strip club magic is gone but its a good thing

It seams having the ability to treat them like nirmal civis goes much further in getting OTC because it shows the coolness, confidence and professionalism i have in this area in my life

Shis

Now if you can just master spelling and punctuation, you'll be a complete and total stud. Good luck.

I don't know about that JS... Maybe a breakdown of the merits of The System and how to pay hookers for sex will make it a complete transformation.

Yep, I was just about to ask if you now make it your MO to find dive clubs where you are the only one wearing a suit.

Lol, fuckers

John smith not even spell check can save me lol

Fuxk you kackie

Why cant you just stick to one user name.

spell check didnt help me jackie. So fuck you kackie

On a serious note...it is true....and was fun being the young attractive, in shape, broke kid that those older ladies just enjoyed

And now that im bald, fat, ugly, with cash its becoming a real blast for me breaking in the new young girls to the OTC side of their profession

I got news for you, you never have enough money. As u get older you become keenly aware how much everything costs and start wondering why you piss any if it away at the club.

Meat maybe once im 40 i will feel like this

Chattyguy this is my only account

Hit the gym, get a toupee and get whatever stripper you talk to drunk, and you can once again be handsome.

Lol, shailynn that would make a funny picture lol

JS – that was cold - LOL

san_jose_guy Joined June 2014

Last Seen September 2015

Reviews 0 Articles 0 Discussions 37 Comments 2,958 Reviewed Clubs 0

SJG Portal: sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

Nice Guys tuscl.net

Join the Revolution sjg-rheinbach.de

Chicago Club photo, and other photos, including San Diego's trains flickr.com

Real TJ, video youtube.com

Philosophy for Handling Strip Clubs, and about Never Letting Girls Sell You Dances tuscl.net

More of My Philosophy tuscl.net

Philly Hole in the Wall Clubs tuscl.net

About Born Again Christianity and Hard Living Sorts tuscl.net

Shadowcat, Making Out w/ Strippers tuscl.net

Siemens to build 35 new diesel electric locomotives at it's Sacramento plant. bizjournals.com

Contraception and STD Prevention Research guttmacher.org

Nice Guys cavemancircus.com/2011/10/24/nice-guy-syndrome-what-it-is-and-why-you-should-kill-it-with-fire/

How to find out how good a dancer is in the VIP/Room, or, why not front room friendliness? tuscl.net

How To Pay Hookers For Sex, television program tuscl.net

Why, at a place like the Sunnyvale Brass Rail, you need to study and work The System tuscl.net

The Importance of Not Treating Strippers Like Strippers tuscl.net

High Performance Magnets, U Alabama mint.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/MINT-G8-Abstract-Combined.pdf

A surprise meeting in Time Square tuscl.net

Why Front Room Friendliness Is So Important and Why Dancers Make More Money This Way tuscl.net

Boom of 2015 Part 1 tuscl.net

Part 2 tuscl.net

Coffee Girls thebravenewworlddotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/l_7832265fd11f4c67b9a0a83ba7084078.jpg

Breastaurants tuscl.net

Time Square Photo, but Kuala Lumpur ajlevan.theworldrace.org/blogphotos/theworldrace/ajlevan/kl_prostitutes1.jpg

Slut Wear tuscl.net

The System tuscl.net

Kudos to JS69 tuscl.net

San Francisco, open tongue girl kissing on stage tuscl.net

Overview of the Bay Area Scene tuscl.net

La Bamba (1987), Tijuana Brothel Scene, around 1958 youtu.be/E7IrVjS5NZA?t=1h16m7s

Floor Dance Tipping Interval? Mr. LDK tuscl.net

Malaysia Flight MH 370 tuscl.net

Terminal Identity amazon.com

Anti-Oedipus amazon.com

Strip Club Songs phoenixnewtimes.com

JS69's Thread tuscl.net

Neoliberalism and Tijuana Sex Work tuscl.net

Fayetteville North Carolina tuscl.net

No more Ford Vans, and Mexican Border Pussy, plus racist San Diego tuscl.net

Karl Marx tuscl.net

Talk about drugs tuscl.net

Talk about single versus married and being careful tuscl.net

Shailynn's Unemployment Thread tuscl.net

mandatory.com

China, funeral strippers blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/23/chinese-government-says-please-stop-hiring-funeral-strippers/

series of posts about an organization i am building tuscl.net

Alabegonz, some much needed words of sanity! tuscl.net

The Boom Of 2015 tuscl.net entirely fictional and any similarity to real persons living or dead is entirely conincidence

Jestrite50, as always, DFKing a hottie in the front room, followed by my own comment tuscl.net

question for SJG tuscl.net

Kick back money, and how people can do things in ethnic minority subcultures that they wouldn't otherwise dare do: tuscl.net

Discussion of AMPs and Trafficking tuscl.net

Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

More Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

Duke69, AMP story tuscl.net

Female Revolutionaries tuscl.net

First Lesson in Vietnamese tuscl.net

Capability Declines With Age? tuscl.net

Discussion of 'seductions' in AMPs, versus what can be done in civilian venues tuscl.net

Discussions of hand holding tuscl.net

Why lapdances are a chump's game tuscl.net

Rick Dugan, "The System" tuscl.net

SJG's Philosophy tuscl.net

substantial discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Preserved Threads:

The Great Society Programs did not go far enough. They were always compromised on behalf of upholding middle class values. In the case of Medicare, this meant a deal which was cut, instead of board determined fees, it was to be the customary physician's fees. It was this, the compromise with the doctors, which made Medicare into something which would prove to be unworkable.

The New Deal legislation brought us some of the best structural changes this country has ever seen. It's just that that was so long ago.

If we want working people to be able to earn a living and to be able to stay afloat, and I say that we have to want this, then we still need much deeper economic system reforms today than what we got with LBJ and The Great Society.

SJG

Dougster, "just making money" is an extremely political position to take. You are making that money off of other people. And you are using the existing rules of our society to do it, and those rules might not be fair. You are also using our existing infrastructure of transportation, banking, and courts too. You are using structures which already exist in order to keep many people down, and seem to be taking us in the direction of a two tier society.

Most all sorts of social programs are designed at least in part in order to humiliate the poor, and to turn them into a public spectacle. They almost have to be designed so, otherwise they would be giving out more money and benefit. What they give out is not enough to lift people out of poverty. But they most certainly do impose order in the working rank and file just above the welfare clients.

We have this going on here in San Jose. A big backer of these programs is the new Mayor of San Jose, Sam Liccardo. He sports all sorts of secular and religious charities aimed at the downtown homeless. They give out some benefits. But what they also do is make people submit to case management. So their affairs will now be open to interpretation by persons interested in breaking their spirit. If someone has grown up in an abusive environment, then letting others take the shattered factoids of their life and try to weave it into a story, will be the final act which guarantees that their abuses win. It is just like subjecting a rape victim to a second rape by telling her that you don't believer her, or that she caused it herself.

Liccardo supports these sorts of things, programs which pay far less than the minimum wage, first of all because he is part of a City Hall contingent committed to breaking the Public Employee Unions, particularly Police and Fire. He is also committed to making San Jose into an Urban Yuppie Utopia. This is what he believes in, and he is in bed with the big high rise developers. He is also a champion of charter schools, places which hire unqualified teachers and put kids on computerized drilling machines for much of the day. He wants to close the "achievement gap" by sending kids to schools that he would never dream of sending any kids of his own to.

stoprocketship.com

That most social programs are primarily intended to humiliate and regulate the poor, and turn them into a public spectacle in order to weaken the Labor Movement is demonstrated over and over in:

Francis Fox-Piven and Richard Cloward amazon.com

The first attempts to provide welfare in order to restrict pan-handling came about during the 1500's, at the very beginnings of Capitalism. The pan handling was socially disruptive. It was interfering with the wheels of progress. People were pan handling because they needed to be able to eat, and Capitalism causes dislocation. Less and less workers are actually needed, and they need to impose order and discipline in their existing labor force or it won't be willing to work at starvation wages anymore.

The idea of welfare goes back to the Roman Empire. It was simply a practical solution to a pressing need. It avoided revolution and kept the empire together. Welfare in the US started as AFDC with the 1935 Social Security Act. Although it is never been more than a few percent of the total budget of public expenditure, it has always been highly controversial. Many people seem to find the idea offensive.

What NY's Daniel Patrick Moynihan concluded was that welfare is simply the cheapest way to address poverty. Any more complex solution ends up costing more money. I think this is obvious.

But for myself, I know that the weakness of welfare is that people are letting themselves be made into objects of pity, instead of organizing and fighting back. Alcohol, drugs, born again Christianity, and psychiatric medication are also all used to keep the poor from organizing and fighting back.

I mean this insurance agent, if he really wanted to hire someone at low but fair wages to rake is leaves, I'm sure he could have found someone. But it sounds like he just wanted to rebuke the homeless man for panhandling. So of course the man was right to tell him where to stick it.

Those at the bottom are often forced to take itinerant forms of employment with pay less than a living wage, and even less than minimum wage. Often those at the bottom end up having to try and get income from people who don't even pay as agreed.

For myself, I am involved in various matters of public and community interest. I learned of one group which was feeding the homeless in a public park, but they make it part of a kind of a church service. The message they put out in this tax payer funded church service is that the homeless and the poor are responsible for their own plight because they don't accept Jesus and because instead of practicing forgiveness, they are "carrying stuff around with them." I also soon learned that most all of these church volunteers have designated scape goats within their own families. Usually it is one of their children. Sometimes it is a sibling. In this later case, what this means is that they side with the parents in their evaluation of this person. I also unearthed a man who had a huge emotional investment in blacksheeping his eldest daughter. He was currently charged with 6 felonies all pertaining to the sexual fondling of his daughters, and his whole church was standing with him and calling the girls liars.

Over the next two years I got heavily involved in this and played a large roll in getting this man convicted and put in San Quentin to serve a sentence which exceeds his life expectancy. And I am continuing to work to try and educate multiple city governments that it is wrong to trample on separation of church and state and to allow these religious pity and condemnation programs access to tax payer funded property. I am making progress.

I think GACAclub has the right way of seeing this. We have created an underclass. Moralizing at such persons solves nothing. We have to undo what we have done. And I am also saying that unredressed religious child abuse is a huge part of this.

And of course shortly after I joined TUSCL I too noticed right away how this condemnation of the underclass is reflected in the attitudes TUSCLer's show towards the very women they are paying money to for sex acts.

SJG

No one who really had a choice would want to live in the gutter. Part of the problem is that living wage work is not available to many people. There is just no way that some people would be the ones to get it. So they have to try and function with sub living wage off the books work, and maybe 50% of the time that means dealing with people who don't pay.

Lots of people will talk about having started with nothing. But why should that be a standard we try to hold people to? And also, the simple fact is that how well things go for people do depend entirely on their background, social background, economic background, and family background. So a young person may have "nothing", or this is what they say. But actually they have a lot going for them.

It is different for people when they are in middle age. They are looked at differently. Their social standing is different.

No one is going to want to throw their life into the garbage dumpster. I am convinced that anyone who lives in the gutter is there because somewhere along the way their social and civil standing were neutralized. So after that the pain of getting through even one day is just unbearable.

Problem is though, that most such people cannot obtain political consioucness. The pain is too great. Then you have local gov't in league with religious groups, you have the gov't funded mental health system and the probations system, and then you have motivationalists. All of these things work to tell people that they are the ones responsible for their dysfunctional lives. So there is no justice. And further, many of these same things are further propagated via child abuse.

The only remedy is always going to be political consciousness raising.

We have an underclass, but it is not created by social programs, it is created by Capitalism and by the institutions which protect Capitalism, like familyism.

SJG

Discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Jestrite50, about not busting a nut tuscl.net

How do we get US SC's up to the quality level of the Hong Kong Bar? For now I am setting aside the pricing difference as I see that as secondary. As I see it, the situation should be analyzed in two parts, the front room dynamic and the backroom dynamic. Please contribute what you can to this exploration: tuscl.net

Some recent threads and posts which are clearly relevant:

silkypants -> Real Time Update Detroit tuscl.net

GroovnHigh and TireTraveler -> First about an all GFE relationship started in Adelitas, then a great account of front room pussy play followed by retreating to a private room. This is the way it should be done, rather than talking about 'extras' and 'mileage' and letting a girl 'sell you dances'. tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Opens up a thread about lap dancing by talking about grope sessions. If this could get to DFK w/ FIV, then you've really got what I would consider to be the ideal, if it could be in the front room and before you have spent enough money to be committed to that girl. tuscl.net

Discussion of German FKK versus TJ, and why there could be a quality of experience difference because in TJ things probably go around the clock and so it could be easier and cheaper to spend more time with your girl. tuscl.net

Discussion about asking waitresses for information about dancers. I try to denounce this, saying that you shouldn't relate to any of the women in the SC by talking about 'extras' or 'mileage' or asking them to gossip about each other. Jestrite50, as only he can, explains how it should be done, dealing with each woman in her own right. tuscl.net

And here, Shadowcat opens a thread right. It was about dancers living in motels. Having motel access is a key to getting HK backroom quality. Shadow cat speaks of a place in South Carolina where he was getting takeout without even going to the SC. tuscl.net

Discussion of Aphrodite's Lingerie Party, in Portland, and why this sort of venue is inherently inferior to an SC. tuscl.net

How strip clubs fall short of their potential: tuscl.net

But so long as people are going to walk into strip clubs and ask dancers, "Do you do extras?" Or they ask dancers which other dancer does good extras, or they even ask waitresses, and in general treat them all like prositutes, or even as vending machines, then all of this discussion will remain throwing pearls before swine. tuscl.net

Long term resident San Jose, CA, familiar with Sunnyvale and San Jose clubs. These are strictly hands off, so it is verbal flirting only. This type of flirting has played a key role in my own development. Knowledge of the history of San Francisco clubs and with the origins of lap dancing, and some familiarity with the clubs as they have evolved since. Long term reader of the Spectator newspaper, until it went under. Familiar with underground Mexican bar table dancing network. This has been tremendous fun! Also intimately familiar with AMPs and AAMPs and the social structures which support them, from all vantage points. My life objective is not to live as a Pathetic Loser, but to live like King Herod the Great.

sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

strip-club-news.blogspot.com/

On JS69's marriage thread: tuscl.net

Duke69, shows us how to club, how to make it happen with dolled up young hotties, starting in the front room, instead of just letting them sell you dances and letting your money get fed to the house and dealing with dissociated losers performing acts upon you. My hat goes off to Duke69, as he has shown us how clubbing should be. tuscl.net

Lena's Feng Shui blog lenasmirnova2013.blogspot.co.uk/

tuscl.net There have been many threads about kissing in SC's. As I see it, you want to make it as natural as possible, and so you want to do it in a way which gives you the initiative. Always treat your girl as a civilian. You want to do it this way to show your favorite dancer that you can be assertive and that you like her. Kissing is one of the best ways to get a woman to open up to you physically and psychologically. So there is no reason to wait until she is in the dance booth or the VIP room. Try and get her kissing you right in the main room. Mostly it's just a matter of learning how to do it nicely. You can give her sitting tips as appropriate to extend your front room time with her. To continue into the dance booth or the VIP Room, you want to get her off script, so that she is not providing some special service to you, standing over you and being a moving target, but instead she is sitting on your lap, straddling your thigh, or something like this. You want it to be on your initiative, and kissing is a great way to establish this. Really, no reason to take to the VIP Room until your pants are going to be coming down. Do as much as possible in the front room, and for sitting tips.

I told someone before who was going to S.F. to try and get a Crazy Horse dancer open tongue kissing while she is on stage. This could be a way of beating a clip joint.

And @JS69, yes Donna in the purple dress and I did a great deal of intense kissing, as we would in a subsequent session too. She was really tickled that I came in there and insisted upon her, just because I saw her outside washing her car. But we also did great FS too. But it would not be until some later years that I really learned how to use positions and rhythms to give exceptional FS. There is more I plan to write about Donna.

I think some people don't want to kiss strippers because they don't really like them. They just want that endorphin rush from ejaculation. Or they have one set of girls to look at, and then another to pay for doing "extras". I think this is really sad.

I think some others just haven't yet used their time in SC's to learn how to talk to women, and how to let them open up.

Others, I think they want to be like Howard Hughes in his later years, living on the top floor of a hotel, all the furniture covered, no one can touch him, and all his food and drink sterilized. The man was nuts. Studies have been done with mononucleosis. It is not transmitted by kissing, that is just folklore.

I read in a book about Mexican culture that in their SC's, if they like a dancer, the first thing they do is kiss her.

Duke69, Real Talk, kissing and talking with your girl are the best way to get to know her! tuscl.net

Duke69, how and when to "just ask" time"ing is everything tuscl.net

Jestrite50, lap siting and kissing tuscl.net

Shadowcat's Kissing thread tuscl.net

VIP Room Kissing tuscl.net

Jestrite50, the master himself speaks! tuscl.net

Duke69 on Jestrite50 tuscl.net

Not Another Kissing Thread, BBJames tuscl.net

Kissing thread with twist, BBJames tuscl.net

Portland, Aphrodite's Hot Lingerie Party This place is set up to offer you more in the backroom than the local SC's, obviously or else there would be no reason to go there. But to make it nice you need to learn how to work it some, make it playful and show good intent and maybe offer some initial lobby tips, and get to see the girls and get them giddy with anticipation, and get your favorite girl DKFing you in the front lobby. It should be doable. tuscl.net

Jestrite50 and two shot girls tuscl.net

my reply on noreallyme's swing club thread, about my own marriage tuscl.net

PhantomGeek -> enjoyable DFK which led to some time in the VIP and a lot more DFK tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Watch to see what king of mileage the other customers are getting at the table tuscl.net

Club_Goer -> Reliable Strippers youtube.com

Hooters, Beijing youtube.com

san_jose_guy Joined June 2014

Last Seen September 2015

Reviews 0 Articles 0 Discussions 37 Comments 2,958 Reviewed Clubs 0

SJG Portal: sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

Nice Guys tuscl.net

Join the Revolution sjg-rheinbach.de

Chicago Club photo, and other photos, including San Diego's trains flickr.com

Real TJ, video youtube.com

Philosophy for Handling Strip Clubs, and about Never Letting Girls Sell You Dances tuscl.net

More of My Philosophy tuscl.net

Philly Hole in the Wall Clubs tuscl.net

About Born Again Christianity and Hard Living Sorts tuscl.net

Shadowcat, Making Out w/ Strippers tuscl.net

Siemens to build 35 new diesel electric locomotives at it's Sacramento plant. bizjournals.com

Contraception and STD Prevention Research guttmacher.org

Nice Guys cavemancircus.com/2011/10/24/nice-guy-syndrome-what-it-is-and-why-you-should-kill-it-with-fire/

How to find out how good a dancer is in the VIP/Room, or, why not front room friendliness? tuscl.net

How To Pay Hookers For Sex, television program tuscl.net

Why, at a place like the Sunnyvale Brass Rail, you need to study and work The System tuscl.net

The Importance of Not Treating Strippers Like Strippers tuscl.net

High Performance Magnets, U Alabama mint.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/MINT-G8-Abstract-Combined.pdf

A surprise meeting in Time Square tuscl.net

Why Front Room Friendliness Is So Important and Why Dancers Make More Money This Way tuscl.net

Boom of 2015 Part 1 tuscl.net

Part 2 tuscl.net

Coffee Girls thebravenewworlddotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/l_7832265fd11f4c67b9a0a83ba7084078.jpg

Breastaurants tuscl.net

Time Square Photo, but Kuala Lumpur ajlevan.theworldrace.org/blogphotos/theworldrace/ajlevan/kl_prostitutes1.jpg

Slut Wear tuscl.net

The System tuscl.net

Kudos to JS69 tuscl.net

San Francisco, open tongue girl kissing on stage tuscl.net

Overview of the Bay Area Scene tuscl.net

La Bamba (1987), Tijuana Brothel Scene, around 1958 youtu.be/E7IrVjS5NZA?t=1h16m7s

Floor Dance Tipping Interval? Mr. LDK tuscl.net

Malaysia Flight MH 370 tuscl.net

Terminal Identity amazon.com

Anti-Oedipus amazon.com

Strip Club Songs phoenixnewtimes.com

JS69's Thread tuscl.net

Neoliberalism and Tijuana Sex Work tuscl.net

Fayetteville North Carolina tuscl.net

No more Ford Vans, and Mexican Border Pussy, plus racist San Diego tuscl.net

Karl Marx tuscl.net

Talk about drugs tuscl.net

Talk about single versus married and being careful tuscl.net

Shailynn's Unemployment Thread tuscl.net

mandatory.com

China, funeral strippers blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/23/chinese-government-says-please-stop-hiring-funeral-strippers/

series of posts about an organization i am building tuscl.net

Alabegonz, some much needed words of sanity! tuscl.net

The Boom Of 2015 tuscl.net entirely fictional and any similarity to real persons living or dead is entirely conincidence

Jestrite50, as always, DFKing a hottie in the front room, followed by my own comment tuscl.net

question for SJG tuscl.net

Kick back money, and how people can do things in ethnic minority subcultures that they wouldn't otherwise dare do: tuscl.net

Discussion of AMPs and Trafficking tuscl.net

Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

More Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

Duke69, AMP story tuscl.net

Female Revolutionaries tuscl.net

First Lesson in Vietnamese tuscl.net

Capability Declines With Age? tuscl.net

Discussion of 'seductions' in AMPs, versus what can be done in civilian venues tuscl.net

Discussions of hand holding tuscl.net

Why lapdances are a chump's game tuscl.net

Rick Dugan, "The System" tuscl.net

SJG's Philosophy tuscl.net

substantial discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Preserved Threads:

The Great Society Programs did not go far enough. They were always compromised on behalf of upholding middle class values. In the case of Medicare, this meant a deal which was cut, instead of board determined fees, it was to be the customary physician's fees. It was this, the compromise with the doctors, which made Medicare into something which would prove to be unworkable.

The New Deal legislation brought us some of the best structural changes this country has ever seen. It's just that that was so long ago.

If we want working people to be able to earn a living and to be able to stay afloat, and I say that we have to want this, then we still need much deeper economic system reforms today than what we got with LBJ and The Great Society.

SJG

Dougster, "just making money" is an extremely political position to take. You are making that money off of other people. And you are using the existing rules of our society to do it, and those rules might not be fair. You are also using our existing infrastructure of transportation, banking, and courts too. You are using structures which already exist in order to keep many people down, and seem to be taking us in the direction of a two tier society.

Most all sorts of social programs are designed at least in part in order to humiliate the poor, and to turn them into a public spectacle. They almost have to be designed so, otherwise they would be giving out more money and benefit. What they give out is not enough to lift people out of poverty. But they most certainly do impose order in the working rank and file just above the welfare clients.

We have this going on here in San Jose. A big backer of these programs is the new Mayor of San Jose, Sam Liccardo. He sports all sorts of secular and religious charities aimed at the downtown homeless. They give out some benefits. But what they also do is make people submit to case management. So their affairs will now be open to interpretation by persons interested in breaking their spirit. If someone has grown up in an abusive environment, then letting others take the shattered factoids of their life and try to weave it into a story, will be the final act which guarantees that their abuses win. It is just like subjecting a rape victim to a second rape by telling her that you don't believer her, or that she caused it herself.

Liccardo supports these sorts of things, programs which pay far less than the minimum wage, first of all because he is part of a City Hall contingent committed to breaking the Public Employee Unions, particularly Police and Fire. He is also committed to making San Jose into an Urban Yuppie Utopia. This is what he believes in, and he is in bed with the big high rise developers. He is also a champion of charter schools, places which hire unqualified teachers and put kids on computerized drilling machines for much of the day. He wants to close the "achievement gap" by sending kids to schools that he would never dream of sending any kids of his own to.

stoprocketship.com

That most social programs are primarily intended to humiliate and regulate the poor, and turn them into a public spectacle in order to weaken the Labor Movement is demonstrated over and over in:

Francis Fox-Piven and Richard Cloward amazon.com

The first attempts to provide welfare in order to restrict pan-handling came about during the 1500's, at the very beginnings of Capitalism. The pan handling was socially disruptive. It was interfering with the wheels of progress. People were pan handling because they needed to be able to eat, and Capitalism causes dislocation. Less and less workers are actually needed, and they need to impose order and discipline in their existing labor force or it won't be willing to work at starvation wages anymore.

The idea of welfare goes back to the Roman Empire. It was simply a practical solution to a pressing need. It avoided revolution and kept the empire together. Welfare in the US started as AFDC with the 1935 Social Security Act. Although it is never been more than a few percent of the total budget of public expenditure, it has always been highly controversial. Many people seem to find the idea offensive.

What NY's Daniel Patrick Moynihan concluded was that welfare is simply the cheapest way to address poverty. Any more complex solution ends up costing more money. I think this is obvious.

But for myself, I know that the weakness of welfare is that people are letting themselves be made into objects of pity, instead of organizing and fighting back. Alcohol, drugs, born again Christianity, and psychiatric medication are also all used to keep the poor from organizing and fighting back.

I mean this insurance agent, if he really wanted to hire someone at low but fair wages to rake is leaves, I'm sure he could have found someone. But it sounds like he just wanted to rebuke the homeless man for panhandling. So of course the man was right to tell him where to stick it.

Those at the bottom are often forced to take itinerant forms of employment with pay less than a living wage, and even less than minimum wage. Often those at the bottom end up having to try and get income from people who don't even pay as agreed.

For myself, I am involved in various matters of public and community interest. I learned of one group which was feeding the homeless in a public park, but they make it part of a kind of a church service. The message they put out in this tax payer funded church service is that the homeless and the poor are responsible for their own plight because they don't accept Jesus and because instead of practicing forgiveness, they are "carrying stuff around with them." I also soon learned that most all of these church volunteers have designated scape goats within their own families. Usually it is one of their children. Sometimes it is a sibling. In this later case, what this means is that they side with the parents in their evaluation of this person. I also unearthed a man who had a huge emotional investment in blacksheeping his eldest daughter. He was currently charged with 6 felonies all pertaining to the sexual fondling of his daughters, and his whole church was standing with him and calling the girls liars.

Over the next two years I got heavily involved in this and played a large roll in getting this man convicted and put in San Quentin to serve a sentence which exceeds his life expectancy. And I am continuing to work to try and educate multiple city governments that it is wrong to trample on separation of church and state and to allow these religious pity and condemnation programs access to tax payer funded property. I am making progress.

I think GACAclub has the right way of seeing this. We have created an underclass. Moralizing at such persons solves nothing. We have to undo what we have done. And I am also saying that unredressed religious child abuse is a huge part of this.

And of course shortly after I joined TUSCL I too noticed right away how this condemnation of the underclass is reflected in the attitudes TUSCLer's show towards the very women they are paying money to for sex acts.

SJG

No one who really had a choice would want to live in the gutter. Part of the problem is that living wage work is not available to many people. There is just no way that some people would be the ones to get it. So they have to try and function with sub living wage off the books work, and maybe 50% of the time that means dealing with people who don't pay.

Lots of people will talk about having started with nothing. But why should that be a standard we try to hold people to? And also, the simple fact is that how well things go for people do depend entirely on their background, social background, economic background, and family background. So a young person may have "nothing", or this is what they say. But actually they have a lot going for them.

It is different for people when they are in middle age. They are looked at differently. Their social standing is different.

No one is going to want to throw their life into the garbage dumpster. I am convinced that anyone who lives in the gutter is there because somewhere along the way their social and civil standing were neutralized. So after that the pain of getting through even one day is just unbearable.

Problem is though, that most such people cannot obtain political consioucness. The pain is too great. Then you have local gov't in league with religious groups, you have the gov't funded mental health system and the probations system, and then you have motivationalists. All of these things work to tell people that they are the ones responsible for their dysfunctional lives. So there is no justice. And further, many of these same things are further propagated via child abuse.

The only remedy is always going to be political consciousness raising.

We have an underclass, but it is not created by social programs, it is created by Capitalism and by the institutions which protect Capitalism, like familyism.

SJG

Discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Jestrite50, about not busting a nut tuscl.net

How do we get US SC's up to the quality level of the Hong Kong Bar? For now I am setting aside the pricing difference as I see that as secondary. As I see it, the situation should be analyzed in two parts, the front room dynamic and the backroom dynamic. Please contribute what you can to this exploration: tuscl.net

Some recent threads and posts which are clearly relevant:

silkypants -> Real Time Update Detroit tuscl.net

GroovnHigh and TireTraveler -> First about an all GFE relationship started in Adelitas, then a great account of front room pussy play followed by retreating to a private room. This is the way it should be done, rather than talking about 'extras' and 'mileage' and letting a girl 'sell you dances'. tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Opens up a thread about lap dancing by talking about grope sessions. If this could get to DFK w/ FIV, then you've really got what I would consider to be the ideal, if it could be in the front room and before you have spent enough money to be committed to that girl. tuscl.net

Discussion of German FKK versus TJ, and why there could be a quality of experience difference because in TJ things probably go around the clock and so it could be easier and cheaper to spend more time with your girl. tuscl.net

Discussion about asking waitresses for information about dancers. I try to denounce this, saying that you shouldn't relate to any of the women in the SC by talking about 'extras' or 'mileage' or asking them to gossip about each other. Jestrite50, as only he can, explains how it should be done, dealing with each woman in her own right. tuscl.net

And here, Shadowcat opens a thread right. It was about dancers living in motels. Having motel access is a key to getting HK backroom quality. Shadow cat speaks of a place in South Carolina where he was getting takeout without even going to the SC. tuscl.net

Discussion of Aphrodite's Lingerie Party, in Portland, and why this sort of venue is inherently inferior to an SC. tuscl.net

How strip clubs fall short of their potential: tuscl.net

But so long as people are going to walk into strip clubs and ask dancers, "Do you do extras?" Or they ask dancers which other dancer does good extras, or they even ask waitresses, and in general treat them all like prositutes, or even as vending machines, then all of this discussion will remain throwing pearls before swine. tuscl.net

Long term resident San Jose, CA, familiar with Sunnyvale and San Jose clubs. These are strictly hands off, so it is verbal flirting only. This type of flirting has played a key role in my own development. Knowledge of the history of San Francisco clubs and with the origins of lap dancing, and some familiarity with the clubs as they have evolved since. Long term reader of the Spectator newspaper, until it went under. Familiar with underground Mexican bar table dancing network. This has been tremendous fun! Also intimately familiar with AMPs and AAMPs and the social structures which support them, from all vantage points. My life objective is not to live as a Pathetic Loser, but to live like King Herod the Great.

sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

strip-club-news.blogspot.com/

On JS69's marriage thread: tuscl.net

Duke69, shows us how to club, how to make it happen with dolled up young hotties, starting in the front room, instead of just letting them sell you dances and letting your money get fed to the house and dealing with dissociated losers performing acts upon you. My hat goes off to Duke69, as he has shown us how clubbing should be. tuscl.net

Lena's Feng Shui blog lenasmirnova2013.blogspot.co.uk/

tuscl.net There have been many threads about kissing in SC's. As I see it, you want to make it as natural as possible, and so you want to do it in a way which gives you the initiative. Always treat your girl as a civilian. You want to do it this way to show your favorite dancer that you can be assertive and that you like her. Kissing is one of the best ways to get a woman to open up to you physically and psychologically. So there is no reason to wait until she is in the dance booth or the VIP room. Try and get her kissing you right in the main room. Mostly it's just a matter of learning how to do it nicely. You can give her sitting tips as appropriate to extend your front room time with her. To continue into the dance booth or the VIP Room, you want to get her off script, so that she is not providing some special service to you, standing over you and being a moving target, but instead she is sitting on your lap, straddling your thigh, or something like this. You want it to be on your initiative, and kissing is a great way to establish this. Really, no reason to take to the VIP Room until your pants are going to be coming down. Do as much as possible in the front room, and for sitting tips.

I told someone before who was going to S.F. to try and get a Crazy Horse dancer open tongue kissing while she is on stage. This could be a way of beating a clip joint.

And @JS69, yes Donna in the purple dress and I did a great deal of intense kissing, as we would in a subsequent session too. She was really tickled that I came in there and insisted upon her, just because I saw her outside washing her car. But we also did great FS too. But it would not be until some later years that I really learned how to use positions and rhythms to give exceptional FS. There is more I plan to write about Donna.

I think some people don't want to kiss strippers because they don't really like them. They just want that endorphin rush from ejaculation. Or they have one set of girls to look at, and then another to pay for doing "extras". I think this is really sad.

I think some others just haven't yet used their time in SC's to learn how to talk to women, and how to let them open up.

Others, I think they want to be like Howard Hughes in his later years, living on the top floor of a hotel, all the furniture covered, no one can touch him, and all his food and drink sterilized. The man was nuts. Studies have been done with mononucleosis. It is not transmitted by kissing, that is just folklore.

I read in a book about Mexican culture that in their SC's, if they like a dancer, the first thing they do is kiss her.

Duke69, Real Talk, kissing and talking with your girl are the best way to get to know her! tuscl.net

Duke69, how and when to "just ask" time"ing is everything tuscl.net

Jestrite50, lap siting and kissing tuscl.net

Shadowcat's Kissing thread tuscl.net

VIP Room Kissing tuscl.net

Jestrite50, the master himself speaks! tuscl.net

Duke69 on Jestrite50 tuscl.net

Not Another Kissing Thread, BBJames tuscl.net

Kissing thread with twist, BBJames tuscl.net

Portland, Aphrodite's Hot Lingerie Party This place is set up to offer you more in the backroom than the local SC's, obviously or else there would be no reason to go there. But to make it nice you need to learn how to work it some, make it playful and show good intent and maybe offer some initial lobby tips, and get to see the girls and get them giddy with anticipation, and get your favorite girl DKFing you in the front lobby. It should be doable. tuscl.net

Jestrite50 and two shot girls tuscl.net

my reply on noreallyme's swing club thread, about my own marriage tuscl.net

PhantomGeek -> enjoyable DFK which led to some time in the VIP and a lot more DFK tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Watch to see what king of mileage the other customers are getting at the table tuscl.net

Club_Goer -> Reliable Strippers youtube.com

Hooters, Beijing youtube.com

san_jose_guy Joined June 2014

Last Seen September 2015

Reviews 0 Articles 0 Discussions 37 Comments 2,958 Reviewed Clubs 0

SJG Portal: sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

Nice Guys tuscl.net

Join the Revolution sjg-rheinbach.de

Chicago Club photo, and other photos, including San Diego's trains flickr.com

Real TJ, video youtube.com

Philosophy for Handling Strip Clubs, and about Never Letting Girls Sell You Dances tuscl.net

More of My Philosophy tuscl.net

Philly Hole in the Wall Clubs tuscl.net

About Born Again Christianity and Hard Living Sorts tuscl.net

Shadowcat, Making Out w/ Strippers tuscl.net

Siemens to build 35 new diesel electric locomotives at it's Sacramento plant. bizjournals.com

Contraception and STD Prevention Research guttmacher.org

Nice Guys cavemancircus.com/2011/10/24/nice-guy-syndrome-what-it-is-and-why-you-should-kill-it-with-fire/

How to find out how good a dancer is in the VIP/Room, or, why not front room friendliness? tuscl.net

How To Pay Hookers For Sex, television program tuscl.net

Why, at a place like the Sunnyvale Brass Rail, you need to study and work The System tuscl.net

The Importance of Not Treating Strippers Like Strippers tuscl.net

High Performance Magnets, U Alabama mint.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/MINT-G8-Abstract-Combined.pdf

A surprise meeting in Time Square tuscl.net

Why Front Room Friendliness Is So Important and Why Dancers Make More Money This Way tuscl.net

Boom of 2015 Part 1 tuscl.net

Part 2 tuscl.net

Coffee Girls thebravenewworlddotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/l_7832265fd11f4c67b9a0a83ba7084078.jpg

Breastaurants tuscl.net

Time Square Photo, but Kuala Lumpur ajlevan.theworldrace.org/blogphotos/theworldrace/ajlevan/kl_prostitutes1.jpg

Slut Wear tuscl.net

The System tuscl.net

Kudos to JS69 tuscl.net

San Francisco, open tongue girl kissing on stage tuscl.net

Overview of the Bay Area Scene tuscl.net

La Bamba (1987), Tijuana Brothel Scene, around 1958 youtu.be/E7IrVjS5NZA?t=1h16m7s

Floor Dance Tipping Interval? Mr. LDK tuscl.net

Malaysia Flight MH 370 tuscl.net

Terminal Identity amazon.com

Anti-Oedipus amazon.com

Strip Club Songs phoenixnewtimes.com

JS69's Thread tuscl.net

Neoliberalism and Tijuana Sex Work tuscl.net

Fayetteville North Carolina tuscl.net

No more Ford Vans, and Mexican Border Pussy, plus racist San Diego tuscl.net

Karl Marx tuscl.net

Talk about drugs tuscl.net

Talk about single versus married and being careful tuscl.net

Shailynn's Unemployment Thread tuscl.net

mandatory.com

China, funeral strippers blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/23/chinese-government-says-please-stop-hiring-funeral-strippers/

series of posts about an organization i am building tuscl.net

Alabegonz, some much needed words of sanity! tuscl.net

The Boom Of 2015 tuscl.net entirely fictional and any similarity to real persons living or dead is entirely conincidence

Jestrite50, as always, DFKing a hottie in the front room, followed by my own comment tuscl.net

question for SJG tuscl.net

Kick back money, and how people can do things in ethnic minority subcultures that they wouldn't otherwise dare do: tuscl.net

Discussion of AMPs and Trafficking tuscl.net

Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

More Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

Duke69, AMP story tuscl.net

Female Revolutionaries tuscl.net

First Lesson in Vietnamese tuscl.net

Capability Declines With Age? tuscl.net

Discussion of 'seductions' in AMPs, versus what can be done in civilian venues tuscl.net

Discussions of hand holding tuscl.net

Why lapdances are a chump's game tuscl.net

Rick Dugan, "The System" tuscl.net

SJG's Philosophy tuscl.net

substantial discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Preserved Threads:

The Great Society Programs did not go far enough. They were always compromised on behalf of upholding middle class values. In the case of Medicare, this meant a deal which was cut, instead of board determined fees, it was to be the customary physician's fees. It was this, the compromise with the doctors, which made Medicare into something which would prove to be unworkable.

The New Deal legislation brought us some of the best structural changes this country has ever seen. It's just that that was so long ago.

If we want working people to be able to earn a living and to be able to stay afloat, and I say that we have to want this, then we still need much deeper economic system reforms today than what we got with LBJ and The Great Society.

SJG

Dougster, "just making money" is an extremely political position to take. You are making that money off of other people. And you are using the existing rules of our society to do it, and those rules might not be fair. You are also using our existing infrastructure of transportation, banking, and courts too. You are using structures which already exist in order to keep many people down, and seem to be taking us in the direction of a two tier society.

Most all sorts of social programs are designed at least in part in order to humiliate the poor, and to turn them into a public spectacle. They almost have to be designed so, otherwise they would be giving out more money and benefit. What they give out is not enough to lift people out of poverty. But they most certainly do impose order in the working rank and file just above the welfare clients.

We have this going on here in San Jose. A big backer of these programs is the new Mayor of San Jose, Sam Liccardo. He sports all sorts of secular and religious charities aimed at the downtown homeless. They give out some benefits. But what they also do is make people submit to case management. So their affairs will now be open to interpretation by persons interested in breaking their spirit. If someone has grown up in an abusive environment, then letting others take the shattered factoids of their life and try to weave it into a story, will be the final act which guarantees that their abuses win. It is just like subjecting a rape victim to a second rape by telling her that you don't believer her, or that she caused it herself.

Liccardo supports these sorts of things, programs which pay far less than the minimum wage, first of all because he is part of a City Hall contingent committed to breaking the Public Employee Unions, particularly Police and Fire. He is also committed to making San Jose into an Urban Yuppie Utopia. This is what he believes in, and he is in bed with the big high rise developers. He is also a champion of charter schools, places which hire unqualified teachers and put kids on computerized drilling machines for much of the day. He wants to close the "achievement gap" by sending kids to schools that he would never dream of sending any kids of his own to.

stoprocketship.com

That most social programs are primarily intended to humiliate and regulate the poor, and turn them into a public spectacle in order to weaken the Labor Movement is demonstrated over and over in:

Francis Fox-Piven and Richard Cloward amazon.com

The first attempts to provide welfare in order to restrict pan-handling came about during the 1500's, at the very beginnings of Capitalism. The pan handling was socially disruptive. It was interfering with the wheels of progress. People were pan handling because they needed to be able to eat, and Capitalism causes dislocation. Less and less workers are actually needed, and they need to impose order and discipline in their existing labor force or it won't be willing to work at starvation wages anymore.

The idea of welfare goes back to the Roman Empire. It was simply a practical solution to a pressing need. It avoided revolution and kept the empire together. Welfare in the US started as AFDC with the 1935 Social Security Act. Although it is never been more than a few percent of the total budget of public expenditure, it has always been highly controversial. Many people seem to find the idea offensive.

What NY's Daniel Patrick Moynihan concluded was that welfare is simply the cheapest way to address poverty. Any more complex solution ends up costing more money. I think this is obvious.

But for myself, I know that the weakness of welfare is that people are letting themselves be made into objects of pity, instead of organizing and fighting back. Alcohol, drugs, born again Christianity, and psychiatric medication are also all used to keep the poor from organizing and fighting back.

I mean this insurance agent, if he really wanted to hire someone at low but fair wages to rake is leaves, I'm sure he could have found someone. But it sounds like he just wanted to rebuke the homeless man for panhandling. So of course the man was right to tell him where to stick it.

Those at the bottom are often forced to take itinerant forms of employment with pay less than a living wage, and even less than minimum wage. Often those at the bottom end up having to try and get income from people who don't even pay as agreed.

For myself, I am involved in various matters of public and community interest. I learned of one group which was feeding the homeless in a public park, but they make it part of a kind of a church service. The message they put out in this tax payer funded church service is that the homeless and the poor are responsible for their own plight because they don't accept Jesus and because instead of practicing forgiveness, they are "carrying stuff around with them." I also soon learned that most all of these church volunteers have designated scape goats within their own families. Usually it is one of their children. Sometimes it is a sibling. In this later case, what this means is that they side with the parents in their evaluation of this person. I also unearthed a man who had a huge emotional investment in blacksheeping his eldest daughter. He was currently charged with 6 felonies all pertaining to the sexual fondling of his daughters, and his whole church was standing with him and calling the girls liars.

Over the next two years I got heavily involved in this and played a large roll in getting this man convicted and put in San Quentin to serve a sentence which exceeds his life expectancy. And I am continuing to work to try and educate multiple city governments that it is wrong to trample on separation of church and state and to allow these religious pity and condemnation programs access to tax payer funded property. I am making progress.

I think GACAclub has the right way of seeing this. We have created an underclass. Moralizing at such persons solves nothing. We have to undo what we have done. And I am also saying that unredressed religious child abuse is a huge part of this.

And of course shortly after I joined TUSCL I too noticed right away how this condemnation of the underclass is reflected in the attitudes TUSCLer's show towards the very women they are paying money to for sex acts.

SJG

No one who really had a choice would want to live in the gutter. Part of the problem is that living wage work is not available to many people. There is just no way that some people would be the ones to get it. So they have to try and function with sub living wage off the books work, and maybe 50% of the time that means dealing with people who don't pay.

Lots of people will talk about having started with nothing. But why should that be a standard we try to hold people to? And also, the simple fact is that how well things go for people do depend entirely on their background, social background, economic background, and family background. So a young person may have "nothing", or this is what they say. But actually they have a lot going for them.

It is different for people when they are in middle age. They are looked at differently. Their social standing is different.

No one is going to want to throw their life into the garbage dumpster. I am convinced that anyone who lives in the gutter is there because somewhere along the way their social and civil standing were neutralized. So after that the pain of getting through even one day is just unbearable.

Problem is though, that most such people cannot obtain political consioucness. The pain is too great. Then you have local gov't in league with religious groups, you have the gov't funded mental health system and the probations system, and then you have motivationalists. All of these things work to tell people that they are the ones responsible for their dysfunctional lives. So there is no justice. And further, many of these same things are further propagated via child abuse.

The only remedy is always going to be political consciousness raising.

We have an underclass, but it is not created by social programs, it is created by Capitalism and by the institutions which protect Capitalism, like familyism.

SJG

Discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Jestrite50, about not busting a nut tuscl.net

How do we get US SC's up to the quality level of the Hong Kong Bar? For now I am setting aside the pricing difference as I see that as secondary. As I see it, the situation should be analyzed in two parts, the front room dynamic and the backroom dynamic. Please contribute what you can to this exploration: tuscl.net

Some recent threads and posts which are clearly relevant:

silkypants -> Real Time Update Detroit tuscl.net

GroovnHigh and TireTraveler -> First about an all GFE relationship started in Adelitas, then a great account of front room pussy play followed by retreating to a private room. This is the way it should be done, rather than talking about 'extras' and 'mileage' and letting a girl 'sell you dances'. tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Opens up a thread about lap dancing by talking about grope sessions. If this could get to DFK w/ FIV, then you've really got what I would consider to be the ideal, if it could be in the front room and before you have spent enough money to be committed to that girl. tuscl.net

Discussion of German FKK versus TJ, and why there could be a quality of experience difference because in TJ things probably go around the clock and so it could be easier and cheaper to spend more time with your girl. tuscl.net

Discussion about asking waitresses for information about dancers. I try to denounce this, saying that you shouldn't relate to any of the women in the SC by talking about 'extras' or 'mileage' or asking them to gossip about each other. Jestrite50, as only he can, explains how it should be done, dealing with each woman in her own right. tuscl.net

And here, Shadowcat opens a thread right. It was about dancers living in motels. Having motel access is a key to getting HK backroom quality. Shadow cat speaks of a place in South Carolina where he was getting takeout without even going to the SC. tuscl.net

Discussion of Aphrodite's Lingerie Party, in Portland, and why this sort of venue is inherently inferior to an SC. tuscl.net

How strip clubs fall short of their potential: tuscl.net

But so long as people are going to walk into strip clubs and ask dancers, "Do you do extras?" Or they ask dancers which other dancer does good extras, or they even ask waitresses, and in general treat them all like prositutes, or even as vending machines, then all of this discussion will remain throwing pearls before swine. tuscl.net

Long term resident San Jose, CA, familiar with Sunnyvale and San Jose clubs. These are strictly hands off, so it is verbal flirting only. This type of flirting has played a key role in my own development. Knowledge of the history of San Francisco clubs and with the origins of lap dancing, and some familiarity with the clubs as they have evolved since. Long term reader of the Spectator newspaper, until it went under. Familiar with underground Mexican bar table dancing network. This has been tremendous fun! Also intimately familiar with AMPs and AAMPs and the social structures which support them, from all vantage points. My life objective is not to live as a Pathetic Loser, but to live like King Herod the Great.

sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

strip-club-news.blogspot.com/

On JS69's marriage thread: tuscl.net

Duke69, shows us how to club, how to make it happen with dolled up young hotties, starting in the front room, instead of just letting them sell you dances and letting your money get fed to the house and dealing with dissociated losers performing acts upon you. My hat goes off to Duke69, as he has shown us how clubbing should be. tuscl.net

Lena's Feng Shui blog lenasmirnova2013.blogspot.co.uk/

tuscl.net There have been many threads about kissing in SC's. As I see it, you want to make it as natural as possible, and so you want to do it in a way which gives you the initiative. Always treat your girl as a civilian. You want to do it this way to show your favorite dancer that you can be assertive and that you like her. Kissing is one of the best ways to get a woman to open up to you physically and psychologically. So there is no reason to wait until she is in the dance booth or the VIP room. Try and get her kissing you right in the main room. Mostly it's just a matter of learning how to do it nicely. You can give her sitting tips as appropriate to extend your front room time with her. To continue into the dance booth or the VIP Room, you want to get her off script, so that she is not providing some special service to you, standing over you and being a moving target, but instead she is sitting on your lap, straddling your thigh, or something like this. You want it to be on your initiative, and kissing is a great way to establish this. Really, no reason to take to the VIP Room until your pants are going to be coming down. Do as much as possible in the front room, and for sitting tips.

I told someone before who was going to S.F. to try and get a Crazy Horse dancer open tongue kissing while she is on stage. This could be a way of beating a clip joint.

And @JS69, yes Donna in the purple dress and I did a great deal of intense kissing, as we would in a subsequent session too. She was really tickled that I came in there and insisted upon her, just because I saw her outside washing her car. But we also did great FS too. But it would not be until some later years that I really learned how to use positions and rhythms to give exceptional FS. There is more I plan to write about Donna.

I think some people don't want to kiss strippers because they don't really like them. They just want that endorphin rush from ejaculation. Or they have one set of girls to look at, and then another to pay for doing "extras". I think this is really sad.

I think some others just haven't yet used their time in SC's to learn how to talk to women, and how to let them open up.

Others, I think they want to be like Howard Hughes in his later years, living on the top floor of a hotel, all the furniture covered, no one can touch him, and all his food and drink sterilized. The man was nuts. Studies have been done with mononucleosis. It is not transmitted by kissing, that is just folklore.

I read in a book about Mexican culture that in their SC's, if they like a dancer, the first thing they do is kiss her.

Duke69, Real Talk, kissing and talking with your girl are the best way to get to know her! tuscl.net

Duke69, how and when to "just ask" time"ing is everything tuscl.net

Jestrite50, lap siting and kissing tuscl.net

Shadowcat's Kissing thread tuscl.net

VIP Room Kissing tuscl.net

Jestrite50, the master himself speaks! tuscl.net

Duke69 on Jestrite50 tuscl.net

Not Another Kissing Thread, BBJames tuscl.net

Kissing thread with twist, BBJames tuscl.net

Portland, Aphrodite's Hot Lingerie Party This place is set up to offer you more in the backroom than the local SC's, obviously or else there would be no reason to go there. But to make it nice you need to learn how to work it some, make it playful and show good intent and maybe offer some initial lobby tips, and get to see the girls and get them giddy with anticipation, and get your favorite girl DKFing you in the front lobby. It should be doable. tuscl.net

Jestrite50 and two shot girls tuscl.net

my reply on noreallyme's swing club thread, about my own marriage tuscl.net

PhantomGeek -> enjoyable DFK which led to some time in the VIP and a lot more DFK tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Watch to see what king of mileage the other customers are getting at the table tuscl.net

Club_Goer -> Reliable Strippers youtube.com

Hooters, Beijing youtube.com

san_jose_guy Joined June 2014

Last Seen September 2015

Reviews 0 Articles 0 Discussions 37 Comments 2,958 Reviewed Clubs 0

SJG Portal: sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

Nice Guys tuscl.net

Join the Revolution sjg-rheinbach.de

Chicago Club photo, and other photos, including San Diego's trains flickr.com

Real TJ, video youtube.com

Philosophy for Handling Strip Clubs, and about Never Letting Girls Sell You Dances tuscl.net

More of My Philosophy tuscl.net

Philly Hole in the Wall Clubs tuscl.net

About Born Again Christianity and Hard Living Sorts tuscl.net

Shadowcat, Making Out w/ Strippers tuscl.net

Siemens to build 35 new diesel electric locomotives at it's Sacramento plant. bizjournals.com

Contraception and STD Prevention Research guttmacher.org

Nice Guys cavemancircus.com/2011/10/24/nice-guy-syndrome-what-it-is-and-why-you-should-kill-it-with-fire/

How to find out how good a dancer is in the VIP/Room, or, why not front room friendliness? tuscl.net

How To Pay Hookers For Sex, television program tuscl.net

Why, at a place like the Sunnyvale Brass Rail, you need to study and work The System tuscl.net

The Importance of Not Treating Strippers Like Strippers tuscl.net

High Performance Magnets, U Alabama mint.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/MINT-G8-Abstract-Combined.pdf

A surprise meeting in Time Square tuscl.net

Why Front Room Friendliness Is So Important and Why Dancers Make More Money This Way tuscl.net

Boom of 2015 Part 1 tuscl.net

Part 2 tuscl.net

Coffee Girls thebravenewworlddotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/l_7832265fd11f4c67b9a0a83ba7084078.jpg

Breastaurants tuscl.net

Time Square Photo, but Kuala Lumpur ajlevan.theworldrace.org/blogphotos/theworldrace/ajlevan/kl_prostitutes1.jpg

Slut Wear tuscl.net

The System tuscl.net

Kudos to JS69 tuscl.net

San Francisco, open tongue girl kissing on stage tuscl.net

Overview of the Bay Area Scene tuscl.net

La Bamba (1987), Tijuana Brothel Scene, around 1958 youtu.be/E7IrVjS5NZA?t=1h16m7s

Floor Dance Tipping Interval? Mr. LDK tuscl.net

Malaysia Flight MH 370 tuscl.net

Terminal Identity amazon.com

Anti-Oedipus amazon.com

Strip Club Songs phoenixnewtimes.com

JS69's Thread tuscl.net

Neoliberalism and Tijuana Sex Work tuscl.net

Fayetteville North Carolina tuscl.net

No more Ford Vans, and Mexican Border Pussy, plus racist San Diego tuscl.net

Karl Marx tuscl.net

Talk about drugs tuscl.net

Talk about single versus married and being careful tuscl.net

Shailynn's Unemployment Thread tuscl.net

mandatory.com

China, funeral strippers blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/23/chinese-government-says-please-stop-hiring-funeral-strippers/

series of posts about an organization i am building tuscl.net

Alabegonz, some much needed words of sanity! tuscl.net

The Boom Of 2015 tuscl.net entirely fictional and any similarity to real persons living or dead is entirely conincidence

Jestrite50, as always, DFKing a hottie in the front room, followed by my own comment tuscl.net

question for SJG tuscl.net

Kick back money, and how people can do things in ethnic minority subcultures that they wouldn't otherwise dare do: tuscl.net

Discussion of AMPs and Trafficking tuscl.net

Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

More Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

Duke69, AMP story tuscl.net

Female Revolutionaries tuscl.net

First Lesson in Vietnamese tuscl.net

Capability Declines With Age? tuscl.net

Discussion of 'seductions' in AMPs, versus what can be done in civilian venues tuscl.net

Discussions of hand holding tuscl.net

Why lapdances are a chump's game tuscl.net

Rick Dugan, "The System" tuscl.net

SJG's Philosophy tuscl.net

substantial discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Preserved Threads:

The Great Society Programs did not go far enough. They were always compromised on behalf of upholding middle class values. In the case of Medicare, this meant a deal which was cut, instead of board determined fees, it was to be the customary physician's fees. It was this, the compromise with the doctors, which made Medicare into something which would prove to be unworkable.

The New Deal legislation brought us some of the best structural changes this country has ever seen. It's just that that was so long ago.

If we want working people to be able to earn a living and to be able to stay afloat, and I say that we have to want this, then we still need much deeper economic system reforms today than what we got with LBJ and The Great Society.

SJG

Dougster, "just making money" is an extremely political position to take. You are making that money off of other people. And you are using the existing rules of our society to do it, and those rules might not be fair. You are also using our existing infrastructure of transportation, banking, and courts too. You are using structures which already exist in order to keep many people down, and seem to be taking us in the direction of a two tier society.

Most all sorts of social programs are designed at least in part in order to humiliate the poor, and to turn them into a public spectacle. They almost have to be designed so, otherwise they would be giving out more money and benefit. What they give out is not enough to lift people out of poverty. But they most certainly do impose order in the working rank and file just above the welfare clients.

We have this going on here in San Jose. A big backer of these programs is the new Mayor of San Jose, Sam Liccardo. He sports all sorts of secular and religious charities aimed at the downtown homeless. They give out some benefits. But what they also do is make people submit to case management. So their affairs will now be open to interpretation by persons interested in breaking their spirit. If someone has grown up in an abusive environment, then letting others take the shattered factoids of their life and try to weave it into a story, will be the final act which guarantees that their abuses win. It is just like subjecting a rape victim to a second rape by telling her that you don't believer her, or that she caused it herself.

Liccardo supports these sorts of things, programs which pay far less than the minimum wage, first of all because he is part of a City Hall contingent committed to breaking the Public Employee Unions, particularly Police and Fire. He is also committed to making San Jose into an Urban Yuppie Utopia. This is what he believes in, and he is in bed with the big high rise developers. He is also a champion of charter schools, places which hire unqualified teachers and put kids on computerized drilling machines for much of the day. He wants to close the "achievement gap" by sending kids to schools that he would never dream of sending any kids of his own to.

stoprocketship.com

That most social programs are primarily intended to humiliate and regulate the poor, and turn them into a public spectacle in order to weaken the Labor Movement is demonstrated over and over in:

Francis Fox-Piven and Richard Cloward amazon.com

The first attempts to provide welfare in order to restrict pan-handling came about during the 1500's, at the very beginnings of Capitalism. The pan handling was socially disruptive. It was interfering with the wheels of progress. People were pan handling because they needed to be able to eat, and Capitalism causes dislocation. Less and less workers are actually needed, and they need to impose order and discipline in their existing labor force or it won't be willing to work at starvation wages anymore.

The idea of welfare goes back to the Roman Empire. It was simply a practical solution to a pressing need. It avoided revolution and kept the empire together. Welfare in the US started as AFDC with the 1935 Social Security Act. Although it is never been more than a few percent of the total budget of public expenditure, it has always been highly controversial. Many people seem to find the idea offensive.

What NY's Daniel Patrick Moynihan concluded was that welfare is simply the cheapest way to address poverty. Any more complex solution ends up costing more money. I think this is obvious.

But for myself, I know that the weakness of welfare is that people are letting themselves be made into objects of pity, instead of organizing and fighting back. Alcohol, drugs, born again Christianity, and psychiatric medication are also all used to keep the poor from organizing and fighting back.

I mean this insurance agent, if he really wanted to hire someone at low but fair wages to rake is leaves, I'm sure he could have found someone. But it sounds like he just wanted to rebuke the homeless man for panhandling. So of course the man was right to tell him where to stick it.

Those at the bottom are often forced to take itinerant forms of employment with pay less than a living wage, and even less than minimum wage. Often those at the bottom end up having to try and get income from people who don't even pay as agreed.

For myself, I am involved in various matters of public and community interest. I learned of one group which was feeding the homeless in a public park, but they make it part of a kind of a church service. The message they put out in this tax payer funded church service is that the homeless and the poor are responsible for their own plight because they don't accept Jesus and because instead of practicing forgiveness, they are "carrying stuff around with them." I also soon learned that most all of these church volunteers have designated scape goats within their own families. Usually it is one of their children. Sometimes it is a sibling. In this later case, what this means is that they side with the parents in their evaluation of this person. I also unearthed a man who had a huge emotional investment in blacksheeping his eldest daughter. He was currently charged with 6 felonies all pertaining to the sexual fondling of his daughters, and his whole church was standing with him and calling the girls liars.

Over the next two years I got heavily involved in this and played a large roll in getting this man convicted and put in San Quentin to serve a sentence which exceeds his life expectancy. And I am continuing to work to try and educate multiple city governments that it is wrong to trample on separation of church and state and to allow these religious pity and condemnation programs access to tax payer funded property. I am making progress.

I think GACAclub has the right way of seeing this. We have created an underclass. Moralizing at such persons solves nothing. We have to undo what we have done. And I am also saying that unredressed religious child abuse is a huge part of this.

And of course shortly after I joined TUSCL I too noticed right away how this condemnation of the underclass is reflected in the attitudes TUSCLer's show towards the very women they are paying money to for sex acts.

SJG

No one who really had a choice would want to live in the gutter. Part of the problem is that living wage work is not available to many people. There is just no way that some people would be the ones to get it. So they have to try and function with sub living wage off the books work, and maybe 50% of the time that means dealing with people who don't pay.

Lots of people will talk about having started with nothing. But why should that be a standard we try to hold people to? And also, the simple fact is that how well things go for people do depend entirely on their background, social background, economic background, and family background. So a young person may have "nothing", or this is what they say. But actually they have a lot going for them.

It is different for people when they are in middle age. They are looked at differently. Their social standing is different.

No one is going to want to throw their life into the garbage dumpster. I am convinced that anyone who lives in the gutter is there because somewhere along the way their social and civil standing were neutralized. So after that the pain of getting through even one day is just unbearable.

Problem is though, that most such people cannot obtain political consioucness. The pain is too great. Then you have local gov't in league with religious groups, you have the gov't funded mental health system and the probations system, and then you have motivationalists. All of these things work to tell people that they are the ones responsible for their dysfunctional lives. So there is no justice. And further, many of these same things are further propagated via child abuse.

The only remedy is always going to be political consciousness raising.

We have an underclass, but it is not created by social programs, it is created by Capitalism and by the institutions which protect Capitalism, like familyism.

SJG

Discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Jestrite50, about not busting a nut tuscl.net

How do we get US SC's up to the quality level of the Hong Kong Bar? For now I am setting aside the pricing difference as I see that as secondary. As I see it, the situation should be analyzed in two parts, the front room dynamic and the backroom dynamic. Please contribute what you can to this exploration: tuscl.net

Some recent threads and posts which are clearly relevant:

silkypants -> Real Time Update Detroit tuscl.net

GroovnHigh and TireTraveler -> First about an all GFE relationship started in Adelitas, then a great account of front room pussy play followed by retreating to a private room. This is the way it should be done, rather than talking about 'extras' and 'mileage' and letting a girl 'sell you dances'. tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Opens up a thread about lap dancing by talking about grope sessions. If this could get to DFK w/ FIV, then you've really got what I would consider to be the ideal, if it could be in the front room and before you have spent enough money to be committed to that girl. tuscl.net

Discussion of German FKK versus TJ, and why there could be a quality of experience difference because in TJ things probably go around the clock and so it could be easier and cheaper to spend more time with your girl. tuscl.net

Discussion about asking waitresses for information about dancers. I try to denounce this, saying that you shouldn't relate to any of the women in the SC by talking about 'extras' or 'mileage' or asking them to gossip about each other. Jestrite50, as only he can, explains how it should be done, dealing with each woman in her own right. tuscl.net

And here, Shadowcat opens a thread right. It was about dancers living in motels. Having motel access is a key to getting HK backroom quality. Shadow cat speaks of a place in South Carolina where he was getting takeout without even going to the SC. tuscl.net

Discussion of Aphrodite's Lingerie Party, in Portland, and why this sort of venue is inherently inferior to an SC. tuscl.net

How strip clubs fall short of their potential: tuscl.net

But so long as people are going to walk into strip clubs and ask dancers, "Do you do extras?" Or they ask dancers which other dancer does good extras, or they even ask waitresses, and in general treat them all like prositutes, or even as vending machines, then all of this discussion will remain throwing pearls before swine. tuscl.net

Long term resident San Jose, CA, familiar with Sunnyvale and San Jose clubs. These are strictly hands off, so it is verbal flirting only. This type of flirting has played a key role in my own development. Knowledge of the history of San Francisco clubs and with the origins of lap dancing, and some familiarity with the clubs as they have evolved since. Long term reader of the Spectator newspaper, until it went under. Familiar with underground Mexican bar table dancing network. This has been tremendous fun! Also intimately familiar with AMPs and AAMPs and the social structures which support them, from all vantage points. My life objective is not to live as a Pathetic Loser, but to live like King Herod the Great.

sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

strip-club-news.blogspot.com/

On JS69's marriage thread: tuscl.net

Duke69, shows us how to club, how to make it happen with dolled up young hotties, starting in the front room, instead of just letting them sell you dances and letting your money get fed to the house and dealing with dissociated losers performing acts upon you. My hat goes off to Duke69, as he has shown us how clubbing should be. tuscl.net

Lena's Feng Shui blog lenasmirnova2013.blogspot.co.uk/

tuscl.net There have been many threads about kissing in SC's. As I see it, you want to make it as natural as possible, and so you want to do it in a way which gives you the initiative. Always treat your girl as a civilian. You want to do it this way to show your favorite dancer that you can be assertive and that you like her. Kissing is one of the best ways to get a woman to open up to you physically and psychologically. So there is no reason to wait until she is in the dance booth or the VIP room. Try and get her kissing you right in the main room. Mostly it's just a matter of learning how to do it nicely. You can give her sitting tips as appropriate to extend your front room time with her. To continue into the dance booth or the VIP Room, you want to get her off script, so that she is not providing some special service to you, standing over you and being a moving target, but instead she is sitting on your lap, straddling your thigh, or something like this. You want it to be on your initiative, and kissing is a great way to establish this. Really, no reason to take to the VIP Room until your pants are going to be coming down. Do as much as possible in the front room, and for sitting tips.

I told someone before who was going to S.F. to try and get a Crazy Horse dancer open tongue kissing while she is on stage. This could be a way of beating a clip joint.

And @JS69, yes Donna in the purple dress and I did a great deal of intense kissing, as we would in a subsequent session too. She was really tickled that I came in there and insisted upon her, just because I saw her outside washing her car. But we also did great FS too. But it would not be until some later years that I really learned how to use positions and rhythms to give exceptional FS. There is more I plan to write about Donna.

I think some people don't want to kiss strippers because they don't really like them. They just want that endorphin rush from ejaculation. Or they have one set of girls to look at, and then another to pay for doing "extras". I think this is really sad.

I think some others just haven't yet used their time in SC's to learn how to talk to women, and how to let them open up.

Others, I think they want to be like Howard Hughes in his later years, living on the top floor of a hotel, all the furniture covered, no one can touch him, and all his food and drink sterilized. The man was nuts. Studies have been done with mononucleosis. It is not transmitted by kissing, that is just folklore.

I read in a book about Mexican culture that in their SC's, if they like a dancer, the first thing they do is kiss her.

Duke69, Real Talk, kissing and talking with your girl are the best way to get to know her! tuscl.net

Duke69, how and when to "just ask" time"ing is everything tuscl.net

Jestrite50, lap siting and kissing tuscl.net

Shadowcat's Kissing thread tuscl.net

VIP Room Kissing tuscl.net

Jestrite50, the master himself speaks! tuscl.net

Duke69 on Jestrite50 tuscl.net

Not Another Kissing Thread, BBJames tuscl.net

Kissing thread with twist, BBJames tuscl.net

Portland, Aphrodite's Hot Lingerie Party This place is set up to offer you more in the backroom than the local SC's, obviously or else there would be no reason to go there. But to make it nice you need to learn how to work it some, make it playful and show good intent and maybe offer some initial lobby tips, and get to see the girls and get them giddy with anticipation, and get your favorite girl DKFing you in the front lobby. It should be doable. tuscl.net

Jestrite50 and two shot girls tuscl.net

my reply on noreallyme's swing club thread, about my own marriage tuscl.net

PhantomGeek -> enjoyable DFK which led to some time in the VIP and a lot more DFK tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Watch to see what king of mileage the other customers are getting at the table tuscl.net

Club_Goer -> Reliable Strippers youtube.com

Hooters, Beijing youtube.com

san_jose_guy Joined June 2014

Last Seen September 2015

Reviews 0 Articles 0 Discussions 37 Comments 2,958 Reviewed Clubs 0

SJG Portal: sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

Nice Guys tuscl.net

Join the Revolution sjg-rheinbach.de

Chicago Club photo, and other photos, including San Diego's trains flickr.com

Real TJ, video youtube.com

Philosophy for Handling Strip Clubs, and about Never Letting Girls Sell You Dances tuscl.net

More of My Philosophy tuscl.net

Philly Hole in the Wall Clubs tuscl.net

About Born Again Christianity and Hard Living Sorts tuscl.net

Shadowcat, Making Out w/ Strippers tuscl.net

Siemens to build 35 new diesel electric locomotives at it's Sacramento plant. bizjournals.com

Contraception and STD Prevention Research guttmacher.org

Nice Guys cavemancircus.com/2011/10/24/nice-guy-syndrome-what-it-is-and-why-you-should-kill-it-with-fire/

How to find out how good a dancer is in the VIP/Room, or, why not front room friendliness? tuscl.net

How To Pay Hookers For Sex, television program tuscl.net

Why, at a place like the Sunnyvale Brass Rail, you need to study and work The System tuscl.net

The Importance of Not Treating Strippers Like Strippers tuscl.net

High Performance Magnets, U Alabama mint.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/MINT-G8-Abstract-Combined.pdf

A surprise meeting in Time Square tuscl.net

Why Front Room Friendliness Is So Important and Why Dancers Make More Money This Way tuscl.net

Boom of 2015 Part 1 tuscl.net

Part 2 tuscl.net

Coffee Girls thebravenewworlddotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/l_7832265fd11f4c67b9a0a83ba7084078.jpg

Breastaurants tuscl.net

Time Square Photo, but Kuala Lumpur ajlevan.theworldrace.org/blogphotos/theworldrace/ajlevan/kl_prostitutes1.jpg

Slut Wear tuscl.net

The System tuscl.net

Kudos to JS69 tuscl.net

San Francisco, open tongue girl kissing on stage tuscl.net

Overview of the Bay Area Scene tuscl.net

La Bamba (1987), Tijuana Brothel Scene, around 1958 youtu.be/E7IrVjS5NZA?t=1h16m7s

Floor Dance Tipping Interval? Mr. LDK tuscl.net

Malaysia Flight MH 370 tuscl.net

Terminal Identity amazon.com

Anti-Oedipus amazon.com

Strip Club Songs phoenixnewtimes.com

JS69's Thread tuscl.net

Neoliberalism and Tijuana Sex Work tuscl.net

Fayetteville North Carolina tuscl.net

No more Ford Vans, and Mexican Border Pussy, plus racist San Diego tuscl.net

Karl Marx tuscl.net

Talk about drugs tuscl.net

Talk about single versus married and being careful tuscl.net

Shailynn's Unemployment Thread tuscl.net

mandatory.com

China, funeral strippers blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/23/chinese-government-says-please-stop-hiring-funeral-strippers/

series of posts about an organization i am building tuscl.net

Alabegonz, some much needed words of sanity! tuscl.net

The Boom Of 2015 tuscl.net entirely fictional and any similarity to real persons living or dead is entirely conincidence

Jestrite50, as always, DFKing a hottie in the front room, followed by my own comment tuscl.net

question for SJG tuscl.net

Kick back money, and how people can do things in ethnic minority subcultures that they wouldn't otherwise dare do: tuscl.net

Discussion of AMPs and Trafficking tuscl.net

Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

More Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

Duke69, AMP story tuscl.net

Female Revolutionaries tuscl.net

First Lesson in Vietnamese tuscl.net

Capability Declines With Age? tuscl.net

Discussion of 'seductions' in AMPs, versus what can be done in civilian venues tuscl.net

Discussions of hand holding tuscl.net

Why lapdances are a chump's game tuscl.net

Rick Dugan, "The System" tuscl.net

SJG's Philosophy tuscl.net

substantial discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Preserved Threads:

The Great Society Programs did not go far enough. They were always compromised on behalf of upholding middle class values. In the case of Medicare, this meant a deal which was cut, instead of board determined fees, it was to be the customary physician's fees. It was this, the compromise with the doctors, which made Medicare into something which would prove to be unworkable.

The New Deal legislation brought us some of the best structural changes this country has ever seen. It's just that that was so long ago.

If we want working people to be able to earn a living and to be able to stay afloat, and I say that we have to want this, then we still need much deeper economic system reforms today than what we got with LBJ and The Great Society.

SJG

Dougster, "just making money" is an extremely political position to take. You are making that money off of other people. And you are using the existing rules of our society to do it, and those rules might not be fair. You are also using our existing infrastructure of transportation, banking, and courts too. You are using structures which already exist in order to keep many people down, and seem to be taking us in the direction of a two tier society.

Most all sorts of social programs are designed at least in part in order to humiliate the poor, and to turn them into a public spectacle. They almost have to be designed so, otherwise they would be giving out more money and benefit. What they give out is not enough to lift people out of poverty. But they most certainly do impose order in the working rank and file just above the welfare clients.

We have this going on here in San Jose. A big backer of these programs is the new Mayor of San Jose, Sam Liccardo. He sports all sorts of secular and religious charities aimed at the downtown homeless. They give out some benefits. But what they also do is make people submit to case management. So their affairs will now be open to interpretation by persons interested in breaking their spirit. If someone has grown up in an abusive environment, then letting others take the shattered factoids of their life and try to weave it into a story, will be the final act which guarantees that their abuses win. It is just like subjecting a rape victim to a second rape by telling her that you don't believer her, or that she caused it herself.

Liccardo supports these sorts of things, programs which pay far less than the minimum wage, first of all because he is part of a City Hall contingent committed to breaking the Public Employee Unions, particularly Police and Fire. He is also committed to making San Jose into an Urban Yuppie Utopia. This is what he believes in, and he is in bed with the big high rise developers. He is also a champion of charter schools, places which hire unqualified teachers and put kids on computerized drilling machines for much of the day. He wants to close the "achievement gap" by sending kids to schools that he would never dream of sending any kids of his own to.

stoprocketship.com

That most social programs are primarily intended to humiliate and regulate the poor, and turn them into a public spectacle in order to weaken the Labor Movement is demonstrated over and over in:

Francis Fox-Piven and Richard Cloward amazon.com

The first attempts to provide welfare in order to restrict pan-handling came about during the 1500's, at the very beginnings of Capitalism. The pan handling was socially disruptive. It was interfering with the wheels of progress. People were pan handling because they needed to be able to eat, and Capitalism causes dislocation. Less and less workers are actually needed, and they need to impose order and discipline in their existing labor force or it won't be willing to work at starvation wages anymore.

The idea of welfare goes back to the Roman Empire. It was simply a practical solution to a pressing need. It avoided revolution and kept the empire together. Welfare in the US started as AFDC with the 1935 Social Security Act. Although it is never been more than a few percent of the total budget of public expenditure, it has always been highly controversial. Many people seem to find the idea offensive.

What NY's Daniel Patrick Moynihan concluded was that welfare is simply the cheapest way to address poverty. Any more complex solution ends up costing more money. I think this is obvious.

But for myself, I know that the weakness of welfare is that people are letting themselves be made into objects of pity, instead of organizing and fighting back. Alcohol, drugs, born again Christianity, and psychiatric medication are also all used to keep the poor from organizing and fighting back.

I mean this insurance agent, if he really wanted to hire someone at low but fair wages to rake is leaves, I'm sure he could have found someone. But it sounds like he just wanted to rebuke the homeless man for panhandling. So of course the man was right to tell him where to stick it.

Those at the bottom are often forced to take itinerant forms of employment with pay less than a living wage, and even less than minimum wage. Often those at the bottom end up having to try and get income from people who don't even pay as agreed.

For myself, I am involved in various matters of public and community interest. I learned of one group which was feeding the homeless in a public park, but they make it part of a kind of a church service. The message they put out in this tax payer funded church service is that the homeless and the poor are responsible for their own plight because they don't accept Jesus and because instead of practicing forgiveness, they are "carrying stuff around with them." I also soon learned that most all of these church volunteers have designated scape goats within their own families. Usually it is one of their children. Sometimes it is a sibling. In this later case, what this means is that they side with the parents in their evaluation of this person. I also unearthed a man who had a huge emotional investment in blacksheeping his eldest daughter. He was currently charged with 6 felonies all pertaining to the sexual fondling of his daughters, and his whole church was standing with him and calling the girls liars.

Over the next two years I got heavily involved in this and played a large roll in getting this man convicted and put in San Quentin to serve a sentence which exceeds his life expectancy. And I am continuing to work to try and educate multiple city governments that it is wrong to trample on separation of church and state and to allow these religious pity and condemnation programs access to tax payer funded property. I am making progress.

I think GACAclub has the right way of seeing this. We have created an underclass. Moralizing at such persons solves nothing. We have to undo what we have done. And I am also saying that unredressed religious child abuse is a huge part of this.

And of course shortly after I joined TUSCL I too noticed right away how this condemnation of the underclass is reflected in the attitudes TUSCLer's show towards the very women they are paying money to for sex acts.

SJG

No one who really had a choice would want to live in the gutter. Part of the problem is that living wage work is not available to many people. There is just no way that some people would be the ones to get it. So they have to try and function with sub living wage off the books work, and maybe 50% of the time that means dealing with people who don't pay.

Lots of people will talk about having started with nothing. But why should that be a standard we try to hold people to? And also, the simple fact is that how well things go for people do depend entirely on their background, social background, economic background, and family background. So a young person may have "nothing", or this is what they say. But actually they have a lot going for them.

It is different for people when they are in middle age. They are looked at differently. Their social standing is different.

No one is going to want to throw their life into the garbage dumpster. I am convinced that anyone who lives in the gutter is there because somewhere along the way their social and civil standing were neutralized. So after that the pain of getting through even one day is just unbearable.

Problem is though, that most such people cannot obtain political consioucness. The pain is too great. Then you have local gov't in league with religious groups, you have the gov't funded mental health system and the probations system, and then you have motivationalists. All of these things work to tell people that they are the ones responsible for their dysfunctional lives. So there is no justice. And further, many of these same things are further propagated via child abuse.

The only remedy is always going to be political consciousness raising.

We have an underclass, but it is not created by social programs, it is created by Capitalism and by the institutions which protect Capitalism, like familyism.

SJG

Discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Jestrite50, about not busting a nut tuscl.net

How do we get US SC's up to the quality level of the Hong Kong Bar? For now I am setting aside the pricing difference as I see that as secondary. As I see it, the situation should be analyzed in two parts, the front room dynamic and the backroom dynamic. Please contribute what you can to this exploration: tuscl.net

Some recent threads and posts which are clearly relevant:

silkypants -> Real Time Update Detroit tuscl.net

GroovnHigh and TireTraveler -> First about an all GFE relationship started in Adelitas, then a great account of front room pussy play followed by retreating to a private room. This is the way it should be done, rather than talking about 'extras' and 'mileage' and letting a girl 'sell you dances'. tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Opens up a thread about lap dancing by talking about grope sessions. If this could get to DFK w/ FIV, then you've really got what I would consider to be the ideal, if it could be in the front room and before you have spent enough money to be committed to that girl. tuscl.net

Discussion of German FKK versus TJ, and why there could be a quality of experience difference because in TJ things probably go around the clock and so it could be easier and cheaper to spend more time with your girl. tuscl.net

Discussion about asking waitresses for information about dancers. I try to denounce this, saying that you shouldn't relate to any of the women in the SC by talking about 'extras' or 'mileage' or asking them to gossip about each other. Jestrite50, as only he can, explains how it should be done, dealing with each woman in her own right. tuscl.net

And here, Shadowcat opens a thread right. It was about dancers living in motels. Having motel access is a key to getting HK backroom quality. Shadow cat speaks of a place in South Carolina where he was getting takeout without even going to the SC. tuscl.net

Discussion of Aphrodite's Lingerie Party, in Portland, and why this sort of venue is inherently inferior to an SC. tuscl.net

How strip clubs fall short of their potential: tuscl.net

But so long as people are going to walk into strip clubs and ask dancers, "Do you do extras?" Or they ask dancers which other dancer does good extras, or they even ask waitresses, and in general treat them all like prositutes, or even as vending machines, then all of this discussion will remain throwing pearls before swine. tuscl.net

Long term resident San Jose, CA, familiar with Sunnyvale and San Jose clubs. These are strictly hands off, so it is verbal flirting only. This type of flirting has played a key role in my own development. Knowledge of the history of San Francisco clubs and with the origins of lap dancing, and some familiarity with the clubs as they have evolved since. Long term reader of the Spectator newspaper, until it went under. Familiar with underground Mexican bar table dancing network. This has been tremendous fun! Also intimately familiar with AMPs and AAMPs and the social structures which support them, from all vantage points. My life objective is not to live as a Pathetic Loser, but to live like King Herod the Great.

sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

strip-club-news.blogspot.com/

On JS69's marriage thread: tuscl.net

Duke69, shows us how to club, how to make it happen with dolled up young hotties, starting in the front room, instead of just letting them sell you dances and letting your money get fed to the house and dealing with dissociated losers performing acts upon you. My hat goes off to Duke69, as he has shown us how clubbing should be. tuscl.net

Lena's Feng Shui blog lenasmirnova2013.blogspot.co.uk/

tuscl.net There have been many threads about kissing in SC's. As I see it, you want to make it as natural as possible, and so you want to do it in a way which gives you the initiative. Always treat your girl as a civilian. You want to do it this way to show your favorite dancer that you can be assertive and that you like her. Kissing is one of the best ways to get a woman to open up to you physically and psychologically. So there is no reason to wait until she is in the dance booth or the VIP room. Try and get her kissing you right in the main room. Mostly it's just a matter of learning how to do it nicely. You can give her sitting tips as appropriate to extend your front room time with her. To continue into the dance booth or the VIP Room, you want to get her off script, so that she is not providing some special service to you, standing over you and being a moving target, but instead she is sitting on your lap, straddling your thigh, or something like this. You want it to be on your initiative, and kissing is a great way to establish this. Really, no reason to take to the VIP Room until your pants are going to be coming down. Do as much as possible in the front room, and for sitting tips.

I told someone before who was going to S.F. to try and get a Crazy Horse dancer open tongue kissing while she is on stage. This could be a way of beating a clip joint.

And @JS69, yes Donna in the purple dress and I did a great deal of intense kissing, as we would in a subsequent session too. She was really tickled that I came in there and insisted upon her, just because I saw her outside washing her car. But we also did great FS too. But it would not be until some later years that I really learned how to use positions and rhythms to give exceptional FS. There is more I plan to write about Donna.

I think some people don't want to kiss strippers because they don't really like them. They just want that endorphin rush from ejaculation. Or they have one set of girls to look at, and then another to pay for doing "extras". I think this is really sad.

I think some others just haven't yet used their time in SC's to learn how to talk to women, and how to let them open up.

Others, I think they want to be like Howard Hughes in his later years, living on the top floor of a hotel, all the furniture covered, no one can touch him, and all his food and drink sterilized. The man was nuts. Studies have been done with mononucleosis. It is not transmitted by kissing, that is just folklore.

I read in a book about Mexican culture that in their SC's, if they like a dancer, the first thing they do is kiss her.

Duke69, Real Talk, kissing and talking with your girl are the best way to get to know her! tuscl.net

Duke69, how and when to "just ask" time"ing is everything tuscl.net

Jestrite50, lap siting and kissing tuscl.net

Shadowcat's Kissing thread tuscl.net

VIP Room Kissing tuscl.net

Jestrite50, the master himself speaks! tuscl.net

Duke69 on Jestrite50 tuscl.net

Not Another Kissing Thread, BBJames tuscl.net

Kissing thread with twist, BBJames tuscl.net

Portland, Aphrodite's Hot Lingerie Party This place is set up to offer you more in the backroom than the local SC's, obviously or else there would be no reason to go there. But to make it nice you need to learn how to work it some, make it playful and show good intent and maybe offer some initial lobby tips, and get to see the girls and get them giddy with anticipation, and get your favorite girl DKFing you in the front lobby. It should be doable. tuscl.net

Jestrite50 and two shot girls tuscl.net

my reply on noreallyme's swing club thread, about my own marriage tuscl.net

PhantomGeek -> enjoyable DFK which led to some time in the VIP and a lot more DFK tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Watch to see what king of mileage the other customers are getting at the table tuscl.net

Club_Goer -> Reliable Strippers youtube.com

Hooters, Beijing youtube.com

san_jose_guy Joined June 2014

Last Seen September 2015

Reviews 0 Articles 0 Discussions 37 Comments 2,958 Reviewed Clubs 0

SJG Portal: sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

Nice Guys tuscl.net

Join the Revolution sjg-rheinbach.de

Chicago Club photo, and other photos, including San Diego's trains flickr.com

Real TJ, video youtube.com

Philosophy for Handling Strip Clubs, and about Never Letting Girls Sell You Dances tuscl.net

More of My Philosophy tuscl.net

Philly Hole in the Wall Clubs tuscl.net

About Born Again Christianity and Hard Living Sorts tuscl.net

Shadowcat, Making Out w/ Strippers tuscl.net

Siemens to build 35 new diesel electric locomotives at it's Sacramento plant. bizjournals.com

Contraception and STD Prevention Research guttmacher.org

Nice Guys cavemancircus.com/2011/10/24/nice-guy-syndrome-what-it-is-and-why-you-should-kill-it-with-fire/

How to find out how good a dancer is in the VIP/Room, or, why not front room friendliness? tuscl.net

How To Pay Hookers For Sex, television program tuscl.net

Why, at a place like the Sunnyvale Brass Rail, you need to study and work The System tuscl.net

The Importance of Not Treating Strippers Like Strippers tuscl.net

High Performance Magnets, U Alabama mint.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/MINT-G8-Abstract-Combined.pdf

A surprise meeting in Time Square tuscl.net

Why Front Room Friendliness Is So Important and Why Dancers Make More Money This Way tuscl.net

Boom of 2015 Part 1 tuscl.net

Part 2 tuscl.net

Coffee Girls thebravenewworlddotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/l_7832265fd11f4c67b9a0a83ba7084078.jpg

Breastaurants tuscl.net

Time Square Photo, but Kuala Lumpur ajlevan.theworldrace.org/blogphotos/theworldrace/ajlevan/kl_prostitutes1.jpg

Slut Wear tuscl.net

The System tuscl.net

Kudos to JS69 tuscl.net

San Francisco, open tongue girl kissing on stage tuscl.net

Overview of the Bay Area Scene tuscl.net

La Bamba (1987), Tijuana Brothel Scene, around 1958 youtu.be/E7IrVjS5NZA?t=1h16m7s

Floor Dance Tipping Interval? Mr. LDK tuscl.net

Malaysia Flight MH 370 tuscl.net

Terminal Identity amazon.com

Anti-Oedipus amazon.com

Strip Club Songs phoenixnewtimes.com

JS69's Thread tuscl.net

Neoliberalism and Tijuana Sex Work tuscl.net

Fayetteville North Carolina tuscl.net

No more Ford Vans, and Mexican Border Pussy, plus racist San Diego tuscl.net

Karl Marx tuscl.net

Talk about drugs tuscl.net

Talk about single versus married and being careful tuscl.net

Shailynn's Unemployment Thread tuscl.net

mandatory.com

China, funeral strippers blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/23/chinese-government-says-please-stop-hiring-funeral-strippers/

series of posts about an organization i am building tuscl.net

Alabegonz, some much needed words of sanity! tuscl.net

The Boom Of 2015 tuscl.net entirely fictional and any similarity to real persons living or dead is entirely conincidence

Jestrite50, as always, DFKing a hottie in the front room, followed by my own comment tuscl.net

question for SJG tuscl.net

Kick back money, and how people can do things in ethnic minority subcultures that they wouldn't otherwise dare do: tuscl.net

Discussion of AMPs and Trafficking tuscl.net

Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

More Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

Duke69, AMP story tuscl.net

Female Revolutionaries tuscl.net

First Lesson in Vietnamese tuscl.net

Capability Declines With Age? tuscl.net

Discussion of 'seductions' in AMPs, versus what can be done in civilian venues tuscl.net

Discussions of hand holding tuscl.net

Why lapdances are a chump's game tuscl.net

Rick Dugan, "The System" tuscl.net

SJG's Philosophy tuscl.net

substantial discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Preserved Threads:

The Great Society Programs did not go far enough. They were always compromised on behalf of upholding middle class values. In the case of Medicare, this meant a deal which was cut, instead of board determined fees, it was to be the customary physician's fees. It was this, the compromise with the doctors, which made Medicare into something which would prove to be unworkable.

The New Deal legislation brought us some of the best structural changes this country has ever seen. It's just that that was so long ago.

If we want working people to be able to earn a living and to be able to stay afloat, and I say that we have to want this, then we still need much deeper economic system reforms today than what we got with LBJ and The Great Society.

SJG

Dougster, "just making money" is an extremely political position to take. You are making that money off of other people. And you are using the existing rules of our society to do it, and those rules might not be fair. You are also using our existing infrastructure of transportation, banking, and courts too. You are using structures which already exist in order to keep many people down, and seem to be taking us in the direction of a two tier society.

Most all sorts of social programs are designed at least in part in order to humiliate the poor, and to turn them into a public spectacle. They almost have to be designed so, otherwise they would be giving out more money and benefit. What they give out is not enough to lift people out of poverty. But they most certainly do impose order in the working rank and file just above the welfare clients.

We have this going on here in San Jose. A big backer of these programs is the new Mayor of San Jose, Sam Liccardo. He sports all sorts of secular and religious charities aimed at the downtown homeless. They give out some benefits. But what they also do is make people submit to case management. So their affairs will now be open to interpretation by persons interested in breaking their spirit. If someone has grown up in an abusive environment, then letting others take the shattered factoids of their life and try to weave it into a story, will be the final act which guarantees that their abuses win. It is just like subjecting a rape victim to a second rape by telling her that you don't believer her, or that she caused it herself.

Liccardo supports these sorts of things, programs which pay far less than the minimum wage, first of all because he is part of a City Hall contingent committed to breaking the Public Employee Unions, particularly Police and Fire. He is also committed to making San Jose into an Urban Yuppie Utopia. This is what he believes in, and he is in bed with the big high rise developers. He is also a champion of charter schools, places which hire unqualified teachers and put kids on computerized drilling machines for much of the day. He wants to close the "achievement gap" by sending kids to schools that he would never dream of sending any kids of his own to.

stoprocketship.com

That most social programs are primarily intended to humiliate and regulate the poor, and turn them into a public spectacle in order to weaken the Labor Movement is demonstrated over and over in:

Francis Fox-Piven and Richard Cloward amazon.com

The first attempts to provide welfare in order to restrict pan-handling came about during the 1500's, at the very beginnings of Capitalism. The pan handling was socially disruptive. It was interfering with the wheels of progress. People were pan handling because they needed to be able to eat, and Capitalism causes dislocation. Less and less workers are actually needed, and they need to impose order and discipline in their existing labor force or it won't be willing to work at starvation wages anymore.

The idea of welfare goes back to the Roman Empire. It was simply a practical solution to a pressing need. It avoided revolution and kept the empire together. Welfare in the US started as AFDC with the 1935 Social Security Act. Although it is never been more than a few percent of the total budget of public expenditure, it has always been highly controversial. Many people seem to find the idea offensive.

What NY's Daniel Patrick Moynihan concluded was that welfare is simply the cheapest way to address poverty. Any more complex solution ends up costing more money. I think this is obvious.

But for myself, I know that the weakness of welfare is that people are letting themselves be made into objects of pity, instead of organizing and fighting back. Alcohol, drugs, born again Christianity, and psychiatric medication are also all used to keep the poor from organizing and fighting back.

I mean this insurance agent, if he really wanted to hire someone at low but fair wages to rake is leaves, I'm sure he could have found someone. But it sounds like he just wanted to rebuke the homeless man for panhandling. So of course the man was right to tell him where to stick it.

Those at the bottom are often forced to take itinerant forms of employment with pay less than a living wage, and even less than minimum wage. Often those at the bottom end up having to try and get income from people who don't even pay as agreed.

For myself, I am involved in various matters of public and community interest. I learned of one group which was feeding the homeless in a public park, but they make it part of a kind of a church service. The message they put out in this tax payer funded church service is that the homeless and the poor are responsible for their own plight because they don't accept Jesus and because instead of practicing forgiveness, they are "carrying stuff around with them." I also soon learned that most all of these church volunteers have designated scape goats within their own families. Usually it is one of their children. Sometimes it is a sibling. In this later case, what this means is that they side with the parents in their evaluation of this person. I also unearthed a man who had a huge emotional investment in blacksheeping his eldest daughter. He was currently charged with 6 felonies all pertaining to the sexual fondling of his daughters, and his whole church was standing with him and calling the girls liars.

Over the next two years I got heavily involved in this and played a large roll in getting this man convicted and put in San Quentin to serve a sentence which exceeds his life expectancy. And I am continuing to work to try and educate multiple city governments that it is wrong to trample on separation of church and state and to allow these religious pity and condemnation programs access to tax payer funded property. I am making progress.

I think GACAclub has the right way of seeing this. We have created an underclass. Moralizing at such persons solves nothing. We have to undo what we have done. And I am also saying that unredressed religious child abuse is a huge part of this.

And of course shortly after I joined TUSCL I too noticed right away how this condemnation of the underclass is reflected in the attitudes TUSCLer's show towards the very women they are paying money to for sex acts.

SJG

No one who really had a choice would want to live in the gutter. Part of the problem is that living wage work is not available to many people. There is just no way that some people would be the ones to get it. So they have to try and function with sub living wage off the books work, and maybe 50% of the time that means dealing with people who don't pay.

Lots of people will talk about having started with nothing. But why should that be a standard we try to hold people to? And also, the simple fact is that how well things go for people do depend entirely on their background, social background, economic background, and family background. So a young person may have "nothing", or this is what they say. But actually they have a lot going for them.

It is different for people when they are in middle age. They are looked at differently. Their social standing is different.

No one is going to want to throw their life into the garbage dumpster. I am convinced that anyone who lives in the gutter is there because somewhere along the way their social and civil standing were neutralized. So after that the pain of getting through even one day is just unbearable.

Problem is though, that most such people cannot obtain political consioucness. The pain is too great. Then you have local gov't in league with religious groups, you have the gov't funded mental health system and the probations system, and then you have motivationalists. All of these things work to tell people that they are the ones responsible for their dysfunctional lives. So there is no justice. And further, many of these same things are further propagated via child abuse.

The only remedy is always going to be political consciousness raising.

We have an underclass, but it is not created by social programs, it is created by Capitalism and by the institutions which protect Capitalism, like familyism.

SJG

Discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Jestrite50, about not busting a nut tuscl.net

How do we get US SC's up to the quality level of the Hong Kong Bar? For now I am setting aside the pricing difference as I see that as secondary. As I see it, the situation should be analyzed in two parts, the front room dynamic and the backroom dynamic. Please contribute what you can to this exploration: tuscl.net

Some recent threads and posts which are clearly relevant:

silkypants -> Real Time Update Detroit tuscl.net

GroovnHigh and TireTraveler -> First about an all GFE relationship started in Adelitas, then a great account of front room pussy play followed by retreating to a private room. This is the way it should be done, rather than talking about 'extras' and 'mileage' and letting a girl 'sell you dances'. tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Opens up a thread about lap dancing by talking about grope sessions. If this could get to DFK w/ FIV, then you've really got what I would consider to be the ideal, if it could be in the front room and before you have spent enough money to be committed to that girl. tuscl.net

Discussion of German FKK versus TJ, and why there could be a quality of experience difference because in TJ things probably go around the clock and so it could be easier and cheaper to spend more time with your girl. tuscl.net

Discussion about asking waitresses for information about dancers. I try to denounce this, saying that you shouldn't relate to any of the women in the SC by talking about 'extras' or 'mileage' or asking them to gossip about each other. Jestrite50, as only he can, explains how it should be done, dealing with each woman in her own right. tuscl.net

And here, Shadowcat opens a thread right. It was about dancers living in motels. Having motel access is a key to getting HK backroom quality. Shadow cat speaks of a place in South Carolina where he was getting takeout without even going to the SC. tuscl.net

Discussion of Aphrodite's Lingerie Party, in Portland, and why this sort of venue is inherently inferior to an SC. tuscl.net

How strip clubs fall short of their potential: tuscl.net

But so long as people are going to walk into strip clubs and ask dancers, "Do you do extras?" Or they ask dancers which other dancer does good extras, or they even ask waitresses, and in general treat them all like prositutes, or even as vending machines, then all of this discussion will remain throwing pearls before swine. tuscl.net

Long term resident San Jose, CA, familiar with Sunnyvale and San Jose clubs. These are strictly hands off, so it is verbal flirting only. This type of flirting has played a key role in my own development. Knowledge of the history of San Francisco clubs and with the origins of lap dancing, and some familiarity with the clubs as they have evolved since. Long term reader of the Spectator newspaper, until it went under. Familiar with underground Mexican bar table dancing network. This has been tremendous fun! Also intimately familiar with AMPs and AAMPs and the social structures which support them, from all vantage points. My life objective is not to live as a Pathetic Loser, but to live like King Herod the Great.

sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

strip-club-news.blogspot.com/

On JS69's marriage thread: tuscl.net

Duke69, shows us how to club, how to make it happen with dolled up young hotties, starting in the front room, instead of just letting them sell you dances and letting your money get fed to the house and dealing with dissociated losers performing acts upon you. My hat goes off to Duke69, as he has shown us how clubbing should be. tuscl.net

Lena's Feng Shui blog lenasmirnova2013.blogspot.co.uk/

tuscl.net There have been many threads about kissing in SC's. As I see it, you want to make it as natural as possible, and so you want to do it in a way which gives you the initiative. Always treat your girl as a civilian. You want to do it this way to show your favorite dancer that you can be assertive and that you like her. Kissing is one of the best ways to get a woman to open up to you physically and psychologically. So there is no reason to wait until she is in the dance booth or the VIP room. Try and get her kissing you right in the main room. Mostly it's just a matter of learning how to do it nicely. You can give her sitting tips as appropriate to extend your front room time with her. To continue into the dance booth or the VIP Room, you want to get her off script, so that she is not providing some special service to you, standing over you and being a moving target, but instead she is sitting on your lap, straddling your thigh, or something like this. You want it to be on your initiative, and kissing is a great way to establish this. Really, no reason to take to the VIP Room until your pants are going to be coming down. Do as much as possible in the front room, and for sitting tips.

I told someone before who was going to S.F. to try and get a Crazy Horse dancer open tongue kissing while she is on stage. This could be a way of beating a clip joint.

And @JS69, yes Donna in the purple dress and I did a great deal of intense kissing, as we would in a subsequent session too. She was really tickled that I came in there and insisted upon her, just because I saw her outside washing her car. But we also did great FS too. But it would not be until some later years that I really learned how to use positions and rhythms to give exceptional FS. There is more I plan to write about Donna.

I think some people don't want to kiss strippers because they don't really like them. They just want that endorphin rush from ejaculation. Or they have one set of girls to look at, and then another to pay for doing "extras". I think this is really sad.

I think some others just haven't yet used their time in SC's to learn how to talk to women, and how to let them open up.

Others, I think they want to be like Howard Hughes in his later years, living on the top floor of a hotel, all the furniture covered, no one can touch him, and all his food and drink sterilized. The man was nuts. Studies have been done with mononucleosis. It is not transmitted by kissing, that is just folklore.

I read in a book about Mexican culture that in their SC's, if they like a dancer, the first thing they do is kiss her.

Duke69, Real Talk, kissing and talking with your girl are the best way to get to know her! tuscl.net

Duke69, how and when to "just ask" time"ing is everything tuscl.net

Jestrite50, lap siting and kissing tuscl.net

Shadowcat's Kissing thread tuscl.net

VIP Room Kissing tuscl.net

Jestrite50, the master himself speaks! tuscl.net

Duke69 on Jestrite50 tuscl.net

Not Another Kissing Thread, BBJames tuscl.net

Kissing thread with twist, BBJames tuscl.net

Portland, Aphrodite's Hot Lingerie Party This place is set up to offer you more in the backroom than the local SC's, obviously or else there would be no reason to go there. But to make it nice you need to learn how to work it some, make it playful and show good intent and maybe offer some initial lobby tips, and get to see the girls and get them giddy with anticipation, and get your favorite girl DKFing you in the front lobby. It should be doable. tuscl.net

Jestrite50 and two shot girls tuscl.net

my reply on noreallyme's swing club thread, about my own marriage tuscl.net

PhantomGeek -> enjoyable DFK which led to some time in the VIP and a lot more DFK tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Watch to see what king of mileage the other customers are getting at the table tuscl.net

Club_Goer -> Reliable Strippers youtube.com

Hooters, Beijing youtube.com

san_jose_guy Joined June 2014

Last Seen September 2015

Reviews 0 Articles 0 Discussions 37 Comments 2,958 Reviewed Clubs 0

SJG Portal: sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

Nice Guys tuscl.net

Join the Revolution sjg-rheinbach.de

Chicago Club photo, and other photos, including San Diego's trains flickr.com

Real TJ, video youtube.com

Philosophy for Handling Strip Clubs, and about Never Letting Girls Sell You Dances tuscl.net

More of My Philosophy tuscl.net

Philly Hole in the Wall Clubs tuscl.net

About Born Again Christianity and Hard Living Sorts tuscl.net

Shadowcat, Making Out w/ Strippers tuscl.net

Siemens to build 35 new diesel electric locomotives at it's Sacramento plant. bizjournals.com

Contraception and STD Prevention Research guttmacher.org

Nice Guys cavemancircus.com/2011/10/24/nice-guy-syndrome-what-it-is-and-why-you-should-kill-it-with-fire/

How to find out how good a dancer is in the VIP/Room, or, why not front room friendliness? tuscl.net

How To Pay Hookers For Sex, television program tuscl.net

Why, at a place like the Sunnyvale Brass Rail, you need to study and work The System tuscl.net

The Importance of Not Treating Strippers Like Strippers tuscl.net

High Performance Magnets, U Alabama mint.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/MINT-G8-Abstract-Combined.pdf

A surprise meeting in Time Square tuscl.net

Why Front Room Friendliness Is So Important and Why Dancers Make More Money This Way tuscl.net

Boom of 2015 Part 1 tuscl.net

Part 2 tuscl.net

Coffee Girls thebravenewworlddotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/l_7832265fd11f4c67b9a0a83ba7084078.jpg

Breastaurants tuscl.net

Time Square Photo, but Kuala Lumpur ajlevan.theworldrace.org/blogphotos/theworldrace/ajlevan/kl_prostitutes1.jpg

Slut Wear tuscl.net

The System tuscl.net

Kudos to JS69 tuscl.net

San Francisco, open tongue girl kissing on stage tuscl.net

Overview of the Bay Area Scene tuscl.net

La Bamba (1987), Tijuana Brothel Scene, around 1958 youtu.be/E7IrVjS5NZA?t=1h16m7s

Floor Dance Tipping Interval? Mr. LDK tuscl.net

Malaysia Flight MH 370 tuscl.net

Terminal Identity amazon.com

Anti-Oedipus amazon.com

Strip Club Songs phoenixnewtimes.com

JS69's Thread tuscl.net

Neoliberalism and Tijuana Sex Work tuscl.net

Fayetteville North Carolina tuscl.net

No more Ford Vans, and Mexican Border Pussy, plus racist San Diego tuscl.net

Karl Marx tuscl.net

Talk about drugs tuscl.net

Talk about single versus married and being careful tuscl.net

Shailynn's Unemployment Thread tuscl.net

mandatory.com

China, funeral strippers blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/23/chinese-government-says-please-stop-hiring-funeral-strippers/

series of posts about an organization i am building tuscl.net

Alabegonz, some much needed words of sanity! tuscl.net

The Boom Of 2015 tuscl.net entirely fictional and any similarity to real persons living or dead is entirely conincidence

Jestrite50, as always, DFKing a hottie in the front room, followed by my own comment tuscl.net

question for SJG tuscl.net

Kick back money, and how people can do things in ethnic minority subcultures that they wouldn't otherwise dare do: tuscl.net

Discussion of AMPs and Trafficking tuscl.net

Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

More Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

Duke69, AMP story tuscl.net

Female Revolutionaries tuscl.net

First Lesson in Vietnamese tuscl.net

Capability Declines With Age? tuscl.net

Discussion of 'seductions' in AMPs, versus what can be done in civilian venues tuscl.net

Discussions of hand holding tuscl.net

Why lapdances are a chump's game tuscl.net

Rick Dugan, "The System" tuscl.net

SJG's Philosophy tuscl.net

substantial discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Preserved Threads:

The Great Society Programs did not go far enough. They were always compromised on behalf of upholding middle class values. In the case of Medicare, this meant a deal which was cut, instead of board determined fees, it was to be the customary physician's fees. It was this, the compromise with the doctors, which made Medicare into something which would prove to be unworkable.

The New Deal legislation brought us some of the best structural changes this country has ever seen. It's just that that was so long ago.

If we want working people to be able to earn a living and to be able to stay afloat, and I say that we have to want this, then we still need much deeper economic system reforms today than what we got with LBJ and The Great Society.

SJG

Dougster, "just making money" is an extremely political position to take. You are making that money off of other people. And you are using the existing rules of our society to do it, and those rules might not be fair. You are also using our existing infrastructure of transportation, banking, and courts too. You are using structures which already exist in order to keep many people down, and seem to be taking us in the direction of a two tier society.

Most all sorts of social programs are designed at least in part in order to humiliate the poor, and to turn them into a public spectacle. They almost have to be designed so, otherwise they would be giving out more money and benefit. What they give out is not enough to lift people out of poverty. But they most certainly do impose order in the working rank and file just above the welfare clients.

We have this going on here in San Jose. A big backer of these programs is the new Mayor of San Jose, Sam Liccardo. He sports all sorts of secular and religious charities aimed at the downtown homeless. They give out some benefits. But what they also do is make people submit to case management. So their affairs will now be open to interpretation by persons interested in breaking their spirit. If someone has grown up in an abusive environment, then letting others take the shattered factoids of their life and try to weave it into a story, will be the final act which guarantees that their abuses win. It is just like subjecting a rape victim to a second rape by telling her that you don't believer her, or that she caused it herself.

Liccardo supports these sorts of things, programs which pay far less than the minimum wage, first of all because he is part of a City Hall contingent committed to breaking the Public Employee Unions, particularly Police and Fire. He is also committed to making San Jose into an Urban Yuppie Utopia. This is what he believes in, and he is in bed with the big high rise developers. He is also a champion of charter schools, places which hire unqualified teachers and put kids on computerized drilling machines for much of the day. He wants to close the "achievement gap" by sending kids to schools that he would never dream of sending any kids of his own to.

stoprocketship.com

That most social programs are primarily intended to humiliate and regulate the poor, and turn them into a public spectacle in order to weaken the Labor Movement is demonstrated over and over in:

Francis Fox-Piven and Richard Cloward amazon.com

The first attempts to provide welfare in order to restrict pan-handling came about during the 1500's, at the very beginnings of Capitalism. The pan handling was socially disruptive. It was interfering with the wheels of progress. People were pan handling because they needed to be able to eat, and Capitalism causes dislocation. Less and less workers are actually needed, and they need to impose order and discipline in their existing labor force or it won't be willing to work at starvation wages anymore.

The idea of welfare goes back to the Roman Empire. It was simply a practical solution to a pressing need. It avoided revolution and kept the empire together. Welfare in the US started as AFDC with the 1935 Social Security Act. Although it is never been more than a few percent of the total budget of public expenditure, it has always been highly controversial. Many people seem to find the idea offensive.

What NY's Daniel Patrick Moynihan concluded was that welfare is simply the cheapest way to address poverty. Any more complex solution ends up costing more money. I think this is obvious.

But for myself, I know that the weakness of welfare is that people are letting themselves be made into objects of pity, instead of organizing and fighting back. Alcohol, drugs, born again Christianity, and psychiatric medication are also all used to keep the poor from organizing and fighting back.

I mean this insurance agent, if he really wanted to hire someone at low but fair wages to rake is leaves, I'm sure he could have found someone. But it sounds like he just wanted to rebuke the homeless man for panhandling. So of course the man was right to tell him where to stick it.

Those at the bottom are often forced to take itinerant forms of employment with pay less than a living wage, and even less than minimum wage. Often those at the bottom end up having to try and get income from people who don't even pay as agreed.

For myself, I am involved in various matters of public and community interest. I learned of one group which was feeding the homeless in a public park, but they make it part of a kind of a church service. The message they put out in this tax payer funded church service is that the homeless and the poor are responsible for their own plight because they don't accept Jesus and because instead of practicing forgiveness, they are "carrying stuff around with them." I also soon learned that most all of these church volunteers have designated scape goats within their own families. Usually it is one of their children. Sometimes it is a sibling. In this later case, what this means is that they side with the parents in their evaluation of this person. I also unearthed a man who had a huge emotional investment in blacksheeping his eldest daughter. He was currently charged with 6 felonies all pertaining to the sexual fondling of his daughters, and his whole church was standing with him and calling the girls liars.

Over the next two years I got heavily involved in this and played a large roll in getting this man convicted and put in San Quentin to serve a sentence which exceeds his life expectancy. And I am continuing to work to try and educate multiple city governments that it is wrong to trample on separation of church and state and to allow these religious pity and condemnation programs access to tax payer funded property. I am making progress.

I think GACAclub has the right way of seeing this. We have created an underclass. Moralizing at such persons solves nothing. We have to undo what we have done. And I am also saying that unredressed religious child abuse is a huge part of this.

And of course shortly after I joined TUSCL I too noticed right away how this condemnation of the underclass is reflected in the attitudes TUSCLer's show towards the very women they are paying money to for sex acts.

SJG

No one who really had a choice would want to live in the gutter. Part of the problem is that living wage work is not available to many people. There is just no way that some people would be the ones to get it. So they have to try and function with sub living wage off the books work, and maybe 50% of the time that means dealing with people who don't pay.

Lots of people will talk about having started with nothing. But why should that be a standard we try to hold people to? And also, the simple fact is that how well things go for people do depend entirely on their background, social background, economic background, and family background. So a young person may have "nothing", or this is what they say. But actually they have a lot going for them.

It is different for people when they are in middle age. They are looked at differently. Their social standing is different.

No one is going to want to throw their life into the garbage dumpster. I am convinced that anyone who lives in the gutter is there because somewhere along the way their social and civil standing were neutralized. So after that the pain of getting through even one day is just unbearable.

Problem is though, that most such people cannot obtain political consioucness. The pain is too great. Then you have local gov't in league with religious groups, you have the gov't funded mental health system and the probations system, and then you have motivationalists. All of these things work to tell people that they are the ones responsible for their dysfunctional lives. So there is no justice. And further, many of these same things are further propagated via child abuse.

The only remedy is always going to be political consciousness raising.

We have an underclass, but it is not created by social programs, it is created by Capitalism and by the institutions which protect Capitalism, like familyism.

SJG

Discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Jestrite50, about not busting a nut tuscl.net

How do we get US SC's up to the quality level of the Hong Kong Bar? For now I am setting aside the pricing difference as I see that as secondary. As I see it, the situation should be analyzed in two parts, the front room dynamic and the backroom dynamic. Please contribute what you can to this exploration: tuscl.net

Some recent threads and posts which are clearly relevant:

silkypants -> Real Time Update Detroit tuscl.net

GroovnHigh and TireTraveler -> First about an all GFE relationship started in Adelitas, then a great account of front room pussy play followed by retreating to a private room. This is the way it should be done, rather than talking about 'extras' and 'mileage' and letting a girl 'sell you dances'. tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Opens up a thread about lap dancing by talking about grope sessions. If this could get to DFK w/ FIV, then you've really got what I would consider to be the ideal, if it could be in the front room and before you have spent enough money to be committed to that girl. tuscl.net

Discussion of German FKK versus TJ, and why there could be a quality of experience difference because in TJ things probably go around the clock and so it could be easier and cheaper to spend more time with your girl. tuscl.net

Discussion about asking waitresses for information about dancers. I try to denounce this, saying that you shouldn't relate to any of the women in the SC by talking about 'extras' or 'mileage' or asking them to gossip about each other. Jestrite50, as only he can, explains how it should be done, dealing with each woman in her own right. tuscl.net

And here, Shadowcat opens a thread right. It was about dancers living in motels. Having motel access is a key to getting HK backroom quality. Shadow cat speaks of a place in South Carolina where he was getting takeout without even going to the SC. tuscl.net

Discussion of Aphrodite's Lingerie Party, in Portland, and why this sort of venue is inherently inferior to an SC. tuscl.net

How strip clubs fall short of their potential: tuscl.net

But so long as people are going to walk into strip clubs and ask dancers, "Do you do extras?" Or they ask dancers which other dancer does good extras, or they even ask waitresses, and in general treat them all like prositutes, or even as vending machines, then all of this discussion will remain throwing pearls before swine. tuscl.net

Long term resident San Jose, CA, familiar with Sunnyvale and San Jose clubs. These are strictly hands off, so it is verbal flirting only. This type of flirting has played a key role in my own development. Knowledge of the history of San Francisco clubs and with the origins of lap dancing, and some familiarity with the clubs as they have evolved since. Long term reader of the Spectator newspaper, until it went under. Familiar with underground Mexican bar table dancing network. This has been tremendous fun! Also intimately familiar with AMPs and AAMPs and the social structures which support them, from all vantage points. My life objective is not to live as a Pathetic Loser, but to live like King Herod the Great.

sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

strip-club-news.blogspot.com/

On JS69's marriage thread: tuscl.net

Duke69, shows us how to club, how to make it happen with dolled up young hotties, starting in the front room, instead of just letting them sell you dances and letting your money get fed to the house and dealing with dissociated losers performing acts upon you. My hat goes off to Duke69, as he has shown us how clubbing should be. tuscl.net

Lena's Feng Shui blog lenasmirnova2013.blogspot.co.uk/

tuscl.net There have been many threads about kissing in SC's. As I see it, you want to make it as natural as possible, and so you want to do it in a way which gives you the initiative. Always treat your girl as a civilian. You want to do it this way to show your favorite dancer that you can be assertive and that you like her. Kissing is one of the best ways to get a woman to open up to you physically and psychologically. So there is no reason to wait until she is in the dance booth or the VIP room. Try and get her kissing you right in the main room. Mostly it's just a matter of learning how to do it nicely. You can give her sitting tips as appropriate to extend your front room time with her. To continue into the dance booth or the VIP Room, you want to get her off script, so that she is not providing some special service to you, standing over you and being a moving target, but instead she is sitting on your lap, straddling your thigh, or something like this. You want it to be on your initiative, and kissing is a great way to establish this. Really, no reason to take to the VIP Room until your pants are going to be coming down. Do as much as possible in the front room, and for sitting tips.

I told someone before who was going to S.F. to try and get a Crazy Horse dancer open tongue kissing while she is on stage. This could be a way of beating a clip joint.

And @JS69, yes Donna in the purple dress and I did a great deal of intense kissing, as we would in a subsequent session too. She was really tickled that I came in there and insisted upon her, just because I saw her outside washing her car. But we also did great FS too. But it would not be until some later years that I really learned how to use positions and rhythms to give exceptional FS. There is more I plan to write about Donna.

I think some people don't want to kiss strippers because they don't really like them. They just want that endorphin rush from ejaculation. Or they have one set of girls to look at, and then another to pay for doing "extras". I think this is really sad.

I think some others just haven't yet used their time in SC's to learn how to talk to women, and how to let them open up.

Others, I think they want to be like Howard Hughes in his later years, living on the top floor of a hotel, all the furniture covered, no one can touch him, and all his food and drink sterilized. The man was nuts. Studies have been done with mononucleosis. It is not transmitted by kissing, that is just folklore.

I read in a book about Mexican culture that in their SC's, if they like a dancer, the first thing they do is kiss her.

Duke69, Real Talk, kissing and talking with your girl are the best way to get to know her! tuscl.net

Duke69, how and when to "just ask" time"ing is everything tuscl.net

Jestrite50, lap siting and kissing tuscl.net

Shadowcat's Kissing thread tuscl.net

VIP Room Kissing tuscl.net

Jestrite50, the master himself speaks! tuscl.net

Duke69 on Jestrite50 tuscl.net

Not Another Kissing Thread, BBJames tuscl.net

Kissing thread with twist, BBJames tuscl.net

Portland, Aphrodite's Hot Lingerie Party This place is set up to offer you more in the backroom than the local SC's, obviously or else there would be no reason to go there. But to make it nice you need to learn how to work it some, make it playful and show good intent and maybe offer some initial lobby tips, and get to see the girls and get them giddy with anticipation, and get your favorite girl DKFing you in the front lobby. It should be doable. tuscl.net

Jestrite50 and two shot girls tuscl.net

my reply on noreallyme's swing club thread, about my own marriage tuscl.net

PhantomGeek -> enjoyable DFK which led to some time in the VIP and a lot more DFK tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Watch to see what king of mileage the other customers are getting at the table tuscl.net

Club_Goer -> Reliable Strippers youtube.com

Hooters, Beijing youtube.com

san_jose_guy Joined June 2014

Last Seen September 2015

Reviews 0 Articles 0 Discussions 37 Comments 2,958 Reviewed Clubs 0

SJG Portal: sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

Nice Guys tuscl.net

Join the Revolution sjg-rheinbach.de

Chicago Club photo, and other photos, including San Diego's trains flickr.com

Real TJ, video youtube.com

Philosophy for Handling Strip Clubs, and about Never Letting Girls Sell You Dances tuscl.net

More of My Philosophy tuscl.net

Philly Hole in the Wall Clubs tuscl.net

About Born Again Christianity and Hard Living Sorts tuscl.net

Shadowcat, Making Out w/ Strippers tuscl.net

Siemens to build 35 new diesel electric locomotives at it's Sacramento plant. bizjournals.com

Contraception and STD Prevention Research guttmacher.org

Nice Guys cavemancircus.com/2011/10/24/nice-guy-syndrome-what-it-is-and-why-you-should-kill-it-with-fire/

How to find out how good a dancer is in the VIP/Room, or, why not front room friendliness? tuscl.net

How To Pay Hookers For Sex, television program tuscl.net

Why, at a place like the Sunnyvale Brass Rail, you need to study and work The System tuscl.net

The Importance of Not Treating Strippers Like Strippers tuscl.net

High Performance Magnets, U Alabama mint.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/MINT-G8-Abstract-Combined.pdf

A surprise meeting in Time Square tuscl.net

Why Front Room Friendliness Is So Important and Why Dancers Make More Money This Way tuscl.net

Boom of 2015 Part 1 tuscl.net

Part 2 tuscl.net

Coffee Girls thebravenewworlddotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/l_7832265fd11f4c67b9a0a83ba7084078.jpg

Breastaurants tuscl.net

Time Square Photo, but Kuala Lumpur ajlevan.theworldrace.org/blogphotos/theworldrace/ajlevan/kl_prostitutes1.jpg

Slut Wear tuscl.net

The System tuscl.net

Kudos to JS69 tuscl.net

San Francisco, open tongue girl kissing on stage tuscl.net

Overview of the Bay Area Scene tuscl.net

La Bamba (1987), Tijuana Brothel Scene, around 1958 youtu.be/E7IrVjS5NZA?t=1h16m7s

Floor Dance Tipping Interval? Mr. LDK tuscl.net

Malaysia Flight MH 370 tuscl.net

Terminal Identity amazon.com

Anti-Oedipus amazon.com

Strip Club Songs phoenixnewtimes.com

JS69's Thread tuscl.net

Neoliberalism and Tijuana Sex Work tuscl.net

Fayetteville North Carolina tuscl.net

No more Ford Vans, and Mexican Border Pussy, plus racist San Diego tuscl.net

Karl Marx tuscl.net

Talk about drugs tuscl.net

Talk about single versus married and being careful tuscl.net

Shailynn's Unemployment Thread tuscl.net

mandatory.com

China, funeral strippers blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/23/chinese-government-says-please-stop-hiring-funeral-strippers/

series of posts about an organization i am building tuscl.net

Alabegonz, some much needed words of sanity! tuscl.net

The Boom Of 2015 tuscl.net entirely fictional and any similarity to real persons living or dead is entirely conincidence

Jestrite50, as always, DFKing a hottie in the front room, followed by my own comment tuscl.net

question for SJG tuscl.net

Kick back money, and how people can do things in ethnic minority subcultures that they wouldn't otherwise dare do: tuscl.net

Discussion of AMPs and Trafficking tuscl.net

Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

More Lovemaking versus Nutting tuscl.net

Duke69, AMP story tuscl.net

Female Revolutionaries tuscl.net

First Lesson in Vietnamese tuscl.net

Capability Declines With Age? tuscl.net

Discussion of 'seductions' in AMPs, versus what can be done in civilian venues tuscl.net

Discussions of hand holding tuscl.net

Why lapdances are a chump's game tuscl.net

Rick Dugan, "The System" tuscl.net

SJG's Philosophy tuscl.net

substantial discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Preserved Threads:

The Great Society Programs did not go far enough. They were always compromised on behalf of upholding middle class values. In the case of Medicare, this meant a deal which was cut, instead of board determined fees, it was to be the customary physician's fees. It was this, the compromise with the doctors, which made Medicare into something which would prove to be unworkable.

The New Deal legislation brought us some of the best structural changes this country has ever seen. It's just that that was so long ago.

If we want working people to be able to earn a living and to be able to stay afloat, and I say that we have to want this, then we still need much deeper economic system reforms today than what we got with LBJ and The Great Society.

SJG

Dougster, "just making money" is an extremely political position to take. You are making that money off of other people. And you are using the existing rules of our society to do it, and those rules might not be fair. You are also using our existing infrastructure of transportation, banking, and courts too. You are using structures which already exist in order to keep many people down, and seem to be taking us in the direction of a two tier society.

Most all sorts of social programs are designed at least in part in order to humiliate the poor, and to turn them into a public spectacle. They almost have to be designed so, otherwise they would be giving out more money and benefit. What they give out is not enough to lift people out of poverty. But they most certainly do impose order in the working rank and file just above the welfare clients.

We have this going on here in San Jose. A big backer of these programs is the new Mayor of San Jose, Sam Liccardo. He sports all sorts of secular and religious charities aimed at the downtown homeless. They give out some benefits. But what they also do is make people submit to case management. So their affairs will now be open to interpretation by persons interested in breaking their spirit. If someone has grown up in an abusive environment, then letting others take the shattered factoids of their life and try to weave it into a story, will be the final act which guarantees that their abuses win. It is just like subjecting a rape victim to a second rape by telling her that you don't believer her, or that she caused it herself.

Liccardo supports these sorts of things, programs which pay far less than the minimum wage, first of all because he is part of a City Hall contingent committed to breaking the Public Employee Unions, particularly Police and Fire. He is also committed to making San Jose into an Urban Yuppie Utopia. This is what he believes in, and he is in bed with the big high rise developers. He is also a champion of charter schools, places which hire unqualified teachers and put kids on computerized drilling machines for much of the day. He wants to close the "achievement gap" by sending kids to schools that he would never dream of sending any kids of his own to.

stoprocketship.com

That most social programs are primarily intended to humiliate and regulate the poor, and turn them into a public spectacle in order to weaken the Labor Movement is demonstrated over and over in:

Francis Fox-Piven and Richard Cloward amazon.com

The first attempts to provide welfare in order to restrict pan-handling came about during the 1500's, at the very beginnings of Capitalism. The pan handling was socially disruptive. It was interfering with the wheels of progress. People were pan handling because they needed to be able to eat, and Capitalism causes dislocation. Less and less workers are actually needed, and they need to impose order and discipline in their existing labor force or it won't be willing to work at starvation wages anymore.

The idea of welfare goes back to the Roman Empire. It was simply a practical solution to a pressing need. It avoided revolution and kept the empire together. Welfare in the US started as AFDC with the 1935 Social Security Act. Although it is never been more than a few percent of the total budget of public expenditure, it has always been highly controversial. Many people seem to find the idea offensive.

What NY's Daniel Patrick Moynihan concluded was that welfare is simply the cheapest way to address poverty. Any more complex solution ends up costing more money. I think this is obvious.

But for myself, I know that the weakness of welfare is that people are letting themselves be made into objects of pity, instead of organizing and fighting back. Alcohol, drugs, born again Christianity, and psychiatric medication are also all used to keep the poor from organizing and fighting back.

I mean this insurance agent, if he really wanted to hire someone at low but fair wages to rake is leaves, I'm sure he could have found someone. But it sounds like he just wanted to rebuke the homeless man for panhandling. So of course the man was right to tell him where to stick it.

Those at the bottom are often forced to take itinerant forms of employment with pay less than a living wage, and even less than minimum wage. Often those at the bottom end up having to try and get income from people who don't even pay as agreed.

For myself, I am involved in various matters of public and community interest. I learned of one group which was feeding the homeless in a public park, but they make it part of a kind of a church service. The message they put out in this tax payer funded church service is that the homeless and the poor are responsible for their own plight because they don't accept Jesus and because instead of practicing forgiveness, they are "carrying stuff around with them." I also soon learned that most all of these church volunteers have designated scape goats within their own families. Usually it is one of their children. Sometimes it is a sibling. In this later case, what this means is that they side with the parents in their evaluation of this person. I also unearthed a man who had a huge emotional investment in blacksheeping his eldest daughter. He was currently charged with 6 felonies all pertaining to the sexual fondling of his daughters, and his whole church was standing with him and calling the girls liars.

Over the next two years I got heavily involved in this and played a large roll in getting this man convicted and put in San Quentin to serve a sentence which exceeds his life expectancy. And I am continuing to work to try and educate multiple city governments that it is wrong to trample on separation of church and state and to allow these religious pity and condemnation programs access to tax payer funded property. I am making progress.

I think GACAclub has the right way of seeing this. We have created an underclass. Moralizing at such persons solves nothing. We have to undo what we have done. And I am also saying that unredressed religious child abuse is a huge part of this.

And of course shortly after I joined TUSCL I too noticed right away how this condemnation of the underclass is reflected in the attitudes TUSCLer's show towards the very women they are paying money to for sex acts.

SJG

No one who really had a choice would want to live in the gutter. Part of the problem is that living wage work is not available to many people. There is just no way that some people would be the ones to get it. So they have to try and function with sub living wage off the books work, and maybe 50% of the time that means dealing with people who don't pay.

Lots of people will talk about having started with nothing. But why should that be a standard we try to hold people to? And also, the simple fact is that how well things go for people do depend entirely on their background, social background, economic background, and family background. So a young person may have "nothing", or this is what they say. But actually they have a lot going for them.

It is different for people when they are in middle age. They are looked at differently. Their social standing is different.

No one is going to want to throw their life into the garbage dumpster. I am convinced that anyone who lives in the gutter is there because somewhere along the way their social and civil standing were neutralized. So after that the pain of getting through even one day is just unbearable.

Problem is though, that most such people cannot obtain political consioucness. The pain is too great. Then you have local gov't in league with religious groups, you have the gov't funded mental health system and the probations system, and then you have motivationalists. All of these things work to tell people that they are the ones responsible for their dysfunctional lives. So there is no justice. And further, many of these same things are further propagated via child abuse.

The only remedy is always going to be political consciousness raising.

We have an underclass, but it is not created by social programs, it is created by Capitalism and by the institutions which protect Capitalism, like familyism.

SJG

Discussion of GFE in AMPs tuscl.net

Jestrite50, about not busting a nut tuscl.net

How do we get US SC's up to the quality level of the Hong Kong Bar? For now I am setting aside the pricing difference as I see that as secondary. As I see it, the situation should be analyzed in two parts, the front room dynamic and the backroom dynamic. Please contribute what you can to this exploration: tuscl.net

Some recent threads and posts which are clearly relevant:

silkypants -> Real Time Update Detroit tuscl.net

GroovnHigh and TireTraveler -> First about an all GFE relationship started in Adelitas, then a great account of front room pussy play followed by retreating to a private room. This is the way it should be done, rather than talking about 'extras' and 'mileage' and letting a girl 'sell you dances'. tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Opens up a thread about lap dancing by talking about grope sessions. If this could get to DFK w/ FIV, then you've really got what I would consider to be the ideal, if it could be in the front room and before you have spent enough money to be committed to that girl. tuscl.net

Discussion of German FKK versus TJ, and why there could be a quality of experience difference because in TJ things probably go around the clock and so it could be easier and cheaper to spend more time with your girl. tuscl.net

Discussion about asking waitresses for information about dancers. I try to denounce this, saying that you shouldn't relate to any of the women in the SC by talking about 'extras' or 'mileage' or asking them to gossip about each other. Jestrite50, as only he can, explains how it should be done, dealing with each woman in her own right. tuscl.net

And here, Shadowcat opens a thread right. It was about dancers living in motels. Having motel access is a key to getting HK backroom quality. Shadow cat speaks of a place in South Carolina where he was getting takeout without even going to the SC. tuscl.net

Discussion of Aphrodite's Lingerie Party, in Portland, and why this sort of venue is inherently inferior to an SC. tuscl.net

How strip clubs fall short of their potential: tuscl.net

But so long as people are going to walk into strip clubs and ask dancers, "Do you do extras?" Or they ask dancers which other dancer does good extras, or they even ask waitresses, and in general treat them all like prositutes, or even as vending machines, then all of this discussion will remain throwing pearls before swine. tuscl.net

Long term resident San Jose, CA, familiar with Sunnyvale and San Jose clubs. These are strictly hands off, so it is verbal flirting only. This type of flirting has played a key role in my own development. Knowledge of the history of San Francisco clubs and with the origins of lap dancing, and some familiarity with the clubs as they have evolved since. Long term reader of the Spectator newspaper, until it went under. Familiar with underground Mexican bar table dancing network. This has been tremendous fun! Also intimately familiar with AMPs and AAMPs and the social structures which support them, from all vantage points. My life objective is not to live as a Pathetic Loser, but to live like King Herod the Great.

sites.google.com/site/sjgportal/

strip-club-news.blogspot.com/

On JS69's marriage thread: tuscl.net

Duke69, shows us how to club, how to make it happen with dolled up young hotties, starting in the front room, instead of just letting them sell you dances and letting your money get fed to the house and dealing with dissociated losers performing acts upon you. My hat goes off to Duke69, as he has shown us how clubbing should be. tuscl.net

Lena's Feng Shui blog lenasmirnova2013.blogspot.co.uk/

tuscl.net There have been many threads about kissing in SC's. As I see it, you want to make it as natural as possible, and so you want to do it in a way which gives you the initiative. Always treat your girl as a civilian. You want to do it this way to show your favorite dancer that you can be assertive and that you like her. Kissing is one of the best ways to get a woman to open up to you physically and psychologically. So there is no reason to wait until she is in the dance booth or the VIP room. Try and get her kissing you right in the main room. Mostly it's just a matter of learning how to do it nicely. You can give her sitting tips as appropriate to extend your front room time with her. To continue into the dance booth or the VIP Room, you want to get her off script, so that she is not providing some special service to you, standing over you and being a moving target, but instead she is sitting on your lap, straddling your thigh, or something like this. You want it to be on your initiative, and kissing is a great way to establish this. Really, no reason to take to the VIP Room until your pants are going to be coming down. Do as much as possible in the front room, and for sitting tips.

I told someone before who was going to S.F. to try and get a Crazy Horse dancer open tongue kissing while she is on stage. This could be a way of beating a clip joint.

And @JS69, yes Donna in the purple dress and I did a great deal of intense kissing, as we would in a subsequent session too. She was really tickled that I came in there and insisted upon her, just because I saw her outside washing her car. But we also did great FS too. But it would not be until some later years that I really learned how to use positions and rhythms to give exceptional FS. There is more I plan to write about Donna.

I think some people don't want to kiss strippers because they don't really like them. They just want that endorphin rush from ejaculation. Or they have one set of girls to look at, and then another to pay for doing "extras". I think this is really sad.

I think some others just haven't yet used their time in SC's to learn how to talk to women, and how to let them open up.

Others, I think they want to be like Howard Hughes in his later years, living on the top floor of a hotel, all the furniture covered, no one can touch him, and all his food and drink sterilized. The man was nuts. Studies have been done with mononucleosis. It is not transmitted by kissing, that is just folklore.

I read in a book about Mexican culture that in their SC's, if they like a dancer, the first thing they do is kiss her.

Duke69, Real Talk, kissing and talking with your girl are the best way to get to know her! tuscl.net

Duke69, how and when to "just ask" time"ing is everything tuscl.net

Jestrite50, lap siting and kissing tuscl.net

Shadowcat's Kissing thread tuscl.net

VIP Room Kissing tuscl.net

Jestrite50, the master himself speaks! tuscl.net

Duke69 on Jestrite50 tuscl.net

Not Another Kissing Thread, BBJames tuscl.net

Kissing thread with twist, BBJames tuscl.net

Portland, Aphrodite's Hot Lingerie Party This place is set up to offer you more in the backroom than the local SC's, obviously or else there would be no reason to go there. But to make it nice you need to learn how to work it some, make it playful and show good intent and maybe offer some initial lobby tips, and get to see the girls and get them giddy with anticipation, and get your favorite girl DKFing you in the front lobby. It should be doable. tuscl.net

Jestrite50 and two shot girls tuscl.net

my reply on noreallyme's swing club thread, about my own marriage tuscl.net

PhantomGeek -> enjoyable DFK which led to some time in the VIP and a lot more DFK tuscl.net

Shadowcat -> Watch to see what king of mileage the other customers are getting at the table tuscl.net

Club_Goer -> Reliable Strippers youtube.com

Hooters, Beijing youtube.com

Would spell check help^^^

Would spell check help^^^