Do you think it works better to keep one's knowledge of strip clubs and how they operate close to the vest, or to let on that this ain't your first rodeo. I think the latter method, while potentially helping one build report with his dancer of choice and cut through the stripper shit, can backfire if the stripper either doesn't do certain things one mentions or does them differently than one's stated preference. In other words, she might get frightened, offended, turned off, etc.
Some new dancers are impressed if you seem to know a great deal. But overall I think the most important thing is to let you girl know why you are in town, why you came to the club, and what you are looking for.
She will treat people who are likely to be regulars differently, and she will treat people who are likely to be seeing her on the outside differently, and she will treat people who are not married differently.
The worst will be for the guys who are just there willing to pay some money to ejaculate. I know that means many our regular forum posters right here. But the girl is not going to open up to people who are like that, as there is no reason to.
It's pretty obvious to any stripper that I spend a little bit of time with that I know lots about strip clubs and strippers. I see no downside to revealing my true PLness. She knows that she probably can't rip me off, and we are able to communicate clearly to avoid misunderstandings. And if she's a new dancer I can help her out with some pointers if she's willing to listen. Why would I want to "play dumb"?
I pretty much agree with JS69. It avoids a lot of SS. At Follies, if they ask, I tell them I am a regular and start running off the names of the managers/bouncers, etc.
^^^^^ Shadowcat, so you tell them that you are a regular, and generally that implies that you are a local. But do you also give them any indication as to whether or not you like to see girls outside, or as to whether or not you are single and any little hints which might suggest whether or not you are open to some sort of outside relationship?
I think the above is much more important than just letting them know if you know how strip clubs operate.
Some guys just want what is offered, like LDKing, or even FS. But other guys are going to be wanting to start bedding down with a girl regularly and promptly.
Can't push it too hard or too fast, but one can let the girl figure it out. They are good with such communications, because they make a lot of difference to them.
I never totally play dumb, but I don't always offer up everything I know either. Like JS said, any stripper I have more than a quick conversation with will quickly be able to pick up that its not my first time in a SC. I see no benefit trying to act like it is. I also don't blab on and on about my activities or my knowledge of strip clubs if it doesn't naturally come up. Even when it does, I sometimes tone it down if I sense she's not ready for it.
I don't think you can make a mistake in telling them you've been to an SC before. They'll be able to tell anyway. The only possible mistake is blabbing personal details about other dancers, telling them you're on tuscl, etc. -- some girls are bothered by what they see as the invasion of their privacy, and those particular girls can and will back off on doing certain things with guys. There were definitely examples above this from the local forums I used to be on, where the girls identified some of the participants, passed that knowledge word of mouth between them, and some of those girls avoided those guys or set lower limits.
I always ask them up front about house fees and their charges for dances. I don't want to waste my time either with a girl that isn't up to the task. Even if a girl is good out front with lots of DFK, lots of hands over each others bodies etc, if she is all bullshit and is going to treat me different out back I don't want to waste my time with her.
Strippers quickly figure out that this isn't my first rodeo, so there's no reason to play dumb, but I certainly don't volunteer that I'm a regular on TUSCL, nor do I let them know how frequently I get extras. Just as they often don't want us to know how easy they are, I don't want them to know that about me :)
Jestrite treats the dancers in strip clubs just like he would treat any other girl. So lots of DFKing in the front room is standard with him, and he never goes with girls into booths or backrooms until that is happening. He is our undisputed Master Womanizer.
Letting girls "sell dances" to you, is a chumps game. In the front room you can lead it easier, and you can feed her money without there being a house cut. And if she doesn't want to play, send her on her way. But don't be surprised if another smarter girl jumps in to take her place.
Save booths and back rooms until you pants are to come down. Usually referred to as "home plate" in you scheme.
When it is time for that, you invite her to the back room.
You don't take her into the backroom to see if she is good, you take her into the backroom because she is already good.
But know, if you handle things this way, the chances that you will end up waking up with her the next morning start to get very high.
I present myself as a regular visitor on business from outside the area. I tell them I am in a business requiring regular frequent travel to their area and always go out for fun. I even do this at my local clubs. This sends several useful messages:
1. I am not a nube -- you're not going to rip me off.
2. I am a regular -- you'd better treat me right for frequent paydays.
3. I am not a local -- anything we do is no-strings-attached -- you don't have to worry about running in to me.
4. I have a job that pays me well enough to visit you.
^^^^^ I feel that that kind of open and honest communications straight up is the best way to go. It makes it easier for the girl. You are telling her what she needs to know, but knows that she should not ask.
Still not hearing that you tell the girl if you would want to be seeing her outside, and on an ongoing basis, or if you just always go to the strip club, to pick the next girl.
I'm not sure I understand SJG front room guidance, but someday I'll try. Are you saying just convo about OTC and ITC business and feed them money?
As far as playing dumb as if I'm not a SC regular, I don't. As others have mentioned, they can usually tell. The first thing that comes to mind as a giveaway is when I say let's catch the next song. Aside from that as simple as it is, I feel letting it be known you're a regular works in your advantage as others have mentioned.
Not that it's anything you'd want to seek out because man they have drama filled lives, but being experienced will definitely have them letting you know some things.
I don't talk about TUSCL and encounters with other dancers with them.
LecherousMonk
It appears you are from the Columbus, Ohio, area. Ain't nothin happenin in Columbus clubs. You need to get away from Capital City out into the countryside and check out the clubs in the real world. We're having some fun out here.
Think the situation through some. Once you agree to go with the girl into a booth or a backroom, you are agreeing to pay a toll to the house, and money to her, but you are also obligating her to perform some sort of a service upon you.
Is that really what you want? Or are you just going along with a gimmick invented to work more money out of guys, without the girls having to do much?
Wouldn't you rather the girl just open up to you and let you lead it in a more civilian manner, like as if she was a girl you'd just met at a party?
You can still feed her money, but more just as a show of respect, not as a fee for service. And in the front room there should be no house cut.
Lap dancing started at MBOT in the 1970's, and what it meant was lap sitting.
Now what else went along with lap sitting varied widely. But the point is there was no fixed structure for the time and money. It was mostly just between you and the girl.
The eye opening encounter for me was when I was cutting out from a stupid convention at the Moscone Center. I saw this extremely cute black girl walking along. She looked to me like an office worker on her lunch hour. I decided I would try and take her to lunch. Nothing ventured nothing gained. Fortune goes to the bold.
So as the side walks were full of people I laid back and tailed her. But I was wrong about her being an office worker. She ducked into the New Century.
Fortune goes to the bold. So I asked about her and was told that her name was Maria, and I paid the cover charge. I had to wait a long time before she came on stage. And this was before there was stage side sitting.
She did her set, peeling down to high heels and makeup, and then doing open tongue kissing with another girl.
And then she saw me, and then she was on my lap.
Now usually they have girl kissing in porno movies and I just FF past it. But here, seeing it live, it was a powerful turn on. It is women showing that they control the erotic.
So I found myself just unable to refrain from telling this girl how much of a turn on seeing that was for me. She replied instantly about how much she was enjoying it.
Well in a situation like that, things are going to happen.
It completely blew me away that she could be so open with me, a total stranger.
I found myself wanting to be more like her, instead of living my gray flannel life.
And this is how P4P sexual situations should be, transformative, life changing, not just for sexual gratification.
This small black girl with huge tits was a real treasure. It would be a waste to have her doing anything else but what she was doing. And the money was insignificant, considering the effect it had on the course of my life.
If I'd not been married then, I believe I'd of been waking up the next morning with this black Maria.
I am still trying to embody what I learned on that day.
And then also in AMPs, kissing is not standard, not at all. But if you can come on to your girl some and let her get softened up, usually you can get her DFKing. And from then on the entire encounter is a mind blowing GFA ( Girl Friend Audition ).
So you don't want your girl performing any service upon you, you just want her to open up and let you make it happen with her.
So the more in the front room the better. Best is intensive DFKing, with FOV/FIV.
Then you invite her to the back room, as your own pants are to come down.
Then you walk her out the front door with you and continue in your own home.
When Diane Feinstein tried to get Jim and Artie Mitchell convicted of felonies, and put an end to MBOT and all contact strip clubs, a big part of their defense was that it was all front room. It was not prostitution because it was not for sexual gratification. Rather it was an audience participation cabaret show, and it was for sexual education.
I agree fully. And this is how they got off.
So it was after this legal victory and after a more accepting administration came into office that they introduced booths and back rooms. Mostly it was just a way for the girl to keep easier control over the interaction. The guy pretty much has to play along with her.
The clubs convince the girls that they make more money like this, no front room action. But girls experienced in wilder and woolier environments know that this is not true. "Wanna Dance" is not the best way to get money out of guys. Front room GFE is. And in the wildest US clubs, the girls don't give you much choice but to start making out with them. Numerous accounts on Black Strip Clubs .net. And then TUSCLER's have affirmed via PM that it is done exactly the same way in the mixed race dives. And then the TJ accounts and videos are overwhelming.
The one who really makes money with the booths and back rooms is the house. They get a larger share of the money.
And people think it raises the mileage level. But most of the time this is not true. All it does is raise the cost, while lowering the typical mileage level.
If you can get a girl softened up and making out with you, she is not likely to refuse much of anything. So in places where front room makeout sessions are common, they are usually FS oriented venues.
But if the girl can get money out of you with "Wanna Dance", then it is probably just dry humping or BJ's, ejaculation services, without the girl ever really opening up to you. Guys go for this, and in my view it is all a chumps game.
Sorry if I outed you and it offended you. I just wanted you to know that the clubs in Columbus Ohio are very low mileage clubs and the front room fratinization I describe in my posts doesn't and will not happen in those clubs. The front room action I describe takes place in clubs where the rules are more relaxed and they allow the girls to do what they got to do to bring in and satisfy customers. The Detroit Clubs are well known for their high mileage although they tend to direct it back room. However there are other clubs that are high mileage like many of the Akron Ohio Clubs but it tends to ebb and flow and goes in cycles. Toledo clubs at one time were high mileage but now have become more restrictive. Right across the border in Michigan though fun can be had with the right girl. The secret is to find a high mileage girl and stick with her. Don't keep changing girls. I go to the club to see the girl not the club and when she changes clubs I CHANGE CLUBS! I follow the girl and keep good communication via phone and text with her. This leads to setting up OTC and GFE meetings. It's not hard you just got to be patient and front room DFK and pussy play are necessary to advance the agenda.
It kinda depends on the dancer - I tend to take the "hands-off" approach per se if she comes across as a bit immature or inexperienced as a dancer - IME it's futile to be logical w/ many a stripper so I play dumb since often times many a stripper can't seem to handle the truth or a custy being direct/too-direct.
Since I often go to $5 and $10 per dance dives where it's often more of a wanna-dance M.O., I'll usually keep it simple and not get into anything too deep; strip-club or o/w - many strippers can get defensive when one offers their opinion about stuff so often times w/ many a stripper IME less is more in terms of what one reveals.
w/ some that I click with I'll be more open - also some not so experienced dancers may get intimidated by a hardcore SCer and may see him as some kinda perv or loser for being a regular or hardcore SCer; not that it matters but ... - so for me it depends but I tilt towards keeping closer to the vest but in large part b/c my dive-club experience is usually just about the grind and not hanging and talking although the latter happens at times.
Where I live the clubs are closely regulated no touching. But still, if I girl is trying to make OTC happen by closing, DFKing will sometimes happen.
And then at the underground Mexican Bar circuit, though against their rules, DFKing still happens when a girl wants OTC. She has to show the guy that she means it and will deliver. Talk does not do it.
And then numerous accounts on Black Strip Clubs .net. Girls jump onto your lap, without asking, and then they start licking your neck and nibbling on your ear lobe. I interpret this as they are defying you to start making out with them.
Then they go to the back room to finish what they have started. In some of these places they don't bother with back rooms. They just take to couches in darkened corners. More deniability for the owner that way, and probably little or no house cut.
And then TUSCL members have affirmed that in the mixed race dives, all the girls do it just like it is done in the black dives.
And then the TJ accounts, the girls are even more aggressive and lead with DFKing. When they are in competition with other girls, that is the way to make the money.
Don't let girls sell you dances. That is a chumps game.
Instead let things develop in the front room. Think of it as a first date.
You can still feed her money, and there should be no house cut. But when it is needed, like when your pants are to come down, you invite her to the back room.
But if you do it this way, also plan on waking up with her the next morning.
26 comments
Latest
She will treat people who are likely to be regulars differently, and she will treat people who are likely to be seeing her on the outside differently, and she will treat people who are not married differently.
The worst will be for the guys who are just there willing to pay some money to ejaculate. I know that means many our regular forum posters right here. But the girl is not going to open up to people who are like that, as there is no reason to.
SJG
I think the above is much more important than just letting them know if you know how strip clubs operate.
Some guys just want what is offered, like LDKing, or even FS. But other guys are going to be wanting to start bedding down with a girl regularly and promptly.
Can't push it too hard or too fast, but one can let the girl figure it out. They are good with such communications, because they make a lot of difference to them.
SJG
The Harem, Dayton, Oh. CW'S Akron, Oh. Alcatraz, Erie, Mi, The Palms, Toledo, Oh.
Just to name a few. You have to be discreet under the table or in a dark corner at 2nd base. You have to be forward and resourceful if you want it !
SJG
Save booths and back rooms until you pants are to come down. Usually referred to as "home plate" in you scheme.
When it is time for that, you invite her to the back room.
You don't take her into the backroom to see if she is good, you take her into the backroom because she is already good.
But know, if you handle things this way, the chances that you will end up waking up with her the next morning start to get very high.
SJG
you're a moron
1. I am not a nube -- you're not going to rip me off.
2. I am a regular -- you'd better treat me right for frequent paydays.
3. I am not a local -- anything we do is no-strings-attached -- you don't have to worry about running in to me.
4. I have a job that pays me well enough to visit you.
Still not hearing that you tell the girl if you would want to be seeing her outside, and on an ongoing basis, or if you just always go to the strip club, to pick the next girl.
:)
SJG
As far as playing dumb as if I'm not a SC regular, I don't. As others have mentioned, they can usually tell. The first thing that comes to mind as a giveaway is when I say let's catch the next song. Aside from that as simple as it is, I feel letting it be known you're a regular works in your advantage as others have mentioned.
Not that it's anything you'd want to seek out because man they have drama filled lives, but being experienced will definitely have them letting you know some things.
I don't talk about TUSCL and encounters with other dancers with them.
It appears you are from the Columbus, Ohio, area. Ain't nothin happenin in Columbus clubs. You need to get away from Capital City out into the countryside and check out the clubs in the real world. We're having some fun out here.
Think the situation through some. Once you agree to go with the girl into a booth or a backroom, you are agreeing to pay a toll to the house, and money to her, but you are also obligating her to perform some sort of a service upon you.
Is that really what you want? Or are you just going along with a gimmick invented to work more money out of guys, without the girls having to do much?
Wouldn't you rather the girl just open up to you and let you lead it in a more civilian manner, like as if she was a girl you'd just met at a party?
You can still feed her money, but more just as a show of respect, not as a fee for service. And in the front room there should be no house cut.
Lap dancing started at MBOT in the 1970's, and what it meant was lap sitting.
Extremely good book:
https://www.amazon.com/Bottom-Feeders-Fr…
Now what else went along with lap sitting varied widely. But the point is there was no fixed structure for the time and money. It was mostly just between you and the girl.
The eye opening encounter for me was when I was cutting out from a stupid convention at the Moscone Center. I saw this extremely cute black girl walking along. She looked to me like an office worker on her lunch hour. I decided I would try and take her to lunch. Nothing ventured nothing gained. Fortune goes to the bold.
So as the side walks were full of people I laid back and tailed her. But I was wrong about her being an office worker. She ducked into the New Century.
Fortune goes to the bold. So I asked about her and was told that her name was Maria, and I paid the cover charge. I had to wait a long time before she came on stage. And this was before there was stage side sitting.
She did her set, peeling down to high heels and makeup, and then doing open tongue kissing with another girl.
And then she saw me, and then she was on my lap.
Now usually they have girl kissing in porno movies and I just FF past it. But here, seeing it live, it was a powerful turn on. It is women showing that they control the erotic.
So I found myself just unable to refrain from telling this girl how much of a turn on seeing that was for me. She replied instantly about how much she was enjoying it.
Well in a situation like that, things are going to happen.
It completely blew me away that she could be so open with me, a total stranger.
I found myself wanting to be more like her, instead of living my gray flannel life.
And this is how P4P sexual situations should be, transformative, life changing, not just for sexual gratification.
This small black girl with huge tits was a real treasure. It would be a waste to have her doing anything else but what she was doing. And the money was insignificant, considering the effect it had on the course of my life.
If I'd not been married then, I believe I'd of been waking up the next morning with this black Maria.
I am still trying to embody what I learned on that day.
And then also in AMPs, kissing is not standard, not at all. But if you can come on to your girl some and let her get softened up, usually you can get her DFKing. And from then on the entire encounter is a mind blowing GFA ( Girl Friend Audition ).
So you don't want your girl performing any service upon you, you just want her to open up and let you make it happen with her.
So the more in the front room the better. Best is intensive DFKing, with FOV/FIV.
Then you invite her to the back room, as your own pants are to come down.
Then you walk her out the front door with you and continue in your own home.
When Diane Feinstein tried to get Jim and Artie Mitchell convicted of felonies, and put an end to MBOT and all contact strip clubs, a big part of their defense was that it was all front room. It was not prostitution because it was not for sexual gratification. Rather it was an audience participation cabaret show, and it was for sexual education.
I agree fully. And this is how they got off.
So it was after this legal victory and after a more accepting administration came into office that they introduced booths and back rooms. Mostly it was just a way for the girl to keep easier control over the interaction. The guy pretty much has to play along with her.
The clubs convince the girls that they make more money like this, no front room action. But girls experienced in wilder and woolier environments know that this is not true. "Wanna Dance" is not the best way to get money out of guys. Front room GFE is. And in the wildest US clubs, the girls don't give you much choice but to start making out with them. Numerous accounts on Black Strip Clubs .net. And then TUSCLER's have affirmed via PM that it is done exactly the same way in the mixed race dives. And then the TJ accounts and videos are overwhelming.
The one who really makes money with the booths and back rooms is the house. They get a larger share of the money.
And people think it raises the mileage level. But most of the time this is not true. All it does is raise the cost, while lowering the typical mileage level.
If you can get a girl softened up and making out with you, she is not likely to refuse much of anything. So in places where front room makeout sessions are common, they are usually FS oriented venues.
But if the girl can get money out of you with "Wanna Dance", then it is probably just dry humping or BJ's, ejaculation services, without the girl ever really opening up to you. Guys go for this, and in my view it is all a chumps game.
SJG
Living his grey flannel life
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBtLClr_…
Tijuana Street
https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3731/13904…
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5467/96345…
https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3680/96331…
Since I often go to $5 and $10 per dance dives where it's often more of a wanna-dance M.O., I'll usually keep it simple and not get into anything too deep; strip-club or o/w - many strippers can get defensive when one offers their opinion about stuff so often times w/ many a stripper IME less is more in terms of what one reveals.
w/ some that I click with I'll be more open - also some not so experienced dancers may get intimidated by a hardcore SCer and may see him as some kinda perv or loser for being a regular or hardcore SCer; not that it matters but ... - so for me it depends but I tilt towards keeping closer to the vest but in large part b/c my dive-club experience is usually just about the grind and not hanging and talking although the latter happens at times.
And then at the underground Mexican Bar circuit, though against their rules, DFKing still happens when a girl wants OTC. She has to show the guy that she means it and will deliver. Talk does not do it.
And then numerous accounts on Black Strip Clubs .net. Girls jump onto your lap, without asking, and then they start licking your neck and nibbling on your ear lobe. I interpret this as they are defying you to start making out with them.
Then they go to the back room to finish what they have started. In some of these places they don't bother with back rooms. They just take to couches in darkened corners. More deniability for the owner that way, and probably little or no house cut.
And then TUSCL members have affirmed that in the mixed race dives, all the girls do it just like it is done in the black dives.
And then the TJ accounts, the girls are even more aggressive and lead with DFKing. When they are in competition with other girls, that is the way to make the money.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XARgc5Um…
Dr. F
https://www.tuscl.net/postread.php?PID=2…
Don't let girls sell you dances. That is a chumps game.
Instead let things develop in the front room. Think of it as a first date.
You can still feed her money, and there should be no house cut. But when it is needed, like when your pants are to come down, you invite her to the back room.
But if you do it this way, also plan on waking up with her the next morning.
SJG