Hi Liter Phoenix Raid

Ironically, probably the safest time to do high mileage dances is a few hours after a raid. They are not gonna come straight back for a 2nd round.

Correction, this was on Tuesday.

Damn. I love Hi Liter. The poor blow job queen. How will she pay for that new car?

I wonder which agency they were booked into? County, city, or state?

Super bowl bidding and other sporting events are being courted, so these things are important to show to committees the commitment to public safety, and this is the easiest low hanging fruit to show action is being taken. Too bad these girls are being targeted as easy pickings for a witch hunt.

DAMN!

I agree with Meat72, LE always goes after the lowest hanging fruit. People that can't afford an attorney. Dog and pony show. LE has too much free time in their hands

It sucks when LE raids a strip club. It’s definitely an easy target. It’s also sad that they do it.

It usually only hurts the dancers. I doubt the owners felt any pain - at least not any long term pain (like a deported dancer would feel).

This raid was in reference to more than 25 silent witness complaints about the Hi Liter with the dancers and acts being called out. My sources said that Amanda/Stephanie, Shelby, Butterfly, Amber and Angie were the majority of the complaints. I understand that all 5 of the above were either fired or arrested on Tuesday. My source also said the ownership is now worried about the Hi Liter Liquor license and is getting serious about cleaning out the well known VIP specialists.

I’m not an attorney, but prior violations at HL seem to be for dirty dancing, while this is three counts of prostitution. That’s much more serious. In theory, couldn’t the owners be charged with keeping a house of prostitution ? Losing their liquor license is not the worst possible outcome for them.

This whole thread is BULLSHIT!!!! Bourbon Street is the best in Phoenix!!!!

Damn damn damn that sucks. Hi-Liter is an awesome club.

A couple questions on Silent Witness

1. How could someone know the names of dirty dancers unless they were customers ? Why would customers complain ?
2. How could anyone know the names accused on Silent Witness ? Isn’t that confidential ?

I'll stop by on Friday or Saturday and see if I can get more info. Damn shame about Shelby.

CP

@mark94...its dancers telling on each other thinking they will make more money. Hoes are dumb. It's like when you get a divorce and have to pay child support. Your ex wife will try to get you fired and still expect payment.

I guess I won't be stopping by for my traditional surf and turf Thursday for $10.99

Ever since they put up the new VIP booths, Hi Liter has been double dog daring LE to react. After LE gave them some brush back pitches, Hi Liter kept doing its thing. It’s one thing to pass a cop. It’s another thing to flip them the bird while you are doing it.

That's f'ed up - these silly anti-P4P laws need to go into the trash-heap of history - this is similar to how they used to go after gays in the gay-bars back in the 60s - it's a waste of resources and hypocritical - let consenting adults do as they please behind closed-doors; if it's not your thing then no one is forcing you to participate - SMH

Salt Nutz: Ah, that makes sense.

In past threads over the years w.r.t. busts, it seems girls were charge w/ prostitution for breaking seldom enforced laws such as grinding on a guy (if I remember correctly)

Seems worst/more-mileage things happen in other clubs (e.g. BML, etc) - is it a liquor thing?

The fact that they actually arrested girls seems like they are targeting this club specifically.

Mark, any number of reasons a customer could complain. Feels like he got overcharged or surprised by the quoted price after services rendered in VIP. Getting back benched by a girl. Etc... I do think some of the girls might be getting revenge. I was so shocked of late by the blatant prostitution out in the open with offers and quotes on the floor by the girls quoted above. It seemed like they got so confident they stopped caring about getting caught.

@chrisjenk94...you are basically saying that PL are going to complain that strippers are too much of a hoe....geeze

I know nothing about the current raid, what the law is or liquor license requirements. And this is probably completely off base. But...

I wonder if the management/owners asked LE to come in and look at a few specific girls. Playing nice if you will by cooperating with LE to show they are "serious" about cleaning up their act. All in order to more easily obtain the liquor license for the old Centerfolds?

Probably not, but stanger things have happened. And did the undercover cops partake in the fun or limit their "investigation" to solicitations from the dancers they arrested?

Wait a minute, did Papi just compare us PLs to "gays in the gay bars back in the '60s"?

Damn! Lol...

Raids tend to hurt clubs for a long time. They might not ever recover fully. Fun girls don't want to work there anymore and customers don't want to go there anymore leaving little for the snitches remaining, if it was caused internally. If it was a sting, shame on LE for having nothing better to do, but dancers should always use more discretion and never proposition right away (if we are talking about outright prostitution). Now if it's dirty dances, what the hell? The whole club isn't going to survive if that is done away with, $10 dances or not.

^^^Corvus: Very plausible theory. I would also take odds that some of the dancers used the complaint process to get rid of some of the more liberal aka successful dancers (@Chrisjenk94). The shutdown of Centerfolds has brought in a large number of new dancers. Harder for some of the longer term HL dancers to make their numbers. Getting rid of the most popular girls would be to their benefit.
Having said that, one of the dancers mentioned told me once that the bouncers know which girls generate the most bank for them (bouncers) and the club. So they have an incentive to give them some room to move.

Dirk, I can tell you with Shelby, Amanda/Stephanie and Angie it is out right prostitution with a set pricing scale and a full menu with BLow Jobs and Full Sex multiple times every afternoon. Shelby thought she was covered because she fucks one of the owners, Buzz, and Amanda/Stephanie fucks a doorman and manger daily to keep them out of their tricks in VIP. They both offer OTC very open with multiple customers as well. Over confidence always bite the criminal in the ass. Besides STDs but that is a different topic for another thread.

At the same time we bemoan the raid, let’s recognize the way that some posters reveal names and details, including in this thread, may have contributed to LE attention.

^ that's bullshit, with all due respect - cops know what goes on in clubs or they can easily find-out - they usually go after a certain club(s) if someone for some reason raises a stink - AFAIK there are other clubs in the area just as bad

I agree about withholding dancer names, but a certain amount of info needs to be put on reviews o/w they are not as useful - until it's known that TUSCL is the reason LE acts then at that point we need to change our reviews - my 2-cents

"... did Papi just compare us PLs to "gays in the gay bars back in the '60s" ..."

My apologies - I did not mean to insult the gay-community

:)

Papi: So, my suggestion that we don’t put names and details together is bullshit, but you agree we shouldn’t use names. Which is it ?

"... he way that some posters reveal names and details ..."

Depends how this statement is to be interpreted:

a) names attached to details

b) names and details not necessarily connected

I agree names should not be attached to raunchy-details, but that details should be included to a certain extent in order for the reviews to be of value vs generic - i.e. if TUSCL is the reason the club got busted it wasn't IMO necessarily b/c names were named; just putting the details would be enough - and again, I don't think TUSCL is the reason the club got raided, or the reason clubs get raided

There is some credibility to both sides of the argument with respect to Tuscl posts. I would assume there is some initial research for LE to decide if a club is worth the time to put a sting together... But it is more about sending a message to other businesses. "Do not be as overt as this one"

To make an analogy... It is legal to possess marijuana in Washington DC, but not to sell it. However 5 minutes of Google go will quickly reveal where you can buy weed or have it delivered to you. There are busts. But the police only have the resources to go after flagrant violations where there was a complaint by the public.

I think most politicians and police are willing to allow vice crimes, like prostitution, drugs, and gambling as long as it goes on under the radar. However, if it becomes visible to the general population, they need to visibly crack down. I’d argue that HLs reputation just became too visible. Do you not think community activists, and other do-gooders, didn’t research HL and stumble on TUSCL ? Do a search on HL and see how soon a TUSCL review comes up. Cindy McCain is the Queen of human trafficking do-goodies. Dollars to Donuts, she is aware of TUSCL. Don’t underestimate the power of TUSCL.

I don’t really care about HL too much even though I know a lot of you others from here in Phoenix do. I have never had any luck there when I go. I always get the ones I don’t want and not the ones I do.

With that being said I do feel bad for those of you who do like going there and get action. It was always one of the best extras SC’s in town. I doubt if it’ll ever get back to where it was before the VIP remodel and first raid.

I'm not fond of the Hiliter girls. They've gone ghetto(somewhat) and if you're not known to spend $$ in VIP the girls ignore you. I have been having only good visits once out of 5 or 6 trips so with those odds I've found other clubs worthy of my time with better success rates fir my type of fun.

The last time this happened at HL, there was a shift in dancers and customers to other clubs. That lasted for 3-6 months. As this plays out, it would be helpful to know what other clubs were good alternatives.

So does anyone know for sure if these girls got fired?

Hmm wonder if its just a coincidence but a girl who I OTC with, whom works at hiliter hit me up today. Asking if I were available.

Rent day approaches while, at the same time, HL management will almost certainly try to enforce limits on dancing. This could result in some interesting developments.

sucks. most of the lawyers, courts, LE and the prudes still legislating morals.

First off, the sky is NOT falling. Hi-Liter is not closing its doors anytime soon, nor will it turn into Bourbon Street North when it comes to dances.

Second, let's be clear about this: Hi-Liter management and ownership reads this website.

From my sources, there were two events that happened essentially simultaneously, and both the result of what was written in either the discussion board here or the reviews. First, it is correct that two "normal looking" plainclothes cops came in, solicited VIP lap dances from a well-known hard-working dancer, and then came back a couple hours later and arrested her. Some other received tickets. The dancer who got arrested has certain concerns about deportation because she believes that if she leaves the country for any reason, she will not be allowed back in, so she will fight tooth and nail to stay here, and should have the cash to do so.

What was the more upsetting event was the chatter on this board that a certain dancer had an STD, and perhaps even her companion as well. I'm told that a customer had actually come to HL to confront said dancer and management, as she had passed on the STD to him, who then passed it on to his wife, who is now filing for divorce. HL management was literally scared to death at how quickly this info spread on TUSCL, and they did not want any additional issues, so those dancers are no longer employed by Hi-Liter. My guess is they end up at Sugar44 or another second tier club similar in style.

Interestingly, the dancer who was arrested was actually welcomed back at the club, and was working her shift as usual. One change I did hear about: the floaters are now checking the dancers' purses for any party favors, and if they have any, they will be asked to leave that day.

Guys, let's not kill the golden goose here. Hi-Liter is the highest profile club in this town, and for good reason, It's not a coincidence that less than a week after an incredibly explicit review naming both a dancer and the acts she performed that HL was visited by LE. We all need to be a lot more circumspect if we want to continue to enjoy the fruits of our favorite dancer's labors. I was there today, got laps from six different dancers, and everything was copacetic.

I think it's time really to get serious about a private website just for the Phoenix mongers, not for LE, dancers or management to read. We need to share intel more effectively to keep the party going.

CP

Thanks Chili. That was a great write up.

I believe there was a discussion board about a certain dancer at Hi Liter and a STD. There were many PL’s that didn’t believe it but it’s true.

We said Chili. We need to even restrict our pms to those we feel we can trust.

Sorry meant Well Said.

@Chrisjenk94: That thread was the one that lit a fire under the manager's ass. One dancer definitely appears to have an STD; her co-worker does not.

FYI, there were at least two new dancers today (Saturday) I hadn't seen before. I lapped them both and both will fit in nicely with the Hi-Liter customer service ethos.

CP

Chrisjenk94: Are you aware that the sort of stuff you write about above, linking names and explicit details, is exactly the sort of thing that causes problems ? Because, it seems you don’t.

Chrisjenk94, you "believe there was a discussion board about a specific dancer at HiLiter and a STD."

It was YOUR discussion post. YOU are the one who posted it. You joined TUSCL last month, you are a newbie here. And your post, while possibly well meaning, may have contributed to the crap that went down (the recent raid)?

Then you named three or four dancers outright and claim they engage in "outright prostitution" with set prices and menus!

Chili Palmer's post contains some great up to date info. Your posts look to me like nothing but trouble on an open forum. Did you intend to cause all this trouble? Or perhaps you are just an idiot? Not sure I've ever called out anyone on this Board before, but you should attempt to explain yourself, because right now you are very suspect.

desertscrub might have been trying to deflect, i don't know. he's a hard one to read. but i do agree with suspect. at first I thought a dancer trying to cause trouble. then I thought maybe LE

It was also chrisjenk who outed Amanda multiple times. Plus, he made the following bizarre claim, which raises lots of questions about ChrisJenk.

“This raid was in reference to more than 25 silent witness complaints about the Hi Liter with the dancers and acts being called out. My sources said that Amanda/Stephanie, Shelby, Butterfly, Amber and Angie were the majority of the complaints.”

I'm with CP and Covus.

My bad guys, I thought when a stripper has a set menu of sexual acts in the VIP and set prices that was called prostitution. Maybe I should have used a different term like provider. Ask yourself have I provided incorrect information. CP just confirmed the STD issue that management moved in to clear up. Are we not supposed to provide detailed information for other PL’s to learn from? Management actually needed to move out some of the blatant VIP providers to make sure they didn’t get shut down. It appears like they have fired 2 or 3 of the ones that were going to get their doors closed anyway. You guys need to chill and find new girls to pay to get off.

you have to be a dancer.

Okay, this STD thing is real and, understandably, got some people really angry. The guy(s) infected. The spouse. Other dancers, especially those with spouses. One of these people, using detailed inside info, decided to put an end to the blatant activity and drive away the dancers who crossed the line. The posts on this forum may have been part of this effort but I think Silent Witness calls were the more direct attack.

Anyway, that’s my theory.

Who fucks a stripper, and then his wife? That's not good policy. That PL got what is coming to him.

He should fuck wife first, then the stripper and wait a few days to see if he needs to visit a doctor. What a dummy! Lol

The dancer, whether engaging in questionable acts is bearing the brunt of this shit storm. She probably got the disease and didn't know, or else was desperate for cash and went forward. I do feel sorry fir the PL going through a divorce. That really is a PLs worst fear.

I still don't get it. Why post these kind of details on an open board. If you want to warn off members why not just post something in general

" I had a bad experience or have heard bad intel on dancer x. If you want further details I will provide a little more via PM if you are an established member. In any event, I will be steering clear of her going forward."

They weren’t trying to warn members. They were trying to destroy the offending dancer.

@Mark

I agree, but his claim was, "Are we not supposed to provide detailed information for other PL’s to learn from? "

I'm either calling BS on the excuse (most probable) or idiocy on the method.

Are we not supposed to provide detailed info....?

No, even though this forum is for info sharing, it is not a Suicide pact. Don’t share info that will damage the clubs and dancers we rely on. Posters need to act like they have half a brain.

^^^ Honestly we don't know which std was transferred, and many guys on here claim to never go covered, always bbbj.

Some people wear their no filters around like a badge of honor.

I have a theory about what really happened at HL. I also have a theory about the JFK assasination. In both cases, I can’t prove it and there is nothing I can do about it. So, this is me shrugging my shoulders, resolving to not over share about club activities, planning to reconnoiter at HL this week, and being willing to start going to other clubs depending on what I find.

I must like mysteries as this isn't my club and I'll likely never visit there. On 9/8 "Chris" shows up on TUSCL with an explicit review about a certain dancer at HiLiter. Also named is her dance partner. I would assume one or both are heavy drug users. "Chris" also separately volunteers the names of the two girls later in a thread discussion.

Ten days later, 9/18 there's a TUSCL meetup in that same club. Apparently there's a group of at least a dozen of you who all frequent that club for obvious reasons. Although some of you are now outraged that "Chris" named names, I've seen numerous reviews from some of you that made it quite clear that there was sex going on in the champagne room. Anyways, the names of the TUSCL members who were at that meetup, or who frequent HiLiter, are pretty much all in that thread.

About a month later, 10/14 "Chris" creates an STD thread claiming that at least two TUSCL members have contracted an STD, implying that it happened during the meetup. Since no one at the meetup has publicly come forward, and since "Chris" started posting prior to the meetup, I would have to assume "Chris" was knowingly posting false info to stir up shit.

Nine days later, 10/23, there's an undercover sting at the HiLiter.

Neither management nor customers have any motive to post the types of details that "Chris" has posted. In addition, the average customer is not going to have access to the types of details posted by "Chris", and the staff who do would be too afraid of retribution to say anything on a public forum. There are other tells I'm not going to divulge. But for me the kicker is that the easiest way for someone to know details like the number of silent witness complaints, and the specific dancers being named, is if the people making the silent witness complaints are other dancers. Hence my conclusion that "Chris" is a dancer who might want to take up chess as it helps you learn the probable consequences of certain moves.

You gotta watch out for Chris, man. She keeps trying to get JS69's real name.

I've been following this thread with great interest, and dismay. I appreciate CP's honest assessment of the post-raid environment of the club, but other than him there are only a couple others with whom I will exchange information. I'm going to stay away a while, probably time for me to take a break anyway. The hazard of a public forum like is is now self-evident, and I fully support the creation of a private, carefully vetted members only discussion group.

USA Sex Guide is your source for members moderated, or else PM only on this site. Never give out info deemed private. If so do the pm thing.

From what I see, this doesn't seem like an issue w/ what is "normally" posted on TUSCL/reviews - seems there's some kinda vendetta/purpose-action going-on to intentionally hurt this club or some dancers in particular and perhaps TUSCL was purposely used as one of those ways - stuff has been written about what goes on in HL (and other PHX clubs) since I've been on TUSCL (Jan 2012); and HL and other PHX clubs have kept chugging along pretty-much business as-usual year-after-year.

There are certain things that will bring heat to a club - an underage dancer is def a heat-bringer; violence (customer getting killed or seriously injured in the club or its parking-lot; or even leaving the club); etc - and also the recent stupid STD thread and associated reviews that seemed intentional and beyond the normal TUSCL threads/reviews (an STD outbreak that threatens the health of the customers is something one would imagine would raise LE's eyebrows beyond the typical things that go-on in a SC which they would rather not deal with unless someone (politician, church-group, etc) raises a stink - localities will usually let SCs be as long as their actions don't become a nuisance or danger to the community, IMO).

About a year ago there was a local Miami club that had to shut-down for a couple of months b/c some douchebag brought his 17 y/o stepdaughter to the club w/ him as a custy (and a friend of her too I think); she was drinking and I think there were also drugs involved but not sure about the drugs (can't remember) - anyway this club is like most Miami clubs where extras go down in VIP and this club has been in biz for about 20-years w/ not-much if any LE issues that I know off, yet as soon as there was an under-age person involved the shit hit the fan and LE was not gonna, and could not, let that go (and it was not even an underage dancer, she was an underage custy) - i.e. certain things will not be tolerated if they get found-out but IME extras is not one of them in place that have traditionally been SC-tolerant.

i don't think there was a conscious intent to hurt the club. my read is that the "clean" dancers got frustrated with the "dirty" dancers for the usual reasons and with management for not taking action. so one of them took the extreme action of outing the girls on TUSCL. something I should have made clear, is that I can accept CP's account of some extremely dumb PL barebacking a dirty dancer and then complaining about it to HL management, outing himself to HL management, local LE, and his wife's attorney. What I don't understand is how anyone could know it was a TUSCL member. if "Chris" had started posting after the raid, I would think perhaps it might be a TUSCL alias, but given that Chris started posting even before the meetup, I think it's more likely that a dancer saw a golden opportunity to cause more trouble. and to be clear, I'm not blaming Chris here. ultimately the dirty dancers brought this on themselves, but HL management also shares a large portion of the blame as well. club management should not be fucking dancers.

I would assume dirty-dancers are the appeal of many-a-club - for many PLs clean-dancers are no-fun (if by clean vs dirty you are talking about-mileage/extras)

yeah Papi, by clean I mean low-mileage dancers (who might occasionally offer moderate or high mileage dances to select customers), as opposed to dirty dancers who are offering VHM and UHM to anyone who pays (and free to management)

A couple years ago, everything was working fine for everyone: HL owners, dancers, customers. Then, the owners got greedy and built the new VIP area. That upset the carefully balanced eco-system.

Owners, dancers, and customers became reliant on a business model that required a high volume of extras. Dancers who embraced the new model thrived while those who didn’t suffered. The model also attracted attention, including from law enforcement. The eco-system was out of balance.

Now, a process of rebalancing has begun. Law enforcement will continue to be involved until owners bring balance back. The fastest way to do this would be to remodel the VIP area, making it smaller and a little less private.

I’m new to Tuscl and frequent HL, one of my CF was Shelby any one know where she might of gone? any help would be appreciated

@Fire1212, according to @chrisjenk94 above, Shelby was a prostitute who gave everyone a nasty STD and caused divorce proceedings to be initiated across the Valley. It was also claimed Shelby was arrested and is now heading to prison for her nasty habits. If you run across @chrisjenk94 slap that little bitch for us.

HS! Thanks for the info.

This is getting nuts. Corvus, I don’t think that was the name accused by ChrisJenk. Even if it was, it is an accusation by an anonymous newbie. Can we please stop mentioning names when talking about what goes on in the club. There is real damage being done.

WOW ....time to put this to rest. Any new info should be shared through pm by trusted members, not newbies on the prowl!!! Go get them Scrub.....I hold them down as long as your aim is good!!!

^^^ You're asking if he wants you to come in his ass, and he is the queer?

That's funny!!