My recent Florida trips (Tampa and S FL) make me wonder why anybody bothers with SCs anywhere else. For example, my old standbys in Baltimore are really losing steam fast. I’m guessing money laundering or other activities (plus the occasional bachelor blowout) seem to be the only reason a lot of these clubs are still open.
Is it laws/regulations ? The business climate? All of the above?
Perhaps more Cuban girls are needed up north?
Seems good/permissive clubbing areas are the exception rather than the norm - seems to me tight local ordinances are often the biggest impediment to a good clubbing scene - also some areas are getting too expensive dances-wise which IMO makes it much harder to be a regular club-goer - expensive dances may drive away a good # of custies - less custies often means less dancers and less dancers lead to fewer custies - some areas may be able to sustain high dance prices but IMO not most areas.
I think a lot of it has to do with local economies and population shifts. Northeast strip clubs have been suffering as high income residents are fleeing most of those states. In contrast, clubs in places like TX and FL, net recipients of these high income earners, are doing great.
Shit, even in northeast Florida, which is not exactly a tourism mecca, the population base is exploding and the clubs are filling up, especially on Thursday-Saturday. Seriously, we've actually had 3 different clubs open up over the last few years - 4 if you count one that was closed for a couple of years for "remodeling." Now it has also brought a lot of inflation to the cost of OTC, which is kinda' pissing me off, but it beats having limited and/or depressing options I suppose.
Demographics are killing strip clubs. 1) Younger males of this generation are poorer than prior generations; 2) Younger males of this generation grew up on the internet and the simple fact is that face to face personal interaction is outside their comfort zone. They'd rather jack off to a cam girl. Proof? Watch an old man at the stage get the most contact for a buck. Watch a young man walk to the stage and flig 20 ones at the dancer then turn and walk away. The old guy could turn that $20 into 5 minutes of groping. 3) Struip clubbing, like golf, like gigars, like steakhouses is an old white man thing. They/we are aging out or just plain ofle dying and we're not being replaced. Yeah I get that non-whites and younger people gold, bu as a general rule, what I stated is accurate. When old white guys are really gone, figure 10 years, you'll see just as mant strip clubs as Sears.
Ski, I'm going to disagree with you on that one. Your "proof" has been a condition that has been around since I was a young man - young guys have always been more self conscious and concerned about appearance than old shameless guys who don't give a shit anymore. I'm seeing plenty of young guys in clubs now, who will be the old guys of tomorrow. I think clubbing in a place like Providence, with so many depressing clubs due to population decline and the aging out of club customers, might be skewing your view.
@skibum. Well, when young males are told by particular media, revisionists, and talking heads that certain personal interactions with women (even looking at them a certain way) constitute harassment (and kissing / feels constitute date rape), it just becomes so much easier to wank to a cam girl, and actually encountering a live woman who bares her boobies is probably an alien experience.
Spend a few weekend nights clubbing in Jacksonville FL, even with the bikini rules for alcohol, and you'll encounter a vibrant club scene. The economy is excellent here right now, with young guys being brought in from all over to work on construction projects, highways and roads, shipbuilding and lots of other long-term gigs. Gotta' love the smell of commerce. ;)
Rick I go to Desires, which is my all-time favorite club anywhere. I never find it depressing. in fact last night, the Bruins were on the big screen to the left (they won) the celtics were on the big screen to the right (they won) and in the middle was the mani stage where in 2 hours I saw every ethnicity and every body type of woman possible. We are having a population decline here due to it being a shitty place to live and an older population, but I was a young guy in a club from lets say 75 - 95, so I getwhat you are saying but after the last economic bust, strip clubs golf courses, cigars and steakhoiuses all continued the decline and never recovered. When was the firt time you saw anyone make it rain, because its something i have only seen over the last 10 years.
The overwhelming left-wing domination in most colleges/universities these days means many young men are indoctrinated to be against sex work where groping a dancer is seen as totally unacceptable.
I still maintain it's mostly a value-proposition - too many clubs are either too expensive for the avg guy to stomach, or the lack of mileage means pretty-much pissing your $$$ away - if there was a better value proposition in terms of cost and mileage, IMO there'd be a much healthier SC scene - most clubs that offer good-value in terms of cost and mileage seems to me to be thriving.
Papi Orwell's 1984 had a group called the anti-sex league and another called the junior anti-sex league. Your comment made me think of how well Orwell predicted the future.
In the context of value (cost/mileage), look at a place like TJHK where it's either lively or packed 24/7 - dancers seem to make very-good $$$ and custies get very good value - seems like a win/win when government gets out of the way and lets the market find its equilibrium
Interesting comments however the median family income is highest in the Northeast, so the money’s still there. Other than Alaska & Hawaii you’re looking at Maryland, New Jersey, Mass, Connecticut & New Hampshire to round out the highest states. I tend to think societal values are the major factor determining strip club attendance. Many years ago I could call many friends to join me in going to a club. Today, the only guy I know who I’d feel comfortable calling is a retired engineer who played trumpet at a strip club in the days before DJ’s.
ski, fair enough that strip clubs certainly face some headwinds. This includes cultural changes for sure. It also doesn't help that cities and towns in many areas have become much more savvy about how to keep new clubs from opening, so clubs that closed during the downturn are not being replaced by new clubs in many areas.
But I also look at vibrant clubs in places like FL and TX, which have many ideal conditions for clubs like more tolerant politicians, booming economies and population growth, and it tells me that demand is still there. So I'm not ready to write off clubs just yet or even any time in the next 30 years.
Florida and Texas also have a lot of visitors. I was in Florida last October and while it was off season, the clubs all seemed dead to me and I have gone to Florida in October abouit 35 of the last 40 years. I hope clubs remain, but imo their demise is inevitable and all I am wrong about is the date. Sincethe boom of 1995 - 2005 ended I have yet to see strip clubs return to where they were back then. The money is still here in Massachusetts with our 2.8% unemployment rate, but I see one club doing great in Providence and the rest not doing well. Hope I am wrong, but 30 years from now I'll be so dead no one will even recall I existed so I doubt I'll care lol.
I agree I do wonder this too, not just with SCs only. Man stores you’ll walk in and there’s nobody there. 4 people working. You should be selling enough stuff to be able to pay those people and the bills too. I don’t even know how the math works out for some of these Businesses sometimes.
^^^ true.
Real estate seems to be cooling down also
There have not been bidding wars on houses in my area the past few months
Detroit clubs have taken a hit since the city began enforcing regulations and taking down the curtains. I won't go to the Penthouse on 8 Mile anymore. However, the suburban clubs are still fun.
The reason why u.s. clubs stay in business is because dumb ass mongers go to them.
Ski, the part of Florida I am in is not a tourism mecca like Miami and Tampa. It's mostly locals supporting these clubs. I was out last night and the clubs were hopping.
For that matter, most Texas cities are not exactly tourism hot spots either.
Population demographics matter. Places that are growing in upper income population and high-paying jobs, and that are tolerant of clubs, have more vibrant club scenes that those that are not. Given my recent experience in Providence, I can guarantee that there were many more local guys in J'ville strip clubs last night than there were in Providence clubs, despite the fact that PVD clubs draw from a far more population dense area. I'll also bet that there were far more dancers working in J'ville than in PVD. So while I don't completely disagree with all of your points, I also don't completely agree with your belief that demand for clubs is drying up. Simply put it's just not what I'm seeing here or in certain other places and this includes younger guys.
If anything, the clubs I visit are busier than I have ever seen them in the 7 years I've lived here. Good paying jobs for skilled workers abound around here and some of these newly flush young guys are taking that cash into clubs. Good times.
A good economy helps.
Keep in mind too that average income is not a metric that can be viewed in a vacuum. It also has to be considered in light of the cost of living. RI/MA are brutally expensive places to live compared to NE Florida in terms of housing, utilities, taxes (on just about everything), etc. $60k a year in Providence is not nearly the same as $60k per year in Jacksonville.
I think a number of smaller clubs operate using old business models and are stuck in the past as a result they don’t attract newer younger customers with changing tastes, but there are some that stay relevant and do well.
One factor helping JAX area clubs is a bunch of horny sailors coming from Mayport and 2 naval air stations. Jacksonville has a large enough population that a significant military downsizing wouldn't close the clubs like some small town army or remote air bases would. I suspect that there would be a noticeable drop off in business.
25, exactly what kind of business model would attract the young millennial crowd ? More computer play stations ? Wtf, either one likes interacting with scantily clad/naked females, or they don't.
^ not sure of the answer but I do know that there’s really nothing new under the sun, there are just new ways of looking at it. People didn’t stop shopping they buy from amazon rather than sears the more things change the more similarities you’re gonna find.
I assume Jacksonville also has the advantage of not much else going on SC-wise in the North-FL/South-GA area
In the internet age, the top club ( or website, or singer, or....) makes money and the rest struggle. So, it’s not surprising if the best club does great and the rest struggle. In Phoenix, there are 2 clubs that get most of the business and about 15 that struggle to keep the doors open.
m94- Would those 2 clubs be Hi Liter and BSC ? If not, then which ones ?
actually Papi_Chulo socialists and the left wing are the ones advocating for legalization of sex work. I know legalization is also a libertarian position but no right winger I know has ever advocated for it in a serious way
SCs just outside the gate of large military bases usually do well even though they aren't run well.
tuscl.net @fagoneer please post here. Thanks
Jacksonville is a very small city (by population) that supports 20 - that's right, 20 - clubs, only a few of which are anywhere near the gates of the military bases. Also, the Southside and northern J'ville clubs do not get much foot traffic from those bases. Those bases have been there forever and don't account for the increase in foot traffic or the new club openings.
^ Low COL, inexpensive by comparison commercial real estate, and low expectations, seem to support north Florida venues for the most part
If there were more cuban girls up North I stop going here like I have in South Florida. Except for Deans Gold I refuse to strip club in Florida south of the Inner Room because of the Cubans.