America is Not Great

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I spent two weeks in Ukraine for the Christmas holidays. There was a park in the city that was open every evening with vendors, selling grog and hluehwein... No card checking, folks happily getting buzzed. I think there was one police officer for the whole event. We cannot have that in America... Too many irresponsible people.

I did not encounter the aggressive panhandling in Ukraine that I encounter almost daily in the USA, despite people being poorer generally.

Huge wealth gap, still no universal health care, higher infant mortality rate than most other industrialized countries.

Capitalism wastes the talents of our people, so we have lots of people who live on alcohol, drugs, psychiatric medication, and on Christianist funamentalism.

SJG

Thanks Lurker for sharing your experience in Ukraine . Its probaly because those people have values and gratitude.

No doubt America has faults but I find it interesting that the OP first choice of a comparison was china.
You have the freedom to say whatever critical things you want about America in America, do you think you could get away with saying critical things about china if you lived in china? Go see how far freedom of speech will get you there.

Basically, yeah..... if we compare the US to other developed or even developing countries, we maybe have the social and material infrastructure of South Africa.

SJG tax the rich

A hell of a lot of people want to come here, but there aren't many in a rush to get out (even though they promised to if our current President got elected).

^Betcha SJG is in no hurry to leave, neither is phat head LOLK

^ And I considered moving to the moon.

All talk.

Most Americans can't get out. They can't qualify for visas to live in most countries. The people wanting to come to the US are mostly from third world countries fucked up by the US.

The US is a lot like South Africa, fucked up infrastructure, still recovering from segregation/apartheid, built on genocide, racist politics, very few social safety nets most of which just keep people at a subsistence level, private health care, shitty public schools, etc

so what, the socio historic context and lack of infrastructure are comparable.

The US has more crime overall than the RSA

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Yes DC9428 America's system has not work for millenials It should be more like Netherlands hell they even have a prostitution museum .

IceyLoco I agree .

It clearly says overall crimes are higher.

Focusing on one thing however and trying to say it discredits any other similarity is meaningless. We're socially, historically and infrastructurally the same pretty much. Even their history of internal colonialism, displacement of indigenous peoples... the homeland system is just like the reservation system. They also have their notion of exceptionalism, which is not unlike American exceptionalism.

Basically, we're a backward religious country with an outdated infrastructure crawling out of segregation/apartheid and struggling to shake off that mindset and institutionalism.

And measuring or attempting to measure a society based on your personal access to hookers is.......Its ridiculous, the world doesn't revolve around P4P, its not any society's goal nor obligation to provide hookers for men who can't get laid. That said, there are hoes every where but its not a measure of society in a positive way

It’s the media that divides us and creates a perception that everyone is entitled and needs to get their fare share handed out to them conveniently, instead of going out and working for it.

If we didn’t have such easy access to rampant media outlets, we wouldn’t have this fear of missing out when we see others having the good life, causing resentment. Over seas in other countries the media isnt as ubiquitous therefore the people are more content with their lives, not seeing other people’s fake platforms that you see so much in America. America has fake media, and it’s up to those who can do for themselves to sort out what is real or fake. Too many lazy and poor
People think they’re entitled to what the hustlers get.

Losers who don't work hard and like to whine don't find America great. Foreigners don't either. Of course where I live the school system is top 10% in achievment in Massachusetts, which makes it top 2% nationally. We are bottom 20% in cost of educartion in Massachusetts with an autism program that teachers from all parts of the state come to observe because it gets results, for minimal costs. Our high school is state of the art and five years old; the private High School has a campus to rival any small college. The Junior High is two years old. Our tax rate is in the bottom 10% of the state and the lowest in the county. Our crime rate is virtually non-existent. Our schools are in the top .06% nationally in educational achievment per dollar spent. Our cable and wifi is half the cost of private providers. We have a town park, rivballing any state park in the state, that we built with donantions. 80% of the people vote, every election. It snowed last night and I had to get up ang go somehwre at 4:00 am and my street was plowed to the pavement. I live on a side street. We have a small ski area almost withion walking distance and the largest in southern new england 20 minutes away. Our public library is beyond fantastic. We have 7 supermarkets, all different within 5 miles (whole foods, Trader Joes, Wegmans, etc); the ocean is 45 minutes away. Worcester is 10 minutes so we have access to the regions Trauma center and another large Hospital. My phjysician is downtown and a 5 minute walk. Worcester has seven colleges, a medical school and a pharmacy school. There are 7 major malls within a half hour. We have a local airport with non-stops to NYC and Florida. Strip clubs are all over the place. We have legal recreational weed sales. We forget to lock the house and close the doors all the time. We live with no fear. I like floating in my pool vaping and drinking beer. Two years ago I watxched a hawk on my deck from 2 feet away during lunch and a small herd of deer winters in our backyard every winter. Move to the fucking Ukraine, South America, but just shut the fuck up young people. You are nothing more than a waste of air. My America is great. I fuckinjg love it. Now millenial ladies, get on your knees, bark like a dog and here's some cash for your troubles; just kidding its bitcoin.

And yet the poverty rate for Blacks is more than double that of Whites in the state and ranks 10th for households earning less than the poverty rate. Your white privilege seems nice though, glad to see you enjoy it.

Just an excuse to try to rationalize the situation.

Have you ever considered that there may be other causes?

Single parent households and children born to children lead to a lot of disadvantages regardless of race for many reasons.
The rate for each among the AA population is much higher. This helps to create the perceived white priveledge that often gets used as an excuse to give up.

My career took me all over the world both on business trips and in numerous foreign assignments.

Bottom line, the USA is not at the top of the heap on any single metric other than GDP and military power. But it is at the better end of the scale on a lot of metrics.

On balance, despite its shortcomings, I can’t think of anyplace else I’d rather live.

Into, some close runners up include:

Australia
Canada
Finland
New Zealand
Norway
Switzerland

We have to tax the rich, because otherwise the money just goes into inflating the stock and real estate markets, as this country divides into the very rich and the very poor.

SJG

Frances Fox Piven, Professor of Political Science and Sociology at the Graduate Center, CUNY
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Yes, the poverty rate for Blacks is higher than Whites.

Now, look at the rates of poverty for people who

1. Have never been arrested
2. Graduated high school
3. Are married

For this group of people, the rate of poverty between Blacks and Whites is nearly identical.

Racism ! White Privilege ! Victimhood !

Australia not bad

I find it odd that these liberals who are anti christian mostly darwin followers cannot let go of taking care of the poor. Maybe its because they are for the most part sucking on the tit of the government. Darwin believes in natural selection and only the strong survive. If this is true then why the hell should any of the strong ever help any of the weak.

SJG, you fucking hypocrite.... try studying up on something other than your own opinions before you post....."Capitalism wastes the talents of our people, so we have lots of people who live on alcohol, drugs, psychiatric medication, and on Christianist funamentalism." It is that Christian Fundamentalism that you are trying to exploit by guilting people into helping the poor. Fuck the poor, if they cannot support themselves then abort them, you want late term abortions, how about aborting the 35 year old child still dependent on the govt. It's all about Darwinism right.... Strong survive the weak perish... the next generation is stronger.

I don't believe any of this I am just sick of the hypocrisy

@flagooner i can't wait to leave us every chance i get! Viva mexico!

Dadillac said "Darwin believes in natural selection and only the strong survive. If this is true then why the hell should any of the strong ever help any of the weak."

Because Darwinism is a theory of biological evolution, and not an ethical or religious belief. People don't "follow" Darwinism like the Hare Krishna.

I'm not in agreement with SJG (thankfully...), but I believe in being charitable to those in need. And I'm not remotely religious.

The problem with America is there are too many irresponsible stupid people who think they are smart, and too few responsible smart people who doubt themselves.

You see it every day on the news, hell even on this thread! People spouting off statistics like it proves their point. People who barely have a high school diploma quoting statistics, calculated by PhD economists and sociologists, that they read in a biased news article.

The problem is that people who talk too much don’t think, and the people who think a lot don’t talk enough.

^^ that, and Americans are too fat.

@ Ishmael.... I also believe in being charitable and generous. I see the fish logos on the back of cars that is a christian logo but then then put legs on the fish and darwin through the middle, it just made me think... What would darwin say about this. So many of the liberals like SJG slam christian morals but depend on teh generosity of those "awful christians".... Christ would say to help the sick and the poor.... Darwin would say fuck them, if they cannot survive and thrive on their own

@Cuntryman, but you keep returning.

Every time I see this thread I want to bitch slap @nemesisk7

Daddilac, the underemployment rate is extremely high, like 70%.

And the middle-class family creates its own scapegoats. This is how you get people living on drugs, alcohol, and psychiatric medications.

And DC, people who are trying to be good people are the real hypocrites. Their acts are predicated on finding faults in others, in wanting to believe that our world is fair and just. Christianity is about turning people into Uncle Toms.

SJG

SJG has finally changed someone with his words and endless rambling..... I believe his mother should have aborted him

This is what im talking about The old man Patriots owner wanted a handy or fs i dont know and now he is getting bashed by the media . We need a society that accepts prostitution.

The world doesnt revolve arounf P2P ????
Qhat do you think marriage is ?

@faganeer who is cuntryman?

I'm sorry for the misspelling. I meant @Cuntrytard

I have a good number of friends and work related friends that have moved out of the USA since 2004. Places such as Morocco, Dominican Republic, Argentina, HongKong, Canada, Mexico, New Zealand, and Germany. These are just a few that come to mind quickly.

Most of them left because they also felt life was better someplace else --all of them either moved back to the US or come back here and ended up splitting time between their new home and here.

Not one of them had any issue qualifying for Visas. One exception is Singapore where you better have a certain skill set if you want to migrate there.

The USA is a big country---typically what someone doesn't like about living ( as an example) in the DC area can be solved by moving to someplace in the SW part of the country.

I'd rather not be like Germany or Denmark....if you like them so much move there. I know people who have...guess what? They are back in the USA again.

America might not be great, but it’s still a couple of billion percent better than any other country on the planet.

^ Bullshit. America is fucking awesome!!!

I also know a few people that moved out of country and returned, one couple I know well moved to Costa Rica three years later the were back in Florida. Another former business partner moved to the DR and became very disillusioned by the constant issues, he said that every day was a new problem, and the third guy I knew moved to Germany said there were so many taxes and nickel and dime issues that he had enough. I personally have looked into buying property in Mexico, St Martin and Costa Rica and found the real estate laws to be problematic and difficult at best.
I think you’re all living a pipe dream if you believe the grass is greener anyplace than here.

^ Fuckin' A right!!!

I’ll make one more point and leave this convo to those that think they know better.
I don’t know for a fact and I’m not interested in researching this but I’ll bet that there are more folks from all of those places that you guys think are so wonderful living here in America, than there are Americans living there in those wonderful places that allow prostitution, if y’all think that’s a reason to leave, my take on it is you’re a bunch of losers. Really just beyond stupid.

twentyfive I "had" property in St Maarten--the Dutch side.......thankfully before the whole island was turned into a parking lot a couple of years ago I bailed. What you find with many of the South American and Caribbean nations is that they rise for a few years in prosperity only to fall as fast as they had risen...........

@Warrenboy the Dutch side would have been better than the French because of the legal system, problem is that the better values were by the bay but I just wasn’t convinced that they would honor the deeds fairly because of the land trust issues.

America is great. It also has its problems. What are those problems and how should they be addressed? That discussion is 99% of the flame wars on any political discussion board or comment section. All the people arguing forget that they have in common the belief that much of America is great.

@twentyfive--I spent most of my free time when there in Marigot. Loved the atmosphere and that the cruise ships ( at least years ago) couldn't get into the harbor so it was not all that much of a tourist magnet.

But a couple of weeks a year was it for me and I decided the problems with remote ownership just wasn't worth the investment.

I propose that @25 and @Warrenboy get a room to finish each other off.

Fucking homos.

@fagoneer shutup old man

Eat your fruit cups it will be alright i promise

I think Flagooner has switched to "puddin pops" in honor of Bill Cosby........

And I think you switched to penises.

I think flagooner is just jealous of my general good looks and naturally easygoing charm ;)

@ Warrenboy last couple of years my favorite island has been Aruba, but I still like St. Martin a lot, but Aruba is better suited to those longer vacations that I have been taking 10 days in St. Martin can be a bit long whereas there’s always something different to do and there are more upscale venues there.

South Africa has a horrible history of race relations. This is why it has such a high per capita homicide rate today.

The United States has a horrible history of race relations. This has much to do with why it has a per capita homicide rate much higher than most other industrialized countries.

And Daddilac, just like we have an expanding wealth gap, we also have an expanding suitable employment gap. Most people are grossly under employed, and then some, usually the scape goats of the middle-class family, are unlikely to ever be able to live anything which passes in our society as a normal adult life.

SJG

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I agree SJG, and those underperforming should be aborted not rewarded.... strong will survive

SJG capitalism has failed most people

I heard AMPs are being close down in san jose !!!!!!

@ nemesisk there goes sjg's amp gfe and front room makeout sessions lol

Pranks will make America great again

Like this one

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