OT: Physics Texts

avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
money was invented for handing to women, but buying dances is a chump's game
So I've ended up owning a copy of Raymond Serway's book. It was damaged, but I glued it back together. Huge 1150 page book, using thin paper. I have a 1990 3rd edition.

https://www.amazon.com/Physics-Scientist…

Now the last two chapters are Special Relativity and an intro to Quantum Mechanics. Even with 1150 pages that is as far as they can get between 2 covers. But Serway and others have follow on books devoted to Modern 20th Century Physics.

https://www.amazon.com/Modern-Physics-Ra…

It is all extremely well written, as well as any I have seen. Clearly Serway has made a detailed study of the earlier texts.

He is very precise in distinguishing centripetal acceleration. And he explains very carefully how when you look at something from within a non-inertial frame of reference, that is an accelerating frame, like moving in a circle, you end up having to invent fiction forces, like centrifugal force, to explain the apparent outward pull. He does an excellent job of deriving and explaining all of this. And of course this is even more cogent as we are all now accustomed to the idea of space flight and orbits, as well as more common vehicles..

Now this book does not get into the Hamiltonian Operator, that is usually reserved for a next year Mechanics course, and it is needed for Quantum Mechanics and Aerospace problems.

The reason I wanted to write about this is because this is a newer book than I am used to.

Decades and decades ago I was writing calculator programs which dealt with physical constants and units conversions. And then a few years back I was working with that 5 volume Berkeley Physics Course which does not use MKS units, but uses CGS. As a result all the electrical units get very strange.

So I looked at it and there was clearly redundancy. If one today wants to make programs which deal with such physics and units systems, the machines should be able to do all the derivations themselves.

So Serway indeed explains it all very well. Platinum-Iridium is a very stable alloy. In France they have the standard for the kilogram.

Now they used to get the time standard from the earth's rotation on its axis. But now they know that this actually does have variation. And then things like China's Three Gorges Damn have slowed it down.

So in the 60's they changed to the Cesium atomic standard.

And in 1980, they changed to a defined speed of light. It is just under 3 x 10^8 M/s.

So they use time and this speed of light in vacuum to derive the meter standard.

In France they do still have a Platinum-Iridium rod with two notches in it one meter apart, but this is no longer the standard. They use the atomic clock and the defined speed of light.

So if you have the speed of light, then this ties down the product of the permittivity and the permiability of free space. These come up as product if the light wave equation is derived from Maxwell's equations.

So they define permiability of free space as 4 * PI * 10^-7. And of course the 4 * PI is in there for convenience because it is the area of a sphere, and because of Gauss's Law, and because the integral is always zero, as there are no magnetic mono-poles.

So this then ties down the permitivity, and this then defines the charge unit, the Coulomb, and this then ties down all your electric and magnetic units.

One can figure this all out, but this book explains it better than any I had previously seen, and it is the first I have seen which drops the standard length rod.

So then there had been 4 forces in nature. The idea that the Weak force was the same as the Electromagnetic Force was floated. So in 1984 they feel that they proved it.

So it is just 3 forces now.

1. Gravitation
2. Electro-Weak
3. Strong

So the Weak force is about 1/10 the strength of the electrostatic force. Not much, and it operates over only a very short range, 10^-12 meters. But it is responsible for most all nuclear decay.

The Strong force holds nuclei together, being 10 to 100x the strength of the electrostatic force. But it falls of very quickly with distance, and operates only over a range of about 10^-15 meters.

So they feel that the Big Bang occurred about 15 to 20 billion years ago. This is pushing back further than I had heard. And it tends to increase the chances of our Sun being at least a 3rd generation star.

They feel that right after the Big Bang, energy levels were so extremely high that all 3 of these forces were one.

And Serway does a very good job of explaining how most all matter to matter interactions, all three states, are driven by the electrical force. Though at the molecular and atomic level this is governed by quantum mechanics, not Newtonian mechanics. So he means friction, material strength, gas pressures and drag, and liquid viscosity
.
SJG

Mark Passio 911 An Inside Job & A Dark Occult Ritual
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SK9xu8tO…

Pink Floyd Comfortably Numb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJZYG5qw…

Tarkus - Emerson, Lake & Palmer [1971] (HD)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKNOlDtZ…

113 comments

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avatar for shailynn
shailynn
6 years ago
when you said "texts" in your thread I assumed you meant TEXT MESSAGES. But. oh I forgot, you're San Jose Guy, no bitches are ever gonna text you!
avatar for gawker
gawker
6 years ago
So what?
avatar for TheeOSU
TheeOSU
6 years ago
You are right mamisan, he even admitted it and posted as sanjosegay a year or two ago.
avatar for orionsmith
orionsmith
6 years ago
SGJ, question.
How fast are you going if a red traffic light appears green? This was an Astronomy question in my Astronomy book. My joke answer was way too fast for the cops to catch you.
I know it's a certain percentage of the speed of light to create a Doppler effect with light.
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
Orionsmith, Gawker, and TheeOSU,

Have you guys ever tried to master difficult material and stay current with it?

If not, how do you earn a living?

Are you people pleasers, is that how? Or do you try and get control of critical resources so that you can make money at other people's expense?

Pretty hard to earn an honest living without some hard earned knowledge about something.

Now if you were female, that would be different. You could earn a living the way Mamisan does, buy getting fucked over and over by Tijuana Tim's Show Donkeys. She readies them for Mexican and US Clubs.

Orionsmith, Gawker, and TheeOSU, do you earn your livings by offering your other two inputs?

SJG
avatar for TheeOSU
TheeOSU
6 years ago
"It was damaged, but I glued it back together. "

That's as far as i read in your post creep which is most likely further than 99.9% of TUSCL has. As damaged as you are you'll never be glued back together after your ex-wife left you. All the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't glue the creep's psyche back together again. Lol
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
Remind me to pour some gasoline all over and around the rock which TheeOSU hides under, and then to ignite it.

SJG
avatar for TheeOSU
TheeOSU
6 years ago
^
All the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't glue the creep's psyche back together again. Lol
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
Reading more of Raymond Serway, about Kinetic Energy and Potential Energy, and what he calls "Conservative Forces", where the actual path followed has no effect on the outcome.

Some people refer to such things as Elastic Collisions or Reversible Processes.

Serway writes extremely precisely, he is careful not to over simply or over generalize. He actually shows the equation for relativistic kinetic energy, though a full explanation will be reserved for the end of the 1150 page book, talking about relativity after electromagnetics and the speed of light.

Serway also makes it clear that when there are multiple force fields in play, then potential energy is a multiple, a sum of potentials.

People who really know this stuff well can read such books just like they were the morning newspaper. I want to know it that well myself.

SJG

Mark Passio on the Chaos Sorcery of 9/11 - Kabbalah, Tarot & Freemasonry - Symbolism and Numerology
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXOJHZho…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
So Raymond Serway is at James Madison University.

https://www.jmu.edu/

Harrisonburg Virginia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Madi…

Maybe 80 miles West by South West from Washington DC

Getting close to West Virginia, Shenandoah Valley.

SJG
avatar for zef8mich
zef8mich
6 years ago
I had 'modern physics' and quantum mechanics courses over 50 years ago but this new stuff is all Greek to me.
avatar for RandomMember
RandomMember
6 years ago

I must have 3 editions of Serway rotting in my basement (I used to teach physics in the evening after my "real" job). It's the kind a of crap text used in state schools where the average pre-med is getting their physics recs out of the way, even though they cant' stand physics.

Better text is Halliday @ Resnick which is a very old text and has gone through multiple editions. Less verbose and to the point. Giancoli isn't bad,either.
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
Well, this is a 1990 text, so it is not that new. And it is just a first year text. But Serway wrote a Modern Physics text to follow it. The people who know this stuff well can read through the books just like they were the morning news paper. I want to get to where I am that good at it.

This is also a good book for applications of quantum mechanics:
https://www.amazon.com/Quantum-Mechanics…

People's educations usually stop once they are out of school. As I see it, that should be when the real education begins. I am working to build an organization which will support this, life long learning.

SJG

Baker Gurvitz Army - Vinyl Album High Quality
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avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
Raymond Serway's book is extremely well written. Includes essay about a revival of interest in General Realtivity. By 1950's it had largely died off. People did not dispute it, just not important. And given the complexity of that math, no one interested.

But new technology for making the measurements, advances in astronomy, and the space program, and interest has been revived.

So again, I think any general math program for a computer, should be ready for 4 dimensions and tensors.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
Bonding, structure and solid-state chemistry / Mark Ladd, formerly Head of Chemical Physics, University of Surrey, UK. (2016)

Fundamentals of physics / Jearl Walker. 8th edition, Haliday and Resnick, (2008)
supposed to be in two volumes.

here, clearly in 3 volumes, multiple sources. (2008) Otherwise these kinds of Physics texts are just too big!


Advanced engineering mathematics / Erwin Kreyszig (2006, but many years, and other authors now using exact same title, and books dealing with Mathematica and with MATLAB

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
Classical mechanics / Herbert Goldstein, Charles Poole, John Safko. (2002)

Introduction to Hamiltonian dynamical systems and the N-body problem / Kenneth R. Meyer, Daniel C. Offin (2017)

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
So reading more of Raymond Serway's 1990 Physics text.

Up to about page 280, very thin paper. Reading about all manner of mechanical energy, and then rotational mechanics. Would be good stuff to build into a computations program, like an e-book built into a desk top program.

It is complex, and not necessarily intuitive straight off.

Book goes up to page 650 with mechanical, thermal, and vibration things. Then it shifts to Electro-Magnetism. Goes quite far, then to light and optics. Then one chapter on Special Relativity, then one on Quantum Mechanics. Then that's the end of the 1150 page text.

I want to be able to go through such books as quickly and easily, and to be able to apply the material as easily as the people do who write such books.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
6 years ago
A course in mathematical methods for physicists / Russell L. Herman , 2014 CRC Press

CRC Press stuff is always good. It is an oversize folio.

8.8 x 1.8 x 11.2 inches 792 pages
https://www.amazon.com/Course-Mathematic…

https://www.amazon.com/Course-Mathematic…

This is kind of standard math, like for Numerical Analysis.

Sometimes books titled like this are really about General Relativity, Tensor Analysis.

SJG

I'll have this book about the opera Carmen in hand soon.
Georges Bizet : his life and work / Winton Dean. (1965)

Carmen, full opera
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sl10z41-…

Okay, this Indiana University version is playing now. It is from their 2015-2016 season.
https://music.indiana.edu/iumusiclive/

Better way to get to it:

Part 1
https://media.dlib.indiana.edu/media_obj…

Part 2
https://media.dlib.indiana.edu/media_obj…

And here, program with some commentary:
https://music.indiana.edu/events/program…

So lets see how some of this sounds when played fixed pitch, i.e. organ:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKNoVOBg…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Gk6J5I_…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DR5YCijs…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEY5Lg_6…


Hal Ashby
https://www.theringer.com/movies/2018/9/…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hal_Ashby

Obama Delivers Stinging Rebuke, Standing Up To Bullies, not following them.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/supposed-stan…

Roe v. Wade in Danger: Released Docs Reveal Kavanaugh Thinks Abortion Decision Is Not “Settled Law”
https://www.democracynow.org/2018/9/7/ro…

As 400+ Children Remain Separated From Parents, Trump Admin Wants to Detain Kids Indefinitely
https://www.democracynow.org/2018/9/7/as…

Mason, 1971
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fyeJk5W…

Hypercapitalism : the modern economy, its values, and how to change them / Larry Gonick, Timothy Kasser. (2018, graphic novel)

https://www.amazon.com/Hypercapitalism-M…

HEADSTONE CIRCUS - Headstone Circus - 1968 (FULL ALBUM) [Psychedelic Rock]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZYPAasu…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Mathematics for physical chemistry / Robert G. Mortimer. (2013)

Numerical methods for chemical engineers using Excel, VBA, and MATLAB / Victor J. Law (2013 CRC Press)

Optimal control for chemical engineers / Simant Ranjan Upreti. (2013)

Plasma physics and engineering / Alexander Fridman, Lawrence A. Kennedy (2011 CRC Press)

SJG

Previews: The War
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEItXS35…

avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
Back in my day Calculus was not taught in high school so my high school physics was not calculus based. Then in college I took calculus based physics.

I think using The Calculus makes physics far more understandable. The same can be said for Economics. It’s a disservice to students to teach non calculus based physics and Econ. Teach them a little calculus first and the subject will be far more understood
avatar for SirLapdancealot
SirLapdancealot
3 years ago
@motorhead mathematics is the language of science. Every scientific law has a math formula associated with it. And often it is calculus based.

And the more expert you become at understanding the mathematics of science you, by definition, become more expert at understanding the science itself.

So absolutely, you must know the math* behind all science to truly understand it. If you don't, you will always have a limited understanding as compared to someone that does.

*And by knowing the math, I don't just mean looking at the formulas in their base forms. By truly understanding I mean that you can crunch numbers and do actual numerical calculations using said formulas. Furthermore, by understanding the calculus you can take that formula and integrate it or take a derivative of it and also combine all this with other basic formulas to determine new scientific laws and also understand how everything relates. This is exactly what Newton and Leibnitz did with inventing calculus at the same time deriving all the laws of motion. They started with a simple momentum formula but then with mathematical expertise this knowledge expanded into the laws and formulas for kinetic energy, acceleration/deceleration, potential energy, work, power, and numerous other laws of physics.
avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
^^
Good explanation. You’re exactly right. My high school physics was just memorize the formula and plug and chug.

When I actually learned how the formula was derived everything seems so elegant.

Designers of the curriculum believe they are making it easier on the student by making the math requirements less rigorous but in fact it makes learning science harder
avatar for SirLapdancealot
SirLapdancealot
3 years ago
^^^ oh so true with your last point. And at the masters and PhD level it gets even harder. The math gets extremely complicated where you have to get into calculus in three dimensions through the understanding of vector calculus and solving multi-variable differential equations. It's certainly beyond me outside of just a basic understanding at the PhD level.

Look at the discovery of the Higgs field and Higgs Boson particle. It took years of mathematical derivation by very smart mathematicians and scientists to mathematically derive them from the math that defined the four basic forces of physics. Without the math there would never have been the experiments at CERN and the other particle accelerator (I forget the name) to prove the existence of that particle and field.

Schools that don't emphasize the math are doing science students an injustice, IMHO.
avatar for SirLapdancealot
SirLapdancealot
3 years ago
Anyway my preferred physics book is "Physics for Scientists and Engineers" by Giancoli. I think I have the second edition.

"I want to be able to go through such books as quickly and easily, and to be able to apply the material as easily as the people do who write such books."

^^^ @san_jose_creep to start, are you actually understanding the math when you read these books? And again you can't just read the books and assume you understand. If you really want to understand them like the writers, you better be able to do advanced calculus derivations by hand, on a good old pad of paper. Crunch some numbers and apply the formulas in a real life example too. Furthermore, like the authors of those books, you'll need to take all that math to a lab or real world scenario and perform an experiment with the right measurement tools to validate all the math you are using for said calculations.

At this point all I see you doing is regurgitating a casual observation from what you are reading from the text of said books. You are giving a summary level of what you are reading but you're not getting into any of the math. I highly doubt that you really understand based on your posts.

Sorry, but this isn't enough. Book learning from the library is good but also is very limited. The people that wrote those books are doing much much more than you are saying you are doing in this thread.
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
The Romance of Engines
Suzuki, Takashi, 1928-

The romance of engines / by Takashi Suzuki. 1977
*-

Modern thermodynamics : from heat engines to dissipative structures / Dilip Kondepudi, Ilya Prigogine (1998)
*-

SJG

Darbuka Drums - Belly Dancing Music
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Sitri @ The Descent - Industrial Fusion Dance
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVkloqEB…

Alicia BellyCraft - Gothic Industrial / Dark Fusion Belly Dance
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gT121UUh…

Verrina - Gothic / Tribal Fusion Belly Dance - March 2010
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGnY-L53…

avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
^^^^^ no, I am not able to do anything like that.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Charles A. Holt, old book, good author
https://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Elec…

Roger Harrington, he actually has two books
https://www.amazon.com/Time-Harmonic-Ele…

Electromagnetic Fields and Waves - Lorrain and Corson

https://www.amazon.com/Electromagnetic-F…

and is this really the who book pdfed?
https://www.zuj.edu.jo/download/electrom…

Introduction to electromagnetic fields and waves / [by] Dale R. Corson [and] Paul Lorrain. (1962 original editon)

And this David J. Griffiths goes much further than you would usually find in an upper division undergrad text on this:
https://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Elec…

This guy has got about 3 main books. This is the second:

Introduction to quantum mechanics / David J Griffiths. (2017)
+

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Dyadic Green's functions in electromagnetic theory / Chen-to Tai. / Chen-to Tai. (1971)

Roger Harrington's books revolve around Green's Theorem.

Vtg Chen-To Tai / Dyadic Green's Functions in Electromagnetic Theory / 1st Ed 1971 Hardcover – January 1, 1971
https://www.amazon.com/Dyadic-Greens-Fun…

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
This book goes way back, but it is good. Starts off with Special Relativity

Modern Physics Sixth Edition
by Paul A. Tipler (Author), Ralph Llewellyn (Author)
https://www.amazon.com/Modern-Physics-Pa…
Modern physics / Paul A. Tipler, Ralph A. Llewellyn.
*

My interests are really only in things which have industrial applications. But this book is still good to spend time with.

Introduction to High Energy Physics
by Perkins, Donald H
Introduction to high energy physics / Donald H. Perkins. (2000 4th edition)
*

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
This is a narrative of the history of Solid State Physics, from the beginings of quantum mechanics in the 1920s and its application to Chemistry.

Out of the Crystal Maze
Out of the Crystal Maze: Chapters from The History of Solid State Physics
by Lillian Hoddeson (Editor), Ernst Braun (Editor), Jurgen Teichmann (Editor), Spencer Weart (Editor)

Out of the crystal maze : chapters from the history of solid- state physics / edited by Lillian Hoddeson ... [et al.].
*-

Of course a big part of this would be the contributions of Stanford's Walter Harrison(DOB 1930), LCAO, Linear Combinations of Atomic Orbitals

He has written many books and some are Dover reprints. Their stuff is always good.

But here is a nice basic book:

Applied quantum mechanics / Walter A. Harrison. (2000)

SJG

Weather Report - Live at Montreux (1976) [Remastered]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfvfXA2S…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Chemistry of Advanced Materials (1998)
Interrante, Leonard V., 1939-
Hampden-Smith, Mark J.


SJG

WOW! Burma Food
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djqAKV1H…

Miles Davis and Thelonious Monk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7zaUceG…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Analytical Chemistry
An Introduction
Skoog, Douglas A.
West, Donald M.
2000

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Non-Equilibrium Statistical Mechanics (Dover Books on Physics)
Ilya Prigogine
https://www.amazon.com/Non-Equilibrium-S…

Dover Reprints are always good

Modern Thermodynamics: From Heat Engines to Dissipative Structures
Dilip Kondepudi, Ilya Prigogine
https://www.amazon.com/Modern-Thermodyna…

Exploring Complexity: An Introduction (1989)
by Gregoire Nicolis (Author), G. Nocolis (Author), Ilya Prigogine (Author)
https://www.amazon.com/Exploring-Complex…
Exploring complexity : an introduction / Grégoire Nicolis, Ilya Prigogine (widely disseminated)
+

Order Out of Chaos: Man's New Dialogue with Nature (1984)
by Ilya Prigogine (Author), Isabelle Stengers (Author), Alvin Toffler (Foreword)
https://www.amazon.com/Order-out-chaos-d…

The End of Certainty (1987)
Ilya Prigogine
https://www.amazon.com/End-Certainty-Ily…

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
A cyclotron is a type of particle accelerator invented by Ernest O. Lawrence in 1929–1930 at the University of California, Berkeley,[1][2] and patented in 1932.[3][4] A cyclotron accelerates charged particles outwards from the center of a flat cylindrical vacuum chamber along a spiral path.[5][6] The particles are held to a spiral trajectory by a static magnetic field and accelerated by a rapidly varying electric field. Lawrence was awarded the 1939 Nobel Prize in Physics for this invention.[6][7]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclotron

SJG

Big Butt
https://tuscl.net/photo.php?id=10593
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Solid state physics / Neil W. Ashcroft, N. David Mermin (1976 826 pages)

Modern physics / Paul A. Tipler, Ralph A. Llewellyn. (2012 6th ed)

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
You start working with the Schrodinger Equation and you just get the one quantum number, Energy, and that is an eigen value for the equation. But the above Paul Tipler book shows the key experiments which establish the other 3 quantum numbers.

To completely describe an electron in an atom, four quantum numbers are needed: energy (n), angular momentum (ℓ), magnetic moment (mℓ), and spin (ms).

https://courses.lumenlearning.com/introc….



And all of this applies not just to elements in the periodic table, it also comes into play in molecular and crystalline orbitals, and this is how work is being done on exotic semiconductors and magnetic materials.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Raymond A. Serway

Modern physics / Raymond A. Serway, Clement J. Moses, Curt A. Moyer. (1989)

a book which looks similar to the above Paul Tippler book.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
The Hamiltonian of a system specifies its total energy—i.e., the sum of its kinetic energy (that of motion) and its potential energy (that of position)—in terms of the Lagrangian function derived in earlier studies of dynamics and of the position and momentum of each of the particles.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamiltonia…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_nu…

https://courses.lumenlearning.com/introc…

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Modern physics / Paul A. Tipler, Ralph A. Llewellyn. (2012 6th ed)
this book has gotten a lot bigger than the versions I remember.

Relativity, Michelson-Morely

Time dilation, length contraction, mass ponderation, and then the relations between momentum and kinetic energy at relativistic speeds.

Extra materials from publisher
https://www.macmillanlearning.com/studen…

Doppler Effect

Wavelength / Frequency shift of star light

Mass / Energy Conversion and Binding Energy

General Relativity, handled in a broad brush manner, because full mathematical treatment requires tensor analysis, which is beyond the scope of this book.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Tipler talks about some ongoing research:

Higgs boson (this edition was from 2012)

Fe-based superconductors. I had not heard of this.

Single-cell biological lasers ?

Anti-Hydrogen atoms trapped for 1000 seconds

High temp superconductors, up to 130 deg K ( liquid Nitrogen -196 deg C, so it is cold enough)

Book has excellent table of nuclides, with their half lives. Many elements have three or more isotopes with a prevalence of 10% or more.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
LN2, 77 deg K. So 130 deg K is plenty high enough.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
So, early measurements of charge and mass of an electron.

Blackbody Radiation

Raleigh-Jeans Equation, Plank's Law

Photoelectric Effect

X Rays and the Compton Effect

But these things are not the reason I got hold of this book.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Continuing with Paul Tipler:

refraction and dispersion of light in prisms. Atomic Spectra.

Rutherford's Nuclear Model and Scattering.

Size of the Nucleus.

Bohr Model of the Hydrogen Atom.

We have the idea of a Rydberg atom, a very huge atom. Postulated and then found in outer space. About as big as a red blood cell. Tipler talks about this as a new area of Physics.

We get into X-Ray spectra.

None of these are the reason I got hold of this book, but they are all steps in the transition from 19th Century to 20th Century Physics.

SJG

Ginger Baker's Air Force - 12 Gates of the City (1970)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ED_6dYfj…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
So we have the Louis de Broglie postulate, wave particle duality, 1924

Davisson-Germer Experiment at bell labs, electron diffraction, Aug 1925.

Diffraction of helium atoms

Wave Packets and the Uncertainty Principle

Probabilistic Interpretation of the Wave Function

Minimum Energy of a Particle in a Box

and now finally:

The Schrodinger Equation, 1926

equation for Psi function, and in position and time, and with a potential function V, and a Hamiltonian E.

And so of course their are Eigen Values or Eigen States or Eigen Wave Forms.

SJG

Intro to Kabbalah Part I - The Tree of Life & Hebrew Letters
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqKUZ4by…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
The Ammonia Atomic Clock, NH3.

The three hydrogens are in a plane. The nitrogen can be above or below. And it oscillates at a frequency of 2.3768 E10 hz. This is first standard in atomic clocks and it is an example to tunneling.

Tunneling is used in Tunnel Diodes and Josephson Junctions.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Hermite Polynmials
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermite_po…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legendre_p…

Both involved with the Schrodinger Equation.

And the reason I got hold of this book, the solution to the Schrodinger Equation, and using Spherical Coordinates, it what gives rise to 3 of the electron quantum numbers, and that is what gives predictions which look like the Periodic Table. It gets you all except spin.

So there are not specific experiments to get to 3 quantum numbers, but it does agree with experiments, especially with the spectra emitted.

SJG

Intro to Kabbalah Part I - The Tree of Life & Hebrew Letters
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqKUZ4by…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
When more than one set of quantum numbers yields the identical energy levels, that is called degereracy. But usually this does not really happen because of some assymetry, magnetic fields, something.

And then of course there is spin, which there is an essential experiment for, and spin is part of what gives things their magnetic properties.

And then there is this idea of reduced mass nuclei, to give the atom a net zero momentum as the electron behavior is calculated.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
So when you extend the Schrodinger Equation to three dimensions, and in sperical coordinats, you get 3 quantum numbers,

n = 1, 2, 3 ///

l = 0, 1, 2, ... (n -1 )

m = -l, (-l+1)... 0, 1, 2, ... +l

known as S, P, D, F, G

But then we get into spin.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Hermite Polynomials and Harmonic Oscillators, Schrodinger Equation:

Affordable Learning Solutions
https://chem.libretexts.org/Courses/Paci…

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Hermit Polynomials
https://mathworld.wolfram.com/HermitePol…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermite_po…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_He…


Orthogonal polynomials of several variables / Charles F. Dunkl, University of Virginia, Yuan Xu, University of Oregon (2014)

So much I have to learn!

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Modern physics / Paul A. Tipler, Ralph A. Llewellyn. (2012 6th ed)
this book has gotten a lot bigger than the versions I remember.

It does much more with High Energy Physics, Astrophysics, and Cosmology.

The thing he just does with a very broad brush is General Relativity, and it is because the math is way too involved. And Quantum Mechanics never has been reconciled to General Relativity.

But he does talk about efforts at CERN to get the Higgs Boson.

For myself though my primary interest is in things which have proximal industrial applications. So this includes, but it not limited to:



For myself though my primary interest is in things which have proximal industrial applications. So this includes, but it not limited to:

Numerical solutions for quantum mechanics, including multiple electrons, Magnetic and Semiconductor materials, excited states and lasers, Spintronics,



Talks about Boltzmann Distribution, which is classical, as opposed to Bose-Einstein and Fermi-Dirac, which depend on which way you go with the Pauli Principle. That plus or minus 1 in the denominator.

And then the curious phenomenon of 3He displaying super fluidity.

And then specific heats for gases, Cv, and for solids too.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Photon Gas, Bose-Einstien

Specific Heats of Gases

Fermion Gases

Ionic, Covalent, Dipole-Dipole, and Metallic Bonds

H2+ Molecule

Polar and Nonpolar Molecules

Diatomic Molecules

Vibrational Energy Levels

Absorption, Emission, Stimulated Emission, and Scattering

Lasers and Masers

Ruby Laser, Helium-Neon Lasers

Solid State Physics

Solids, Ionic and Covalent

Classical Conduction

Quantum Theory of Conduction

Heat Capacity

Magnetism in Solids

Paramagnetism, Diamagnetism, Ferromagnetism

Spintronics

Band Theory, Kronig-Penney Model

Quantum Wells

Hall Effect, Spin Hall Effect, Junctions

Superconductivity

BCS Theory

High-Temperature Superconductivity

Josephson Junction

Nuclear Physics

Magneto Resisive Random Access Memory
MRRAM

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Felix Bloch, Swiss American Physicist

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felix_Bloc…

SJG

Gimme Shelter [Rolling Stones Cover] - Britny Lobas at The Roost Austin, Tx
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B71GZQYH…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Introduction to Solid State Physics
Kittel, Charles (1989)
+

Modern physics / Raymond A. Serway, Clement J. Moses, Curt A. Moyer (1989)
*

SJG

Gimme Shelter [Rolling Stones Cover] - Britny Lobas at The Roost Austin, Tx
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B71GZQYH…
avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
Fundamentals of Geophysics by William Lowrie is the standard introductory text for a first undergraduate course in Geophysics

But I’ve never met a stripper who interested in Geophysics

But some do well with signal processing.
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Strippers do well with Signal Processing? What do you see them doing? How much do they really understand?

https://www.amazon.com/Fundamentals-Geop…

could be interesting.

Thermal Physics, Charles Kittel and Herbert Kroemer
2nd ed 1980

This book won awards for how good a job it does explaining things and for how well they use illustrations and diagrams.

https://www.amazon.com/Thermal-Physics-2…

Don't seem to be as many copies around as I would have thought. So I also see these newer books:

A Guide to Thermal Physics: from the Fundamentals thru Callen-Level Equilibrium Thermodynamics
by Chris McMullen (2010)
0

An Introduction to Thermal Physics 1st Edition
by Daniel V. Schroeder (2021)
https://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Ther…
0

but we have this:
An introduction to thermal physics / C.J. Adkins. (1987)
*

Kittel and Kroemer
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_ph…

https://physics.weber.edu/thermal/links.…

SJG

People have called this song, "An Apocalyptic Gem".

The School of Rock plays Gimme Shelter with Special guest star Orianthi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwlRGS0x…

Gimme Shelter - Portland School of Rock House Band
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVnnXeER…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Women and Physical Science?

German Chancellor Angela Merkel was a Physical Chemist. We have a woman on this forum who has a Mathematics Degree. They are out there.

And then we had a member who taught college Physics classes and he discussed the merits and demerits of some of these texts, like Halliday and Resnick. And then this Thermal Physics book, its really thermal physics, but on top of quantum mechanics, so if one follows this it gets into what is today being called Numerical Chemistry.

Maths in Chemistry: Numerical Methods for Physical and Analytical Chemistry (De Gruyter Textbook)
by Prerna Bansal | Sep 7, 2020

https://www.amazon.com/Maths-Chemistry-N…

Selected problems in physical chemistry : strategies and interpretations / Predrag-Peter Ilich. (2010)
*

Chaos : from simple models to complex systems / Massimo Cencini, Fabio Cecconi, Angelo Vulpiani.
*

And then countless people on this forum have taken a class which uses a book like this Thermal Physics. Strip club enthusiasts are not all circle jerkers, it is just a clique of circle jerkers that are bullying anyone else off of the board.

SJG

https://www.amazon.com/Romwe-Womens-Slee…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
So Kittel and Kroemer feel that their book is logically better than the books they learned from. As this is 1980 book, I know not what might have been before.

They lay out the logical development in an introduction. Fundamental temperature is multiplied by the Boltzmann constant to get conventional temperature. In MKS Boltzmann constant is Joules / deg K.

Then entropy is the log of the multiplicity. Remember this is based on quantum mechanics. And though they write "log" by context they mean log base e.

THen you have to multiply this entropy by Boltzmann to get conventional temperature.

Then they define 1 over fundamental temperature (tau) as the partial of fundamental entropy with respect to energy, with Number and Volume constant. THey you multiply this tau by Boltzmann to get conventional temperature.

For two bodies brought into thermal contact, energy will flow so as to maximize entropy, and this happens when this above partial derivative giving 1/tau are equal on both sides.

SJG

The All Girls Power Band from School of Roc LA plays Dangerous
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhGGK8le…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUQ-wIxQ…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwlRGS0x…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
^ Marites, I think they will let you into the circle jerk room.

*******************************************

So this gets into probability and that means permutations and combinations, and hence factorials.

I had already spoken about how you need special treatment for this in computing machines.

I these examples the total items, N is small. You can keep tally of the factors, to keep it of integer scale, and then most of them will cancel out.

But they also talk about much larger cases, like 1E20, for the number of atoms in a sample you can see and hold. And then you can't keep it as integer and you can't expect exact cancellation. But just coming with the floating point value will be an overflow, and even the time involved in the multiplication is prohibitive.

So they have the Stirling Approximation for large factorials, and you can get the log of it. And log always means base e here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirling%2…

And then they do something with the Gaussian Integral. Everyone knows that is an unsolvable integral.

So if you roll 2 six sided die, how many ways can you get a total of 2 or 12? One each. But how about for 5, 6, or 7? Lots of ways.

Well doing N large problems like this it takes on a gaussian distribution.

So what they do is change it to a 2 dimensional integral, and then to polar coordinates, and it is over the whole plane. This is all new to me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaussian_i…


SJG

The School of Rock plays Gimme Shelter with Special guest star Orianthi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwlRGS0x…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwpG4pe3…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Military electronics is speced to operate over about the maximum feasible temperature range. Sometimes though the way this is reflected in contracts leaves a lot of wiggle room. Just need it to work. Okay, but sometimes there is precise component matching and the electronics are very temperature sensitive. Sometimes this will pertain to things like the steering of missiles which allow our pilots to prevail over enemy air space defenses. So if our pilots are to have a chance in these duels, the equipment has to work as intended. And so this means the measurements have to be repeatable, and to get this you have to control temperature as closely as possible. Any slop in control of temperature during measurements means more slop in component characterization.

Kittel and Kroemer talk about a 1968 meeting where Physicists decided on some temperatures by definition. That is, with some phase transitions they are repeatable to a close degree than the degree to which you can determine when on the Kelvin scale they belong.

So I am going to look at some. They like triple points because melting and boiling point depend on pressure. Triple point sets its own pressure.

So they defined the triple point of pure water to be at 273.16 deg K ( 0.01 deg C)

I want to look at phase diagrams for Water, Ammonia, Carbon Dioxide, Oxygen, Nitrogen, and the melting point of Zinc.

Water, this affirms the 0.01 deg C triple point. Water is the strange one because solid gets less dense than liquid.

https://courses.lumenlearning.com/chemin…

boiling point does move around.


Ammonia

looks like melting point has no dependence on pressure?

https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/ammon…

Triple point pressure of ammonia: 0.0601 atm = 0.0609 bar = 6090 Pa = 0.8832 psi (=lbf/in2)
Triple point temperature of ammonia: 195.5 K = -77.65 °C = -107.77 °F

You can reach that with LN2, but can you have and buy pure ammonia? Is ammonia considered a van der walls solid? It always seems to be that the anti-water in this world.

https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/ammon…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonia

TBC

SJG

Pantera
https://tuscl.net/photo.php?id=10783

The All Girls Power Band from School of Roc LA plays Dangerous
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhGGK8le…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonia

NH3 boils at −33.34 °C (−28.012 °F) at a pressure of one atmosphere, so the liquid must be stored under pressure or at low temperature.

Melting point −77.73 °C (−107.91 °F; 195.42 K) (Triple point at 6.060 kPa, 195.4 K)

So to have pure ammonia, it has to be under pressure or at low temp. Maybe you could make it?

So if you use the triple point as your temp ref, the pressure takes care of itself. But you need to start by evacuating a vessel. ANd then the pressure will be low, so you have to have the vessel well sealed. ANd if you want to immerse temp sensors for calibration, not so easy.

Melting and boiling points do depend on pressure, but melting usually depends less. Will an HVAC system change the pressure enough to matter. Can you just call up the airport or look online, will that work well enough.

Ammonia used to be used as a refrigerant. Sulphur dioxide too. So I add Sulphur dioxide to the list.

Ammonia is toxic, and Sulphur dioxide is worse.

Sulfur dioxide:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulfur_dio…


Boiling point −10 °C (14 °F; 263 K)

Melting point −72 °C; −98 °F; 201 K

So if you have a lab setup that runs on LN2 and does military electronics, these temps are all fine for calibrations.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
so all these temps are reasonable, but how this would actually work still remains very complex. Want to look at CO2, O2, N2, and the melting point of Tin

CO2, this is the strange one, no liquid except at very high pressure:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_dio…

phase diagram

its about 7 atmospheres before you have liquid.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Carbo…

Critical point (T, P) 304.128(15) K[2] (30.978(15) °C), 7.3773(30) MPa[2] (72.808(30) atm), so they are saying 72 atmospheres



^ correction, above is not the triple point

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_dio…

Triple point 216.58 K (−56.57 °C), 518.5 kPa

Temperatures very reach able with LN2. And this one has a high pressure triple point.

O2 has a triple point which is too cold. But boiling point at 1 atm is

https://www.britannica.com/science/oxyge…

boiling point −183.0 °C (−297.4 °F)

N2 boiling point

boiling point −195.8 °C (−320.4 °F)

Tin, melting point
melting point 231.97 °C (449.54 °F)

There is still much much more I need to know about this. Can you use metal containers, for good heat conductivity? How can you know the barametric pressure, and well enough.

Here right now, SJ int

30.03 in
Lat: 37.35917°NLon: 121.92417°WElev: 59ft.
...
San Jose, San Jose International Airport (KSJC)

30.03 in (1016.93 mb)

SJG
avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
Vegetable lasagna should be band
avatar for Icee Loco (asshole)
Icee Loco (asshole)
3 years ago
Motirhead why are you trolling sjg? To join the bandwagon?
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Vegetable lasagna is not any good for doing temperature calibration.

So Kittel and Kroemer are talking about Plank Radiation or Black Body Radiation, Photons, but then they are also talking about Phonons, and electrical noise in resistors. They defined fundamental temperature and fundamental entropy. You multiply these by the Boltzmann constant to get conventional temperature and entropy.

They have defined 1/temperature as the partial derivative of energy with volume and number of particles held constant. I am accustomed to this. But do I understand it, have an intuitive feel for it?

A lot of the early books in this are were written by Mark Zemansky

Heat and thermodynamics : an intermediate textbook for students of physics, chemistry, and engineering / by Mark W. Zemansky. (1943), want this old edition because the page count is a big lower.


KSJC barometric pressure
Pressure (altimeter) 29.95 in. Hg (1014 hPa)

Slightly above the standard point, but lower than it was a few minutes ago. How does one do temperature calibrations?

SJG

School of Rock AllStar Students perform "I Heard It Through The Grapevine" by CCR
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQDa2j8W… Zemansky
avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
I just hated no one commenting on this thread.
avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
Can pizza be used for temperature calibration?

A hot slice of pizza will often burn the roof of the mouth because the cheese contains fats that can reach a very high temperature. Fats can hold heat for a long time. Consuming them before they have had time to cool can result in a burn.
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
No, but good temperature control is important when making pizza in a home oven. Some have cast concrete slabs for the home oven. Preheat the slab and then it helps cook the dough without burning the cheese.

Richard Feynman used to take his notebooks to his favorite strip club and work out problems. A while back someone PMed me about that.

There is likely to be a huge boom in sophisticated guided missiles, radar or otherwise.

There are people here besides me who have had experience with critical aspects of such things. Very good temperature control for making the measurements, so that they are repeatable, is sometimes over looked, and at great cost.

Kittel and Kromer talk about measuring temperature, the secondary or transfer measurements. Thermoelectric voltage of thermocouples, 400-1400 deg K ( you can go lower)
electrical resistance of metals (14 to 700 deg K) Platinum RTD remains the gold standard, much more accurate than thermocouples.

germanium semiconductor, each sensor individually calibrated, for 0.05 to 77 deg K.

If you can, just calibrate your RTD and the electronics that measures it right on site. Use good numerical calibration methods. But there are still other issues in play. Put your RTD in Copper pick ups, better thermal conductivity than Aluminum. Want everything at the same temperature.

SJG

The School of Rock plays Gimme Shelter with Special guest star Orianthi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwlRGS0x…
avatar for TheeOSU
TheeOSU
3 years ago
^

Сан-Хосе ползучести

San-Khose polzuchesti
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
So Kittel and Kroemer explain that if you have 2 systems in thermal contact, then the two partial derivatives of entropy with respect to energy will be equal. That is they are at the same temperature.

And that gets more to what I would say that to know the temperature of something you have to be able to bring something else into thermal equilibrium with it.

But you can't really get thins to the same temperature. Thermal equilibrium is a matter of degree. It is an approximation.

And there are other thermodynamics books where they life the requirement of thermal equilibrium and just talk about stead state.

Electrically heated and LN2 cooled temperature plates are great fun! But sometimes you really also need a temperature sensor on the top of you Device Under Test and an external digital loop, and also some patience. You also need to be concerned about frost, the atmosphere on the top of the place. And it matters if you expect your measurements to be repeatable.

This all relates to the Zeroth Law of Thermodynamics.

And then people like Ilya Prigogine did all of their work on Dissipative Structures, things which are never in thermal equilibrium.

SJG

The School of Rock plays Gimme Shelter with Special guest star Orianthi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwlRGS0x…
avatar for TheeOSU
TheeOSU
3 years ago
^

Сан-Хосе ползучести

San-Khose polzuchesti
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Making Pizza, think crust and with your own dough, in residential oven is a challenge. The commercial ovens make metal contact on the bottom.

So if you want it to work residential you have to do some trial and error. I got a second over rack so I could put a heat shied over the top of the pizza to protect the cheese from getting burned by infra red.

Flan is another tricky one. They say caramelize the sugar in a sauce pan and then pour into the backing pan. But that means too much temperature drop. Best if you can figure out exactly how to caramelize the sugar in your baking pan, and then let it cool a bit and put the interior stuff in.

Omega Therm Platinum RTD's
https://www.omega.com/en-us/resources/rt…

2, 3, or 4 wire
https://www.omega.com/en-us/resources/rt…

SJG


The School of Rock plays Gimme Shelter with Special guest star Orianthi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwlRGS0x…

You always want to keep your women in high heels and makeup
Desparks
https://tuscl.net/photo.php?id=3125
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
A lot of people on this board are just financializers. They don't really do anything or know anything. But this is not everyone here.

**************************************************

So Kittel and Kroemer write about Chemical Potential and Gibbs Distribution, as well as Helmholtz Free Energy.

They talk about Gibbs Terms and Gibbs Sums (zeta) and Absolute Activity (Lambda). This is not classical thermodynamics because particles and quantized and energy is too. So we get these probability and occupancy stats.

They talk a lot about Lead Acid Batteries too.

page 133 they have a table which lays out all the partial derivative definitions.

Going to talk about Ideal Gases, but these are not the classical, they are the Bose-Einstein type and the Fermi-Dirac Type. So the macro scale stats are different. Going to talk about the number of internal degrees of freedom, which is a kind of challenging concept in classical thermodynamics too.

Talks about what is an is not reversible. Gas expanding suddenly into double volume has turbulence and is not reversible.

SJG

The Rolling Stones - Gimme Shelter - 2013 School of Rock AllStars Team 4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we-3Y3vh…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
So as we look at fundamental temperature and fundamental energy, in the units that is done with, when the energy in question minus the chemical potential, is much much larger than fundamental temperature, then both Fermi-Dirac and Bose-Einstein become identical to the classical limit.

A process without a change of entropy is called an insentropic process or an adiabatic process.

Clausius-Clapeyron Equation is the Vapor Pressure Equation.


SJG

Sex Slave Uni
https://tuscl.net/photo.php?id=10885

Claudette Colbert
https://tuscl.net/photo.php?id=10893

The Rolling Stones - Gimme Shelter - 2013 School of Rock AllStars Team 4
https://pleasershoes.com/collections/ple…

Pleaser 10 inch
https://pleasershoes.com/collections/ple…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Fluke Triple point of water shell, 4 sizes and pick between quarts or glass. About $1600

https://us.flukecal.com/products/tempera…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkFmrWsS…

And from National Physics Laboratory
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKDW1e3i…

I guess these cells have already had the air vacuumed out and then have been sealed up with just liquid water and vapor water.

SJG

Pleaser 10" w/ ankle strap
https://pleasershoes.com/collections/all…

avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Another water triple point cell video.

https://www.nist.gov/video/triple-point-….

"
A triple-point cell is a sealed glass vessel containing water of a specific isotopic composition. Adding a mixture of dry ice and alcohol into an open well in the center of the cell causes the surrounding water to freeze into an ice mantle. The cell now contains three phases of water in equilibrium - liquid, gas, and solid. After allowing the ice to anneal over a period of at least ten days, the temperature of the triple-point can be measured with a platinum-resistance thermometer.
"

anneal over 10 days!

Holy Shit!

And they suggest that you do use a platinum resistance thermometer.

Really, 10 days before it stabilizes?

Measures voltage required tp maintain constant current (this is not a bridge circuit)

Also, how does this temperature control bath work and how does it not form ice bridges?

Kelvin
https://www.nist.gov/si-redefinition/kel…

Kelvin Present
https://www.nist.gov/si-redefinition/kel…

SJG
avatar for CandymanOfProvidence
CandymanOfProvidence
3 years ago
What leads to explosive diarrhea is the triple point of caca.
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Fluke makes good stuff!

https://www.testequity.com/product/14043…

$2,852

This is probably used / new.

10 thermocouple types and 7 RTD types.

SJG

Newshour Today
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm8vQOop…

https://tuscl.net/photo.php?id=3372
avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
Psychophysics quantitatively investigates the relationship between physical stimuli and the sensations and perceptions they produce.

Strip clubs could be a good laboratory to test out various hypotheses
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
^ People have tried to use EEG BioFeedBack to show this, sometimes putting the data through fast Fourier transform.

Not everyone who posts on this forum is a Financializer. Some people do real things and that sometimes is involved with testing and measuring.

Fluke manuals

https://assets.testequity.com/te1/Docume…

https://www.fluke.com/en-us/product/cali…

This version might be better for an automatic test system
https://www.fluke.com/en-us/product/cali…

built in 24V power supply. I guess that means no Wall Wart.

https://www.fluke.com/en-us/product/cali…

a B version
https://www.fluke.com/en-us/product/cali…

Users manual, pdf/WORD 50 pages
https://dam-assets.fluke.com/s3fs-public…

Fluke Corporation
P.O. Box 9090
Everett, WA 98206-9090
U.S.A.

Still can't see that this as any digital control connection.

Fluke Process Tools and Accessorties
https://dam-assets.fluke.com/s3fs-public…

still unclear.

SJG

Newshour Today
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm8vQOop…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
RS-232 interface

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Fluke hand held dry well, w/ RS-232

https://www.testequipmentdepot.com/fluke…

The Fluke Calibration 9100SA156 Handheld Dry-Well Temperature Calibrator with Block "A", 35 °C to 375 °C (95 °F to 707 °F) may be used as a portable instrument or bench top temperature calibrator for calibrating thermocouple and RTD temperature probes. This instrument is small enough to use in the field, and accurate enough to use in the lab. Calibrations may be done over a range of 35°C to 375°C (95°F to 707°F). Temperature display and setability resolution is 0.1 degrees.

The temperature is accurately controlled by Fluke's digital controller. The controller uses a precision platinum RTD as a sensor and controls the well temperature with a triac driven heater.

Only goes down to 35 deg C.

But how does it work?

"
The temperature is accurately controlled by Fluke's digital controller. The controller uses a precision platinum RTD as a sensor and controls the well temperature with a triac driven heater.
"

So this is hot only, and with the accuracy of a precision platinum RTD?

52 pages
https://www.testequipmentdepot.com/fluke…


SJG

Linda Ronstadt - You're No Good - 2016 School of Rock AllStars Team 6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMM5bjkK…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
So above has an aluminum block for its dry block. Various size holes in it for inserting probes. Loop closed around platinum RTD and NIST of standards traceable calibration papers.

Close to set point it has proportional controls using a triac.

Some temp plates are not proportional for hot, and none are proportional using CO2 or LN2, that is always valve open or valve closed.

I still like the idea of being able to use a phase change, and triple point is the best. But not that easy to do beyond water.

SJG

Linda Ronstadt - You're No Good - 2016 School of Rock AllStars Team 6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMM5bjkK…
avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
I declare this thread closed! 😊
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Not everyone who likes strip clubs is a financializer. Some people do real things and know about real things.

This thread has only just started.

Fluke
Drywell, Temperature Calibrator
https://www.zoro.com/fluke-drywell-tempe…

RS-232 interface, accurate to 0.25 deg C

Typical Cooling Time: 20 min (Ambient to -25 Degrees C) ( how does this get down to -25 deg C ?)

Here it says:

Temperature Range: -13 Degrees to 284 Degrees F/-25 Degrees to 140 Degrees C

For Stem Diameter: 1/16 in, 1/8 in, 3/16 in, 1/4 in, 3/8 in, 1/2 in

Fluke #9103-A-156 Specifications
https://www.fluke-direct.com/product/flu…

54 page manual
https://www.fluke-direct.com/pdfs/cache/…

SJG

Linda Ronstadt - You're No Good - 2016 School of Rock AllStars Team 6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMM5bjkK…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Okay, this uses thermo electric devices to control the temperature.

Those are very ineffiecient. BUt I guess for a narrow range and when you want good accuracy, I guess it is okay.

You aren't trying to change the temperature of anything very big.

THis costs $4800.

Manual gives the formulas for their 4 parameters calibration model. That is how this box works. But that is also how they want you to let it calibrate your probes. So you have to interpret the readings you get off of them that way.

Electrical only calibration would also help IMHO.

It all depends upon what this is for.

SJG

Linda Ronstadt - You're No Good - 2016 School of Rock AllStars Team 6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMM5bjkK…
avatar for motorhead
motorhead
3 years ago
CERN was established to prevent the brain drain of physicists to the US
avatar for TheeOSU
TheeOSU
3 years ago
C'mon creep, you're slipping up. You've only bumped this thread 4 times in the last hour, you're capable of so much more before you get shoved out the library doors.
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
True!

Remember we were to have had the Super Conducting Super Collider, near Dallas.

SJG
avatar for TheeOSU
TheeOSU
3 years ago
Check that 5 times in an hour, that's a little better.
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
We have Lawrence Livermore and SLAC, so some felt that the Super Conducting Super Collider should have been here. Some faulted the CA proposal for not being good. So it went to TX.

Site chosen and a small amount of work done.

Bill Clinton, trying to consolidate the budget cancelled it.

I think this was right. Let CERN run its course, then come along with something better.

One of the arguments was about super conducting magnets. CERN and SCSC use Liquid Helium super conduction. That is very costly.

The argument is that we are at the threshold of being able to use high temperature super conduction, meaning liquid nitrogen. Much lower cost. So SCSC cancelled and site left.

How close are we though?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-tempe….

I don't know how close we are.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-tempe…

https://iopscience.iop.org/journal/0953-…

Now they are even talking about room temperature super conductivity
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room-tempe…

https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1…

Still unclear as I see it.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Ammonia Calibration: How to calibrate for ammonia with Orion Star A meter ??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3dUibxq…

SJG

Linda Ronstadt - You're No Good - 2016 School of Rock AllStars Team 6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMM5bjkK…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
^

This is what they are talking about, not temperature

https://www.thermofisher.com/order/catal…

************

Ammonia
Triple point pressure 0.00609 MPa=MN/m2 0.0609 bar 0.0601 atm 0.883 psi=lbf/in2
Triple point temperature 195.5 K -77.65 °C -107.77 °F

I don't think this is very useful, to low in temp.


Sulphur Dioxide

The triple point of sulfur dioxide is at −73°C and 0.17 kPa

this could be better, but the stuff is really toxic.

Here, using Sulfur Hexaflouride to calibrate platinum RTDs. 40 pages
https://nvlpubs.nist.gov/nistpubs/jres/1…

just a few pages
https://www.cenam.mx/sm2016/pdf/1814.pdf

Ammonia versus Freon
https://www.process-cooling.com/articles…

Ethelene Glycol freezing point
8.78°F

for 100% it is
-12.8 deg C

SJG

avatar for TheeOSU
TheeOSU
3 years ago
So you post 3 more comments talking to yourself out of spite when I called you on the previous 5.
8 comments talking to yourself in approx 2 hours, you're a real POS!
Post some more dickwad!
avatar for CandymanOfProvidence
CandymanOfProvidence
3 years ago
In honor of the 100th comment in this thread:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm-upHSP…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Candyman, you are leaking, out the tail pipe. We need to remedy this. See if 4" will do the job.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Oatey-Grippe…

********************

Looking to temp testing systems. Can alcohol be used used to transfer cold? Look at Isopropyl Alcohol first.

https://www.britannica.com/science/isopr…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isopropyl_…

could be useful:
Melting point −89 °C (−128 °F; 184 K)

Boiling point 82.6 °C (180.7 °F; 355.8 K)

Phase behavior
Triple point 184.9 K (−88.2 °C), ? Pa

Heat capacity, cp 1.54 J/(gK) at 25°C

The exact value of the specific heat capacity of water is 4182 J/kg°C.

Looks feasible, but it is flammable. Need to learn more about what the common practices are.

SJG

avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
I had to make a call on someone to get my Raymond Serway Physics book back.

Once The Organization has a place beyond people's homes, we can start building a collection. This won't be with membership dues, it will be with other money that I control. I will focus on old text books because they are hard to otherwise get.

How about Automotive Anti-Freeze to transfer cold, and how many kinds are there? I think 2 kinds.

https://www.valvoline.com/en/what-is-ant….

https://www.tomkadleckia.com/what-is-ant…
talk about going down to -30 F

https://www.valvoline.com/en/engine-cool…

Antifreeze is really divided into 2 different types – IAT and OAT antifreeze. IAT (inorganic acid technology) antifreeze is the green antifreeze of old, and the universal standard for over 70 years. During the late 80’s, cars began using more and more aluminum parts in engines, and the need to come up with a better, longer lasting antifreeze led to OAT (organic acid technology) antifreeze. While any IAT green antifreeze can be mixed with other green, mixing OAT antifreeze with other types is not recommended. Many manufacturers developed their own blend of OAT antifreeze, with less of more silicates and phosphates, and in doing so, developed a specific color of antifreeze to identify it. You should check your owner’s manual, to check on what type or color of antifreeze your car takes. One of the most common, and longstanding coolants of this type is DEX COOL®, which was developed by GM in the late 1980’s and has been used ever since. You can find out more about the history and details of different types of antifreeze here!

talks about -34 deg F

https://www.autozone.com/diy/antifreeze-…

https://www.walmart.com/browse/auto-tire…


So let me look now at electronics specified temperature ranges:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_…

Commercial: 0 ° to 70 °C
Industrial: −40 ° to 85 °C
Military: −55 ° to 125 °C

Full Military: −55 °C to 125 °C
Automotive: −40 °C to 125 °C
AEC-Q100 Level 2: −40 °C to 105 °C
Extended Industrial: −40 °C to 85 °C
Industrial: −20 °C to 85 °C

Very hard to do 125 deg C reliable semiconductor operation, when that is the ambient. Often only having to go to 85 deg C

-55 is hard to reach, and some semiconductor stuff will have carrier freeze out. But it can be done.

-34 deg F is about -35 deg C. Not low enough for all.

Only miltary wants -55 deg C. Most stuff only wants -40 deg C.

Automotive is a harsh environment, but going to 125 deg C is very hard to do while maintaining reliability.

SJG

Shirley Manson
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYJ1jNnG…
avatar for rickmacrodong
rickmacrodong
3 years ago
SJG what will the membership dues cost?
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Only men pay, women never pay anything. And we will help people with their careers to make sure they can pay. And because of being in the org there are all sorts of things one will not need to be spending money.

The dues will be significant. But they will only be a portion of the orgs revenue, and I do not disclose what the dues are until they are considered candidate members.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Sulfur hexafluoride

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulfur_hex…

It has a density of 6.12 g/L at sea level conditions, considerably higher than the density of air (1.225 g/L).

The electrical power industry used about 80% of the sulfur hexafluoride produced in 2000, mostly as a gaseous dielectric medium.[16] Other main uses as of 2015 included a silicon etchant for semiconductor manufacturing, and an inert gas for the casting of magnesium.[17]

Sulfur hexafluoride is a nontoxic gas, but by displacing oxygen in the lungs, it also carries the risk of asphyxia if too much is inhaled.

Heat capacity (C) 0.097 kJ/(mol·K) (constant pressure)

Melting point −64 °C; −83 °F; 209 K
Boiling point −50.8 °C (−59.4 °F; 222.3 K)

^ this could be useful for triple point calibration.

https://www.epa.gov/eps-partnership/sulf…

https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.10…

https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.10…

Cell:
https://nvlpubs.nist.gov/nistpubs/jres/1…

^ 40 page pdf from NIST

THey show 4 different immersion cells. I think you immerse in alcohol. Not sure if you can have SF6 in the cell when it comes to room temperature.

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
So lets go back to Freon v Ammonia

https://www.process-cooling.com/articles…

What are New Freons?

“The original refrigerants were ammonia and sulfur dioxide. Ammonia was the biggest industrial refrigerant, while sulfur dioxide was used more in home refrigerators and small appliances,” Vantine said, adding that the use of sulfur dioxide was eventually discontinued because of its toxicity. Ammonia also is toxic, but it is controllable, and its distinct odor makes it “self-alarming” if any leaks occur.

Lots of rules about ammonia.

New Freon
https://www.process-cooling.com/articles…

Freon 401A
https://www.freon.com/en/-/media/files/f…

^ boiling point -51 deg C. Very good for lots of stuff, but for some stuff need maybe -70 deg C.


https://www.freon.com/en/industries/refr…).

Freon™ 95, a perfluorocarbon (PFC) refrigerant, can also be used in similar applications requiring temperatures below -40°C to -101°C (-40°F to -150°F).
-100 deg C, excellent!
https://www.freon.com/en/industries/refr…).

https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/…

https://linustehttps://linustechtips.com…

chtips.com/topic/972411-can-alcohol-cool…

https://www.reddit.com/r/watercooling/co…

https://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.…

https://www.overclockers.com/forums/thre…

https://forum.hardwareheaven.com/threads…

https://www.quora.com/Why-cant-I-use-str…

SJG

The Rolling Stones - Gimme Shelter - 2013 School of Rock AllStars Team 4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we-3Y3vh…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Freon 95, machines that use it?

This seems to be a charging, recharging, and recycling machine.
https://www.toolpan.com/Mastercool-Comma…

Freon™ 95, a PFC-based refrigerant, is the industry standard replacement for R-13 and R-503 in very low temperature applications [below -40°F to -150°F ...

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
Ultra-Low Temperature Freezers
Dependable performance over the range of -40°C to -86°C
https://www.phchd.com/us/biomedical/ultr…

Lab Monitoring
https://www.phchd.com/us/biomedical/lab-…

-150°C Cryogenic Freezers

Our mechanically refrigerated design promotes better top-to-bottom uniformity than liquid nitrogen storage without the concern of cross contamination often associated with LN2 freezers. The -150°C Cryogenic Freezer can also be used to pre-freeze items without the risk of sample shock or damaged vials common with liquid nitrogen storage systems.

https://www.phchd.com/us/biomedical/pres…

High-stage R407D, Low-stage HFC mixed refrigerant

chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/http://markitbiomedical.com/knowledge-ce…

SJG
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
3 years ago
As I now have my Raymond Serway Physics book back:

General Relativity uses math which is beyond the scope of this book. It is beyond my scope too.

But Serway got a special guess essay written

Talks about Einstein's Equivalence Principle, between gravitaiton and acceleration.

Talks about Gravitation Redshift
This can be seen on earth, like from the tower at Harvard University.

Deflection of Light
This is what made Einstein's name a household word. Gravitational Lense

Perihelion Shift
Orbit of Mercury

Gravitation Radiation, predicted that this could be so from Einstein's equations, waves traveling at the speed of light. Gravitational Astronomy predicted.

Black Holes

SJG

Eric Clapton - Wonderful Tonight [Official Live] (electric)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UprwkbzU…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
2 years ago
Classical mechanics / John R. Taylor (2005 748 pages)

Classical Mechanics (3rd Edition) [Hardcover]
Herbert Goldstein (Author), Charles P. Poole Jr. (Author), John L. Safko (Author)
Classical mechanics. / Herbert Goldstein. (1965, 399 pages, lots of newer and longer editions of this)


https://www.amazon.com/Classical-Mechani…

also this:
https://www.amazon.com/Classical-Mechani…

https://www.amazon.com/Classical-Mechani…

Classical mechanics / Tom W.B. Kibble, Frank H. Berkshire. (464 pages)
*

SJG

Led Zeppelin - In The Light - Team 3 2014 School of Rock AllStars
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBaSIT44…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
2 years ago
^ So reviewing the above post about mechanics books:

Goldstein, Herbert, 1922-2005.
Title Classical mechanics. / Herbert Goldstein.
Imprint Reading, Mass. : Addison-Wesley, 1965.
399 pages
*

Author Goldstein, Herbert, 1922-2005.
Title Classical mechanics / Herbert Goldstein.
Imprint Reading, Mass. : Addison-Wesley Pub. Co., 1980.
672 pages
**

Goldstein, Herbert, 1922-2005
Title Classical mechanics / Herbert Goldstein, Charles Poole, John Safko
Imprint San Francisco : Addison Wesley, [2002]
©2002 638 pages, 3rd ed
*

https://www.amazon.com/Classical-Mechani…

https://www.amazon.com/Classical-Mechani…

https://www.amazon.com/Classical-Mechani…

Classical mechanics / Tom W.B. Kibble, Frank H. Berkshire. (464 pages)

Classical mechanics / Tom W.B. Kibble, Frank H. Berkshire. (2004 478 oages, Lagrangian and Hamiltonian)
*

Classical mechanics / John R. Taylor (2005 748 pages)

Classical mechanics / John R. Taylor(2005, 786 pages)
*

SJG

Georges Delerue, Movie Music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IC43lBrH…
avatar for san_jose_guy
san_jose_guy
2 years ago
Order out of chaos : man's new dialogue with nature / Ilya Prigogine and Isabelle Stengers ; foreword by Alvin Toffler. (2017 349 pages)

SJG

Eric Clapton - Wonderful Tonight [all electric and with special vocal solo]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UprwkbzU…

TJ Zona
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twnLACRf…

avatar for groundball
groundball
2 years ago
We used Serway in college, it's pretty good for a survey text! Later, I specialized in nuclear physics and fluid dynamics so of course there are some things in there (like you've pointed out) that are not covered in depth, and yes the science/understanding has improved since the 1990 version. It's in my basement somewhere, lol.
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