TUSCL friends I am often known for my random posts some funny, some sexy (i hope anyway) and all honest. This is something i have been thinking alot about and something i have heard other dancers talking about and that is finding the self worth in ourselves as dancers. From the minute a dancer enters the club on audition night to her last night working she is judged primarily on outward apperance. Now certainly the ability to talk to customers is important as well as the ability to hustle. But by and large the decision to talk or get a dance with a girl is based on appearance. I think this affects the personality of dancers more than we realize. Slowly we start altering ourselves to make us more appealing. Clothing and makeup styles change, behaviors change and this may carry over into our personal lives. Most dancers are dramatic (perhaps the entertainers in us) most are loud and most have no worries in the world besides looking the part. The constant need for attention can be harmful if not regulated well. Self worth comes from inside a dancer at her core. Most dancers need to identify as what they enjoy doing for example (not me just and example) im a mom that enjoys gardening, reading and spending lazy days around the house... and i am also a dancer.... Most often this is reveresed and starts out with a question.... what do you do? I'm a dancer.... No thats what you do for a living and something much different than what you do or who you are.... The take home to my fellow ladies (and the customers that love them) is dont let the alter ego of a dancer spill over into real life outside of the club. With a small amount of grounding a dancer can be the girl that she needs to be inside of the club and also be a strong independent lady outside of that atmosphere. Just a bit of monday motivation from me to you.
Thanks for reinforcing, via personal view, what I always believed to be the case with most of my favorites. It is important that the job not define who they are but they must be effective in playing their dancer role. It always involves striking a balance of “club validation” and sense of worth in real life. Appreciate your insight.
In my experience, most exotic dancers work an average of 3 shifts per week leaving far more time for other activities and pursuits than most working stiffs. How that time is used is either a cause or a result of the individuals self image , self worth, and strength of ones ego.
In many cases, dancers need another job, however many others just have more leisure time.
If that time I'd spent on positive avocations then I'd take that to be a reflection of someone who's got their shit together. However if extra time is used on self destructive behavior or negative activities, that's a reflection of a woman who doesn't think very highly of herself.
So I guess I agree with you.
Desire is the source of all suffering. If your happiness is conditioned on attaining something, including other people’s approval, you are on the wrong path.
My suspicion is that most people in the entertainment industry have an excessive need for other’s approval. That seldom ends well.
The dancer with whom I spend mot of my time (and money) has been in the business for five years. I won't talk about how she got there because it is personal and not my place. I will say that she was a single mom, working two jobs and struggling to get by. An old friend bumped into her at her waitressing job and after some catching up asked what she was making. Working about 50 hours a week she was lucky to come away with $500. Her friend recommended Amateur Night at RI Dolls where she could make that a night. It took her a couple tries to get the courage to "take it off" but she ended working there for a while before moving into Providence because it was closer to home and a better schedule.
Almost five years later she has bought a house, a car and started a savings account for her daughter's college. There are times that the chore of dealing with the assholes all guys can be gets her down and she questions her decision. I remind her that she has made difficult choices at a young age but she does the dancing by her rules, is wise with her money and has provided a home and a future for her daughter.
I know it can be a rare story but she has started preparing an exit strategy with a five year plan. I hope it has a happy ending!
I’ve always thought that any kind of difficult work or lifestyle choices does not define a person and shouldn’t need to. That being said, stress takes a huge toll on all of us and we need to learn how to manage our own self image.
In the case of a lot of strippers, they are valued for their looks, as PD said, and that can be harmful if that’s the only message they internalize. Ultimately, it’s up to each person to rise above their difficulties or succumb to them. But I would think stripping would be full of potential pitfalls, especially given the young age of most strippers.
+1 to poledancer83. I brought this topic up some time back was told I had no idea what I was talking about but I've seen a few dancers get the blues to being outright depressed--as well as I have asked if the proverbial switch that a dancer is supposed to throw when she goes from her real life to the stage starts to blur as the months turn into years. and the switch is thrown back and forth week in week out.
I don't know what you mean by "most dancers are loud." I am "loud" when I have to talk over the music to customers but I'm not loud in real life. I have no idea what that even means.
I've said this before, dancing helped me find my self-worth. I know "who I am" and am more confident in myself than I was before I started dancing. Before I started dancing I was broke, owed my University several thousand dollars so I couldn't go back until paid them, and before I owed them the money and was enrolled I'd sit in the back of the class and never participate just like I did in high school; I was extremely passive in all facets of life. Couldn't make business calls or do much that required communication with strangers, was never assertive.
I started dancing years ago I think sometime in July. I was able to get a new apartment, no roommate this time, within like 2 weeks. In that same time span I was also able to pay cash and go to the local community college for a semester while I saved to pay off the rest of what I owed my University, which I did within 6 months or so from when I started dancing, so I was able to go back the following semester. I sat in the front row, participated in all my classes, made friends, etc. I wasn't too shy to talk to the professor after class about something, my grades improved, and so did my life. It was pretty freeing, actually. I could go out and shop or go eat a nice meal whenever I wanted. Even go on random vacations when I had time off from school. I ended up moving again, to a nice 2 bedroom apartment in an affluent and safe suburb, again by myself. No roommates.
Of course this job takes a physical toll on a person mentally and physically. I remember when I was still relatively new to dancing and was doing a lot of pole tricks back when Landing Strip's poles where thick like pillars, I'd wake up in the middle of the night sometimes with a shooting pain in my arm and would have to take an ibuprofen and a Flexeril (a non-narcotic skeletal muscle relaxer) just to get back to sleep. Sometimes after a shift my feet are killing me. Used to have my (now ex) boyfriend rub them just so I could fall asleep. But the pain is worth it. There are plenty of manual labor jobs that are rough on the body (they should try it in heels though). You muscle through it.
The mental part can be worse for some women and better for others. For me, there is good and bad. I've explained how much dancing has caused me to come out of my shell, which is good. It's also very emotionally taxing, but again, so are many jobs.
You and I seem very different as strippers. I don't know why you started dancing, but you've expressed before that one of your favorite parts is getting attention. I started dancing for two reasons only: 1) MONEY 2) the ability to have a flexible schedule so I can more or less make money whenever the hell I want. As far as attention goes, I have to deal with guys who are NOT paying me giving me attention every time I visit my mom or family/friends in Detroit. Can't walk down the street without some guy yelling "aye, LightSkin!" when I'm in Detroit. It's annoying. Attention is annoying, I only like it at work in a consequential sense; getting money = attention. I could have 500 guys ignore me all night and not give a shit as long as I have 1 guy spending a lot of money on me. Of course 500 guys would not ignore me, but I'm speaking hypothetically. Getting attention at work is actually annoying to me unless the guys giving me attention are also giving me money.
Dancing has taught me a lot about men and about how marriages fall apart through time, so I even credit dancing for me being wise beyond my years about that and will be smart when choosing someone to settle down with --- but that's a whole different topic.
The main negative for me is that I drink more than I did before I started dancing. I would have a drink a little here and there, and had my fair share of getting wasted and partying as a youngin' so by the time I started dancing (19 or 20), I was past the "let's party and get fucked up" stage of my life (I graduated high school and started at my University all when I was 17, my sister and I got a house together and it became a party house). But at work, you're offered drinks all night. So I would say that I drink more than I originally did, but that is something that can be maintained.
I've dealth with depression before I started dancing and after, so it's not like dancing ever caused that.
My clothing and makeup style has changed as one's should while they're growing up, especially being in my 20s now vs when I was new to being an adult. I have my own sense of identity, which relates to how I dress. I also have more money and am therefore able to spend more and have a wider range of attire that I can afford.
So really, dancing has helped more than it has hurt. It's given me more confidence than it has taken away.
Great read, but customers in strip clubs are just as full of shit as the dancers and you will get no real insight at all into marriages. If you want to have a chance at a long term, happy marriage, marry your best friend, to whom you are sexually attractive. In over 35 years the only type of couple I never see in divorce court is the one where they are best of friends and do a lot of fun things together. No, I do not mean with the children.
Very insightful from both dancers. My primary point of reference is my ATF who's been a dancer for more than 10 years, but has also been a heroin addict for that time and as a result has been very "extras friendly". She and I have talked at length about prostitution ( her only way to support her habit), dancing, and her self image.
She's fortunate in that all the drug use has not negatively impacted her appearance, but the drugs and her being used by men has severely damaged her ability to function; to move forward; to get beyond the status quo. All of her friends are drug involved. All of the men in her life are either addicts or "customers".
She, through the nine years I've known her has had periods of sobriety (10 months on methadone once) and she surprisingly has some hesitation about dancing ( getting naked on stage). When she's been totally sober ( no methadone & no suboxone) she's been unable to work as a dancer. Dancing to her always includes blow jobs and occasional sexual with strangers.
I don't know if she'll ever find herself. She recently said to me that sometimes she doesn't care if she lives or dies.
I really like her and care about her and yet realize my role in enabling her drug use. I bought her a two year old car, provided free room & board for 6 months, and helped her save a couple of grand.
She & her BF ( who has a saleable skill) are leaving tomorrow, driving 1500 miles and starting a new life.
Her story is sadly not infrequent among the dancers I know.
Great perspective from both dancers. For most young people I don't see it so much as finding yourself, so much as it is creating yourself. You get to choose where you find your self worth.
Net net, sex work in general, and stripping in particular, is empowering to women. The financial resources generated in the industry feed and care for a lot of people. However, there are several dark elements to the business that negatively impact many people, namely: sex trafficking, drug and alcohol abuse, physical and mental abuse, and STDs. Enlightened countries, where prostitution is legal, address these risks head on.
I have respect for sex workers across the full spectrum of its many forms. Before stepping into a strip club for the first time just a few years ago, I had a generally negative/uninformed view of the industry. I see things quite differently now that I’ve developed friendships with several dancers.
Interesting perspectives. Stripping can be empowering, but can also break some people. Like pro athletes, the flow of money has a limited shelf life. Unlike some career fields, stripping is something one can viably do much past 40 into your 50's and 60's.
Whenever a dancer reaches "that point", the transition into a field outside the sex industry will likely be as tough as dealing with the day to day (or night to night) stresses of the stripping gig. In several cases, losing the working hours flexibility, having to put in twice (or more) the time for the same amount of $$ as a lucrative weekend at the club.
Gawker - that is sad. Her addiction struggle reminds me of my sister's. She's been on heroin for about 7 1/2 years. Before her last rehab gig, she admitted she had never been clean for more than 4 days since she first used. It was like a slap in the face because she was bragging about it and me and my family were looking stupid because we had gone to her NA key tag ceremonies to support her when she got her 30 days clean, etc and it was all a lie. She's also stolen from me and other members of my family and I have also been an enabler unfortunately over the years (didn't want to see her get sick so I'd give her money). Also paid hundreds of dollars a month for a halfway house to keep her out of jail where she snuck out and got high every night.
She's now in a relationship with a man in his 60s who she met while she was working at the club. He was a customer. She has been fired from at least 4 or so clubs in Detroit, and obviously it's hard to get fired from a Detroit strip club! She has stopped dancing and is now shacked up with the man in his 60s so she just takes his money (or sometimes steals it then brags to me about that too although she claims to love him), so now she doesn't work anywhere anymore.
It is crazy because my mom lives in Detroit and I don't, but my sister used to live at my mom's until my mom would kick her out and she'd stay at a seedy motel or even under a bridge, then come back to my mom's neighborhood to get her drugs and alcohol. So around June of last year I came to my mom's to watch the NBA finals game with them... Some random people down the street thought I was her and I didn't even know who the fuck they are but they knew my sister... one lady was even waiving her little gun around, and they called the cops on me. They felt stupid the next day (I wasn't there) when their alcoholic asses we're at the liquor store at 10am when it opened and so was my sister... they realized I was telling the truth about having a twin, but none of them ever apologized to me.
I have an unromantic personality. I was in school, had anxiety for the future, which involves as I saw being stuck in an office playing office politics with petty people. And so I chose less clothed self-employment.
I found out that there’s no getting around the politicking if you wanna be a top earner at a top club, but there’s enough to be made even just staying under the radar.
I thought at the time I was motivated by money. But really I think it was just freedom.
As for self esteem I think it’s slightly higher than it used to be. But there’s been more changes in my life other than just dancing for me to be sure.
In a competitive capitalistic society such as ours, many people are judged by what they can bring to the table, not just strippers - athletes are one example where often from one day to the next all of a sudden no one wants you - and in other competitive fields often times older workers can fall by the wayside.
Not trying to say stripping doesn't have its particular challenges; just that it's not necessarily all-roses in the non-stripping world and their are pros-and-cons to stripping/not-stripping.
PaulDrake - politicking in large clubs is like, having to involve yourself in the club's business with managers and bouncers to find out who the whales are who will get champagne rooms, or else the bouncers / VIP hosts will send other girls to their booths and those other girls will tell the champagne rooms. It also involves heavily tipping the VIP hosts after you've done a champagne room and the more you tip them, the higher chances they will point out big spenders to you or bring you over to the table and introduce you to the big spenders, etc. Top clubs are like that. There are always girls they favor and introduce to the well-known whales.
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I find myself every night when I reach the bottom of a bottle of tequila!
In many cases, dancers need another job, however many others just have more leisure time.
If that time I'd spent on positive avocations then I'd take that to be a reflection of someone who's got their shit together. However if extra time is used on self destructive behavior or negative activities, that's a reflection of a woman who doesn't think very highly of herself.
So I guess I agree with you.
My suspicion is that most people in the entertainment industry have an excessive need for other’s approval. That seldom ends well.
Almost five years later she has bought a house, a car and started a savings account for her daughter's college. There are times that the chore of dealing with the assholes all guys can be gets her down and she questions her decision. I remind her that she has made difficult choices at a young age but she does the dancing by her rules, is wise with her money and has provided a home and a future for her daughter.
I know it can be a rare story but she has started preparing an exit strategy with a five year plan. I hope it has a happy ending!
In the case of a lot of strippers, they are valued for their looks, as PD said, and that can be harmful if that’s the only message they internalize. Ultimately, it’s up to each person to rise above their difficulties or succumb to them. But I would think stripping would be full of potential pitfalls, especially given the young age of most strippers.
I've said this before, dancing helped me find my self-worth. I know "who I am" and am more confident in myself than I was before I started dancing. Before I started dancing I was broke, owed my University several thousand dollars so I couldn't go back until paid them, and before I owed them the money and was enrolled I'd sit in the back of the class and never participate just like I did in high school; I was extremely passive in all facets of life. Couldn't make business calls or do much that required communication with strangers, was never assertive.
I started dancing years ago I think sometime in July. I was able to get a new apartment, no roommate this time, within like 2 weeks. In that same time span I was also able to pay cash and go to the local community college for a semester while I saved to pay off the rest of what I owed my University, which I did within 6 months or so from when I started dancing, so I was able to go back the following semester. I sat in the front row, participated in all my classes, made friends, etc. I wasn't too shy to talk to the professor after class about something, my grades improved, and so did my life. It was pretty freeing, actually. I could go out and shop or go eat a nice meal whenever I wanted. Even go on random vacations when I had time off from school. I ended up moving again, to a nice 2 bedroom apartment in an affluent and safe suburb, again by myself. No roommates.
Of course this job takes a physical toll on a person mentally and physically. I remember when I was still relatively new to dancing and was doing a lot of pole tricks back when Landing Strip's poles where thick like pillars, I'd wake up in the middle of the night sometimes with a shooting pain in my arm and would have to take an ibuprofen and a Flexeril (a non-narcotic skeletal muscle relaxer) just to get back to sleep. Sometimes after a shift my feet are killing me. Used to have my (now ex) boyfriend rub them just so I could fall asleep. But the pain is worth it. There are plenty of manual labor jobs that are rough on the body (they should try it in heels though). You muscle through it.
The mental part can be worse for some women and better for others. For me, there is good and bad. I've explained how much dancing has caused me to come out of my shell, which is good. It's also very emotionally taxing, but again, so are many jobs.
You and I seem very different as strippers. I don't know why you started dancing, but you've expressed before that one of your favorite parts is getting attention. I started dancing for two reasons only: 1) MONEY 2) the ability to have a flexible schedule so I can more or less make money whenever the hell I want. As far as attention goes, I have to deal with guys who are NOT paying me giving me attention every time I visit my mom or family/friends in Detroit. Can't walk down the street without some guy yelling "aye, LightSkin!" when I'm in Detroit. It's annoying. Attention is annoying, I only like it at work in a consequential sense; getting money = attention. I could have 500 guys ignore me all night and not give a shit as long as I have 1 guy spending a lot of money on me. Of course 500 guys would not ignore me, but I'm speaking hypothetically. Getting attention at work is actually annoying to me unless the guys giving me attention are also giving me money.
Dancing has taught me a lot about men and about how marriages fall apart through time, so I even credit dancing for me being wise beyond my years about that and will be smart when choosing someone to settle down with --- but that's a whole different topic.
The main negative for me is that I drink more than I did before I started dancing. I would have a drink a little here and there, and had my fair share of getting wasted and partying as a youngin' so by the time I started dancing (19 or 20), I was past the "let's party and get fucked up" stage of my life (I graduated high school and started at my University all when I was 17, my sister and I got a house together and it became a party house). But at work, you're offered drinks all night. So I would say that I drink more than I originally did, but that is something that can be maintained.
I've dealth with depression before I started dancing and after, so it's not like dancing ever caused that.
My clothing and makeup style has changed as one's should while they're growing up, especially being in my 20s now vs when I was new to being an adult. I have my own sense of identity, which relates to how I dress. I also have more money and am therefore able to spend more and have a wider range of attire that I can afford.
So really, dancing has helped more than it has hurt. It's given me more confidence than it has taken away.
She's fortunate in that all the drug use has not negatively impacted her appearance, but the drugs and her being used by men has severely damaged her ability to function; to move forward; to get beyond the status quo. All of her friends are drug involved. All of the men in her life are either addicts or "customers".
She, through the nine years I've known her has had periods of sobriety (10 months on methadone once) and she surprisingly has some hesitation about dancing ( getting naked on stage). When she's been totally sober ( no methadone & no suboxone) she's been unable to work as a dancer. Dancing to her always includes blow jobs and occasional sexual with strangers.
I don't know if she'll ever find herself. She recently said to me that sometimes she doesn't care if she lives or dies.
I really like her and care about her and yet realize my role in enabling her drug use. I bought her a two year old car, provided free room & board for 6 months, and helped her save a couple of grand.
She & her BF ( who has a saleable skill) are leaving tomorrow, driving 1500 miles and starting a new life.
Her story is sadly not infrequent among the dancers I know.
I have respect for sex workers across the full spectrum of its many forms. Before stepping into a strip club for the first time just a few years ago, I had a generally negative/uninformed view of the industry. I see things quite differently now that I’ve developed friendships with several dancers.
Whenever a dancer reaches "that point", the transition into a field outside the sex industry will likely be as tough as dealing with the day to day (or night to night) stresses of the stripping gig. In several cases, losing the working hours flexibility, having to put in twice (or more) the time for the same amount of $$ as a lucrative weekend at the club.
She's now in a relationship with a man in his 60s who she met while she was working at the club. He was a customer. She has been fired from at least 4 or so clubs in Detroit, and obviously it's hard to get fired from a Detroit strip club! She has stopped dancing and is now shacked up with the man in his 60s so she just takes his money (or sometimes steals it then brags to me about that too although she claims to love him), so now she doesn't work anywhere anymore.
It is crazy because my mom lives in Detroit and I don't, but my sister used to live at my mom's until my mom would kick her out and she'd stay at a seedy motel or even under a bridge, then come back to my mom's neighborhood to get her drugs and alcohol. So around June of last year I came to my mom's to watch the NBA finals game with them... Some random people down the street thought I was her and I didn't even know who the fuck they are but they knew my sister... one lady was even waiving her little gun around, and they called the cops on me. They felt stupid the next day (I wasn't there) when their alcoholic asses we're at the liquor store at 10am when it opened and so was my sister... they realized I was telling the truth about having a twin, but none of them ever apologized to me.
I have an unromantic personality. I was in school, had anxiety for the future, which involves as I saw being stuck in an office playing office politics with petty people. And so I chose less clothed self-employment.
I found out that there’s no getting around the politicking if you wanna be a top earner at a top club, but there’s enough to be made even just staying under the radar.
I thought at the time I was motivated by money. But really I think it was just freedom.
As for self esteem I think it’s slightly higher than it used to be. But there’s been more changes in my life other than just dancing for me to be sure.
Not trying to say stripping doesn't have its particular challenges; just that it's not necessarily all-roses in the non-stripping world and their are pros-and-cons to stripping/not-stripping.
Here’s an example of people explaining this phenomena: https://www.stripperweb.com/forum/showth…