Am I paying her too much?

That depends on how much she is accustomed to making at the club where she works. I know strippers that will go home after they have made $200. Others that will stay until the last customer leaves.

RickyBoy (don’t you miss hearing that from Dougster) you aren’t paying her too much, you aren’t paying her enough!

I've definitely met strippers where I was paying them for an OTC well under what they made during a shift ITC; my possibly delusional explanation is that she'd rather make a little less money doing an easy OTC with an only-mildly-distasteful but respectful and appreciative PL with whom she feels safe, than make a little more money (potentially -- there's always bad days, so no guarantees) fighting off smelly guys, guys who try to stick their fingers in her cooch, douchebags, being treated like shit by the manager, dealing with ITC politics from other girls, etc.

In short, I don't think you're necessarily paying her too much. I just think with some girls, OTC with a PL is preferable to the self-esteem-challenging conditions ITC.

" can skip work if your for sure any day"

--------------
Translation: She's in low demand at work and desperate to make a few hundred bucks. She sounds lovely.

Maybe she’s just a laid back girl - who isn’t overly concerned about maximizing her earnings. She’ll take a bit less home - but she knows what she will earn ahead of time.

It might look better to have an otc date than deal with the potential drama associated with her club?

Less than $400.00 and she is willing to skip work.WOW..no dancer at top Pilly or Baltimore clubs will do that.You are not paying too much.You are paying less if she is atleast 8

Depths on what she makes on an average shift, but sounds like you are getting a deal.

In the south, IMO anything up to $300 is not necessarily overpaying, and $200 will often do and on some occasions even $150 if one is an aggressive negotiator - but of course there are factors such as how good the $$$ is at her club and the going rate at the club for ITC extras.

I try to pay the median/fair value - lately in my PL-career I've rather erred on the side of slightly overpaying than low-balling her - I assume for the most part these girls need the $$$ more than we do and a little extra probably makes/keeps them happy.

If I feel I may be overpaying a bit, these days I just look at it as being generous when one can is a good thing.

w.r.t. her missing her shift, could be several factors:

* it's summer and the club is slow

* it's summer and she wants to take some time off from the club herself

* it's summer and she needs to look after kids out of school


Or she and some accomplices are planning to rob you and you end up dead.

Maybe RickDugan is just a rich stud and she wants to have sex with him cause she’s horny?

That sounds really cheap to me. If she's on top of her hustle I don't see why she isnt making $500 or more per shift, double that on weekends

If she's an 8+, the question is irrelevent. An eager 8+ is easily worth 350. Besides, it would be awkward as hell to go lower after you paid 400.

Good luck out here in CA with only $400 OTC. Girls in the bay want $600-1000 for OTC

@JimGassagain +1

400 is not too much - assuming our polyester OP selects 8+ an above for OTC.
But don't be shocked after doing you - dancer hits the club anyways.
A little SS is good for sex anyways - so she may have thrown that exclusive out there to get you excited already.

How many hours does she spend with you vs the club? I've gotten the impression you send girls packing after they do the deed.

400 for less than 2 hours is better than 300 for a full club shift.

You're probably "overpaying" by a small amount, but you can leverage that for better service and good will.

Humpty, the Bay is more extensive than SoCal. We have more Mexican undocumented girls undercutting the market, and Bay area is just stupid expensive overall.

@Dugan, you’ll prolly turn this around, but if you can afford it and her service is good, why chisel with her and end up with the typically unhappy girls that you usually mess with.
I’d overpay a bit just because I can, if you give her what she’s looking for, it works out better, if you try to get her to take less she’ll resent it.

-->"Good luck out here in CA with only $400 OTC. Girls in the bay want $600-1000 for OTC"

Humpty, which clubs are you going to where you're being quoted that? Dayshift or nightshift? Are you letting the girls name their price, and that's what they're saying, or are you proposing a price and that's what they're counterproposing?

Echo JamesSD’s question. A good looking girl with good hustle can make $400-600 in a decent shift. If she is spending that time with you and missing the shift, no it’s not overpaying IMHO.

I know Rick sticks to nightshift, but it is absolutely the case that in this area, on slow dayshifts, easily possible for girls to walk away with $200-$300 in a shift, after tip-outs, etc. That's 8 rough hours of dancing, customer bullshit, stripper politics bullshit, management bullshit, being on her feet, etc. $350 for a dayshift girl, for a Rick-style 2-hour OTC, may not be a bad deal, once she's gotten over the whole "having sex with a PL" thing. A little shakier for my more typical 4-6 hour OTCs

Also it depends on
1 - How much time she is going to spend with you?
2 - What are you going to do with her?just chilling out like going 5o lunch/dinner and/or shopping and/or movie?

Is she spends only 1 hour then it is very good deal for her.

For me it depends on time & what the time entails. With one I’ve seen for a very long time, we do 2 hours for 300. This is good for drinks together & multiple rounds. I’ve also done one hour stinks with others for 200-250.

IMPLO, I don't think one needs to match "what she would typically make in a shift" - OTC IMPLO should be additional $$$, not replacing her ITC income - not fair to ask a PL to single-handedly carry all the financial weight - as has been mentioned, OTC for her means not having to deal w/ the club; paying fees; and working a longer hours.

I agree Papi, just pointing out that even if SHE feels it's fair to buy out a shift -- and that's a common view on SW -- $350 can match it even by that standard.

@Darkblue: Agreed about northeast pricing. Even 10 years ago, when I lived in the NYC metro area, I could not have kept a solid 8 out of the club for a whole shift for a few hundred bucks. The economics down here are very different.

@Subraman: I think you are right with the total cost-benefit analysis. The additional money she MAY make is not worth the hassle to her, nevermind the risk of having a bad night. As far as hanging out with them for 6 hours, fuck dude - I just don't have the patience. ;)

@25, why would I give you shit just for posting a reasonably stated opinion? I hear what you're saying, but honestly what I am paying her is quite decent for this market. In fact, I have girls in the roster I could pay even less to, but this girl if a lot of fun. Also, I'm not asking her to skip a whole shift - that is her choice.

But 25 I will also add that if what you were getting at is something like: "why are you questioning if you are overpaying her if things are good with her?" then fair enough.

Around here I would think that's slightly above fair market value. It's about how hot she is, how much time, and how many rounds you get

at my fave club, $300 would easily buy out a weekday day or mid shift. maybe even a weeknight night shift, depending on whether the girl was any good at getting overpriced VIPs

I'd not have agreed to pay her if I wasn't satisfied with the arrangement, but if she treated me well and I overpaid a bit I just don't care all of that much, I have a different philosophy, I only care whether I feel like i'm getting my money's worth. She did say that she'd skip work for you any day, so what she is saying appears to be she is making bank and you are a good enough custie, that she will forego any of her other custies, on any given day, that's worth something don't you think.

I don't worry about paying too much. I pay for the level of entertainment I receive and thinking about maximizing everything takes away the fun.

YMMV. good luck

25, to be clear, I already pay this girl $100 more per event than I pay some other girls for OTC. I hear where you are coming from though.

I think that I some of my posts sometimes give the impression that I am cheap or nickel and dime these girls. That is not really the case. Yes I am careful about not going hog wild, but that is a function of a long game where I do this a lot and do not want this hobby to get out of control from a spending standpoint.

But with all of that said, I hear your point from a philosophical standpoint and generally agree.

It is only overpaying if you regret it afterward !!!! Sometimes a $150 visit is overpaying based on the service.

I hear you Papi... it is just how I’ve approached the scenario of spending many hours of quality time. If I’m asking her to be away from work I’m going to be sure to cover her. The budget decisions then come down to the frequency of seeing her during a month.

The only way to know is to offer her less and see if she accepts.

A lot of times dancers are willing to make a less than they could in the club for a sure thing where they don’t have to give anything to the club. Esp if they like the customer and know him somewhat well

So that explains why some of my fav dancers don't show up randomly.

These sorts of threads are why I think rickdugan is pulling some sort of long-term and reasonably subtle act.

Notice that he never actually gave an amount he's paying. He said he wasn't going to name an actual amount and only specified it was under $400. Why be so mysterious regarding the actual amount of money? After all, it is not like he specified the place or the girl!

I've long thought rickdugan was a serial exaggerator. After all, why be so pissed off at Dougster? I'm not going to relitigate Dougster's posts, but Dougster was actually easy to ignore. He'd post threads entitled some variant of "rickdugan is a fag" and then bump it by adding "LOL!" All rickdugan had to do was put Dougster on ignore and not respond (if he really was who he portreys himself as).

But he would respond! Why is that?

Forgot....huh? Are any of us who we “portreys” ourselves to be...? I too eventually put Dougster on ignore but it was because he was wasting the site’s bandwidth and adding nothing new or original. Don’t know why we have to bring up that old news now?

I’ll echo what others have said. If she’s looking at almost $400 clear without having to deal with the club, its management, the other girls, and customers who are not nearly as nice as you, she might consider that a good deal, even if she could make double that by working.

I know that my ATF expressed that opinion on more than one occasion. She never actually *skipped* a shift for my $100-200, but she was two or three hours late on occasion.

If you can trust her, that sounds like a great deal.

Geography makes a big difference. I haven't any experience with West coast clubs but in SoFL, north of Miami I've seen from 500/2 hrs to 600/hr. That's before negotiating. In central MA, 150-300/hr is typical which is crazy cuz cost of living is about the same between the 2 places!

How long?
Is she gonna up and split 42 seconds after you drop your load?
Is there more than just a fuck going on?

RD: Until hooking up with her doesn't rock your boat, you already know the answer to your question from your end. From her end, it's the sure thing without the club grind and sharing her money with the club. It's the proverbial win-win, until either side doesn't feel it's so.

I probably shouldn't add at this point, but why not add a little clarification and modest apology.

I agree with bubbly267 that nobody on TUSCL is exactly as they portray themselves. Part of the fun of the Internet is playing a part. Even the most truthful among us do it a little bit.

All I meant was that real alpha males don't get all bent out of shape because somebody they don't know from Adam says stupid shit about them. They certainly don't reply to said stupid shit. They fly 30,000 feet above the stupid shit!

rickdugan is one of my favorite posters. He tells brilliant crazy stories. Often laced with a soupçon of dickish d-baggery but I suspect that is just the way he thinks "alpha males" sound.

I also suspect he's actually not a bad guy IRL. Of course, it doesn't matter to me whether he is a good guy or a total d-bag because I don't know him from Adam. As long as his crazy stories are brilliant and the character he plays on the Internet is amusing that's good enough for me! ;)

I think Rick's question was meant to be rhetorical in order to generate a discussion, vs him really being confused as to what he was paying

A dancer who has a truly amazing body and face has skipped her shift a few times during the week to see me for $400 at her place. The thought that I am paying too much never entered my mind. I know she can definately make more at work but then again...she has to go to work. We all have lazy days and spending some at home, working out or just doing fun stuff in general. Who knows she may arrange seeing someone else that day too, not that I care at all.

Does not knowing her rock bottom price mean that much to you that you feel cheated in some way?

$400 is a lot if she's a pig. If you find her hot and she takes good care of you I wouldn't think twice about it. Sounds like a win-win scenario.

In Houston have paid strippers 100-300 for itc or otc FS. Current Sb (x stripper) averages 150. When she was dancing 100 itc, 200 otc. Women off sd sites 100-200 per session.

I just reread the text convo.

I don't know OTC protocols, but if she is the one that wants to see you shouldn't she be the one who is paying?