@Dougster wrote:" Riet n u luv Fox news n Trump, voet 4 Goldwater, n nvr peyd 4 sex eethr riet dumdum. "
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strip clubs, sugar babies -- it's all paid sex and prostitution in my book. I've been completely consistent there.
No I'm not a leftist, just a moderate Democrat. Didn't vote for Sanders because he proposed all sorts of pie-in-the-sky stuff that can't be paid for. I'm in favor of limited, intelligent, government. Not for single-payer.
Strip clubs attract hard-core Libertarians and right-wings types. Only in a forum like this would I be perceived as a leftist.
You know, you keep saying that this place is crawling with libertarians (or "randoids" as you colorfully call us). But who here other than me is an actual libertarian? There are lots of guys here who call themselves that word but then when you scratch the surface you find out that they are really just garden-variety liberals or conservatives who also happen to want to legalize drugs or prostitution. Not that there's anything wrong with that. But words have meaning, right?
@BHO true words have meanings but both Random and myself have been described as liberals by jackasses that think that works as a dismissive true Random is more liberal than I am but I am much more of a conservative that most of these Trumpites their definition of conservatism is my definition of rude and uneducated.
Yes, a few of the Trumpkins have called me a liberal, too, even though I am MUCH more conservative on taxes, spending, trade, or guns than any of them seem to be.
Random says he's not a leftist. Maybe he's right. Leftist implies a radical revolutionary type... like Che Guevara... or Bill DiBlasio... or san_jose_guy LOL. But Random is still at least left-wing. You don't need to be ideologically pure to be a left-winger or a right-winger because the meaning of these words changes over time. Unlike libertarianism which is more ideologically based and consistent over time.
@BHF my point was being politically incorrect is not a virtue it is just a bullshit excuse to trash other people’s beliefs my other point was here on TUSCL the biggest jackasses try to stop anyone’ from speaking their mind theirs idiots don’t get the idea that if I or anyone else states a point that we don’t give a fuck I’ve dealt with bullies IRL so on the internet, please.
It would be kinda pointless to be registered with the Libertarian Party, though. Their primaries are usually a choice between several people who all believe exactly the same thing. 2016 was the first time that there was any disagreement since like 1988.
Because the term is unpopular. In a similar vein, I remember after 2008 when no one wanted to admit that they were Republicans or sometimes even conservatives, because of the negative association with George W. Bush. Bush was about as popular as erectile dysfunction at the time, and the economy was in the shitter. I had already been a libertarian for a long time but suddenly I had a lot of company from people who started calling themselves libertarians, too. Oddly, these new converts believed in "sensible regulations on large corporations" (whatever that means), loved Social Security and Medicare, and hated immigration and gays. They were really just mainstream conservatives who wanted to pretend that they were something else because people would look at them like they were traitors to the country if they admitted the truth at the time.
We shouldn't even be calling lefties liberals anyhow. The word Liberal really means someone who believes in freedom: American liberals gave that inconvenient little concept up around the turn of the 20th century. I call them moderate socialists because that's what they really are.
@Burlington- I agree that defining these various labels is difficult, but maybe I can help you with some concrete examples.
(1) For example, favorite entertainer by affiliation:
Lefty - Michael Moore
Moderate Democrat - Alec Baldwin
Republican - Toby Keith
Libertarian - Alan Greenspan
(2) Best health care system:
Lefty- Patterned after UK. Very effienct and cost effective, but long wait times and MDs pushed into working class.
Moderate Dem - Small tweaks to Obamacare so that everyone is covered. Leave everything else pretty much as it stands.
Republican - Let the poor drop dead and forget provision for pre-existing conditions. Because I'll never get sick and strip clubs are more important than my families health insurance.
Libertarian - The government should have absolutely no role in health care because...Ayn Rand
(3) Attitude toward Bitcoin
Lefty- Used by Manafort to launder money
Moderate Dem - Experimental stage, but technology is interesting
Republican - Don't give a shit as long as I get rich trading cryptos
Libertarian - Don't need no stinkin' Fed
(4) Favorite passtime
Lefty -Million Woman March
Moderate Dem - bareback sex with cute coeds
Republican - Gun convention
Libertarian - Re-reading all 1200 pages of Atlas Shrugged
(5) Attitude toward social security and medicare
Lefty - Vital no matter what it does to the national debt
MOderate Dem - worried about debt, but privatizing is impossible
Republican - Not needed. Cut taxes and everyone will become rich because...Art Laffer
Libertarian - Privatize and get the government out of entitlements because...Ayn Rand
(6) TUSCL members that personify each
Lefty - @Rockstar and @SJG
Moderate Dem - @RandomMember
Republican - @Dugan
Libertarian - @Che
White-nationalist weirdos - @GammaNut, @TiredTraveler
Last comment: Seriously @Burlington, I just turn off and stop listening to Libertarians who thing the financial crisis was caused by government lending to the poor. It's a litmus test that shows whether ideology is more important than the facts.
LOL that was funny. I'll just point out that Toby Keith endorsed Obama in 2008. But other than that, I get your point. I've tried to be a reasonable open-minded person: certainly, I would never say that something is true merely because Ayn Rand or anyone else said so, but enough libertarians are cult followers that a joke like this does ring true. Ayn Rand was a deeply flawed person but I still like her. And while there are areas where I deviate somewhat from libertarian dogma myself, they are few and far between. So you may have a point there too.
As for government lending to the poor, that's not exactly how I would describe it. You raised this issue last month when we were talking about the movie The Big Short. I responded, but you ignored my response. This is what I said at the time:
"The US government had actually been directly pushing more and more people to buy homes since at least the 70s. Then they put the whole thing on steroids in the 90s. HUD told Fannie and Freddie to increase the percentage of their portfolio that is subprime, so they did. Fannie and Freddie told banks to make as many subprime loans as they could, because they would buy anything that the banks had for sale, even the garbage. And the rest is history. Everyone was just stupid, never believing that the housing market could have a sustained collapse. It wasn't a conspiracy, it was stupidity. Stupidity facilitated by the federal government. And now everyone wants to blame the banks for the bailouts. Let me ask you this: if a dog is begging at your table and someone steals your food off your plate and feeds it to the dog, who do you blame, the dog or the thief?"
@Burlington, there must be hundreds of articles out there showing that the percentage of subprime loans made by private Wall Street loans during the housing-bubble years outstripped those made by Fannie @ Freddie.
You're probably right. But the key was that they made the loans because they were profitable and because they knew the government wanted them to make the loans. There was an implicit backstop for the banks because they were fulfilling public policy. You and I would have done the same thing as they did. It was considered part of public policy under the Clinton and Bush administrations. Washington wanted to get more people into homes to share in the prosperity of the economy. Each administration probably also felt that if someone becomes a homeowner during a certain presidency then they will attribute their newfound prosperity to the ruling political party at the time. It's an understandable assumption. Didn't work out so well.
@BurlyHo lol - "We shouldn't even be calling lefties liberals anyhow. The word Liberal really means someone who believes in freedom: American liberals gave that inconvenient little concept up around the turn of the 20th century. I call them moderate socialists because that's what they really are." Amen. The only true Liberals today are in the Republican or Libertarian parties. The Democratic party is now a cult of personality (first Obama, now Clinton) that echoes a lot of the National SOCIALIST Party of Nazi Germany. Funny how everyone keeps forgetting that the Nazis were LEFTIES!
The Nazis were definitely left of center on economic policy, but they were hard right on most social policy. They imposed high taxes on the wealthy especially in the occupied territories, their economy was addicted to central banking and subsidies, they were trade protectionists, they were environmentalist wackos, they opposed gun rights and gay rights, they had the most expansionist foreign policy since at least Napoleon, they worshiped State power, they hated free speech, and they were obviously violent racist maniacs. So basically they were the exact opposite of modern libertarians. I'm proud to say that I disagree with literally every single thing they stood for... even the stuff that most people would find unobjectionable. It all sounds bad to me.
@BurlyHo - with the exception of opposing gay rights, everything you've outlined describes today's Democratic Party. so it seems like you're proving my point. the Dems today are obsessed with identity politics, except they've flipped the script on it's head. now instead of glorifying whites they want to exterminate whites, but the end result is the same - massive concentration of state and corporate power, which is fascism
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Ignore this one^^^
You're not a leftist?
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strip clubs, sugar babies -- it's all paid sex and prostitution in my book. I've been completely consistent there.
No I'm not a leftist, just a moderate Democrat. Didn't vote for Sanders because he proposed all sorts of pie-in-the-sky stuff that can't be paid for. I'm in favor of limited, intelligent, government. Not for single-payer.
Strip clubs attract hard-core Libertarians and right-wings types. Only in a forum like this would I be perceived as a leftist.
You know, you keep saying that this place is crawling with libertarians (or "randoids" as you colorfully call us). But who here other than me is an actual libertarian? There are lots of guys here who call themselves that word but then when you scratch the surface you find out that they are really just garden-variety liberals or conservatives who also happen to want to legalize drugs or prostitution. Not that there's anything wrong with that. But words have meaning, right?
Yes, a few of the Trumpkins have called me a liberal, too, even though I am MUCH more conservative on taxes, spending, trade, or guns than any of them seem to be.
Random says he's not a leftist. Maybe he's right. Leftist implies a radical revolutionary type... like Che Guevara... or Bill DiBlasio... or san_jose_guy LOL. But Random is still at least left-wing. You don't need to be ideologically pure to be a left-winger or a right-winger because the meaning of these words changes over time. Unlike libertarianism which is more ideologically based and consistent over time.
Since it's not, I'm happy just to have libertarian beliefs.
And one of my libertarian beliefs is that it's no one's God damned business who is on my ignore list.
It would be kinda pointless to be registered with the Libertarian Party, though. Their primaries are usually a choice between several people who all believe exactly the same thing. 2016 was the first time that there was any disagreement since like 1988.
I totally agree with all of this, too.
"...I’ve dealt with bullies IRL..."
Thar's because your such a pussy! :)
Because the term is unpopular. In a similar vein, I remember after 2008 when no one wanted to admit that they were Republicans or sometimes even conservatives, because of the negative association with George W. Bush. Bush was about as popular as erectile dysfunction at the time, and the economy was in the shitter. I had already been a libertarian for a long time but suddenly I had a lot of company from people who started calling themselves libertarians, too. Oddly, these new converts believed in "sensible regulations on large corporations" (whatever that means), loved Social Security and Medicare, and hated immigration and gays. They were really just mainstream conservatives who wanted to pretend that they were something else because people would look at them like they were traitors to the country if they admitted the truth at the time.
We shouldn't even be calling lefties liberals anyhow. The word Liberal really means someone who believes in freedom: American liberals gave that inconvenient little concept up around the turn of the 20th century. I call them moderate socialists because that's what they really are.
(1) For example, favorite entertainer by affiliation:
Lefty - Michael Moore
Moderate Democrat - Alec Baldwin
Republican - Toby Keith
Libertarian - Alan Greenspan
(2) Best health care system:
Lefty- Patterned after UK. Very effienct and cost effective, but long wait times and MDs pushed into working class.
Moderate Dem - Small tweaks to Obamacare so that everyone is covered. Leave everything else pretty much as it stands.
Republican - Let the poor drop dead and forget provision for pre-existing conditions. Because I'll never get sick and strip clubs are more important than my families health insurance.
Libertarian - The government should have absolutely no role in health care because...Ayn Rand
(3) Attitude toward Bitcoin
Lefty- Used by Manafort to launder money
Moderate Dem - Experimental stage, but technology is interesting
Republican - Don't give a shit as long as I get rich trading cryptos
Libertarian - Don't need no stinkin' Fed
(4) Favorite passtime
Lefty -Million Woman March
Moderate Dem - bareback sex with cute coeds
Republican - Gun convention
Libertarian - Re-reading all 1200 pages of Atlas Shrugged
(5) Attitude toward social security and medicare
Lefty - Vital no matter what it does to the national debt
MOderate Dem - worried about debt, but privatizing is impossible
Republican - Not needed. Cut taxes and everyone will become rich because...Art Laffer
Libertarian - Privatize and get the government out of entitlements because...Ayn Rand
(6) TUSCL members that personify each
Lefty - @Rockstar and @SJG
Moderate Dem - @RandomMember
Republican - @Dugan
Libertarian - @Che
White-nationalist weirdos - @GammaNut, @TiredTraveler
I could go on, but you get the idea...
"I want to see liwet's tits...".
I was wondering, do you assume liwet is female, or are you coming out of the closet?
LOL that was funny. I'll just point out that Toby Keith endorsed Obama in 2008. But other than that, I get your point. I've tried to be a reasonable open-minded person: certainly, I would never say that something is true merely because Ayn Rand or anyone else said so, but enough libertarians are cult followers that a joke like this does ring true. Ayn Rand was a deeply flawed person but I still like her. And while there are areas where I deviate somewhat from libertarian dogma myself, they are few and far between. So you may have a point there too.
As for government lending to the poor, that's not exactly how I would describe it. You raised this issue last month when we were talking about the movie The Big Short. I responded, but you ignored my response. This is what I said at the time:
"The US government had actually been directly pushing more and more people to buy homes since at least the 70s. Then they put the whole thing on steroids in the 90s. HUD told Fannie and Freddie to increase the percentage of their portfolio that is subprime, so they did. Fannie and Freddie told banks to make as many subprime loans as they could, because they would buy anything that the banks had for sale, even the garbage. And the rest is history. Everyone was just stupid, never believing that the housing market could have a sustained collapse. It wasn't a conspiracy, it was stupidity. Stupidity facilitated by the federal government. And now everyone wants to blame the banks for the bailouts. Let me ask you this: if a dog is begging at your table and someone steals your food off your plate and feeds it to the dog, who do you blame, the dog or the thief?"
Just messin' with you. Many here may think I'm a guy because of the avatar, but really, the seal is female, so no one really knows.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBnO9dw3…
Sorry, No matter how much you'd like that, I don't flow your way. Straight up here! Said in the TRUEST way possible! :)
You're probably right. But the key was that they made the loans because they were profitable and because they knew the government wanted them to make the loans. There was an implicit backstop for the banks because they were fulfilling public policy. You and I would have done the same thing as they did. It was considered part of public policy under the Clinton and Bush administrations. Washington wanted to get more people into homes to share in the prosperity of the economy. Each administration probably also felt that if someone becomes a homeowner during a certain presidency then they will attribute their newfound prosperity to the ruling political party at the time. It's an understandable assumption. Didn't work out so well.
The Nazis were definitely left of center on economic policy, but they were hard right on most social policy. They imposed high taxes on the wealthy especially in the occupied territories, their economy was addicted to central banking and subsidies, they were trade protectionists, they were environmentalist wackos, they opposed gun rights and gay rights, they had the most expansionist foreign policy since at least Napoleon, they worshiped State power, they hated free speech, and they were obviously violent racist maniacs. So basically they were the exact opposite of modern libertarians. I'm proud to say that I disagree with literally every single thing they stood for... even the stuff that most people would find unobjectionable. It all sounds bad to me.
Still love you buddy, in a most non-sexual way!