterproductive. Any time that I have been in a situation that led to OTC, the dancer suggested it, usually along the lines of saying that we should go out sometime, or similar comments that, to an objective observer (such as LE) could be construed as a non-commercial communication (although I have always taken it as such).

I agree with AB that there are some real safety concerns to be considered, especially if one is an out of town businessman hitting an unfamiliar club. I am amazed at the guys who will go to a dancer's residence, at which they are completely vulnerable to any potential set up. I am even a little leery of hotels that have separate entrances to each room directly from outside (such as Red Roof Inns), as opposed to those that involve entering the rooms from an interior hallway.

Remember the words of that contemporary English philosopher Elton John:

You feel her nails scratch your back just like a rake/
That's one dude gone/
Just one more john who made a mistake.

The extra B, or sometimes two B's stands for Bareback.

"I can have just as much fun ITC for $150 as I did with her OTC. She did excellent full service but when it was over. It was over. Nothing to talk about."

That's depressing. If you don't have any more fun with her in your hotel room, away from the club, than you did at a crowded club, then I don't think the OTC was worth it.

FONDL, How do you know if a place is "known" for extras?
I read reviews here and chat boards elsewhere, but don't remember extras being a topic freely discussed.

I know what a BJ is, but what is a BBJ?

Whenever a dancer asks me to take her to the VIP room after a counch dance or 2, I usually ask, "What can we do there that we can't do here?". Answers I have gotten range from "You can touch me anywhere except the kityy" to "I'll suck you cock". I took the latter girl up on it and she did it. Another dancer told me during a couch dance that she gave good blow jobs. I didn't realize it at the time but she was probably telling me that more was available.

Oh, and just to mention the obvious: If you inquire about extras and she responds with "I'm a dancer not a prostitute" then it is best just to leave it at that rather trying to argue with her that she technically (and in spirit) is one.

ChiTown, Thanks for the extra disclaimer. I probably owe you a few hundred dollars for that, right?

I went into a tiny rural club once where there were two dancers working. I asked the first one, who was moderately attractive, if there were any private dances and she said yes but she didn't do them, I should see the other girl. The other "girl" came out and she immediately quoted prices for a normal dance, a BJ and full service. She was old, butt-ugly, had huge fake boobs and was missing a bunch of teeth. I said no thanks and I left. The only other times I've encountered extras the girl just did them, no discussion, no asking for extra $$$. And they were girls who I'd never met before. But the places were known for extras and I think that's the key. If you want extras, go to a place known for them. Looking for the one girl who does extras in a place not known for them is a waste of time.

AB, you forgot, "In the event that any offer is construed as involving real people and/or situations, all such offers are for time involved, and not for any activities, sexual or otherwise."

I disagree with the "never ask" philosophy. While it's true that most let you know on their own, there's nothing to be lost by asking if a stripper has not offered you anything yet. Sometimes you'll run into some big surprises!

(Some will not have anything to offer ITC but may propose OTC stuff to you at this point: If they do always be aware that since they know you want something the first price they are going to quote will be insanely high. Never take it unless you also routinely burn money in your fire at home. In fact, I would stay away from them for a couple of weeks and ask again to see if the price has gone down yet...)

If she follows up with "what did you have in mind?" then start with the tamest thing beyond what she is currently doing, and work your way up. Do it with a sense of humor, of course, and you WILL NOT offend any stripper by asking. (Even if you do there are tons of other strippers you can get dances from instead so who cares?)

Nothing I've said should be interpreted in any way other than as hypothetical situations and questions presented for entertainment and informational purposes. I do not endorse in any manner solicitation or prostitution of any kind. Think that covers me ChiTown?

If you're curious about some of the dancer cues that are letting you know that more is available, I think we can all come up with some that we've seen over the years. Here's my list of things that are most likely subtle (and some not so subtle) ways to let you know your inquiries will be entertained.

First some subtle ones:

1) The dancer encourages more and more contact on your part, asking if you enjoyed it or if you'd like to do more. Or if she asks if you'd like to do something that is outside club rules or overtly sexual even if you don't. This can be disguised as dirty talk, but it can be a scam for a VIP so be careful. The point is if she puts the idea of getting more in your head, it is often an indication she wants you to consider asking.

2) The dancer asks what you're doing after you leave the club.

3) The dancer mentions rules of the club, such as "We're not even allowed to joke about meeting outside the club." or "If they catch us doing X or Y we get fired on the spot" in a manner that indicates she is willing to bend them as long as she doesn't get caught.

4) The dancer mentions when she gets off work and mentions where she will be. Usually a neutral public place like a coffee shop or bar.

If more than one of these is used in one visit I'd gamble that she is offering an OTC meeting. The more obvious ones:

1) Leading questions, such as "When do I get to see you naked?" can be an invitation for you to offer an OTC meeting.

2) Mentioning that she works OTC sometimes. This will probably at first be something legal like bachelor parties or private lapdances, but it is usually an invitation to ask her about it and start negotiations.

In general dancers aren't stupid about saying things that can be taken as an invitation. Most of these are for new customers who they are trying to feel out without exposing themselves to LE. If you get to be a regular or known in a club you may just get asked outright. (I've been more than once) As I said, never having taken up an offer I can't offer much past this point, but remember some dancers can be planning something other than rendering services for a fee, especially if they know you will be at a specified place at a specified time with a load of cash. Aside from being illegal it can be dangerous or even fatal, so consider carefully wether you are in any condition to make sound judgements.

What about asking for more grinding? how would you ask for that? Do you say baby back that ass up?, Do you like to ride? what works best?

If by extras you mean actual sex for money I'm with FONDL and Yoda. Over the years several dancers have indicated, sometimes very subtly, that more was available if I was interested. It has usually taken a while for the offer. Never having gone there I can't advise you on the next step. If by extra you mean merely a little more than club rules allow or an OTC lapdance I'd say DavidS' subtle inquiry might work since it can easily be interpreted as just wanting a slightly spicier dance. (Good lord, did I just agree with DavidS!?). The problem I'd see with DavidS' method is that the next obvious question is "What did you have in mind?" which puts you right back at the start having to ask pretty explicitly for the extra you had in mind. However since asking if something is available could easily be viewed as entrapment it would at least let her know you aren't LE and save some time (or get you slapped or tossed out).

FONDL is right. If a dancer does them she will offer them. Sometimes she will wait until she is sure you are not LE but, if it's on the menu, eventualy she will approach you with an offer. Some girls do extras just as an incentive to keep your business or get you to buy more dances without actually charging "extra" for the extras.

There's never any reason to ask. If there's anything else on the menu she'll let you know. Or else she'll just go ahead and do it without any discussion. If she doesn't initiate it, it's not on the menu.

Ask if you can do anything "more interesting next song" or if you can "have more fun". If you are willing to pay more than ask if she does any dances above X where X is the standard rate. (Use this last one with caution though: sometimes their naughtier dances will consist of something totally lame.) Most girls, round here at least, will be pretty open about what they'll do once they figure out you are interested.

Mailman I am not even sure how to ask a dancer for more Grinding during a lapdance so I sure can't tell you anything about asking for extras.

A Good Rule to Employ...
"Don't sample the goodies unless you are prepared to go through addiction AND withdrawal."