General Petraeus Affair

If you find yourself unable to be or remain faithful in a marriage and need sexual interactions whenever you want or need it, and it is NOT an option in the marriage, get Divorced - Or don't get married to begin with. Not marrying leaves you free to have Sex at any time with anyone.

It's not so much that I disagree with you Alucard, but have you ever been married? When I couple that with the fact that you also pay for sex, your repeated commentary on fidelity seems a bit too much.

Regardless of his love or attraction to his wife there's also a matter of circumstance. It's not implausible to believe that there were long periods when he didn't get to be in the same room with his wife. Additionally for a couple like them, divorce is not an easy option, and even if divorced it's not like relationships are simple matters for CIA directors.

I agree with Alucard. It doesnt matter who finds it hard to be monogamous. You decided to get married. Thats a serious commitment. If you feel the need to "do things" Behind Your Spouses Back, then maybe you're not cut out for that type of commitment and you should just get out before you hurt somebody

No I have never been married. But that doesn't disqualify me from having an opinion about it, and to REPEATEDLY express that opinion.

The General's situation is special given his job and power and responsibilities. But his actions in being unfaithful ended up having far reaching impact. I believe he is smart enough to know better given his position. He made a bad choice. When any of us make bad choices we usually reap bad consequences. And sometimes others are very negatively impacted too. He could have and IMO should have handled his emotional and sexual needs differently, given his position in the government.

The world isn't black and white, and it's easy to say "don't get married in the first place" or "get out, get divorced". They got married when they were still in college (maybe just out of college) and divorce is hard enough, imagine how it would be for a Washington power couple one of whom is the head of the CIA. Getting divorced might get you run out just as quickly as cheating.

What he did was wrong but I think it's a cheap shot to stand on a pedestal an opine about faithfulness.

It's funny dudes on a strip club review site like Alucard who have never been married talking monogamy! My point was, monogamy is hard and a strip club is like a safety valve for married guys for letting off a little steam without carrying on a marriage ending affair. And Petraeus can not do that because of his position so he has to have an affair to let off steam and then gets his ass busted. Guys are guys. It's just the way it is.

Marriage is black and white when it comes to being unfaithful behind your spouses back. You made the commitment. If you don't find it easy to get out, then I'm sorry, but that doesnt excuse you from your vows.

And I can stand on a pedestal because I've never cheated on anyone, be it my spouse or ex boyfriends. Anytime I have acted "immorally" Lol in the club, it has been disclosed, by me, immediately. And anytime I've met anyone outside the club, I have had a prior discussion with my significant other about it.

I'd walk through fire before I intentionally hurt or mislead someone I cared about. And if I'm in a relationship with someone, whether I'm still in love with them or not, I made a commitment to that person and they are still owed respect.

ll69: "It's funny dudes on a strip club review site like Alucard who have never been married talking monogamy!"

I kinda get the feeling alutard didn't have much choice in the matter. So he's making a virtue out of a necessity. This ain't the only realm he does it in, either.

I'd put money on him not being allowed to smoke, drink, or do drugs due to a medical condition (CAD), not because of any superior "morality" there either.

It would interesting to see how "moral" the guy is in areas where actually has some say in the matter. Not too well, I'd bet. Hence, his need to pontificate against others, where it actually is a choice. Kind of his way of trying to kid his own brain that he is an okay fellow when he is not.

Thanks Stiletto25.

Yes monogamy can be hard, which is why it should be taken seriously. If you can't hack it, don't marry.

@stiletto25... You so funny :-) ! Anytime you acted immorally it was "disclosed"! Hahaha that is so funny. In other words you did the same thing Petraeus did but you "disclosed" it? Nice. Ok so when you fuck a guy outside the club you let your Sig Other know about it. Right. Keep standing on your pedestal dear...

I'm free to express my opinions here as I see fit on issues of interest. I will continue to express my opinions. Others may see it as preaching, or getting on a pedestal or trying to force my opinions &/or way of living on others. If you don't like my opinions, that's TOO BAD. I don't set myself up as perfect or as an enforcer of beliefs. I am quite flawed and make plenty of unwise decisions. I have paid dearly for some choices.


I challenge any honest, clear thinking and NONDELUSIONAL member to find a situation where I have tried to FORCE anyone else to attempt to live by my beliefs. Any member is free to agree or disagree and to read or not read my opinions. Think the way you wish and behave how you wish. And live with the consequences - GOOD or BAD. There are PLENTY of people in this country and in the World who are MORE than READY to try to enforce their beliefs and way of living on everyone else. And often through Violence.

Also I have never used alcohol, or smoked, or used illicit Drugs. I have NEVER felt any need &/or desire to. I know the consequences of indulging in these habits. These consequences are easy to see in the World.

QUERY: Did he give her classified information to help her with her next book? Or help her get classified information?

The General made his decision and is accepting the consequences of his unfortunate choice.

Ok alucard good for you. No drugs alcohol etc just strippers...

@alutard: Dude, why you flipping out? No one is challenging your right to express your opinion. Just saying that if you had no choice in the matter you have no credibility when you talk about the subject.

I'll make the equation so simple even your pea brain can understand. LatinaLover (and others) = choice in the matter, therefore credibility. Alutard = no choice in the matter, hence no credibility. Simple, huh?

The science is pretty clear that it's in a male's evolutionary DNA to spread his seed to as many females as possible.

I'm not saying infidelity is acceptable, I'm just saying that it's millions of years of evolution vs a few thousand years of Judeo-Christian teachings. In the long run, who's gonna win that horse race?

For me the most troubling part of the Petraeus affair is the intrusion by a government agency into the private life of a citizen, recalling that the FBI investigation started over harassing (presumably not threatening) emails emanating from an anonymous email account.

The second most troubling aspect of this discussion thread are three implicit assumptions: 1) that monogamy is an essential ingredient of every marriage, presumably more important than love, respect and support 2) that adultery is OK as long as it is disclosed to your partner and 3) that anyone who is discovered to have had an extramarital affair should be automatically judged to be incapable of performing his/her job (in spite of the fact that they performed the job effectively while having the affair--but the public disclosure of the affair then disqualifies them from continuing in their job).

I don't "buy" any of these three assumptions and I'm troubled by the government intrusion into a person's private life, even if that person was a high ranking official who appeared to be performing his job with skill and dedication.

Readers of this forum are welcome to express differing opinions-- that's the function of a discussion forum.

" Have you seen his wifey? "

Exactly! I wouldn't hit that with my car.

Latinlover- I've never had sex with a customer so I dont know how you interpreted that. Immorally, in my eyes, could mean touching a boob. Inside or outside the club, I have never engaged in vaginal, anal, or oral sex. So, actually, yes, I will stay on that pedestal.

If you'd like to keep deflecting the fact that you think its okay to go outside your marriage because " youre a man"....well Im sorry for you. But where would I have gotten that idea dear. Silly me!!

For a career military officer aspiring to be a general I can tell you that divorce is a roadblock to further promotions.I'm positing the theory that just perhaps the Mrs. knew of the General's infidelities and "took one for the team" so as not to stall his fast track to four stars.And while the military frowns on divorce,adultery is in the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) and is a career-ender.So much so that Petreaus may be court martialed if it can be shown the affair started while he was on active duty.As an aside,this guy was a helluva soldier.When things were going to hell in Iraq,it was his leadership that righted things."People" magazine may not be kind to him,but military history will.

When it comes to such things as your word, commitment, relationship, trust and the sanctity of marriage - I'm in complete agreement with Drac, Stiletto, etc on these fundamental, foundation type things here...

The government intrusion into his life is the price he pays for his position of trust. I got a glimpse of this life years ago and decided I wanted no part of it. What he should have done, what the people I knew did, is find a high priced escort. This method can blow up in your face too, but in spite of the headlines, it's really very safe.

Even If he was not married he would have the same road blocks. There is more to this than a simple affair.

Fidelity in marriage is a fine thing and I practiced it for decades. However, there has been much written about the strains on long-term marriages when the wife's libido plummets after menopause while the husband still feels a robust need for sexual satisfaction. Until you have experienced the disillusionment of recognizing the sex is no longer a part of your relationship with a woman you still love I don't feel you are in any position to moralize to me about fidelity, divorce, or sexual mores.

@otto- I understand your position. I was advocating commitment and more importantly trust, meaning disclosing information to your spouse and not having sex behind their back. I would imagine it would cause alot of pain to a wife to hear her husband has been unfaithful behind her back. No one deserves that, especially someone your still in love with.

@tiredtraveler- There is much more to the situation then an affair. No doubt.

All of the following are true:
- I am married, recognized by the states of NY, where I was married, NC, MO and KY, where I've resided and paid taxes, and by the US Federal Government, for whom I worked and to whom I paid taxes.
- I have sex with women other than the one to whom I am married.
- I am not acting immorally with regard to sex outside my marriage.

Geogremicro- Dont take this as me trying to judge you, you're actually one of my fav TUSCL members, I'm just asking because I'm confused and don't understand your position.

If you are married, and have sex with other women besides your wife, how is that not being unfaithful/ immoral/ cheating?

Alucard you say your not trying to force your opinion on anyone, but then you bring it up every chance you get. Any time you can announce how clean cut you are and respectful of women and anti-infidelity, you shout it from the roof top. That's beyond 'stating an opinion'.

Should you cheat on your spouse? No. Is this particular situation vastly more complex than usual? Yes.

Bottom line I think a certain sanctimonious ass who clearly avoids being in a situation where they have to practice fidelity, shouldn't lecture others about it.

@stileto, maybe you have more of a leg to stand on but I think the peculiarities of this instance make saying "just get a divorce" a little simplistic.

@GoVikings: "If you are married, and have sex with other women besides your wife, how is that not being unfaithful/ immoral/ cheating?"

You're assuming facts not in evidence. Check your premises.

:)

" Have you seen his wifey? "

“Exactly! I wouldn't hit that with my car.”

Big time LOL – I’ve never heard put that way – will have to remember than one!!!

George- I don't even know what assuming facts not in evidence means. But my guess would be you're saying what she doesn't know won't hurt her? Is that right?

I admire Stiletto’s take on fidelity – and I think most “women” would strongly agree with her – the problem here is that men and women will never biologically view, or have the same feelings/thoughts, towards sex. Men and women ARE equal but they are NOT the same.

Often times when studies are done w.r.t. male/female sexuality, more often than nor “sex” is at the top of the list for men where it is often much further down the list for women.

It is also peculiar that the guys on this thread strongly advocating the concept of fidelity are the ones that are not, or never been, married – not passing judgment – just an observation.

Furthermore, it can be argued that if one has sex or visit SCs, that in itself can be considered morally objectionable, married or not?

To further piggyback on the sexual differences b/w men and women – perhaps the numbers speak for themselves – what would one say is the ratio of female-dancer SCs to male-dancer SCs – 1000 to 1 – maybe greater?

GV - I believe GMD's wife is aware of his exploits and is ok with them so I think that is why he said what he did.

I agree with Stilleto as well.

Women cheat just as much as men, they just complain about it louder.

@ jester - women do cheat like men. Ive seen it time and time again amongst my friends, strippers and non strippers. I also think women are more sly about it than men.

Was he a General when he had the affair?

We all know of situations where a relative or a friend has been emotionally and financially devasted by a bitter and contentious divorce. Some guys can tough it out and hold their careers together and stay steady on the job. Others get lost in the battle, turn to drink, become depressed and sometimes suicidal. Reactions vary based on the strengths or weaknesses of the individual. Divorce used to be a career ender at senior corporate levels. "If he can't manage his family, how can he lead this department." Now that divorce has become almost an accepted fact of life, it is no longer an automatic career ender in civilian life.

The U.S. military believes that senior officers moving towards "flag" rank must demonstrate an ability to keep their lives, marriages and finances under control so that they can focus on their assignments and avoid any situation that could be a distraction. It is assumed that heavy drinking, drug use, financial difficulties or "fooling around" will expose a senior officer to blackmail, the temptation of bribery, accidential security breaches or lapses that could threaten the mission and get people killed. We can argue that this policy is an overreach and not realistic, but that is the way the U.S. military establishment sees things. Thus, adultery is a violation of the UCMJ because it might lead to divorce and emotional burdens that distract from the assigned mission.

Consider: (1) Lt.Col. does not make it to the B.G. list (candidates for future Brigader General) because of a spouse's heavy drinking. Risk of repeating something that was discussed at home; (2) filing bankruptcy shows financial weakness making bribery possible; (3)divorce because of adultery destroys a general's emotional stability.

This week a four star general was demoted to three stars because he misused government funds with excessive travel, luxury suites and personal purchases. It appears that he did these things to keep his wife entertained. A "pussy whipped" general misappropriated government funds to give his wife what she wanted or both of them lacked discipline and judgment.

The Defense Investigative Service of the Department of Defense deals with these issues. They clear candidates for promotion to "flag" rank.

Yet, if you can keep it quiet, maybe nothing happens. Biographers have revealed the Gen. Dwight D. Eisenhower was involved with his London driver, Kay Summersby. She revealed the affair in her book "Past Forgetting" after his death. William Manchester's excellent biography of Gen. Douglas MacArthur, "American Caesar," discloses that "Dugout Doug" had a 25 year long relationship with a Phillipino mistress. In neither case was the ability to focus on the command ever compromised. (One biographer has claimed that Gen. George C. Marshall, Army Chief of Staff, threated to bust Ike down one star and order him home if he divorced Mamie and married Kay in the middle of the war while everyone else was slugging through the mud across Europe.)

The military is a separate world with it's own set of rules and reasons for maintaining order and discipline. Generals have heavy responsibilities in the defense of this great and good land. They accept those limitations and we rely on their dedication.

@GoVikings: No, it means that I never explicitly or implicitly promised not to have sex with other people. I'm not breaking any promises, nor am I lying about it, so I'm not being unfaithful.

@Papi_Chulo: Please explain why you think "it can be argued that if one has sex or visit SCs, that in itself can be considered morally objectionable, married or not". In and of themselves, I don't see how either of this is morally objectionable, even if done at the same time.

@GMD, does you wife think you promised to be faithful?

@jester214: Nope.

Clinton started it all ...

John Edwards, Tiger Woods, Ah-Nold Schwaznagger, Mark Hurd (HP guy), Tony Parker (spurs), Petraeus - all gone
... and big-daddy clinton's still smiling.

TUSCL founder should extend "distinguished member" invitation to the fellas listed above.

Within a week all will cry out loud:
"Dang, fuck, shit - why didn't anybody tell me 'bout this???"

Final question: What would you rate (fuck factor) mistresses of the above mongers? collectively?
I'd rate a 2 (being generous)