Can High Mileage and Low Mileage Clubs Exist in Harmony; if the Law Allows It?

I can't speak for all, of course, but sometimes I just enjoy going into a club, having a beer or two, and looking a lovely naked ladies. Other times, mileage is of more importance.

So, in my world, yes, they could co-exist.

They not only can but often do. There are lots of strip club customers who never buy a private dance, either because it doesn't interest them or they can't (or aren't willing to) afford it. To them mileage is irrelevant, they just want to look at and talk to naked girls. Many neighborhood strip clubs don't even offer private dances even when they're allowed, and lots of girls prefer to work in such places. Most of us here probably never set foot in places like that but there are a large number of them.

I think you'd have to have a certain minimum population for the two options to co-exist side by side. In a small burg that only supports one or two clubs, I think it's unlikely the two would be of radically divergent types. But in a big city, particularly one that has a wide range of income types of spending patterns, the different spending styles could be acccommodated by different but still successful clubs. Seems to me. Maybe Vegas would be a good example -- off-strip "dive" type locals places with low costs, probably extras available; on-strip "glamour" type tourist places with high costs, probably m ore "by the book" behaviors. Just my guess, never been to Vegas.

Hi Fondl,

I'm not aware of any clubs like that in Miami, anymore.

I was thinking in terms of competition. It seemed like the prevailing thought was that if you have a mileage club competing against a conversation club (some mileage at dancer's discretion, but not the focus of the club) that the mileage club would of course win hands down and run the other club into the ground. I just didn't think that was the case where you have a very free market. Where freedom is restricted, the mileage club, imo, will win hands down over the conversation club depending on the specific freedoms that have been eliminated.

With The Trap at what I think was its peak, I did actually spend more time and money at Angels even though The Trap at the time had a lot more to offer. The problem was that The Trap with less mileage was more expensive than Angels. Money was extremely tight and I needed to be in a club where even small amounts of money were valued. The Trap, had the hot dancers and friendly people and was much closer to where I lived. Money problems prevailed.

Jablake, clubs like I described are common in smaller towns. There are also a lot of places like that in the older section (not downtown) in both Philly and Baltimore and probably a lot of other cities that I'm not familiar with. Book Guy makes a valid point about clubs in smaller towns being pretty similar, the ones I'm familiar with are mostly the no-private-dance type I described.

Hi FONDL,

Thanks for the information. I believe Philly and Baltimore have good reps as far as having high mileage clubs. So the two can exist under the right conditions one of which is probably "a certain minimum population" as Book Guy posted. Here in Miami we not only had crowded areas we also had more rural areas as well. And, we had rich and poor. All different types of people. W. Dixie Hwy. was special in that there were clubs fairly close together and different type customers generally would flock to a certain type club. The typical customer at The Trap would probably walk into Angels and walk out as fast as possible. Angels didn't exactly welcome new customers generally. :) The clubs were like night and day even though at the time they were both white clubs. And, there was Tootsies that was loud and slutty with lots of action and could be fairly dangerous especially away from the club to where a pool table place was. Seemed like pool tables attracted bad characters. Shooting pool, I didn't do much because of money trouble--it was a special treat. Tootsies had a nice mix of super hot and super dog. I just couldn't take the noise, which was the loudest I've heard anywhere. :( All 3 of the clubs mentioned I considered to be very different. I think Tootsies was also white with maybe a light dancer here or there--so many years have passed. I don't even know how many.

jablake,

Are you talking about the old Tootsies or the OLD Tootsies?

Hi clubber,

I think it is the OLD Tootsies. The one before they started going up scale. The regular old Tootsies was for me upscale. The new current Tootsies is off the chart upscale, but it is funny I can go to the new upscale and spend even less money than at Angels! That just blows my mind. :) Of course, I have more fun at Angels . . . but there is more of a history.

When I type OLD I mean the oldest of the versions and lowest class of the version. The regular old for some people might not seem too upscale, but for me it was.

Also, the OLD Tootsies had the incredibly blaring music that just plain hurt. :( The next version (old Tootsies) the music wasn't bad and the clients were much higher "quality."

I'd completely forgotten because it has been so many years. The OLD Tootsies was very small compared to next version of old Tootsies. I don't even remember how they ended up so big, it didn't seem like there was space.

The slutty dancers reminded me of Mons (Mons was better), but the Mons was quiet and I could have lived at the Mons. What a cheap wonderful club the Mons was. Beautiful slutty dancers, low prices, nice and quiet. I just immediately fell in love with that club. It was like I'd discovered a ton of gold, but I had to return home before collecting the booty and bringing it home.

I've seen this within 30 miles of each other a lot of the time. One club may be high mileage while a 30 minute drive (sometimes a lot closer in a bigger city) there is a club with little to no mileage but the dancers look very nice and the customers just go to watch and talk to the dancers. I myself go one club and don't buy any lap dances in a low to no mileage club and just watch the dancers while less than 30 minutes away, my mileage may consist of dancers jumping up on my shoulders during a stage tip to who knows what.

For me, 30 minutes of driving is substantial. I'm think right across the street or next door. Open a strip club near The Trap that went back to the old format and I think it would be a very successful business.

jablake,

The OLD Tootsies to which I referred was around back in the late 70's early 80's. It was located where the old Tootsies was (NW 7 Ave & 183 St) before they moved to the now new Tootsies. They had a juke box for music and the dancers would hustle quarters for it.

Yes, that is the OLD Tootsies. And, then it increased in size by maybe a factor of more than 4 while remaining in the same location. Not only did it increase in size it, imo, went way upscale. Of course, I also considered The Trap upscale while probable most people would consider it a friendly dive at its peak. Then the new Tootsies again increased in size, but moved.

So, I was referring to the OLD Tootsies at the old location before it increased in size. 183rd? I thought it was 199th and NW 7th. But, I'm not great with remembering addresses/locations. Very near me in the NW many years ago there was a club that was heaven, but it was a "hidden" club. I could find the general area, but not the exact location. I seem to remember NO signs to speak of and it was a real surprise because I didn't even realize it was a strip club until I went in and it was WOW!!! Hot girls galore (mainly white or all white) and I was treated like royalty; it was too good to be true. :) The next day I went to find it, I figured I would recognize the exterior, and it wasn't to be. If I had a better sense of direction . . . or written the address down . . .

There are two clubs on the outskirts of Baltimore about 5 minutes apart - one has very high milage LDs, the other has no private dances, just stage dancing. Both are quite popular.

Apparently it isn't all about the mileage. :)

Thanks again!


(BTW, I do actually need some contact. It just doesn't seem too hard core to me. But, to an air dancer it might seem like rape!)

Hi FONDL,

Does the stereotype of the more attractive dancers working at low mileage clubs hold up?

I would think that is the case. What does a dog have to offer besides lapping? Of course, there is that buga boo the beauty is in the eye of the beholder . . .

Jablake, I can't say from first hand knowledge, but I don't think it does in this case. There are actually 4 clubs in very close proximity - a super nice GC with medium contact, a total dump with extras as standard fare, plus the other two places I mentioned - a high milage LD factory and a place with no private dances at all. I haven't been to them all but from the reviews over the years it appears that the high milage LD factory draws the most attractive dancers, probably because the girls there make the most money - it's wildly popular (which is in part why I've never gone.) The extras place does the least business of the 4, judging from the parking lots when I go by, probably because they have by far the least attractive dancers (as in oink oink.)

That is a surpise that the high mileage club draws the most attractive dancers. But, times change.

Truly, it should be heaven if you like BIG women. I don't see a shortage of BIG, but then seeing 1 is 1 too many imo. Perhaps if I was a GC fan, then I'd be complaining that they don't have any pleasingly plump dancers. As it is the new huge Tootsies, a GC, doesn't seem to have much in the way of small cute dancers that I like. Just as well given the cost of a dance is out of my ball park.

Truly if BIG is your thing then the local Walmart should be your best buddy. Probably there are a bunch of good Walmart pick-up lines too. Like, I'm Smart Shopper, I'm a Walmart Shopper, Please Take a Seat in My Cart. :) Or, I Love Walmart Because They Have Lots of Bargains, And DAMN You Look Like The Bargain of Eternity. :) Ok, if I had any interest in picking up Walmart customers then I'd work on those lines----OTOH, blubber butt should be grateful with any dumb lines I can generate! BTW, many times DUMB can be GOOD THING, NOT A BAD THING, A GOOD THING. :)

jablake,

My mistake, it was 199th street. The new is at 183rd. I quit going to the OLD before they enlarged it. It was just a local place, much like The Trap. Last time I visited The Trap, I couldn't wait to finish my beer and get out! Not many remember the OLD Tootsies. Do you remember a place on the west side of 7 Ave. just south of Tootsies?

Jablake, I'm not saying that's generally true, I don't know whether it is or isn't. But I think earnings potential may be as important a consideration for a girl deciding where to work as is mileage, and the places that provide the best earnings potential can probably be more selective in who they hire than the places that don't provide as much income opportunity.

Hi clubber,

Maybe the east side of 7th Ave? It seemed like there were a lot of places in the old days---a ton of erotic massage or one on one dance on NW 7th. FONDL had posted about the older generation being more tolerant. And, it is funny because yes I think generally that was the case (excluding the racial issues, for example) even though the tolerant people were often extremely conservative. By conservative I don't mean waving the American flag all over the place or spouting religious BS as if it were the only truth. By conservative I mean an extremely healthy distrust of government and being numbered i.e. national identification.

I didn't see the OLD Tootsies as being comparable to The Trap at all. The Trap in its hey day I remember ALL 9s and 10s and prices out of my reach (I was very poor) and the place was comfortable for talking (the music wasn't loud) with the really sweet girls that didn't seem slutty. I was well treated even though I didn't have money and I wasn't a smiler. The OLD Tootsies the music was like rocket engines, but louder. I could barely talk to the dancers even with yelling. It drained a ton of the fun away. The girls all seemed slutty (I loved it!) and they had super hot dancers to super dog dancers. I could afford the prices and would have done a little business if I could have held up under the music attack. It is bad when a couple days later you're still having hearing trouble. Yes, other people would lump them together, but I just saw them as having very different focuses and products. In fact, I think it is normal for the typical club goer to see one dive as essentially equal to other dives. Also, The Trap from my perspective was upscale (yes, I realize now that was a minority view) and the OLD Tootsies seemed more down and dirty, but definitely more upscale than Angels. I think the Angels of old was No. 1 in being down and dirty (not sex wise) and out and place even dive lovers would generally avoid. At one time it had NO music, which was fantastic!!! :) The dancers didn't dance, which was fantastic!!! There wasn't a requirement to be friendly, which was fantastic!!! Ah, the good old days and at the time I knew they were good days, but just didn't have any money to really have a blast.



Hi FONDL,

One example is good enough for me! :) To me, it is a NO brainer because mileage is not the be all and end all for me. The problem is opening the club and having the right to restrict anyone for any reason and to free of all the government BS. IOWs, ideally I could open a conversation strip club on a used book store budget. Now, we're talking freedom. And, I don't think the girls need to make as much as totally nude because it is NOT all about the money. :)

I think that you will go to a club that you choose. There are plenty of people who prefer the lower mileage clubs or to be quite honest they wouldn't exist. I personally feel that those clubs are a waste of my time but different strokes for different folks. The deal is almost all dancers if they had their way would blow-up the LD high mileage places. They stay in business because of guys like me who wouldn't go to a club period or at least wouldn't spend any real money there without contact. The attractive dancers know they can make money at those places but some of low mileage "upscale" places have exhorbitant prices and so they will prefer to work at these places because they can potentially make more money without the so-called "slut" factor. The 2 types of clubs can coexist simply because people have very different wants and needs.

Jablake, just to clarify, in my example the high mileage place that gets the most attractive dancers is high but LEGAL mileage. The extras place, which is obviously even higher mileage, has the least attractive dancers of the 4 clubs mentioned. I think a lot (maybe most?) dancers don't much care how high the mileage is as long as it doesn't cross the line into extras. Just like most probably don't care whether it's nude or only topless. The money is the more important criteria in deciding where to work.

Hi FONDL,

What is "LEGAL" is a matter of opinion even when the statutory law is clear. And, it is not merely a matter of opinion between a know nothing layperson and an experienced $400 per hour attorney. You can have high priced attorneys experienced in that area of law all be in agreement over a straight forward and simple area of law and boom the judge see the exact opposite.

I gave a link to a case (I was just a "bystander") where the trial judge decided one way, the appeals court decided another way, and the Florida Supreme Court ignored the main issue (which all the judges did) and reversed the appeal court. It is really such an idiotic fraud, but most people in ordinary professions are so slow that they make the attorneys seem like super brains.

I guess I should be grateful that the attorneys aren't brain dead also and for all my wonderful "freedoms." :)

Jablake, you're taking me much too literally. When I say legal, I'm talking about the absence of extras (uncovered genital contact of one sort or another.) I'm well aware that the law and it's interpretation are murky and vary with both place and time - we've talked about that many times here. But I think we all agree that uncovered genital contact in a strip club is almost always illegal.

Hi FONDL,

Sorry about that.