Extras, OTCs and Good Girls

"You guys are saying, that the girls who absolutely refuse to do "dirty" acts inside the club, are still good bets for getting them to do all the necessary services outside the club." I'm not saying that at all, I'm only saying that on rare occasions they may do so. Unlike a lot of the bad girls, who only care about money, the good girls usually have to really like you first.

What I'm saying is you can't and shouldn't make assumptions about who does what. What I do know is that all of these women have one thing in common; They want our money money. Some will do more than others to get it. Often times a dancer will want to build some trust before revealing everything thats on the menu. Other times they will pull your member out in the middle of the first song in the VIP room. The only consistency is inconsistency.

Interesting. You guys are saying, that the girls who absolutely refuse to do "dirty" acts inside the club, are still good bets for getting them to do all the necessary services outside the club. I think I see an angle here, for horn-swoggling some of my "too clean" favorite girls into something more enjoyable for me, and suddenly hope springs eternal!

>I think most of the "good" girls are like that - good most of the time but not all of the time.<

You are so right there, FONDL. So many dancers you think you know have some secret of when they broke all the rules. I've also been surprised to find that I didn't know how wild some sweet, innocent-looking thing actually was until pretty late in the game. I've pretty much given up assuming any of them to be good girls, and nothing surprises me anymore.

I've discovered myself to be on both sides of a mistaken impression. On the mild side, there was an 18-year-old cutie I enjoyed hanging out with at the club, although her dances were pretty tame. She had only been dancing a few weeks when she told me about going shopping with a 70-something dude who was notorious for trying (unsuccessfully) to buy his way inside the pants of the latest fresh meat. She asked if that bothered me, and I replied that it sounded sick but I kind of liked hearing it. She then told me she had worn a skirt with no panties and how per his request she had flashed a young shoe salesman. She assured me that he never touched her, but I knew it was pointless for me to try to know the truth.

On the wilder side, one night strippers were complaining that the upstairs ladies room was blocked off in the middle of a busy night. The reason turned out to be that the manager had taken a payment from a big slob vending salesman to keep it off limits while he fucked a dancer in there, who happened to be one of my faves. I knew she had a bit of a bad streak, but that one shocked me.

On the other hand, I've known strippers who were quite slutty with me from the start but kept up a good girl image with other customers who fawned over them. I might snicker over what fools they seem, but I know there are times I've been in their shoes.

Doug, I don't have any wild stories to email you about your previous ATF. I wish I did, of course. I don't recall her being any stickler for rules, nor badmouthing other girls as "dirty dancers". The dances I got from her right from the start were comparable to the best dances from other girls at the club. - good two-way contact, but no extras. Well, except for that time in the bathroom stall. (Just kidding.)

The real thrill is probably the same one girls feel for the abusive jerk biker type that they all seem to go for. "Yeah, he's a jerk, but NOT TO ME, I'm the one who tamed him. To me he's sensitive, and caring, and a real Gentle Ben, a Rotweiler all muzzled and nuzzling up for a cuddle." In fact, a lot of guys make mistakes early in their dating career by trying to be exactly that thing which the abusive dude is supposed to turn INTO, but by leaving out the aggressive / abusive part at the start. "What," asks the milquetoast drip, "I'm sensitive, I'm caring. Why does she want to date him?"

Well, I think we men have presented a similar conundrum to women. A guy wants a VERY clean nice girl who never does the nasty things ... except with HIM. The fall from grace, the change-over from "normal" to "special" behavior, THAT'S the real pay-off for the partner. Making him, or her, act in some manner that is totally out of keeping with his or her normal behavior. Makes ya feel all the more special. :)

Of course, this is a flawed system. It just means that girls go for jerky guys, and end up spending most of their time with aggressive men (and, in fact, learning the false lesson, that "all men are jerks") while seeking a sensitive one. And guys go for innocent girls, and end up spending most of our time with petite drips who are limp fish in the sack (and, in fact, learning the false lesson, that "all women dislike sex").

It's about double-reversals. At least for males, we have the advantage of being able to abandon the character-behavior issue, and rely on something much more solid and reality-based -- her looks. No matter HOW she acts, we can always relate to how good she looks. If she looks hot, and acts innocent, maybe we can turn her dirty; if she looks hot, and acts dirty, maybe we can turn her dirty. But if she looks anything other than hot, then we don't care WHAT she acts like. Thank goodness for THAT reality check!

I've found over the years that many girls who will see you OTC and perform all acts imaginable for the right price will not perform extras in the club. I've also met dancers who would not do OTC but who also worked for an escort agency. I've even found girls who will perform full service in the VIP room of a club but never do OTC. I guess we need to classify dancers a good girls or bad girls but I've met plenty of dynamite ladies who where one, the other or a little of both.

Yes. my only OTC experiences so far have involved a dancer who, within the confines of the club was a wholeome, small town girl, in fact a little on the prudish side. I certainly wouldn't say that she was a "whore" in the hotel room, but she WAS IN the hotel room, doing most things that customarily go on there, which obviously indicates a substantial degree of bad girl-dom.

It's my opinion any girl who does any OTC action doesn't do anything "bad-girlish" in the club. I think the most any of my OTC encounters ever did in the club was let me suck their nipple. And the ones who do stuff ITC all are "bad girls". In truth, I think it depends on what I want.

It's been my observation that dancers get known around the club as the "bad girl" for being indiscreet and too aggressive, more than for how far they'll go. There have been times while I was fingering the girl I was sitting with, she would point out another girl giving a dance nearby and complain about what a slut she was for letting the guy openly suck on her nipples. I might snicker to myself at her seeming hypocricy, but actually it's about discretion.

I don't usually like that type of "bad girl" because their agressiveness seems mercenary. Perhaps their recklessness makes the intimacy feel less special, too. On the other hand, when a "good girl" fave points out a "whore" to me, I try to get a dance with her if I'm interested at the first opportunity. There's added fun when the good girl sees and shakes her head over my incorrigibility.

"... dancers get known around the club as the "bad girl" for being indiscreet and too aggressive ..." I agree. I also think being indiscriminate has something to do with it - bad girls misbehave with everybody, good girls are somewhat more selective.

I'm sure it will come as no surprise to learn that I too prefer the "good" girls. Except that I don't think there is a clear distinction between the "good" girls and the "bad" girls. Like most things in life, it's not black and white, it's shades of grey. And I don't think it's just an act. For example, I know for a fact that my ATF was a good girl most of the time. But I also know for a fact that she occasionally behaved like a bad girl when the conditions were just right (or wrong.) I think most of the "good" girls are like that - good most of the time but not all of the time.

DougS, if you really enjoy your current fave I wouldn't take the chance of pushing the envelope. You might succeed once but if you do it could irrevocably change your relationship for the worse, it might cause her to trust you less. Because I think the real conundrum is that however you start out is how they will prefer to continue, so if you know her as a good girl she'll prefer to keep it that way, and the only way to get to know her as a bad girl is to start out that way.

Ahh Chandler... Another conundrum, and don't think this question hasn't crossed my mind. If a good girl / "clean dancer" is only acting that way to make her more appealing to me, perhaps if I pushed the envelope, would it open easily, or maybe she is not acting and is truly not a "dirty dancer".

This question was bouncing in my mind a lot more when I was with my prev ATF (that'd be the dancer that we both know - the one that I re-located in Indy several months ago). Especially as things got steamier. Perhaps your ITC experiences with her were different from mine (I'd like to hear about them, if you want to email me), but I am fairly sure she was clean and rule bound. I believe that as we got to know each other better, and she felt more comfortable with me, she became more relaxed. Not that it was always about it, but she also got into a money crunch, which I feel influenced a few things.

As for my ATF, I would be totally shocked if it were all an act. I'm confident that she's not an "extras" type girl.

Doug, I wonder whether these good girls are just presenting themselves the way they think you want them to be. Dancers tend to do that with their good customers. We have no way of knowing how they behave with other customers, and it shouldn't concern us how that compares. The way I see it, they're all good girls when they behave badly, which they all do or they wouldn't be there.