This might be a first.

I hope that I haven't violated any rules.

There are no rules. You're fine.

There is some ambiguity as there are differing views as to what is spam. And I think more importantly, there are differing views as to what sort of posts are so offensive that they should be discouraged.

For myself I see the issue as being negative and personal meta. That is, party A posts something, and then other people, instead of responding, they post a meta narrative. They don't respond in any way to what party A posted, instead they try to start a meta narrative, a conversation about the conversation, and it will be one loaded with personal attacks.

Humor might be an exception, but one has to know a party's limits, and with online it is easier to have misunderstandings.

The only people I have ever put on ignore are entities which only post these negative meta narratives. They are not just people who have a differing view on something, they are entities which only want to post personal attacks, and they do it by starting these conversations about the conversation and about the various parties.

When I have encountered these parties I have spent a great deal of time giving detailed explanations, but they still refuse to listen or engage with it.

They are pushing a kind of conversation which no one would tolerate f2f, and that is very disrespectful of this board. Such types have driven many valuable posters away, and they always seem to try and drive the women away.

But some people see spam differently, they see it as anything which does not stay within very narrow topical bounds, or which is not the most literal kind of response to a post. My own view is that this kind of thinking is wrong. And most of the people who seem to promote it, seem themselves incapable of dealing with anything outside of their own thinking.

Some of the best posts are those which offer subtle but critical reads on a thread. I find that @pphw often posts some of the most insightful stuff, but it is never a direct literal. I find his posts most valuable.

Now slander, for that to be it has to be stuff someone could possibly believe is real. So I have put on ignore some types who take the Iago character, always saying things to bait people, things which someone could believe to be real. I have grown tired of explaining to them, so the only step to take is just ignore.

But not all trolls or sock puppets are like this. I know who @Mamasan is, but I find that entities posts humorous. And they are so because no one would mistakenly believe that they are real.

The posts I object to are those which try to suppress reasoned discussion, and they do this by trying to drive people off of this board, as well as by spreading slander.

Otherwise I find posts, even if Off Topic, which encourage reasoned discussion, to be good.

Also, much of the real venom seen does seem linked to people who cannot accept those who do not align with their own political views, and especially when those views are of the Right Wing Hate type.

So Founder, thank you for starting this thread. What do you think? What do others think?

SJG

Spam is posting the same stupid shit OVER and OVER

You should start banning (temporarily) the spammers. Just give them a week off and if they persist, 2 weeks, 3 weeks, and so on. Having a set of rules to follow can help people see what is and what isn't permitted on these boards.

Personally, I really hate the flaming, the legitimate threads that become flame wars, people calling others pedophiles, etc.

Also, we do have a lot of new posters. Some of the older posters seem to have left. These new people are not going to be aware of previous discussions where differences ended up getting worked out.

Most of the time people do just defacto agree to disagree. So they don't anymore post personal attacks.

There are only a few who seem to have nothing better to do than post personal attacks, and ones which sound like they could be real. These discourage civil discussion. They make people afraid to post much of anything.

SJG

There are no effective ways to ban people. Accounts and emails are free.

I asked nicely to stop the spamming.

I don't like rules. This board has been free and open for far too long to start having rules now.

The spammers know who they are. They know they need to stop with their petty annoying bullshit.

I don't think I'm a guilty party, but if somehow I have posted too much, sorry.
Founder is cool and does a commendable job running the site. He also was cool to me when I unknowingly posted 2 reviews of same club in a month and I asked my I didn't get the month's access, so based on that, more than happy to acquiesce to his requests.

"Spam is posting the same stupid shit OVER and OVER"

There are still going to be differences in POV about what that includes, especially what constitutes stupid shit.

As I see it, personal attacks as negative meta narratives are the worst.

When there is moderation and rules, then that can make the environment more negative as people fight to defend the legitimacy of their posts. There have been previous threads about what is spam, and people's views were extremely divergent. Some people think there is one right way of thinking and communicating, and anyone who differs from that is wrong.

Recently I have seen more of what I would call naive posts, coming from new people who don't know all that has been posted before. I try to engage with them politely. I think these posts, showing more openness, are good. But those who post this way have often become targets for some of the most negative meta. I think here of @LarryFisherman. No legitimate reason to be targeting him for anything negative. But many did. They post Iago type stuff and others believe it.

There are some here who do nothing but try to bait other people. Recently some have gone to posting stuff which really could cause trouble. I think it should not be this negative.

But trying to enforce that without making it even worse could be difficult. And it would always be time consumptive.

When it gets really personal and is no longer about any topic, just about trying to drive a person off, that is what I see as the worst.

SJG

Spam is also posting a completely irrelevant comment on a thread just to get a rise out of folks you SJG do this all of the time.

^ I consider that trolling, not necessarily spamming.

I do consider anything SJG writes as SPAM however.

Deleting threads or posts would be a lighter remedy than suspending anyone. And it would constitute a kind of a warning.

Some stuff people just disagree about, like politics and BitCoin.

But accusing people of imaginary crimes, and of a most sensitive nature, that I really object to.

I also object to the homophobia, a kind of hate speech.

Some posts attack people's privacy, trying to postulate this and that, implying that if they don't deny and disclose, then the provocation posts must be true. No one would accept this f2f, and so I see it as a disrespect of this board.

I think the best is that which encourages reasoned discussion, and even if some don't agree.

This country has been made more negative by the rise of Right Wing Hate media, and its political office holders.

I do think it would be better if people were more reserved in starting new threads. To many new threads makes it hard to find things. And they are just doing it for that shock value of having the title listed.

If people want to talk about things, better to just continue existing threads. So I do think continuing access and ability to make more posts is important.

I have noticed that most of the worst trolls really do go silent once they see that they really are ignored.

The openness of this forum is one of its greatest features in my opinion. On boards which have moderators, the real trolls are usually these moderators.

SJG

SPAM is also a delicious canned meat product.

OMG SJG, shut up.

25, yesterday I posted something on your thread, just because my thread looked to have been terminated. I had to post it or lose it. No harm intended.

Flagooner wrote, "I do consider anything SJG writes as SPAM however."

Do you really mean that or did you mistype?

There is no ambiguity. The spammers know who they are. They have been called out repeatedly. They just lamely try to justify it by claiming it’s for a good cause. In others words the ends justify the means, no matter how inconsiderate it is to the vast majority of the members here who don’t really care about their stupid crusade.

25 also wrote,

"Spam is also posting a completely irrelevant comment on a thread just to get a rise out of folks you SJG do this all of the time."

I don't see it that way. I think you are defining relevance too narrowly.

And this was why I mentioned @pphw, someone who always posts extremely insightful things, usually things which contain a great deal of insightful criticism. But no, they are not just a literal response to the OP.

But many have complained about the negativity of this board. I see that as unneeded.

SJG

Well @SJG here’s the point of convo it’s fine to disagree with anything you like but I spammed your post to retaliate for your spamming mine if there is a thread about apples you have a tendency much of the time to try to change the convo you start talking about bullshit like who is running for governor of Arkansas on that thread about apples you know that you do this and like flagooner just said how about shutting the fuck up and listening you actually might learn something worthwhile.

I'm not protecting anyone. I just want this board to be usable. If you honestly feel that someone is a pedophile then call the police and really do something about it. Running someone off a web site is a lot different than well deserved prison time.

I vote to put SJG in prison. The crime, never shutting up.

Love you founder

@SJG
"There is some ambiguity as there are differing views as to what is spam. And I think more importantly, there are differing views as to what sort of posts are so offensive that they should be discouraged."
"There are still going to be differences in POV about what that includes, especially what constitutes stupid shit."

Maybe take a hint? If you have to ask, "is this spam?" then the answer is probably "yes."

Here's a metric for you to use (I think you'll be able to understand): If a subset, [x], of all your posts, [X], are similar in writing style, subject matter, etc., and less than half of [x] prompt a discussion with other users regarding the subject matter of [x], then [x] is most likely spam.

Said another way:

"If this guy calls you an asshole, tell him to fuck off. If this other guy calls you an asshole, tell him to fuck off. If this third guy calls you an asshole--take a look in the mirror."

@founder you said exactly what I’ve been saying aren’t you afraid they’re gonna turn on you ;). Actually who cares they are too lazy to get involved with anything more strenuous than gazing at they’re navels. Call the police that might be more human interaction than these idiots can deal with.

I'm with txtittyfag. If I am not going to be allowed to call out the fact that there is a self-admitted pedophile on this board, then I do not wish to participate. Either delete my account or let me know and I will leave on my own.

Dougster and txtity.. you've called him out. Now call the police. All you're doing at this point is ruining what was once a good time for stripclub fans.

The spammers are attention whores. Put them on ignore, or simply stop responding to them, and they will lose interest. Child psychology 101.

It took me a while to figure this out but, once I did, my time on this forum became pleasant again.

you're all such lying hypocrites. founder has already stated LE has asked for his database records. so you faggots have succeeded in attracting the attention of LE to everyone on this board, not just VM. at this point if there is anything to be done the proper authorities have already been alerted. so there is absolutely and literally no justification for you to continue to spam this forum.

Is it really true that Vincemichaels is a pedophile? Is there any evidence?

I know he lied about being a war hero, but pedophilia is completely heinous.

SJG does not spam the board, he just posts his opinion but doesn't start daily threads calling TUSCLers names and starting flame wars with other members on purpose and *constantly* - no fucking reason for any member to hijack the board for his own persona entertainment/agenda - I don't go on other social boards but I assume what some do on here would not be tolerated on other boards

@Papi don't be a patronizing little bitch now ;)

as i said before, these are personal vendettas and agendas, and have absolutely nothing to do with justice. when the board admin and founder creates not one but two separate threads, and even states that LE has already taken an interest, and these faggots still try to pretend they don't understand what founder wants, and still try to argue their right to hijack a board, you have to come to the conclusion either there is some real serious mental illness involved, or there is a whole another agenda at work other than the stated one

^ homophobic much?

@25:

That damn flagooner is a bad influence on me

@Papi I know he's the troll daddy that started all this ;)
Lets call @flagooner out for trolling ; )))

@Founder: I thought the police were already called?

And if not. Not good enough. New users will in over time and they might not be aware of what he is. Unless we remind them.

Let me put it this way:

TUSCL now needs to choose. If @vincemichaels is not gone from the board by Monday, I will be.

Founder - you are more than reasonable. Your request is something that each member should honor. I hope this goes as intended. The discussions shouldn’t be about personal vendettas.

Band flagooner

Ban me? Ban you! Ban all of you!!!

^^^Rong lets steal all of the vowels off his keypad

I just like to share my experiences, tell stories and if I can help someone who suffers from depression like I do then my goal has been completed. I'm not trying to hurt anyone or bash anyone. I try not to feed trolls and will always defend the girls of the club as well as my Home Club. I appreciate this site very much. I love giving different looks with a positive feel to it like in my articles.

Hey founder, does Cashman have a gag reflex?

^^^Fucking funniest comment of this thread.I cant stop laughing you fuck.

God, we have a self-admitted pedophile on this board and people's biggest concern is spam. What the fuck is wrong with these people? Unbelievable.

^^^ you two silly fucks

https://i.pinimg.com/474x/bf/f2/9c/bff29…

Haha, like I would ever leave TUSCL...

Trolling this board is basically my whole fucking pathetic life

Flagooner - I do have a gag reflex - and founder hasn’t found it. Thanks for asking!

Does he have a small dick?

@Founder = very concerned about the spamming occurring on the board
@Founder = doesn't care about the fact that there is a self-admitted pedophile on the board

There's a difference between spamming and trolling. Both simply need to be ignored. As Mark94 said, it's basic child psychology.

All these attacks on VM coming from the same pathetic douchbag or two are spam. When you have to scroll past obnoxious, dead-end post after obnoxious, dead-end post, that person is spamming the board. It is a demonstration of their own pointless little life and complete disregard for others that they have and use their time to send up a million posts that no one even wants to see. VM should really put them on ignore.

SJG is a troll. I have him on ignore because he write screen-filling manifestos that often have little or nothing to do with the thread he is writing on. I am still not convinced he isn't crazy like a fox. RandomLoser and 25IQ are further examples of trolls. They are so threatened by people with different political opinions that they have to attack everything they say, regardless of whether the post is political or not. Like SJG's rants, these attacks add nothing to the conversation and are just a waste of time for those who want to enjoy the thread, read others' thoughts, and post their own. Like spammers, it is a demonstration of their own ignorance and shows their lack of consideration for other users.

The only effective way to deal with them is to put them on ignore. Like poorly raised children, they seek attention. If no one reads or responds to their posts (VinceMichaels) then they will give up, go away, and spam another board. One or two might even get the idea to stop spamming and trolling and become productive contributors.

Ah, so when @gaymanu95 attacks others for their political point of views, that is fine. Just the way things should be because he is a right wing whacko. When those with more left leaning views attack others it is "trolling".

Makes alot of sense! You sure are a smart guy, @gaymanu!

@founder, no disrespect meant, but this is your own fault. Asking trolls and spammers to just politely stop but not force the issue is not going to work on the worst offenders. As you can see, the worst offenders have made it clear by trolling this thread that they don't give a fuck that you are asking them to do anything. With no control over kicking members off and with no moderation or hard rules to follow, you will continue to get trolls and spammers on the boards.

Even SJG, one of the worst spammers on the boards is blathering about and acting like he isn't the problem and that it is others, yet he spams the boards on a regular and daily basis with either the same content over and over or OT posts ad nauseum.

Whether it is just blatant disrespect for you or just their own ignorance, you simply asking won't change much of anything on these boards.

I would suggest that, if you don't moderate or ban folks, you find a way to make the spammers and trolls permanently and automatically ignored by everyone. They are posting but nobody sees their posts anyway.

College educated too, IIRC.

Well said, gammanu, well said.

Spammers gonna spam

Trucidos—a sincere thanks. Now if only the others would get the message. If not, hopefully at least one will be true to his word and voluntarily leave the board by Monday. That will cut the problem down by half. Unfortunately I don’t think it was anymore a real “threat” than a spoiled child threatening to hold his breath till he gets what he wants.

Um sorry SJG but despite your long posts you have no clue what slander is. First of all not one thing ever written on this board and by that I mean nothing ever, is slander. When people incorrectly use slander they really mean the Tort of defamation. Slander is defaming someone orally and libel is defaming someone in writing. That's all, so everything here being written isn't slander. Can we stop with references to LE checking out this board please. It just makes you sound childish and ignorant and LE is smart enough to know that everything posted here is useless for their purposes. Here is a plea to VINCEMICHAELS - Please, please, please, please stay past Monday. That way when the biggest problem makes up another impotent fake name so he can come back, we can laugh at him. Even though SJG is an annoying know it all and a bigot he is neither a troll, nor a spammer, just a progressive fraud.

Better question is how does anything here become slander or libel when all that we have here is an anonymous group of screen names , unless you have a personal relationship with another member how is it possible to libel them here on this venue, and as Skibum points out correctly slander is speech
Most of this is stupid if like gramma nut and anal Ivan’s blathering politics or SJGs dementia Dougsters and txttys supposed concern for the welfare of children and dumbassery is just an excuse to troll and behave like jerks, and neither one even knows what stolen valor actually is. My understanding that the laws require a profit motive for the stolen valor statutes, where’s the profit in making up stories on an entirely made up board of screen names.

@Dougster said:

"@Founder = very concerned about the spamming occurring on the board
@Founder = doesn't care about the fact that there is a self-admitted pedophile on the board"

I was away from this board for almost a week and I just came back, and I absolutely cannot believe that you guys are still talking about this stuff! (Frankly, I also can't believe that LE hasn't shut TUSCL down by now LOL.)

Listen, Founder SHOULD be more concerned about spam than about a pedophile lurking here. This isn't a forum about Disney movies! There are no kids here! And Founder's goal is to run a website where guys can discuss strip clubs and other man-related stuff, not to police the web and rout out every criminal. Besides, what's the point of harassing someone on TUSCL? To make his life so miserable that he... what? Decides to leave and never talk about strip clubs again? Seriously, is that the point? Maybe you would prefer that he finds a different place on the web to discuss underage girls instead of staying here and (mostly) discussing grown women. Would that be a good outcome?

If you're really so concerned, I think you should call the police. Your goal should be to get pedophiles off the streets and into custody where they can't harm children anymore. Not to simply harm and shame them. What would be the point of that? Making their lives miserable won't make pedophiles stop being pedophiles.

^^^They don’t give a damn about the welfare of children, animals,or anything else it’s just an excuse for tomfoolery don’t you get it they just had the mistaken notion that they are the smartest guy in the room and didn’t realize that there are a lot of smart guys here as a result they got their asses whipped.

Interesting. We've had random months over the years where the boards were so clogged with troll posts that heavy use of ignore was the only way that non-troll topics were remotely readable. In fact, one troll name has literally thousands of troll posts dedicated solely to me and a few other screen names easily had hundreds each before they dropped off.

None of those extended historical troll bombings seemed to faze the powers that be. But suddenly we are drawing the line at a relatively light sprinkling of troll posts, easily ignored, identifying the resident pedophile. Alrighty then. ;)

Look, I don't pay the bills around here and obviously the guy who does can run the site as he sees fit. But the seeming inconsistency here does call into question whether there is an ulterior motive at work.

^^^Another one of the smartest guys here LOL

@twentyfive,

I don't know that anyone necessarily got their asses whipped. They didn't convince anyone and no one convinced them of anything. It was kind of an annoying stalemate until Founder arrived as a deus ex machina to ask them to please stop being so annoying. That's the thing about the internet. All this discussion back and forth and yet no one ever seems to convince anyone of anything else, ever. Why people keep coming back to argue is almost beyond me. But we do.

"None of those extended historical troll bombings seemed to faze the powers that be. "
__________
It's just that making fun of you was in everyone's interest, @Dugan. It was fun entertainment at your expense. Don't take it personally; it's just that @Founder doesn't like you.

Yes BHF but they look foolish and they were humiliated if you’re objective you’d agree. Jes sayin

Randumb, fair enough. Maybe I'm not the most likable personality on here and I can live with that. But if a pedophile like vincemichaels and snarky ankle-biting pedo-sympathizing half-men like twentyfive are the preferred membership profile, then somehow I can live with rubbing against the grain a bit. ;)

But that nonetheless shows an interesting bias relating to when troll posts are and are not ok. again, his site and his dime, but still...

Do what you gotta do founder. My read is there are just a few self righteous OCD posters at work here. I like this board when its fun but some posters take themselves and others way too seriously. Effectively they are attempting to hijack a board you created by strapping a verbal bomb vest on and blowing it up to influence you and everyone that uses it.

If this becomes too much of a PIA for you then I say shut it down. The review section is where the main value of the board lies. This sideshow board while fun shouldnt be a burden to you.

The irony is I actually like some of the spammers more lucid moments and reading their comments about interesting or fun topics. But they are turning into little Captain Ahabs and want to take everyone done with em in mindless pursuit of their mission.

Late to the party, but...

As Cashman said, "Founder - you are more than reasonable." Can't agree more. However I can't comment on much of this as I have so many ignored and all those mentioned above, My thoughts, founder, it's your board and your prerogative to do whatever you wish. I can state as one that's been here for over 17 years, the board has really changed and for the worse. I hope the offending parties clean up their act or get the hell out of here!

Now a question for founder, if all the bad leave, what happens if I really do need to pack up and move?

"TUSCL now needs to choose. If @vincemichaels is not gone from the board by Monday, I will be."

I think we all know Dugly won't actually leave but still nice to dream.

@ Dougster and tittyfag. You guys won, and exposed vm. Everyone knows he is a lying mentally disabled person w zero self awareness, at best. And possibly worse. You took your victory laps, and the majority of members who posted for the following few days acknowledged that you’d exposed him and condemned what he’d said. A few ppl defended him in some way (he might have reached out and begged them to), and some ppl just can’t ever admit to being wrong in any sense, or always have to play devil’s advocate.

It’s time to have some confidence and accept your win. You can’t drop the mic and then run over and keep picking it up.

@ flagooner. Ahahahahaha!! You are my favorite ❤️

Bj99 "It’s time to have some confidence and accept your win. You can’t drop the mic and then run over and keep picking it up. "

the best line of the discussion and most relevant to all the whiners.

ty

OOOOH, a mentally disabled person is not what I am HJ99. I don't ever recall seeing you at our MENSA meetings. Do you even know what MENSA is, stupid one ??? LOL As to your other pathetically wrong statements, I won't waste my time, destroying your stupid assertions. You are the mentally disabled one. Too bad, baby girl. Go home to txtitty'dumbass's shit bed and smell his roses. LMAO

Well I'm glad there are a few folks who can see clearly on this very simple issue: @rickdugan and @Bj99 for instance. Let me see if I can put it simply enough

having a self-admitted pedophile on the board = huge problem

defending a self-admitted pedophile because he is your friend and acted nice for an hour or two in real life = show your naivety and is a huge problem

spamming an internet message board about strippers = a trifling

Wrong again, Douchester. To your feeble mind anything is horrible to contemplate. I'm waiting as we all are to see your disappearance on Monday. Yeah right, at most you'll disappear and replace yourself.

Bj99’s comment is well said. It’s time to let this one go. They exposed VM - and it’s done.

You don’t need to wait until Monday to see if people leave. Hit the ignore button. Instant gratification. Si se puede! You have the power. It’s like magic.

Geez, nothing like beating dead horses. This horse is strong, these pathetic on and ons and ons, are hilarious. I'd like to see the skeletons in your closets, all of you who bleat how terrible things are.

I like how Dugly acts like he hasn't been spamming the board with multiple accounts and attacking others over bullshit for years.

^^^^ Quite true, jester214.

I like how jester214 failed to mention with stock ticker RICK double from where I said it would last year. Right on schedule too. Before that he was always like "Hey, Dugly. Has RICK doubled yet?". For some reason he stopped asking that question.

*** JESTER214 LOSES AGAIN ***

@vincemichaels: " I'd like to see the skeletons in your closets, all of you who bleat how terrible things are."

Again trying to implying that having sex with a 14 y/o is no big deal. Everyone does it occasionally, right, @vinceygirl? Or they do even worse things. Like spam internet message boards about strippers.

Guys you better get to work on asking @Founder to ban @vincemichaels. Else you are going to having a disgusting pedophile here instead of me able to guide you through the cryptocurrency volatility we are going to experience this year.

Got about 72 hours to decide. Make the right call!

omg lol vm! Do you wear a cape and diaper in real life? And maybe jump up and down on your sofa (I’m sorry..I mean, “sail boat”) between posts? Bc that’s how I always picture you. ;P ugh. You are always good for a laugh!!

@Dougster,

Having a self-admitted pedophile on the board is not a huge problem. If he were a teacher at a school, now that would be a huge problem. If he were a pediatrician or a babysitter, that would be a huge problem. But why is it a huge problem for him to hang out and shoot the shit on some low-life message board? You're not making the case. As far as I can tell, he's just another retard. The internet is full of them.

I don't know if anyone has pointed this out to you yet, but there are real-life convicted pedophiles and registered sex offenders living in your very neighborhood right now... mere blocks from where your kids live! I've seen the websites myself. They live in my neighborhood, too. Isn't that a slightly bigger problem for you?

@txtittyfag,

I guess I am. Enlighten me.

Dugly when you leave on Monday will txtittyfag and all your other alternate accounts go to?

As far as I can see the door is unlocked feel free to leave or not, why wait 72 hours just don’t let the keyboard hit you in the ass on the way out.
As far as I can see you are boring and repetitive it was fun while it lasted.
In the eternal words of a very famous southern belle “why bless your heart” “you all come back soon yeah”

Well I'm sure @25 well be glad to see me leave because one less person to call him out for defending and being friends with a pedophile.

@jester214: Hey, remember when you said you short any stock I said would double, and I told you to short SVXY and you chickened out. Said you were only joking. Did your conversation with your broker go something like this afterward

jester214: "Yeah, I want to buy as much SVXY as I can"
jestie's "guy": "Ok, but you do realize there is only $2,000 left in the account"
jester214: "How can there only be that much left?"
jestie's "guy": "Well you lost alot of money shorting treasuries. We had to close the before because you ran out of margin"
jester214: "Damn it! But I always thought all it took to be right about something was to disagree with Dugly. No that I've realized that is wrong I have almost no money left"

@BHF: You are making a very strange argument. Of course there is nothing that can be done about people we don't know are pedophile because, well, by definition, we don't know about them. I would say once we know someone is a pedophile we don't want them on the board, however.

For one thing we don't want them to have a means of meeting other pedophile. Sure they'll go somewhere else, but we don't want to contribute to them communicating with each other. I take @vincemichaels threads were slowly divulges more and more of his pedophilia as partly him wanting to be told it's okay by normal people (and by not banning him from the board we are telling him that) and him "fishing" for other pedophiles to talk to. As other have noted it's a problem in of itself.

IMO, these people who are worried about LE interest for selfish reasons (oh, I'm worried they'll come after me for getting a HJ at Bogart's!) are missing the point.

@25: I'll leave at the time of my choosing. If you want things differently, take it up with @Founder.

@txtittyfag,

This website isn't my neighborhood IRL. VM is just a bunch of stupid words and pixels on a screen. That's all he is to me. I don't have kids but if I did, I would probably be mildly concerned at the thought of all the sex offenders living nearby... and then I would get over it quickly because there is literally no place I could move where sex offenders don't live. They're everywhere. Worrying about them is like worrying about germs and car accidents. They're just a fact of life.

Honestly, I don't even believe in sex offender registries. Either these people are still dangerous or they aren't. If they are still a danger to kids... then keep them in jail! For life if necessary. I mean, what good will the registry do if they're still dangerous to children? And if they aren't dangerous anymore, then what's the point of putting them on the registry in the first place?

STOP SPAMMIG NOW GOD DAMITA !!!!

@Dougster,

Dude, I'm telling you, we DO know about them. Every state has a website with registered sex offenders and their addresses listed on it. They are out there. See for yourself.

I don’t care if you leave or not as far as I’m concerned I enjoy the normal posts that you make I have not advocated that you leave the board nor anyone else for that matter. If you virtually attack me I’ll retali in kind but with a more adult style I won’t act like a baby brat and sulk over anything you have to say.

@ dougster, you are playing into Burlington’s fetish by debating him. You know he’s sitting there stroking himself and waiting to work in Hillary, or Hitler, so he can really get off.

@BHF: we know about the ones on the sex offender registry. Or are you saying that every pedophile is on the sex offender registry? That seems plainly wrong. Even if true, @Founder often will not know the real life identities of people joining the board. You connect through TOR for instance and register with e-mail address you also got through TOR connections.

@Bj every response to dougsters troll posts is actually playing to his fetish the one thing I can guarantee you is if they got no responses they’d dry up and blow away. Yes I know I respond it amuses me.

@25: You can imagine you are arguing "2 + 2 = 5" with whatever maturity level you want. You're still wrong. Big thing people keep ignoring on here is the truth. They want things to be one way "He seemed nice for the hour or two I met him in real life. Don't want to think he is a pedophile. Oh, I know let's think up so excuses. He must have made that admission about the sailboat because someone was holding a gun to his head and told him to lie. Yeah, that's the ticket! Now I can feel okay about my judgement about him."

Oh fuck man we’ve heard your version ad nauseaum try something new for gods sake, grow up, your version is if he ain’t with us he’s against us, we’ve heard this so often that’s just your own desperation trying to remain relevant when you have become irrelevant.
Schoolboys say if he’s your friend than I’m not, who really gives a shit what some anonymous poster on the internet says. Anyone who cares has a few rocks in their head.

@Dougster,

No, I'm saying that pedophiles living blocks away from your kids IRL is more of a problem in the grand scheme of things than VM on a message board, where there are no children around, talking anonymously about strippers. I mean, are you also freaking out about the people on the registries? Or is this a reaction that you reserve only for VM?

@Bj99,

I don't even know what you're talking about anymore. I don't see where I'm more argumentative than everyone else here. In fact, I sometimes begin my posts with things like "I could be wrong," "I hope I'm wrong," etc. And I've admitted that I'm wrong many times. For example, I predicted that Dougster would never get LE's attention merely by posting on a message board. Obviously I was wrong about that. Anyway, if you don't want to talk to me anymore, feel free not to. It's a free country.

@BHF: sorry, not following. You're saying I should do what about people on sex offender registry beyond what's already done?

Don’t you mean “free country”? You know, the ‘might be a faggot’ thread is in full swing.

You know, I’m just teasing ;P

Now as for @25. He is basically reduced to this:

@25: "2 + 2 = 5"
@Dougster: "No. 2 + 2 = 4, you idiot"
@25: "Ha! I didn't call anyone an idiot when I said 2 + 2 = 5. That's much more mature. So 2 + 2 = 5. Or, at worst, it's a matter of opinion"
@Dougster: "Dude, you're head is full of shit. 2 + 2 = 4"
@25: "Oh, quit repeating the same old tired argument that 2 + 2 = 4. You are so predictable. Since nobody predicted I would say 2 + 2 = 5. That is much better"

^ exactly!

@Dougster,

OMG man, I don't even know anymore. That's what's so fucked up about this whole conversation. I'm not telling you to do or not do anything. I'm saying A) you seem to be outraged by VM and his presence on this board, B) you aren't particularly outraged by the presence of pedophiles and registered sex offenders living in your neighborhood, C) it seems more important to you to remove VM from TUSCL than to remove the pedos from your own actual physical neighborhood, D) how can that possibly make sense to you? I'm saying you've lost all sense of proportion. A real life sex offender in your neighborhood, as harmless as he may be, is surely a somewhat bigger menace than a random asshole on a message board. Do you want VM to be placed on a sex registry? Would that make you happy? He would be registered, but he would still be on TUSCL, he'd still be living wherever he is, and he would still be a pedophile. What would that accomplish? Nothing. What does endlessly talking about it accomplish? Nothing. What would forcing him off a message board accomplish? Nothing. LE is interested in the board now and I'm sure it is a nuisance to Founder, but I'm also sure that VM isn't going to jail. So what's the point?

@Bj99,

Whatever.

BHF: "What does endlessly talking about it accomplish"

Think I covered this before: It makes sure that new posters are aware of what he is. It also harms his ability to make friends at these TUSCL meetups, IRL. At least I hope it would. But with what @rickdugan called

"snarky ankle-biting pedo-sympathizing half-men like twentyfive"

I'm beginning to wonder if people are just like "Oh, yeah. We knows he's a pedophile. No biggie. At least he never spammed an internet message board. Because would be something really serious!"

Very funny dougster but still stupid.

Just like when he incessantly posted about vincemichaels war service or rickdugan's system and rickdugan being a fag or when he posted incessantly about txtittyfan shorting treasuries. He was protecting America!

He's a Yankee Doodle Dandy, if any of you care to look up it's original meaning it is an insult.

Dugly will you be leaving at 11:59PM on Sunday or Monday?

@Dougster,

A) If you think people here are getting numb to it and that people don't think it's a big deal that he's a pedophile anymore, then that's your own fault for posting about it non-stop.

And B), why do you want new posters to be aware of who he is? These are adults, not children. Anyone who chooses a babysitter from their contacts on TUSCL needs his head examined. Unless you're worried that he's going to molest one of the other board members.

And why do you want to damage his ability to make friends at meetups? Shouldn't you be more interested in preventing him from molesting kids? This whole thing reminds me of the guy who lost his keys in the couch cushions but goes to look for them under the streetlight outside because it's brighter out there.

And once again, have you checked out the list of registered sex offenders living nearby? And do you distribute leaflets about them to warn your neighbors?

@jester214: What is your preference?

txtittfyfag: "jestiegirl you have Douchester and myself mistaken with SHORT EYES STOLEN VALOR vinceymichaels, he's the one protecting America."

Protecting us all from the VietCong.


Difference this time jestie is I'm willing to put it all on the line this. I don't seem the same coming from you. I guess you are okay with the self-admitted pedophile @vincemichaels. Let me guess. One of your boyfriends?

So Dougie the impotent grandstands about leaving and on the same thread backs down like the anonymous pussy he is in real life. LE isn't interested in this board at all. Defamation requires no profit motive, but if you read the case law you will note it is almost impossible to prove damages and most verdicts are for one dollar. LE cannot shut this board down, no matter what is said here, because that is a clear First Amendment violation. I don't know VM, but the idea that he is somehow worse than Doug, who is simply valueless is amazing. Why we would need to be saved by a pimply faced teen in a basement is amazing. I appreciate 25's reference to the Revolutionary war and he is correct about the song. What is truly astounding is that Doug thinks his comments will prevent VM from making friends, as if not making friends here with people is some kind of punishment. Hey Dougie how many people you friends with in real life from here? Who the fuck would want to me you? No I am purposely excluding the multitudes who would like to slap him silly. Why not try being an adult Dougie? If people recall twenty five and I had a "beef" for awhile and have moved on. I may disagree with him, but he is real and has my respect. No its not based on the fact that if an inane buffoon like Dougie dislikes him he must be a - ok. I am a semi-recovered gambler in that I seldom gamble more than 250 days a year any longer, but one sure bet is that if there is a pedophile here ..... it would be someone identifiable by the classic line from Shakespeare: HE WHO DOTH PROTEST TOO LOUDLY. Who natters on and on about the subject in a self-righteous way?

@25: Um, you're the one who is stupid. Although when I think of just how stupid you would have to be to be defending @vincemichaels. I wonder if there is more of an agenda involved.

@BHF: Not interested if going after pedophiles who are already known to the public and have been found guilty and dealt with by the justice system. Now if you can tell me that all knew posters will be made aware of @vincemichaels, maybe we can have a warning link at the top of the page, then I'm happy to drop all of it.

@skibum609: Sorry? Where did I back down on leaving? You trippin' out on something?

@skibum609: Ok, I'll be adult. Just like the way you demonstrate in your posts. I'll have to lower my maturity level 3 or 4 notches to get there but if you insist.

Good to hear you and @25 are friends now. You seem perfect for each other!

LOL!

Sooner the better imo.

EST, we need to know for the countdown clock?

Okay, if you prefer Sunday, then Monday it is.

LOL!

@Dougster,

But what are you warning people about exactly? The point about being a pedophile means he's only a danger to *children*.

@BHF: I'm warning that they should be careful about being friends with him. Let me put it this way: would you knowingly make friends with a pedophile even if you knew he won't be attracted to you because you are too old? Even if you knew he had no knowledge of where your children are?

Oh, what a moron you are. Nobody will miss your dumb ass. Goodbye, chump.

This is by far the funniest thread I have ever read!

I can't for sure tell who is just play acting, and who really believes the things they are saying, especially with Dougster. I can't believe that he really believes what he is saying. I think he's just always going over the top.

@Founder,
I told you so. There are very divergent views about what is spam and about what sorts of posts should be discouraged. We have had threads specifically discussing spam before. It went no where. It was just like this.

I still see the issue as I explained. Going into meta-narrative, a conversation about the conversation, and going into personal attacks and trying to bait people is a real problem. Most of all, it tends to discourage civil conversation from other people.

And I have seen this before, someone posts fallacious things just to bait someone, and other people are taken in by it. They believe there must be some basis to it.

People on a board like this are coming from different backgrounds and they have different communications styles. It is wrong to just look for people to pick on, and Dougster is the worst in this regard. That he does this irritates me. But I have to admit that I did miss his presence when he as absent for 6 months. In some areas he does make a significant contribution.

I used to have to do troll patrols after every single post, just to see if people had replied with negative meta. If that goes without response, then that just encourages other people. But as now I have enough of the worst offenders on ignore, and as people know that I will reply if they do that, the problem has all but vanished.

@TwentyFive,
I admit that I dumped a copy and paste onto your thread, just because one of my regular threads seemed to be locked down, a couple of days ago. But I would not have done it if it looked like that would have interdicted any ongoing conversation. No harm intended.

But otherwise, I think your idea of what is topically relevant is far too narrow. Its like you want this to be a locker room or tavern conversation. Not everyone wants that. Not everyone talks like that.

Also, people have asked about talking to other custies in strip clubs. I replied that I usually avoid that, and also that I prefer the no alcohol clubs. Less problems with customers, but also a higher grade of dancers.

@Futuretrackstar,
You seem to think that if two or three people see something a certain way, than that means that they must be right, and then that everyone else has to go along with them. You think everyone must become part of the herd.

I could not disagree more strongly. I don't live like that f2f, and I never have.

And that herd logic does seem to be the basis of the political Right, especially when it comes to those who statistically are most likely to vote that way, White Males.

@Everyone,
I have a great deal of online message board experience. I'm not claiming to have more experience than others, but my experience is still substantial. And its on different kinds of boards.

Online boards get people talking to each other who would not do so f2f. F2f, people have radar, they form impressions about people from their body language and from their manner of dress. So they are careful about how much they say to strangers. They try not to say things which would disclose too much about themselves or their views until they feel that they know the person well enough.

Online it is different. There other clues are concealed, and people post in reply to one person, often without worrying about who else might be reading it.

And so you get people who have entirely contradictory world views, and verbally interacting with each other.

Here on this forum there are many who cannot stand to see a well articulated counter view, and so they go into these personal attacks via a negative meta-narrative ( conversation about the conversation ).

Remember @coldnshallow? I suspect that she picked that name because an ex-SO called her that and it really hurt her. I think she just joined because she wanted to know more about how guys looked at strip clubs and what the appeal was.

Eventually she found out that it was mostly mongering and non-monogamy, and she did not go along with any of that.

But there was no reason for people to be trolling her and attacking her and going into these meta-narratives to try and destroy her., She had a right to her views, just like anyone else does.

And being female, you've got to expect that she will see most of these things very differently.

But no, she got run off. And then later she tried another handle, and she got run off again.

There was no reason for that.

SPAM = Posts that are just advertisements, not someone trying to be part of ongoing conversations.

Trolling = Posts that are only intended to hurt someone and to destroy their reputation by posting stuff about them where the evidence is dubious at best. Trolling seeks to cut off civil discourse, to prevent it by intimidating people.

Humor is not trolling, so long as it stays within reasonable bounds. But it is better to err on the more conservative side because it is hard to know how people are taking things.

@Founder, this new software makes it impossible to get links to individual posts, even by going to Posts on someone's profile. It would help if there were an easy way, like right on the post, to get a URL for that post. Most boards have this now.

Maybe you took the links from people's profiles and post lists to discourage a type of trolling, like shadowing someone?

SJG

Agree.. humor is not trolling. :)

^ OMG, I only read the first sentence, but I actually agree with the sleepy time rapist about something.

^ "Now if you can tell me that all knew posters will be made aware of @vincemichaels, maybe we can have a warning link at the top of the page, then I'm happy to drop all of it."

Maybe a new tagline in the rotation:

"Vincemichaels is a pedophile, but we can't get him to leave."

or something like that.

@Dougster,

No, probably not. But that's not the question I'm asking. If you acknowledge that all you're trying to do is prevent him from "making friends" with other people on a message board, then what's the point? Do you care more about self-righteously "punishing" someone for perceived wrongs like a vigilante or about protecting innocent children? Were you molested as a child? Were your kids molested? If so, I can understand the obsession. But regardless, this makes little sense to me. Nobody "chooses" to be a pedophile, any more than you and I "choose" to be attracted to adult women. They are what they are because of the way they are. They belong in jail to protect others, not as a form of punishment for the way they were born.

@vincemichaels: well there is what they say now and what things will be like when it really happens.

"Oh, shit! Bitcoin down 30% today. Should I buy more or is it going to implode complete. Hmmm.... I know, a TUSCL circle jerk will decide the matter... Oh, fuck! All I learned from that is it might go up, might go down, or might stay the same. And you can't time the market. But you should never pick stocks at random. And Bitcoin is worse than other asset classes. Even if inability to time the market should mean they are all the same.."

"well, maybe I find a drinking buddy so I can just ignore the problem that I can't make a decision here. That @vincemichaels is willing to meet me... God. I'm just going to lie and tell him I don't have any children though."

OMG @bj99

Did you actually read a SJG post?

If you were here I'd have to give you a serious tongue lashing.

BHF: "But regardless, this makes little sense to me. Nobody 'chooses' to be a pedophile, any more than you and I 'choose' to be attracted to adult women. They are what they are because of the way they are. They belong in jail to protect others, not as a form of punishment for the way they were born."

Wow is all I can say to that! I'll just let that comment of yours speak for itself.

BHF - I’ve not looked at things in that way before. I’m not sure if I agree, but it’s a very interesting point you raise. Regardless of why they shouldn’t be allowed to be in society might be a moot point - as they should never be allowed on the street.

Flagooner - it’s odd - as I agreed with one of SJG’s statements too. I didn’t read most of that last post - but the sentence or two I did read - seemed rational. Either he’s staying on his meds - or I’m falling off the deep end - lol!

I can always use a good tongue lashing! :)

@Cashman1234,

Yeah, I agree they belong in jail, possibly for life, especially if they assaulted a very young victim. People like that don't "rehabilitate," they just have a permanent sickness.

But I've always felt that the purpose of the criminal justice system should be to A) protect people from others and B) to extract restitution to repay victims and their families. But we don't have that kind of system. We are mostly concerned with punishment, rehabilitation, and paying fines to the government instead of to the victims.

@Bj99 I’ve heard the girls at the Inner Room refer to flagooner as old sandpaper tongue. ;)

For the first time in a long time, I scanned through comments without logging in. Otherwise, I wouldn't have to see the stupidity posted by losers like Dugly and 25IQ. I regret doing that. I didn't realize just how low and childish people on this board could be. I'm almost ashamed to even be associated with some posters.

You should all be ashamed of yourselves, accused pedophile or not!

Trolls feed off this conflict, why do you think they won't let it die? So VM may or may not have had carnal relations with a 14 year old girl. RIckDugan may or may not wear 3-piece suits into strip clubs to actually run the system. I might be 80 or 18. Unless you are sitting next to one our colleagues drinking a beer and sliding money into a garter why the fuck should you even care? This thread has gone totally off topic because people are feeding the trolls. The thread is that this board is suffering from the actions of a few, and the trolls should grow up and stop.

I respect Founder's patience and reluctance to Big Brother the board, but maybe it is time to start blocking e-mails, IP addresses, and dot-names.

Beware of HJ99's herpes.

Yep, Douchester should be banned.

Let's see gaymanu95 just called me "dugly" and jester214 called me Dugly. Both don't understand how banning IP address is impractical. Looks like we've undercovered another one of jester214's aliases. (txtittyfag(dot) is another one.)

LOL!

Lol 25, such a hater!

Vm.. just go away and play with your pool toys a few mins.

*band

I’m pretty sure I am philosophically opposed to SJG on every level, but I have to to compliment him on his last post, which I found well written and perceptive. Well, I have to admit everything he writes is well written even if I think most of it’s bat shit crazy.

“You should all be ashamed of yourselves” - gamma.

Really?

Hahahaha!! ;P

I wonder if gramma nut is a swallow or spit type?

@vincey and @25 lying in a bed...
@25's eating ass while @vincey's giving head.

Dougie is such a child reciting his mother goose rhymes for the guests, so his mommy lets him stay up a little later.

@25 is such a child molester defender. Now I think he is smart enough to know @vincemichaels actually is one. So why is he lying when he says he doesn't know? More sinister agenda?

Dougie grow up, your parents are tired of picking up your poop all over the place.

And your children are ashamed of you defending a self-admitted pedophile.

You'd be well advised to leave my children out of this you stupid motherless fucker.

“Dougster19 Minutes Ago
@vincey and @25 lying in a bed...
@25's eating ass while @vincey's giving head.”

Anyone who has spent time in the military knows the real verse is “two old ladies lying in bed, one rolls over to the other and says . . . “. Stolen Valor? Less than 72 hours to go.

Has it really come down to ‘your mama’?

Bj99 “your mama” is an intelligent argument - when compared to this crap!

@25: What are you going to do about it (internet) tough guy?

@Bj99: Well @25 is not exactly the most original poster on here. Boring and repetitive. Just repeats the same ol' idiocy over and over. Can't think up his own stuff, just repeats things others have. Only expresses opinions when he is sure others will agree with them. A real spineless defender of pedophiles he is.

@Dougster-Alpha Mike Foxtrot.

I have no doubt, realAlexDeLarge. Founder like a lot of us don't need the same 25 discussions clogging up the site.

doesn't

@vincemichaels is a self-admitted pedophile.

Only 60 more hours.

vm,

this realalex guy just joined and KNOWS all about TUSCL. Seems a Clockwork sort of droog!

I heard 25IQ burst into tears like a bitch when someone mentioned his kids. I bet his kids won't even talk to him. Who knows, they might have gotten lucky to fall far from the tree, and took up work at Mar el Lago for the Trump campaign just to spite the hateful little SJW daddy.

If I were going to spam the board like the other assholes do, I would be posting that reminder every. damn. day. But, I like TUSCL too much to ruin everybody else's good time like Dugly Douchester does, so 25IQ gets a lucky pass.

You need to watch yourself you yellow motherfucker I won’t burst into tears I’ve made you my bitch many times over if you want to continue you’d be well advised as well never run into me IRL I’ll show you exactly where you stand. Pussy.

Thank you sir I’ll let you pass by don’t really look for trouble, don’t run from it neither.

Don't fuck with @25 folks! He learned internet tough guy'ness from the vinceygirl michaels school.

The last dozen or so comments are probably proof that this board needs some moderation. When it gets to the point where people are making up aliases to insult each other's mothers, IQs, etc., and where a third of all posts are about vincemichaels and whether he is a pedophile and what exactly we all think of his pedophilia... well that's proof that shit has gone off the rails. We seem to have crossed that line several years ago.

Well the TUSCL droogIgnore works!

And Clubber knows the meaning of work, lifting the highball as we gaze at the dancers from our seats at the bar. :)