I am a hot girl on Seeking Arrangement... Day 1

• Also some of those offers were probably low and then the guy would be willing to negotiate up. However I think some offers were actually high, as in that is the price the guy is offering for an overnight.
• Some of the high offers were pretty demanding. Like BDSM sex contracts with lots of rules and exclusivity.

• There was definitely a relationship between age and ugliness and the amount offered. Some of the guys offering more were seriously fugly.
• One guy was pretty decent looking who offered $500 that was about the only exception. Maybe he wants something weird sexually.

"One guy sent a dick pic. Weirdly his dick was on the smaller than average size so I don't know why he would do that?"

I've told flagooner like 100 times to stop sending out pictures of his little penis but he won't listen. I wonder if finding out that this time a man was on the other end will change his behavior?

Damn dude that is awesome Intel. Thank you for sharing. Well done!!!

^^^ Don't forget to ad me to your trust list!

And smash that like button

Already done! This is genuinely useful stuff

Damn that was you, I withdraw my offer.

This an awesome topic interested stuff. Good shit.

*interesting

Cool I’ll be looking forward to hearing some of the bizarre messages sent your way as some good entertainment for us.

A sugar baby once told me she respected guys who didn’t have their face out in the open. Think about it, if you’re truly a “high level” guy with lots of money, you’re probably smart enough NOT to put your face on some random sugar daddy site especially if you’re married with kids.

This is interesting. So there doesn't seem to be any prohibition for members being "transaction" based ?

Great stuff man! I like your commitment to the experiment.

• One other note, a lot of guys want to IMMEDIATELY make it clear that they will only start with PPM. I think starting PPM is good and normal but talking about it right off the bat is bad and unnecessary.
• Had one sad guy who keeps emailing me asking why I don't like him. He is sad. He also raised his offer from $375 to 500.
• One thing I can see is that it is easier for a girl to get a higher amount once. A lot of guys want to pump and dump with a hot girl once and then move on. Getting consistent income of a higher amount is much harder, and I think some of the guys offering moderate amounts are not in it for the long term.
• I think because the account is new I am probably getting a lot of guys who target new girls. It will be interesting to see if the offers go up as time goes on. I don't plan on keeping the account going for more than a week.

@Warrior15 - From what I understand you can easily get banned for talking about "pay per meet" prices on SA. Most people on the sugaring forum advise to get the conversation off of SA as soon as you can. Initially I tried to get guys to email me eventually figured out that most guys are not sugaring experts and seem totally willing to talk PPM prices openly on the site. About 50% of guys want to move the conversation to text or kik. The rest are not savvy enough to know that. Also by the amount of people that are willing to talk PPM it must be that you have to be reported, so don't be an asshole or lowballer.

At first I thought it was a douche move to be pretending be a chick and wasting these guys' time, but gotta admit it does provide some interesting insight from the other: female) side

"Also by the amount of people that are willing to talk PPM it must be that you have to be reported..."

Pretty sure SA has some sort of AI algorithm to identify messages that contain both sex and PPM.

The Reddit forum has other examples of guys posting as fake SBs. I think you've proven what's pretty obvious: 95% of the men are chasing the same 5% of the women

.

Agree with Shailynn that plenty of married guys don't post public pictures

-->"Damn that was you, I withdraw my offer."

Good, more PaulDrake booty for me. I hereby add 10% to my offer of half of juice's weekly salary plus 3 dick pics.

@Subraman - I sent you a link to my profile. Lmk what you think. Message me on there with the password "goat lover" and I'll give you the private pic access.

@Drake: "Obviously there must be a lot of girls who aren't interested in 40+ year olds."

No, it's not at all obvious and it's not a dating sate. Money doubles in the stock market every decade or so and there are lot more wealthy men 60+ than 40-.

Site*

I made a SA a long time ago and this was my exact experience and it panned out to lead to zero arrangements lol.

Interesting thank you

Damn, you ARE a hot chick, PaulDrake! I can't message you w/ my fake unpaid SA account, but sent you the nick in messages here

Yeah the girl I picked out is pretty perfect for baiting people on SA.

@RandomMember well those times are changing. More and more I'm meeting millionaires in their 20s. Then again, I'm in my 20s and working alongside them and their friends, so my view may be smaller than I believe

I have a question or 2

1. If many of these guys just want to pump and dump, why not go on an escort site like Eros? Arguably hotter chicks, they all want to be wined, dined and mortified, and the dude can just come again some other day, garunteed.

2. Why isn't this on the Article section?

Really? Because most millenials I run into have negative net worth from student loans.

@Estafador a lot of guys who want an arrangement say ‘no pros/no escorts/etc’

I think you should keep it going longer than a week

So now that the initial rush is over the account has slowed down a lot. Getting some higher offers. But again I think some of the higher offers are scams. Once someone makes an offer I immediately ban them LOL. So I am not keeping the conversation going long enough to hear their scam. One high offer wanted me to get a bank account at a specific bank and two others wanted to pay me with paypal (known scam - they will reverse the charge after the deed is done).

So there are definitely a few "types" of guys on SA:

• Old white guys trying to look young. This is probably the largest group. Think of some guy in his 50s wearing a terrible shirt and hairstyle that is completely non-fitting for his age. Sometimes they have bleached hair (think Guy Fieri) and are always overly tan. Shirtless pics are common, but they are never super muscular or ripped. All of these guys profiles are big about talking about whatever active fitness things they do.
• Older fogies not trying to look young. Think 60-80yo grandpas. These guys tend to write really nice heartfelt messages. I didn't get as many of these but my girl's profile specified she was looking for under 40.
• Chubby to Fat spectrum white guys in their 30s. Some of them are serious bottom feeders (lowballers) and all of them seem pretty sad.
• Young asians in their 30s are pretty common, and seem to have money. Some of them aren't bad looking actually. It just sucks to be a shorter asian guy I guess.
• Indian guys in their 40s-50s. These guys are very common, maybe the second largest group. They tend to be fierce negotiators and generally refuse to make the first offer. But if you can get them to make an offer they are always low but never lowball. They play it very smart. However they usually are pretty demanding in what they want (overnights, exclusivity, etc). A lot of them seem to put Z-E-R-O effort into their pics. Once guy, I have not fucking idea what he is thinking. He has the worst most disgusting pic ever. It is him in the gym, balding, giant belly, sweat stained shirt with a HOLE in it. Seriously why would ANYONE in their right mind not immediately delete that photo after taking it...?

@BoringLoser - After a week I am thinking of making a second account with more of a girl next door type. This one is too universally hot. I want to try again with someone I would actually be interested in. For that account I won't talk to anyone just compare the view counts.

@Subraman - With all of the traffic some of these girls get what is your strategy on conversation?

With all these dumbshit stereotypes, have you ever considered that you might be gay, @Drake? Maybe you enjoy the attention? Can you afford the $90 or so that it takes to actually get some real-life experience?

My thought is that this is very inconclusive. You are still one sided, you know what men are offering and you are a man. You don’t have any evidence of which guys this “girl” would move on.

What kind of freak would pose as a woman and interact with hundreds of men?

^Never heard of that behavior happening at all. Ever.

Sounds stupid to me

If you read some of my previous comments you'll get a similar account in that many of the women on SA when they meet someone who treats them well, has manners, and doesn't have a hump on his back , they are pretty intent on sealing the arrangement quickly. Certain areas seem much worse than others for bottom feeders ( Northeast Ohio being where I hear the most complaining about Splenda Daddies)

DC seeming to be the best area for people being who they say they are ( who would have thought DC for honesty)

Smash that like button

My SA relationship goals are normally long term and I shy away from high hustle pros. If I want P and D I would get an escort or go to a strip club here in D. But I suppose some could view it as good turf to find amateur escorts still learning the ropes.

I have had conversations about gift offers sight unseen with some of my former sb's. Basically who does this? Apparently it does happen quite a bit and I don't understand how anybody could do that with somebody who could be a total fake or just pure hustle. I personally I find that particularly pathetic and an amateur move. Maybe I'm just an asshole.

Have you gotten many sight unseen gift or $ offers Paul?

Rule # 1--get the conversation off he site to e-mail and then telephone Rule #2--meet for coffee or drinks ( which might turn into dinner if the conversation goes well and needs to be extended) Rule # 3- She'll let you know what your next move is.......

-->"@Subraman - With all of the traffic some of these girls get what is your strategy on conversation?"

It's not a strategy exactly, but I seem to have hit my stride with:

1. Favorite, but do not contact, new girls. They're flooded with messages they can't keep up with. Plus, it's good for her to get a dose of the scammers, pic requesters, johns, and incredibly rude guys. They put the fair maiden in distress (and disgust), which prepares her for when I ride in on my mighty steed

2. In a week or two, contact her with a short polite message that references some part of her profile in a clever way, and that does not request her private pics, or make any reference to sex. I could be imagining it, but I feel like this noticeably increases the chance of a return message, even from a hot in-demand chick.

3. Quickly move to establish a little rapport, get her private pics, and get off the site to texting to discuss meeting (and, if she wants, allowance & intimacy details)

PS By "ride in on my might steed", I mean "send her dick pics as soon as she gives me her number"

Trying to understand why @Drake is asking for advice and a strategy?

After all, he’s already done a careful statistical and demographic study of the sugaring scene – the kind of careful work that would make the National Science Foundation green with envy. Why worry about having a strategy when your competition consists of homely east Indians, short Asians, and pathetic, awkward, and decrepit white men in their 50s? Just post your picture and be done with it!

Flirting with other middle-aged men online may not be the most pleasant thing. But look at the rewards!!

@pinsugardoll - You are right, it is inconclusive. And if I picked a different type of girl (older, younger, or curvier) I would probably attract a different crowd. But there are some valid takeaways. For instance if you are a guy in his 50s who stays fit, you are NOT unique on SA. You need to do something else to stand out, for instance add a couple pics in a business suit, or polo shirt with a golden retriever, you are already maxed out on the shirtless pics. If you are a chubby guy in his 30s, you're pics make you look look sad, so take some better pics, get someone to make you genuinely laugh, maybe get a selfie with a few pretty girls you work with.

@randommember - I tend to massively over-research, and over-do everything I put my mind to in life. It is a side effect of my personality and how my obsessive brain works. I don't expect you to understand. I also had some minor surgery a few days ago and I am stuck at home bored out of my mind.

As far as my plans for SA. I haven't decided, before doing this experiment I was pretty dead set on doing it in January when my CF moves away. But after this experiment I am not so sure. The competition on SA is a lot tougher than I was expecting. If I do decide to go the SA route I think I will have a pretty big advantage knowing what I am up against.

@RandomMember well all the millionaires I've been around didn't go to college. They learned all their skills online and use the power of interest to build their net worth (stocks, ETFs, high yield savings accounts etc.). One of these dudes I know became millionaire status by age 26 due to real estate and real estate INVESTING

I disagree with this statement.........

For instance if you are a guy in his 50s who stays fit, you are NOT unique on SA

and even more so with this one

add a couple pics in a business suit, or polo shirt with a golden retriever, you are already maxed out on the shirtless pics.

@Estafador my college education was limited, but the truth is folks that go to college out earn those that don’t by a lot, it’s very possible that the folks that you are around that claim millionaire status are compensating, or there are other folks around you that have money but prefer to keep it quiet.

DC if you plan on staying in the DC area I would suggest you finish college, take a Fed job, and get them to pay for your Masters.......

There are certain parts of the country it means more than others to have a college education---you happen to be in one of them.

It isn't all that much different. You can judge yourself by the amount of traffic going up and down I-95 everyday between Richmond and DC.

Understood and I'd place a bet a fair amount of those in their 20's claiming to be millionaires and touting their wealth live in Poserville as I like to call it......Poserville is where your Social Media account is designed to make everyone think you are the sh*t.....but in truth you can just drop the (are and the)

^The poseurville folks are gonna be up in arms about your expose, I’ll bet you get .0003% of the twenty somethings mad at you ;)

@DC Oh no, I'm the only one in ny. But yes, millionaire isn't what it used to but it's a huge stepping stone to make making money even easier

Also, never said it was because they didn't get a degree, just stating a tidbit fact. Personally, these people were just able to focus heavily on their craft. Two dudes, that I met through association, but don't know personally went to school and the military and used their formal education skills to supplement their careers.

DC--yes especially if they are including real estate in that million because depending on the situation and location it's not liquid enough.

One of the secrets to my life has been to work in large cities, ( have clients there) but live in small town USA. A lot more people do it now than when I started my own business decades ago but based on what I observed back then I was ahead of the curve.

The DC area in particular has a lot of people living large but living paycheck to paycheck and in some cases not being able to cover their bills even then.

If you want to carry that argument over to the left coast, someone was selling a 500-700 sq ft shack, that would probably sell for under $50K where I live in KY, for over $1.5M in a Cali suburb. So definitely location is a BIG factor in determining whether a "millionaire" is really rich or not.

So I decided to end the experiment. I got the info I wanted and I want to minimize collateral damage. The second wave of offers was indeed a little higher however as the girl I picked was a particular brand of hot a lot of higher offers were from other metro areas of the country for her to fly there for a few days (someone earlier in the thread mentioned the 95% of guys are fighting for 5% of girls and I think that rings true here). Also a lot more offers in the second wave were wanting more overnights, or multi days in a row.

The easiest advice I would give to guys from my experiment is that your photos should show a range. You don't just want pics of you in front of a jet or rolls royce. They shouldn't all be workout photos. You want a spectrum, one pic showing luxury, one pic doing something active, one selfie in a group with a few age appropriate women. Past that to stand out I would add some more millennial style photos, do one sticking your tongue out, and do a photo with the snapchat puppy filter. Things like that would make you stand out massively over the crowd.

Here are the second round of offers: 120 200 250 275 300 300 300 300 400 400 400 500 500 500 500 500 625

Nice reporting. That was pretty interesting, Paul.

@nicespice - I am glad you approve of my trolling lol.

Really good stuff Paul. Some things to consider:

-->"as the girl I picked was a particular brand of hot a lot of higher offers were from other metro areas of the country for her to fly there for a few days"

Based on conversation on the sub, the vast majority of these out-of-town offers are scammers. As an SD, you likely do not need to factor these fellows into your calculations

-->"Past that to stand out I would add some more millennial style photos, do one sticking your tongue out, and do a photo with the snapchat puppy filter. Things like that would make you stand out massively over the crowd."

Stand out, but in a bad way, in that you've made it easy for her to identify that you're a tool. Standing out isn't a virtue in itself. I'd be careful here about going from descriptive "here's what guys who contact me do" to prescriptive "here's good advice on how to hook a good SB"

So I looked it up and my account got about 450 messages in 36 hours.

@Subraman - Yeah my advice is probably a little too broad. Obviously over a certain age you can't pull off the tongue out or puppy filter photo. I am in my 30s so I could totally pull those off, so I was more thinking off myself trying to avoid the mopey guy in 30s stereotype. For an older guy in his 50s I would still stand by the advice to show a variety in your photos.

@DC - nope. The Cali shack is actually that. It is a 1 bedroom/1 bath with a roof that is barely staying up.

Have you accepted my offer yet PaulDrake? At least show us your tits!

--->"or an older guy in his 50s I would still stand by the advice to show a variety in your photos."

Yeah, the tongue out or puppy filter definitely wouldn't work for an older guy. I'm actually not convinced it wouldn't work against a younger guy, either -- this isn't a dating site, the girls are primarily looking for signs that the man is mature, stable, "generous", and able to afford what he claims. Puppy filter or tongue out might play on a real dating site, but it sends exactly the opposite message from what women are looking for on SA, is my guess, even if the guy can "pull it off" elsewhere. I think all but the newest least-experienced girls will move on immediately when they see a man sticking his tongue out.

I feel the same way about "variety of pics". Maybe on a real dating site. On SA, you might be thinking too much like a guy. For guys, the most important part of a female profile is the pics. For women, everything I read on the sub is that pics absolutely are not -- I mean, they don't want you to look horrible, but one face pic and one body pic is all that's needed to show that, anything else is gravy.

Anyway, just my theory based on what I've read on the sub. Could be wrong, of course, but I think experienced SBs might not be looking for typical dating-site indicators

would be very interested in seeing the reaction on the Reddit sub to this being posted over there. very little "information" going on lately. mostly just whining about one thing or another

Sticking your tongue out only really works when its a girl doing it......or if you are Gene Simmons.

good idea, pretty informative for the guys. i've actually always wanted to make a sugar daddy profile myself and see what it's like on the other side. maybe i will