US Surpasses Sweden in COVID-19 Deaths Per Capita

"US has thousands of deaths each day"

No, the US has in the range of 500 to 1200 deaths per day as of early september. Trump's new darling medical advisor (Scott Atlas) wants the US to emulate the Swedish approach.

nymag.com

Im hearing us doctors are feeling pressure to report all deaths as virus caused even if they arent sure if it was. got to keep everyone afraid

^^ no that's bullshit that started from QAnon.

The original rationale for the lockdown was to prevent hospitals from being overwhelmed. When it became obvious that wasn't going to happen in most places, the reason for the lockdown was switched to suppressing the disease. Sweden, one of the few countries not to go into lockdown, had a large number of deaths at the beginning of the epidemic but once the individuals most likely to succumb from the disease had caught it and died then deaths rapidly dropped. The efforts to suppress the disease in the U.S. spread the deaths out over a longer period of time but in the end we had the same number of deaths.

Overall, not only did the U.S. not have fewer deaths but the U.S. might have been left worse off in other areas since shutting down strip clubs and all the other businesses caused a lot of economic damage. Sweden had only a 6% economic contraction in the second quarter of this year compared to a 10% contraction here in the United States. A lot of the economic contraction in Sweden happened in the import-export sector which was disrupted by the lockdowns in neighboring countries.

Whether we like it or not, this virus is going to run it's course. Some countries that were held out as examples of doing the right thing, at some point in time, are now not so exemplary.

We can close down as long as the experts want but this virus will just be waiting in the wings. If a vaccine that works comes out, that will help. If vulnerable people stay home, those who choose can go on with their lives.

Screw this Corona crap. People die, its called life. The CDC report the other proved this whole thing is the biggest fraud in human history. People die but not from this thing. You've all list your friggin minds.

Interesting the Trumpophobe idiots are admitting some worldwide scam illness is about partisan politics to them. You would think they would be embarrassed.

Kamala Harris caused the corona virus sucking Willie Brown's cock. But it's OK. Its a scam anyway.

I see more and more people without maks the last few days. Hopefully people are simply fed up with the scam. I predicted this would happen two or three weeks after the initial lockdown but better late than never.

kick the fucking doors open... and let us decide what our tolerance level is

Not one more day of shutdowns, lockdowns, rules, restrictions, masks, or anything else.

If you are paranoid, hide in your closet the rest of your life. You have no moral right to te anyone else what they can or can't do. Especially over some joke illness that kills almost no one.

I didnt hear anything from qanon just real people one guy in the medical industry and a pastor's wife that said her husband had a heart attack. She said they listed death as virus. Why care if they make it seem worse? Im still wearing mask everywhere and staying homeexcept work etc . Regular flu theyonly report active cases Not the millions who ever had it. also heard congress quietly working on new law for required new digital currency while everyone worries about virus.probably law passes this fall Start replacing cash in weeks. Might be allbs. Believe what you want.

If you have no money nothing to worry about. Not sure why someone no money posts on strip club site im hoping next year its a voluntary exchange Digital Cash For Dollars Have To Protect Us From Virus Or Something Maybe Everyone Gets Basic Income Check Probably All Bs Keep Worrying About Virus And Politics

For @DocSavage: Graph of per-capita deaths of Sweden and neighbor Denmark:

drive.google.com Both had about the same 8% decline in GDP.

For @Orion: Do you think something you heard from your pastor's wife convinces anyone that most MDs are feeling pressure to falsify death certificates? If anything, Covid deaths are understated. As I posted above: bullshit.

Quick back-of-the-envelope calculation:
(1) The population of US is about 330M (2) An estimate of Covid infection fatality-rate: 0.3% (3) Herd immunity occurs when 65% of the population is infected.

(330M)(0.003)(0.65) = 643K deaths if we follow the Swedish model.

RandomMember, the epidemic isn't over in Denmark yet. They had a spike in cases at the beginning of August and the Danish government then required everyone to start wearing face masks on August 15th when using public transportation in an effort to combat the increase in cases. Estimates are that the Danish government deficit will be 8% of GPD this year compared to 4.5% for Sweden. The Danish government was able to decrease their economic contraction by borrowing and spending money to stimulate the economy. This money will have to be paid back in the future using increased taxes which will cause lower economic growth then. So the Danish policy decreased cases and economic decline in the short term while pushing it off into the future.

Here in the U.S. the economic damage from the lockdowns will last years into the future. For example, it is estimated that half of all restaurants may eventually go out of business. The three trillion extra dollars the U.S. government had to borrow to deal with the economic damage from the lockdowns will have to be paid back. Americans will have a lower standard of living in the future because of this. Someday they will look back on the lockdowns and will realize what a mistake they were.

Good example of how people cherry-pick their metrics. Another example is NBA ratings. If the total viewership numbers are anemic, they will boast about the ratings in the 18-49 demographic. An NBA game finally won it's timeslot in total viewership, so the fake media pushed that metric instead.

“(2) An estimate of Covid infection fatality-rate: 0.3% (3) Herd immunity occurs when 65% of the population is infected.”

From what I’ve read, fatality rate is .1% or lower. Lots of sources think herd immunity will occur at much lower percentages because of antibodies from other CoVid. I can’t prove my numbers. Can you prove yours ?

Denmark has had a grand total of 12 deaths since Aug 1.

It's intended to be approximate. If I use 0.1% infection fatality rate, that gives about 215K deaths. We'll most likely be there in about a month.

@savage, my GDP numbers are outdated by at most 3 weeks. Post where you're getting your year-end estimates. So far Sweden wins for having vastly more per- capita deaths.

538 is tracking the predictions of the leading 14 models here:

projects.fivethirtyeight.com (although the wife of @Orion's pastor isn't included).

One of the models (IHME) was the darling of the WSJ and the White House earlier this year because it predicted 61K deaths, in line with a bad flu year. Now the IHME is predicting 410K deaths by year end.

Here's the IHME model predictions:

covid19.healthdata.org

@Nicki wrote: "Good example of how people cherry-pick their metrics.:

Here are the eurostat numbers showing that Denmark and Sweden had about the same GDP downturn (8%-ish) as of a few weeks ago. There's been no uptick in deaths so far in Denmark:

ec.europa.eu

You post a lot obnoxious shit @Nicki; try to back it up with facts.

Remember Randumb, hospitals are incentivized in the US to categorize a death as Covid for the Medicare reimbursement is higher. Since your countries with socialized medicine aren’t incentivized for labeling their deaths as Covid primary, they’re not going through all the trouble like the US agencies are steering their deaths in that measure. I’m sure you’ll spin this around into some pseudo scientific circular logic, Randumbmember, because that’s how you justify everything. Very Randumb.

I have family that work in hospitals. It is happening. They do a covid test on every death. If the dead person tests positive for Covid, they are marking the death as Covid. Even if Covid had nothing to do with the death. It's estimated that 30-40% of all the Covid deaths are this scam. Did they die and did they have Covid 19 ? Yes, then it's marked as Covid. I don't get a CRAP where Ran-Dumb-Member gets his information. And why the fuck would anyone quote what those stupid modelers are saying now ? These people said 3 million, then they said 60,000, then they said 120,000, now they say 400,000. Anyone can make up a number and be closer than these idiots.

RandomMember, when you make comparisons in deaths between Sweden and Denmark you are making an apples and oranges comparison because they don't have the same demographics.

Denmark has much stricter immigration laws than Sweden and fewer third world immigrants. A large number of deaths in Sweden were in this immigrant group. Many immigrants in Sweden were unemployed so the government set up a program to find jobs for them and gave many of them jobs in nursing homes. Their poor Swedish language skills and lower IQ made it difficult for them to follow directions on how to control the disease and this caused higher death rates in nursing homes. Swedish police have little control in immigrant areas of major cities. The Swedish authorities were aware of this and knew it would be difficult to enforce lockdowns in these areas and that was a factor in deciding to not lockdown. So a lesson to be learned from this is to have less third world immigrants but American liberals who point to Denmark as an example to follow ignore this. They think third world immigration is good because immigrants overwhelmingly vote to put more liberals in office.

There are other factors involved too I've read about. Unlike Denmark, the northern part of Sweden is very cold so the population is concentrated in the south leading to greater population density. Higher population density equals more deaths. Stockholm has higher mass transit usage than any other Scandinavian city and that leads to more deaths. There was an unusually low number of flu deaths in Sweden in 2019 so many people who would have died from the flu in 2019 died from coronavirus in 2020 instead. Sweden followed the Andrew Cuomo policy of moving sick people from hospitals to nursing homes with similar results. Sweden uses a death classification method which puts more deaths in the COVID- 19 category. Finnish people like to retire in Sweden so Sweden has more elderly people. I don't know if all of these factors are true but they sound plausible. The mainstream media is not going to report any of this because they want to make the Swedish model look bad so if you Google on this you are going to find mainly information coming from one side.

There is a problem with proponents of more government intervention in general. They tend to look at short term benefits of a government intervention while ignoring long term costs. When considering the effects of an intervention you need to look at both the seen and unseen. The seen is in the present and the unseen is often in the future. This focus on the present has led lockdown proponents into advocating policies which will have disastrous . long term results. The coming economic contraction will lead to future deaths of despair like suicides and deaths from drug and alcohol abuse. Cancer deaths are already increasing in the U.S. because diagnosis and treatment were put off due to the exclusive focus on this disease. If you add up all these future deaths caused by the lockdown it may very well exceed deaths from Covid-19.

^^^Good post and I'll keep an open mind. I think of the two countries as neighbors and very similar.

Y’all Trump dicksuckers retarded 😂😂

@ RandomMember - I didn't question the GDP rate. My reply brought in the question that Denmark's GDP would have contracted more had they not increase their debt while Sweden. So when comparing 'effective' GDP. Denmark's was actually worse.

Oh yeah, and fuck you too.

Wow Sweden only has a population of 10.5 million people. You can compare it to individuals states like Georgia or North Carolina with there population of 10.5 million each but your comparing it to the whole United States which has 360million plus. Of course if your comparing it to 360million people to Sweden only 10.5 million population, the 360million population will have more deaths.

Yes after a thorough search I see where you cribbed the "effective GDP" argument in the far fringes of the interwebs. But couldn't find any details on exactly how it was calculated or the magnitude of the correction.

Everything in this thread is per capita BigMac. Thanks genious

Genius *

@BigMac - Explaining further, my graph comparing Denmark & Sweden is done per capita. @Nicki went out of his way to state in the title that the US has surpassed Sweden in per-capita deaths. So your post doesn't make any sense. Until recently, Sweden and the US had the 10th and 11th WORST per-capita death rates in the world.

The "effective-GDP" argument is new to me. Quick search shows that both Sweden and Denmark had Covid fiscal stimulus, but couldn't find any details about how large the effective-GDP correction is. I'm wondering if the effective-GDG argument is the result of a few cranks out there or the result of some think-tank. As I said above, post a link with a supporting calculation.

It's an academic argument since the states will do whatever they want regardless of what Atlas or Trump are recommending.

Whatever, the way I look at it is population wise of course your numbers are going to be less if you have less people. Try comparing Sweden to New Zealand.

Got it. You're the only one in this thread who doesn't understand the meaning of per capita.

New Zealand has done exceptionally well -- per capita deaths below ours by a factor of about 100x.

"Thanks genious"

Didn't the fake doc phil spell genius, genious? Not the real doc phil who is a great guy but the fake dot doc. Or was that another troll who always used the term "space genious"? Another one of your alias troll accounts like real dougster, mtent, josh43, and countless others rumdum? For being such a self proclaimed "genious" you slip up a lot and expose your true ignorance by exposing your past troll accounts you moronic dipshit!