Gen Z- America's future is fucked

Especially since virtually every register in fast food chains now requires the cashier to enter the amount of money given by the customer, and automatically calculates the change for them. No thinking required.

Kids are smart. They’ll figure it out!

Experience is the best teacher.

“Kids are smart“

Lol. Have you read the recent articles about the NYU chemistry professor who was fired because students and parents complained his organic chemistry class was “too hard”. (In my best whiny Gen-Z voice)

There’s a reason intro organic chemistry is intentionally difficult. It’s typically used as a weed out course for aspiring pre-med students

You young guys are fucked. Think what your medical care will look like where you reach retirement

That's the fault of Boomers, Gen-X-ers (I'm at the tail end), and the top end of Millennials.

We outsource our parenting to iPads, helicopter our kids and don't let them solve shit for themselves, and have ratfucked the public education system.

But at least Gen Z will be called by the right pronouns!

Lulz

I’m early Gen X. My son is early millennial and fits every negative stereotype. I did my best to raise him by example, not helicoptering nor outsourcing his education to devices, but apparently I failed. Dude can’t even be bothered to get his drivers license and can’t hold a job.

The idea that kids of today are smart is hysterical. They are the exact opposite. They get a court order from me via email that a 1960s ten years old would understand and within five minutes I have to explain it to a 24 year old.

It's not just fast food workers and spoiled college students. This is kinda lengthy, but here's an example of what that $10 confusion eventually leads to down the road:

A few months ago I applied for a firearm carry permit, almost immediately after NJ amended the law that now allows it. Didn't expect quick action on it because A) it's NJ and B) figured they'd be inundated with applications. But about one month ago I received a c/c letter from the Superior Court of NJ to the County Prosecutor informing him that I'd been approved and the Prosecutor has 14 days to raise an objection before they issue my permit. Of course there's nothing they could object to, so after a month I decided to follow up with a call to my local PD where I had originally applied.

The person in charge of firearms applications informed me that since the law changed they've processed hundreds of applications and, to date, they've received exactly ONE completed permit from the Court, which is where they are approved and the cards are physically produced with the pictures and lamination, etc.

I decided to call the Courthouse and was informed that a shipment containing "dozens" of completed permits (including mine) was sent, BY CERTIFIED MAIL, to my town's police department over two weeks ago. She also mentioned that complete packets with the original applications and all documents, letters, background check results, etc. were all in the package. So I call back the girl at the PD, and she says she never got anything, so maybe give it another week. I say, "You do understand these were sent certified mail two weeks ago, from the Courthouse which is less than a mile down the street from you?"

Now I'm getting pissed, not because it's taking long, but because there are "dozens" of firearms permits with all the applicants' personal information lost in the wind somewhere, and she doesn't seem to care in the least. When I pressed her further, she begrudgingly says that I should call back the court and find out who signed for it. Maybe it's still on that person's desk and hasn't gotten to her yet. I thought perhaps SHE would be inclined to make that call herself, but whatever.

I call back the lady at the Court, she puts me on hold for five minutes, then she says they never got the return receipt from the certified mail and, guess what... I should maybe give it another week. Now I remind this person that we're talking a distance of less than a mile, and it shouldn't take two weeks for certified mail to go that far. She was unconcerned, and said that the Post Office has been slow lately. WTF? So I suggest that she call the Post Office and have them track it, and she says there's no way for them to track it. Again, WTF? I said there must be a tracking number, but I was talking to a wall.

So I call back the lady at the PD just to let her know that pretty much the entire life history of "dozens" of townspeople is missing, along with permits to carry firearms. They could be at the Post Office, or fell off the truck, or sold to identity thieves, nobody knows. She told me that she had already spoken to the Court lady about it, and together they'd find out what happened, and call me as soon as they find the package.

Keep in mind, the Post Office is directly across the street from the PD. She could pick up the phone, or better yet, walk across the street and say hey do you have a package for us? But nope. That was Monday, today is Friday, and I haven't heard a thing. I don't think these people even know what "problem solving" means. Shit, they don't even acknowledge that there might BE a problem.

I'd like to ask both of these two ladies if they know how much $21.71 minus $11.71 equals. They'd probably need a phone app to figure it out. I'm not sure how old or what generation they belong to, but they both sounded young, like I was talking to someone my daughter's age, or perhaps younger.

The reason university professors are so tied to student evaluations js universities adopting corporate models. The customer has to get a sense of satisfaction for their tuition money. Higher attrition rates mean more money for schools. It's very right wing.

Also. Your generation isn't all that bright either. American Stupidity isn't limited to any generation

@motorhead, I was pre-med for my first 2 years, and we might as well have gone to a different university.
Humanities and social sciences courses were curved around a B+. Organic Chemistry was curved around a B-/C+, and I doubt Molecular Biology, Genetics, and Biochemistry were any nicer. And we were the hardcore nerds, no football players and rich kids whose daddies would get them a primo job at Goldman Sachs.

@Conan, take your early millennial kid to the strip club. Buy yourself expensive bottles, hourlong VIPs, and extras. And tell your son that the more helpless he acts, the more nights like that you're going to spend away his inheritance.

A customer at one of my clubs tips us with dollar coins. I used some at a Taco Bell and the moron employee claimed it was fake. Then she changed it to them being Euros. Her manager had to correct her.

The same thing happened a while ago using an older looking $100 bill at a Meijer or Target (I don't remember where). They claimed it was fake and the manager corrected them. As a millennial, I hate zillennials.

As far as math goes, historical data shows the lowest time for math performance was those taking the SAT in 1980 and 1981
https://www.erikthered.com/tutor/histori…

And the worst year for math on the ACT were those taking that test in 1983.
https://www.erikthered.com/tutor/histori…

Subtract 17 years from that and that makes the cohort born from 1963-1966 the worst at math. It’s also because of that cohort’s dismal performance was why A Nation at Risk was published and there was panic over the downfall of America back in the early 80s.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Nation…

But that cohort did produce the likes of Jeff Bezos and I’m sure many others. So as a whole group, they figured some stuff out and things turned out okay.

So my opinion, Gen Z is fine. If they don’t do as well in front of a cash register, my guess is that they have more anxiety and get more emotionally flustered. And it doesn’t help that some people really get off on being cruel to customer service people instead of getting therapy. 🤷🏻‍♀️

So people taking a math test on pen and paper did worse than people running a test on a computer? wow. Wikipedia is like God as a source. Most importantly let us make sure we neglect the many changes to the test making it easier. Not comparing scores on the same test. Then again see spot run and a tale of two cities are both books.....

Since so few people pay with cash, and the ones who do probably pay with larger bills, she might have thought she got your order wrong. Since you were giving her almost twice as much as what your order cost.

@nice that was around the time when deidustrialization kicked into high gear. Probably many kids who shot for Cs high school, thinking they'd get a decent factory job, got hit with the reality that a HS diploma was no longer enough to stay in the middle class.

That kind of awkward exchange has been happening to me for over 30 years, so my opinion is that the shortfall the OP describes regarding the math is more of understanding instead of generational. Boomers gen X and Millenials all participate in this mistake.

This is a little OT, but one thing that pisses me off really bad is at McDonald's or wherever if your total comes to $10.01 and you give a $20 you get $9.99 change. Come on man.

About 10 years ago I decided I was done getting fucked like that and I bought a little change purse that I keep in my car. But it's not only for a few cents. If my bill is $11.71 like the OP, you can bet they'll be getting the $1.71 in dimes, nickels and pennies. Just my little way of sticking it to the man.

I have seen a lot of this too where people can't seem to count for shit. My hope is that they are just tired or have anxiety or something and not actually that bad at math all the time. I tend to give them the benefit of a doubt.

I went to a McDonald's for my morning coffee and the girl at the register got flustered trying to count out the change. Next time I went for coffee the girl remembered me and wouldn't take my money and just gave me the coffee. Works for me, thank you!

how about this then? fast food chains should have job applicants take a 6-7th grade math test. if the applicant is unable to score well then the only final conclusion is that applicant is far from able to handle any kinds of money exchanges and shouldn't be hired.

using nyc as an example of the present state of education, according to a new york state education audit:

The New York City Department of Education (DOE) – the nation’s largest school system, comprising 32 school districts – served approximately 900,000 students at its more than 1,500 elementary, middle, and high schools (excludes charter schools/students) in the 2021-22 school year. Over the past several years, DOE has reported increases in the percentage of students graduating from its high schools, yet the percentage of students whom it has determined to be college ready has continuously lagged. For example, in 2019, while 77.3% of high school students citywide graduated, only 57% were considered college ready. Similar percentages occurred in 2018 and 2017.

My Mom taught school her entire working life. From 1962 to 1970 she taught in a parochial school and from 1970 - 2005 she was a card carrying unionized public-school teacher. She taught everything from 5th grade to special ed, but spent most of her time teaching first grade. When she retired I asked her how kids had changed and she said: "When I first started i didn't expect the children to be like mine and know how to read, write and do math beyond addition and subtraction, as they weren't raised by a teach, but i expected them to know their letters and numbers and have basic reading and math skills. By the time i retired I was pleased if they knew how to Velcro their footwear shut. I've been working with kids and investigating custody matters for almost 40 years, take away the computer and kids can do literally nothing. If they cannot look it up, they don't know it. The average 21 year old today still acts amazed when I tell them that when I was 21 I lived in a house with 30 people and 1 phone. Growing up with computers has done nothing but hasten the demise of all societies. The one good thing is that a nuclear dust cloud will lower temperatures and end the climate emergency..........

@Bubbleyum, a friend had a similar experience about 15 or so years ago using $2.00 bills at Walmart. The poorly trained (and) public school undereducated cashier AND THE CASHIER'S MANAGER accused him of having counterfeit money. Never one to avoid a scene or a conflict, my friend demanded the store manager. The manager educated the 2 employees but this sort of thing is sadly the norm. Personally, I enjoy the penny trick at fast foods, convience stores, most anywhere.

To the old timers. It's your kids raising idiots. The dollar doesn't fall far from the stage....

Hey misterorange- I’m not generally a conspiracy minded fellow, but it sounds to me like the beauracrats that are supposed to be processing these permits have decided that they don’t give a damn what the NJ Legislature decided, they will be damned before they allow citizens to carry firearms in public, and they are gonna drag their feet at every step, hoping you eventually forget about it and give up. Given the proximity of those offices, you could have hand-walked the whole process, but I’m guessing they wouldn’t allow that. Sheesh, good luck.

Maybe it's as simple as: she works at a drive through because she isn't very bright?

@azdd - Yes it occurred to me that maybe they're intentionally holding back and blaming the Post Office. But if they think I'll give up they're sorely mistaken.

“To the old timers. It's your kids raising idiots“

Nice story, but I don’t have any kids. Lulz

But I get what you’re saying. Just a couple of observations. Every generation has smart kids and stupid kids. Hardworking kids and lazy kids. Maybe Gen Z isn’t any dumber, but it does seem they ** may be ** less hardworking, less dedicated. I dunno. I don’t want to make a blanket statement.

The high end performers certainly are equal or perhaps better than the high end kids of my era. Hell, we didn’t have AP Calculus or AP Chemistry. So kudos to the the top performers

Icee,

There could be some merit to what you said. The greatest generation had it so difficult, the depression then WW2 so I can easily understand they wanted the Boomers kids to have a better easier life. And it just cascaded from there for each subsequent generation

People are overlooking the obvious cause: ever-increasing government interference in schools. At this point, the School Boards are no better than the DMV. Schools are no longer places where students learn and young people socialize and grow. They have become little indoctrination bureaucracies which are more concerned with growing their budgets than educating are youngsters. The news no longer talks about twelfth graders reading at a 3rd grade level and high-schoolers who cannot find America on a labelled map. All the stories now are about labeling parents terrorists, why perverted men should be in the womens' locker rooms, and how school are the only safe place for little Jane to get a double mastectomy and hysterectomy because she's a tomboy.

The end result is someone who cannot figure out $10 change with the help of calculator.

There’s lots of qualified children who are out there doing incredible things way more than when I was a kid because they have so many more tools available that I never adapted. Are they all found in public schools and working customer service? No. They’re too busy working on other avenues designed to make life better and more efficient. Public shooting or not, the biggest indicator a child will grow up and succeed is the family’s socioeconomic status. They stand a far greater chance because most education comes from outside the classroom and economic status can provide those learning opportunities where as low income resort to TV and fast food as their staples for home life.

Moorhead. Nowadays people are made to believe technology will always be available. People are too dependant on their phones and apps or computers doing things for them. People probably said the same thing when the abacus came around.
But Stupidity is annoying no matter how Old someone is

^finally true admission.

Has there ever been a generation that didn't think the next generation or two behind weren't a bunch of spoiled, lazy, idiots? Not that I disagree, I mean we had that thread the other day where they seemingly discovered that smiling, being nice, and generally providing good service as a waitress lead to better tips.

I can picture a couple of neanderthals sitting in a cave talking shit about how useless their grandkids are.

Why are y’all using paper cash and coins to pay for stuff? I mean, it’s one thing to pay hookers and strippers with cash, cuz they don’t have NFC chips implanted in their breasts, but it’s now the 21st century. Paying for stuff with cash and coins just pisses off the people in line behind you, and you don’t get any cash back from the purchase like you do with a CC.

^^ huh? Pay hookers electronically is your solution? Cash is no detectable for both the pathetic loser and the provider.

I didn’t write that, nor did I imply it. I wrote that people shouldn’t use cash so much in retail and fast food joints. Save the cash for the hookers.

"Why are y’all using paper cash and coins to pay for stuff?"

because cash will always be king. has been for quite some time and will continue as.

also maybe because there are some of us out there who don't like to leave trails behind after making purchases and just be left alone.

and if there are people in line that are impatient and who don't feel like waiting an extra 90 seconds while standing in line well fuck them.

Kids today are extremely smart and proficient in all areas that are of interest to them. Unfortunately most of the time work is not of interest as a substantial number of them are catered to on all levels of their human interaction parents/school/athletics etc. I’ve raised my own the way I was raised. A hard work ethic, guidance with tough love and freedom to make their own mistakes/learn. Pleased to say they’re each in the top tier of income earners for 20 yo’s. No debt and acquiring assets for cash already.

In the sixties and seventies schools adopted something called "New Math" that replaced traditional math. It was confusing because it was too abstract and replaced basic lower-level math with higher-level math that students weren't ready for. After much criticism, including a book called "Why Johnny Can't Add", it was dropped. Late Boomers, like myself, who had to suffer through "New Math" tend to be the worst at doing regular basic math computations.

The same thing happened with the look-say or whole word method replacing phonics in reading. This also received a lot of criticism, including a book called "Why Johnny Can't Read". This involves learning each word like an Egyptian hieroglyphic or Chinese ideogram rather than sounding out the vowels and consonants. I was unable to learn to read using the look-say method and my first-grade teacher wanted to hold me back a year. My mother thought that would attach a stigma to me that would follow me all through school and was against it. My first-grade teacher couldn't say my mother didn't know anything about education because my mom taught first-grade too. I was then advanced into the second grade. My mother taught me phonics and gave me interesting books to read instead of the boring Dick-Jane-Spot school readers, and I quickly learned to read with her help. She also worked with me on basic math skills. The traditional methods of education really were the best and I was lucky I had a traditional minded teacher as a mother.

^ Woah, that’s pretty interesting stuff and a whole educational history that I didn’t know about. That would make sense though that testing scores started falling the longer children had to be saturated in that experimental stuff and then started rising again when it was done away with. I just assumed there was some kinda Dazed and Confused-style partying in the 70s affecting things, lol. And of course this was back when testing scores was a better indicator because this was before the era of affluent families paying test prep services to teach kids how to “game” the test or outright cheating scandals pushing scores higher than they deserve. (So I’ll give you that, Skibum) But despite the flaws with standardized tests, I don’t know a more accurate or better way to measure a whole group of people’s math abilities over time. I think even now, it’s more objective than one person’s bad customer service incident(s).