Desperation

Fulsome?

It's the 3 piece suit that keeps the coming back for more.

On a serious note, some PLs have a healthy rotation of girls (you) and some strippers do not have a whole lot of PLs so go to (her). It appears she didn't take your date too seriously and now regrets it because I'm hindsight she probably realizes a P4P date is easy money.

You said she's hot, so maybe give her another chance, but it sounds like she had restrictions (I don't do this I don't do that) and I'm willing to bet most of those restrictions will still be there.

Also, if she gave a shitty BJ drunk, I doubt she would give a better one sober. I tend to think when girls are drunk they are more wild in bed.

rick you are one predatory piece of shit.

^ Grow a sack already sclvr. There's nothing wrong with refusing to buy something that is not meeting one's needs. It's her decision as to whether she wants to earn the money or not.

I find that if the sex is uninspired, there's not much you can do to save it. Let's say you go OTC again, this time she doesn't get drunk, but still gives a mediocre BJ and doesn't "like to do certain things". To me, there's nothing appealing in that. And this is coming from me, a guy who revels in the social aspects of OTC (just spending time with her, going out and eating and drinking together, etc) much more than you do -- in the end, even for me it's about the sex, and if the sex is bad, I tend to pass.

Be up front. She thinks the problem is her drinking. She is willing to fix that. If you tell her what is the real problem, she may be willing to fix it.

I agree with K....

I would give her another chance but tell her what you didn't like about the experience. She will either try hard and make it a grand slam event... .or she will say that she still doesn't do those things you wish for her to do and then you can walk away. Or let her try to sell you on a good time.

either way you can still try to have a good time with a hot piece of ass.

I would give it another go.

I, too, expect nothing less than a fulsome experience when I pay for sex.

Why even bother responding when your harem is already in great shape? Rather than waste time and money on her, find another one better than her. Past performance is indicative of future results. We all know this to be true of these women.

Tell dat bitch to get a new job because her sex game is garbage and drinking on the job made it worse

I'd find a replacement. I was recently trying to get OTC setup with one and aside from the price which I eventually agreed to, she laid out one rule and I was like wtf! Only position was her riding. After she told me that I told her don't worry about it.

Give her one more chance to make it right. As already stated, tell her WHAT you didn't like.

Just tell her that she has to take it up the ass or you're not interested.

IMO He owes it to all men to try to get her to improve.

Ask for a freebie to make up your mind

^ LOL

Maybe he could open up a training school for whores as a companion piece to "The System"

^^^^^^^^^^ :)

twentyfive +20

SJG

"... rick you are one predatory piece of shit ..."

I'm sure that was meant as constructive criticism

It's always good to give a 2nd-chance especially since she seems to be aware there was an issue - but I'm w/ the others in that it is more likely she's a dud and not just an off night; but it's not 100% predictable.

I would think a girl like-that that admits she's not up to snuff might be willing to learn, but I don't think you (Rick) are the type to have the time nor patience to be a trainer?

I'm also one of those that buys into the school of thought that hot chicks are often not as goon in bed - as w/ anything else being good in bed may have nature and nurture components (some people are just born good at something and others become good at it thru necessity or practice).

IMO often times in life in general for some people things come easy to them so they are not as used to working-hard for stuff nor applying themselves when they need to go beyond their natural gifts - e.g. good-looking chicks are used to receiving (attention; etc) and not giving and they may not know how to go the extra-mile when need be - thus my unscientific opinion that good-looking chicks tend to not to be as good in bed (understanding that this is not universal b/c nothing is except death and taxes).

It's worth another shot; but it sounds she doesn't have it in her particularly since most people get less inhibited when drunk rather than the other way around; but not everyone reacts to alcohol the same way.

FWIW, I don't think there are that many women who really can deliver straight, narrowly defined, P4P.

I think it best to operate more by a Mistress System, where there usually will be maintenance money, but not actually paying for sex. So you know the woman, it is not just expecting her to deliver on call.

SJG

" "... rick you are one predatory piece of shit ..."

I'm sure that was meant as constructive criticism"

I didn't recognize it as criticism.

Was this the bitch that was vomiting in that one story you shared with us Rick ?

^ No juice, that was several girls ago. The puking girl was actually a good provider for a long time until she melted down.

Thanks to everyone else for the input. Truth be told, my feelings about it are as mixed as the opinions posted by all of you. But given the other better options I have, I'm probably going to pass on a third attempt. I recently gave another chick a third shot and attempt #3 was no better than the first two. I also have just enough humanity left not to want to leverage a girl's desperation to get her to do what she doesn't really want to do - but just barely. ;)

^^^^^^^

I accept that.

;)

SJG

I've always been of the opinion that there's no such thing as a bad blowjob, however my ATF spoiled me with exquisite tongue and mouth work. I was with a former dancer recently for some road head and between her pecking at it like a hen, gagging, and spitting on my floor mats it was far less than perfection. You've got weigh your concerns against her strengths and you'll have your answer.

^^^^^ :)

SJG

I sometimes will work with a girl and give her a chance to redeem herself. Sometimes they just have an off night, sometimes they are nervous if they haven't gotten to know you. Last night I was with a girl in Cincinnati and she wasn't the best but I made up for it. By the time I was done with her she had gotten off 4 or 5 times and she was shot. She told me "you are good" We were at her house so I left and went back to my hotel. About an hour later she texted me and wanted me to come back and fuck her again it was so good.

^^^^ :)

SJG

So of course I went back and fucked her again.

^^^^^^ Obviously this involves more than just a straight P4P relationship with the girl, getting her feelings stirred up. I say that this way is far better!

SJG

Rick by the way it is better not to pay a girl for sex for several reasons. If you are just paying for sex as soon as they are done they want to leave because "the job is over". I make it a GFE experience and it's more of a date with sex after. I pay them nothing for the sex per se but I do help them out financially. That is disassociated from the sex. Like a shopping trip, movie, drinks and dinner, etc.

Cool beans Rick thanks for the response

"I pay them nothing for the sex per se but I do help them out financially."

I say that that is the right way and the best way!

SJG

First, any monger who is not at least a little bit predatory is never gonna get laid for a reasonable price.

Second, Rick, I'd also be tempted to tell her "it wasn't the drinking, it was the fact that you didn't seem to be into it. You didn't want to do some of the stuff that I want. That's perfectly ok, everybody has preferences and stuff they don't like."

rickdugan is a fuckin' homosexual faggot!

Only you know how much you enjoyed the experience. If she was hot enough I would have fun even if she just laid there but she would have to be smoking hot like my ATF for me to enjoy it if she was not into it. Personally I would not, but then I already have a smoking hot ATF who is into me so I would prefer to get "into" her. But if I did not have her, then I would consider giving another a good shagging once in a while but keep my eyes open for a better option.

sclvr5005, no disrespect but to be fair to rickdugan this is probably one of his less predatory posts.

The thing that has always bothered me about rickdugan is the stuff about hoping these girls' lives take a turn for the worse. It is a one thing to say that you're going to try to get the best deal you can, it is another thing entirely to hope that an addict backslides so you can save money. One is normal human behavior and the other is pure d-baggery!

I've decided that he is largely a serial exaggerator. Maybe he actually goes strip clubs and whores around, but I think that about 10% of what he says is actually true. His stories are so over the top. They are always "I had problem X but I couldn't solve it because of problem Y which was further complicated by stupid activity Z and by the way I was driving around totally drunk!"

What normal person would actually behaves that way?

Everyone who posts or uses this site regularly is predatory. Leveraging the experiences and lessons of each other to up our strip club game. Even if you are only seeking a club with bare nipples instead of pasties, you are hunting knowledge and advice. From RickDugan and JS69 to Papi and myself, we are all predatory while using this site. And that, my fellow clubbers, is not an inherently bad thing.

I agree, GammaNu95. I sense something had changed when I returned to clubbing. Everything had changed over the course of 12 years, so I needed to seek out more knowledge, and to understand what is going on. Information wants to be free. It is more chilling when the flow of information is restricted, IMO. Also competition is good.

There is predatory, and then there is predatory.Of course we are all hunting for prey, but to seemingly hope for a dancer to hit rock bottom for a bargain deal is beyond scummy.

What I have discovered, with the help of this site and all of you, is that Chris Rock was right. There is no sex on the Champagne Room.

It's in the VIP.

Look back at @Dugan's last three threads:

"Desperation"

"When they feel"

"When they plead"

All three have the same goofy theme: @Dugan's paying for sex, yet these dancers find him irresistible and they're desperate to have him back. In his minds eye, @Dugan's not a john paying for sex. Instead he's a rich, irresistible, well-dressed, stud, notching yet another gorgeous beauty on his belt. It's clearly his identity.

It's not so much predatory as it is goofy, and it largely defines TUSCL: Grown men going to strip clubs and coming here to brag about paying hookers for sex.

99% of us pay for sex one way or another.

When I was married, I used AMPs, sometimes heavily. It was just a way to try and stay sane. Likewise, our local strip clubs are no touching. So I did lots of verbal flirting with pretty girls. But I still did not treat the girls like prostitutes. I just enjoyed them in a completely civilian manner.

Today, I plan to be using Strip Clubs and AMPs while on the road, but I still won't be treating girls like prostitutes. If I session with them, then I will also be extending the offer of regular outside liaisons, and then introducing her to my friends and offering her involvement in other non-sexual business ventures.

SJG

AMPS are too risky for stings by local law enforcement. SJG you do realize you're putting your career on the line visiting those amps? A John gets his record reported to his employer.

Police can't do things like that. And besides, today I run my own affairs.

AMPs are no more likely to get busted than Strip Clubs are. And even if one is there when a bust happens, doesn't mean the cops can have anything on them.

And besides, now I'm really only interested in knowing girls on the outside.

SJG

real or imagined... gotta say good.

As far as I can tell rickdugan is absolutely textbook narcissistic personality disorder (NPD). Even the stuff he says off the cuff is straight out of the textbook, e.g. describing his wife several times as "the mother of my children". I haven't seen a single thing from him that doesn't fit.

As some may know NPD is a close neighbor to anti-social personality disorder, and, true, to form, RickyBoy has many of those traits, although I doubt he would get the diagnosis as a full blown sociopathy (for example the guilt he feels for his failures in life seem to pre-empt that. And he has a very strange notion of "ethics" as opposed to an absence. E.g. the rule he has about forcing him to stay in a strip club for at least two hours so he can do a review.)

The predatory natural and bragging about it is the anti-social (sociopathic) traits at work. At the same time, I like to call "dipshit predatory". "dipshit" because it's a given that when you offer enough girls in strip clubs cash for sex some will say yes and it doesn't matter who you are. But it's the confirmation bias and narcissism that convinces him that he has accomplished something significant in the "predator" department.

Dougster, come on now, lets be nice.

SJG

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Access to Western Esotericism Antoine Faivre amazon.com

STICK MEN Larks' Tongues in Aspic, Part II youtube.com

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Lol!

rickdugan is fag.

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