Price Wars, The Bottom Line

I understand your points and you articulate them well.

Customers and service providers (whether the provider is a dancer or a dentist, etc.) will always see things from different points of view. The customer, no matter what the service, will always look for the best deal; e.g. that is why Wal-Mart is the biggest retailer in the world – no matter how one feels about that – the fact is that they are. The customer is often unaware, or they simply don’t care, about the business person’s predicament; i.e. the fact that the provider can only go so low on what they charge based on the service they offer and the cost and effort the providers have to incur.

Things inevitably change/evolve. It used to be (25+ years ago) that one got excellent service when they flew – i.e. comfortable seating, great service, nice meal – now, you are lucky to get a few peanuts and a soda; i.e. things change/evolve.

Reading your description of today’s SC environment made me think how it somewhat correlates to porno movies now a days. It used to be that pornos used to have at least some sort of a plot (albeit always a very bad one) and some sort of dialogue/conversation when leading up to the sex scenes. Now a days, the most dialogue/conversation ones hears in a porno will be some moaning and maybe the guy saying “yeah you like that bitch”. Again, things change/evolve.

Like I said, your points, especially from a provider’s point of view, are valid IMO – but as I’ve said, things change/evolve.

I have also noticed from the comments on this site from dancers (and those I’ve read on the pink site), that women/dancers and men/customers are more often than not going to see things from different points of view since we at the very least have very different motivations for what we do in the realm of SCs. You mentioned:

“It's all about the thrill of the hunt for these bargain hounds. What's more is if YOU think that you have gone above and beyond to provide service to such individuals, THINK AGAIN. Their allegiance is only to the next best thrill around the corner that can be negotiated for the best price!”

Doesn’t this also just as equally apply to dancers when they are sizing up potential customers – in particular - “Their allegiance is only to the next best …” - but in this case the next best customer. I don’t think most dancers have much more allegiance to their customers than most customers have to the dancers.

Thanks for contributing to TUSCL!!!

Bargain Hunters
My time in a sc is limited and precious.To haggle with my ATF over a mere $5 is foreign to me,you guys remind me of vw beetle drivers(w a Obama bumper sticker} doing 30 in a 55,get out of my way.

Competition should bring down prices. That is the whole point of competition among sellers--it's good for the buyer.

jackslash: you completely missed the point of this article. And being that your a consumer, this isn't really geared towards you.

I can understand the point of view in this article. These girls are hustlers and should be respected as such. Everyone needs to eat and for them to throw away food to satiate the desire of the consumer doesn't help their needs in either the short or long run. What's the point of working if you constantly have to dumb down your prices. Pretty soon, you'll be asked for freebies and you can already see it. "I come to you all the time, hook me up with a free dance". That's food you could of had if not being adamant. I out of respect wouldn't bother to haggle for a cheaper deal because of that (and the fact that its too much effort. I came to the club to enjoy, not work).

On the flipside, you should not expect repeat customers, if you yourself aren't loyal to them first. even if they shell out slightly less cash than the one time guy your going to meet.

@jackslash: "Competition should bring down prices."

Not always. Sometimes is raises quality instead. Raising quality without raising the price is as good a result as lowering prices without lowering quality.

Avalons07: "due to pressure from consumer demand for cut rate dances that consumers are now 'dance shopping' for the highest mileage for the lowest dollar." "So, in this tough marketplace to those of you girls who have pre-set prices, I say stick to your guns! "

It seems to me that Avalon is arguing against price competition among sellers. She advocates price fixing rather than free market competition. Such action is not only un-American, it is also illegal. It violates the Sherman Anti-Trust Act. I am sure that Avalon and her fellow strippers would never knowingly break any laws, and I am only warning them so that they do not cause the Department of Justice to prosecute them.

I agree with Avalon.

Also, am I fucking stupid or something? Price fixing? Un- American? In violation of some act? Am I missing a joke somewhere? Im a dancer, ya know, a stripper. The last thing I am is anti- American. As for the illegal part, I could care less. If you care about those type of lawful vs unlawful technicalities, you shouldnt even be in the club.

Its funny though how people only blow the whistle when its on something they dont like, like price fixing, but when it comes to extras or dances with decent mileage, they dont say a word except brag to their fellow tusclers. Im sure patrons like Jackslash would never violate any dance laws. Thats illegal.

I maintain that the adage that when it comes to quality "you get what you pay for" rings true. Can you get value from Walmart, Replacement NFL Officals and skanky ho dancers. No Doubt, but at what true cost over time...

To each his own, but I would generally rather pay the premium for quality and the arguable depth of better overall value propostion that brings to the table. When I go to a club, I'd much rather sift thru, seek out and spend time with the higher quality dancer(s), even at a premium than to go for the lower octane level semi-worthless experience....

Great response MD-Thanks. Eli Manning

Just to set the record straight:for both the TUSCL and the non- TUSCL-ers. My article was meant to cover a broad spectrum and not aimed at price fixing JACK SLASH.

No I am not in the biz of price fixing. If you could read in between the lines of the just of the article, perhaps you would see that you missed the entire point exactly. If a REGULAR has to haggle with his ATF to begin with JACK SLASH then maybe it's high time for him to rethink his haggling strategy b.c. said dancer is an A.T.F. Once again you missed the point. Perhaps you should re-read the article.

Would you not be inclined to pay a SET price that you had previously agreed to with your favorite dancer? One of the points that I raised was, if you had already had a set price for quite some time in the past with said dancer, then why go and try and re negotiate that price with her just b.c. you have had $10 lap dances at another club at the risk of offending her and losing her friendship and service? Does she provide higher quality dances? Yes, but if that is what you have come to expect then, that was one of the exact points that i was trying to impart.

avalon: Your post strikes me as another "bad day at work" rant that belongs on the pink site. To touch on some points............

If you're using a lower unemployment rate vs 09 as a metric for economy getting better, I suppose so. That would be like declaring that spring has arrived just because temperature is above freezing- it isn't warm yet, and there's still a big freaking pile of snow left to melt. A byproduct of "Great Recession" is that those still employed haven't exactly been getting generous raises, many have taken pay cuts as a condition of remaining employed. Thus, people will seek the best value for the $$ spent. This is more out of necessity than a jolly sport game.

Speaking for myself, I personally don't start off dancer encounter by trying to chisel her down in price- that kills the mood for me. My value shopping entails price shopping by club rather than individual dancer. I don't seek the cheapest places in town, but if a club raises their prices more than other clubs, then they'd better offer a substantially better experience if they want my business.

I gather that you work in a club where price negotiation is the norm. Most of my experience has been otherwise. In one notable FL club example, I generally ask for dance prices upfront. If dancer quotes a volume discount, I'll continue. If she sticks with flat upper price per dance, I'll pass.

"Would you not be inclined to pay a SET price that you had previously agreed to with your favorite dancer? One of the points that I raised was, if you had already had a set price for quite some time in the past with said dancer, then why go and try and re negotiate that price with her..."

I agree with you, and I think this is the basis of the discontent. If you were used to paying a set price for quite some time in the past with said dancer, but the next time you come in the dancer announces the price increases by 33%, wouldn't that cause you some concern? There was no attempt at renegotiation - the price of the service was just announced. The service didn't change - just the price. And if similar service is available from another provider at the previously agreed price, where is the decision? You suggest customers need to be loyal, but so do dancers.

Stiletto and Avalon, I'm sorry. I was being facetious.

Willing buyer - willing seller. The clubs usually set the dance prices. If you do not like the price no one is forcing you to purchase a dance (at least until Obama gets involved then you may be forced at gunpoint to get a dance from his skank ass ho bitch) As far as extra tips and negotiations if her price is to high don't buy.

I have had a set price with a dancer whom I have a long term relationship. Even though I know prices are lower today and that I am overpaying, I don't renegotiate. When she lowers the services, I back away.

I thoroughly believe in the ATF model. It doesn't pit one dancer against another in a Low Ball bidding war. I continue to pay an ATF a prior agreed upon price for designated services. The services may vary slightly from session to session, but the price stays constant unless a change is worked out. In the end it tends to even out.

There is nothing wrong with trying to get the most bang for your $$$. And the Dancer should be able to try to get the most she can for her services.

The ATF model allows me to receive a known & consistent sexual experience & the dancer has a consistent and long term customer. I think it is a Win/Win scenario.

The variation in prices with respect to dancing is called “living in America”; i.e. free-market competition.

I haven't had an ATF ask for a price increase. They've been satisfied with my attention thus far it appears.

And I haven't had any reason to request a decrease in price or more effort for what I have paying. Again WIN/WIN!

Y'see, Alucard goes about it sensibly, achieving what is the goal of the market, having the supplier and consumer both be satisfied with the deal.

But all the same, good thing lap dances can'd be efficiently outsourced to an offshore call center... :D

LDs do get outsourced... they call it phone sex!

if guys haggle with me over price, sometimes i agree, sometimes i don't. depends on how i feel and whether i like them. but i try to avoid coming down because if a guy gets a deal the first time around he'll always expect it, and if i like him i want him to become a regular. i work hard to keep my regulars happy, don't get many complaints.

If you don't like your job, get a new one. Case closed

As a longtime customer with a long history at some very nice clubs, I have been fortunate enough to build some lasting (for a sc) relationships with some dancers. Some times it worked in my favor( I recently won an iPad), and sometimes it didn't ( she tired to increase her price without an increase in service). Though I know the house varies and the house like in a casino will always get the money, I have been known on the proper occasion with the proper girl to pay ones house as well as bring them things from time to time. I know what you're thinking, think what you want. In most cases we both got what we wanted from defined and relatively safe relationship. The biggest change I have see with this economy is the upswing in prices with less services and providers expecting "regular" status way too soon. Price does equal quality in mot cases as stated by some before. Just don't forget your regular, for that guy whose here on night. Like I always say," 2000 tonight or 15k over the year?" Thankfully we live in America and we both have the choice, you can walk away and I can choose not to buy.

it's isn't unusual for me to drop $160 to $300 in an evening. that's a gd chunk of change for a regular working stiff. USUALLY the bulk of it ends up in 1 or 2 dancer's garters. i don't HAVE to negotiate a price. it is all a matter of VALUE for me. i will politely pay & thank a dancer after her "air-dance." one or two of her co-workers will end up with the $100 to $250 of my recreation money instead. simple as that. i vote with my feet.

[jackslash quotes Avalons07:] Avalons07: "due to pressure from consumer demand for cut rate dances that consumers are now 'dance shopping' for the highest mileage for the lowest dollar." "So, in this tough marketplace to those of you girls who have pre-set prices, I say stick to your guns! "

[jackslash comments:] It seems to me that Avalon is arguing against price competition among sellers. She advocates price fixing rather than free market competition.

-- Um Jack, I don't think she said "standardized" prices; I think she just means that if you've decided what you want to charge, don't take less just because other girls do. Price fixing is when the girls get together & say, "None of us is gonna go below $XXX." This happens too, of course.

Yes, Avalon, times are tough, & I know this increases my mileage (& options). Remember, my work hours are down too, so I have less to start with. I have to hump extra on my job 'cuz we have fewer hours (but just as much work, of course). My pay rate is also down. So yes, I do have to shop more carefully in the clubs, & I also know that even my paltry $$ have some extra leverage 'cuz money's tight.

Believe it or not, Avalon, I do try to be decent about it. I don't pay inflated prices, & girls who don't discount one way or another lose business. As independent businesswomen (w/in club limits) they get to make that choice. If a girl is really sweet I'll tip her extra, whether after a dance or onstage. If I find someone else I like better, @ least I'll be polite to the ex & be sure to green her next stage set a little.

I am in fact cultivating a fave, because it's a lot of time & $$ to find such a great girl. Yeah, she had to start out 'cheap' -- like all the others -- but now she's getting most of my loot 'cuz she delivers such an awesome experience for me. I'm nobody's deep-pockets sugar daddy, but I help her pay a few bills. I also remember who else has been sweet to me & show them some respect when they're onstage.

So the moral of the story is yeah, there's truth in what you say, We're all on the losing side of an economic war & the people who control the money can pit us against ea. other. It sucks. Life goes on & we all gotta deal w/ it as gracefully as we can.